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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: Arcanius on Tue, 14 June 2011, 18:59:19
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What keyboards have the best build quality for price? I'm looking at Cherry switches myself, and although I lurk here constantly, I haven't yet made up my mind as to what I want to buy.
For me, a Leopold would cost $140,
A Poker $125,
A Choc Mini $120,
And a Das $115.
I'm just not sure what I want, I'd prefer it to be compact, so Das only wins if it's so far above the others (and I know it's not.)
How much flex does a Poker have, being the only PCB mounted board?
Also, what about other boards? What boards do you have where you've found shoddy build quality, or other stupid issues?
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What STD (No, it stands for Shortcoming Taxing Distinction) does the Poker have?
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I think the general consensus here is that Filcos are the benchmark for quality (in regards to keyboards that use Cherry switches anyway), while Leopold, Das, etc. are all good value for what you get.
Poker doesn't have flex when typing, but it does feel a lot more plasticky then a Filco.
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I live in Canada, so Filco is difficult to obtain, unless I want to ship from China or use a package forwarding service, which would drive the cost upwards of $200.
I think I win that one award Ripster gave to the person who had been on Geekhack longest without buying a mechanical.
I started Lurking in July of last year, and have yet to buy a mechanical. I'm still thinking about what to buy.
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A base BlackWidow (not ultimate) is actually a decent board. It's not my cup of tea but it's one of the cheapest ways to get some Cherries in your life and probably the most likely to be in stock around you.
If that doesn't work the Leopold is a decent option as well.
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You could buy a filco on amazon, unless they don't sell to Canadians (I really don't know).
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Nah, they don't. Im sure you could find someone nice enough to buy it and send it to you.
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A Filco on Amazon is 140. Shipping to Canada would be about another $30. I'm sorry, but that's a ton of money. The only other choice is to go buy it off armygroup. What's the shipping nowaday form there? Still $20?
Also, Chobopants, I have a friend with a Blackwidow, which I do somewhat like, but I'm looking for brown switches. My friend's BW has really loose keycaps, they're horrible. I can push down on a key, and then wiggle it side to side. Also, I managed to completely strip his keyboard using only my fingers. Horrid.
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A Filco on Amazon is 140. Shipping to Canada would be about another $30. I'm sorry, but that's a ton of money. The only other choice is to go buy it off armygroup. What's the shipping nowaday form there? Still $20?
Also, Chobopants, I have a friend with a Blackwidow, which I do somewhat like, but I'm looking for brown switches. My friend's BW has really loose keycaps, they're horrible. I can push down on a key, and then wiggle it side to side. Also, I managed to completely strip his keyboard using only my fingers. Horrid.
i can strip a girl by just looking at her
kind of like how joey from Friends could unhook bras by looking at it
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Wait, PCHome had the $20 shipping. :S
Does anybody have a price that they paid for Armygroup shipping to North America?
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A Filco on Amazon is 140. Shipping to Canada would be about another $30. I'm sorry, but that's a ton of money. The only other choice is to go buy it off armygroup. What's the shipping nowaday form there? Still $20?
Also, Chobopants, I have a friend with a Blackwidow, which I do somewhat like, but I'm looking for brown switches. Also, most retailers carry BWs at $90, I think, so I'd rather fork out another 25 and get a Das. I'm just curious about other options. :)
Don't forget the PLU ML-87. And just pick a keyboard you will enjoy anyone you get better than not having one. As for paying the premium for the Filco, I would go with the cheaper option of the DAS, Ducky, PLU, or Choc. Right now I am rocking my Choc over the Filco, haven't even touched the Ficlo since I got the Choc. I am sure they will all do the same thing which is type. And if you don't like the one you pick for any reason just sell it and get a different one.
Personally I am thinking of returning my Filco brown and just keeping the Filco Red when it gets here along with my Choc mini and probably getting a Poker or a PLU.
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That just brings me to $170 again. :(
It it really worth $30 over a Leopold?
What happened to PChome's Filcos?
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(http://www.upl.co/uploads/CompaqMX118002.jpg)
For quality over the price, an old, second hand Compaq MX 11800 is very good. I buy it in my city for 20 USD, and I use it exclusively before I can buy a Filco, then I only use the Compaq at home.
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Tony, I'm not that cheap! :D
I have a ton saved up, but I'm just apprehensive about spending.
I was thinking of getting a used 11800, or maybe an 8113, but decided I want something compact, black, with NKRO, and something I know is good quality and won't die on me. Used boards, especially off ebay, kind of worry me.
Filco distribution by amazon is a bit.... sucky. It totally cuts into their revenue from Canada!
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Tony, I'm not that cheap! :D
I was thinking of getting a used 11800, or maybe an 8113, but decided I want something compact, with NKRO, and something I know is good quality.
Filco distribution by amazon is a bit.... sucky. It totally cuts into their revenue from Canada!
It sounds like you're pretty picky. I am too. Honestly, I don't think you're going to be happy with less than a Leopold and may as well just spring for a Filco at this point. Save up some cash and make the investment. The difference between 70 and 140 dollars isn't that much when we're talking something that will hopefully last you 5+ years.
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Then I have to either ship from Armygroup or get somebody to help me ship it from the USA to Canada. My only fear is getting a dud, and having to somehow send it back.
I think too much, it seems. I take a VERY long time to make a decision. And then philosophize as to how good or bad the decision was.
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Don't forget the PLU ML-87. And just pick a keyboard you will enjoy anyone you get better than not having one. As for paying the premium for the Filco, I would go with the cheaper option of the DAS, Ducky, PLU, or Choc. Right now I am rocking my Choc over the Filco, haven't even touched the Ficlo since I got the Choc. I am sure they will all do the same thing which is type. And if you don't like the one you pick for any reason just sell it and get a different one.
Just read your post. Thanks for the advice, I've looked at the PLU, but the lack of real NKRO and apparently shoddy build quality turned me off. Your post makes me consider just doing it the "easy" way and getting a Leopold, knowing I have a one-year warranty, and a good board that is still supreme to many others.
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one that should be on your list is the Rosewill RK9000. very nice build quality and it's $100. It's also sold on newegg.
I honestly like my rosewill more than my filco.
edit: I guess they don't sell them anymore on newegg. : (
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Not on sale anymore, and they have blues, I want browns for "silent" typing. (I don't bottom out on blues, even though I usually type on a Model M, and so I'm sure I could teach myself to not bottom out browns)
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The Poker with mx red is about $75, I own choc mini, Filco, and have previously owned PLU ML-87 and two Duckys, and a Das,
I just got the Poker this week, and I think the Poker and the Choc Mini probably have the best build quality for the money, the Choc Mini has better key caps then the Poker, but the Poker has a better built case and REALLY nice stabilizers, best I've seen in the business.
but that's all without considering the shipping cost from People's Republic.
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lolwut? You said earlier that you hadn't bought a mechanical yet.
Then you say that you have a model m. Uh, that's a mechanical...
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Yeah, but I didn't buy it. A friend of mine had it lying around, and gave me it for free. For that, I helped him with some trig equations. :D
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im curious as to where you are looking at the poker and choc mini that has them priced at over $100. all the ebay auctions for new boards have them around $80 us.
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i heard you wanted some herf with your lerf
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im curious as to where you are looking at the poker and choc mini that has them priced at over $100. all the ebay auctions for new boards have them around $80 us.
The cheapest Poker listed is for $99.90 and that's without the $25 shipping charge. The cheapest Choc Mini is for $89.90 and again that is without the $25 shipping charge.
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you guys forgot to factor in manfaux's connection with the kbc triad
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I got my poker from manfaux for $100.95, so still over $100
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Then there's Moogle. 500 posts praising Ducky over Filco before his Ducky arrived.
He doesn't say that much anymore.
What happened to fssbzz, btw? He praised some particular asian keyboard, then wrote buying howto, then ... disappeared.
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Why no ducky?
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I wouldn't mind a Ducky, but the only tenkeyless is the 1087, and with case issues, I'm quite hesitant.
Buying a Noppoo or Poker would be cheaper off of taobao, but I'm still afraid of buying one, having it sent, and realizeing a swtich is chattering, or something is wrong with it.
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I wouldn't mind a Ducky, but the only tenkeyless is the 1087, and with case issues, I'm quite hesitant.
Buying a Noppoo or Poker would be cheaper off of taobao, but I'm still afraid of buying one, having it sent, and realizeing a swtich is chattering, or something is wrong with it.
Hmm, I'm kinda in the same boat with you atm.
I don't need something perfect but I don't want obvious flaws / issues.
The thing with Ducky 1087 is, in the beginning it had problems with a visible PCB / some cracking plastic, but I've heard (from a ducky-importer) that these problems have been resolved in the ducky 1087's made in the last few months.
The question I sended him:
"I have some concerns regarding the 1087, I heard some people have problem with some plastic breaking and the PCB being visible from the outside."
His response:
"Oh, that was in the first production run when they had some teething issues. They have resolved all of those since then and it is pretty much problem free nowadays :)"
So I assume the Ducky 1087 should be "problem-free" right now, and also I'm wondering when the 9008 Ducky will come in tenkeyless version.
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I'd go for engraved PBT Keys anyway over anything else, no matter what keyboard I buy I want engraved PBT keys on them :)
Just don't want a keyboard with visible pcb, stuff cracking off, awful glossy surfaces etc those 3 things are major no-go's to me.
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I have no build quality issues with my newer Ducky 1087- for 90$ shipped, it's a very good deal.
But for the last month, I have used nothing but my Leopold with blues. It's very well-built, sturdy, and fun to type on. Too bad they're constantly out of stock at EK.
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I have no build quality issues with my newer Ducky 1087- for 90$ shipped, it's a very good deal.
But for the last month, I have used nothing but my Leopold with blues. It's very well-built, sturdy, and fun to type on. Too bad they're constantly out of stock at EK.
How would you say the quality of a Ducky 1087 is compared to your leopold?
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I am in the same boat as Arcanius (with less time expended). I have been lurking here for about a month and really want a mechanical keyboard with cherry browns. The problem is that all these mechanical keyboards seem to have their own deficiencies (quirks?).
Filco = pinging switches and it seems like complaints about quality control have been on the rise. $140
Leopold = mushy stabilizers $121
Ducky = bad cases (among other issues).
Choc mini and poker = I just get the sense they are of inferior construction and they are just too new without a pedigree, unlike Leopold. $120
Das = shiny, no tenkeyless, and some complaints of wobbly keys. $115
Zowie, xArmor = too much bling for my tastes and the xArmor seems to have serious build problems. $100
I honestly don't understand why this is such a difficult decision though. After all, I just bought a new ssd for more money and with much less anxiety. What is it about a mechanical keyboard that causes such consternation?
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its not. just buy them all.
problem solved
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I honestly don't understand why this is such a difficult decision though. After all, I just bought a new ssd for more money and with much less anxiety. What is it about a mechanical keyboard that causes such consternation?
An SSD has verifiable specifications that have nothing to do with your personal taste (other than faster is better). A KB on the other hand is something you touch and therefor no one can tell you what it's really going to feel like for you. Then there's whether you really have a handle on living with a modified layout (tenkeyless or 40/60% models). I loved typing on the Choc Mini, got rid of it because of the layout. Now I have a Filco gen1 tenkeyless and am very happy.
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Well, my daughter is still 8 years from college. Perhaps if I just borrowed a little...
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It did occur to me that people expect more from their filco's, so they are scrutinized more closely. When I read multiple threads of people returning their filco's because I pinging, however, it makes me nervous.
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I am in the same boat as Arcanius (with less time expended). I have been lurking here for about a month and really want a mechanical keyboard with cherry browns. The problem is that all these mechanical keyboards seem to have their own deficiencies (quirks?).
Filco = pinging switches and it seems like complaints about quality control have been on the rise. $140
Leopold = mushy stabilizers $121
Ducky = bad cases (among other issues).
Choc mini and poker = I just get the sense they are of inferior construction and they are just too new without a pedigree, unlike Leopold. $120
Das = shiny, no tenkeyless, and some complaints of wobbly keys. $115
Zowie, xArmor = too much bling for my tastes and the xArmor seems to have serious build problems. $100
I honestly don't understand why this is such a difficult decision though. After all, I just bought a new ssd for more money and with much less anxiety. What is it about a mechanical keyboard that causes such consternation?
Obviously you missed the best keyboards for the price that are obviously the Cherry boards.
I bought one of them, brand new, for 44€, is not nice looking as an xarmor, nor ringing like a filco, nor compact like a poker, but are built better than any of them.
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Tell me Ripster, are filco owners just that anal-retentive.
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Obviously you missed the best keyboards for the price that are obviously the Cherry boards.
I bought one of them, brand new, for 44€, is not nice looking as an xarmor, nor ringing like a filco, nor compact like a poker, but is built better than any of them.
Find me a cherry board with brown switches for 44 euros that is not a compaq 11800, and I'm in.
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Find me a cherry board with brown switches for 44 euros that is not a compaq 11800, and I'm in.
There are the clears ones that are way better than browns.
http://www.shopping.de/cherry-tastatur-g80-3000lqcde-0-grau/details/0/avin/12928841/?utm_source=preissuchmaschine&utm_medium=website&utm_campaign=preisroboter
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While it is a bit of an irony that the browns have less substance than the clears, having used the blues and liked their lighter touch, I am more interested in the lighter browns (right now anyways).
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While it is a bit of an irony that the browns have less substance than the clears, having used the blues and liked their lighter touch, I am more interested in the lighter browns (right now anyways).
Indeed I don't like either (http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?17357-U9BL-Beige-edition-(clear-switches-brown-springs). BTW If I have to forcibly choose between clears and browns I'd go for clears.
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Ducky = bad cases (among other issues).
This problem with casing has been fixed with Ducky 1087
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How would you say the quality of a Ducky 1087 is compared to your leopold?
Really, the main difference is the weight- it's easy to notice the Leopold is heavier. And the Leopold just feels a little more like a quality keyboard- right on par with filco. But 40$ better? Probably not.
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This problem with casing has been fixed with Ducky 1087
Yes, my new 1087 is much better built than my old one. I'd have no problem with it being my only keyboard.
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It did occur to me that people expect more from their filco's, so they are scrutinized more closely. When I read multiple threads of people returning their filco's because I pinging, however, it makes me nervous.
I don't think that is exactly what he was saying. I think the point was that since there are more people with Filcos here than other boards, you get more complaints, it does not mean there are more complaints as a percentage of the Filcos owned (at least not neccessarily). I could be wrong, but that is what it seemed like to me :)
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You should do a Old versus New Ducky Review. Don't try and duck your responsibilities.
Yes, I should, but I don't have the old one anymore for photo comparisons...
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Really, the main difference is the weight- it's easy to notice the Leopold is heavier. And the Leopold just feels a little more like a quality keyboard- right on par with filco. But 40$ better? Probably not.
Hmmmmmmmm
Do you happen to know is the Ducky 1087 PCB or plate mounted the switched?
All I want is a solid Tenkeyless Brown MX keyboard, doesn't need to be perfect just needs to be solid, and I don't know wether I should buy a Ducky 1087 or not now :P
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The ducky uses aluminum plate mounting... That's why it's a bit lighter. But it's still plate mounted.
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Hmm okay, thx for the info ;), besides the weight the Leopold still feels a better quality board then Ducky you think? (Typing wise, construction wise, the way it "feels", etc)
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I'm curious about this as well.
Also, I remember Majestouch mentioning a hidden feature in the Leopold? What did this turn out to be? There is mention of a secret feature even on the Leopold website. :P
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superior wave soldering machines?
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It may be the 18KRO, but... is that really so important? I mean... it's cool and all, but not really necessary. 6KRO is more than enough for most tasks.
Also, the way I read Majestouch's post made it seem like it was more important/significant.
Teleportation device upon hitting Alt-Pipe?
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Teleportation device when you hit Alt-Pipe?
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Meh this mech-keyboard stuff is driving me nuts, why is this so extremely hard to choose what to buy, HMMMMM.
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Lester, I agree. I want a winning lottery ticket, so I can buy one of everything.
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Lester, I agree. I want a winning lottery ticket, so I can buy one of everything.
That would be amazing, If only if only :( :(
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Lester, whether you get a Leopold or a Ducky 1087, I suspect you will be happy.
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I'm Canadian and was/is in the same boat as the OP. I finally decided to bite the bullet and grabbed a DAS S Silent. I loves it. :thumb: It's great for typing, so I keep it at the office 24/7. I tried to use it for SC2, but for some reason it just didn't feel right. I use a TT Meka at home for SC2 and it actually feels better.
I say grab a DAS pricematched (to ~$110). It really is a great alternative. Pick up a Filco later =)
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Well right now the Das Ultimate is out of stock on both NCIX and Directcanada.com, and I don't want a lettered one, considering how ugly the font is. :P
In any case, I have to wait at least another 3 weeks until I can buy, which is just enough for everything to go out of stock! Unless EK'll get stock early July.
edit: It seems I am wrong. They weren't in stock a week ago! :S
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Lester, whether you get a Leopold or a Ducky 1087, I suspect you will be happy.
Hmm, I'm thinking a lot about a Ducky 1087, or maybe wait for Ducky 9008 tenkeyless, hmm
so big dilemma this mech keyboard scene ^_^
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We solve the keyboard dilemma by buying every brand and every type of switches.
Then we got cash flow dilemma.
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Then we got cash flow dilemma.
And how do we solve that? :P
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Win the lottery! Tsk tsk, it's all so simple now!
Well, I think I'll just end up getting a Leopold. $142.50 shipped, not counting taxes. That'll end up around... $160 by the end of next month when I order. -.-
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I'm thinking a lot about a Ducky 1087 atm :P But maybe I'll wait for the Ducky 9008 tenkeyless version, hmmm