geekhack

geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: Masterchief79 on Thu, 25 July 2013, 19:29:41

Title: Trackball keyboards
Post by: Masterchief79 on Thu, 25 July 2013, 19:29:41: Hi guys,
I got my G80-11801 a few day ago. You know, thick PBT lasered caps, Logitech trackball, G80-1800 layout and browns. I was using the trackball just to surf from the bed, and when using my laptop on the desk, I still had my regular mouse. But I'm really starting to get used to this trackball. Haven't used my mouse all day and I'm not really missing it. Sure, when it comes to scrolling, you're lacking a scrolling wheel... but I don't have that much space on my desk (always between 2 and 4 keyboards) and I really appreciate not to need a second mouse besides my desktop PC mouse.

So, whatcha think about trackball keyboards? Do you own one or would consider a trackball useful, maybe even on new mechanicals, like idk a HHKB or something? Do you prefer a touchpad (like the G80-11900)? Are there other trackball KBs which might even have a scrolling wheel?^^

PS: I like the case of this keyboard. Newer G80-1800's have been just clipsed, this one is solid as f*ck with eleven screws in the back. :D

Pic of my desk right now with my QPad+Lachesis and the 11800 at their side (didn't clean anything for the pic, people who are going to complain about that take THIS POTATO (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4c/Potato_heart_mutation.jpg))

(http://abload.de/img/p7260040ptk0s.jpg)
Title: Re: Trackball keyboards
Post by: vivalarevolución on Sat, 27 July 2013, 16:14:33: Disappointed there are not more responses to this thread, but I am a fan of trackball keyboards. I have long considered getting that Cherry G80-11800, but the Cheery switches and non-ergo layout sway me towards not adding it my collection. Plus a lot of older trackball keyboards suffer from low DPI.

But I love a good trackball keyboard more so than touchpad. A touchpad is not ergonomic at all, and will cause your hands to hurt at some point because your hands are not meant to move around on flat surfaces. The Apple MAgic touchpad does have great features, but the darn thing makes my hands hurt after awhile.

Here is a picture of my favorite trackball keyboard, my Maltron. The trackball is in such a position that you rest your hand and navigate with the numberpad as well. Overall, I find this setup to be one of the best navigation options around.

[attach=1]

Then I experimented with the Kinesis Advantage and an Apple Magic Trackpad in the middle. While having the trackpad in the middle was convenient, it still made my hands hurt.

[attach=2]

Lastly, trackpoints. I love a good trackpoint on a laptop, but the only keyboards I would buy with a trackpoint, the IBM Model M13, was made for monitors with less pixels and is not that ergonomic.
Title: Re: Trackball keyboards
Post by: vivalarevolución on Sat, 27 July 2013, 16:30:25: Any experience with this keyboard? You happen to know what switches it has? I am guessing rubber domes with those tiny arrow keys.

[attach=1]
Title: Re: Trackball keyboards
Post by: RyanM on Sun, 28 July 2013, 19:37:26: What's the cheapest one is likely to find a decent mech board with a *larger* trackball for? I have the Cherry ML board with the trackball I picked up for $8 and, aside from ML, it's pretty awesome. Trackballs that are the same size as the ones found in mice are annoying to use, though.
Title: Re: Trackball keyboards
Post by: BlueBär on Sun, 28 July 2013, 20:06:48: Quote from: prdlm2009 on Sat, 27 July 2013, 16:30:25
Any experience with this keyboard? You happen to know what switches it has? I am guessing rubber domes with those tiny arrow keys.

Probably not Cherry MX because the step of that caps lock key is too far right. Also the slim function and arrow keys, as you already noticed, look like something non-MX.

Quote from: RyanM on Sun, 28 July 2013, 19:37:26
What's the cheapest one is likely to find a decent mech board with a *larger* trackball for? I have the Cherry ML board with the trackball I picked up for $8 and, aside from ML, it's pretty awesome. Trackballs that are the same size as the ones found in mice are annoying to use, though.

I don't think a keyboard with a large trackball exists, at least I have never seen one. You should probably get a seperate trackball if you want something decently sized.
Title: Re: Trackball keyboards
Post by: kurplop on Sun, 28 July 2013, 20:48:35: Quote from: BlueBär on Sun, 28 July 2013, 20:06:48

I don't think a keyboard with a large trackball exists, at least I have never seen one. You should probably get a seperate trackball if you want something decently sized.

I made one out of a Slimblade and an ErgoDox. It took a while to get use to but it it really is a joy to use. http://www.flickr.com/photos/kurplop/8731901844/in/set-72157633538408496

Whole thread here. http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=43709.0

I'm currently working on another with the trackball on the right of the keyboard
Title: Re: Trackball keyboards
Post by: IvanIvanovich on Sun, 28 July 2013, 21:04:41: I came across this bad boy (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Evergreen-Systems-G104-10087-2W-Full-System-Keyboard-with-Track-Ball-/400533027937?pt=PCA_Mice_Trackballs&hash=item5d41a0fc61), and thought it might interest someone, though it appears to be a G81, you could always replace it with a G80-18XX
Title: Re: Trackball keyboards
Post by: davkol on Mon, 29 July 2013, 03:39:52: Quote from: prdlm2009 on Sat, 27 July 2013, 16:30:25
Any experience with this keyboard? You happen to know what switches it has? I am guessing rubber domes with those tiny arrow keys.

(Attachment Link)

Rubber dome. Very quiet, but otherwise rather unpleasant one. I'm not fond of the trackball in it either, it's "too slow".
Title: Re: Trackball keyboards
Post by: BlueBär on Mon, 29 July 2013, 05:40:02: Quote from: kurplop on Sun, 28 July 2013, 20:48:35
I made one out of a Slimblade and an ErgoDox. It took a while to get use to but it it really is a joy to use. http://www.flickr.com/photos/kurplop/8731901844/in/set-72157633538408496

Whole thread here. http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=43709.0

I'm currently working on another with the trackball on the right of the keyboard

I have seen your project (very nice btw) but I meant something without modding :)
Title: Re: Trackball keyboards
Post by: wesleyh on Mon, 29 July 2013, 05:47:32: Ideally, we need a new ergodox kit with trackball built-in.
Title: Re: Trackball keyboards
Post by: FoxWolf1 on Mon, 29 July 2013, 09:44:07: Quote from: prdlm2009 on Sat, 27 July 2013, 16:14:33
Show Image
(http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=46216.0;attach=29632;image)

A conventional keyboard with a trackball positioned like that, that is, central with respects to the typing area, and decent surfaces for the palm rest areas (padded cloth or leather...but no gel, please, since that stuff always winds up leaking out of wrist rests and making the whole desk area really disgusting...and of course, no sharp or rough edges/corners) would be very difficult for me to resist buying, assuming that it is at least decent in other regards (has the right switches for my preference available, acceptable build quality, 6KRO or better, uses a trackball that can be adjusted to reach comfortable cursor speeds without affecting my mouse, etc.).
Title: Re: Trackball keyboards
Post by: Masterchief79 on Mon, 29 July 2013, 15:30:03: @prdlm2009: Nice ones :)
@kurplop: woah, impressive! Looks like a PC of a 1970ish James Bond Villain, giant red trackball with "start nuclear war" function included if you slam it hard enough xD
@ivan: That's one bad boy indeed, must not get tempted again... Luckily, that's ANSI, so I couldn't use it anyway. But those big trackballs are pretty cool after all, pity there are not THAT many stock keyboards with one.

@Topic: Glad there was some input after all, I was surprised no one cared.^^
Title: Re: Trackball keyboards
Post by: vivalarevolución on Mon, 29 July 2013, 19:38:55: Quote from: Masterchief79 on Mon, 29 July 2013, 15:30:03
@prdlm2009: Nice ones :)
@kurplop: woah, impressive! Looks like a PC of a 1970ish James Bond Villain, giant red trackball with "start nuclear war" function included if you slam it hard enough xD
@ivan: That's one bad boy indeed, must not get tempted again... Luckily, that's ANSI, so I couldn't use it anyway. But those big trackballs are pretty cool after all, pity there are not THAT many stock keyboards with one.

@Topic: Glad there was some input after all, I was surprised no one cared.^^

I care! I love a good trackball keyboard. Just wish there was a wider selection.

How is the speed on the trackball for G80-11800? Does it feel rather slow compared to moder mice?
Title: Re: Trackball keyboards
Post by: Masterchief79 on Tue, 30 July 2013, 19:47:46: I don't have much experience to compare it to. I'm using a 4000dpi Razer Lachesis at my desktop, so I might be spoiled by that. I'd take a guess and say the trackball is somewhere at 1500dpi. Still a lot faster and smoother than old mice (usually between 500 and 800 dpi afaik), and you need a bit of training to hit small buttons and stuff precisely. But nothing against a gamer mouse of course.
After all, I think Cherry chose a pretty perfect speed for the trackball. If it would be even faster, it would get really hard to hit a small button. Personally, I can work better with it than with the default trackpad of my laptop (not considering the fact that this one has a scrolling option and the trackball doesn't - so when it comes to scroling and you have to grab the slider all the time, I like the trackball a lot better^^).
Title: Re: Trackball keyboards
Post by: grave00 on Fri, 02 August 2013, 23:31:35: This Keycat works pretty good. Every once in awhile I'd hit a dead spot. Blue Alps are nice. I'd have used it longer the last go around but the tiny backspace is no fun. It's hard to plug it in sometimes as the adapter butts up against the VGA plug on the older PC I was using it with. The C keys act as mouse buttons.[attachimg=1]