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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: poog on Mon, 29 July 2013, 08:56:07

Title: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: poog on Mon, 29 July 2013, 08:56:07
http://imgur.com/a/ixDhR#0

kind of cool to see what everyone is using
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Danule on Mon, 29 July 2013, 09:17:00
this is cool!
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: bMind on Mon, 29 July 2013, 09:42:30
Wow..This IS great!
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Flyersfan1 on Mon, 29 July 2013, 09:51:08
I'm surprised that there was one guy using a Dell membrane, I guess it works well enough for him :)
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Puddsy on Mon, 29 July 2013, 09:53:23
I'm surprised that there was one guy using a Dell membrane, I guess it works well enough for him :)

Flash used a membrane up until fairly recently, too. In fact, so did many other brood war pros. I always thought that that was a neat piece of trivia.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: CPTBadAss on Mon, 29 July 2013, 09:54:22
A lot of the Korean pros used a QSenn DT-35 because it was a $5 rubber dome board. Cheap and it worked. According to Sifo, it's actually not bad for a rubber dome.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: SpAmRaY on Mon, 29 July 2013, 10:07:16
My favorite was the board that was missing an 'M' and I believe was using caps lock on the spacebar.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: keymaster on Mon, 29 July 2013, 10:09:07
A lot of the Korean pros used a QSenn DT-35 because it was a $5 rubber dome board. Cheap and it worked. According to Sifo, it's actually not bad for a rubber dome.

In addition, I've also read that those rubber domes were used in computer cafes, so many players got accustomed to it.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: tp4tissue on Mon, 29 July 2013, 10:22:02
mostly generics..

Same stuff we buy here..

they probably leave the good stuff at home
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: tehsprayer on Mon, 29 July 2013, 11:33:33
My favorite was the board that was missing an 'M' and I believe was using caps lock on the spacebar.

(http://i.imgur.com/leD2n2w.jpg)

My favourite.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: CPTBadAss on Mon, 29 July 2013, 11:34:58
WTF Sase?! How does he even type?? @.@
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: SpAmRaY on Mon, 29 July 2013, 12:27:38
My favorite was the board that was missing an 'M' and I believe was using caps lock on the spacebar.

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/leD2n2w.jpg)


My favourite.

That's the one!!

Perhaps that is the result of a rage quit.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: CPTBadAss on Mon, 29 July 2013, 12:31:00
SC2 players are infamous for changing their caps out like that so it's easier for them to hit hotkeys. I believe it was Boxer, nada, and MarineKingPrime who had certain caps removed or changed like Sase does in the picture above because they felt it helped them play better if those caps weren't there. They wouldn't hit those keys or anything.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Danule on Mon, 29 July 2013, 12:39:45
removing the keys lets you know where your hands are when you arent looking jsut remove the cap off a key that you dont use and you know the one beside it is the one you want to press.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: meiosis on Mon, 29 July 2013, 14:22:58
mostly generics..

Same stuff we buy here..

they probably leave the good stuff at home

They only use one keyboard and bring it everywhere, going as far to use a ruler to make sure it is straight compared to their posture.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Xenderwind on Mon, 29 July 2013, 15:09:10
SC2 players are infamous for changing their caps out like that so it's easier for them to hit hotkeys. I believe it was Boxer, nada, and MarineKingPrime who had certain caps removed or changed like Sase does in the picture above because they felt it helped them play better if those caps weren't there. They wouldn't hit those keys or anything.

I forgot who it was but there were stories from I think tasteless/artosis of some korean player who would bring a pencil with him to type in the removed rubber dome keys.  I wanna say he was a terran because I think I heard the name "pencil terran."
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Saturn on Mon, 29 July 2013, 17:24:37
Pretty cool.  I notice the Axiom guys are using WASD v2's already.  Must be part of a sponsorship deal.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Sifo on Mon, 29 July 2013, 17:25:49
Ah. You guys should see my dt-35 from brood war days
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Xenderwind on Mon, 29 July 2013, 17:29:00
Ah. You guys should see my dt-35 from brood war days
Didn't you do the like MKP qsenn where you mix black/white keycaps.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Sifo on Mon, 29 July 2013, 17:30:18
Here are the two most famous DT-35's. Sadly they're both dead.

MarineKing
(http://i.imgur.com/NO8up3e.jpg)

BoxeR
(http://i.imgur.com/ScJfq9c.jpg)

This is what my black DT-35 used to look like. I only use the white one now and it has a retro keycap scheme (Model M two tone)
(http://i.imgur.com/Ty4hy.jpg)
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Xenderwind on Mon, 29 July 2013, 17:35:42
Here are the two most famous DT-35's. Sadly they're both dead.

MarineKing
Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/NO8up3e.jpg)


BoxeR
Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/ScJfq9c.jpg)


This is what my black DT-35 used to look like. I only use the white one now and it has a retro keycap scheme (Model M two tone)
Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/Ty4hy.jpg)

God that first one is so dirty.  I'm still sad they never sold Slayers jersey's, i would have worn that thing all the time.

Edit: Whaaaaaat?!?! I just found out some slayers stuff got auctioned off after the team disbanded here (http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_ipg=&_from=&_nkw=&_armrs=1&_ssn=projectdarkhorse&LH_Complete=1&rt=nc).  All the clothes is too small for me, but the last autographed keyboard bag was only $75 :(
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Batmann on Mon, 29 July 2013, 17:47:54
My favorite was the board that was missing an 'M' and I believe was using caps lock on the spacebar.

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/leD2n2w.jpg)


My favourite.

that's a good one
I guess he doesn't like mothership core so much!
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Sifo on Mon, 29 July 2013, 18:07:12
Look closely that's not the M key that's missing.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Thimplum on Mon, 29 July 2013, 18:08:38
WTF Sase?! How does he even type?? @.@

You have to use Letter Spacing Drills, if you take my meaning.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Kampeki on Mon, 29 July 2013, 19:03:52
Leopold and Filco seem to be the main choices amongst them, anyone know why Ducky isn't more used, since I hear most people say they are supeior to leopold?
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: hashbaz on Mon, 29 July 2013, 19:07:57
That classic Starcraft chessboard scheme is what drew me to geekhack in the first place.  I was searching for ways to dye keycaps so I wouldn't have to buy two keyboards! :D
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: YoungMichael88 on Mon, 29 July 2013, 21:48:06
http://imgur.com/a/ixDhR#0

kind of cool to see what everyone is using
I don't know how Sifo finds the time to play on ALL these SC2 teams! And my goodness his keyboard preference varies wildly from picture to picture!
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: meiosis on Mon, 29 July 2013, 21:49:18
Leopold and Filco seem to be the main choices amongst them, anyone know why Ducky isn't more used, since I hear most people say they are supeior to leopold?

Leopold is Korea based.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Sifo on Mon, 29 July 2013, 22:06:08
http://imgur.com/a/ixDhR#0

kind of cool to see what everyone is using
I don't know how Sifo finds the time to play on ALL these SC2 teams! And my goodness his keyboard preference varies wildly from picture to picture!

Just that good

Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: kmiller8 on Mon, 29 July 2013, 22:09:11
Just that good

(http://i.imgur.com/0zPAt3n.png) (http://"")
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Mon, 29 July 2013, 22:11:58
Who composed this album? This is actually pretty cool.

Some of them use TKL, but their hands are still WIDE apart haha. If you're going to do that, might as well get a full size.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: fuzzybaffy on Tue, 30 July 2013, 00:49:19
Interesting that some of the players switch up equipment from time to time. For instance, you can see MVP using the G9x in one picture, and the Steel Series Sensei in a couple of others.

That said, anyone notice that they are actually using those laser sensored mice, the G9x and Sensei? Tells me the whole "built-in acceleration" problem isn't that much of a problem, as I always believed.

Seems to me the most favored mice are the Sensei, G9x, or Abyssus. With a couple of Deathadders and Zowie Micos here and there.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Sifo on Tue, 30 July 2013, 02:47:21
The built in acceleration on this G9X pissed me off to no end in the first 2-3 days. Used to it now. (http://i.imgur.com/0zPAt3n.png) (http://"")
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Grim Fandango on Tue, 30 July 2013, 03:18:10
Interesting.

Would like to see this for Counter Strike players.

Interesting that some of the players switch up equipment from time to time. For instance, you can see MVP using the G9x in one picture, and the Steel Series Sensei in a couple of others.

That said, anyone notice that they are actually using those laser sensored mice, the G9x and Sensei? Tells me the whole "built-in acceleration" problem isn't that much of a problem, as I always believed.

Seems to me the most favored mice are the Sensei, G9x, or Abyssus. With a couple of Deathadders and Zowie Micos here and there.

One thing I notice right away is that SC2 players tend to use different mice compared to CS players, possibly favoring other features and characteristics of the mouse over sensor reliability.  It is not so much that acceleration is not an issue, it is more that in comparison to FPS, sensor accuracy and reliability does not play as big of a role in RTS. You see the same thing for MOBA players. In competitive FPS, you will find very few people using laser sensors in general. Even if they are sponsored by Steelseries, they go out of their way to avoid using mice like the Sensei, even going for models that are no longer in production like the Ikari optical. NIP is one example. The gear they use is on the website. I believe one of them had the Sensei listed as his mouse, but he has never used it in tournaments (and it has been removed from his list of equipment).

All acceleration is, is that in addition to distance translating to cursor movement, the speed with which that distance is covered also affects cursor movement. This is not always a bad thing, and people can get used to it. However, most people in FPS prefer the simplicity of mouse movement=cursor movement. Adding speed to the equation makes things needlessly complicated in a game where precision aiming is key. It is especially noticeable for people using lower sensitivity, where long sweeps at variable speeds are common. This amplifies the effects of acceleration. That is not to say that acceleration is bad for everyone and in every FPS. Many Quake players prefer it. What it gives you is an automatic variable sensitivity. With positive acceleration, you move slow for precision shots, then automatically the cursor moves very slow on the screen. You move fast to turn 180 degrees ingame, and you do not have to cover the same distance as without acceleration. One other reason people turn it off however, is because it is hard to get consistent across games and different mice. Personally I found it very hard when trying (software) acceleration to get a handle on it. But that is mainly due to many years of low sensitivity gaming without acceleration (Counter Strike GO ingame 1.75; 500 DPI; Windows sensitivity 6/11). The slight positive hardware acceleration on laser sensors is not nearly as bad (or noticeable) but I feel it hurts more than it helps since there is probably some inaccuracy and difference between what I expect the cursor to do and what it actually does, not being used to it. It is hard to unlearn muscle memory.

In RTS however, things are kind of different. Acceleration might for example be actually nice to have if a large part of mouse-movement is used to control the camera. In addition, when pinpoint accuracy is not key in the game, the trade off of having an automatic variable sensitivity for accuracy could be more worth it. It is also common to have a much higher sensitivity compared to top FPS players, which in practice greatly reduces the effects of acceleration.

However, despite all this, people do overreact to the slight hardware acceleration found in modern laser mice. Especially when not playing genres where it can be an issue. I feel that a lot of people do not understand what it is or how it affects gameplay. At the same time, I feel it makes sense to focus on sensor quality when buying a mouse. Though other factors of both the sensor (max tracking speed, lift of distance etc.) as well as the mouse itself (type of switches omron, huano, shape, weight) should also be taken into consideration. This is clearly what the SC2 players are doing.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: CalmB4tehPwn on Tue, 30 July 2013, 03:32:32
What I've learned today: No matter how much of a grudge I have against Razer, I should consider using a Goliathus
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: fuzzybaffy on Tue, 30 July 2013, 04:05:14
Interesting.

Would like to see this for Counter Strike players.

Interesting that some of the players switch up equipment from time to time. For instance, you can see MVP using the G9x in one picture, and the Steel Series Sensei in a couple of others.

That said, anyone notice that they are actually using those laser sensored mice, the G9x and Sensei? Tells me the whole "built-in acceleration" problem isn't that much of a problem, as I always believed.

Seems to me the most favored mice are the Sensei, G9x, or Abyssus. With a couple of Deathadders and Zowie Micos here and there.

One thing I notice right away is that SC2 players tend to use different mice compared to CS players, possibly favoring other features and characteristics of the mouse over sensor reliability.  It is not so much that acceleration is not an issue, it is more that in comparison to FPS, sensor accuracy and reliability does not play as big of a role in RTS. You see the same thing for MOBA players. In competitive FPS, you will find very few people using laser sensors in general. Even if they are sponsored by Steelseries, they go out of their way to avoid using mice like the Sensei, even going for models that are no longer in production like the Ikari optical. NIP is one example. The gear they use is on the website. I believe one of them had the Sensei listed as his mouse, but he has never used it in tournaments (and it has been removed from his list of equipment).

All acceleration is, is that in addition to distance translating to cursor movement, the speed with which that distance is covered also affects cursor movement. This is not always a bad thing, and people can get used to it. However, most people in FPS prefer the simplicity of mouse movement=cursor movement. Adding speed to the equation makes things needlessly complicated in a game where precision aiming is key. It is especially noticeable for people using lower sensitivity, where long sweeps at variable speeds are common. This amplifies the effects of acceleration. That is not to say that acceleration is bad for everyone and in every FPS. Many Quake players prefer it. What it gives you is an automatic variable sensitivity. With positive acceleration, you move slow for precision shots, then automatically the cursor moves very slow on the screen. You move fast to turn 180 degrees ingame, and you do not have to cover the same distance as without acceleration. One other reason people turn it off however, is because it is hard to get consistent across games and different mice. Personally I found it very hard when trying (software) acceleration to get a handle on it. But that is mainly due to many years of low sensitivity gaming without acceleration (Counter Strike GO ingame 1.75; 500 DPI; Windows sensitivity 6/11). The slight positive hardware acceleration on laser sensors is not nearly as bad (or noticeable) but I feel it hurts more than it helps since there is probably some inaccuracy and difference between what I expect the cursor to do and what it actually does, not being used to it. It is hard to unlearn muscle memory.

In RTS however, things are kind of different. Acceleration might for example be actually nice to have if a large part of mouse-movement is used to control the camera. In addition, when pinpoint accuracy is not key in the game, the trade off of having an automatic variable sensitivity for accuracy could be more worth it. It is also common to have a much higher sensitivity compared to top FPS players, which in practice greatly reduces the effects of acceleration.

However, despite all this, people do overreact to the slight hardware acceleration found in modern laser mice. Especially when not playing genres where it can be an issue. I feel that a lot of people do not understand what it is or how it affects gameplay. At the same time, I feel it makes sense to focus on sensor quality when buying a mouse. Though other factors of both the sensor (max tracking speed, lift of distance etc.) as well as the mouse itself (type of switches omron, huano, shape, weight) should also be taken into consideration. This is clearly what the SC2 players are doing.

ZZZZZZZzzzzz. If hardware accel is a problem for you with FPS, then go with optical mice. But, clearly, for these SC2 Pros, the acceleration isn't enough of an issue for them to want to switch.
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: meiosis on Tue, 30 July 2013, 04:12:25
Just that good

(http://i.imgur.com/0zPAt3n.png) (http://"")

IIRC we have d.Dream on this forum now. Probably much more knowledgable about current Sc2 Pro Play.

:P

I actually think Topre might be something people might move into later on,
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Grim Fandango on Tue, 30 July 2013, 04:13:51

ZZZZZZZzzzzz. If hardware accel is a problem for you with FPS, then go with optical mice. But, clearly, for these SC2 Pros, the acceleration isn't enough of an issue for them to want to switch.

Why so mean :( I was just trying to be informative. Based on your comment I thought you might be wondering about this (the general perception of acceleration being bad, and yet SC2 pros use it). I made my post in response to your comment, but not as a way to attack your post or anything like that. You do not have to read it if you do not want to. But what I posted was not a case against acceleration. I mentioned acceleration is preferred even by some (professional) quake players, and has unique benefits that could be worth it depending on preference and genre.

Acceleration is not only "not an issue", it may be something they prefer to have, even amplified with software acceleration, in an RTS. I was just pointing out that because of the different ways in which the mouse is used by FPS and RTS players, acceleration plays a different role. I even agreed with you that people tend to overreact to the slight hardware acceleration in laser mice.

People here always talk about the smallest technical details and differences in feel and preference of keyboards, keycaps, stabilizers etc. While my post might not be as interesting since this is a keyboard forum, I do not feel it is out of line :)
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Grim Fandango on Tue, 30 July 2013, 04:39:09
Just that good

(http://i.imgur.com/0zPAt3n.png) (http://"")

IIRC we have d.Dream on this forum now. Probably much more knowledgable about current Sc2 Pro Play.

:P

I actually think Topre might be something people might move into later on,

Possibly when their sponsors start manufacturing/branding them ;)
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Sifo on Wed, 31 July 2013, 10:01:12
Hey I'm semi-friends with Dream where's he at? Kid always dodges me and calls himself noob!
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 31 July 2013, 10:05:41
Talked to him in the Miami GB thread. Seems cool and gave me a sup son hehe. And there's a fake Incontrol who even has the proper capitalization in his name but its not actuall the EG player. =(
Title: Re: album of some sc2 players' keyboard/mouse setups
Post by: Polymer on Thu, 01 August 2013, 01:53:43
What I've learned today: No matter how much of a grudge I have against Razer, I should consider using a Goliathus

Haha..They actually make a good mousepad...I'm a fan...a bit surprised to see how many there were though...