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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: brainandforce on Mon, 16 September 2019, 17:25:04
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Recently, Unicomp posted a photo of their Lexington factory on their Facebook page. However, when you look closely at the center, you'll notice an interesting detail:
[attachimg=1]
It looks like they have manufactured a new SSK, which is a big development. This leaves me with 2 questions: first, are they using the original IBM molds for this keyboard, and second, when can I get one??
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Wow, and it's only about, what, 4 or 5 years after they promised they'd have one of these ready for Christmas?
That's not an IBM mold as there are extra keys. And I think I see LED's over the right side function keys, which could make sense, in a way, if they're using a controller mounted above the navigation cluster, the could have a daughter LED with it. And using the same controller as the fullsize would be a cost saving move.
I suspect they're targeting the holiday season for announcement.
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I'm just happy to see they're still in operation.
I'd love for them to make an SSK version as TKL is very important to many of us.
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Is the new SS competitively priced or Nostalgia priced ?
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Is the new SS competitively priced or Nostalgia priced ?
asking the real questions here
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I wish they'd make a 122 in a layout more resembling "ANSI 103 + more rows and columns".
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Plot twist. It's a membrane keyboard :p :p :p :p :p or a model f?
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Hopefully it's not just a prototype bait and they actually produce something!
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Now if only someone could persuade them to throw a better pointing stick module and one of those fancy NKRO membranes that a few of the gaming companies are using into the EnduraPro...then I wouldn't have to think about keyboards anymore.
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From the Facebook thread:
Third, we took the picture of the factory at the request of the writer of the CNBC article to add a little touch of humanity to a rather dry discussion of tariffs, but they choose not to use the photo. So, we choose to post it with a link to the article. We put the tenkeyless model in the picture to support a conversation about the status of that project. No, it’s not a stealth announcement. But, in the way of status, some of the parts in that model, particularly the top and bottom cover, are first shot parts from new tooling. We’re working on improving the fit and the texturing of those tools. We have other tools and parts that are being developed and require testing. So, we’re still not close to setting announce dates or accepting orders. But we’re making good progress.
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From the Facebook thread:
Third, we took the picture of the factory at the request of the writer of the CNBC article to add a little touch of humanity to a rather dry discussion of tariffs, but they choose not to use the photo. So, we choose to post it with a link to the article. We put the tenkeyless model in the picture to support a conversation about the status of that project. No, it’s not a stealth announcement. But, in the way of status, some of the parts in that model, particularly the top and bottom cover, are first shot parts from new tooling. We’re working on improving the fit and the texturing of those tools. We have other tools and parts that are being developed and require testing. So, we’re still not close to setting announce dates or accepting orders. But we’re making good progress.
Rats.
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Neat
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I am curious if the new mold will help things. I was not impressed with the Unicomp keyboard I once owned, very flimsy case for one thing.
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Wow, and it's only about, what, 4 or 5 years after they promised they'd have one of these ready for Christmas?
I confess I have not paid particular attention to new keyboard offerings in some time, but I have been seeing talk of a Unicomp SSK off and on for years.
Is Unicomp a serious* going concern? Or is it, instead, a hobby for a small group of people who are anxious to maintain a low-pressure atmosphere and dawdle their way toward product releases? I am under the impression they meet the description of the latter rather than the former. However, I cannot claim to know very much about Unicomp's ways of doing business.
Admittedly, I am likely to be biased because of a brief but memorable acquaintanceship with jet-propelled Chinese manufacturers, who, if nothing else, are excellent at getting things under way.
(It is only later in the relationship that they introduce their hapless Western partners to the concept of "quality fade.")
*By "serious," I mean their profits are used to fund school fees, mortgages, etc.
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I confess I have not paid particular attention to new keyboard offerings in some time, but I have been seeing talk of a Unicomp SSK off and on for years.
Is Unicomp a serious* going concern? Or is it, instead, a hobby for a small group of people who are anxious to maintain a low-pressure atmosphere and dawdle their way toward product releases? I am under the impression they meet the description of the latter rather than the former. However, I cannot claim to know very much about Unicomp's ways of doing business.
Admittedly, I am likely to be biased because of a brief but memorable acquaintanceship with jet-propelled Chinese manufacturers, who, if nothing else, are excellent at getting things under way.
(It is only later in the relationship that they introduce their hapless Western partners to the concept of "quality fade.")
An interesting choice of thread to offload your strange worldviews in.
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So, is this finally my chance to play with buckling springs without having to waste all my desk space?
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So, is this finally my chance to play with buckling springs without having to waste all my desk space?
Maybe. But it'll likely take a few more years before it's released.
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So, is this finally my chance to play with buckling springs without having to waste all my desk space?
Note that a normal SSK is almost as big as a modern fullsize xD .
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So, is this finally my chance to play with buckling springs without having to waste all my desk space?
You may have tried this already, but just in case you have not: have you considered a keyboard tray?
I mention this because E TwentyNine was not having a laugh when he said Unicomp had raised everyone's hopes about this keyboard a half-decade ago:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=56668.msg1280920#msg1280920
With Unicomp claiming, "we’re making good progress," after 5 years with nothing to offer, I suspect they will have their SSK ready just in time for GHers to blow their first pension cheque on it.
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So, is this finally my chance to play with buckling springs without having to waste all my desk space?
You may have tried this already, but just in case you have not: have you considered a keyboard tray?
I mention this because E TwentyNine was not having a laugh when he said Unicomp had raised everyone's hopes about this keyboard a half-decade ago:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=56668.msg1280920#msg1280920
With Unicomp claiming, "we’re making good progress," after 5 years with nothing to offer, I suspect they will have their SSK ready just in time for GHers to blow their first pension cheque on it.
I doubt it. Most everyone already got the original ones by now. It took too long.
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Is the new SS competitively priced or Nostalgia priced ?
Chances are -- competitively priced. But by competitive priced, I mean reasonably priced for lower quality materials and deteriorating tooling. That said, for the mid 100's price point, I'd happily buy one if it means I don't wear out my original SSK.
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So, is this finally my chance to play with buckling springs without having to waste all my desk space?
Note that a normal SSK is almost as big as a modern fullsize xD .
LOL! So comparing the SSK to a full size is inconceivable!
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March 2020!
https://www.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=3377270405647589&id=401589123215747&sfnsn=mo
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March 2020!
https://www.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=3377270405647589&id=401589123215747&sfnsn=mo
IDK about that bottom row but it's pretty cool they're doing this :cool:
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Those crazy sons of *****es have finally done it!? And thank the IBM gods that they went with a (mostly) standard SSK TKL layout instead of that weird alternate one they floated a long time ago. If I didn't already have two SSKs I'd definitely be buying a gift certificate right now.
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$105 UNITED STATES FREEDOM UNITS, not too bad. I wouldnt mind picking one up but already have the Ellipse board coming in. Still I want I miss my ssk
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Pretty cool. I guess I need to sell my SSK before it goes down in value.
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Pretty cool. I guess I need to sell my SSK before it goes down in value.
Don't tell him guys...
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Over five years since the announcement, and it'll be six by the time it ships.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=56668
But good for them. At that price point is aggressive for what it is, hopefully it'll get some of these youngsters into the game.
I like the classic form factor, would like a classic bottom row even better. If they want to trim the perimeter of the keyboard, can see that version selling as well.
I do notice no embedded numpad side printing and no numlock key (but it has the light) so I'm guessing that stuff is planned but just isn't in the mockups or early pics.
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What frustrates me is the $10 surcharge for a 103 layout. I gave away my Customizer 104 a couple years ago but I loathe the new 104 layout.
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What frustrates me is the $10 surcharge for a 103 layout. I gave away my Customizer 104 a couple years ago but I loathe the new 104 layout.
if it's anything like the current full size keyboards with the same bottom row layout you should be able to swap to 103 yourself.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=67076.0
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In theory, you could just buy a 7u spacebar from them and do the mod yourself. I haven't tried this personally, but I can't think of any reason why it wouldn't work.
It does disappoint me that they don't just make the 103-key layout the default - the 104-key layout looks hideous, and the extra key doesn't really give you much useful functionality.
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Since SSK barely saves any space vs standard full size (thin bezel) cherry boards.
PERHAPS, they should splice further, and get down to 75/ 80% ??
People will buy it for nostalgia/ retroness, but it does still alienate the pragmatic users.
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The gift certificate method is an interesting way to raise funds for the tooling without crowd sourcing.
Has the added advantage that if the ssk cannot be delivered in the proposed timeframe, it can be used on another of Unicomp's products if the certificate holder were to become disenchanted with the wait (as has happened elsewhere).
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I want to believe, but it's hard to keep up hope after all this time. I'm a fairly big fan of what Unicomp does. (Not necessarily how they do it.) I want this to be successful.
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Check the Unicomp website, announcement was made. March 2020.
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Check the Unicomp website, announcement was made. March 2020.
...and what has that got to do with anything? Promises promises.
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Just pulled out the ol' EnduraPro for a change of pace and was checking their website. I feel like an out-of-touch grey beard at this point (and I have a few SSKs) but I will still buy one. This is good news, especially at that price. I am still amazed that they are somehow still in business. My hats off to them. I wonder if they will have more than one layout so that we can have new barrel frames.
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Check the Unicomp website, announcement was made. March 2020.
Just to rub it in a bit more: December 10th, 2014.....
Date: 2014-12-10 16:03:01
Name: Jeanne Deters
Printer friendly version
Message:
We are working on a tenkeyless keyboard, however, it is taking longer than anticipated. Look for more news on it in the next several months. Thanks for your interest.
You can follow us on FaceBook: FaceBook.com/pckeyboard
Regards,
Customer Service
Edit: One thing I can say is Unicomp customer service is the very best experience I have ever had. And Jeanne has helped me on several occasions and I have no complaints whatsoever. Good people!
I just had to let you know that they have been promising the keyboard for a very very very long time.
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They probably do not have enough money to make it, and are running into various blocks. There is a questionable demand for it, there are very few people who buy Unicomp anyway, and they must have postponed it in order to save money.
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They probably do not have enough money to make it, and are running into various blocks. There is a questionable demand for it, there are very few people who buy Unicomp anyway, and they must have postponed it in order to save money.
There seems to be an interesting, even uncomfortable, dichotomy there. Nobody seems to particularly want to buy anything from Unicomp. At the same time they don't want to see them fail either, because buckling spring production must continue at all costs.
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They probably do not have enough money to make it, and are running into various blocks. There is a questionable demand for it, there are very few people who buy Unicomp anyway, and they must have postponed it in order to save money.
There seems to be an interesting, even uncomfortable, dichotomy there. Nobody seems to particularly want to buy anything from Unicomp. At the same time they don't want to see them fail either, because buckling spring production must continue at all costs.
I've said it before and I'll say it again: takeover.
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I've said it before and I'll say it again: takeover.
Ellipse already gets caps from them, doesn't he? They would do well to form some sort of formal partnership with him, maybe move some of the Model F production to their facility, modernize/diversify the case and layout offerings, offer budget-oriented variants, etc.
I imagine that even if they had managed enough sales/production to economize that it would still cost quite a bit more than if the same were to happen with the current Chinese facility, but maybe people would be less reluctant to pay the current premium if "Made in the U.S.A." could be slapped onto the case.
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They probably do not have enough money to make it, and are running into various blocks. There is a questionable demand for it, there are very few people who buy Unicomp anyway, and they must have postponed it in order to save money.
There seems to be an interesting, even uncomfortable, dichotomy there. Nobody seems to particularly want to buy anything from Unicomp. At the same time they don't want to see them fail either, because buckling spring production must continue at all costs.
If by 'they' you mean people who buy their keyboards, I guess. It's unfortunate that the designs went to a company that refuses to innovate or have decent quality.
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I've been curious to see what's happened with this. Undoubtedly delayed due to Quarantine. I wonder how much this will slide the date. A few weeks? Or a few months? Or a few years?
We can't know with them.
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They probably do not have enough money to make it, and are running into various blocks. There is a questionable demand for it, there are very few people who buy Unicomp anyway, and they must have postponed it in order to save money.
There seems to be an interesting, even uncomfortable, dichotomy there. Nobody seems to particularly want to buy anything from Unicomp. At the same time they don't want to see them fail either, because buckling spring production must continue at all costs.
I throw a few bucks their way from time to time, There is no better source of new custom keys for IBM boards.
I've largely enjoyed them. Though I don't consider them equal to what they once were.
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I bought a new 103 from them recently. There's nothing inherently wrong with it (aside from nuclear-level blue LEDs) but it's probably a hard sale to a lot of crowds. The PCMR crowd wants RGB and NKRO. The Geekhack crowd wants MX mount keycaps. The /r/mk crowd wants a 25% because TKL isn't cool anymore. I personally want about 25 macro keys without compromising the main layout like the 122 does.
Unless you've already felt buckling springs and liked them, you're going to be seduced by another shiny object on the way to Unicomp.
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This is very very true.
I got me a Model M 5-2 from them, and then an M122, and loved them dearly. It was a major part of what got me into the hobby, and into buying and collecting old IBM boards as well.
And you are right in even my case. I got a ducky Shine 3 yellow before I bought them years ago because I loved the lights. But I always kept them in the back of my mind, eventually I bought from them and was quite happy. I do think their customer service is very good.
I just wish things had gone differently for them, but I feel like that's a pretty wide spread and held belief.
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Apparently, Unicomp is also releasing a new version of the full size M that will be heavier and made with new tooling: https://www.pckeyboard.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/Update%20and%20Announcement%20v_1.2.pdf
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I wonder where this is in development. The last update on Facebook is from August.
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I wonder where this is in development. The last update on Facebook is from August.
I had been wondering the same. I didn't even know they were doing updates via Facebook ... since it is Facebook, which I will never use. The comments section revealed a slightly more recent updated from SharktasticA (https://www.reddit.com/r/modelm/comments/jtohcj/update_from_unicomp_regarding_retiring_of_black/) though.
It basically just reiterated what they said previously, with no change in status.
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I will say that I have typed on the Mini M, and it feels good. Feels like an M. I would wager they're having difficulty getting in the quantity of PCBs and **** they need based on the preorders. This does not feel like a Matias-tier preorder. The product does exist, it's just Unicomp being Unicomp.
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I got "the email" today stating that it's now possible for gift certificate holders to purchase / pre-order the Mini M. The final cost for gift certificate holders will be $105 + shipping minus the gift certificate. Shipping is expected to start in 3-1/2 weeks on the first day of "spring" (ha!). US orders only at this point - international will come later after regulatory approvals.
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Same! Had preordered when it was first announced. Completed the preorder/order today! Excited, been waiting a long time for this
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Wow !!! Great news .. IMHO Model M Space Saver, the best keyboard in the world has been reloaded !
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That's fantastic to hear. I suppose I should have stopped being lazy and preordered a few weeks ago when I last had the urge. I really shouldn't even buy another Model M to begin with though.
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Our buddy SharktasticA got his hands on a prototype as well and has put out a typing video.
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Our buddy SharktasticA got his hands on a prototype as well and has put out a typing video.
I do indeed. Unicomp asked me to critically review an engineering sample to find any flaws to fix before shipment. I have an article coming later today with a lot of details about it. For now, enjoy this typing demo:
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So we can thank SharktasticA if it's great and we can organize the mob if it blows. Can't wait for the "[IC] SharktasticA witchhunt - a community-wide universal event"
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The video of Sharkastica has been watched with great dedication just today! Over!
:D Very nice
Is there any mechanical difference with the buckling spring switches of the original ?
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The video of Sharkastica has been watched with great dedication just today! Over!
:D Very nice
Is there any mechanical difference with the buckling spring switches of the original ?
No, the only thing about the switches that's changed is the membrane. It now effectively supports higher rollover.
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I've never owned a Model M, but seeing as I'm located in the same city as Unicomp AND they're shipping a new TKL M soon... Might be worth it. Would need to make some space though...
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I've never owned a Model M, but seeing as I'm located in the same city as Unicomp AND they're shipping a new TKL M soon... Might be worth it. Would need to make some space though...
Buckling spring is something that really needs to at least be experienced, even if you don't end up preferring it. They may let you in to see around and maybe try out a Model M. From everything I have seen, they seem to be pretty friendly people.
If you don't like some of the characteristics of the Model M, there's always the Model F.
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I've never owned a Model M, but seeing as I'm located in the same city as Unicomp AND they're shipping a new TKL M soon... Might be worth it. Would need to make some space though...
Buckling spring is something that really needs to at least be experienced, even if you don't end up preferring it. They may let you in to see around and maybe try out a Model M. From everything I have seen, they seem to be pretty friendly people.
If you don't like some of the characteristics of the Model M, there's always the Model F.
I'll put some thought into that! Honestly, I'd love to give them a shot before going in on a purchase. I don't like making uninformed decisions when the thing I'm buying is $100 or more.
And I've given some thought to looking at Model Fs, but what I'd really like to try is an IBM beamspring board. Just looks and sounds so satisfying to use, from the things I've seen. Definitely not anywhere still producing those though, to my knowledge at least!
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I've never owned a Model M, but seeing as I'm located in the same city as Unicomp AND they're shipping a new TKL M soon... Might be worth it. Would need to make some space though...
Buckling spring is something that really needs to at least be experienced, even if you don't end up preferring it. They may let you in to see around and maybe try out a Model M. From everything I have seen, they seem to be pretty friendly people.
If you don't like some of the characteristics of the Model M, there's always the Model F.
I'll put some thought into that! Honestly, I'd love to give them a shot before going in on a purchase. I don't like making uninformed decisions when the thing I'm buying is $100 or more.
And I've given some thought to looking at Model Fs, but what I'd really like to try is an IBM beamspring board. Just looks and sounds so satisfying to use, from the things I've seen. Definitely not anywhere still producing those though, to my knowledge at least!
Beam spring boards are pretty complex ... and built like literal tanks. If anyone were to ever want to recreate them, they would have a hard time selling them for a profit.
They're hard to describe. I can tell that the Model F was meant to feel similar. Beam Springs almost feel like they're not connected to anything at all. Almost all you feel is perfectly smooth travel down. The tactile event itself is more clicky (as in sound) than it even is tactile, yet it is still somehow satisfying.
There was a recycling place that had a displaywriter board a few months back. They knew what they had though, so I didn't want to cough up $1,000 for it, given the layout. That was my shot to try one though.
There is this (https://kono.store/blogs/keyboards/silo-beam), if it ever actually comes out. It certainly has the potential to dethrone Kaihua's box clickies.
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There is this (https://kono.store/blogs/keyboards/silo-beam), if it ever actually comes out. It certainly has the potential to dethrone Kaihua's box clickies.
Definitely going to look into that when I get home. Work VPN autoblocks shopping sites but not GH lol
Edit: Forgot to mention this, but I also have looked into beamsprings before. Watched Chyros' video breaking them down, as well as his review of a beamspring board. Made me super interested in trying them.
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Just released my article on my experience with the Mini Model M prototype:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=111415.0https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=111415.0
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Made me super interested in trying them.
The action is exquisite but the configuration is an abomination. Included in configuration is layout, which is "odd" in any variant. I am old and my muscle memory is so deeply ingrained that something that far from what I have been using for decades is pretty well out of the question. I even hate using my laptop and it has a good keyboard (an old Thinkpad 440P).
But the other component of "configuration" is height. I don't know the exact measurement but let's just say that it is 3 or 4 fingers from tabletop to key cap. If there was ever a perfect candidate for being embedded into the surface of a desk, that is it. Otherwise, you should seriously look into getting a shorter desk.
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A couple of the beamer variants aren't outrageously bad in layout, like the 5251. It's not far off from an XT. The height off the desk to start with is a pain. I tried to simulate it once and couldn't do it. I like an angle, but not that high. Maybe if the desk was higher.
In my experience with a beamer a long time ago, I remember it feeling like smooth and then punching a hole or something like that. I get why people like it but it's not for me. I might one day buy a 5251 though.
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A couple of the beamer variants aren't outrageously bad in layout, like the 5251. It's not far off from an XT. The height off the desk to start with is a pain. I tried to simulate it once and couldn't do it. I like an angle, but not that high. Maybe if the desk was higher.
In my experience with a beamer a long time ago, I remember it feeling like smooth and then punching a hole or something like that. I get why people like it but it's not for me. I might one day buy a 5251 though.
In my brief testing, I couldn't really even put a finger on anything about beam springs that were really necessarily any better than buckling spring or Alps SKCM, to my tastes. A Model F isn't that much less smooth, and I think I even prefer the way that the spring weight stacks sharply just before it buckles.
Maybe I would need to spend more time with a beam spring board though.
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A couple of the beamer variants aren't outrageously bad in layout, like the 5251. It's not far off from an XT. The height off the desk to start with is a pain. I tried to simulate it once and couldn't do it. I like an angle, but not that high. Maybe if the desk was higher.
In my experience with a beamer a long time ago, I remember it feeling like smooth and then punching a hole or something like that. I get why people like it but it's not for me. I might one day buy a 5251 though.
The action is exquisite but the configuration is an abomination. Included in configuration is layout, which is "odd" in any variant. I am old and my muscle memory is so deeply ingrained that something that far from what I have been using for decades is pretty well out of the question. I even hate using my laptop and it has a good keyboard (an old Thinkpad 440P).
But the other component of "configuration" is height. I don't know the exact measurement but let's just say that it is 3 or 4 fingers from tabletop to key cap. If there was ever a perfect candidate for being embedded into the surface of a desk, that is it. Otherwise, you should seriously look into getting a shorter desk.
I mean, honestly, I'm not interested in trying beamsprings to use them in my everyday keyboard - I just kind of really want to experience them and what they feel like to type on. If I can get one switch to make a little fidget thing and one to tear down and look at the mechanics of just for fun every now and then, I'd be pretty satisfied overall with that level of ownership, honestly. Don't need / want more than that.
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Yeah I think I generally prefer the feel of BS, but I'll take that beam spring or clicky alps any day and not feel like I'm missing much. Anything else makes your fingers sad. Even Acer. Even Futaba MA, even Box clicky things.
By the by, this Mini M will be my first tenkeyless that I've used in over a decade. I wonder how it will go. I also wonder if now people are going to absolutely hammer Unicomp with requests to do their weird left handed alice layout.
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By the by, this Mini M will be my first tenkeyless that I've used in over a decade. I wonder how it will go. I also wonder if now people are going to absolutely hammer Unicomp with requests to do their weird left handed alice layout.
Not that it would do much of anything for the forseeable future. It took them this long to start making new TKLs, and that only took relatively minor modifications. Layout changes as drastic as going to Alice or 60% would require more time on top of that.