Ergodox Keyboard Kit

[TotalChaos]

As long as I am not in the states this won't be viable for me.

Why not?

They ship to Norge for $20.00

[jdcarpe]

As long as I am not in the states this won't be viable for me. Maybe I'll get in touch with one of the lovely gentlemen on the forum to hold one for me. Hmmm. I really want to support the project. *goes into the think tank*

However you need me to help, Glissant, just say the word.

[Glissant]

You're always there when I need you, J.D. I'll be sure to remember to harass you when I decide .

[JustCallMeCrash]

Another thought on the single-pcb issue (Who would want just one?)... you could program a chorded board!
Not that I'm doing that, but it's a thought.

[jdcarpe]

I've looked again at the chat response, and what I get from it is this: the "kit" that is being offered includes the PCB (2 halves), case w/plate, Teensy, diodes, switches, etc. Enough to build a complete ErgoDox keyboard. If you want to order "extra" PCBs, they are $22/ea. "Extra" PCB in this case would be each "half." So if you mess up both halves, you need two "extra" PCBs to replace them, which would be additional $44.

[The_Beast]

Could you order just the PCBs and order/make everything else yourself?

[jdcarpe]

Could you order just the PCBs and order/make everything else yourself?

Not from Massdrop. Minimum order is a kit minus switches. But someone else might order the extra PCBs for you, if you asked.

[Glod]

I've looked again at the chat response, and what I get from it is this: the "kit" that is being offered includes the PCB (2 halves), case w/plate, Teensy, diodes, switches, etc. Enough to build a complete ErgoDox keyboard. If you want to order "extra" PCBs, they are $22/ea. "Extra" PCB in this case would be each "half." So if you mess up both halves, you need two "extra" PCBs to replace them, which would be additional $44.

That's what I meant earlier....

[danielucf]

It is all well and good to see this posted here, but isn't it a group buy, and shouldn't it also be posted in the group buy section where more people will see it? I'm in for one, and hoping the Aluminum version is worth the extra money. I ordered an extra PCB under the impression that it was a set of two because my soldering skills are at nooblet level. I may add another.

[alaricljs]

The group buy forum is for *running* group buys.  Not advertising.

[danielucf]

The group buy forum is for *running* group buys.  Not advertising.

I guess since you are an administrator themsed the rules. I thought it could be considered "running" a group buy through Mass Drop, but I guess if Mass Drop and/or the Ergodox team turns a profit it is frowned upon? Too bad they didn't do a real group buy, would probably sell considerably more units.

[Glod]

its up to 27 sold and 12 committed (to 199 assume) and there is still well over 2 weeks left to go

I am super excited, I shall build a trifecta of community keyboards: ErgoDox, Phantom, and GH60 (presumably)

  )

edit: ha up to 30 + 12, slowing down but still 30+12 aint bad with 16 days to go

[Salash]

I am definitely going to buy and put together this keyboard. I just don't know if I want the full hand case or the classic case! How do I decide? This is stressing me out!

Also where is the best place to buy the key-caps for this? I want printed at first.

[AKIMbO]

I am definitely going to buy and put together this keyboard. I just don't know if I want the full hand case or the classic case! How do I decide? This is stressing me out!

Also where is the best place to buy the key-caps for this? I want printed at first.

Full hand case for sure....how else are you going to rest your palms.

[Salash]

Okay I think you make a good point. Also when it says extra PCB's if I get an extra 2 for $44 just in case I **** up twice. Then the kit would ship with a total of 4 right? Are circuit boards interchangeable for each side?

I really hope that this goes on another group buy at some point in the future where it ships put together. I could see myself buying another one of these. I am not willing to wait that long though because I have been OCD lurking this thing forever.

[bisl]

Just in case this opportunity never comes around again, I picked up four units...two full-hand, two classic, two acrylic and aluminum, one of each combination of configuration options. Will post photos after the fact if people are curious. No switches though until they get reds.

Also, for anyone who's still unsure--don't be silly, of course the kit comes with two PCBs
Any extra boards purchased are per hand, in addition to the two needed.

[litster]

someone please ask massdrop what legs are used.  My drawing has holes on the bottom plate so you can screw in something.  If you are ordering, you should at least find out what legs are under the keyboard.  Use my design at your own risk.  I am not responsible for the end product. 

[bisl]

According to Massdrop, they are using a type of rubber screw-in foot for the boards, or at least experimented with them for the prototype. These parts aren't listed in the manifest though so I'm not sure if they're going to be offered as part of the package or if it'll be BYO. I had suggested KMAC legs to them, since that's what the design was made for, but it probably goes without saying that it would have been impractical to source them. That's my take, anyway.

[asura]

Want the PCB only?

"The best way to do this is to have you check out normally and notify one of our live chat reps so they can put a note on the transaction saying to only collect payment for the PCB ($44 shipped to your door).

Let me know what works best for you,

- Will"

They really are bending over backwards.  I'm sure everyone probably checking both posts, but just in case I'll pop it up in the other one too.

[TDub]

Since I didn't see it in the thread yet, ordering without switches knocks off 44$. So it comes out to 52 cent for each switch, which seems like a good price.

Cherry Switches (84pc)     44$
PCB (both sides)             44$

Teensy board (1pc)          ~18-20$ (approx. marketprice not a qoute from massdrop)
1N4148 diode (100pc)      ~1$
=======================
so about 109$ for those, which (with the 199$ price) leaves 80$ for the rest of the components + overhead for organisation and such:

Case (10 sheets of material, five per side)
MCP23018 I/O expander
3.5mm TRRS connector (2 pc)
USB mini B connector
USB mini B plug
0.1 UF ceramic capacitor
2.2K Ω resistor (3pc)
3mm T1 LED (6pc)
USB cable Male A to male mini B
2ft, 4 Contact TRRS Cable
M3 Metric 22mm Screws

I don't know about the rest of you but it seems like a pretty fair price. Especially with the aluminium option for 65$ more.

Anyone know approx. prices for the other stuff, like the resistors and such?

[kurplop]

I think Massdrop is offering a very fair deal. If they sold 100 kits, even at $100 profit per unit, that is only $10,000. To build a prototype designed by others with no promise of a return, make arrangements with manufacturers and suppliers, be willing to customize orders, listen to "helpful suggestions"by "potential buyers", offer free shipping (US) and then be taxed on what's left over, in California no less, for a $10,000 return is a venture that I think is being more than fair. 
I think we should thank Massdrop for taking on this project and making it a reality. Capitalism at its finest!

Also a big thanks to all the contributors of the Ergodox project. It's great to see such talented people offering their services without pay to see this project through.
 

[haskellelephant]

Just in case this opportunity never comes around again, I picked up four units...two full-hand, two classic, two acrylic and aluminum, one of each combination of configuration options. Will post photos after the fact if people are curious. No switches though until they get reds.

Also, for anyone who's still unsure--don't be silly, of course the kit comes with two PCBs
Any extra boards purchased are per hand, in addition to the two needed.

Yea, I asked them about it in their comment section and what they said was:
"The keyboard requires two PCB's, but the kit comes with two.
The base kit comes as a complete keyboard (without keycaps)."
So I presume that in order to ask for exactly two pcbs one should
choose N/A under "extra pcb".

[Glissant]

I finally jumped on this. Trying to get in touch with them about shipping to Norway. I used my CONUS address in the meanwhile.

By the way, has anyone considered where to get keycaps for this? I am assuming here, but our regular sets won't fit 100% on the Ergodox, right?
(And yes, I have seen them talk about WASD possibly making a set for the dox)

[kmiller8]

I finally jumped on this. Trying to get in touch with them about shipping to Norway. I used my CONUS address in the meanwhile.

By the way, has anyone considered where to get keycaps for this? I am assuming here, but our regular sets won't fit 100% on the Ergodox, right?
(And yes, I have seen them talk about WASD possibly making a set for the dox)

There will be a massdrop GB directly after this one based off of this poll https://www.massdrop.com/vote/ergodox-keycap

[Glissant]

Thanks, kmiller8 . Blank pbt xD SO NERDYYYYYY.

[TotalChaos]

I vote for Front Printed keycaps or Front+Top Printed keycaps.

I really need front printed keycaps because I glue soft impact absorbing material to the tops of keycaps which sort of obscures the legends.   

[DanGWanG]

Will there be a final order confirmation?  I want to add a bag of switches and extra PCB, but maybe I'm dumb I can't find how to modify my order...

[Glissant]

I'm not sure about the final order confirmation, but modifying your order is done by clicking on your name(or username) at the top right of the site, picking "Purchase history" and then "Order Update".

[dorkvader]

Okay I think you make a good point. Also when it says extra PCB's if I get an extra 2 for $44 just in case I **** up twice. Then the kit would ship with a total of 4 right? Are circuit boards interchangeable for each side?

I really hope that this goes on another group buy at some point in the future where it ships put together. I could see myself buying another one of these. I am not willing to wait that long though because I have been OCD lurking this thing forever.

The ErgoDOX has a single PCB that you flip over for the other side, so each kit has two identical PCB's, one for each hand. I don't think there'll be a group buy of fully-assembled units, but there are several members on GH that have offered their services to assemble the ErgoDOX. Here's everyone that's mentioned it (To my knowledge: Pm me to be added or removed)

TheProfosist (USA)
DorkVader (USA)
Geekabit (EU)
Dirge (UK)
localredhead (?)

[Salash]

Just ordered a full hand cherry blued ergodox with 2 extra PCBs. I'm glad I live in the future. I can't wait to put this thing together and mount it to my chair

Any thoughts on pointer mods? Track point? touch-pad? joystick? ball?

[regack]

So I started out as a 'Commit To Join' person because I was uncertain about the original pricepoint.  I saw more and more people watching, but no more commitments, so I decided I could deal with it, and I didn't want to ride it out.  I couldn't find anything in the 'Edit Order' section to change my purchase type, so I shot off an email to support@massdrop.com.  They responded back pretty quickly with a nice email, and changed me over.  So if you want to change, it's easy.

tl;dr - To change from Commit to Buy, email support@massdrop.com and they'll change it for you.

[bisl]

I wouldn't be surprised if, in the future, they implement a feature allowing to choose which price break at which your commit converts to a buy, rather than fixing it specifically to the last price break. Maybe one day!

[litster]

changing from Commit to Buy seems like a fairly common user scenario for MD, and you have to email support to make that change? 

[kmiller8]

changing from Commit to Buy seems like a fairly common user scenario for MD, and you have to email support to make that change?

If you hit "Commit to Buy at $199" your order will only be placed if they hit the $199 tier. What regack did (it looks like) Is changed his "Commit to buy at $199" to "Buy no matter what"

Which apparently needs a contact of support.

[bisl]

changing from Commit to Buy seems like a fairly common user scenario for MD, and you have to email support to make that change?

If I took at stab at reconstructing their design, I'd say that the user they imagined was a cost-motivated user who prioritized saving money over everything else. This user would jump in on Commit, and he'd be ok with it if he didn't get his product because the buy didn't get to the top price break.

Supporting the customer who changes his mind halfway through the buy (or redesigning a set of user stories surrounding a buy for products unavailable anywhere else) is more work to handle in an automated way, and I'm guessing they're only discovering a need for these now.

[wiredPANDA]

Will there be a final order confirmation?  I want to add a bag of switches and extra PCB, but maybe I'm dumb I can't find how to modify my order...

You used to be able to modify orders, but with the site relaunch - this feature was broken/disabled temporarily.  You'll have to email MassDrop support to update orders right now.

[mikelanding]

I too change my order from "commit to buy" to "Join group buy". I did it via their excellent Chat Support. Changes was done on the sport. I also change my shipping address to US address at same time. All done with ease.

I might order 1 more. Either keep as spare or See anyone around my country appreciate this excellent KB.

[regack]

changing from Commit to Buy seems like a fairly common user scenario for MD, and you have to email support to make that change? 

I was a bit surprised to find that out myself, but I guess it was easy enough to just shoot off an email (that was part of my question in the email : "I don't see where I can change it").

Anyway, I just posted it in case anyone else wanted to change and bump up the numbers/drive down the cost

[TheProfosist]

I will be starting a GB for assembling ErgoDox's later today so if you interested keep you eyes posted prices will be similar to my phantom GB.

[TheProfosist]

just noticed something are there no stabilizers in the kit for the 2x thumb keys?

[TotalChaos]

just noticed something are there no stabilizers in the kit for the 2x thumb keys?

Somewhere it was said that they are not strictly necessary.  I guess that is a matter of opinion though.  I have not typed on one so I can't give my own opinion.

Have you typed on one yet?

[dotancohen]

But you don't have to have an account here to SEE the GB (terms, pricing, timing, ...).  That's the distinction I think is being made.

The issue is that these Facebook-connected sites are grooming the incoming generation into being complacent about giving up their personal information. Without looking, who wants to bet that the site lets one sign in with Facebook instead of / in addition to opening an account directly on the site?

[mikelanding]

just noticed something are there no stabilizers in the kit for the 2x thumb keys?

Somewhere it was said that they are not strictly necessary.  I guess that is a matter of opinion though.  I have not typed on one so I can't give my own opinion.

Have you typed on one yet?

I dont think it is necessary to have stabilizers on 2X thumb key. Speaking as a Kinesis Advantage user. I dont really miss press the 4 thumb keys as much as other 1X or 1.25X keys

[bisl]

The issue is that these Facebook-connected sites are grooming the incoming generation into being complacent about giving up their personal information. Without looking, who wants to bet that the site lets one sign in with Facebook instead of / in addition to opening an account directly on the site?

As a developer, it makes a metric pantload of sense to support facebook authentication, because not only do some people prefer it, but it also relieves the development team from maintaining their own credentials, which is likewise a metric pantload of work. And even this is without consideration of the essentially free marketing they get when people like their stuff and it's reflected on their facebook pages.

Just the same, on the other hand, Massdrop supports both methods: I signed up with my email address, not facebook. So if you want to stick it to facebook, you've got that method available to you as well.

Would you really boycott a site just because it integrates with facebook?

[wiredPANDA]

Depends on my mood and the most recent security flaws with Facebook.

I'm not a fan of linking all my site access to a single system, that has questionable security policies/practices.  One security breach on FB will cause chaos on tons of sites.

/threadcrapping

[TheProfosist]

groupbuy and form up for assembly http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=39263.0

[TheProfosist]

just noticed something are there no stabilizers in the kit for the 2x thumb keys?

Somewhere it was said that they are not strictly necessary.  I guess that is a matter of opinion though.  I have not typed on one so I can't give my own opinion.

Have you typed on one yet?

well since their 2x keys I would prefer to have stabs, does anyone know what kind are needed?

[wiredPANDA]

Looks like Costar stabs from an old image litster posted when he originally designed the case.  I wasn't able to find any written information, just the image with a few stabs in place.

via:  http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=22780.msg684442#msg684442

[BugBuster]

This is for those who are in Europe and who desperately wants the keyboard and has absolutely no hope to assemble it themselves:

I've shown the ErgoDox instructions to my father and he is ready to help the community with assembling services in Europe. Last 25 years he was working at the local electronics repair shop, i.e. basically spending 6 days a week 8 hours a day with hot iron on his table. Plus last year he was also working at Ericsson factory testing GSM equipment.

The complete build will cost 50 euros and this includes: soldering, flashing with a latest firmware of your choice, testing every key and screwing it all together. So you get fully ready keyboard like from the shop.

The algorithm:

• you order the kit(s) from MassDrop and pay for it
  
• the kit is sent either directly to us in Estonia or to someone being a proxy in US to avoid paying extra taxes and reduce shipping
  
• optional, see above: proxy collects all the orders and sends them in one box to Estonia
  
• finally I receive it in Estonia and pay import taxes if we fail to avoid them
  
• I issue an invoice to you: import taxes (if any) + 50 euro + intra-EU shipping (as far as I can see it is around 14 euros in maxi-letter, small box may be more, please correct me)
  
• keyboard gets assembled
  
• meanwhile you pay the invoice to my PayPal
  
• I double test it and send ready keyboard to you

So you pay either 2 or 3 times depending if you choose to use US proxy and if everything gets organized:

• to MassDrop for the kit
  
• to US proxy for US->EU shipping
  
• to me: EU taxes(?) + 50 euro + EU->EU shipping

Let me know in PM if there is interest.
I think I would need the following details:

• nick
  
• email (for emergency messages)
  
• address to estimate EU shipping
  
• number of kits you are going to order
  
• are you ok if we have US proxy?
  
• max price if 50 euros is way too much for you - we will see if we can figure smth out

[dorkvader]

groupbuy and form up for assembly http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=39263.0

This is for those who are in Europe and who desperately wants the keyboard and has absolutely no hope to assemble it themselves:

I've shown the ErgoDox instructions to my father and he is ready to help the community with assembling services in Europe. Last 25 years he was working at the local electronics repair shop, i.e. basically spending 6 days a week 8 hours a day with hot iron on his table. Plus last year he was also working at Ericsson factory testing GSM equipment.

The complete build will cost 50 euros and this includes: soldering, flashing with a latest firmware of your choice, testing every key and screwing it all together. So you get fully ready keyboard like from the shop.

The algorithm:

• you order the kit(s) from MassDrop and pay for it
  
• the kit is sent either directly to us in Estonia or to someone being a proxy in US to avoid paying extra taxes and reduce shipping
  
• optional, see above: proxy collects all the orders and sends them in one box to Estonia
  
• finally I receive it in Estonia and pay import taxes if we fail to avoid them
  
• I issue an invoice to you: import taxes (if any) + 50 euro + intra-EU shipping (as far as I can see it is around 14 euros in maxi-letter, small box may be more, please correct me)
  
• keyboard gets assembled
  
• meanwhile you pay the invoice to my PayPal
  
• I double test it and send ready keyboard to you

So you pay either 2 or 3 times depending if you choose to use US proxy and if everything gets organized:

• to MassDrop for the kit
  
• to US proxy for US->EU shipping
  
• to me: EU taxes(?) + 50 euro + EU->EU shipping

Let me know in PM if there is interest.
I think I would need the following details:

• nick
  
• email (for emergency messages)
  
• address to estimate EU shipping
  
• number of kits you are going to order
  
• are you ok if we have US proxy?
  
• max price if 50 euros is way too much for you - we will see if we can figure smth out

I'll add this information to the list of assembly folk.

---

About stabilizing the thumbkeys,  I don't think costar stabilizers will fit without modifications. Since most thumb-key presses are (in my experience) generally on-axis, I don't think it needs it. Although I agree, it'd be nice to have.

Bytheway, MD's pictures look really similar to litster's, so I'm fairly certain the case design is exactly the same.

I mean, whenever I hit shift, or sapacebar, etc. I'm usually pretty for off the axis, so these keys really do need stabilizers, but whenever I press a large thumb key, it's always been okay.

You can see some good pictures that MD has below:
https://massdropinc.s3.amazonaws.com/img_bucket/ergo-dox-instruction/_W3T2091.jpg
https://massdropinc.s3.amazonaws.com/img_bucket/ergo-dox-instruction/_W3T2095.jpg

After looking at this, you might be able to put a costar plate-mount stabilizer in there.