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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: jundis on Sun, 11 August 2013, 16:09:38

Title: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: jundis on Sun, 11 August 2013, 16:09:38
Hello.

I've been using a Microsoft Sidewinder x6 keyboard for a couple years now, but I really want to get a mechanical keyboard for better feedback.

Couple questions though.

1. I've found extremely varied opinions on this, but what is the quietest switch type? I've tested the Razer Blackwidow, and I cannot stand the loud clicks after having a relatively silent non-mechanical for the past few years.
2. I've got a white case and the white Siberia V2 headset, and plan on getting a white mouse, is there any white mechanical keyboard? Both WASD and DAS seem to only have black bases, and I'd rather not go for the Thermaltake MEKA keyboard (as I'm really tired of the red backlight). Preferably one with clear or light blue backlights.
3. Is there no media key mechanical keyboard bases? I've really gotten used to having the media keys on the top of my keyboard, and while I can live without the macro keys I don't think I'd be willing to give up pause/play and mute.

TL;DR: So really, my ideal keyboard would be:
- Silent
- White with white/light blue backlight.
- Media keys
- Replaceable caps, or comes without caps.

Sorry if this is a bother. Thanks for any assistance.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: tp4tissue on Sun, 11 August 2013, 16:11:26
what ever you just thought, STOP IT.

Now, imagine heaven.

Now, imagine you can BUY IT

Now, Google Ergodox
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: inteli722 on Sun, 11 August 2013, 16:27:19
(geez, it's like tp4tissue stalks for these threads. :'( )

Anyways, ignore him. The Ergodox...
(https://s3.amazonaws.com/massdropinc/product-images/massdrop-product-ergodox-au3.jpeg)

...is an ergonomic mechanical keyboard that you have to build yourself and is relatively limited. Also doesn't provide backlight capabilities.

Before I recommend anything, I'd like to know if you want Tenkeyless or full sized.

The first couple keyboards that come to mind are:

(http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/media/v2-front.jpg)
(http://gaming.logitech.com/assets/47814/g710-gaming-keyboard-images.png)


Few reasons for my choices:


However, neither comes in white, though I'd imagine plasti-dipping your keyboard wouldn't be that big of a deal.

A strike against the G710+ is the bottom row of the keyboard has a funky layout, so replacing keycaps is difficult, and I've also heard about some QA issues.

A couple strikes against the WASD v2 are the fact that the backlit version isn't availible yet, and the keycaps are regarded as extremely thin.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: tp4tissue on Sun, 11 August 2013, 16:28:53
Quote from: inteli722 on Sun, 11 August 2013, 16:27:19
(geez, it's like tp4tissue stalks for these threads. :'( )

Anyways, ignore him. The Ergodox...
Show Image
(https://s3.amazonaws.com/massdropinc/product-images/massdrop-product-ergodox-au3.jpeg)


...is an ergonomic mechanical keyboard that you have to build yourself and is relatively limited. Also doesn't provide backlight capabilities.

Before I recommend anything, I'd like to know if you want Tenkeyless or full sized.

The first couple keyboards that come to mind are:

  • WASDKeyboard v2
Show Image
(http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/media/v2-front.jpg)

  • Logitech G710+
Show Image
(http://gaming.logitech.com/assets/47814/g710-gaming-keyboard-images.png)

[/list]

Few reasons for my choices:

  • Both can come with white backlights, though the WASD one is a little while away.
  • Both have Media Keys built into the firmware.
  • G710+ comes with o-rings pre-installed, while WASD provides an option to order them in a few different settings

However, neither comes in white, though I'd imagine plasti-dipping your keyboard wouldn't be that big of a deal.

A strike against the G710+ is the bottom row of the keyboard has a funky layout, so replacing keycaps is difficult, and I've also heard about some QA issues.

A couple strikes against the WASD v2 are the fact that the backlit version isn't availible yet, and the keycaps are regarded as extremely thin.

^^^  all of this is a lie...

disregard..

Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: inteli722 on Sun, 11 August 2013, 16:31:03
Quote from: tp4tissue on Sun, 11 August 2013, 16:28:53

^^^  all of this is a lie...

disregard..

Oh come on, tp4tissue. We've had this discussion before. No need to start it again.

Seriously, OP. Ignore him. He's our resident troll, and whenever this sort of thread pops up, he decides to chime in his opinion, which he thinks overrules yours, because "**** you, ergonomics for the win".
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sun, 11 August 2013, 16:34:06
It's not white but I think the board that would suit you best is the WASD V2 like Intelli722 said.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: jundis on Sun, 11 August 2013, 16:36:23
Haha..

While I would love to get into ergonomic keyboards, I can't type with them. As weird as it is I type with the index, middle, and ring of my left hand on all keys YHN and to the left (on QWERTY) and then my index of my right hand for UJM and right, and the ring finger for back space/shift/enter.

I tend to go for keyboards that have numpads. While I don't use them often, it's nice to have there for when I do a lot of calculator work on my computer.

The white isn't a massive dealbreaker, as I have been using a black keyboard all this time, but the backlight is not very negotiable. I don't look at my keys when I type often, but there are somethings I still have to check out once and a while and I type in the dark a lot, so label-less and backlight-less keyboards just don't work for me.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: inteli722 on Sun, 11 August 2013, 16:38:08
Also, I just noticed something. The WASD v2 Backlit version is known as the "Code" version, and uses Cherry MX Clears. Those, while sometimes regarded as the quietest switches, are rather heavy (not Green heavy, but heavy), and very tactile. Someone on here could mod it for you, or you could do it yourself, but you should probably look into the switch type you'd like.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: tp4tissue on Sun, 11 August 2013, 16:40:04
Quote from: inteli722 on Sun, 11 August 2013, 16:31:03
Quote from: tp4tissue on Sun, 11 August 2013, 16:28:53

^^^  all of this is a lie...

disregard..

Oh come on, tp4tissue. We've had this discussion before. No need to start it again.

Seriously, OP. Ignore him. He's our resident troll, and whenever this sort of thread pops up, he decides to chime in his opinion, which he thinks overrules yours, because "**** you, ergonomics for the win".

So you're walking down the street.

a pretty girl comes into view.

She agrees to let you have your way with her.

Then, across the street, boom, smash, wizzz....

An alien ship crashes, and the green lantern guy comes out, badly hurt, he's dieing.

The Ring of power transforms into an Ergodox so you can send a galactic email to the guardians notifying them of an impending evil invasion..


So yea, use the Ergodox, become the green lantern, Save the universe, or w/e some chick...  she's probably got some crappy rubber dome back at her house...
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: rowdy on Sun, 11 August 2013, 17:03:49
Can I type stuff like that if I get an ErgoDox? ;)
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Phillip_J_Fry on Sun, 11 August 2013, 17:07:27
Quote from: inteli722 on Sun, 11 August 2013, 16:38:08
Also, I just noticed something. The WASD v2 Backlit version is known as the "Code" version, and uses Cherry MX Clears. Those, while sometimes regarded as the quietest switches, are rather heavy (not Green heavy, but heavy), and very tactile. Someone on here could mod it for you, or you could do it yourself, but you should probably look into the switch type you'd like.

I've already ordered Filco TKL Brown...and now I regret that I didn't know about WASD v2 with CLEARS that, I suppose, suit me better than browns...
:(

update: btw, http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/wasd-v2-87-key-barebones-mechanical-keyboard.html -- I can't choose mx clear switches...
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: FoxWolf1 on Sun, 11 August 2013, 17:25:40
Keycool 108, maybe? Occasionally one shows up with full backlighting rather than partial. Not 100% sure if the extra four keys do media, though.

I think I've seen a few of the new 108-key Ducky keyboards with white cases and white backlighting, and some standalone media keys in the upper right corner...that might work for you.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: jundis on Sun, 11 August 2013, 17:30:12
Quote from: FoxWolf1 on Sun, 11 August 2013, 17:25:40
Sometimes fully backlit versions of the Keycool 108 show up:
Show Image
(http://img03.taobaocdn.com/imgextra/i3/695432482/T2xqP8XXNaXXXXXXXX_!!695432482.jpg)

White case, white backlight, and dedicated media keys. Silence is a matter of switch choice, as ever.

Wow. That right there is the keyboard I want. Any idea where I can pick one up or are they limited?
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: FoxWolf1 on Sun, 11 August 2013, 17:31:56
Not sure where you'd get one of those here and now...just got the pic off a Taobao ad (here (http://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=a230r.1.14.213.uny0wm&id=17202477823)). Also, come to think of it, I'm not sure what the keys in the upper right actually do...I've been assuming they were media keys, but maybe not. The symbols are odd...
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: tp4tissue on Sun, 11 August 2013, 17:33:03
Quote from: rowdy on Sun, 11 August 2013, 17:03:49
Can I type stuff like that if I get an ErgoDox? ;)

only one way to find out...
But probably, yes, 99.9999999% chance
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: dorkvader on Sun, 11 August 2013, 18:29:22
1. There aren't any totally silent switches. Even rubberdomes will have noise. Many people like a "click" sound when a switch actuates, so the cherry blue switch accentuates that. I'm not surprised you find it annoying, coming from rubberdomes.

To "silence" a switch, many people put an o-ring or rubber "landing pad" under the keycap. This will effectively cancel out most of the noise caused by bottoming out a switch, as well as reduce the travel (the distance between the non-pressed height and depressed height, 4.0mm for most switches) but you will still getsome noise when the switch "tops out". It is possible to negate top out noise, but it can be quite difficult. The easiest way is to change your typing habits to account for it. I can type quietly when I try, and silently when I'm going slowly.

2. There are lots of white cased keyboards in many sizes. Keycool, leopold, and ducky all have offerings with various features. There are others, I'm sure, but that springs to mind first.

3. media keys are present on many, but not all keyboards. If you find the "perfect" keyboard that includes everything else, you can add media key functionality with programs like autohotkey. This is an excellent solution if you are using it only on your own personal computers.

To revisit item #1, the cherry mx blue is designed to generate a click. There are quieter switches like linear ones. If you want cherryMX, good linear switches are reds (or maybe blacks). If you are really worried about noise, I believe the matias quiet keyboards may be the best. They are one of the quietest mechanical switches that's easy to get a'hold of, and come in white. I don't know about media keys, though.

The ergoDOX is an ergonomic keyboard. It is fully programmable and may-or-may-not suit your purposes. You will have to spend a few hours assembling it, once you get a kit. It is not a retail item.

Hope this helps!
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: bazemk1979 on Sun, 11 August 2013, 19:33:20
There is no such thing as quick question when it comes to MK, there is quick wallet sweep though :)
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Matias on Sun, 11 August 2013, 21:04:03
Quote from: dorkvader on Sun, 11 August 2013, 18:29:22
If you are really worried about noise, I believe the matias quiet keyboards may be the best. They are one of the quietest mechanical switches that's easy to get a'hold of, and come in white. I don't know about media keys, though.

Not backlit but very quiet for a mechanical, you can hear how the Quiet Pro sounds in comparison to Cherry boards here...

http://matias.ca/quietpro/pc/#soundbox

Mac models are white.  PC models are black.

Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Tony on Sun, 11 August 2013, 23:45:34
1. All mech switches are louder than rubber dome, but Topre and brown/red/black switches are the quietest. You can use o-rings to dampen the sound, but it also dampens the typing feel.

2. You can buy a lamp. Almost all of good mech keyboards are not equipped with led and media keys.

3. For media keys, you can use AutoHotkey to create your own hotkeys for pause, play and stop.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: jundis on Tue, 13 August 2013, 01:01:21
As I figured, there's no perfect keyboard unless I build it myself.

If anyone ever finds that fully backlit white Keycool 108, shoot me a PM. I've been looking and will continue, but I'd rather not buy it from one of the sketchy taobao dropship sites.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Findecanor on Tue, 13 August 2013, 10:44:56
1. The Matias Quiet switch, in the Matias QuietPro (http://www.matias.ca/quietpro/) is the quietest mechanical. It is more quiet than some rubber dome keyboards, even. Personally, I don't think that it feels too different from a rubber dome keyboard, though, just more crisp.

Within the Cherry MX family, I would say that the Black, Brown and Clear are the more silent switches. All are loud when you hit the bottom, but the higher force of Black and Clear make you bottom out less often and the tactility of the Clear and Brown will help you avoid bottoming out. The Clear are unusual.
You can dampen the landing (and the sound of landing) by installing O-rings in the keycaps. WASD Keyboards (http://www.wasdkeyboards.com) is the only vendor (that I know of) that offers to install O-rings in the keyboards they sell.

Topre switches are not mechanical in the same sense as Cherry MX or Matias' switches, but they are very high quality and have a very good feel for rubber dome. Standard Topre switches are quite silent to begin with, but there is also a more silent version.

2. There are white mechanical keyboards, but they are not as common. Filco and Leopold have had white keyboards.
Keyboards where only either the keys or the case is white are easier to find. Zowie, Ducky and Tt eSports have such keyboards. CoolerMaster Storm (CM Storm) has shown white keyboards in trade shows, but I have not seen them in stores yet.

3. Ducky's full-size keyboards have media keys over the numeric keypad. CM Storm Quickfire Rapid has media functions together with a Fn key.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 02:20:55
Hi.. Nice to meet you here. Hope this is a right thread for my questions and apologies for the resurrection of old thread.

I've been using this keyboard from my very first Acer 486DX PC, from 20 years ago. It's been my favorite keyboards ever but it's really old now and the lack of Windows key proof to be a deficiency in Win 8 OS. But I'm not sure what switch mechanism it is using. Can you tell?

(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/01/uzama3ug.jpg)

(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/01/yhy6eneg.jpg)

So I'm thinking I an upgrade but because I live in Malaysia, my choices are limited. If I were to import, the shipping charges is going to kill me. My most cost effective choice is Razer BW Ultimate. I know it's not getting a lot of love here but how bad is it? I've a friend who is going to clear his stock and he's selling me a brand new BW 2013 (green backlight) for about us$95. I thought it's pretty reasonable and it's about time I retire the Acer keyboard.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Gazeb0 on Sun, 01 September 2013, 02:43:30
Quote from: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 02:20:55
But I'm not sure what switch mechanism it is using. Can you tell?

Those are black alps switches. Also used on the Dell AT101W keyboard (which is also an old keyboard).

As per OP's question, might I suggest the CM Storm Quickfire TK (http://www.amazon.com/CM-Storm-QuickFire-TK-Mechanical/dp/B00A378L10/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1378020672&sr=8-3&keywords=quickfire+tk) with Brown switches? It employs white backlighting with a white backplate (kinda cool looking, if you ask me). Also, it uses Fn-key enabled media keys and backlight controls. On top of that, it is capable of doing NKRO over USB, has a detachable USB cable, tenkeyless design with a tenkey... so yeah, lots of awesome features for the price, in my opinion. Great build quality, too. I installed black 50A o-rings (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0051XWXCE/ref=oh_details_o03_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) on mine, definitely reduces the noise considerably. And, since browns are a silent switch type, I'd say this keyboard fits the bill. I'd definitely check it out. But I guess I'm a bit biased about CM Storm keyboards  :D
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 03:01:59

Quote from: Gazeb0 on Sun, 01 September 2013, 02:43:30
Quote from: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 02:20:55
But I'm not sure what switch mechanism it is using. Can you tell?

Those are black alps switches. Also used on the Dell AT101W keyboard (which is also an old keyboard).

Thanks. Looks like alps switches are really nice to type then. Back many years ago when I was programming on those IBM mainframe dumb terminals, I love those keyboards. Are they alps or buckling switch? I don't think I have tried Cherrys so I will have to try it first and compare it with the alps. But the alps are really good and lasting - 20 years!
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Matias on Sun, 01 September 2013, 03:09:04
Quote from: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 02:20:55
I've been using this keyboard from my very first Acer 486DX PC, from 20 years ago. It's been my favorite keyboards ever but it's really old now and the lack of Windows key proof to be a deficiency in Win 8 OS. But I'm not sure what switch mechanism it is using. Can you tell?

As Gazeb0 says, those are Black ALPS.  You can probably find another old board with those same switches on eBay.

If you want to buy new, the closest you'll find to them in a PC layout are these, which we ship to Malaysia for $15...

http://matias.ca/quietpro

Quote
So I'm thinking I an upgrade but because I live in Malaysia, my choices are limited. If I were to import, the shipping charges is going to kill me. My most cost effective choice is Razer BW Ultimate. I know it's not getting a lot of love here but how bad is it? I've a friend who is going to clear his stock and he's selling me a brand new BW 2013 (green backlight) for about us$95. I thought it's pretty reasonable and it's about time I retire the Acer keyboard.

Thoughts?

If you can try the Razer BW Ultimate locally and are happy with it, go for it.  $95 is a bargain, and no shipping charge.

Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Matias on Sun, 01 September 2013, 03:19:04
Quote from: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 03:01:59

Quote from: Gazeb0 on Sun, 01 September 2013, 02:43:30
Quote from: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 02:20:55
But I'm not sure what switch mechanism it is using. Can you tell?

Those are black alps switches. Also used on the Dell AT101W keyboard (which is also an old keyboard).

Thanks. Looks like alps switches are really nice to type then. Back many years ago when I was programming on those IBM mainframe dumb terminals, I love those keyboards. Are they alps or buckling switch?

Could be either...

IBM used to use ALPS switches, then switched to buckling spring -- probably as a cost saving measure (buckling springs are cheaper to make).

Quote
I don't think I have tried Cherrys so I will have to try it first and compare it with the alps. But the alps are really good and lasting - 20 years!

If you like ALPS, Cherrys will probably feel crappy to you (not tactile enough), but who knows.  If you can get one locally, give it a try and see if you like them.

Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 03:41:15

Quote from: Matias on Sun, 01 September 2013, 03:09:04


As Gazeb0 says, those are Black ALPS.  You can probably find another old board with those same switches on eBay.

If you want to buy new, the closest you'll find to them in a PC layout are these, which we ship to Malaysia for $15...

http://matias.ca/quietpro
Wow, $15 to ship to Malaysia is very attractive indeed. Are these using alps too?
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: terran5992 on Sun, 01 September 2013, 06:00:08
Forget about cherry , get topre :)
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 07:40:58
What's that? You pulling my legs or something? :)
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Tony on Sun, 01 September 2013, 09:26:23
1. I think based on quietness: Topre (quietest)- Cherry Red - Cherry Black-Cherry brown - Cherry blue (noisiest)

2. Most mech keyboards are without backlights and the ones with backlights are not very popular. I think backlights are useless. If I ever need to know which keys are, I prefer a lamp.

3. Most mech keyboards are without media keys. You can use third party programs to emulate these media keys at any position you'd like.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: axtran on Sun, 01 September 2013, 11:05:15
Backlit, some media keys, quiet (Cherry MX Clear): why not try the CODE Keyboard?
http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/products/code-keyboard.html
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: daerid on Sun, 01 September 2013, 11:35:02
Uhhhh the stem looks like black alps, but the switch housing definitely does not. Is this some sort of rare alps switch? Or is it a clone?
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: abdulmuhsee on Sun, 01 September 2013, 11:49:39
Quote from: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 03:41:15
Wow, $15 to ship to Malaysia is very attractive indeed. Are these using alps too?

Matias is essentially the only remaining company that manufactures keyboards with ALPS switches; their keyboards use their own kind of ALPS which they have been developing for awhile. 

If you want the exact same kind of switches you had in your old keyboard, then you'll have to look for another vintage keyboard, but if you want a newly manufactured ALPS board that feels a bit different, possibly better, then I'd give Matias a shot.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: C5Allroad on Sun, 01 September 2013, 18:56:20
Sorry if someone recommended this but the K70 comes to mind with media keys and cherry mx browns, blues or reds.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 21:42:00
Quote from: abdulmuhsee on Sun, 01 September 2013, 11:49:39
Quote from: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 03:41:15
Wow, $15 to ship to Malaysia is very attractive indeed. Are these using alps too?

Matias is essentially the only remaining company that manufactures keyboards with ALPS switches; their keyboards use their own kind of ALPS which they have been developing for awhile. 

If you want the exact same kind of switches you had in your old keyboard, then you'll have to look for another vintage keyboard, but if you want a newly manufactured ALPS board that feels a bit different, possibly better, then I'd give Matias a shot.
Thanks for your explanation. Love your avatar! I think we are both Alps lover, no? I am keen to try a newer Alps butI will also give a actual hands-on for the Razer BW that my friend is selling for $90, no shipping required. The price of the BW is very attractive.

I am now reading some reviews on Matias - when you mention new Alps switch, I believe you are referring to the version 4 keyboard that was released in Nov 2012? The only thing I didn't quite like the Matias is the glossy finish - at least from the product photos, it looked like a glossy finish ala a Das. The key caps looked like it has textured plastic, so that is not too bad.

I am also not so sure I wanted the Quiet Pro vs the Tactile Pro. To me, real mechanical keyboard has to be loud :D :D I suppose these two used the same switch, except the Quiet having some sort of dampener, no?
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Findecanor on Mon, 02 September 2013, 05:05:23
Quote from: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 02:20:55
But I'm not sure what switch mechanism it is using. Can you tell?
...
Show Image
(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/01/yhy6eneg.jpg)

Quote from: Gazeb0 on Sun, 01 September 2013, 02:43:30
Those are black alps switches.
Quote from: Matias on Sun, 01 September 2013, 03:09:04
As Gazeb0 says, those are Black ALPS.
Wrong and wrong, those are Acer's own switches (http://deskthority.net/wiki/Acer_switch). They are very often mistaken for black Alps. However, black Alps switches don't click.
Acer switches can also have a white slider, but they are otherwise exactly the same as black Acer switches.

I think that is an Acer 6311 keyboard. There is version of that keyboard with Windows keys - the Acer 6311-W or 6311-TW. There are also rebranded Acer 6311 keyboards, and they should have the model number, but not the Acer name.
The Acer 6312 has a vertical Enter key. Chinese 6311 keyboards have a "big-ass" backwards-L Enter key.

Quote from: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 03:01:59
Back many years ago when I was programming on those IBM mainframe dumb terminals, I love those keyboards. Are they alps or buckling switch?
Some really old IBM terminal keyboards were Beam Spring keyboards (http://deskthority.net/wiki/IBM_Beam_Spring_Keyboards).
Later terminal keyboards had buckling spring switches.

As far as I know, only IBM keyboards made for the Japanese market had Alps switches, and all of them were linear, not clicky like the others.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: terrpn on Mon, 02 September 2013, 08:02:25
acer switches and NOT alps..............right

somehow they feel cheaper as well- but there is click :-\
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: ch_123 on Mon, 02 September 2013, 08:09:41
Quote from: Matias on Sun, 01 September 2013, 03:19:04
Quote from: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 03:01:59

Quote from: Gazeb0 on Sun, 01 September 2013, 02:43:30
Quote from: Belfong on Sun, 01 September 2013, 02:20:55
But I'm not sure what switch mechanism it is using. Can you tell?

Those are black alps switches. Also used on the Dell AT101W keyboard (which is also an old keyboard).

Thanks. Looks like alps switches are really nice to type then. Back many years ago when I was programming on those IBM mainframe dumb terminals, I love those keyboards. Are they alps or buckling switch?

Could be either...

IBM used to use ALPS switches, then switched to buckling spring -- probably as a cost saving measure (buckling springs are cheaper to make).


As has been pointed out, this was only the case for IBM Japan, who had a substantial degree of independence from the rest of IBM and seemed to buy locally in order to make things cheaper. It should also be noted that the first tactile Alps switch they used was basically a cheap version of IBM's own beam spring. (see http://deskthority.net/wiki/Alps_plate_spring (http://deskthority.net/wiki/Alps_plate_spring))

While a Model M or Brother Switch membrane buckling spring _may_ be cheaper than an Alps switch, there's no way that an Alps keyboard would cost more than a Model F or beam spring board.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Belfong on Mon, 02 September 2013, 09:16:33
Yeah, the Acer I was using is clicky. Quite loud. If you said that the black alps is not clicky, then I think you nailed it. It's not an alps then. I'm surprise Acer find it cost effective to produce their own switches at that time.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Findecanor on Mon, 02 September 2013, 11:31:28
Yeah, these switches are simpler internally. There are actually membranes underneath them all.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Matias on Mon, 02 September 2013, 19:30:52
Quote from: Belfong on Mon, 02 September 2013, 09:16:33
Yeah, the Acer I was using is clicky. Quite loud. If you said that the black alps is not clicky, then I think you nailed it. It's not an alps then. I'm surprise Acer find it cost effective to produce their own switches at that time.

That's pretty interesting...

If you're planning on getting rid of it, I can take it off your hands, in exchange for any one of the mechanicals in our lineup.  You can take your pick.  :-)

Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Belfong on Mon, 02 September 2013, 19:56:42

Quote from: Matias on Mon, 02 September 2013, 19:30:52
Quote from: Belfong on Mon, 02 September 2013, 09:16:33
Yeah, the Acer I was using is clicky. Quite loud. If you said that the black alps is not clicky, then I think you nailed it. It's not an alps then. I'm surprise Acer find it cost effective to produce their own switches at that time.

That's pretty interesting...

If you're planning on getting rid of it, I can take it off your hands, in exchange for any one of the mechanicals in our lineup.  You can take your pick.  :-)
That's pretty awesome. I don't plan to get rid of it but you made an offer I can't refuse. I'll take it up, Mr Matias and thank you.

I actually like tactile and clicky but the Tactile Pro model is only for Mac, isn't it? If that's the case, I will settle for the Quiet Pro black.

How can we do this? Can you PM me your address and I'll ship it to you. If you are satisfied with the Acer keyboard, then we can exchange. I'm open to other ideas.
Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Matias on Thu, 05 September 2013, 03:55:46
Quote from: Belfong on Mon, 02 September 2013, 19:56:42

Quote from: Matias on Mon, 02 September 2013, 19:30:52
Quote from: Belfong on Mon, 02 September 2013, 09:16:33
Yeah, the Acer I was using is clicky. Quite loud. If you said that the black alps is not clicky, then I think you nailed it. It's not an alps then. I'm surprise Acer find it cost effective to produce their own switches at that time.

That's pretty interesting...

If you're planning on getting rid of it, I can take it off your hands, in exchange for any one of the mechanicals in our lineup.  You can take your pick.  :-)
That's pretty awesome. I don't plan to get rid of it but you made an offer I can't refuse. I'll take it up, Mr Matias and thank you.

I actually like tactile and clicky but the Tactile Pro model is only for Mac, isn't it? If that's the case, I will settle for the Quiet Pro black.

How can we do this? Can you PM me your address and I'll ship it to you. If you are satisfied with the Acer keyboard, then we can exchange. I'm open to other ideas.

Great!

I just PMed you.

Title: Re: New to mechanical keyboards, quick questions.
Post by: Belfong on Wed, 18 September 2013, 00:45:52
Hi Matias, I have received the keyboard. Am surprise that it shipped within a week. I think this is probably a least known thing - that international (non-US) shipping is from Taiwan and that it cost just us$15. I think that the awareness of the low shipping cost will make more people in my country (or region) interested to import Matias. Typically, we have the impression that shipping from US on a heavy stuff like this would cost around us$50-$70, so that itself deterred many from even thinking of buying online.

Good point for me to talk about when I'm doing my review of the keyboard.

BTW, initial quick impression: love the tactility and quietness! I am using it in an office and was actually surprise at how quiet and tactile it is. Thanks again!!