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geekhack Projects => Making Stuff Together! => Topic started by: Matt3o on Thu, 13 September 2012, 12:42:25

Title: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Thu, 13 September 2012, 12:42:25
I wanted to try to make my own keycaps, so I got some silicone and epoxy resin... and I must say that it's harder than it seems :)

1) I made the key a little thicker filling some resin into it

(http://i.imgur.com/k2qBH.jpg)

2) bi-adhesive tape on the key

(http://i.imgur.com/zaWgN.jpg)

3) the key positioned together with 3 reference pins

(http://i.imgur.com/i8YZu.jpg)

4) silicone... wait 24h

(http://i.imgur.com/tIloK.jpg)

5) 24h later

(http://i.imgur.com/6EUuU.jpg)

6) coat with vaseline

(http://i.imgur.com/tckmp.jpg)

7) mold ready!

(http://i.imgur.com/k2vIk.jpg)

8 ) end result

(http://i.imgur.com/obg13.jpg)

Unfortunately the stem is not perfect and I have to redo the male part of the mold, but I'm quite satisfied as a first try. I need to find a thicker keycap to make the mold, the one I have is too thin, not really good for molding.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: i3oilermaker on Thu, 13 September 2012, 12:53:05
Wow that looks awesome! Where did you get your materials?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: boost on Thu, 13 September 2012, 12:57:36
Nice. But where's the fill port?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Thu, 13 September 2012, 13:08:08
I've found everything in a local arts and crafts store.

There are many kinds of silicone for molding, being the key so small I took the smoothest one (it is called "10 shore" I believe). It has a very long dry out period (24h) but you don't have to worry about air bubbles since they mostly evaporate in the first couple of hours.

The epoxy resin is the clearest I've found, it is mixed with the reagent at 1/4 proportion and when wet it's smooth like baby oil.

I already ordered some thicker PBT keycaps to make a better mold. I must say it's a time consuming task and you have very little margin for error.

Nice. But where's the fill port?

I tried without it. I just put the resin into the female and closed with the (resin coated) male mold.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Mugen on Thu, 13 September 2012, 13:14:07
Without the fill port you'll have a hard time getting a cap without air bubbles. also - from experience would recommend building a small vacuum chamber that will basically suck the air out of the cast. You can build one with ~30$, in the process of building one myself - waiting for my pump.

Boost did you use a vacuum chamber with your molds?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Thu, 13 September 2012, 13:14:14
You were far more successful than I.

My mold was perfect but my keys had bubbles, lots of bubbles.

Let us know how you progress!

Title: Re: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: boost on Thu, 13 September 2012, 14:53:06
Boost did you use a vacuum chamber with your molds?

Nope. Got a ****ton of bad keys. Lol.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: funkymeeba on Thu, 13 September 2012, 15:04:28
What we really could use is a nice wiki page that details this whole process. It doesn't seem overly scientific, but does seem like something that will take some effort to do well.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Mugen on Thu, 13 September 2012, 15:07:58
What we really could use is a nice wiki page that details this whole process. It doesn't seem overly scientific, but does seem like something that will take some effort to do well.

That would definitely be helpful, but I think only someone like Clack can put something really good together as it seems he mastered the technique.
I dont know of anybody else who does it that consistently.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: funkymeeba on Thu, 13 September 2012, 15:11:18
Maybe with what the rest of us presently know, yes. However, there's plenty of smart people here. Someone's bound to come up with a good way to do it.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Thu, 13 September 2012, 16:15:09
I've found a vert good epoxy resin, if you put it into the stem before closing the mold it's close to impossible to have bubbles. As you can see from the picture the key turned out very clean. But I'm still a noob I probably have to trash a dozen molds before mastering the technique, next time I'll try with vents.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: SmallFry on Thu, 13 September 2012, 16:24:36
That sir, was super cool! Congrats on the cap!
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Mugen on Thu, 13 September 2012, 22:48:37
I've found a vert good epoxy resin, if you put it into the stem before closing the mold it's close to impossible to have bubbles. As you can see from the picture the key turned out very clean. But I'm still a noob I probably have to trash a dozen molds before mastering the technique, next time I'll try with vents.

Can you post a picture of the Resin youre using? with standard caps everything goes well, but if you try to cast something with more complex details (like a face with eyes and a mouth) then the risk of bubbles greatly increases.
I should get my pump tomorrow after which i'll probably be spending the weekend putting together with a chamber and running some pressure tests, if its successful (and maybe if it isn't) i'll post the details here.
So far all the materials cost me ~35-40$ but im sure i'm forgetting something and will have to stop by homedepot or what not.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Fri, 14 September 2012, 00:53:54
you are right, I was not considering complex keys. Looking forward to seeing your report.

The resin is an Italian product called SIRIOEPOS 552 (http://www.archiproducts.com/en/products/52183/andromeda-chemical-anchor-sirioepos-552-proind.html). It's not properly for casting but it's really good.

They define it "superfluid" and it really is, it's almost watery for the first 5 minutes. When it is still fluid brush it into the mold taking care to fill all the holes, then fill the female mold and wait few minutes for the resin to become gelly, at that point you can close the mold. You shouldn't have any bubbles in this way.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Fri, 14 September 2012, 04:04:45
The resin I use is specifically designed for precision parts so is specifically designed to have no shrinkage.


Did your resin shrink during curing?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Fri, 14 September 2012, 04:21:09
no shrinking whatsoever
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Paranoid on Fri, 14 September 2012, 06:37:21
nicely done :) I'm gonna make some myself but still waiting for my materials to arrive. You definitely need a fill port and (at least) one to let the air out.
I don't own any vacuum equipment, nor do I have knowledge to build one myself, so hoping that some vibrating will get all the bubbles out.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Mugen on Fri, 14 September 2012, 08:50:25
The resin I use is specifically designed for precision parts so is specifically designed to have no shrinkage.


Did your resin shrink during curing?


What Resin is that?

nicely done :) I'm gonna make some myself but still waiting for my materials to arrive. You definitely need a fill port and (at least) one to let the air out.
I don't own any vacuum equipment, nor do I have knowledge to build one myself, so hoping that some vibrating will get all the bubbles out.


If you have a laundry machine, you can just place your cast on that - it worked for me. problem is i live in an apartment building with a shared laundry room, so people were looking at me weird when I brought my Resin >_<
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Computer-Lab in Basement on Fri, 14 September 2012, 09:08:25
Would like to learn how to do this myself someday.  What kind of plastic did you use to make they key itself?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Fri, 14 September 2012, 09:15:22
epoxide resin. it's a 2 components resin which solidify at room temperature. You can also color it by adding some pigment
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Computer-Lab in Basement on Fri, 14 September 2012, 09:29:21
Must find these materials... WANT TO MAKE MY OWN CAPZ!!!!

Any chance you could post some links to where I might be able to purchase said materials?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Fri, 14 September 2012, 13:35:36
I took them from a local retailer (they do not sell online) but I believe you can find pretty much everything you need here http://www.smooth-on.com/Model-Making/c1290/index.html

The silicone I used is close to what they call "Mold Max 10". They don't seem to have the resin I used, anyway they have interesting howtos and faqs, I'm sure you'll find all you need.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Computer-Lab in Basement on Fri, 14 September 2012, 13:58:23
Thanks, I'll look into that.  Hopefully I can make my own custom keycaps someday like this...
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Sun, 16 September 2012, 12:21:45
a quick update, while waiting for the new thicker keycaps to arrive I've found a local dealer which sells epoxy pigments in the following selection http://www.ralcolor.com/

Add 1% of pigment (which is a gel/paste) for a transparent effect, add 10% to get a solid color.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Mon, 17 September 2012, 01:26:46
Another very interesting find. Transparent silicone rubber so you can see if and where you have bubbles:

[attach=1]

More info http://www.prochima.com/public/eng/CRISTAL%20RUBBER%20ing.pdf
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Paranoid on Mon, 17 September 2012, 13:57:29
If you have a laundry machine, you can just place your cast on that - it worked for me. problem is i live in an apartment building with a shared laundry room, so people were looking at me weird when I brought my Resin >_<

Damn, why didn't I think of that :p I'll have to stand on a ladder for that though since the dryer is on top of the washer ^^

Another very interesting find. Transparent silicone rubber so you can see if and where you have bubbles

That's the silicone that I'm gonna use, and am comfortable with. That way you can also make easier cuts in difficult molds. I'm just curious how it's gonna go without a whole lab (like in college). Still waiting for it to arrive :)

a quick update, while waiting for the new thicker keycaps to arrive I've found a local dealer which sells epoxy pigments in the following selection http://www.ralcolor.com/

Add 1% of pigment (which is a gel/paste) for a transparent effect, add 10% to get a solid color.

Is the brand called ralcolor or are these just the color codes?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Mon, 17 September 2012, 14:04:55
Is the brand called ralcolor or are these just the color codes?

I think RAL is the color code.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Mon, 17 September 2012, 21:48:23
The resin I use is specifically designed for precision parts so is specifically designed to have no shrinkage.


Did your resin shrink during curing?


What Resin is that?


I use GI-1000 for my silicone and OC-7086 for my resin.

This is the kind of accuracy you can get with these resins:



Red
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Tue, 18 September 2012, 08:08:32
I am currently casting a couple of Model M caps, a Model F barrel and a Model F full key.  I'll report back when I know how they come out.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Tue, 18 September 2012, 08:16:26
how long does it take to your resin to cure? I've found a resin that cures in 30 minutes (the one I used before takes 18h) and I'm temped to try it
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Computer-Lab in Basement on Tue, 18 September 2012, 08:51:01
I am going to order myself some of these materials later this week and will try to make myself some homemade keycaps.  I might try casting some of the small SiiG MiniTouch F keys, along with some MX keycaps, of course... can't wait to try this out!  Thanks for posting this thread, Matt3o!
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Tue, 18 September 2012, 09:32:14
how long does it take to your resin to cure? I've found a resin that cures in 30 minutes (the one I used before takes 18h) and I'm temped to try it

Sorry, let me give you a more specific answer:
GI-1000 (Used to create molds) -> 16-18 hours cure time.  I de-mold it usually in about 6-8 hours.

OC-7086 - (Water-clear urethane) -> You can remove it from the mold in 3 - 4 hours.  Strictly speaking it doesn't fully cure for a week but you likely wouldn't notice any difference between 24 hours and 1 week unless you had test equipment.

GI-1000 is expensive at $14.50 per lb (2lb quantity) or $10 per lb (10lb quantity).  It's so worth it.

Unless you are willing to invest in a lot of effort, vacuum chamber, pressure pot and incredible attention to detail I would not recommend OC-7086 as it is incredibly sensitive to everything and will form bubbles with the slightest excuse.

I'm currently testing other urethanes to look for a more practical for home use formulation.

EDIT:
After discussing my requirements with their chemist, I'm going for IE-3080 from innovative-polymers.com.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: fl0w3n on Thu, 20 September 2012, 13:37:38
Post more pictures of results!

I'd be interested in trying this as well. 

Would doing some sort of small print out with some sort of special paper/ink, and then laying it in the mold give you the ability to make caps with images? 
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Sat, 22 September 2012, 12:07:02
Two different resins, no vacuum or pressure.

Mold release and patience will improve the quality.  Specifically, the bad habit I have of opening molds 12 hours too early.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Sat, 22 September 2012, 12:53:41
not bad at all. I agree patience is the key :)

I'm still waiting for the keycaps to make the new mold, at this point I believe they got lost in post office. Next week I'll order more, maybe from Europe this time, are qwerkeys keycaps thick?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Sat, 22 September 2012, 19:56:01
feature=youtu.be

Working Model F prototype.  Now to cast in clear-glass!
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Mugen on Sun, 23 September 2012, 22:29:56
Where can i order this fast resin stuff? the resin that i have hardens in like 90 seconds but i get bubbles like a mofo. so far my attempt to build a chamber has not gone well, pump is not strong enough.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Mon, 24 September 2012, 01:08:07
feature=youtu.be

Working Model F prototype.  Now to cast in clear-glass!

 :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Computer-Lab in Basement on Tue, 25 September 2012, 14:31:12
Just ordered all the stuff I need to make myself some homemade keycaps!  Can't wait to get them in the mail... will post my first attempts once I get them.  Thanks for the links, Matt3o!
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Mugen on Tue, 25 September 2012, 18:40:11
Just ordered all the stuff I need to make myself some homemade keycaps!  Can't wait to get them in the mail... will post my first attempts once I get them.  Thanks for the links, Matt3o!

Where did you make the order, the company i spoke to only did the orders by phone, same?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Computer-Lab in Basement on Tue, 25 September 2012, 19:07:06
I ordered from this site:

http://www.smooth-on.com/Model-Making/c1290/index.html
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Computer-Lab in Basement on Thu, 27 September 2012, 14:36:25
Just got these in the mail today:

[attachimg=1]

Time to try out this DIY keycap-making process...


Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Wess on Thu, 27 September 2012, 17:53:28
Just got these in the mail today:

(Attachment Link)

Time to try out this DIY keycap-making process...

Looks great!! ... Now what will you make? Pics plz :P Would be great if you documented the whole process in a separate thread ;)
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Computer-Lab in Basement on Thu, 27 September 2012, 18:08:01
I'll be sure to do that when I make another mold.  I started making the first half of the mold about an hour ago, but it's gonna have to cure overnight before I can make the second half.  It's my first time doing this, so I'm not expecting anything great.  I'll post pics soon.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: rowdy on Thu, 27 September 2012, 18:13:51
Take your time the first time around - once you are familiar with the process you will know when you can cut corners and when not.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Computer-Lab in Basement on Thu, 27 September 2012, 19:12:24
^This.  That's why I'll probably end up by letting the mold cure for a few extra hours so I don't end up my messing it up or something...
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Fri, 28 September 2012, 07:03:43
It's counter-intuitive but the thinner the part, the longer the urethane takes to cure.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: neeb on Sun, 30 September 2012, 20:08:41
Any update/new pics on this guys? Really awesome work so far! I want to give this a try when I have some extra money
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: proest on Sun, 30 September 2012, 22:55:02
Wow, this is awesome! I think I'll try this out...
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Wed, 03 October 2012, 14:19:31
This it's using easy-cast.  I would recommend against it's use as it's too flexible.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Wed, 03 October 2012, 15:06:38
A requested, photo of my mold.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: neeb on Wed, 03 October 2012, 15:43:04
Awesome work Red!
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Thu, 04 October 2012, 19:10:57
I have 30 minuets to my next Dee-mold time.  If the spilt plastic is anything to go by we're about to start an obsession :-)
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Thu, 04 October 2012, 20:20:07
Tah dah!
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: jeroplane on Thu, 04 October 2012, 20:49:53
 :eek: Imagine those on a backlit keyboard. Great colour, and the molds are looking neat!
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: jwaz on Thu, 04 October 2012, 20:56:17
Woah that raspberry color is great, are the stems firm enough to take a beating?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: neeb on Thu, 04 October 2012, 21:29:20
Red: Wow, that's effing awesome! I would love to see some more videos (if possible) when you have some free time man, epic work so far! How many keycaps are you making at a time? It looks like there's quite a few on the 2nd attached image of your last post. Also, have you tried anything for MX yet?

Matt3o: Anything new in your efforts? I know you were waiting for a better keycap to arrive to make a mold from; I'd love to see how your little gems are coming along :D!

Computer-Lab in Basement: Have you punched out any keys yet with your new supplies?

Really awesome work all of you, and anyone else that's been trying this and hasn't posted/posted in another thread/I forgot about. I think this is probably the most interesting post on GH atm, I would really love to give this a try (and plan to) when I have some extra money :D!

Edit: Btw, what is a Model F? Lol. Sorry, I'm still learning when it comes to all of this. The one that you made, is that like the switch/keycap for an IBM Model F or what exactly?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Fri, 05 October 2012, 01:30:59
I received the keycaps a couple of days ago, now to the mold!

Actually the next step would be... CNC :) I can get one at a very reasonable price (€500) and I'm seriously considering it.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: neeb on Fri, 05 October 2012, 01:57:33
I received the keycaps a couple of days ago, now to the mold!

Actually the next step would be... CNC :) I can get one at a very reasonable price (€500) and I'm seriously considering it.

I really don't know much about modeling or anything crafty lol. Can you give a link to something you're considering that would work well for this?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Fri, 05 October 2012, 03:13:46
It's a machine controlled mill to build 3D prototypes (from a 3d computer model). The one I should get is similar to this http://www.bluemelon.org/index.php/Products/BM0502_CNC_Mill
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: neeb on Fri, 05 October 2012, 04:20:26
It's a machine controlled mill to build 3D prototypes (from a 3d computer model). The one I should get is similar to this http://www.bluemelon.org/index.php/Products/BM0502_CNC_Mill

So you would create a keycap in the software that goes with that bad boy and then it pops em out?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Fri, 05 October 2012, 04:32:42
yes, I could sculpt a prototype I could build a mold from. Would be nice to be able to design any kind of 3D keycap :)
It would be also possible to build wooden keyboards for example.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: neeb on Fri, 05 October 2012, 05:06:56
yes, I could sculpt a prototype I could build a mold from. Would be nice to be able to design any kind of 3D keycap :)
It would be also possible to build wooden keyboards for example.

Would you be able to do different colors/designs or would this just mold the keycaps and you'd need something different for 3D printing or w/e you wanna call it?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Fri, 05 October 2012, 05:29:42
multiple colors on the same key is extremely complex. The easiest would be to mask and spray color. There's a product called Mr.Masking (by Mr.Hobby) that makes masking pretty easy.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: neeb on Fri, 05 October 2012, 05:39:34
multiple colors on the same key is extremely complex. The easiest would be to mask and spray color. There's a product called Mr.Masking (by Mr.Hobby) that makes masking pretty easy.

No no I didn't mean different colors on the same keycap lol. I just meant if you're using one of these CNC mill machines, can you sculpt keycaps in any color you want or does it just sculpt them in some base color that you'd have to change using something else?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Fri, 05 October 2012, 05:44:50
oh well. usually the milling machine is used for the prototype. You can use the prototype to make a mold and cast it in any color. Anyway you could have the CNC milling the final product. In that case you can use any material/color, from wood to aluminum (with everything in between).
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: neeb on Fri, 05 October 2012, 05:49:07
oh well. usually the milling machine is used for the prototype. You can use the prototype to make a mold and cast it in any color. Anyway you could have the CNC milling the final product. In that case you can use any material/color, from wood to aluminum (with everything in between).

So you would likely be using the mill to make some nice 3D keycap prototypes, then make a mold by hand, and then cast actual keycaps? If that's the case, what are the advantages of that vs using the mill to produce the end product? is it more expensive to use the mill or why exactly would you want to mold/cast by hand instead of the machine?
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Fri, 05 October 2012, 06:10:39
depends on many factors. The number of keys you want to produce for example, or the material. If you want an aluminum key of course you have to mill it directly.

CNC is usually pretty slow. It might need 1 hour to make one side of the cap. So if you need a lot of keys you better make a mold. Also with a mold you have a wider range of colors you can choose from while you might not be able to find the prototyping plastic in the color you want.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: neeb on Fri, 05 October 2012, 06:13:26
depends on many factors. The number of keys you want to produce for example, or the material. If you want an aluminum key of course you have to mill it directly.

CNC is usually pretty slow. It might need 1 hour to make one side of the cap. So if you need a lot of keys you better make a mold. Also with a mold you have a wider range of colors you can choose from while you might not be able to find the prototyping plastic in the color you want.

Ahhh I see now, thanks for clarifying all of that. I apologize for the 20 questions there, I just find all of this extremely fascinating xD
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Fri, 05 October 2012, 08:57:23
Make sure you have deep pockets for the CNC.  The software chain is insanely expensive.

I'd start with casting an existing key / keycap.  Get that process down before you start milling wax.



Red
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Fri, 05 October 2012, 09:02:25
Make sure you have deep pockets for the CNC.  The software chain is insanely expensive.

why you say so? most of the softwares are free.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Fri, 05 October 2012, 10:15:04
Not for three or four axis control.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Fri, 05 October 2012, 10:44:29
I have a license for Mach3 which is an up to 6-axis CNC controller and it wasn't expensive at all (I paid less than $100 at the time I believe). It's not probably the most sophisticated software around, but it works.

Also there's a linux distro dedicated to CNC that is completely free.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Fri, 05 October 2012, 11:02:48
The money isn't in the control software.  The money is in the G-Code generators.  CAM.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: Matt3o on Fri, 05 October 2012, 11:10:38
don't remember what I have as g-code generator. I built a cnc many years ago and indeed ending up with a good g-code wasn't easy. Lots of tweaking is needed. But if the model is not horribly complicated shouldn't be a problem.
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: alvinliang on Fri, 05 October 2012, 13:19:45
it looks so cool, i wanna make my own key cap
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: __red__ on Sat, 13 October 2012, 16:16:20
I have fully functional caps using the problematic plastic.

I did it with red dye because I wanted to see the difference between easy plastic and hard plastic with the dye.

Anyways, photos!
Title: Re: keycap DIY
Post by: smilertoo on Sat, 23 May 2015, 13:56:33
Don't you get resins that you bake with UV lighting?