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geekhack Marketplace => Interest Checks => Topic started by: SamuraiKek on Wed, 25 August 2021, 14:29:23

Title: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: SamuraiKek on Wed, 25 August 2021, 14:29:23
Manibus


by Blank Tehnologii (https://blank.computer/)

[attachimg=23]



Manibus is a 3 year passion project with the aim of building a truly ergonomical and elegant keyboard while not breaking the bank.



IC Form (https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSeCBYZ4GpWyFHz39HQiXN4e-RcaPUzi2KyjDkTj_F-GfY0_zA/viewform)



0. Contents:

1. Details
2. Status
3. Pricing
4. Renders and Photos
5. FAQ


[attachimg=8]    [attachimg=9]

1. Details

- 62 keys
- staggered ortholinear layout
- cnc'd aluminum cases
- colors: anodized seaweed green & bead blasted silver
- cnc'd polycarbonate magnetic palm rests
- aluminum plates
- hotswap PCB's with USB-C
- weight is ~500g/half without palm rest and ~750g/half with palm rest
- 58x1u keys, 2x1.5u keys, 2x2.25u keys, doesn't require special ergonomic sets, a TKL set would work just fine
- QMK configurable
- 3D print the plates and try out the layout here (https://github.com/SamuraiKek/manibus-switch-plates)
- expected Group Buy: Q4 2021


2. Status

Multiple 3D printed prototypes and two aluminum prototypes have been built so far.
5 rounds of PCB prototypes. Currently waiting for the 6th one to finish and get delivered.
Here's (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=110060.0) an in-depth look at the design process of the keyboard I've made a while ago.

08/30/2021 Made the switch plate files available as STL's for 3D printing. Added more photos.

09/11/2021 Opened issue to include the layout in the Split Keyboard Layout Comparison Site (https://github.com/jhelvy/splitKbCompare/issues/60)

10/08/2021 Third aluminum prototype arrived

10/14/2021 6th round of PCB's arrived, now with hotswap


3. Pricing

Price will start from 250€ and will be sold with and without palm rests.
Number of units will be unlimited and GB will run for a month.
Estimated GB launch date: December 1st.
More details in the upcoming GB post.



4. Renders and Photos

[attachimg=10]    [attachimg=11]

[attachimg=12]    [attachimg=13]

Exploded view

[attachimg=14]

[attachimg=15]

Plates

[attachimg=16]

PCB's

[attachimg=17]    [attachimg=18]

V1 Prototype

[attach=1]    [attach=2]    [attach=3]
[attach=4]    [attach=5]    [attach=6]

V2 Prototype

[attachimg=19]    [attachimg=20]    [attachimg=7]

[attachimg=21]    [attachimg=24]    [attachimg=22]


5. FAQ

Q: Can you provide a typing test and more pictures/renders?
A: Yes. We're working on all of the above and will update this IC regulary when they're ready.

Update: We now have two typing tests available:
 


Q: Are you planning to include other color options?
A: While we'd love to work with different colors, we simply don't have the capacity to ensure they will come out as expected for now. We're mainly trying to deliver two solid options and with little to no color variance between the halves.

Q: Will you provide a tenting option?
A: Short answer no. A good tenting option would increase the manufacturing cost by quite a lot and we're trying to reach a reasonable price. That being said, the underside of the cases will have m2 screw holes that can be used to either screw in different length screws to achieve a tilt or, if you're a tinkerer, attach a custom 3D printed tilting mechanism.

Q: I live in X location on Y continent, will you deliver there?
A: We are selling worldwide. As long as it's covered by DHL, we're shipping to you.


Title: Re: [IC[Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard]
Post by: SamuraiKek on Wed, 25 August 2021, 14:35:53
Reserved

11/11/2021 Updated overall IC. Added more photos, renders, typing videos.
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: baobaozi on Sun, 29 August 2021, 17:22:05
I like the sentiment, more splits in the world and more "higher end" ones are nice.

But this one seems to lack refinement. Have you made a proto, even if it's just a 3D printed plate to put switches and caps onto? I dare say that thumb cluster is unusable. That's not how thumbs angle, I guesstimate you'll be hitting two thumb keys at once.

ai03 is coming out with the orbit-x soon and you can see they've put more consideration into the case design.

But I wish you the best, whether you decide to revise or not
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: SamuraiKek on Mon, 30 August 2021, 04:24:26
Hi! Thanks for your reply and thoughts.

Quote
But this one seems to lack refinement. Have you made a proto, even if it's just a 3D printed plate to put switches and caps onto?

The pictures in the post are of the aluminum prototype. Cases are anodized aluminum and wrist rests are polycarbonate. No fancy renders and studio photos yet, but we're in the middle of doing these and we'll update the post when they're ready.
You can have a look at the development process of this keyboard which took almost 3 years: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=110060.0 (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=110060.0)

Quote
I dare say that thumb cluster is unusable. That's not how thumbs angle, I guesstimate you'll be hitting two thumb keys at once.

We have made multiple design iterations of this keyboard, starting from a layout closer to ergodox style keyboards. Our conclusions and findings have actually led us to this more compact thumb cluster. I get into more detail about it in the development post ^. TL;DR of this would be: after using an ergodox and our first protoype for almost a year and seeing many people complain about  the thumb cluster on ergodox style boards, we've tried to do a different approach which in our opinion is much more comfortable and natural for a split style keyboard.
I will follow up with a typing test video when I get the chance.
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: _rubik on Mon, 30 August 2021, 12:15:16
Interesting choice to found a full company behind this one board. I'm not a frequent ergo board user, but this layout looks pretty appealing.

Would you be open to releasing a plate file so folks can handwire a proto themselves before committing a full alu version? I know ergo layouts are highly subject, so I (and I'm sure others) may want to feel it themselves before committing?
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: SamuraiKek on Mon, 30 August 2021, 12:53:20
Quote from: _rubik on Mon, 30 August 2021, 12:15:16
Interesting choice to found a full company behind this one board. I'm not a frequent ergo board user, but this layout looks pretty appealing.

Would you be open to releasing a plate file so folks can handwire a proto themselves before committing a full alu version? I know ergo layouts are highly subject, so I (and I'm sure others) may want to feel it themselves before committing?

It made sense to found a company. We have bigger plans in the future and it gives some trust to the community that we're serious about what we're doing, especially this being our first product. Handing invoices, paying income taxes, etc is also easier as a company, at least where we're from.

Releasing the plate file actually sounds like a great idea. I will set up a github repo and will update this comment and the post with a link to it once it's ready.

EDIT: Here is the link to the repo: https://github.com/SamuraiKek/manibus-switch-plates (https://github.com/SamuraiKek/manibus-switch-plates)
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: _rubik on Mon, 30 August 2021, 13:00:00
Quote from: SamuraiKek on Mon, 30 August 2021, 12:53:20
Quote from: _rubik on Mon, 30 August 2021, 12:15:16
Would you be open to releasing a plate file so folks can handwire a proto themselves before committing a full alu version? I know ergo layouts are highly subject, so I (and I'm sure others) may want to feel it themselves before committing?

Releasing the plate file actually sounds like a great idea. I will set up a github repo and will update this comment and the post with a link to it once it's ready.

Hell yeah :thumb:. I'm excited to get one of these built and to try it out
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: baobaozi on Wed, 01 September 2021, 08:47:21
Well, I'm happy to be proven wrong!

Any chance there's a printable layout so I could check it out?

Quote from: SamuraiKek on Mon, 30 August 2021, 04:24:26
Hi! Thanks for your reply and thoughts.

Quote
But this one seems to lack refinement. Have you made a proto, even if it's just a 3D printed plate to put switches and caps onto?

The pictures in the post are of the aluminum prototype. Cases are anodized aluminum and wrist rests are polycarbonate. No fancy renders and studio photos yet, but we're in the middle of doing these and we'll update the post when they're ready.
You can have a look at the development process of this keyboard which took almost 3 years: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=110060.0 (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=110060.0)

Quote
I dare say that thumb cluster is unusable. That's not how thumbs angle, I guesstimate you'll be hitting two thumb keys at once.

We have made multiple design iterations of this keyboard, starting from a layout closer to ergodox style keyboards. Our conclusions and findings have actually led us to this more compact thumb cluster. I get into more detail about it in the development post ^. TL;DR of this would be: after using an ergodox and our first protoype for almost a year and seeing many people complain about  the thumb cluster on ergodox style boards, we've tried to do a different approach which in our opinion is much more comfortable and natural for a split style keyboard.
I will follow up with a typing test video when I get the chance.
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: SamuraiKek on Wed, 01 September 2021, 09:25:25
Quote
Well, I'm happy to be proven wrong!

Any chance there's a printable layout so I could check it out?

Yep, you can download the layout files from here: https://github.com/SamuraiKek/manibus-switch-plates (https://github.com/SamuraiKek/manibus-switch-plates)
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: iaji on Thu, 02 September 2021, 22:21:38
Quote from: SamuraiKek on Mon, 30 August 2021, 04:24:26
Hi! Thanks for your reply and thoughts.

Quote
But this one seems to lack refinement. Have you made a proto, even if it's just a 3D printed plate to put switches and caps onto?

The pictures in the post are of the aluminum prototype. Cases are anodized aluminum and wrist rests are polycarbonate. No fancy renders and studio photos yet, but we're in the middle of doing these and we'll update the post when they're ready.
You can have a look at the development process of this keyboard which took almost 3 years: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=110060.0 (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=110060.0)

Quote
I dare say that thumb cluster is unusable. That's not how thumbs angle, I guesstimate you'll be hitting two thumb keys at once.

We have made multiple design iterations of this keyboard, starting from a layout closer to ergodox style keyboards. Our conclusions and findings have actually led us to this more compact thumb cluster. I get into more detail about it in the development post ^. TL;DR of this would be: after using an ergodox and our first protoype for almost a year and seeing many people complain about  the thumb cluster on ergodox style boards, we've tried to do a different approach which in our opinion is much more comfortable and natural for a split style keyboard.
I will follow up with a typing test video when I get the chance.
here's a video of a comfy thumb row based on my hand. have you tried somethinglike this?
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: SamuraiKek on Fri, 03 September 2021, 04:46:03
Quote from: iaji on Thu, 02 September 2021, 22:21:38
here's a video of a comfy thumb row based on my hand. have you tried somethinglike this?

Hi! Thanks for sharing that video. The thumb position when using Manibus is actually very similar to yours. I've started from a layout like yours but then I figured that if I wanted a high profile case that would go nicely with Manibus, I wouldn't be able to tray mount it without having a gap where the plate is visible between the thumb keys which I really don't like. It ruins the clean look for me. The solution was to put the keys upright, bring them close to each other and have these 1.25u and 2.25u keys that actually perform, I would say, just as well.
I could have gone with something similar to your layout, but then I would have had to change the mounting system from tray mount to a top/bottom mount which would have made the case 2 part. A 2 part case would imply higher manufacturing costs. Split alu keyboards are more expensive to machine already and adding an extra layer of complexity with a sandwich design would have only made things pricier.

That's the reason why I've designed the layout this way. It's still very comfortable, I love the desing (but that's subjective I guess) and it stays true to what I set out to do: a high quality split aluminum keyboard with a reasonable price.

Here's also a short video demonstrating the thumb position on Manibus:

Not convinced yet? Download the plate files from here: https://github.com/SamuraiKek/manibus-switch-plates and try it out yourself  :D
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: hottrout on Fri, 03 September 2021, 08:49:30
Interesting
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: reminbee on Thu, 09 September 2021, 16:47:45
Great stuff! The thumb cluster on the ergodox has always been a little too far away from me, and caused strain after long hours of continuous use. Looks like this would help alleviate that! My only comment is filling in some of the sharper corners will help unify the design language (https://i.imgur.com/0oXgoAn.png), but I suspect that straight section is due to a limitation with the PCB? Looking forward to seeing the final result of this project.
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: SamuraiKek on Fri, 10 September 2021, 13:54:58
Quote from: reminbee on Thu, 09 September 2021, 16:47:45
Great stuff! The thumb cluster on the ergodox has always been a little too far away from me, and caused strain after long hours of continuous use. Looks like this would help alleviate that! My only comment is filling in some of the sharper corners will help unify the design language (https://i.imgur.com/0oXgoAn.png), but I suspect that straight section is due to a limitation with the PCB? Looking forward to seeing the final result of this project.

Thank you! You will love this layout then  ;D I know what you mean about filling those sharper corners but as you suspected, it's a design constraint. That's where the USB-C connector sits and filling the zone with extra material would make for a deep entry for the usb cable so I'd rather keep it like this. It has actually grown on me  :D The sollution would be to change from a tray mount design to a top/bottom mount design but that would add extra cost to manufacturing which I'm trying to keep as low as possible.
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: baobaozi on Fri, 10 September 2021, 21:08:50
Quote from: iaji on Thu, 02 September 2021, 22:21:38
here's a video of a comfy thumb row based on my hand. have you tried somethinglike this?
I have, I prefer thumb clusters that fan out more, like yours, and are N/S further away from alphas (like Draculad) because I'm a wrist floating typist, I find the thumb position is different to wrist resting.
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: SamuraiKek on Thu, 11 November 2021, 12:18:56
Updated IC.

What's new:

1. Final case prototypes have arrived.
2. Final PCB prorotypes have arrived and are functional, now supporting hotswap sockets.
3. Moved audio jacks near the thumb cluster. Previously located next to the USB-C port at the top of the case.
4. Added more renders & photos with the new prototypes.
5. Added typing tests.
6. Updated overall information.
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: Arcoril on Sun, 14 November 2021, 12:35:24
Looks really promising, but will there be a stabilizer option for the 2.25u thumb key?
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: SamuraiKek on Sun, 14 November 2021, 16:02:01
Quote from: Arcoril on Sun, 14 November 2021, 12:35:24
Looks really promising, but will there be a stabilizer option for the 2.25u thumb key?

Thank you. Yes, there will be. I've just realized the render with the plate doesn't have the cutouts for the stabilizers but it's going to support plate-mount stabilizers.

Here are some actual photos of the plate from our prototype:

[attachimg=1]    [attachimg=2]
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: SamuraiKek on Tue, 30 November 2021, 08:20:16
Just got another round of high quiality photos for manibus:

PCB:

[attachimg=1]    [attachimg=2]

Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: SamuraiKek on Tue, 30 November 2021, 08:22:25
Wrist rests:

[attachimg=1]   
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: SamuraiKek on Tue, 30 November 2021, 08:23:52
Seaweed green:

[attachimg=1]
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: SamuraiKek on Tue, 30 November 2021, 08:25:30
Silver:

[attachimg=1]
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: SamuraiKek on Tue, 30 November 2021, 08:28:27
[attachimg=1]    [attachimg=2]

[attachimg=3]    [attachimg=4]
Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: SamuraiKek on Tue, 30 November 2021, 08:33:03
Check out how Manibus's magnets work:

Title: Re: [IC] Manibus - Split ergonomic aluminum keyboard
Post by: SamuraiKek on Tue, 30 November 2021, 08:35:12
First 30 orders will get a free set of 62 Kailh Box White clicky switches!

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