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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: iwobobul on Sat, 14 October 2023, 02:45:45
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Is there a definitive answer to the question "Are vintage blacks better, than hyperglides?"
I have a g80-1000 from 1990 that I want to desolder the blacks from to use in a Kohaku. But the board is kinda nice and I don't want to ruin it if I don't have to. So it comes down to a question – are vints better than hyperglides?
I know this is an old topic, but despite it being old I did not manage to find a definitive answer to this question.
As I see it there are two factors at play here.
First – vints could be heavily used.
Second – vints could have been made using different molds/nylon blend.
A lot of people say you can just break in hyperglides and they are going to be the same as vints, so I tried to find any comparison of the NOS vint and Hyperglide, to compare them stock, and found this video from Maker Mods, but the audio quality is just horrendous and it's impossible to make out anything really
Then there's this video from Chyrosran where he compares a vint vs hyperglide, but the vint is used and broken in t=387
Then there is this one post that compares "NOS" vint with a new retooled black, and says that vint is much smoother https://imgur.com/gallery/krIHB1m but again, this is not a hyperglide and there is no actual audio test to make one's own judgement
There is this video that got very close, but used different paltes for each build which makes it useless
And there is this very, very questionable comparison video, where not all switches are even named
So I decided to post here and ask, if there are maybe some links that you are aware of that I cannot find, that would shed some light and introduce the clarity to this question. Hopefully something a bit more scientific?
Thank you all and sorry for bringing it up again to those of you who found closure :)
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I believe it is a mixture of both the new and different molds along with being broken in for a while.
The molds are different which may have made the switch smoother, however this would have been a very minor thing and probably not that noticeable.
Another thing is that these were the first mx molds to be produced, which means that they would have been far better in quality as the mold hadn't been destroyed from use. The first round of switches is the better ones simply because the mold is better, for example the gateron ink blacks V2s had issues that the V1 didn't have. This video explains it a lot better than I could've and in more detail.
The use of the switches is also a pretty big factor, as the plastics in the switch break down with more use, resulting in a more smoother actuation. However the only benefit to getting vintage blacks is that they are already broken in.
I still need to try vintage blacks (I think I might have at a meetup but not 100%) but from what I have heard hyperglides that are broken in a lot and lubed are very comparable to vintage blacks that have been modded as well. The difference is very slight though, but the difference is much more apparent when you are using the switches stock.
I'd still recommend modding vintage blacks anyway, even if you are putting them back into a cherry board and/or not wanting to lube them. Cherry springs (and pretty much all manus stock springs) are pretty inconsistent, and cherry springs have a lot of spring ping and crunch so you should get an aftermarket spring like tx then just swap the springs and solder (maybe put an oil on the springs as well)
So the answer is... It depends (but in a lot of circumstances it seems to be that vintage blacks are better, but again it's more nuanced) hope this helps somewhat.
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Is there a definitive answer to the question "Are vintage blacks better, than hyperglides?"
Yes. That answer is it depends.
Vintage Cherry MX Blacks aren't all created equal, just like today's batches of the same switch. The mold hasn't changed drastically over the years so the main 2 things that affect the smoothness is freshness of the mold used and amount of break-in.
There's good hyperglides and there's bad hyperglides. There's good vints and there's bad vints.
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imo it doesnt matter blacks are blacks but i have hyperglides just cuz i can get them new and they're convenient
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imo it doesnt matter blacks are blacks but i have hyperglides just cuz i can get them new and they're convenient
yeah same here + cheaper than vints lol.
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imo it doesnt matter blacks are blacks but i have hyperglides just cuz i can get them new and they're convenient
yeah same here + cheaper than vints lol.
To be fair, vints don't really have a set price since you're buying all of then 2nd hand. You can buy them for $1 per switch on mechmarket or take 20 keyboards for free from a company looking to get rid of some old equipment they don't want anymore.
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To be fair, vints don't really have a set price since you're buying all of then 2nd hand. You can buy them for $1 per switch on mechmarket or take 20 keyboards for free from a company looking to get rid of some old equipment they don't want anymore.
Oh yeah that's definitely an option. Haven't tried to find keyboards that way, because vintage stuff is way less common here + don't know where you would find companies that would have this stuff.
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What's special about Vintage blacks is the worn in "casing".
The stems make very little difference to the smoothness, they're very slick out of the box, but the casing is rough for a long while.