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geekhack Community => Reviews => Topic started by: CPTBadAss on Sat, 09 March 2013, 09:33:40

Title: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sat, 09 March 2013, 09:33:40
(http://i.imgur.com/Y5XRiIG.jpg)
My Leopold: Imsto Blue PBT Cherry. Stock Spacebar. TeamLiquid and GH January novelty caps. Shadovved GH sticker.


I’ve had this keyboard for about 2 months now and I felt I’ve had enough time with it to write a review. I was really excited for this keyboard too because this is my first TKL board. For home use, the layout is nice. The lack of the tenkeypad puts my hands closer together which is more comfortable. And since I don’t use the numberpad at home too much, I’ve grown very fond of the new layout. I still require the pad at work so my fullsize Filco MJ2 is good for me there.

I snagged this board in the classifieds for a seriously good deal. Before I bought my Filco, I did tons of research on the Leopolds for sale at EliteKeyboards. And just to let you know what I’ll be comparing this to, at the time, I had a Blackwidow and a Filco MJ2. Since then I’ve sold the Blackwidow and have a Cherry G84-4100. Like the majority of the keyboards I've owned, this keyboard has Cherry MX Blue switches.

Anyways, here we go:


Aesthetics
The older Leopolds have rounded edges (http://elitekeyboards.com/products.php?sub=leopold,fullsize&pid=fc500rcab) and have odd branding/LEDs. But the FC700R has been updated to have squared edges like a Filco and has LEDs shifted. There are ones under the scroll lock, caps lock, and F5 (which shows when you do Win-Lock, disabling the windows key). I think the LED shift and the squared edges look amazing. There’s also no branding on the top so the board looks very clean. Of course, I had to ruin this by adding a personal touch and threw on this sick-nice metallic GeekHack sticker :P

FC700R also comes in white, black, and graphite (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=25649.0) forms. I was fortunate enough to snag a graphite one. The dark grey looks super nice and I think is a fun change from the standard black that many commercially bought keyboards come in.


Keyboard Macro Details
Unfortunately I haven’t opened up this keyboard (or any other keyboard) yet. I’m still not confident in my abilities to do so. I will attempt it one day and post pictures here of the PCB and soldering. In the meantime you can check out pictures from BroCaps here (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=41048.msg818722#msg818722) (Thank you!). For a TKL board, it seems pretty hefty; seems like maybe it is 2-3 pounds. If you like using the flip-out angled feet, the board has really solid ones. They flip out and have rubber tips. However I find the angle too extreme and prefer it flat.  The only thing I don’t like is the cheap rubber feet on the bottom. If it wasn’t as heavy as it was, I think it might slide around. The detachable USB cable is nice but the female port is really tight and it’s almost impossible to remove by hand. I usually have to use some pliers to help me out. But I guess that’s actually a good thing since the cable won’t come out easily.  Plus, I get to use Mimic’s hot cable (purple and pink is super hot).


Typing on this keyboard
The flat profile on the Leopold OEM caps feels nice when you press down on the keys; it seems to slightly reduce the actuation distance. That’s opposed to my Imsto Cherry replica caps which cup my fingers a little more. After trying both the stock Leopold caps and the Imsto caps, I really prefer the Imsto caps. The profile is amazing and somehow the PBT feels smoother than any other caps I’ve tried besides POM.

That being said, the stock thick PBT caps are still nice. The texture feels nice to type on and the keys feel more “solid” when I press down on them. The board also sounds different from my Filco with Valentine’s set. The sound is less high pitched and seems to only emphasize the actuation click. My Filco has a higher pitched click and the thin ABS seems to amplify and resonate the click. 

However, I felt that when I typed on the Leopold, the bottom out was very jarring. I could feel every impact in my hand and it was very awkward for me. I think I wasn’t used to typing on the heavier PBT caps and pressed too hard to try and compromise by smashing down on the keys. Regardless, I didn’t like the impact I felt on this board. So for me, I felt this board was infinitely more amazing if I added some soft-landing pads from EliteKeyboards. O-rings reduced the travel too much and the 50A black o-rings from WASD still had that awkward bottom out. Soft-landing pads took away the impact feeling and slightly reduced the noise. Beautiful. I’m not sure why I don’t get this feeling on my Filco but for me, this board is now perfect. I get the wonderful clicky tactile feeling of blues without any of the jarring impact.


Final Thoughts
I’m not sure if the bottom out feeling is the same for everyone else’s experience for the FC700R but I wouldn’t say this is a detractor from getting it. I think it’s one of those hyper-personal, nit-picky things that we all love so much. Overall, the stock board is super nice and I’m glad I got to buy a Leopold after all. I think the departure from the old Leopold styling and the change to the new look really helps the aesthetics. And the board just feels solid to type on. I’ve grown to like it as much as my Filco. I think the build quality is pretty great but I wish that the feet were a little better. Maybe I’ll add some weight to the board somehow to compensate.

If anyone has pictures of the PCB that I can borrow, I’d be very grateful. BroCaps linked some pictures. The link can be found in the edit in my article above or in the comments below (Thanks again!). Some other nice pictures of the board can be found here (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=25649.0).  And if you want some of my thoughts on o-rings and soft pads, please check out my review (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=40227.0).


Edit: Flacman contacted PC Case Gear in Australia and got this answer concerning the finish on the stock keycaps.

So I emailed the retailer and this is his 'official answer.'

Quote
The FC700R keyboards we carry use a laser etch with a coating over the top, which is why we have had many customers assume these are printed. The initial revisions of the FC700 we received did not wear well, so this extra clear coat was added in order to improve durability of the keycaps which it did do.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: Michael on Sat, 09 March 2013, 12:21:42
Awesome review, bro.

I had a FC700R modded to ergo clear, and sold to reptile. Sadly I eventually sold it due to not being able to find a suitable spacebar for most custom SP sets.

If you want to stick with the stock keycaps, it's awesome, though.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Sat, 09 March 2013, 12:27:37
Nice review! It's a shame Leopold had to come out with such a non-standard spacebar so you can't replace it with any other sets. That grey spacebar on the imsto blue cap sets is a bit of an eye-sore since it's only 1 grey key. That's just my personal opinion though.


Unfortunately I haven’t opened up this keyboard (or any other keyboard) yet. I’m still not confident in my abilities to do so. I will attempt it one day and post pictures here of the PCB and soldering.

I'm interested to know what you find when you open it up. One of the reason why EK said they won't be carrying these new FC700R was because of some quality issue that they haven't specified. This obviously has to be the interior since the exterior hasn't had any complaints from what I've seen. If the interior is like the older FC200R, then it's nothing to brag about.

PS - what did you do with your old caps? If you decide to get rid of them, let me know  ^-^
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sat, 09 March 2013, 12:34:56
Keymaster and I were talking about a putty mod for the spacebar. I agree that having that one off spacebar isn't ideal. But I don't know enough to mod my only imsto spacebar. Until I figure that out, I'm keeping my stock caps.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: Michael on Sat, 09 March 2013, 12:38:01
I put up the mod I did for mine here (http://s1166.beta.photobucket.com/user/magicmeatballs/library/FC700R). Not sure if I have enough shots to satisfy curiosity about build quality, but I would put in on par with Filco, and one up for the PBT caps and space bar.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Sat, 09 March 2013, 14:38:51
Keymaster and I were talking about a putty mod for the spacebar. I agree that having that one off spacebar isn't ideal. But I don't know enough to mod my only imsto spacebar. Until I figure that out, I'm keeping my stock caps.

You can either mod the spacebar stem or the plate. For spacebar stem, just cut it off, shift it over, and expoxy it down again. For the plate, if you have steady hands, precision, and patience, you can cut new mounting holes in the plate for the new stabilizer positions. Here's is a Leopold I built/modded for someone. It has both stabilizer positions for the native Leopold spacebar, as well as mounting position for any standard 6.25x spacebar:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/WhiteFireDragon/keyboard/th_IMG_2635.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/WhiteFireDragon/keyboard/IMG_2635.jpg)



I put up the mod I did for mine here (http://s1166.beta.photobucket.com/user/magicmeatballs/library/FC700R). Not sure if I have enough shots to satisfy curiosity about build quality, but I would put in on par with Filco, and one up for the PBT caps and space bar.

Thanks for those pics. It looks exactly the same as the older leopold, except for PCB color. Which means it's actually a tad lower in quality than Filco or the newer Duckies. All the soldering pads for the switches are only single sided, whereas Filco/Ducky are double-sided PCB with soldering pads on both sides that goes all the way through the hole as well. Lastly, I'm not even sure why Leopold chose through-hole as opposed to SMD for most of the sensitive electronics components.

The stock PBT caps from these newer Leopolds are definitely better than Filco's thin ABS stock caps.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sat, 09 March 2013, 14:52:12
Keymaster and I were talking about a putty mod for the spacebar. I agree that having that one off spacebar isn't ideal. But I don't know enough to mod my only imsto spacebar. Until I figure that out, I'm keeping my stock caps.

You can either mod the spacebar stem or the plate. For spacebar stem, just cut it off, shift it over, and expoxy it down again. For the plate, if you have steady hands, precision, and patience, you can cut new mounting holes in the plate for the new stabilizer positions. Here's is a Leopold I built/modded for someone. It has both stabilizer positions for the native Leopold spacebar, as well as mounting position for any standard 6.25x spacebar:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/WhiteFireDragon/keyboard/th_IMG_2635.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/WhiteFireDragon/keyboard/IMG_2635.jpg)

Are you still doing mods like that? I'd love to get that setup.


Quote
I put up the mod I did for mine here (http://s1166.beta.photobucket.com/user/magicmeatballs/library/FC700R). Not sure if I have enough shots to satisfy curiosity about build quality, but I would put in on par with Filco, and one up for the PBT caps and space bar.

Thanks for those pics. It looks exactly the same as the older leopold, except for PCB color. Which means it's actually a tad lower in quality than Filco or the newer Duckies. All the soldering pads for the switches are only single sided, whereas Filco/Ducky are double-sided PCB with soldering pads on both sides that goes all the way through the hole as well. Lastly, I'm not even sure why Leopold chose through-hole as opposed to SMD for most of the sensitive electronics components.

The stock PBT caps from these newer Leopolds are definitely better than Filco's thin ABS stock caps.

And now we know, thanks for the knowledge :D


And thanks for the kind words guys
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: SmallFry on Sat, 09 March 2013, 20:01:00
Nice review man! Also, WFD, what the heck, both stabilizer styles? COOL!
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: dante on Sun, 10 March 2013, 10:32:04
Can you compare the typing height (how low profile) the FC700R is to a Ducky?
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sun, 10 March 2013, 10:34:17
Can you compare the typing height (how low profile) the FC700R is to a Ducky?

I don't have a Ducky. If you bring a Ducky to the Chicago meet, we can answer that question there.

Edit: I'll be going to MechanicalKeyboards.com's Storefront the week before Chicago and I'm sure I'll try out a Ducky there. I can let you know after that meet if you like.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: noons on Sun, 10 March 2013, 11:05:06
If you dont mind me asking where did you purchase this? At least from what I could tell there were not easily obtainable in the US.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sun, 10 March 2013, 11:19:12
If you dont mind me asking where did you purchase this? At least from what I could tell there were not easily obtainable in the US.

I say it in my review. I bought it from the Classifieds here. The only other reliable way to get this board that I know of besides the Classifieds is getting it sent from Australia.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: tp4tissue on Sun, 10 March 2013, 20:35:40
Is the black one "un- painted" vs the white one which is painted
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sun, 10 March 2013, 20:37:47
Is the black one "un- painted" vs the white one which is painted

I have no idea. My graphite one doesn't feel painted.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: tp4tissue on Sun, 10 March 2013, 20:39:08
Is the black one "un- painted" vs the white one which is painted

I have no idea. My graphite one doesn't feel painted.

experiment-fun-time-USA? :D
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: noons on Wed, 13 March 2013, 09:06:09
If you dont mind me asking where did you purchase this? At least from what I could tell there were not easily obtainable in the US.

I say it in my review. I bought it from the Classifieds here. The only other reliable way to get this board that I know of besides the Classifieds is getting it sent from Australia.

Doh! sorry missed that!
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: deazncy on Fri, 22 March 2013, 01:16:42
Liking that TL keycap! SCII ftw!
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: evolz on Sat, 23 March 2013, 04:43:11
Great Review Thanks for the info  :D
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: flacman on Mon, 25 March 2013, 01:32:26
Good review. I have the brown switch of this keyboard and have had it for about a month now. I share your sentiment with the shorter actuation and it still slightly bugs me when I type on it for long durations (for that I have my HHKB). For gaming, the standard layout is great but the keys don't feel as tactile as the browns on the MJ2 and is a lot more...scratchy sounding?

Not sure which version of the board you got, but were your stock caps pad printed? All the press media for the 700R suggest laser/dye-sub printing? The page on PC Case Gear here in Australia listed it with laser-marked characters...but it's clear that they have shiny pads printed on the caps..which actually get in the way of typing because I sit in front of a large window and it reflects off the glossy letter coat; making reading the key cap a little hard in bright sunlight.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 26 March 2013, 08:45:24
Liking that TL keycap! SCII ftw!

Thanks, I love TeamLiquid; both the site and the team :)

Great Review Thanks for the info  :D

Thanks for checking it out.


Not sure which version of the board you got, but were your stock caps pad printed? All the press media for the 700R suggest laser/dye-sub printing? The page on PC Case Gear here in Australia listed it with laser-marked characters...but it's clear that they have shiny pads printed on the caps..which actually get in the way of typing because I sit in front of a large window and it reflects off the glossy letter coat; making reading the key cap a little hard in bright sunlight.

I'm pretty sure my caps are laser-printed. And I have the charcoal version. Not sure if the colors/versions mean that the caps printing style changes.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: flacman on Wed, 27 March 2013, 08:14:14
So I emailed the retailer and this is his 'official answer.'

Quote
The FC700R keyboards we carry use a laser etch with a coating over the top, which is why we have had many customers assume these are printed. The initial revisions of the FC700 we received did not wear well, so this extra clear coat was added in order to improve durability of the keycaps which it did do.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 27 March 2013, 08:18:39
Awesome, thanks for the info. I'll add that to the OP later.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: dante on Wed, 27 March 2013, 09:33:23
I know I am going to be in the minority here but I think coatings on keycaps is gross.

I have some $5 rubberdomes which might not be all that great to type on but have their lettering as stickers.  And guess what - they still look brand new and nice months/years later.

Dyesub or Doubleshot FO LYFE!
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 27 March 2013, 09:44:09
I much prefer doubleshots or dyesub as well Dante.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: megaforce on Wed, 03 April 2013, 19:08:00
Glad to see that Leo went to a good home!
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 03 April 2013, 19:09:15
Glad to see that Leo went to a good home!

Thanks again Megaforce!! It's my daily driver at home and I wuvs it :D
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: redocto on Sat, 06 April 2013, 19:47:45
I love this keyboard! Been using for like 2 weeks now.
I actually didn't like the feel of the stock keycaps, so I replaced all of them with my old Filco keyboard caps.

Recently I bought a set of PBT white keycaps but the spacebar.... sigh...
Looking into modding at the moment.
Definitely a hassle.

But awesome keyboard for typing/playing.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sat, 06 April 2013, 22:11:09
You can try the putty mod on the space bar. I'm currently just living with the stock spacebar until I figure out what I really want to do.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: danielucf on Thu, 11 April 2013, 04:40:55
I loved my FC700R but also sold it because of the non standard spacebar. I had the black one though so any black set matched decently. The thick rubber caps on the feet should be a standard feature on all keyboards.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: CPTBadAss on Thu, 11 April 2013, 13:10:55
Argh! Im in the hunt for a black or white one so I can match sets. Its my only complaint with the board
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: dante on Thu, 11 April 2013, 16:37:22
haha ... wow that was a long time ago  :))
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: CPTBadAss on Thu, 11 April 2013, 17:01:00
ROFL. I better see you tapping out a review on your phone mid-meet sir :P
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: Lastpilot on Mon, 15 July 2013, 17:02:09
Thanks for this review. Man I really can't resist the clean sharp edges of the FC700R. Nothing beats it.

It's definitely a candidate for my next board.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: omegatony on Mon, 15 July 2013, 21:22:41
Great review.  :D
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: reiuorw on Mon, 15 July 2013, 23:31:19
by using BLUTACK, you can use standard spacer bar on FC700R without mod

http://www3.kbdmania.net/xe/tipandtech/6734644

though language is Kor, but I think you would know how to use it by just seeing image.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 16 July 2013, 06:35:17
Reiuorw that's genius. I'm going to find my blutack and try it later tonight!
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: Lastpilot on Tue, 16 July 2013, 07:27:29
Reiuorw that's genius. I'm going to find my blutack and try it later tonight!
Please post your thoughts on the results! :]
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: reiuorw on Tue, 16 July 2013, 09:24:15
Reiuorw that's genius. I'm going to find my blutack and try it later tonight!

I hope that would work well. :)
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: CPTBadAss on Thu, 14 November 2013, 20:57:49
Completely forgot about this mod until I re-read this review for some reason tonight. I tried it. Works ok. Seems to be a bit sticky if I press too hard but maybe the tack needs to dry out a little first.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: Candyflip on Mon, 18 November 2013, 15:47:18
nice review this keyboard is exactly what I am looking for, sadly the guy from Indonesia who sells them here can't ship to my country  :'(
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: lilky on Sun, 22 December 2013, 13:31:45
God this keyboard looks so beautiful...I want one so bad but I can't bring myself to bite the shipping costs from Hendy  :mad: Maybe when I visit family in Korea I'll pick a couple up!
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: Candyflip on Sun, 22 December 2013, 15:24:00
God this keyboard looks so beautiful...I want one so bad but I can't bring myself to bite the shipping costs from Hendy  :mad: Maybe when I visit family in Korea I'll pick a couple up!
Can't your someone from your family send you one, I think they are cheaper when bought there
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: lilky on Sun, 22 December 2013, 18:12:09
Yes, they are cheaper when bought there (you could probably haggle one down to $90 USD) but the shipping costs would make it cost-ineffective. Shipping a 3-4 lb package from SK to US costs like $30-$50 .
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: Candyflip on Mon, 23 December 2013, 04:04:42
Yes, they are cheaper when bought there (you could probably haggle one down to $90 USD) but the shipping costs would make it cost-ineffective. Shipping a 3-4 lb package from SK to US costs like $30-$50 .
120-140 is a reasonable price for the fc700r shipped
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: Travellerr on Sat, 28 December 2013, 12:38:42
Nice review, thanks for that I have not seen too many reviews about the 700r because they are a bit harder to get than the older models of Cherry mechanical keyboards from Leopold. I happen to really like the minimal, clean cut, and dark grey aesthetics of the version and model of the Leopold. I was up in the air about getting one of these a while back doing some nice keycap modding. Though I ended up going with another Leopold keyboard, the fc660c topre keyboard, which I have no regrets about this purchase. I love it very much, but I am still looking into getting a Leopold 700r and doing some more in depth modding to this mechanical keyboard which I have not yet done before. I am thinking about getting this keyboard and possibly having cherry mx clear switches swapped with the brown ones that I would be purchasing with this keyboard.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: Canious on Mon, 30 December 2013, 22:51:49
Love the color of the keycaps, thanks for the awesome review  :thumb:
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: aref on Sat, 29 March 2014, 23:00:59
Thanks for posting the review. I am going to replace my CMQFR with a graphite FC700R/MX Blue. I like MX Blue switches and have been considering a WASD or an M2. But I think prefer the FC700R. From the typing videos, the Leopold doesn't have the pinging issues I've had to dampen in my CMQFR and M2; a plus in my book.
Title: Re: Leopold FC700R Review
Post by: boradori007 on Sun, 30 March 2014, 02:21:57
Great review, thanks!