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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: itlnstln on Fri, 28 January 2011, 08:38:11
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First off, I'm not going to post this in the mods section, because Ripster has a great article there with plenty of pics, I don't have a camera, and this was spur-of-the-moment.
I had the great idea last night to swap the letter portion of the rubber dome mat between my HHKB and my RF 103 to see if the difference in feel was due to the overall construction differences of the 'boards or if it was due to the rubber domes. What's the worst that can happen? I have an all-45g. RF103 and a variable-weight HHKB? After following Ripster's guide and removing about eleventy billion screws from the RF, I came to several discoveries:
- Topre-based keyboards suck to take apart
- The Realforce is a beast of keyboard construction-wise; much more so than the HHKB.
- Da Domes R Different
Wait, what?
That's right, folks, the domes are different (here's where I wish I had the camera). There's really not that much see, however. The differences appear be simply hole alignments for the case screws. Just by pressing on the "naked" dome I could tell there was a difference. So after about an hour of putting everything back together, I did a typing test. Sure enough, I have the best-feeling HHKB on the face of the earth, and the Realforce, well... yeah.
That's not quite the end of the story, though; the domes only get you about 80% there. Earlier speculation assumed the domes were the same, but it was differences in the construction that created the differences in feel. That's not entirely false. See, the switch plate (the part where the caps connect and press on the domes) is plastic on the HHKB, is part of the upper case and is attached to the PCB by about 10 screws. The Realforce, on on the other hand, uses a more sturdy metal plate, and that plate is soley attached to the PCB via the eleventy billion screws. The case on the RF is "passive" in that the PCB just kinds sits in there and the case snaps on around it. This added plate/PCB sturdiness helps provide the entire Realforce feel.
Is it worth it to buy both 'boards and swap the domes? Absolutely not. What this does show is that Topre seems to have saved the good **** for their own products and gives 3rd party 'boards (at least the HHKB and maybe the uTron) it's leftovers.
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Cool mod. Thanks for the info!
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Thanks. Now you'll just have to wait another 2 1/2 years until my next mod. One thing this also shows is how bad the spacebar on the HHKB is. Even after swapping the dome, the spacebar still sucks.
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Now you'll just have to wait another 2 1/2 years until my next mod.
Why?
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Several reasons:
1. I'm pretty lazy
1a. I don't have time, and I don't choose to invest any of the free time I do have to mods.
2. I just don't get that geeked out over doing this kinda stuff
3. I get paid. If there is the option of modding a keyboard or buying it, I'm going with the latter.
4. Investment/Return. Most of the mod ideas I have had or have seen on Geekhack have a lot of investment (mainly time) and very little reward (to me).
This specific mod transcended a lot of that. It was fairly quick, I can't buy a HHKB that feels like this, and the ROI was good.
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Putting the damn things back together was a *****. The springs like to "buddy up," too, and it was hard to tell sometimes if I was putting only one spring in the dome. I thought I had lost 3 springs and it turned out I had put two springs in some of the other domes. Of course, I did the mod the ***** way and only replaced the domes that created a "sheet" the size of the HHKB. It was easy enough then to cut off entire sections I didn't need (like the F keys) with a pair of scissors.
Like I mentioned, swapping the domes only gets you about 80% there. The overall structure certainly influences the key feel. If I ever want to reverse the mod someday, I think I'll just buy another Realforce and keep my existing one for parts.
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The funny thing was I didn't even think about the hole alignments until I was putting the HHKB back together. I ended up taking a T-pin and poking a hole in the mat to put the screw in. I didn't feel like unscrewing everything to fix it. Fortunately, the RF was not a problem.
<- Lazy.
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I just threw that in there for funsies. The only difference I could really see was in the screw hole shapes and locations which will differ, anyway, based on the 'board it's going in. The only thing I couldn't see was how thick the mats and, more importantly, the domes were as I don't have a micrometer. Otherwise everything looked the same. Without more precise measurements, there's no telling really what the real differences are.
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Damn, what a BIG blank spot (and I don't mean Africa).
Yeah, poor Russia.
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That could be you Ripster!
I still like the ring of "Ripsterskeyboards.com"
...or maybe "RipstersExclusiveFilcoFanboiEmporium.com"
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I still like the ring of "Ripsterskeyboards.com"
...or maybe "RipstersExclusiveFilcoFanboiEmporium.com"
I should register these and point them to geekhack.