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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: BaconKnight on Thu, 28 April 2011, 01:58:03
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If you're like me, I'm sure a lot of you have watched your fair share of keyboard typing videos on Youtube and it just struck me how many typists out there type incorrectly. And I'm not talking about some minor issue, but the fact that it seems a lot of people type with only two fingers on their right hand. A couple times I ever seen some people use ONLY their right pointer finger, even for the space bar!
I don't think it's a "handed-ness" thing because I'm left handed and use all my righty fingers (though I do tend to notice sometimes I use my pinky for backspace, sometimes my ring, seems about 50/50)
Maybe it's because I took typing classes in high school, back when they'd force you to type on real typewriters with no backspace cart installed, but I always wonder why they don't just "unlearn" their way and try to use all their fingers.
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I believe "some people use ONLY his right pointer finger, even for the space bar!" is me.
I posted that video.
I type the way I do because I have never been through typing class nor does my current job require me to type quickly.
At home, I don't type much as I game more than I actually type.
I been trying to "re-learn" to type properly. Fixed by spacebar with my pointer-finger already.
Maybe people just feel it's more comfortable to type that way as you should know by now that the QWERTY layout is not ergonomic.
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Haha, nothing wrong with going with what works. I was wondering since I think my right hand would get tired if I had to type like that, granted I do have to type a lot for work.
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After having evaluated the ergonomics of dished keyboards, I consider touch typing on a flat, non-symmetrically staggered QWERTY keyboard to be wrong anyway.
Personally, I think that there is a lack of videos on Youtube of people touch-typing on Maltron and Kinesis keyboards in slow motion and high resolution ... but that may be just me. :-)
My dad typed on typewriters using only his index fingers ... but he did it fast.
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In my opinion, touch-typing is a great method of torture. I use both hands, and most of my fingers. Left thumb doesn't do much until ctrl/alt are needed, pinkies don't do squat but shift on either side and few symbols on the right. I use whatever finger happens to be in the area of the key that's needed. This means that either index finger is likely to hit any key from rfc on the left to ikm on the right. That is without looking at the keyboard and I cruise along at ~100wpm.
Give me an ergo keyboard and I'll show you how to sink a nail without the proper tool. :)
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If my news on kids is up to date schools do not even teach cursive anymore? so why not teach them proper typing. Heck even before I had tried mavis beacon, i had school classes for typing and even before that my mom took me to computer classes with commodore 64's that had typing games. It only makes sense that older people do not know how to type cuz they were used to secretaries or whatever but i'm thinking anyone under 40? should be at least half-@$$ touch typing.
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Hey, at least these videos feature keyboards we approve of! :lol: I've always been happy to see people doing their own thing. I say let people use whatever method they want, even a two-finger touch typing approach. As long as they know where the keys are, and can type without looking, let em use whatever fingers they want.
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Geez, I hated having to learn cursive in school. As soon as they stopped force feeding me that junk, I just remembered how to write my signature and said adios to the rest!
Good point about teaching kids how to touch type. Maybe they figure computers are so common place nowadays teaching typing would be redundant for a lot of kids. Personally I'd think even kids who already know how to type well could always afford to take one class to learn how to "type correctly" and minimize bad habits. Before typing class I use to think I was super fast, not realizing how many mistakes I was making because I was trying to type faster than my fingers were accurate at that point and that was slowing me down overall. I swear, nothing is as unforgiving as a real typewriter with no backspace cart, that thing still gives me nightmares. You soon learn just how inaccurate your typing is when every mistake is printed onto paper forever to see. Good practice though.
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Here's one I prepared earlier, as they say.
[video=youtube;pYJtF1I3PRs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYJtF1I3PRs[/video]
I'm transcribing the audio you can hear in the background. If my hands seems a bit out of "synch" with it, that's because I'm touch typing in short hand.
I made the video mainly to show how little physical effort is involved in using the "Malt" key layout.
This other video
[video=youtube;o4H931A3BDE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4H931A3BDE&feature=related[/video]
shows how, even on the same keyboard, using the QWERTY layout causes a lot more movement of the hands and arms.
Joe
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It always depends on your goal but you don't need to attend classes to learn touch typing.
I was still a teen when an girlfriend spent less than an hour over my shoulder to show me which finger goes where (Ok she had to remind me couple of times to focus on the keyboard).
Then I practiced on my own by reading /typing extracts from books. Back then I was working in a tourist information kiosk. I didn't even have a computer. A friend lent me an old keyboard. Just touch typing on the keyboard alone with no screen was enough. Within less than two weeks I was faster than previously with my self-inflicted intuitive technique with couples of fingers in both hands.
I noticed that you are much more prone to errors when you see what you type on the screen while you are typing it. A cheap touch typing software might be a good investment for accuracy. The letter sequences they use are meant to train your brain for accuracy as well.
To bad (for them) so many people don't bother to learn how to type properly. It doesn't take long and certainly improve productivity (if you need to generate documents/text). I mean, reponding to a load of emails per day is part of so many jobs. Having touch typing in your toolbox is a good asset.
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If you're like me, I'm sure a lot of you have watched your fair share of keyboard typing videos on Youtube and it just struck me how many typists out there type incorrectly. And I'm not talking about some minor issue, but the fact that it seems a lot of people type with only two fingers on their right hand. A couple times I ever seen some people use ONLY their right pointer finger, even for the space bar!
I don't think it's a "handed-ness" thing because I'm left handed and use all my righty fingers (though I do tend to notice sometimes I use my pinky for backspace, sometimes my ring, seems about 50/50)
Maybe it's because I took typing classes in high school, back when they'd force you to type on real typewriters with no backspace cart installed, but I always wonder why they don't just "unlearn" their way and try to use all their fingers.
Even a genius like ''L'' dont type normally with full fingers, why should us?
(http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n246/TheNinjaCandyman/0bc3a839da0f30_full.gif)
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Can't argue with that logic.
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Is that Ann Widdecombe narrating that video? Time to get my cattleprod.
I suspect the lady concerned is Pam Hobday, wife of Stephen Hobday, who collaborated with Lilian Malt to create the Maltron keyboard.
I met both Pam and Stephen in the late '90s when they came to Perth and from memory, it sounds like her.
She used to do the hand soldering of the keyboards. I think she's done two of the ones that I've got.
Joe
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I did have a class on touch typing and didn't really learn anything. It was only until I had a million papers and what not to type up that I bothered learning to touch type qwerty. Then when I learned dvorak I had to touch type since the printing on the keys is irrelevant.
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I am for classes about touch typing. The problem is that, as dr/owned said, there's not necessarily an incentive to pay attention. Unless you're covering the labels with a silicone keyboard cover (or, perhaps you order Otaku boards - kinda doubt it for a computer lab), you won't gain from it. I was religious about not cheating when I took typing (which was harder, as I could have easily). I was one of a couple people who actually did so.
In the end, I made some money on the side. People would pay me to retype their paper with corrections and I'd have it done in 5 minutes (I wouldn't write any of the content; I would merely make any corrections they/their teachers had indicated.
I don't type fully proper though. Type to Learn did not give me that. I tend to type pretty freeform. I use the nubs to get back to F and J, and I use my pinkies on the modifiers, and I use the space bar with my thumbs (heavy preference towards the right thumb), but I don't always return every finger to the home row.
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I don't type fully proper though. Type to Learn did not give me that. I tend to type pretty freeform. I use the nubs to get back to F and J, and I use my pinkies on the modifiers, and I use the space bar with my thumbs (heavy preference towards the right thumb), but I don't always return every finger to the home row.
Same here... Do what you are describing above is considered bad practice?
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You can always buy a Michela's machine
(http://www.senato.it/img/repository/relazioni/libreria/manifestazioni/2004/smau%20sicilia%202004/michela1.jpg)
Is still used in the Italian senate (http://translate.google.com/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=it&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=it&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.senato.it%2Frelazioni%2F21615%2F21699%2F28647%2F30920%2F30923%2F30924%2Fgenpagina.htm&act=url).
You can reach 200 words per minute with this...
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Same here... Do what you are describing above is considered bad practice?
Generally speaking, yes. When you are typing normal sentences you should be staying on the home row for as long as possible.
But let's assume you need to type an obscene amount of []{}\|'";:, then I'd argue that it's OK to not be on the home row and use other fingers than the pinkie.
But whatever works in the end is probably fine.
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You know what really messed me up on modifiers? when in the mid 90's ppl in AoL chatrooms were all talking like this...
"HeY SuP YaLl, WaS hApEnNiNg?"
after of course indulging in that a few times with other teenage friends I decided, um now, guess I'll type like a normal human.
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Here's one I prepared earlier, as they say.
[video=youtube;pYJtF1I3PRs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYJtF1I3PRs[/video]
I'm transcribing the audio you can hear in the background. If my hands seems a bit out of "synch" with it, that's because I'm touch typing in short hand.
I made the video mainly to show how little physical effort is involved in using the "Malt" key layout.
My favourite part is where you use your fingers to press Ctrl-Backspace on the thumb keypad ...
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I took a high school typing class because I thought it'd be easy credit. I was horrible for half the semester, and then one day it clicked and I was touch typing 60wpm. Little did I know that would start me on the career path I'm on this very day (that class was 16-17 years ago).
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I never learned to properly touch type, but I had developed my own form that let me cruise along at about 65-70 wpm. I never did the whole home row thing, just kind of hovered over the keyboard and flew along. About two years ago, I started kind of trying to learn how to touch type properly, and I picked up an Otaku board to force me to learn. Since then, my speed has increased to about 75-80wpm, but I still don't completely touch type properly. My current typing style is probably a mix between proper home row usage and my old free form style from left over reflexive habits. For example, I'll still occasionally end up with a finger from my right hand hitting keys that probably should have been hit by my left hand. I'm still working on it. =)
EDIT: Just took a typing test, 94 wpm! =)
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I switched to dvorak and decided to learn to touch type at the same time.