Print Page - [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.

geekhack Marketplace => Interest Checks => Topic started by: Blitzschnitzel on Sun, 26 September 2021, 10:00:26

Title: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Blitzschnitzel on Sun, 26 September 2021, 10:00:26

Renderings:

[attachimg=1]

[attachimg=2]

[attachimg=3]
Top Left: Neoprene dampener for in between the switches. Top Right: Mounting screws and rubber washers.
Middle Left: Case frame. Middle Right: A stack of neoprene to fill the space under the PCB.
Bottom Left: Laser etched acrylic back plate. Bottom Right: Switch plate.

[attach=9]
Push in PVC feet, because we really don't like the glue on feet coming off.

Our yet unpolished prototype: (Also no cut for the USB port yet)

[attachimg=4]

[attachimg=5]

[attachimg=6]

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[attachimg=8]

IC Form:
https://forms.gle/qNbuaMDVwX58W9cFA (https://forms.gle/qNbuaMDVwX58W9cFA)

Hi, we are a team of two CNC machinists from Latvia and an industrial designer from Germany. Since the design and manufacturing comes from the same people, we are very free to experiment with shapes and materials.

For our first project we are working on Ferrum. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard. We chose stainless steel because, when polished, it gives a very clear, warm and lasting reflection. In comparison, polished and anodized aluminium has a rather dull sheen and polished brass or copper would need a clear coating which will wear off.

With roughly 1.6kg this keyboard will definitely stay where you put it. It might not be a portable laptop extension but it would be a great conversation piece for 40% afficionados on PC. The angle is 7° and the centre top of a DSA keycap on bottom row is 28mm high

We are planning switch plates for plank and plank style ortho PCBs as well as the Daisy PCB. The 4x4 numpad is an idea for a later time. Neoprene dampeners are also in planning. Also, we like the unpolished raw look with all the tooling marks so much. We are discussing if we should offer an unpolished version. What do you guys think?

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: d3adc3II on Sun, 26 September 2021, 10:20:27

this size is perfect for ortho layout. Ortho pls.

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: bloodparticle on Sun, 26 September 2021, 10:20:44

Definitely an interesting project, will keep my eyes on it... totally love the the unpolished raw look!

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Alejo1707 on Sun, 26 September 2021, 10:30:28

Quote from: d3adc3II on Sun, 26 September 2021, 10:20:27

this size is perfect for ortho layout. Ortho pls.

X2

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Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Blitzschnitzel on Sun, 26 September 2021, 10:37:42

Quote from: d3adc3II on Sun, 26 September 2021, 10:20:27

this size is perfect for ortho layout. Ortho pls.

As you can see on the second picture, we have already planned for an ortho version. ;) The switch plate is already laser cut. Only the USB port will be on the left instead of the middle for the ortho version.

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Finite on Sun, 26 September 2021, 11:06:14

I need that unpolished finish! It looks absolutely stunning, and would also be cheaper I presume.

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Alejo1707 on Sun, 26 September 2021, 11:17:52

Quote from: Blitzschnitzel on Sun, 26 September 2021, 10:37:42

Quote from: d3adc3II on Sun, 26 September 2021, 10:20:27
this size is perfect for ortho layout. Ortho pls.
As you can see on the second picture, we have already planned for an ortho version. ;) The switch plate is already laser cut. Only the USB port will be on the left instead of the middle for the ortho version.

I just grazed over that picture as some artistic take on your board. I suggest to more explicitly state there will be an ortho version, for a side board and some ortho plates hidden in pictures is not nearly enough and they show you are not keen or care about them.

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Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: qwahtroh on Sun, 26 September 2021, 11:25:22

Really like the unpolished look. +1 for ortho

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Blitzschnitzel on Sun, 26 September 2021, 11:34:05

Quote from: Finite on Sun, 26 September 2021, 11:06:14

I need that unpolished finish! It looks absolutely stunning, and would also be cheaper I presume.

Yes. At this early stage we are not able yet to fully estimate the production costs. Since Covid-19 the price of stainless steel has also fluctuated immensely. The polishing will be the most labour-intensive step. So, a raw version will definitely be cheaper.

Quote from: Alejo1707 on Sun, 26 September 2021, 11:17:52

Quote from: Blitzschnitzel on Sun, 26 September 2021, 10:37:42
Quote from: d3adc3II on Sun, 26 September 2021, 10:20:27
this size is perfect for ortho layout. Ortho pls.
As you can see on the second picture, we have already planned for an ortho version. ;) The switch plate is already laser cut. Only the USB port will be on the left instead of the middle for the ortho version.
I just grazed over that picture as some artistic take on your board. I suggest to more explicitly state there will be an ortho version, for a side board and some ortho plates hidden in pictures is not nearly enough and they show you are not keen or care about them.

Sent from my GM1917 using Tapatalk

Thank you for the input. I have put a highlight on the text section.

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Darth_munkee on Sun, 26 September 2021, 12:04:06

This looks great, I vote unpolished. Will definitely be in for an ortho version.

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: paperassgasket on Sun, 26 September 2021, 12:09:08

This is like the perfect intersection of P4CK3R and Menhir.
I'm in.

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Willtato on Sun, 26 September 2021, 13:23:38

The keycaps look cosy. Love it.
Hope it's affordable :)

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Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: HappyB0T on Sun, 26 September 2021, 13:51:24

Keyboard design great enough to convince me into a 40%. Macro pad looks really really awesome!

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Faceman76 on Sun, 26 September 2021, 14:05:36

Fyi, keyhive has a 40% board that compatible with other cases. Would be cool if manufacturers worked together to create a universal 40% fitment.

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Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: _rubik on Sun, 26 September 2021, 14:08:22

I see now why you were asking about typing height :p

Really cool project! As others have said, that unfinished look with the raw striations actually looks pretty nice. I'll be following along closely

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: kajahtaa on Sun, 26 September 2021, 15:55:45

love this. 19.05mm ortho ?

likely i'd make my own plate

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Blitzschnitzel on Sun, 26 September 2021, 16:29:38

Quote from: _rubik on Sun, 26 September 2021, 14:08:22

I see now why you were asking about typing height :p

Exactly :D

Quote from: kajahtaa on Sun, 26 September 2021, 15:55:45

love this. 19.05mm ortho ?

likely i'd make my own plate

As it is planned for now, the ortho plate will fit both 19.05mm and 19mm grids. The cut-outs in the middle will fit the switch precisely and then get a tiny bit wider towards the edges. Since the 40% is just 12 keys wide, the extra width on the outside will just be 0.3mm. Well within the tolerance for Cherry switches.
The hight of the grid is 19.05, since the 0.1mm difference should easily be taken up by the hot swaps or through holes.

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: kajahtaa on Sun, 26 September 2021, 21:08:29

I'm in.

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: aperumdesign on Mon, 27 September 2021, 04:46:09

Clicked for the mirror polished SS in the title, but that unpolished SS look is really interesting and unique. I'd be in either way. Also extremely keen on the idea of a matching numpad

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Thockologist on Mon, 27 September 2021, 08:27:13

Always have been curious about 40% boards, this might make me jump on getting one depending on the price. I think the unpolished prototype looks fantastic, the texture from machined metals always looks great imo.

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: cigs_coffee on Mon, 27 September 2021, 13:09:46

Def. prefer the unpolished look.

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Blitzschnitzel on Tue, 28 September 2021, 07:26:56

Thank you everyone for the great feedback.
There is one thing I would like to ask the community about the plate mounting method. In the prototype the plate is still top mounted. A gasket mount would need a solid back piece. Right now, the keyboard has a nice heft but a back piece would send the weight off the rails.
Our idea is to use nitrile washers around the eight mounting points to decouple the plate.
Would it be fair to call this solution a gasket mount? Mechanically it should behave the same as a regular gasket mount and be more customizable.

[attachimg=1]

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: aperumdesign on Tue, 28 September 2021, 07:51:46

Quote from: Blitzschnitzel on Tue, 28 September 2021, 07:26:56

Would it be fair to call this solution a gasket mount? Mechanically it should behave the same as a regular gasket mount and be more customizable.

(Attachment Link)

I think I'd be more inclined to call that solution an isolated top mount, but it would surely help nonetheless.
I suppose another option would be to replace or even couple washers with leaf-springs on the plate. Something like what the Menhir by Fruit is employing (although there are probably enough resemblances between the boards at this point!)
Also nothing wrong with extra heft! But not sure what impact that would have on affordability

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Darth_munkee on Tue, 28 September 2021, 08:03:59

Quote from: aperumdesign on Tue, 28 September 2021, 07:51:46

Quote from: Blitzschnitzel on Tue, 28 September 2021, 07:26:56
Would it be fair to call this solution a gasket mount? Mechanically it should behave the same as a regular gasket mount and be more customizable.

(Attachment Link)

I think I'd be more inclined to call that solution an isolated top mount, but it would surely help nonetheless.
I suppose another option would be to replace or even couple washers with leaf-springs on the plate. Something like what the Menhir by Fruit is employing (although there are probably enough resemblances between the boards at this point!)
Also nothing wrong with extra heft! But not sure what impact that would have on affordability

It'd probably start to be a problem for shipping costs at some point. Imagine getting a 40% case strapped to a mini pallet, delivered by freight!

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Blitzschnitzel on Wed, 29 September 2021, 12:22:58

Quote from: aperumdesign on Tue, 28 September 2021, 07:51:46

I think I'd be more inclined to call that solution an isolated top mount, but it would surely help nonetheless.
I suppose another option would be to replace or even couple washers with leaf-springs on the plate. Something like what the Menhir by Fruit is employing (although there are probably enough resemblances between the boards at this point!)
Also nothing wrong with extra heft! But not sure what impact that would have on affordability

I could make a flex simulation in Solidworks. But the thing with leaf springs is that I have yet to find someone who can tell me how much exactly the plate should flex. Washers are a lot more user adjustable. Add a few, take a few away.

Quote from: Darth_munkee on Tue, 28 September 2021, 08:03:59

It'd probably start to be a problem for shipping costs at some point. Imagine getting a 40% case strapped to a mini pallet, delivered by freight!

Yes, 2kg packed is a magic mark. Plus, we are trying to keep the price low. A solid back piece would probably add 50% to the selling price.

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: JoltFX on Wed, 29 September 2021, 15:36:56

I didn’t know I needed this… thanks for letting me know :)

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Blitzschnitzel on Sun, 03 October 2021, 12:30:57

Hi. We have made an IC form. We would be very happy if you guys would answer our questionnaire to help us further develop this project. Also if you already posted here.;) If you want, you can leave your email address in the form. We would then send you an email when this project goes into a group buy.

IC Form:
https://forms.gle/qNbuaMDVwX58W9cFA (https://forms.gle/qNbuaMDVwX58W9cFA)

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Big Click on Sun, 03 October 2021, 17:30:37

I need this in my life! :eek:

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: dtywill on Wed, 06 October 2021, 20:18:48

Will there be a discord channel or will updates only be here

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Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Blitzschnitzel on Thu, 07 October 2021, 10:08:16

Quote from: dtywill on Wed, 06 October 2021, 20:18:48

Will there be a discord channel or will updates only be here

To be honest this is our first IC and we don't know all the ropes yet. So, if a Discord channel is needed, we will open one. Most ICs here seem to be more pre-GroupBuy marketing for a finished design. We are more interested in your feedback to influence design decisions. That is why your feedback and filling out the IC form is much appreciated.

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: kajahtaa on Thu, 07 October 2021, 11:59:27

I'm not active on the 40s discord but perhaps it would be worth looking into

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Armyofkeyboards on Mon, 11 October 2021, 14:35:01

To be honest the raw one looks real good.
I would still offer both polished and unpolished, but I'm pretty sure the unpolished is going to be more popular.

Any idea on the looks of the bottom of the board?

Nice work!

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Blitzschnitzel on Sat, 16 October 2021, 12:41:31

Quote from: Armyofkeyboards on Mon, 11 October 2021, 14:35:01

To be honest the raw one looks real good.
I would still offer both polished and unpolished, but I'm pretty sure the unpolished is going to be more popular.

Any idea on the looks of the bottom of the board?

Nice work!

Thanks! From the IC form responses it seems like a polished version might not be in the first group buy. But we will keep on it depending on the success of the first GB. We will be able to post pictures of the bottom soon.

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: keybo_hobo on Sat, 16 October 2021, 13:59:10

What is the idea behind those raised edges that makes keycaps flushed with edges of the case?

Title: Re: [IC] Ferrum by KOKO. A mirror polished, stainless steel, 40% keyboard.
Post by: Blitzschnitzel on Thu, 16 December 2021, 12:25:10

The People behind the Ferrum keyboard would like to wish you all a merry Christmas.

[attachimg=1]

We are still working hard on finalizing the design. Thank you all who answered the IC. Your feedback has been going into the 2.0 version, which we are working on right now. You can expect a price estimate early next year. ;)