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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: ciornav on Tue, 19 December 2023, 02:06:23
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Hello, I have a razer deathstalker chroma (model number RZ03-0150), a low profile membrane or chiclet (they seem to not agree on the notations on the product itself - "membrane" and the documentation - "chiclet") which after some time gives me finger strain for programming/office use. Sometimes I’m going till the bottom when pressing a key (sometimes with some force), but I’m not sure if this is the problem of my strain. I guess it’s either the bottoming or the high actuating force causes my finger strain. On my laptop, the strain is largely reduced (Dell precision 7670).
I know it’s probably not the keyboard for this (programming/office) use, but I got it for free, so I took it.
I’m considering buying a new one (hesitating as an example from logitech products: mx keys, mx mechanical and g815), but would like to avoid the finger strain. So would like co compare the actuating force curves for the switches (should I take care of more things such as tactile vs linear or how the bottoming is for the keyboard?). Is there some information about the bottoming of keyboards somewhere? Thanks,
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Hello, I have a razer deathstalker chroma (model number RZ03-0150), a low profile membrane or chiclet (they seem to not agree on the notations on the product itself - "membrane" and the documentation - "chiclet") which after some time gives me finger strain for programming/office use. Sometimes I’m going till the bottom when pressing a key (sometimes with some force), but I’m not sure if this is the problem of my strain. I guess it’s either the bottoming or the high actuating force causes my finger strain. On my laptop, the strain is largely reduced (Dell precision 7670).
I know it’s probably not the keyboard for this (programming/office) use, but I got it for free, so I took it.
I’m considering buying a new one (hesitating as an example from logitech products: mx keys, mx mechanical and g815), but would like to avoid the finger strain. So would like co compare the actuating force curves for the switches (should I take care of more things such as tactile vs linear or how the bottoming is for the keyboard?). Is there some information about the bottoming of keyboards somewhere? Thanks,
maybe a variable realforce
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The reason why your laptop does have less strain is because of the actuation force of the laptop keys, which is much less than a traditional rubber dome (the same line of laptops has the actuation force at about 34gf so I assume it's the same for your model, would still be much lighter than rubber dome boards, which vary but probably 60gf+)
If you are looking at mx style boards, than I would recommend getting a hotswappable keyboard in the layout that you like and spring swapping the switches that come with it with 35g springs (sprit springs seem to be the only option that sell good quality springs at the range, I'll link what I'm tlakinbg about here - https://rndkbd.com/products/sprit-springs?variant=43822770880746)
Linears and tactiles in my experience aren't that big of factor, unless it's a long pole switches which creates a harder bottom out, which may lead to more strain. So probably don't get those.
You should also get something that has a softer bottom out, which will reduce the harshness of keystroke and would reduce strain, something like a pc plate usually is a decent option.
If you want a recommendation, I'd say the keychron Q pro series would be alright for what you need, just would need to buy the springs and a switch opener to replace the springs with the lighter ones. However idk how much you are willing to pay for a keyboard so that may be out of your price range.
Hope this helps
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I'll second the Realforce suggestion. My fingertips used to tingle and get sore with mechanical keyboards, I'm assuming because of the hard bottoming out. I haven't had any pain since using a Realforce keyboard. Mine is a uniform 45g model, but the variable weight ones are nice if you type with the proper fingers. I don't, so there were a couple of keys that always felt mushy.
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30g switch real force and variable realforce are the softest landing and lead strain I've experienced
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topre is the answer.
Get the new Realforce R3 it has 45g key switches on it though.
Perhaps a variable realforce would be better. the new R3 doesnt come in variable configs
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since you have finger strains and probably some issues with typing a split corne with 20g choc pinks would probably relief a lot of pain
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how is 20g even possible
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how is 20g even possible
I think that's for when you want to sort of wave your hand in the general direction of the key and have it register a press.
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20g is pretty much only possible on linears and maybe rubber dome, it would lack the ability to return/reset after being pressed in an MX style switch if it had almost any tactility.
Finger pain can be too stiff of a switch, excessive bottoming or it can be switch bind
Stiffness is pretty self explanatory. There is two schools of thought on excessive bottoming, one is go stiffer so less likely to bottom or you can go lighter spring and now if you do bottom it won't be as jarring to your fingers. As for switch bind (where the switch gets pressed slightly off center and wedges itself), the only fix for this is lube or different switches.
As for OP, it will take a few weeks use for your fingers to acclimate then it will be fine, you just need to build up the muscle endurance for it.
If you want a keyboard closer to what you have and reduce that strain you're going to either have to use linears or customize some tactile switches, just beware as mentioned not all can function with such low spring weights and even those that do require more effort than a typical tactile. You need super thin lube (or oil) and be hyper vigilant about applying it and even then some may stick even after some break in. Also, tactiles at these weights don't always function how you think, some tactiles get more tactile with lighter springs while others just becomes softer all around. Also at these rates even heavier caps and stabs can be heavy enough to make them even more sensitive than other switches and cause you to accidentally trigger them just simply homing or resting your fingers.
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how is 20g even possible
I think that's for when you want to sort of wave your hand in the general direction of the key and have it register a press.
just push your finger down in the air above the key and the air pushed down will actuate it
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how is 20g even possible
For MX i don't know if it would work great. But for Choc it works great and Choc weight converted is probably around 35g bottom out MX.
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how is 20g even possible
For MX i don't know if it would work great. But for Choc it works great and Choc weight converted is probably around 35g bottom out MX.
If I can get a 35g tactile to be snappy I'm pretty sure I can get a 20g mx linear to work.
Not saying it will be easy to get it working , much less working well but I'm certain it could be done.