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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: Daniel Beaver on Sun, 29 August 2010, 11:50:06

Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Sun, 29 August 2010, 11:50:06
I posted this image a couple of weeks ago:

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/CrateFullOfKeyboards.jpg)


I friend of a friend pulls gold out of old computers for some extra cash. He has managed to fill multiple sheds full of old computer components.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/08282010711.jpg)


Fortunately, keyboards don't have much gold in them, and so he let me take a bunch of them. And by a bunch, I mean a little over 60. Pictured below is most of the "keyboards of interest". I found a couple dozen more after I took the picture.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/08282010714.jpg)


I found 17 terminal Model Ms

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/08282010704.jpg)


I also found 27 regular Model Ms. 15 of those are late-era blue labels (generally from 1995-1997). Three are grey labels. One is a silver label. The rest are Lexmark and AT&T branded. A lot of them are missing keys.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/08282010706.jpg)


There were quite a few "keyboards of interest" with mechanical switches which I grabbed. I don't recognize most of them, but I suspect some of you will. I will be taking individual pictures once I clean them. There are a few Dell keyboards with linear switches, some HP keyboards with some sort of switch that I don't recognize. Not all of them are pictured here.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/08282010705.jpg)


I also found four Model Fs, of various makes.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/08282010712.jpg)


I don't recognize a lot of the keyswitches. I'm pretty sure this one is mechanical.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/08282010702.jpg)


And of course, the super-majority of what I found were awful, mushy feeling things.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/08282010703.jpg)


I've tested a few, and so far every single one has worked fine. It's going to take forever to clean these. All of these will go up on eBay eventually.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Phaedrus2129 on Sun, 29 August 2010, 11:56:59
*sniff* It's so beautiful.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ch_123 on Sun, 29 August 2010, 12:23:36
I see some quite interesting things there. Now, if only I had the money to pay for the shipping across the Atlantic...
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ClackHead on Sun, 29 August 2010, 12:24:58
Amazing find.

You have much work ahead of you my friend.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: spolia optima on Sun, 29 August 2010, 12:31:34
no doubt there are some gems in there. but damn those are disgusting. gonna take a lot of work to get those operational.  Is that funky looking AT&T keyboard made in Italy?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: WhiteRice on Sun, 29 August 2010, 12:40:56
Wow what a great find!

Any small form factor keyboards?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Sun, 29 August 2010, 12:42:25
Quote from: WhiteRice;217883

Any small form factor keyboards?


Sadly, no. I was hoping to find an Model M spacesaver, but no such luck.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: erricrice on Sun, 29 August 2010, 13:31:43
You should probably just do a mass key cleaning batch where you take all the keys off of all of them and just through them in a huge bucket of soap water or something.  Would probably be the quickest way do clean the keys at least.  Sorting them out later would be a bit of a pain though.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Sun, 29 August 2010, 14:14:51
Ripster has it right - even among the same model numbers, the keys look ever so slightly different. That means that I will be cleaning them individually. The missing keys are more problematic... I may have to mix and match, just out of necessity. I might do whole-board key transplants from the terminal Model Ms, just to maintain consistency. We'll see.

Denture cleaner is da bomb. Makes cleaning so simple.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: audioave10 on Sun, 29 August 2010, 14:28:07
Nice haul and you should offer some here for sale. Most will make you good money on Ebay but its probably alot of work.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: chimera15 on Sun, 29 August 2010, 14:53:58
Wow that's crazy.  It looks like an archeological dig.  Do any of them work after being exposed to the elements like that?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Sun, 29 August 2010, 14:57:22
Quote from: chimera15;217915
Wow that's crazy.  It looks like an archeological dig.  Do any of them work after being exposed to the elements like that?


I have yet to find one that doesn't work.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Superfluous Parentheses on Sun, 29 August 2010, 15:20:10
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;217917
I have yet to find one that doesn't work.


I'm not that surprised. The Model M I've got was stored in a leaky attic for years before I got it and covered in grime. Still works perfectly and cleaned up very nicely.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: chimera15 on Sun, 29 August 2010, 15:23:37
Wow, I didn't notice it the first time, you found a model f AT in that mess.  Nice find, worth way more than any gold he coulda pulled out of it. lol  Does that one work?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Superfluous Parentheses on Sun, 29 August 2010, 16:16:53
Quote from: kishy;217953
During my brief experience with MorningSong's attached to the experimental converter I learned that I prefer the feel of the Model M...but NKRO over USB is an attractive prospect.


As I understand it, you can't have more than 6 "normal" keys + 4? 8? modifiers over USB. If the controller is made correctly, you should be able to have any combination of those work though. Which is better than my Model M's refusal to do CAPS+Left shift+S.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Jack on Sun, 29 August 2010, 16:17:32
Suggestion: Get small mesh laundry bags ( http://www.compressionstockings.com/images/JuzoLaundryBag.jpg ) and put each set of keys in them to wash.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: MissileMike on Sun, 29 August 2010, 16:35:37
Hey, I notice there's one of those strange AT&T build buckling spring keyboards like I have.  It's the quietest BS keyboard I have tried.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ch_123 on Sun, 29 August 2010, 17:10:24
Hah, I noticed that too. Was going to get it, but the shipping is a bit too much.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Sun, 29 August 2010, 17:16:41
PM me if you guys want anything right off the bat, and I can prioritize what I clean and test.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Jack on Sun, 29 August 2010, 18:06:18
I can't know much from the photos, but if you could make a quick list of model numbers and quantities that'd be awesome.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ch_123 on Sun, 29 August 2010, 18:23:22
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;217866
Show Image
(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/08282010705.jpg)


Can you get the part number of the keyboard on the top of the middle row? It may be a Model F terminal keyboard, which I'm pretty sure a few people around here would want.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: WhiteRice on Sun, 29 August 2010, 18:31:27
(http://zachwang.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/08282010714.jpg)


ALPs? :)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: 8_INCH_FLOPPY on Sun, 29 August 2010, 19:52:21
I am so jealous.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: chimera15 on Sun, 29 August 2010, 20:10:40
Quote from: ch_123;218004
Can you get the part number of the keyboard on the top of the middle row? It may be a Model F terminal keyboard, which I'm pretty sure a few people around here would want.

What's the second one down in the middle row?  A model f type alps board? Or an xt?  The enter looks a little strange though.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: clickclack on Sun, 29 August 2010, 21:20:05
I am having significant and disturbing bouts of deja vu right now.

I have also been missing some keyboards lately...
(looks over shoulder)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Sun, 29 August 2010, 23:08:06
Quote from: clickclack;218070
I am having significant and disturbing bouts of deja vu right now.

I have also been missing some keyboards lately...
(looks over shoulder)


Your signature disturbs me. Is this how it started for you?


chimera15: Do you mean the AT&T board? Not sure... it's buried in a pile in my car. I'll get to it eventually.


ch_123: Date: 24 Sept 85, PT NO: 6110345, ID NO R3172, EC NO 528510, PLT NO FL10. I have two of these, and I think they are the same model (the other is buried under a pile right now)


I like the Laundry bag idea.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Manyak on Mon, 30 August 2010, 00:08:24
Nice find :D

If you've got a dishwasher you can just throw everything in there btw. I've plenty of boards like that before, it saves a LOT of work. Just make sure the keycaps are in mesh bags so they don't end up all over the place :p
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: clickclack on Mon, 30 August 2010, 00:13:19
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;218106
Your signature disturbs me. Is this how it started for you?

Wait till I update the sig! heehee
Nah, my "accumulation" started when I was working on a sculpture. But once the bug bites it's a long road to recovery, if indeed recovery is what you are after.

Just as a tip though-
I have had my fair share of really, really, really, insanely nasty dirty keyboards and I have learned a few things because of this. One of them being if they are really dirty (loose dirt or liquid like grime) then handle then as little as possible before actually cleaning them. You don't want dirt and grim to sneak further into the general mechanicals or between tiny contacts.

Looks like you found some fun stuff there, enjoy!
=)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: KillerBee on Mon, 30 August 2010, 00:23:53
ahhh love seeing that some model M's will see use again
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ch_123 on Mon, 30 August 2010, 04:54:38
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;218106
ch_123: Date: 24 Sept 85, PT NO: 6110345, ID NO R3172, EC NO 528510, PLT NO FL10. I have two of these, and I think they are the same model (the other is buried under a pile right now)


Those ones are Model Fs alright. Add that to the list of particularly interesting things to sell :p
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: chimera15 on Mon, 30 August 2010, 06:01:58
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;218106
Your signature disturbs me. Is this how it started for you?


chimera15: Do you mean the AT&T board? Not sure... it's buried in a pile in my car. I'll get to it eventually.


ch_123: Date: 24 Sept 85, PT NO: 6110345, ID NO R3172, EC NO 528510, PLT NO FL10. I have two of these, and I think they are the same model (the other is buried under a pile right now)


I like the Laundry bag idea.


yes, looks like it
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Shawn Stanford on Mon, 30 August 2010, 06:34:51
Crikey, is it really going to be worth the effort to clean all those up? Hmm...

Going price for a clean Model M is about $45, you've got 34. Let's round down to 30 to cover missing keycaps and such. So, max value is about $1,500. Assuming you run the keys and case through the dishwasher, tearing down, cleaning and reassembling a Model M is at least 30 minutes work. Double that if you do it by hand.

You also have to consider the time to package and ship, so another 30 to 60 minutes each, depending on your proximity to a post office.

Then there's the eBay and PayPal percentage...

I'd be surprised if your final payday was more than $20 an hour. I think I'd just keep a few interesting ones and offer the rest as-is to Geekhackers for $25 + whatever your time is worth + shipping. Give the buyer the opportunity to clean the years of grime off (isn't that half the fun?).

YMMV...
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: leqin on Mon, 30 August 2010, 07:28:11
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;217917
I have yet to find one that doesn't work.


This doesn't surprise me - model M's are built like brick outhouse's and my own is a survivor from a coffee spill and several months flung outside to face the elements only to still be working long after other cheaper mushier rubbish gave up working.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Shawn Stanford on Mon, 30 August 2010, 09:53:23
Oh, and FWIW: I'll take one of the Dells as-is (just to match my work computer).
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Mon, 30 August 2010, 11:28:11
Heh, that's a good idea. So I'll put it out there officially:

If you want, you can buy anything you see straight-up, an save me the effort of cleaning them. I can take pictures and send part numbers, and things like that, as well as testing them to make sure they work. We can negotiate on price over PM (I will be reasonable).


All the ALPS boards I'm finding feel very frictiony. Can the dust do bad things, or are they just like that? (I've never felt ALPS before, so I don't know what they're supposed to feel like). The cherry switches don't seem to have the same problem.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: erricrice on Mon, 30 August 2010, 12:07:00
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;218259
Heh, that's a good idea. So I'll put it out there officially:

If you want, you can buy anything you see straight-up, an save me the effort of cleaning them. I can take pictures and send part numbers, and things like that, as well as testing them to make sure they work. We can negotiate on price over PM (I will be reasonable).


All the ALPS boards I'm finding feel very frictiony. Can the dust do bad things, or are they just like that? (I've never felt ALPS before, so I don't know what they're supposed to feel like). The cherry switches don't seem to have the same problem.


ALPS can just kinda be like that, if you haven't used them before.

But with all the dirt and probably usage, I'm sure they're more stiff than they should be.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: vils on Mon, 30 August 2010, 12:43:19
I'll grab a model F if shipping to Europe is reasonable.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Mon, 30 August 2010, 12:54:49
Quote from: vils;218276
I'll grab a model F if shipping to Europe is reasonable.


Shipping to Europe is never reasonable, especially with the weird dimensions that a keyboard demands from a package.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Mon, 30 August 2010, 13:27:12
Here's some stuff I cleaned up yesterday. PM me if you are interested in buying.


Dell AT101W

Many of the keys are very unresponsive. They all work if you pound on them enough; here are the keys that are giving me the most trouble:

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sales/DellAT101W-1.png)

And the keyboard itself:

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sales/DellAT101W-front-1.JPG)

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sales/DellAT101W-rear-1.JPG.JPG)


IBM Terminal Model F

I have no way to test this, but it seems to be in very good shape. This was under a roof, so it never go rained on. It feels divine to type on. All the keys are present.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sales/Model-F-front-1.JPG)

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sales/Model-F-rear-1.JPG.JPG)


IBM Model M Blue Label

Works great.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sales/ModelM-Blue-front-1.JPG.JPG)

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sales/ModelM-Blue-rear-1.JPG.JPG.JPG)


IBM Model M Grey Label

Works great.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sales/ModelM-Grey-front-1.JPG)

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sales/ModelM-Grey-rear-1.JPG.JPG)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ironman31 on Mon, 30 August 2010, 13:33:00
If you have any at model f's I'd be interested for the right price.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Mon, 30 August 2010, 13:39:12
Yeah, I'm really disappointed with the boards that have ALPS switches. The barn is was really dusty, and a lot of them hard dirt packed under the keys. I was hoping to actually use that AT101W, but I think it would only be really useful for spare parts.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Shawn Stanford on Mon, 30 August 2010, 14:00:48
Well, I'm not interested in the Alps switches, just the BS. Are any of those Dells BS? If you don't get any takers on the terminal keyboard you showed, I'd be interested in just the keycaps...
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Mon, 30 August 2010, 14:28:32
Quote from: Shawn Stanford;218310
Well, I'm not interested in the Alps switches, just the BS. Are any of those Dells BS? If you don't get any takers on the terminal keyboard you showed, I'd be interested in just the keycaps...


Do you mean Model Ms with Dell logos? There aren't any of those, only AT101Ws and a couple of rubber domes.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: itlnstln on Mon, 30 August 2010, 14:32:52
I'm not sure about other ALPS-based keyboards, but those AT-101Ws didn't store for ****.  Welly and I had bought some used ones, and they were terrible.  The NIB ones I had weren't too bad for ALPS.  It seems like everyone that has had used AT-101Ws got a poor-feeling 'board.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Mon, 30 August 2010, 18:22:24
Cleaned one more today:

IBM Personal Computer Keyboard
Similar feel to the 122 key terminal Model F boards. Has an AT connection, but I haven't been able to get it to work with and AT to PS/2 adapter; is it even possible to do that with this keyboard? The F9 key is missing, which is frustrating, although I suppose I could just swap an F9 in from one of the terminal Model M boards. They stabilizer bar in the spacebare is bizarre, and I can't figure out how to mount it properly. Despite my best efforts, the case has significant scuffing on it, and one of the legs is broken.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sales/PCKeyBoard-front-1%203.JPG)

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sales/PCKeyBoard-front-1.JPG)

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sales/PCKeyBoard-rear-1.JPG)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: microsoft windows on Mon, 30 August 2010, 18:52:57
Well, you can always use its keys.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: chimera15 on Mon, 30 August 2010, 20:58:54
What colors are the alps? Also complicated or fakes? Given their age I assume they're real?  The bases and bare switches, and leaf springs are worth something, even if they're gritty.  If they're real alps switches they're worth something.  Also any double shot alps caps are worth something.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Mon, 30 August 2010, 22:53:37
Quote from: chimera15;218408
Also any double shot alps caps are worth something.


I'll get to those in a bit :bowl:  I'm surprised how many of these boards have double-shot keys.

I need to read up on the ALPS wiki and try to find out what types are in these. They have all different colors.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Oqsy on Mon, 30 August 2010, 23:22:26
Daniel: very interested in a Terminal Model F cleaned or uncleaned.  I'm also after any era Model M (must be 100% functional), also cleaned or uncleaned (I prefer to clean them myself to save you time/work and also because that way I know exactly what's going on with the board).  

I also have a method for cleaning / "defrictioning" alps key switches that might interest you... it will NOT be cost effective at the size of your haul, but after using this method, the switches are as smooth at silk (minus any engineered tactility :P )

PM me with a price on any of the above you have available in whatever condition and I'll get back with you promptly :D

edit:  Oops forgot to mention that I'm looking for a Model F AT as well.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: JBert on Tue, 31 August 2010, 14:58:55
Any of those thick Displaywriter or other buckling beam keyboards in there? They can be recognized by their bulky case.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Tue, 31 August 2010, 16:02:54
Quote from: JBert;218623
Any of those thick Displaywriter or other buckling beam keyboards in there? They can be recognized by their bulky case.


I didn't see any when I was looking. The oldest I have found are the Model Fs.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: 8_INCH_FLOPPY on Tue, 31 August 2010, 18:28:36
If you have a non-working keyboard with Cherry compatible keys, I could make use of them.  I melted mine....  The only keyboard I know of that uses Cherry compatible keys but doesn't use Cherry switches are the Gateway2000 keyboards, though I'm sure there are are others.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Wed, 01 September 2010, 01:12:25
I cleaned a blue label Type M today, which had the controller PCB underneath the indicator. I've never seen that before in a Type M, but most of these are probably built this way. I also cleaned this:


Weird HP branded keyboard (EDIT: It's a keyboard from a HP-9000 300-series Unix workstation)

The keys on this are awesome. The labels look like they are dye-sublimated, and multicolored. The layout is actually really neat looking. It was, however, the filthiest keyboard I had yet cleaned.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/HP%20Layout%204.jpg)

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/HP Layout 2.jpg)


The switches are mechanical, with a linear feel to them. There is a very subtle tactile feel when you bottom them out.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/HP%20Layout.jpg)


Now it's all pretty looking. It has two ports on the back which look an awful lot like SDL ports, but which won't fit an SDL cable. Anybody have any ideas what this is?

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sales/OddHP.JPG)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: apex on Wed, 01 September 2010, 02:32:22
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;217866

I also found 27 regular Model Ms. 15 of those are late-era blue labels (generally from 1995-1997). Three are grey labels. One is a silver label. The rest are Lexmark and AT&T branded. A lot of them are missing keys.

Show Image
(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/08282010706.jpg)


i would gladly take one of those Late-era blue label Model M keyboards off your hands!
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Findecanor on Wed, 01 September 2010, 05:33:15
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;218747
Weird HP branded keyboard
...
Anybody have any ideas what this is?

Keyboard from a HP-9000 300-series Unix workstation. I have no idea of how to interface them with a modern PC.

I like the layout and it looks like NKRO.. but wouldn't the thrown on these switches be close to 2 mm ?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Wed, 01 September 2010, 11:02:59
For all of you who want Blue label Model Ms, here is my proposal:


For $20 + shipping, I will send you a Blue label Model M or a Terminal Model M in its filthy, disgusting, uncleaned, but fully functional state. I will replace any missing keys, and will check to make sure all the keys and LEDs work properly. PM me for details. I'm only going to accept paypal payments.

For $30 + shipping, I will send you a Grey label Model M (i.e., 1391401), or a branded model M (AT&T or Lexmark). More people have PMed me about these, so I'm selling them at a slight premium. Again, they will be dirty, filthy, but full functional.

I am selling the silver label Model M for a bit more, as four different people have expressed interest in buying it.

The Model F keyboards are going on ebay.

Quote from: Findecanor;218766
Keyboard from a HP-9000 300-series Unix workstation. I have no idea of how to interface them with a modern PC.

I like the layout and it looks like NKRO.. but wouldn't the thrown on these switches be close to 2 mm ?


You know, you're right. Listening really closely, I can hear and feel the switch toggling about halfway through the travel (about 2mm). But again, it is very subtle. I wish I could re-use these keys on some other board, they really are lovely.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: microsoft windows on Wed, 01 September 2010, 16:41:49
I wouldn't pay $20 for a keyboard that dirty. $10 sounds more reasonable. You can just buy a nice clean one off ebay for $15 plus shipping.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Rusty Rat on Wed, 01 September 2010, 17:01:36
Quote from: microsoft windows;218947
I wouldn't pay $20 for a keyboard that dirty. $10 sounds more reasonable. You can just buy a nice clean one off ebay for $15 plus shipping.

Its a good price, if you get something off EBay you are probably going to clean it and with Beavers keyboards he is guaranteeing they are fully functional and all have keycaps.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Shawn Stanford on Wed, 01 September 2010, 19:59:57
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;218290
IBM Terminal Model F

I have no way to test this, but it seems to be in very good shape. This was under a roof, so it never go rained on. It feels divine to type on. All the keys are present.

Show Image
(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sales/Model-F-front-1.JPG)


I'm very tempted to jump on this just for these keycaps. Those 'PF' keys are sexy. This is a true mainframe keyboard, the other 122-keys I've seen are AS400 stuff.

Oh, wait: Dan, is this one headed for eBay with the other Model Fs?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: microsoft windows on Wed, 01 September 2010, 20:01:49
That's a Model F there. Don't take it just for the keycaps! If you get it, you oughta convert it and use it. I've heard they're great keyboards.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Oqsy on Wed, 01 September 2010, 21:50:34
I've also been after a terminal F from this lot if there is a second after kishy's...  I'm assuming me means all will go to ebay, terminal or not.  If that's the case i will also withdraw my interest.  If they're being sold straight up here to gh members I'm all over it.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ricercar on Wed, 01 September 2010, 22:19:02
Quote from: daniel beaver;218747
Show Image
(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sales/oddhp.jpg)

I have the AT version of that HP Workstation board.


(http://geekhack.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=12319&stc=1&d=1283397462)

I'd pay $20 for the workstation version.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Wed, 01 September 2010, 22:50:07
ricercar: Deal. PM me, and we'll work out details. I have two of these, BTW (I have only cleaned one of them)

Anyone who wants a Model F: I need to finish cleaning my second Terminal Model F. It has a crack in the case, unfortunately, but I will have pictures up soon. After I have that one up, I will formally take offers (tomorrow at the latest).

microsoft windows: I have some Dell Quietkeys, if you're interested in those :)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Shawn Stanford on Thu, 02 September 2010, 06:23:55
I'm not going to fight over it: If those guys are seriously drooling, then I'll take a pass...
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: didjamatic on Thu, 02 September 2010, 08:05:34
Man, where have I been?  For some reason I thought this thread would be about windows 3.1 or IE4 so I hadn't even opened it.  Great score!  Here's a free tip as I've hit many motherloads like this myself... don't bring this crap into your house.  I've found everything from live larvae and bugs to mouse crap to who knows what inside keyboards and until they are cleaned keep those suckers outside.  Seriously.  And don't wash that crap in your sink, it could be covered with rat poison, mouse urine, asbestos and agent orange for all you know.  When they're this filthy, handle them with care.  You might want to pressure wash them on a hot day and let the sun dry them out - they've already experienced the elements so you won't hurt them at this point.

__

Can you post the date for the Model M silver label 1390120?

If you have a PC AT Model F that is incomplete, I've been looking for an Alt key and the + key from the keypad.  The XT key's won't work.

I'm interested in any Blue, Pink, Yellow, or Brown ALPS switches.

Second from top in middle, is that ATT board buckling spring or ALPS?
Fifth one down in middle with round edges, what is that?  What switches?
Sixth one down in the middle, what is that?
(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/08282010705.jpg)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: didjamatic on Thu, 02 September 2010, 08:08:31
Man, where have I been?  For some reason I thought this thread would be about windows 3.1 or IE4 so I hadn't even opened it.  Great score!  Here's a free tip as I've hit many motherloads like this myself... don't bring this crap into your house.  I've found everything from live larvae and bugs to mouse crap to who knows what inside keyboards and until they are cleaned keep those suckers outside.  Seriously.  And don't wash that crap in your sink, it could be covered with rat poison, mouse urine, herpes, asbestos and agent orange.  When they're this filthy, handle them with care and don't inhale that dust.  You might want to pressure wash them on a hot day and let the sun dry them out - they've already experienced the elements so you won't hurt them at this point.

__

Can you post the date for the Model M silver label 1390120?

If you have a PC AT Model F that is incomplete, I've been looking for an Alt key and the + key from the keypad.  The XT key's won't work.

I'm interested in any Blue, Pink, Yellow, or Brown ALPS switches.

Second from top in middle, is that ATT board buckling spring or ALPS?
Fifth one down in middle with round edges, what is that?  What switches?  I will probably take that one as-is.
Sixth one down in the middle, what is that?  EDIT - it's an HP, what switches?
(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/08282010705.jpg)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Thu, 02 September 2010, 15:28:42
More pictures. I layed them out more orderly. These are the ones I haven't cleaned yet.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/pavementoverview/OverviewOfKeyboards.jpg)


Model Ms
(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/pavementoverview/ModelMs.jpg)


Terminal Model Ms, and also a Model F (can you spot it?)
(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/pavementoverview/TerminalModelMs.jpg)


In this picture:

Topmost left, and second down from the left:
Labled "TO-300". These have black cherries and doubleshot keys, and a phone-line style connector. I suspect someone here would be interested in a full set of cherry-compatible doubleshot keys.

Bottom Left, second from the bottom: It has a trackball, that's all I know.

Bottom Left: some Apple keyboard.

Top Right: another one of those strange HP keyboards, with the *****in keys.

Right, second down: a brand-less keyboard with yellow-orange alps.

Right, Third down: just a Model M, but with a frayed cable. This will be a donor board.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/pavementoverview/Overview1.jpg)


Top right: an AT&T branded board with strange, pink keyswitches. I'll get a picture up soon. Uses a serial (?) cable. The key feel is quite good, actually, better than any other keyboard in the bunch (with the exception of the Model F keyboards).

Middle left: Two Dell Quietkeys, standard rubber dome keyboards. MS Windows pimped these, and I have to agree with his basic assessment of them.

Right, second down: White ALPS, doubleshot keys. The label has been washed away by the rain.

Right, third down: Another Dell 1301W. This one is in better shape than the one I posted previously in this thread.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/pavementoverview/Overview2.jpg)


Right, bottom: another white ALPS board, with doublshot keys.

Left, bottom: Why, whatever could this be? :whoo:

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/pavementoverview/Overview3.jpg)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: itlnstln on Thu, 02 September 2010, 15:33:03
Is that Oldsmobuick part of the lot?  If not, it should be.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Thu, 02 September 2010, 15:57:24
Quote from: itlnstln;219281
Is that Oldsmobuick part of the lot?  If not, it should be.


My friend's car. It runs a lot better than my Subaru. Sort of like a Model M in that regard.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ricercar on Thu, 02 September 2010, 20:40:55
Daniel - I wasn't serious about the offer for the HP. Time was I could impulse buy keyboards, but that time ain't now.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Fri, 03 September 2010, 00:21:09
Awww, well, if you still want it, I'll send it to you for free (plus shipping, of course).


I cleaned up the Model F PC AT, performed HaaTa's big backspace mod, and JBert's spacebar spring mod. The layout is surprisingly tolerable. The numpad contains all the functionality of the home culster, and the alt and ctrl keys are in sensible locations. The lack of an F11 and F12 key may become an issue, but we'll see. Full key rollover - smashing down on every key gives a satisfying readout in Aquakeys.

The king of keyboards?

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/KingOfKeyboards.jpg)

Sorry, not for sale :D
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: iMav on Fri, 03 September 2010, 00:40:41
Just to clarify...the "big backspace mod" should not be contributed to me.  (however, I did implement a variation on it to replicate the HHKB layout).

Those keyboards are great.  After having owned one, a Model M is simply dissatisfying to type on.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Fri, 03 September 2010, 01:24:40
Quote from: iMav;219418
Just to clarify...the "big backspace mod" should not be contributed to me.  (however, I did implement a variation on it to replicate the HHKB layout).

Those keyboards are great.  After having owned one, a Model M is simply dissatisfying to type on.


Who originally did that mod?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Half-Saint on Fri, 03 September 2010, 01:51:40
I'm still hoping to find a model F AT at the flea market. eBay prices + shipping are just plain insane... plus I'd get killed by import duties for sure.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Fri, 03 September 2010, 01:57:28
Quote from: Half-Saint;219430
I'm still hoping to find a model F AT at the flea market. eBay prices + shipping are just plain insane... plus I'd get killed by import duties for sure.

That's the right way to approach it. Treasure hunting is a pleasure all in itself, and you can really pat yourself on the back when you find something awesome.



Anyone interested in those doubleshot keys that I mentioned in the pictures? I feel like my last big post got buried one page back.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: TheSoundofTyping on Fri, 03 September 2010, 10:44:09
Quote from: iMav;219418
After having owned one, a Model M is simply dissatisfying to type on.


Pardon my noobness, but how do they differ?  I assumed that under the keys, they were the same as a Model M.  Different buckling springs?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Fri, 03 September 2010, 11:56:38
My PC AT actuates at 14 nickles, so 70g (My Model M actuates at 75g). It feels lighter, but that must have more to do with the feel of the mechanism than anything else. The actuation point seems "sharper". And yes, it bottoms out easier than a Model M. And it's loud, much louder than a Model M.

I might just start stealing key posts and flappers out of my cracked Terminal Model F so I can add keys to my PC AT board. I have the luxury of access to spare parts.

Having tried the XT and AT version, I've got to say that they feel almost identical (the wiki claims that the XT feels nicer). In any case, the XT's layout is awful, and it would never be usable even if you could get it working on a modern PC. It is better built, though (the rear panel is metal, and the internals are different).
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: itlnstln on Fri, 03 September 2010, 12:16:46
Is the Model F at all like the DisplayWriter?  If so, the F is a loud *****.  The DW also has a sharp activation point and feels a little lighter than an M.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: itlnstln on Fri, 03 September 2010, 12:35:27
It is a nice pic.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: microsoft windows on Fri, 03 September 2010, 17:54:09
Let me guess...it's a picture of a weird Japanese girl (Ripster's fetish).
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: JBert on Sat, 04 September 2010, 17:07:55
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;219580
Having tried the XT and AT version, I've got to say that they feel almost identical (the wiki claims that the XT feels nicer). In any case, the XT's layout is awful, and it would never be usable even if you could get it working on a modern PC. It is better built, though (the rear panel is metal, and the internals are different).
Actually, the layout is still what is used today in Europe so it is not unusable, it's just annoying.
Key feel is subjective, but I do think that the difference may come from a different mould for the barrels and a tighter squeeze on them from the front plate.

It could certainly be called of the king of keyboards, but only if you just looked in the "clicky, useable-out-of-the-box" category. The model F XT or buckling beam keyboards can still be a tad nicer, but they just don't work out of the box.

Quote from: itlnstln;219582
Is the Model F at all like the DisplayWriter?  If so, the F is a loud *****.  The DW also has a sharp activation point and feels a little lighter than an M.
Buckling springs were a cost saving measure from the display writer's technology. Buckling beams could be tuned better for lighter springs, yet it contains thrice as much parts.

If I recall webwit's explanation correctly, the sound of the keys was more like snapping metal, yet muffled by the large case and a rubber "blood-shield" like on the TG3s. Still noticeable though.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Wed, 08 September 2010, 19:38:34
That cracked Model F is totally trashed - I found it in a 5 gallon bucked, which was filled with rainwater. It was probably sitting in there for years.

About 40 or so of the hammers were rust-free, however. I used a few of them to add keys to my Model F PC AT. Does anyone else want some?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Oqsy on Wed, 08 September 2010, 21:54:21
Oqsy mourns.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: EverythingIBM on Wed, 08 September 2010, 23:26:48
Quote from: ripster;219584
I'll do a Model F XT sound recording someday.  Metal back.   Even pingier.

Doubleposting this pic but it's a NICE pic....

Pew, Pew, Pew!

Animated GIFs hog too much CPU...

And I don't like it.

Quote from: Daniel Beaver;221075
That cracked Model F is totally trashed - I found it in a 5 gallon bucked, which was filled with rainwater. It was probably sitting in there for years.

About 40 or so of the hammers were rust-free, however. I used a few of them to add keys to my Model F PC AT. Does anyone else want some?

An IBM keyboard is never trashed! Well as long as the circuitry is OK.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Thu, 09 September 2010, 02:09:00
Quote from: EverythingIBM;221134
An IBM keyboard is never trashed! Well as long as the circuitry is OK.

The circuitry is very trashed, as in "contacts rusted together into giant rust balls bad".



Quote from: ripster;221139
Show Image
(http://i44.tinypic.com/11abmgg.jpg)

Are those supposed to look like gardening tools?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ch_123 on Thu, 09 September 2010, 05:11:48
Quote from: JBert;219960
If I recall webwit's explanation correctly, the sound of the keys was more like snapping metal, yet muffled by the large case and a rubber "blood-shield" like on the TG3s. Still noticeable though.


See video here. (http://geekhack.org/showwiki.php?title=Island:8681)

In a sense, it feels like what it sounds like.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Shawn Stanford on Thu, 09 September 2010, 06:27:34
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;221075
That cracked Model F is totally trashed - I found it in a 5 gallon bucked, which was filled with rainwater. It was probably sitting in there for years. About 40 or so of the hammers were rust-free, however. I used a few of them to add keys to my Model F PC AT. Does anyone else want some?

I'm still interested in the keycaps...
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ch_123 on Thu, 09 September 2010, 06:49:12
What type of Model F is it?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: didjamatic on Thu, 09 September 2010, 07:07:59
I've been looking for an ALT and + key for an AT model F if you have them.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ch_123 on Thu, 09 September 2010, 07:36:56
I have a plus key if you want it. I broke one of the stabilizer holders off the front plate, so I put in a stabilizer insert from a Model M and put in a plus key from same Model M. I still have the F's one lying around if you want it.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: TexasFlood on Thu, 09 September 2010, 07:41:17
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;221075
That cracked Model F is totally trashed - I found it in a 5 gallon bucked, which was filled with rainwater. It was probably sitting in there for years.

About 40 or so of the hammers were rust-free, however. I used a few of them to add keys to my Model F PC AT. Does anyone else want some?

My model F is missing a key, the top right key in the group on the left side, think it should say "clear" on it.  Have one of those spare?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Thu, 09 September 2010, 11:22:45
People who want stuff: PM me with exactly what you want, and I will provide. The trashed model F is a terminal variety. I have the (nearly) full keycap set from that. I also have voluminous model M terminals, which share a lot of keys with the Model F terminal.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Oqsy on Thu, 09 September 2010, 17:23:23
Daniel: Interested in a complete M terminal fwiw.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: microsoft windows on Thu, 09 September 2010, 17:24:47
Quote from: didjamatic;221188
I've been looking for an ALT and + key for an AT model F if you have them.


You could probably find the Alt key off an XT F.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Thu, 09 September 2010, 18:47:16
Okay, I have a question:

Are Model F key stems supposed to be compatible with Model M key stems? I'm able to mix and match them no problem, but I was given the impression over some PM conversations that they are supposed to be different.

I'm also going to be heading out for a few days, so I'll be incommunicado until Monday or so.

Ripster: your stuff is in the mail. Weee!

Oqsy: PM me, we'll work out details. I need to find a box big enough for that damn things....
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ch_123 on Thu, 09 September 2010, 18:49:31
I think they are shaped slightly differently, but they are basically the same thing, and I have used them interchangeably.

I have noted however, that double-part Model M keycaps don't work well on the AT Model F. I think it's because the two parts are a little bit wider, and they rub off the neighboring cap.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Thu, 09 September 2010, 18:56:51
Quote from: ch_123;221421
I have noted however, that double-part Model M keycaps don't work well on the AT Model F. I think it's because the two parts are a little bit wider, and they rub off the neighboring cap.

I'm using two-part Model M keys on a Model F AT right now, and it doesn't seem to be rubbing at all. Huh.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ch_123 on Thu, 09 September 2010, 19:00:41
Odd. Just feels very odd on mine.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Scarzy on Thu, 09 September 2010, 19:11:34
Not only am I extremely jealous, I also live in Europe. FML.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: armenws on Thu, 09 September 2010, 19:39:36
holy crap the ones you tested actually work? They look water damaged but I guess they're not.

Legendary haul dude.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Sun, 12 September 2010, 20:26:53
I passed by my treasure trove again today.

Found lots of old Apple-brand stuff.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010775.jpghttp://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010775.jpg)


Weird mechanical switches

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010773.jpg)


Boxes full of buried treasure

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010772.jpg)


Gizmos I can't identify

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010770.jpg)


And keyboards, of course. I found a couple of Model F-XT-ish boards that were hard-wired to a big IBM boxes. I had to leave these behind, since I couldn't unhook them.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010768.jpg)


Here was the day's haul. I am running out of space to store keyboards, so I was very choosy. Top left is a terminal Model F (Kishy, want?). Top right is a Model F with a space-saving layout; it has two connectors on the back, one which looks like a parallel port, one which looks like a serial port. Bottom left is a metal-label Model M. Bottom right is a Model F AT.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010776.jpg)


I also found dozens more Model Ms and ALPS boards, but ignored them for now. I'm an apartment dweller, so I can't afford to hoard so much crap. I'm still on a work trip (in the next-town over from my treasure trove, incidentally), so I won't be able clean or ship anything until Tuesday. PM me then if you want anything.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: TexasFlood on Sun, 12 September 2010, 20:44:34
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;222579
I passed by my treasure trove again today.

Weird mechanical switches

Show Image
(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010773.jpg)


Looks like a "space invader" (http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?t=8643).

Quote from: Daniel Beaver;222579
Gizmos I can't identify

Show Image
(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010770.jpg)

Schoolmaster Filmstrip Projector (http://www.blujay.com/item/Schoolmaster-Graflex-SVE-Filmstrip-Projector-8130800-2146846)?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: KillerBee on Sun, 12 September 2010, 21:24:56
Muuuuuust get more M's!! The force is too strong to hold back
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Oqsy on Sun, 12 September 2010, 23:05:35
ooo whichever F kishy hasn't spoken for pm sent :D
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Shawn Stanford on Mon, 13 September 2010, 06:37:08
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;222579
Gizmos I can't identify
Show Image
(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010770.jpg)

It's a filmstrip projector.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: KillerBee on Mon, 13 September 2010, 15:40:17
Sgt. Stanford dont lie that is the top secret proton blaster that we have to fight against the secret invisible weapons of mass destruction that you and me are looking for!

Must find that secret cove and bury myself in Model M clickyness!!
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Shawn Stanford on Mon, 13 September 2010, 21:39:34
Please report to the nearest government agency - the local Farm Bureau should do - for debriefing and re-education...
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: JBert on Tue, 14 September 2010, 15:42:47
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;222579
And keyboards, of course. I found a couple of Model F-XT-ish boards that were hard-wired to a big IBM boxes. I had to leave these behind, since I couldn't unhook them.

Show Image
(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010768.jpg)
Sent you a PM for such a keycap set. I don't really need the spacebar so you can leave that one on.

Sadly, still no affordable buckling beam keyboard...
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Wed, 15 September 2010, 14:06:42
I see now the issue with the Model F keys. On my Model F, I have double-piece model keys. It works well, but the clearance between keys is virtually nil when both are crooked (less than 1mm, probably close to 1/5th of a mm). There is probably enough variation between batches that in some cases you will get rubbing.

FYI, I just got back from my trip this morning, so I'm working on processing everyone's requests.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Sat, 23 October 2010, 02:16:49
Thread necrophilia!

I have spent a lot of time cleaning up these Alps keyboards, and have had something of a 180° opinion change about Alps in general. White ALPS, with a little bit of silicon grease on the sliders, compare quite favorably with my Filco (cherry blues). I'm rather appreciating the lack of hysteresis in the switch, and the lower-pitched click. Not quite as smooth as a cherry, but close. Still, it is an incredible time sink to open and clean 101 keys.

It has also become clear to me that white alps and blue alps are basically identical. still, blue is cool looking:

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/geekhackposts/reasontechnology/DellAT101BlueAlps.jpg)

Unfortunately, my AT101W with blue Alps is on the fritz. Whole sections of the boards aren't working (i.e, the 4,5,6,3 and del key on the numpad). I'm not so sure how much more work I want to put into it.


In the meantime, my Filco has been sitting in a corner all this week, replaced by this wonderful thing:

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/geekhackposts/reasontechnology/ReasonTechnology%201.jpg)

Cleaned inside and out, with cleaned and re-lubricated white alps. It feels great to type on. The keys are awesome too: double shot, multi-color.

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/geekhackposts/reasontechnology/ReasonTechnology%202.jpg)

Build quality is quite good. The bottom half of the case is steel. The soldering is very consistent on the PCB. And, to my surprise, full NKRO.

I have no idea what sort of keyboard this is. The manufacturer is "Reason Technology", and the model number is simply "101". I couldn't find a date anywhere. It uses an AT connection, so it's probably fairly old (it WAS in the same lot as all my other Model Fs). Huh.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Moogle Stiltzkin on Sat, 23 October 2010, 03:40:25
I'm very impressed by your find. Gratz.

People don't know what their throwing away in the trash sometimes o_O;
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: hoggy on Sat, 23 October 2010, 16:12:31
You know, I use an in/out tray to store my keyboards, maybe I should just leave them outside on the window still...

(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010768.jpg)


...Please tell me you've let it in by now.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Sat, 23 October 2010, 16:19:24
Actually, I never picked that one up, as it was permanently attached to the machine behind it. It's going to sit outside allll winter.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: 8_INCH_FLOPPY on Sat, 23 October 2010, 17:35:49
I keep hearing that white ALPS and blue ALPS are the same, but they feel completely different to me.  White take so much more force.  At least, mine do.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: keyb_gr on Sat, 23 October 2010, 18:53:22
Quote from: 8_INCH_FLOPPY;237750
I keep hearing that white ALPS and blue ALPS are the same, but they feel completely different to me.  White take so much more force.  At least, mine do.

Then either you've got simplifieds there or they are in need of cleaning & lubing. Apparently they can develop significant friction upon off-center keypresses if dusty. No wonder ALPS are hit'n'miss.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Sat, 23 October 2010, 19:36:17
It may be that they are, in fact, somewhat different when observed under close scrutiny. Still, I would be willing to bet that the difference is cause either by wear or by lubrication.

The blue ALPS I have tried have all felt great, wheras the white ALPS have required cleaning and lubrication before they felt comparable.

I R SCEPTICAL.
Also, the placebo effect is strong.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: NewbieOneKenobi on Sat, 23 October 2010, 22:22:20
Model F! The keyboard of my childhood, before I realised I'd never make it into IT studies due to maths and physics. I still coded my way out of physics and maths homework on one (QBasic FTW!) and gave the code to the rest of the class. You'd be willing to part with one of the four?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Sun, 24 October 2010, 00:41:41
Ripster: I could send you a couple if you wanted. The bottom half is, in fact, a bit different. Not sure how much of a difference it really makes.

acfrazier: Watch the marketplace. I'm gearing up to do a whole bunch of restorations and bolt mods.

NewbieOneKenobi: Sorry, all those are long gone.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: codek on Sun, 07 November 2010, 01:18:44
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;222579
I passed by my treasure trove again today.

Found lots of old Apple-brand stuff.

Show Image
(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010775.jpghttp://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010775.jpg)



Weird mechanical switches

Show Image
(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010773.jpg)



Boxes full of buried treasure

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(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010772.jpg)



Gizmos I can't identify

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(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010770.jpg)



And keyboards, of course. I found a couple of Model F-XT-ish boards that were hard-wired to a big IBM boxes. I had to leave these behind, since I couldn't unhook them.

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(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010768.jpg)



Here was the day's haul. I am running out of space to store keyboards, so I was very choosy. Top left is a terminal Model F (Kishy, want?). Top right is a Model F with a space-saving layout; it has two connectors on the back, one which looks like a parallel port, one which looks like a serial port. Bottom left is a metal-label Model M. Bottom right is a Model F AT.

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(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010776.jpg)



I also found dozens more Model Ms and ALPS boards, but ignored them for now. I'm an apartment dweller, so I can't afford to hoard so much crap. I'm still on a work trip (in the next-town over from my treasure trove, incidentally), so I won't be able clean or ship anything until Tuesday. PM me then if you want anything.


did you get this from the Swan station on the island from LOST?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Sun, 07 November 2010, 12:54:33
I'm not a watcher of LOST, so the reference is lost on me.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e7/Sting.png)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Pylon on Sun, 07 November 2010, 14:23:22
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;243846
I'm not a watcher of LOST, so the reference is lost on me.

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(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e7/Sting.png)


If you play crash cymbals or high hat on crash cymbals, that means to muffle it immediately after the note by pushing it onto your chest.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: quadibloc on Sun, 07 November 2010, 17:23:09
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;222579
Gizmos I can't identify.
That is a filmstrip projector. When I was a child, they used them a lot in school.

Basically, a short length of film is projected one image at a time. So it is optically equivalent to a slide projector, but the mechanics for advancing from one image to the next is simpler.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Fwiffo on Sun, 07 November 2010, 18:12:20
Flashbacks from health class...
"Billy is confused by the changes going on in his body. *beeeep*"
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: 8_INCH_FLOPPY on Tue, 09 November 2010, 22:55:51
Quote from: Daniel Beaver;222579

Boxes full of buried treasure

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(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/sept122010/09122010772.jpg)




Is that that keyboard in the middle of the box a space-cadet, or am I hallucinating?  I call dibs.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Fwiffo on Tue, 09 November 2010, 23:10:41
I call secondary dibs on any reasonably decent condition space cadet you find.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: msiegel on Tue, 09 November 2010, 23:46:05
tertiary dibs!

wait, that's a mac plus keyboard 0_o

although there looks like a model f/xt behind it :D
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: rantenki on Wed, 10 November 2010, 00:10:33
I'll just leave this here: http://blog.makezine.com/archive/2010/11/the_mechanical_glory_of_the_ibm_sel.html (http://blog.makezine.com/archive/2010/11/the_mechanical_glory_of_the_ibm_sel.html)

tl:dr; Video:

Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Wed, 10 November 2010, 00:34:05
Nope, not a Space Cadet. Sorry!

Epic video, BTW. I have three Selectrics and enjoy them immensely. They are my favorite machine of any type. Make magazine is worth subscribing to, especially if you are a member of this crowd.

EDIT: WHOA, I did not realize that Whippletrees had that property (transmitting pseudo-digital output via discrete analog input). I was not informed of this in my mechanical linkage class in college.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Shawn Stanford on Wed, 10 November 2010, 06:16:00
What the hell is a 'Space Cadet' keyboard?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: zefrer on Wed, 10 November 2010, 06:34:56
Who knows man, space invader switches maybe?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Shawn Stanford on Wed, 10 November 2010, 07:05:22
After I asked I made a more thorough search of gh and managed to find a picture of a wierd-ass Symbolics keyboard that I think was being called a 'Space Cadet' keyboard.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: woody on Wed, 10 November 2010, 08:12:24
IIRC the Wikipedia entry on keyboard has picture of it. The board heavy on modifiers.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Senor_Cartmenez on Wed, 10 November 2010, 08:39:54
I can't ignore it any longer...

Every time I read the title of this thread I HAVE TO think of this:
(http://www.flushtv.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/bread-and-butter.jpg)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Thu, 11 November 2010, 23:07:03
Here's the deal:

I'm moving back to home to Puerto Rico at the end of November. I cannot take these keyboards with me. I probably can't store them anywhere up here in Minnesota (I currently keep them in my apartment's garage space). So I'm going to be throwing them all out at the end of the month, UNLESS people want to buy them from me for cheap. So... PM me if you want anything that I posted in this thread. I hate to see good keyboards go to waste.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: msiegel on Thu, 11 November 2010, 23:43:12
yarr, cheap keyboards off the starboard bow!

there's so much booty, ye might have to sell em in lots, matey ;)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Thu, 11 November 2010, 23:43:55
Ugh, but that may be what it takes. I knew I would regret hauling all these back home with me.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: msiegel on Thu, 11 November 2010, 23:46:07
arrr there any more dirty XTs in that treasure hole?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Thu, 11 November 2010, 23:50:40
This post has pictures of everything I have left, though some of this stuff has been sold. (http://geekhack.org/showpost.php?p=219276&postcount=74) A lot of the Model M's are gone, as well as some of the ALPS boards. No Model F's of any kind left, sorry. I'm thinking $5 per keyboard plus shipping to take it off my hands. FYI, I will not clean anything, but I will ensure that any board I sell is fully operational.

Quote
More pictures. I layed them out more orderly. These are the ones I haven't cleaned yet.

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(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/pavementoverview/OverviewOfKeyboards.jpg)



Model Ms
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(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/pavementoverview/ModelMs.jpg)



Terminal Model Ms, and also a Model F (can you spot it?)
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(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/pavementoverview/TerminalModelMs.jpg)



In this picture:

Topmost left, and second down from the left:
Labled "TO-300". These have black cherries and doubleshot keys, and a phone-line style connector. I suspect someone here would be interested in a full set of cherry-compatible doubleshot keys.

Bottom Left, second from the bottom: It has a trackball, that's all I know.

Bottom Left: some Apple keyboard.

Top Right: another one of those strange HP keyboards, with the *****in keys.

Right, second down: a brand-less keyboard with yellow-orange alps.

Right, Third down: just a Model M, but with a frayed cable. This will be a donor board.

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(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/pavementoverview/Overview1.jpg)



Top right: an AT&T branded board with strange, pink keyswitches. I'll get a picture up soon. Uses a serial (?) cable. The key feel is quite good, actually, better than any other keyboard in the bunch (with the exception of the Model F keyboards).

Middle left: Two Dell Quietkeys, standard rubber dome keyboards. MS Windows pimped these, and I have to agree with his basic assessment of them.

Right, second down: White ALPS, doubleshot keys. The label has been washed away by the rain.

Right, third down: Another Dell 1301W. This one is in better shape than the one I posted previously in this thread.

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(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/pavementoverview/Overview2.jpg)



Right, bottom: another white ALPS board, with doublshot keys.

Left, bottom: Why, whatever could this be? :whoo:

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(http://www.danielbeaver.net/storage/projects/keyboards/pavementoverview/Overview3.jpg)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: jaynoon on Fri, 12 November 2010, 00:59:42
Do you still have the white Alps (right, 2nd down, bottom picture) or is that one of the ones that's already gone?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Shawn Stanford on Fri, 12 November 2010, 06:35:40
I will definitely take a couple of Model Ms for $5 plus shipping.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Lanx on Fri, 12 November 2010, 06:41:33
me 2 as well i'd like 2 model M's to see how'd i'd be able to mod em 5$ per plus shipping.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: kps on Fri, 12 November 2010, 09:03:05
PM sent requesting one Terminal M and one PC M donor.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ironman31 on Fri, 12 November 2010, 09:05:04
I PMed you a little while ago about some keyboards
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: woody on Fri, 12 November 2010, 10:02:58
Daniel Beaver, that should be a pre-2006 Forester, no?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Fri, 12 November 2010, 12:38:33
woody: Yep

Rest: PM me if you are interested in cheap Model Ms, and I can ship them out ASAP.

jaynoon: I may have used that particular one as donor board for switches, I'll check.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Oqsy on Fri, 12 November 2010, 16:38:40
beaver: pms a plenty :D
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ironman31 on Fri, 12 November 2010, 22:41:52
payment sent
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: KillerBee on Fri, 12 November 2010, 22:51:06
PM-PM!

Ohh Boy! Ohh Boy
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Sun, 14 November 2010, 11:59:37
I have time today to head out to my stash, so I should be PMing people who are interested in boards today or tomorrow with pictures and specific part numbers out to people.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: kps on Sun, 14 November 2010, 13:19:32
Quote from: kishy;246720
If anyone gets one of the 122-keys from Daniel which has the right-angle plug, and intends to throw away that original cord, I'd appreciate having it instead...

(properly detached from the inside, not cut, and with no connector or cord damage ideally)


I can do that; I intend to do an internal USB conversion. However, I won't have the board in my possession until the new year.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: 8_INCH_FLOPPY on Sun, 14 November 2010, 17:16:04
HOLY TAMALE!
MUST... SAVE ....KEYBOARDS.. FROM DESTRUCTION!

PM sent.
I await your response with great anticipation.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: KillerBee on Sun, 14 November 2010, 17:28:39
Quote from: kishy;246720
If anyone gets one of the 122-keys from Daniel which has the right-angle plug, and intends to throw away that original cord, I'd appreciate having it instead...

(properly detached from the inside, not cut, and with no connector or cord damage ideally)


Oh.... I threw 2 of these away (granted if the ones from the 102 terminal would have suited you)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: KillerBee on Sun, 14 November 2010, 20:06:14
They where the 5 pin wide spread DIN so I think they would have not worked
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Sun, 14 November 2010, 20:17:27
Arrrggg... I've got to travel for work tomorrow, so I won't be able to do anything about this tonight or tomorrow. Those who have paid: I will have to ship on Tuesday, sorry about that.

I have transported everything to my apartment, and I put in an order to Uline for boxes. I will be setting up a separate thread to manage orders, and I should have individual pictures of every single keyboard there. Everything will be $5, of course.

Those who have PMed me: you are not being ignored, just trying to get everything organized on my end. This is an awful large quantity of stuff to move.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Sun, 14 November 2010, 21:21:27
I'll probably have quite a few leftover boards, due to the lack of keys. I can send you any cables I have leftover for the 122 key boards. The 101's, on the other hand, I have a shortage of cables for. Many of the cords of the late-model boards are frayed. Which says something about the build quality of those boards (none of the old-model boards have frayed cables). They may actually be good candidates for USB mods, since the pins on the controller are probably intact on all of them.

I should say that I can't test any of the 122 key Model M's, but I'm rather sure they all work fine. I have yet to find a single Model M in this stash which are electrically faulty; the only non-functional boards are the ones with mechanical problems (missing springs, crushed cases and the like). If I have learned anything from these, it is that Model M's are ****ing tough as hell.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Mr. Perfect on Mon, 15 November 2010, 00:00:51
This might be a futile question, but those TO-300 boards with the Cherry blacks and the "phone connector", can they be converted to DIN or something? I've been wanting to try the Blacks, and wouldn't mind doing a bit of modding if the cost of entry was $5 and some Windex. :)

[Edit]OK, some Googleing suggest that those are non-standard interfaces. Guess that doesn't work...
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Wed, 17 November 2010, 10:50:55
Big update

I got caught at an off-site job for three days longer than I anticipated, and I only have a couple of days to clean out my apartment before I leave. As such, packaging and shipping these keyboards has become a logistical impossiblility. The promised $5 per keyboard is not happening.

Fortunately, I did find a home for them on a friend's farm. They'll have to sit in his shed for a few months (years?) before I can get back to them.

Those of you who have paid me already: I am sending out paypal refunds right now. Let me know if I missed you.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: ironman31 on Wed, 17 November 2010, 12:05:13
Good luck on your move
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: 8_INCH_FLOPPY on Wed, 17 November 2010, 13:11:16
Damn, I knew it was too good to be true.

At least they won't be trashed.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Azuremen on Wed, 17 November 2010, 21:29:42
Oh how unfortunate. I was hoping to order a few keycaps from you at some point after you'd sorted everything out, since I'd just picked up a Model M for cheap from Goodwill that is missing a few.

Good luck with the move though, those can be such a hassle.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: WhiteRice on Wed, 17 November 2010, 22:02:28
Would you say that these keyboards will be studied by top men?

Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Daniel Beaver on Wed, 17 November 2010, 23:45:19
You could say that.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Oqsy on Thu, 18 November 2010, 22:59:14
/END epic score thread.
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: msiegel on Thu, 18 November 2010, 23:16:20
*slowly exits theater*

(this was an "epic score" ;)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Fwiffo on Thu, 18 November 2010, 23:26:14
*Stays to watch the credits*
(my cousin was a best boy grip)
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: nowsharing on Sun, 21 November 2010, 21:42:34
I'm told that the bolt-modded M that I ordered from you arrived yesterday in great shape. Thanks!! I'll be home in mid-Dec and might bring it back to Brazil with me.

Did you get my PM asking if you had any PCBs that I could buy?
Title: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: Lanx on Tue, 23 November 2010, 01:09:24
i haven't gotten a refund yet, or is my order actually going through?
Title: Re: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: alienman82 on Sun, 01 October 2017, 18:35:34
removed.
Title: Re: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: rowdy on Tue, 02 January 2018, 03:55:30
Quote from: alienman82 on Sun, 01 October 2017, 18:35:34
link dead

Link should not be brought back from the dead, like this thread :p
Title: Re: One man's trash is another man's treasure
Post by: EscapeVelocity on Tue, 02 January 2018, 23:56:27
I just got a Mitumi E99-ZC 12 buckling rubber cup keyboard (rubber dome with slider).  I had to re-attach the stabilizer bars on the space bar, which also had a spring (only switch that had a spring). It saw little to no use because of the space bar issue. Near mint condition.