Author Topic: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)  (Read 54304 times)

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Offline Puddsy

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Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #50 on: Tue, 15 November 2016, 15:09:34 »
Furnace is a better name.

Good looking set.
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Offline gandroider

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Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #51 on: Tue, 15 November 2016, 19:02:32 »
This better be a GB after the XDA finished, or else you destroy my wallet  :)) :))

Offline jchan94

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Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #52 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 01:58:04 »
This better be a GB after the XDA finished, or else you destroy my wallet  :)) :))

Aha looks early 2017.
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Offline wodan

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Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #53 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 02:24:30 »
That's a very nice and distinctive coloring scheme and I am very interested.

This is why I would like to bring the ISO-Essentials kit to your attention that was specifically designed with GMK base kits in mind:


With just 30 1u keycaps you can add support for five languages that have a strong presence in the keyboard community (ISO-UK, German, Danish, Swedish, Norwegian):

If you were planning to keep the same caps from the GMK Hydro GB, it's actually only 25 additional 1u keys you need to accomplish this since 5 of the keys are already included in HYDRO. The markup should be less than 15$ according to GMK.

I am currently building a mailing list of users from these countries, also looking into their national communities that are not DT, GH or /r/mk, and actively advertise all GBs that include ISO-Essentials keycaps to them:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=85823.0

Offline jchan94

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Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #54 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 02:35:14 »
That's a very nice and distinctive coloring scheme and I am very interested.

This is why I would like to bring the ISO-Essentials kit to your attention that was specifically designed with GMK base kits in mind:
Show Image


With just 30 1u keycaps you can add support for five languages that have a strong presence in the keyboard community (ISO-UK, German, Danish, Swedish, Norwegian):
Show Image

If you were planning to keep the same caps from the GMK Hydro GB, it's actually only 25 additional 1u keys you need to accomplish this since 5 of the keys are already included in HYDRO. The markup should be less than 15$ according to GMK.

I am currently building a mailing list of users from these countries, also looking into their national communities that are not DT, GH or /r/mk, and actively advertise all GBs that include ISO-Essentials keycaps to them:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=85823.0

I definitely see your concern with the ISO-essentials kits and such.

In no way am I trying to exclude those keys, but by adding those keys, the cost goes up $15.00 to at least 150 people, and while there are ISO users there, I believe that the cost is hard to justify for many people who will not use those keys.
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Offline wodan

  • Posts: 551
Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #55 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 02:54:46 »
There are currently no GMK keycap sets with NORDE support out there. Any set that offers this support at this point will receive a lot of interest from these countries. Many people there have long been waiting for a keycap set in their locale and never found one. Many of them stopped looking or switched to ANSI. I am trying to collect as many of them as possible and draw their attention to the GBs that support their locale layout.

With the help of buyers from NORDE countries, it might be possible to reach 250MOQ. This price drop would pay for the ISO-Essential keycaps.

Any GB participant who might not be interested in the ISO-Essential keycaps himself will still benefit from a better resell value of his keycaps. The few GMK keycap sets with international support will continue to be in high demand by all those looking for a localized set.

Offline jchan94

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Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #56 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 02:59:18 »
There are currently no GMK keycap sets with NORDE support out there. Any set that offers this support at this point will receive a lot of interest from these countries. Many people there have long been waiting for a keycap set in their locale and never found one. Many of them stopped looking or switched to ANSI. I am trying to collect as many of them as possible and draw their attention to the GBs that support their locale layout.

With the help of buyers from NORDE countries, it might be possible to reach 250MOQ. This price drop would pay for the ISO-Essential keycaps.

Any GB participant who might not be interested in the ISO-Essential keycaps himself will still benefit from a better resell value of his keycaps. The few GMK keycap sets with international support will continue to be in high demand by all those looking for a localized set.

Most definitely. If you have a mailing list, I would love to email people who need the keys and ask them if there is enough interest in running the ISO keys for Flames
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Offline wodan

  • Posts: 551
Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #57 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 03:02:43 »
I'll keep following this thread and try to get everyone on board before this leaves IC stage. Changes like this shouldn't be lobbied/pressed during a GB ...

Thanks for considering this, hope I can get this into one of your GMK GBs one day :)

Offline pomk

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Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #58 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 04:15:40 »
That's a very nice and distinctive coloring scheme and I am very interested.

This is why I would like to bring the ISO-Essentials kit to your attention that was specifically designed with GMK base kits in mind:
Show Image


With just 30 1u keycaps you can add support for five languages that have a strong presence in the keyboard community (ISO-UK, German, Danish, Swedish, Norwegian):
Show Image

If you were planning to keep the same caps from the GMK Hydro GB, it's actually only 25 additional 1u keys you need to accomplish this since 5 of the keys are already included in HYDRO. The markup should be less than 15$ according to GMK.

I am currently building a mailing list of users from these countries, also looking into their national communities that are not DT, GH or /r/mk, and actively advertise all GBs that include ISO-Essentials keycaps to them:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=85823.0

I definitely see your concern with the ISO-essentials kits and such.

In no way am I trying to exclude those keys, but by adding those keys, the cost goes up $15.00 to at least 150 people, and while there are ISO users there, I believe that the cost is hard to justify for many people who will not use those keys.
I'm not trying to be offensive, but based on previous large SP group buys and how well certain kits sell, the same can be said for the keys marked with red in the following illustration. These keys also cost a lot more than 15$ to include. I used 50% of the buyers as the qualifier.
153047-0
« Last Edit: Wed, 16 November 2016, 04:26:25 by pomk »

Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #59 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 09:22:40 »
Looks great! I'm in!

Offline romevi

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Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #60 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 09:26:42 »
That's a very nice and distinctive coloring scheme and I am very interested.

This is why I would like to bring the ISO-Essentials kit to your attention that was specifically designed with GMK base kits in mind:
Show Image


With just 30 1u keycaps you can add support for five languages that have a strong presence in the keyboard community (ISO-UK, German, Danish, Swedish, Norwegian):
Show Image

If you were planning to keep the same caps from the GMK Hydro GB, it's actually only 25 additional 1u keys you need to accomplish this since 5 of the keys are already included in HYDRO. The markup should be less than 15$ according to GMK.

I am currently building a mailing list of users from these countries, also looking into their national communities that are not DT, GH or /r/mk, and actively advertise all GBs that include ISO-Essentials keycaps to them:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=85823.0

I definitely see your concern with the ISO-essentials kits and such.

In no way am I trying to exclude those keys, but by adding those keys, the cost goes up $15.00 to at least 150 people, and while there are ISO users there, I believe that the cost is hard to justify for many people who will not use those keys.
I'm not trying to be offensive, but based on previous large SP group buys and how well certain kits sell, the same can be said for the keys marked with red in the following illustration. These keys also cost a lot more than 15$ to include. I used 50% of the buyers as the qualifier.
(Attachment Link)

There are more users who will use the keys marked in red than those who will use ISO-only keys. You have people in the Asian market as well who rely on many of the keys marked in red but who will not use the ISO-essentials keys. The ISO ones included already will provide for the basic ISO layout, but you won't have the keys required for specific languages.

Offline pomk

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Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #61 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 09:57:57 »
That's a very nice and distinctive coloring scheme and I am very interested.

This is why I would like to bring the ISO-Essentials kit to your attention that was specifically designed with GMK base kits in mind:
Show Image


With just 30 1u keycaps you can add support for five languages that have a strong presence in the keyboard community (ISO-UK, German, Danish, Swedish, Norwegian):
Show Image

If you were planning to keep the same caps from the GMK Hydro GB, it's actually only 25 additional 1u keys you need to accomplish this since 5 of the keys are already included in HYDRO. The markup should be less than 15$ according to GMK.

I am currently building a mailing list of users from these countries, also looking into their national communities that are not DT, GH or /r/mk, and actively advertise all GBs that include ISO-Essentials keycaps to them:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=85823.0

I definitely see your concern with the ISO-essentials kits and such.

In no way am I trying to exclude those keys, but by adding those keys, the cost goes up $15.00 to at least 150 people, and while there are ISO users there, I believe that the cost is hard to justify for many people who will not use those keys.
I'm not trying to be offensive, but based on previous large SP group buys and how well certain kits sell, the same can be said for the keys marked with red in the following illustration. These keys also cost a lot more than 15$ to include. I used 50% of the buyers as the qualifier.
(Attachment Link)

There are more users who will use the keys marked in red than those who will use ISO-only keys. You have people in the Asian market as well who rely on many of the keys marked in red but who will not use the ISO-essentials keys. The ISO ones included already will provide for the basic ISO layout, but you won't have the keys required for specific languages.
I'm merely pointing out that it is a fallacy adding keys that most do not need, while using the same rhetoric for justifying the exclusion of others. By your response, the removal of HHKB backspace should come as a given, as a stepped capslock is more popular. A fair resolution would be to have a 'need/dont need' poll for all keys and set the bar at a certain qualifier, but do note that there are more ISO users than HHKB backspace users.

I know that it is easy to think that you could someday find use for specialized keys for specific layouts, while you can never think of yourself using keys of a different locale.

Offline romevi

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Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #62 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 10:10:39 »
That's a very nice and distinctive coloring scheme and I am very interested.

This is why I would like to bring the ISO-Essentials kit to your attention that was specifically designed with GMK base kits in mind:
Show Image


With just 30 1u keycaps you can add support for five languages that have a strong presence in the keyboard community (ISO-UK, German, Danish, Swedish, Norwegian):
Show Image

If you were planning to keep the same caps from the GMK Hydro GB, it's actually only 25 additional 1u keys you need to accomplish this since 5 of the keys are already included in HYDRO. The markup should be less than 15$ according to GMK.

I am currently building a mailing list of users from these countries, also looking into their national communities that are not DT, GH or /r/mk, and actively advertise all GBs that include ISO-Essentials keycaps to them:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=85823.0

I definitely see your concern with the ISO-essentials kits and such.

In no way am I trying to exclude those keys, but by adding those keys, the cost goes up $15.00 to at least 150 people, and while there are ISO users there, I believe that the cost is hard to justify for many people who will not use those keys.
I'm not trying to be offensive, but based on previous large SP group buys and how well certain kits sell, the same can be said for the keys marked with red in the following illustration. These keys also cost a lot more than 15$ to include. I used 50% of the buyers as the qualifier.
(Attachment Link)

There are more users who will use the keys marked in red than those who will use ISO-only keys. You have people in the Asian market as well who rely on many of the keys marked in red but who will not use the ISO-essentials keys. The ISO ones included already will provide for the basic ISO layout, but you won't have the keys required for specific languages.
I'm merely pointing out that it is a fallacy adding keys that most do not need, while using the same rhetoric for justifying the exclusion of others. By your response, the removal of HHKB backspace should come as a given, as a stepped capslock is more popular. A fair resolution would be to have a 'need/dont need' poll for all keys and set the bar at a certain qualifier, but do note that there are more ISO users than HHKB backspace users.

I know that it is easy to think that you could someday find use for specialized keys for specific layouts, while you can never think of yourself using keys of a different locale.

No, I'm thinking more globally. You eliminated the num pad keys, as well as a few others required for Winkeyless boards, which many more in Asian countries and other parts of the world use. For the ISO-specific ones, you have users located primarily in certain European countries who will use them only. In many of the previous keyset runs, the language-specific kits usually fall way behind (I remember Trouble Minds as one I joined which had trouble accumulating orders for that kit, and that was even on Massdrop).
Of course, it could be that jchan is thinking that the language kits won't be as successful as if he were running the set on Massdrop, which brings in a lot more traffic than Keyclack.

Offline pomk

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Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #63 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 10:44:06 »
That's a very nice and distinctive coloring scheme and I am very interested.

This is why I would like to bring the ISO-Essentials kit to your attention that was specifically designed with GMK base kits in mind:
Show Image


With just 30 1u keycaps you can add support for five languages that have a strong presence in the keyboard community (ISO-UK, German, Danish, Swedish, Norwegian):
Show Image

If you were planning to keep the same caps from the GMK Hydro GB, it's actually only 25 additional 1u keys you need to accomplish this since 5 of the keys are already included in HYDRO. The markup should be less than 15$ according to GMK.

I am currently building a mailing list of users from these countries, also looking into their national communities that are not DT, GH or /r/mk, and actively advertise all GBs that include ISO-Essentials keycaps to them:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=85823.0

I definitely see your concern with the ISO-essentials kits and such.

In no way am I trying to exclude those keys, but by adding those keys, the cost goes up $15.00 to at least 150 people, and while there are ISO users there, I believe that the cost is hard to justify for many people who will not use those keys.
I'm not trying to be offensive, but based on previous large SP group buys and how well certain kits sell, the same can be said for the keys marked with red in the following illustration. These keys also cost a lot more than 15$ to include. I used 50% of the buyers as the qualifier.
(Attachment Link)

There are more users who will use the keys marked in red than those who will use ISO-only keys. You have people in the Asian market as well who rely on many of the keys marked in red but who will not use the ISO-essentials keys. The ISO ones included already will provide for the basic ISO layout, but you won't have the keys required for specific languages.
I'm merely pointing out that it is a fallacy adding keys that most do not need, while using the same rhetoric for justifying the exclusion of others. By your response, the removal of HHKB backspace should come as a given, as a stepped capslock is more popular. A fair resolution would be to have a 'need/dont need' poll for all keys and set the bar at a certain qualifier, but do note that there are more ISO users than HHKB backspace users.

I know that it is easy to think that you could someday find use for specialized keys for specific layouts, while you can never think of yourself using keys of a different locale.

No, I'm thinking more globally. You eliminated the num pad keys, as well as a few others required for Winkeyless boards, which many more in Asian countries and other parts of the world use. For the ISO-specific ones, you have users located primarily in certain European countries who will use them only. In many of the previous keyset runs, the language-specific kits usually fall way behind (I remember Trouble Minds as one I joined which had trouble accumulating orders for that kit, and that was even on Massdrop).
Of course, it could be that jchan is thinking that the language kits won't be as successful as if he were running the set on Massdrop, which brings in a lot more traffic than Keyclack.
Great that you are thinking globally! Maybe Europe will fit in your world some day.
When I marked the keys out I just selected the ones that less than 50% would buy as part of a GB, if given choice, based on previous GBs which had higher fidelity in the kit contents than is typically possible on a GMK buy. At 25~40% you could add numpad, then the rest is difficult to ascertain, as they are typically bundled even in SP GBs due to their low volume. Qualifier for winkeyless can sometimes be determined if 7U spacebars are sold only separately and for example on granite R4 winkeyless would be qualified at under 8%, which is already marginally lower than the qualifier for uk+international at 9%.

Offline romevi

  • Formerly romevi
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Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #64 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 10:51:23 »
That's a very nice and distinctive coloring scheme and I am very interested.

This is why I would like to bring the ISO-Essentials kit to your attention that was specifically designed with GMK base kits in mind:
Show Image


With just 30 1u keycaps you can add support for five languages that have a strong presence in the keyboard community (ISO-UK, German, Danish, Swedish, Norwegian):
Show Image

If you were planning to keep the same caps from the GMK Hydro GB, it's actually only 25 additional 1u keys you need to accomplish this since 5 of the keys are already included in HYDRO. The markup should be less than 15$ according to GMK.

I am currently building a mailing list of users from these countries, also looking into their national communities that are not DT, GH or /r/mk, and actively advertise all GBs that include ISO-Essentials keycaps to them:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=85823.0

I definitely see your concern with the ISO-essentials kits and such.

In no way am I trying to exclude those keys, but by adding those keys, the cost goes up $15.00 to at least 150 people, and while there are ISO users there, I believe that the cost is hard to justify for many people who will not use those keys.
I'm not trying to be offensive, but based on previous large SP group buys and how well certain kits sell, the same can be said for the keys marked with red in the following illustration. These keys also cost a lot more than 15$ to include. I used 50% of the buyers as the qualifier.
(Attachment Link)

There are more users who will use the keys marked in red than those who will use ISO-only keys. You have people in the Asian market as well who rely on many of the keys marked in red but who will not use the ISO-essentials keys. The ISO ones included already will provide for the basic ISO layout, but you won't have the keys required for specific languages.
I'm merely pointing out that it is a fallacy adding keys that most do not need, while using the same rhetoric for justifying the exclusion of others. By your response, the removal of HHKB backspace should come as a given, as a stepped capslock is more popular. A fair resolution would be to have a 'need/dont need' poll for all keys and set the bar at a certain qualifier, but do note that there are more ISO users than HHKB backspace users.

I know that it is easy to think that you could someday find use for specialized keys for specific layouts, while you can never think of yourself using keys of a different locale.

No, I'm thinking more globally. You eliminated the num pad keys, as well as a few others required for Winkeyless boards, which many more in Asian countries and other parts of the world use. For the ISO-specific ones, you have users located primarily in certain European countries who will use them only. In many of the previous keyset runs, the language-specific kits usually fall way behind (I remember Trouble Minds as one I joined which had trouble accumulating orders for that kit, and that was even on Massdrop).
Of course, it could be that jchan is thinking that the language kits won't be as successful as if he were running the set on Massdrop, which brings in a lot more traffic than Keyclack.
Great that you are thinking globally! Maybe Europe will fit in your world some day.
When I marked the keys out I just selected the ones that less than 50% would buy as part of a GB, if given choice, based on previous GBs which had higher fidelity in the kit contents than is typically possible on a GMK buy. At 25~40% you could add numpad, then the rest is difficult to ascertain, as they are typically bundled even in SP GBs due to their low volume. Qualifier for winkeyless can sometimes be determined if 7U spacebars are sold only separately and for example on granite R4 winkeyless would be qualified at under 8%, which is already marginally lower than the qualifier for uk+international at 9%.

The insult is unnecessary.

As for the keys, those are the keys that are bundled as standard with most GMK sets. You marked off a good deal of them which many nowadays come as part of the main kit. My intention was never to add the ISO-specific sets, but a retort of your removal of many of the keys which are now considered part of the main kit in many, if not all, of the recent GMK GBs. There are far many more users of Winkeyless and full-size keyboards in this hobby than there are of language-specific kits. Or perhaps that's just the vocal majority; I'm basing my view on the pictures I've seen on geekhack, /r/mechanicalkeyboards, Massdrop, and Slack. (I don't frequent deskthority as much these days, so I can't gauge my opinion on that. However, when I did browse there frequently they seemed more inclined to older keyboards and keysets than modern sets (save, of course, for 7bit's stuff).)
For the extras, those are based on jchan's personal preference for his set.

Offline pomk

  • Posts: 470
  • Location: Finland
Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #65 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 11:26:39 »
That's a very nice and distinctive coloring scheme and I am very interested.

This is why I would like to bring the ISO-Essentials kit to your attention that was specifically designed with GMK base kits in mind:
Show Image


With just 30 1u keycaps you can add support for five languages that have a strong presence in the keyboard community (ISO-UK, German, Danish, Swedish, Norwegian):
Show Image

If you were planning to keep the same caps from the GMK Hydro GB, it's actually only 25 additional 1u keys you need to accomplish this since 5 of the keys are already included in HYDRO. The markup should be less than 15$ according to GMK.

I am currently building a mailing list of users from these countries, also looking into their national communities that are not DT, GH or /r/mk, and actively advertise all GBs that include ISO-Essentials keycaps to them:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=85823.0

I definitely see your concern with the ISO-essentials kits and such.

In no way am I trying to exclude those keys, but by adding those keys, the cost goes up $15.00 to at least 150 people, and while there are ISO users there, I believe that the cost is hard to justify for many people who will not use those keys.
I'm not trying to be offensive, but based on previous large SP group buys and how well certain kits sell, the same can be said for the keys marked with red in the following illustration. These keys also cost a lot more than 15$ to include. I used 50% of the buyers as the qualifier.
(Attachment Link)

There are more users who will use the keys marked in red than those who will use ISO-only keys. You have people in the Asian market as well who rely on many of the keys marked in red but who will not use the ISO-essentials keys. The ISO ones included already will provide for the basic ISO layout, but you won't have the keys required for specific languages.
I'm merely pointing out that it is a fallacy adding keys that most do not need, while using the same rhetoric for justifying the exclusion of others. By your response, the removal of HHKB backspace should come as a given, as a stepped capslock is more popular. A fair resolution would be to have a 'need/dont need' poll for all keys and set the bar at a certain qualifier, but do note that there are more ISO users than HHKB backspace users.

I know that it is easy to think that you could someday find use for specialized keys for specific layouts, while you can never think of yourself using keys of a different locale.

No, I'm thinking more globally. You eliminated the num pad keys, as well as a few others required for Winkeyless boards, which many more in Asian countries and other parts of the world use. For the ISO-specific ones, you have users located primarily in certain European countries who will use them only. In many of the previous keyset runs, the language-specific kits usually fall way behind (I remember Trouble Minds as one I joined which had trouble accumulating orders for that kit, and that was even on Massdrop).
Of course, it could be that jchan is thinking that the language kits won't be as successful as if he were running the set on Massdrop, which brings in a lot more traffic than Keyclack.
Great that you are thinking globally! Maybe Europe will fit in your world some day.
When I marked the keys out I just selected the ones that less than 50% would buy as part of a GB, if given choice, based on previous GBs which had higher fidelity in the kit contents than is typically possible on a GMK buy. At 25~40% you could add numpad, then the rest is difficult to ascertain, as they are typically bundled even in SP GBs due to their low volume. Qualifier for winkeyless can sometimes be determined if 7U spacebars are sold only separately and for example on granite R4 winkeyless would be qualified at under 8%, which is already marginally lower than the qualifier for uk+international at 9%.

The insult is unnecessary.

As for the keys, those are the keys that are bundled as standard with most GMK sets. You marked off a good deal of them which many nowadays come as part of the main kit. My intention was never to add the ISO-specific sets, but a retort of your removal of many of the keys which are now considered part of the main kit in many, if not all, of the recent GMK GBs. There are far many more users of Winkeyless and full-size keyboards in this hobby than there are of language-specific kits. Or perhaps that's just the vocal majority; I'm basing my view on the pictures I've seen on geekhack, /r/mechanicalkeyboards, Massdrop, and Slack. (I don't frequent deskthority as much these days, so I can't gauge my opinion on that. However, when I did browse there frequently they seemed more inclined to older keyboards and keysets than modern sets (save, of course, for 7bit's stuff).)
For the extras, those are based on jchan's personal preference for his set.
I have noticed that you are against adding locale specific keys. I am for adding them, if that was unclear.
I am merely stating that the 'de-facto' standard GMK set content does not make sense if championed by anything else than the arbitrariness of the GB leader. I stated my viewpoint because jchan defended his arbitrary kit content based on what most use and or need, and that there might be more ISO users who would make use of the locale specific keys than there are for some keys that are already included in the 'de-facto' GMK kit contents.
Do you have statistics from your picture analysis? My analysis on the subject is based on how well kits typically sell, although the demographic for GMK buys might be vastly different from SP group buys.

Offline Vigrith

  • Posts: 1843
Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #66 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 13:30:34 »
Without meaning to prolong the discussion... NORDE is just not popular enough as per the numbers ran by every buy of the last x amount of time. It's a shame because I'm all for inclusion, I reside in an ISO country as well as I've stated elsewhere (though I use ANSI) but it's about cost/efficiency. You're not going to impose an extra $15 or 20 or however much is necessary to cover NORDE and such specific layouts, you cannot do that whilst being cost efficient. The cash things like a numpad pull in (and would pull out if removed) on the other hand is sizeable compared to Norwegian keys for example, if there's a choice to be made the choice will err on the side of the majority, so long as there has to be a choice you will not be able to sway that but with numbers.

You're in the minority if you're using any kind of ISO, that's indisputable, big part of it surely being that paying import tax/large shipping fees on things that come from outside of the EU - you can't change that, and so long as the minority is so minute it's not going to happen. No one would oppose to it if the costs were $0, no one's against helping others I would assume (or hope), but they are not.

Offline pomk

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Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #67 on: Wed, 16 November 2016, 13:47:19 »
Without meaning to prolong the discussion... NORDE is just not popular enough as per the numbers ran by every buy of the last x amount of time. It's a shame because I'm all for inclusion, I reside in an ISO country as well as I've stated elsewhere (though I use ANSI) but it's about cost/efficiency. You're not going to impose an extra $15 or 20 or however much is necessary to cover NORDE and such specific layouts, you cannot do that whilst being cost efficient. The cash things like a numpad pull in (and would pull out if removed) on the other hand is sizeable compared to Norwegian keys for example, if there's a choice to be made the choice will err on the side of the majority, so long as there has to be a choice you will not be able to sway that but with numbers.

You're in the minority if you're using any kind of ISO, that's indisputable, big part of it surely being that paying import tax/large shipping fees on things that come from outside of the EU - you can't change that, and so long as the minority is so minute it's not going to happen. No one would oppose to it if the costs were $0, no one's against helping others I would assume (or hope), but they are not.
I wonder what is the price of the 1.5-1-1.5-7-1.5-1-1.5 bottom row? From the granite R4 analysis it seems that it is about as popular as norde-uk would be.

Offline potatobot

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-18-16 Renders added)
« Reply #68 on: Fri, 18 November 2016, 08:52:28 »
oh its pyro now.  ;D

Offline romevi

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Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #69 on: Fri, 18 November 2016, 09:16:50 »
Without meaning to prolong the discussion... NORDE is just not popular enough as per the numbers ran by every buy of the last x amount of time. It's a shame because I'm all for inclusion, I reside in an ISO country as well as I've stated elsewhere (though I use ANSI) but it's about cost/efficiency. You're not going to impose an extra $15 or 20 or however much is necessary to cover NORDE and such specific layouts, you cannot do that whilst being cost efficient. The cash things like a numpad pull in (and would pull out if removed) on the other hand is sizeable compared to Norwegian keys for example, if there's a choice to be made the choice will err on the side of the majority, so long as there has to be a choice you will not be able to sway that but with numbers.

You're in the minority if you're using any kind of ISO, that's indisputable, big part of it surely being that paying import tax/large shipping fees on things that come from outside of the EU - you can't change that, and so long as the minority is so minute it's not going to happen. No one would oppose to it if the costs were $0, no one's against helping others I would assume (or hope), but they are not.
I wonder what is the price of the 1.5-1-1.5-7-1.5-1-1.5 bottom row? From the granite R4 analysis it seems that it is about as popular as norde-uk would be.

It's my assumption, from my time being here and other keyboard forums, that Winkeyless is more popular than any ISO kit; you have people in ISO using 7u space bars, as well as all over the rest of the world. You have to remember that Granite was in its fourth run at the time, so it may be that people already picked up the main kits in earlier rounds. I remember the thread for Granite in its latest round and there were many who were joining simply to pick up any odd child packs they didn't already obtain in earlier rounds.
GMK sets cannot be compared easily to how SP sets are broken and run. GMK standard main packs are very similar to what's being done in this IC--not much more, not much less.

Offline pomk

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Re: [IC] GMK Flames
« Reply #70 on: Fri, 18 November 2016, 10:17:47 »
Without meaning to prolong the discussion... NORDE is just not popular enough as per the numbers ran by every buy of the last x amount of time. It's a shame because I'm all for inclusion, I reside in an ISO country as well as I've stated elsewhere (though I use ANSI) but it's about cost/efficiency. You're not going to impose an extra $15 or 20 or however much is necessary to cover NORDE and such specific layouts, you cannot do that whilst being cost efficient. The cash things like a numpad pull in (and would pull out if removed) on the other hand is sizeable compared to Norwegian keys for example, if there's a choice to be made the choice will err on the side of the majority, so long as there has to be a choice you will not be able to sway that but with numbers.

You're in the minority if you're using any kind of ISO, that's indisputable, big part of it surely being that paying import tax/large shipping fees on things that come from outside of the EU - you can't change that, and so long as the minority is so minute it's not going to happen. No one would oppose to it if the costs were $0, no one's against helping others I would assume (or hope), but they are not.
I wonder what is the price of the 1.5-1-1.5-7-1.5-1-1.5 bottom row? From the granite R4 analysis it seems that it is about as popular as norde-uk would be.

It's my assumption, from my time being here and other keyboard forums, that Winkeyless is more popular than any ISO kit; you have people in ISO using 7u space bars, as well as all over the rest of the world. You have to remember that Granite was in its fourth run at the time, so it may be that people already picked up the main kits in earlier rounds. I remember the thread for Granite in its latest round and there were many who were joining simply to pick up any odd child packs they didn't already obtain in earlier rounds.
GMK sets cannot be compared easily to how SP sets are broken and run. GMK standard main packs are very similar to what's being done in this IC--not much more, not much less.
I'm well aware of what previous gmk sets have comprised of. I would not be voicing my opinion if I did not want a slight change to it.

There are also european people living across the world, same as winkeyless users. Also, why the sudden interest in winkeyless ISO users? You did not seem to have any before. I dare to say that if an opportunity, first ever, to buy an international gmk set presents itself, I don't think that a small issue like 1,5U mods are going to make one not buy the set.

As far as I know the fourth granite run was the largest one yet, and if people were, as you suggest, mainly picking extras, would it not show as an additional interest in, say, winkeyless layout? By your argument the popularity of winkeyless layout would be even lower than 8% in a typical buy.

If SP kit popularity/structure cannot be used to determine the need for certain keys, how can you at the same time use them to say that international keys are a small minority?

Offline skcheng

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-18-16 Renders added)
« Reply #71 on: Fri, 18 November 2016, 10:59:53 »
I really like the original mock up.   Red print over over orange.

Can we also get nibbed F and J keys as well??

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-18-16 Renders added)
« Reply #72 on: Sun, 20 November 2016, 07:00:09 »
I really like the original mock up.   Red print over over orange.

Can we also get nibbed F and J keys as well??

No nibs, only bars. Sorry mate :P
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Offline jchan94

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Render)
« Reply #73 on: Fri, 25 November 2016, 07:47:54 »
Got a GMK render back right now and updated the thread :)

Edit:

Looks like they put white legends on the addon color mods. What do you think of them ?
« Last Edit: Fri, 25 November 2016, 07:51:21 by jchan94 »
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Offline pomk

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Render)
« Reply #74 on: Fri, 25 November 2016, 08:09:41 »
Got a GMK render back right now and updated the thread :)

Edit:

Looks like they put white legends on the addon color mods. What do you think of them ?
Needs some nordic ISO love, otherwise a great looking set!  :thumb:

Offline neralo

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #75 on: Sat, 26 November 2016, 21:50:53 »
i'm a fan of the orange red, but overall the set isn't for me. I hope this does as well or better than Hydro!

Now, wake me up when GMK Electric becomes a thing. That set looks pretty much right up my alley.
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Offline catweewee

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Render)
« Reply #76 on: Sat, 26 November 2016, 22:22:37 »
Got a GMK render back right now and updated the thread :)

Edit:

Looks like they put white legends on the addon color mods. What do you think of them ?

I like!

Will there be scooped F and Js?

Offline poolside

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Render)
« Reply #77 on: Sun, 27 November 2016, 07:02:19 »
Got a GMK render back right now and updated the thread :)

Edit:

Looks like they put white legends on the addon color mods. What do you think of them ?

White and gray both look good to me. Hydro had gray legends, why not go with white this time?

Also good job with the fat arrows on the 1.5u R2 and 1u R1 Backspace caps.  :thumb:
I prefer them to the standard slimmer arrows on smaller caps not large enough to accommodate the arrow and the "Backspace" legend.

Offline jchan94

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #78 on: Sun, 27 November 2016, 07:43:16 »
Got a GMK render back right now and updated the thread :)

Edit:

Looks like they put white legends on the addon color mods. What do you think of them ?

White and gray both look good to me. Hydro had gray legends, why not go with white this time?

Also good job with the fat arrows on the 1.5u R2 and 1u R1 Backspace caps.  :thumb:
I prefer them to the standard slimmer arrows on smaller caps not large enough to accommodate the arrow and the "Backspace" legend.

Got a GMK render back right now and updated the thread :)

Edit:

Looks like they put white legends on the addon color mods. What do you think of them ?

I like!

Will there be scooped F and Js?

Yes, F and J are scooped and also include barred versions.

Ah yes, I think we'll change it to the N9 keys then for consistency :D
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Offline catweewee

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #79 on: Sun, 27 November 2016, 08:55:45 »
Got a GMK render back right now and updated the thread :)

Edit:

Looks like they put white legends on the addon color mods. What do you think of them ?


White and gray both look good to me. Hydro had gray legends, why not go with white this time?

Also good job with the fat arrows on the 1.5u R2 and 1u R1 Backspace caps.  :thumb:
I prefer them to the standard slimmer arrows on smaller caps not large enough to accommodate the arrow and the "Backspace" legend.

Got a GMK render back right now and updated the thread :)

Edit:

Looks like they put white legends on the addon color mods. What do you think of them ?

I like!

Will there be scooped F and Js?

Yes, F and J are scooped and also include barred versions.

Ah yes, I think we'll change it to the N9 keys then for consistency :D

Sorry what change? Are you keep the white on orange keys? I think they look sick. Adds character to the whole set.

Offline duynguyenle

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #80 on: Sun, 27 November 2016, 10:51:16 »
Got a GMK render back right now and updated the thread :)

Edit:

Looks like they put white legends on the addon color mods. What do you think of them ?

White and gray both look good to me. Hydro had gray legends, why not go with white this time?

Also good job with the fat arrows on the 1.5u R2 and 1u R1 Backspace caps.  :thumb:
I prefer them to the standard slimmer arrows on smaller caps not large enough to accommodate the arrow and the "Backspace" legend.

Got a GMK render back right now and updated the thread :)

Edit:

Looks like they put white legends on the addon color mods. What do you think of them ?

I like!

Will there be scooped F and Js?

Yes, F and J are scooped and also include barred versions.

Ah yes, I think we'll change it to the N9 keys then for consistency :D

Hi jchan, for this particular colour scheme, I certainly think White on Red looks much better than N9 on Red, I understand the desire to maintain consistency between sets but in this case white looks better. Although I would still like to see the mockup with N9 on red, just to see how it would fit in with the whole set
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Offline jchan94

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #81 on: Sun, 27 November 2016, 10:53:28 »
Got a GMK render back right now and updated the thread :)

Edit:

Looks like they put white legends on the addon color mods. What do you think of them ?

White and gray both look good to me. Hydro had gray legends, why not go with white this time?

Also good job with the fat arrows on the 1.5u R2 and 1u R1 Backspace caps.  :thumb:
I prefer them to the standard slimmer arrows on smaller caps not large enough to accommodate the arrow and the "Backspace" legend.

Got a GMK render back right now and updated the thread :)

Edit:

Looks like they put white legends on the addon color mods. What do you think of them ?

I like!

Will there be scooped F and Js?

Yes, F and J are scooped and also include barred versions.

Ah yes, I think we'll change it to the N9 keys then for consistency :D

Hi jchan, for this particular colour scheme, I certainly think White on Red looks much better than N9 on Red, I understand the desire to maintain consistency between sets but in this case white looks better. Although I would still like to see the mockup with N9 on red, just to see how it would fit in with the whole set

You are most definitely correct. I've talked it over with a few people and they believe the RED and WHITE will be best for it.

I think we will push forward with this GMK render when we are ready to launch it.

More news to come as we press and finalize the novelty designs.
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Offline neralo

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #82 on: Sun, 27 November 2016, 22:27:21 »


More news to come as we press and finalize the novelty designs.


Looking forward to novelties, probably will jump on those at the very least!


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Offline Jeu

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #83 on: Tue, 29 November 2016, 17:04:34 »
Is it going to be more orange like the GMK mockup or more red like the renders done by Zan? Upon closer inspection it seems more orange than I remember anyways....anywho looks good!

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #84 on: Tue, 29 November 2016, 17:53:46 »
Is it going to be more orange like the GMK mockup or more red like the renders done by Zan? Upon closer inspection it seems more orange than I remember anyways....anywho looks good!

Colors are GMK colors:

 
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Offline smart5088

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #85 on: Fri, 09 December 2016, 23:43:37 »
GMK Electric interest.!

Offline maximm

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #86 on: Sat, 10 December 2016, 02:34:54 »
Im down with this. Do a green set after the red :)

Offline jchan94

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #87 on: Sat, 10 December 2016, 05:16:38 »
Probably going Red then Yellow as I spend more time on the green one
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Offline KetchyKech

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #88 on: Thu, 05 January 2017, 12:55:13 »
People are crazy for hydro and im just here like...... PYRRROOOOOOO

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Offline romevi

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #89 on: Thu, 05 January 2017, 13:19:25 »
People are crazy for hydro and im just here like...... PYRRROOOOOOO

Show Image


Hydro is definitely my favorite GMK set, but I may have to get this and the Zelda-themed one so I have all three sets!

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #90 on: Thu, 05 January 2017, 13:22:44 »
People are crazy for hydro and im just here like...... PYRRROOOOOOO

Show Image


Hydro is definitely my favorite GMK set, but I may have to get this and the Zelda-themed one so I have all three sets!

oh man...this is the first I hear of a possible zelda set...

@_@ sounds like a dream
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Offline romevi

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #91 on: Thu, 05 January 2017, 13:27:58 »
People are crazy for hydro and im just here like...... PYRRROOOOOOO

Show Image


Hydro is definitely my favorite GMK set, but I may have to get this and the Zelda-themed one so I have all three sets!

oh man...this is the first I hear of a possible zelda set...

@_@ sounds like a dream

Well, it started as the complementary set to Hydro and Pyro, but didn't work as well as he wanted, so now it's looking like a Hylian theme.



https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=84258.msg2246721#msg2246721

Offline smittysteve

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #92 on: Thu, 05 January 2017, 13:32:59 »
People are crazy for hydro and im just here like...... PYRRROOOOOOO

Show Image


Hydro is definitely my favorite GMK set, but I may have to get this and the Zelda-themed one so I have all three sets!

Agreed- so dang excited that Hydro is in the now-foreseeable future! Pyro looks pretty dang sweet too- the black and red combo is such a classic... And Zelda?? Guessing that will be the green set? Yes, please.

With Hydro shipping soon then on to the JC65, hoping/ guessing Pyro rolls onward February-ish? All are really great key sets, Jchan- great start to 2017!

Offline Overchecken8

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #93 on: Thu, 05 January 2017, 13:39:33 »
People are crazy for hydro and im just here like...... PYRRROOOOOOO

Show Image


Hydro is definitely my favorite GMK set, but I may have to get this and the Zelda-themed one so I have all three sets!

oh man...this is the first I hear of a possible zelda set...

@_@ sounds like a dream

Well, it started as the complementary set to Hydro and Pyro, but didn't work as well as he wanted, so now it's looking like a Hylian theme.

Show Image


https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=84258.msg2246721#msg2246721
Hylian alphas are the dream

Offline boost

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #94 on: Thu, 05 January 2017, 13:40:27 »
count me in!
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Offline Vigrith

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #95 on: Thu, 05 January 2017, 13:46:44 »
Hylian alphas are the dream

100%. I'm sure JC hasn't forgotten about Forare, I know I haven't, and given the fact it is DSA having Hylian alphas should be just as easy as it was for Granite and XDA to get Tengwar - who knows, if XDA succeeds maybe we'll even have XDA Forare instead of DSA.

Offline Chazmondo

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #96 on: Wed, 11 January 2017, 08:34:30 »
Super interested in electric, or should I say electro?  :thumb:

Offline RupturedChaos

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #97 on: Wed, 11 January 2017, 12:34:49 »
Really like the Pyro set. Would definitely be picking one up


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Offline _BMW_M3_

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #98 on: Sun, 15 January 2017, 19:15:44 »
Finally another red keyset for red boards :)
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Offline smittysteve

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Re: [IC] GMK Pyro (11-25-16 GMK Mockup added)
« Reply #99 on: Sun, 15 January 2017, 19:53:24 »
Agreed. I like this one a lot. In for sure when it goes up.