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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: Hak Foo on Wed, 31 October 2012, 00:32:30
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It seems like, compared to the variety of 60 and 80 percent layouts, there isn't much out there for those who want a larger-than-normal layout.
I see:
* Hideous gamer boards which require custom macro software to activate the buttons
* Long-ago retired models like the Focus 9000 or Wang 724, often themselves limited in programmability.
* POS boards like the Cherry 8200 with compromises in the layout and often undesirabler switches
* Old 122s with strange mappings and odd edit blocks. This includes both Unicomp and things like Cherry 2500 series boards.
Yet the market seems completely ignored. How come? ISurely it's an obvious upsell-- buy the standard 104, or for $20 extra, get the version with an extra 10 programmable keys. Or alternatively, a sensibly priced programmable numpad.
I suppose the best route would, now, be taking a favourite 104, a $20 external numpad, run the latter through a Soarer adaptor, and package the entire thing in a custom case.
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You want extra buttons for macros?
that's just a gimmick imo.
I have had a Logitech G15 and then a G19 for several years and I never used the macro buttons...
Should I find myself in need of alot of macros, I'd rather just use some software to map them using modifiers + normal buttons, and save desk space.
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LoL Kishy. I like my M, granted it's keyblocks. I love the PBT feel and how I dyed the keys...I should be up and running with it once I get some header pins to fit into the socket that I soldered into the original PCB though. I bought the board last year around July and haven't used it due to the lack of the header pins. :(
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All else being equal, I would prefer a straight-ANSI layout as in the standard Model M, and the slightly smaller Unicomp variants are even better.
However, after using my heavily-modded Model F-122 for nearly a year, I have come to love the second set of function keys on the left.
That extra row on the top does not see much use, although I do use the top 2 corners for 2nd (1st choice, actually) "Escape" and "Mute"
I would probably not bother with the 122-key format except that this is the only way I can get a near-ANSI layout with capacitive buckling springs, the ultimate switch for me. That is well worth the cost and hardship.
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Old 122s (Model F variants, anyway) are as customizable as you want and the mappings are only as weird as you make them.
Plus, buckling spring...the clear winner :)
Agreed! I like a ridiculously big keyboard too -- got myself a 122 terminal, Soarer modded it, and I'm loving it.
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Why doesn't someone just put the navigation cluster on the left, so that the alphanumeric area is central? (Or maybe the number pad on the left, either will do.)
Whose stupid idea was it that you should keep adding more and more keys off to one side? :P
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Whose stupid idea was it that you should keep adding more and more keys off to one side? :P
It was someone at Digital Equipment (DEC). IBM and others just copied their design, supposedly because it had become popular.
I believe that the design had sort of evolved into this.
First, there was the DEC VT50 terminal where the monitor was on the left side with logic boards on the right. The keyboard was part of a homogenous unit and centred front of the screen, so there was unused keyboard space to the right of the keyboard.
Then, the follow-up VT52 terminal got a numeric keypad. It was placed to the right, like on the previous VT05, but still with the main keyboard centred in front of the screen and with more space to the right than to the left.
Then DEC came up with the Inverse T (http://www.eldacur.com/~brons/NerdCorner/InverseT-History.html) cursor keys and decided to place them in-between the main keyboard and numeric keypad...
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I use my Lexmark 'aircraft carrier' at work. Without any modification at all it works fine via PS/2. Plus, all the keys have unique keycodes so you can map them to whatever you need.
I have to admit, I'm now used to having my Esc key in the top left corner of the numpad area- much nicer for VIM usage :-)
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Why doesn't someone just put the navigation cluster on the left, so that the alphanumeric area is central? (Or maybe the number pad on the left, either will do.)
Whose stupid idea was it that you should keep adding more and more keys off to one side? :P
http://www.amazon.com/DSI-Left-Handed-Keyboard-Black-KB-DS-8861XPU-B-V2/dp/B0009S52X8
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With a set of function keys available on the left, they are the ones I use 80% of the time.
They are much closer and more handy there. Too bad that F11 won't fit.
My complaint about the layout of the Model F AT is on the right side, the lack of a proper numpad and home cluster (the queer Enter/Backspace can be fixed).
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All else being equal, I would prefer a straight-ANSI layout as in the standard Model M, and the slightly smaller Unicomp variants are even better.
However, after using my heavily-modded Model F-122 for nearly a year, I have come to love the second set of function keys on the left.
That extra row on the top does not see much use, although I do use the top 2 corners for 2nd (1st choice, actually) "Escape" and "Mute"
I would probably not bother with the 122-key format except that this is the only way I can get a near-ANSI layout with capacitive buckling springs, the ultimate switch for me. That is well worth the cost and hardship.
That is awesome. I think I have added a fourth board to my must have list....
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Only 4?
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That is awesome. I think I have added a fourth board to my must have list....
It is a big ole honker, for sure. Those are 12" architectural and engineering scales above it. Make sure that you have plenty of desk space.
It probably goes without saying that there is plenty of room inside for an internal Teensy (and I did not even have to drill any holes, there are extra mounting posts and everything.
Just remember to do a floss mod while you are in there, it makes a marvelous final touch.
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Only 4?
Trying to keep the list small, and my wallet full.
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i like a huge board full prograble as part of my collection but not many people have interest in that sort of thing so i dont know if itll ever get developed
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^ lol gets that way, doesn't it.
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You want extra buttons for macros?
that's just a gimmick imo.
At home, they're useful for media keys; at work I can bind them as HTML tags I use a lot, like <br /> or </li><li>
I used a 122 for a while at work, although the ISO enter and tiny shift are annoying, but I found the keys that aren't in their 104 locations frustrating-- I use Print Screen a lot for "crop and modify screenshot", for example. Eventually, it died on me -- backspace kept jamming and it was over 20, so I gave up on it, threw it with the Cherry 8200 in the spares closet, and sent out for a Ducky 1008.
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I'm starting to feel like tkl are just too big now... is something wrong with me.
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To each his own.
I use the number pad and home cluster constantly, although when I retire (whenever that might be) I would give up the numpad.
Massive acreage and weight are not actually positives for me, they just are not negatives. I have large strong hands and fingers, so I need room and space between keys to type well and accurately. And I don't like to have to use Shift/Alt/Control/Function or something like "NumLock" to toggle things off and on.
Luckily I have a meter side-to-side and half a meter front-to-back for my keyboard/mouse setup, with notepads, telephones, and calculators and such outboard of that. Without all that room, I would be looking for a smaller board, too.
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To each his own.
I use the number pad and home cluster constantly, although when I retire (whenever that might be) I would give up the numpad.
Massive acreage and weight are not actually positives for me, they just are not negatives. I have large strong hands and fingers, so I need room and space between keys to type well and accurately. And I don't like to have to use Shift/Alt/Control/Function or something like "NumLock" to toggle things off and on.
Luckily I have a meter side-to-side and half a meter front-to-back for my keyboard/mouse setup, with notepads, telephones, and calculators and such outboard of that. Without all that room, I would be looking for a smaller board, too.
It'd be nice if there was a readily available BS numpad to make me get an Unsaver with an external pad. ;_;
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All else being equal, I would prefer a straight-ANSI layout as in the standard Model M, and the slightly smaller Unicomp variants are even better.
However, after using my heavily-modded Model F-122 for nearly a year, I have come to love the second set of function keys on the left.
That extra row on the top does not see much use, although I do use the top 2 corners for 2nd (1st choice, actually) "Escape" and "Mute"
I would probably not bother with the 122-key format except that this is the only way I can get a near-ANSI layout with capacitive buckling springs, the ultimate switch for me. That is well worth the cost and hardship.
Great mod! I have a 122 Model M (the shape is quite similar to your Model F) and also thinking about heavily modding it (right know it's not in great shape). Which kind of paint have you used for the case? I was thinking about using plasti dip or something similar.
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I went to NAPA and bought "Dupli-Color Vinyl and Fabric Coating" for about $8 per can. The selections are not great but the Charcoal Gray is a very nice color.
One can did 3 boards (front only, Fs have black metal backs) and I used at least 4 very thin coats.
Clean very well, of course. I am not a plastics expert, but the F cases are a much harder and more brittle plastic than the M cases. My first cases were broken and I had to fix them with JB Weld, so they had to be painted. Just coincidence that the Charcoal Gray is a near-perfect match to JB Weld.
The M material is better, I would say, but it might not hold paint as well. I have often wondered about the very early M-122s that have the badge on the high part at the right - whether they are the same, or are interchangeable with the F-122 cases.
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I'll ping Kishy and ask him. He used to have side by side comparison of the two before the W0RM.
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I'm not sure what everyone's opinion is, but at least for me any key on the left side of left ctrl is annoying for me.
I tried blackwidow once and I keep hitting the macro keys instead of left ctrl (which I needed for lots of program short cuts). At school we had that Sun Microsystems keyboard with find, cut, paste, print... etc on the left hand side, I keep hitting those too and can never get used to it.
So now my rule of thumb is: Macro keys on keyboard = will not buy this keyboard.
Though after using Filco I find even though I have the desk space anyway, I still prefer the form factor it just looks cleaner on the the desk :)
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Are you talking about the second set of function keys?
Actually, the first set. They didn't move up above until later on the Model M.
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in the spirit...
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in the spirit...
Strangely I like this one :) But yeah, the function keys to the left would distract me as I tend to run my fingers over to the left side of the keyboard, then up above `~, past the gap, and press the first key that I find, which should be Esc.
Muscle memory.
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Awesome plate!
I painted mine bright colors.
Where the heck is "Enter"?
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LOL I know and that's a lot of caps lock and alt keys.