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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: lam47 on Tue, 11 November 2008, 18:36:38

Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Tue, 11 November 2008, 18:36:38: Just found this at my brothers house and gave it a good clean inside and out.

It looks like a mac extended and has white alps switches.
It has ABD connectors on both sides and is a bit useless to me as I dont have the converter.
Is it worth selling or would someone like it?

I will try to get pics up tomorrow.
My poor dog Mr B is having the balls off so I might not get chance.

Inside it has a nice PCB with the switches soldered to it. Between them is a sheet of black steel.

Sticker on the back has serial, + other info.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Wed, 12 November 2008, 04:48:08: Cleaned up nice.
I love the way the alps feel.
Where is a good place to get an adapter for this?

Here are some pictures.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v331/laurie47/DSC00282-1.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v331/laurie47/DSC00284.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v331/laurie47/DSC00285.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v331/laurie47/DSC00286.jpg)
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: itlnstln on Wed, 12 November 2008, 06:12:34: Awesomw clean up job! It looks almost brand new. I know Belkin makes an ADB adapter, and it should be pretty easy to find online.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Wed, 12 November 2008, 06:19:43: Thanks for that! I will take a look.
I learnt to clean white plastics working on Japanese arcade machines.
Whitening toothpaste is the secret ;)
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: iMav on Wed, 12 November 2008, 06:21:03: Just out of curiosity, what did you use to clean it? (cuz from the pics it looks like it was significantly yellowed).

If you don't want to keep it yourself, let me know. I think my wife would love to use a white alps 'board with her MBP. (and I believe I have some ADB adapters lying around)
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Wed, 12 November 2008, 06:24:14: EEK. Could I buy one of your adapters?
I would like to have a go before giving up on it completely.
Oh see above for cleaning tips :)
Lots of work with a toothbrush :)
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: bigpook on Wed, 12 November 2008, 07:30:18: Whitening toothpaste? lol...and how did you arrive at that solution?
Any particular brand? Talk about a keyboard that is minty fresh : )

It looks really nice btw, nice job!
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: itlnstln on Wed, 12 November 2008, 08:19:32: Quote from: lam47;10822
EEK. Could I buy one of your adapters?
I would like to have a go before giving up on it completely.
Oh see above for cleaning tips :)
Lots of work with a toothbrush :)

Unfortunately, I don't have one to sell. I did not realize that they were fairly expensive and only one company seems to make them (Griffin, not Belkin). I guess they aren't very popular devices. You may want to put up a "WTB" request in the market place board. There are several members who, at one time, used older Apple kbs and may have an adapter to sell.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Wed, 12 November 2008, 08:42:14: I used pearl drops Hollywood smile lol.

Thanks for the info itlntla. I have seen one for £25. Think it would be worth it as the keyboard is very nice.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lowpoly on Wed, 12 November 2008, 10:15:47: Does your tooth paste process make yellowed plastic white again?
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: Chloe on Wed, 12 November 2008, 10:38:15: Toothpaste is a mild abrasive so using it is removing a layer of plastic. Whitening toothpaste has a bleaching agent. Here's a good article on yellowing:
http://www.vintagecomputing.com/index.php/archives/189
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: D-EJ915 on Wed, 12 November 2008, 11:07:36: that is a very impressive clean-up job! nicely done
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Wed, 12 November 2008, 20:19:43: So is this an apple extended 2 copy? Forgive me I dont quite understand how power user could use the patent.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: Donut on Thu, 13 November 2008, 17:12:34: Quote from: lam47;10785
It looks like a mac extended and has white alps switches.
It has ABD connectors on both sides and is a bit useless to me as I dont have the converter.
Is it worth selling or would someone like it?
...
Inside it has a nice PCB with the switches soldered to it. Between them is a sheet of black steel.

Sticker on the back has serial, + other info.

I'd say it's definitely worth keeping.

Can you post a pic of the sticker on the back? I have a keyboard which looks identical apart from the branding (exact same key layout and internal appearance), an ETC Peripherals Powerglide 105.

The keyboard itself is made by Ortek Technology. My one has a stylised O (for Ortek I guess) instead of the cloverleaf symbol on the Command keys. Not sure why they did that, unless Apple considered the symbol a trademark.

It has clicky white Alps switches which I really like the feel of. (The Apple Extended Keyboard II switches aren't really clicky.)

Regarding ADB-to-USB adapters... there are several models but those that I have tried aren't perfect for using the keyboard with a PC. They treat the left and right Shift, Option and Command keys as the same, for example. I've tried three adapters made by different companies, but haven't yet tried a Griffin iMate.

NTI (a manufacturer of KVM switches) used to make an ADB-to-USB converter which I suspect might work fully/properly, but I haven't tried that.

Quote from: lam47;10785
So is this an apple extended 2 copy? Forgive me I dont quite understand how power user could use the patent.

Which patent is that, out of interest?
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Thu, 13 November 2008, 17:28:54: Hey donut thanks for the reply.
I will post a picture of the rear label tomorrow.

Patent might be the wrong word.
I just mean it seems almost identical in structure to an extended 2.

I always thought the apple extended was clicky. I dont know a lot though so Im sure I am wrong.

Finaly, I have the griffon iMate so will let you know tomorrow when my ADB cable arrives how well it works.

Oh and do you have any pics of your keyboard?
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lowpoly on Fri, 14 November 2008, 04:04:13: The Extended II is not clicky and the switch is dampened at the bottom to reduce noise when bottoming out. I believe the Extended I is the same without the dampening but I never tried one.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Fri, 14 November 2008, 05:45:36: Oh right. Cheers lowpoly good to know.
Im typing on the poweruser now and its so nice.
The imate works perfectly, the apple key is the windows key control and alt are working perfectly. I will do some work on it today and post some more feedback later.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lowpoly on Fri, 14 November 2008, 05:53:47: Any dead keys?
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Fri, 14 November 2008, 05:57:46: The power one in the top right does not seem to to anything.
Is there an application that will let me test every key? One that simply shows on and off.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Fri, 14 November 2008, 06:02:10: found one.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Fri, 14 November 2008, 06:08:10: Right. Only key not recognized is the power key.
The right shift ctr windows and alt are mirrors of the left ones.

Otherwise its all go and perfect.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lowpoly on Fri, 14 November 2008, 06:14:32: That's good. I always have one dead regular key beside the power key with the Extended II and the iMate.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Fri, 14 November 2008, 06:19:15: Oh no. Which one?
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lowpoly on Fri, 14 November 2008, 06:45:23: I think it was ^/° in the upper left, just left to the 1 key (german layout with vertical enter).
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Fri, 14 November 2008, 07:18:29: How many keys on the board?
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lowpoly on Fri, 14 November 2008, 07:31:41: I can't count the keys right now but it probably has one more key than the American version and that should be the reason why the iMate doesn't translate it.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: megarat on Fri, 14 November 2008, 11:36:53: Quote from: lam47;11002
Patent might be the wrong word.
I just mean it seems almost identical in structure to an extended 2.

Some nitpicky comments about design similarity (although you probably already know this):

The Apple Extended II had a single-row return key (next to the quotes key), and a full-size delete key. the "|" & "\" key was on the QWERTY row, above the return key, and was somewhat longer than a standard single-width key. The L-shaped return key was common among third-party Mac keyboards (and perhaps required, to hedge against design-copyright infringement claims? I don't know).

Also, the Apple Extended II had flatter keys with less contour. Although as I understand it, two significant variants of the Extended II were made, and there might have been differences in the key shape. To me, the profile of the keys with this board is reminiscent of the not-as-classic Apple Design keyboard (which was not-as-classic only because of the lack of quality switches, not because of the key design).

Without counting, I'm confident that the PowerUser 105 and the original Apple boards have the same number of keys. There is only the size/rearrangement difference in the area of the return/delete/"pipe and backslash" keys.

I love that this has white Alps, that makes it a great find. I think it's terrific that these older, unknown, quality keyboards are being discovered and pulled into service. It feels like we're techno-archaeologists in a way, finding sophisticated alien artifacts buried in the sand, and supplanting our own clunky inventions with them.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lowpoly on Fri, 14 November 2008, 12:03:14: L-shaped vs. single row return is the difference between ANSI layout (American) and ISO (Europe).
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Fri, 14 November 2008, 15:05:10: Only one thing is annoying me. The little bumps are on k and d and not on j and f. Its making my touch typing a lot harder to learn.
I would just switch them but Ella uses the keyboard too and I have to keep popping them of which I dont really want to.
Anyone know where I can buy keycaps in the UK?
Thanks.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lowpoly on Fri, 14 November 2008, 15:13:25: Give the d/k nipples a few more days. I got used to that quickly when I used my Extended II.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: DMuk on Fri, 14 November 2008, 15:22:31: Quote from: Chloe;10857
Toothpaste is a mild abrasive so using it is removing a layer of plastic. Whitening toothpaste has a bleaching agent. Here's a good article on yellowing:
http://www.vintagecomputing.com/index.php/archives/189

Very informative, thanks.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Fri, 14 November 2008, 19:05:27: Sorry this is late.
Pic of the sticker on the base.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v331/laurie47/DSC00314-1.jpg)
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: Chloe on Fri, 14 November 2008, 19:12:44: I googled the FCC ID, it looks like (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Adesso-Extended-Beige-Keyboard-305-FCC-ID-KJXKB205_W0QQitemZ200255288997QQihZ010QQcategoryZ51084QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1713.m153.l1262) this keyboard was also sold under the Adesso name.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lam47 on Fri, 14 November 2008, 19:18:31: That one is very slightly different. Only by a tiny bit though.
It does not have the two little nodules by escape and power.
Also the led labelling is right next to the power key. On mine it has a gap.
And no labels under the f keys. I would guess its the same inside though.

Still looks damn close.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: fkeidjn on Tue, 03 March 2009, 00:27:33: *Bump*

What is the active ingredient for the whitening in the whitening toothpaste, in general and the one that was used for this keyboard? I could simply use bleach, but wouldn't bleach whiten beyond the original color?
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: skriefal on Tue, 03 March 2009, 00:45:13: You could try this (http://retr0bright.wikispaces.com/), if you'd like to really de-yellow the plastic. More info here (http://www.amibay.com/viewtopic.php?f=88&t=1645).
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: lowpoly on Tue, 03 March 2009, 02:21:18: More links in the wiki.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: Chloe on Tue, 03 March 2009, 14:40:43: Quote from: fkeidjn;23277
*Bump*

What is the active ingredient for the whitening in the whitening toothpaste, in general and the one that was used for this keyboard? I could simply use bleach, but wouldn't bleach whiten beyond the original color?

The active ingredient in Pearl Drops Hollywood Smile is Zinc Peroxide. Not all whitening toothpastes have this. I wouldn't use chlorine-based bleach as it can degrade plastics.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: FKSSR on Tue, 03 March 2009, 16:08:03: I just bought the CompuCable ADB to USB cable (here is another one on ebay (http://cgi.ebay.com/USB-TO-MINI-ADB-ADAPTOR-BY-COMPUCABLE-WITH-MANUAL-CD_W0QQitemZ170306385901QQcmdZViewItemQQptZCOMP_EN_Cables_Connectors?hash=item170306385901&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50)).

These things are freaking expensive just for being a connector converter cable. I gave my girlfriend the Macally MK96 I bought for her Macbook, but it doesn't have an ADB input, so I have to buy the stupid converter for $32.00. Ugh. Oh well, at least the MK96 was cheap.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: FKSSR on Mon, 23 March 2009, 10:54:11: Does anyone know if the Apple Design Keyboard II M2980 (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fb/Apple_Extended_Keyboard_II_black.jpg) is the same keyboard as this PowerUser keyboard? It looks the same, but I suspect it is not.

Besides this Adesso/PowerUser keyboard and the AEKII, were there any other Mac keyboards made with white alps switches?

Thanks!
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: Chloe on Mon, 23 March 2009, 12:13:14: The M2980 are rubber dome.
Title: White alps ABD, poweruser 105
Post by: FKSSR on Mon, 23 March 2009, 12:25:06: Thanks!

Do you know anything about the KeyTronic Mac Pro Plus? I heard some dude raving on it, but I can't find anything about the switches.