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geekhack Community => Keyboard Keycaps => Topic started by: swill on Mon, 30 September 2013, 23:21:27
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I understand the doubleshot part because you get infinite wear and the keycaps feel more solid. But why are they all ABS? Is it because sourcing is harder for PBT or POM or is it because the majority of people actually want ABS material? Or is it a price thing?
I am just surprised to see so many ABS GBs when I see a lot of people on here who prefer PBT.
Can anyone enlighten me?
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I understand the doubleshot part because you get infinite wear and the keycaps feel more solid. But why are they all ABS? Is it because sourcing is harder for PBT or POM or is it because the majority of people actually want ABS material? Or is it a price thing?
I am just surprised to see so many ABS GBs when I see a lot of people on here who prefer PBT.
Can anyone enlighten me?
I believe a lot of this has to do with color selection, for a few reasons.
1. PBT does not like to doubleshot due to this particular plastic having a very large thermal expansion coefficient. In English, it shrinks a lot when it cools down making it a pain to do doubleshots with.
2. A lot of people like accent colors on mods and the two vertical columns of keys on the left and right side of the alphanumerics. The common solution for this most of the time is to just reverse the colors. This can't usually be done with PBT because of the dark legend on light colored cap restriction. This can be circumvented by doing what is usually called a negative dyesub where the entire cap is dyesubbed and leaving the legend the color of untainted plastic.
3. PBT is also very difficult to make space bars with because of the shrinkage during cooling will warp the cap. Sometimes to the point where it won't be able to be mounted onto a keyboard without fixing at home. There are a couple methods that I have heard of for this though. One involves hot water and the other involves a good hair dryer. Both involve a book to hold flat during the cooling process though.
4. This is purely speculation though but i believe that PBT may be more expensive of a raw material thus making finished products more expensive.
For what its worth I would love to see more PBT GB's though through. I would love to see some with negative dyesubbed mods to reverse colors as well. Although I am not sure how many manufacturers that we use have that capability. However, if you are really wanting something in PBT you should get in touch with imsto. He is from overseas but does a ton for the forums and the keyboard community in general in regards to PBT caps.
If I have anything wrong here guys please correct me.
Melvang
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Everybody (mostly) on this board seems to prefer the feel of PBT over ABS so I don't think its that the majority of people really prefer ABS. However, ABS is really a lot cheaper than PBT even if you get irregular colors. An ABS kit can go as low as 20 bucks while the PBT kit is like 40, 35 if you get into a group buy. And those prices are for the mass produced ones, not the custom colors you see in the group buys.
Plus, with the frequent group buys, I have a suspicion that most people here buy new keycap sets and replace them over and over again so they don't have to see the keycaps get shiny.
Finally, while looking at the LCARS interest check thread, I think that there are more color options for ABS caps and the colors are more vibrant with ABS. If you are buying keycaps based on their appearance, I suppose it is logical to get the best-looking ones.
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Because double shot PBT is a very, very new thing. Previously you could only get double shot ABS.
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There are some cheap DS PBT sets around now. Wasn't it $33 for Vortex? Horrible legends, but.
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Everybody (mostly) on this board seems to prefer the feel of PBT over ABS so I don't think its that the majority of people really prefer ABS. However, ABS is really a lot cheaper than PBT even if you get irregular colors. An ABS kit can go as low as 20 bucks while the PBT kit is like 40, 35 if you get into a group buy. And those prices are for the mass produced ones, not the custom colors you see in the group buys.
Plus, with the frequent group buys, I have a suspicion that most people here buy new keycap sets and replace them over and over again so they don't have to see the keycaps get shiny.
Finally, while looking at the LCARS interest check thread, I think that there are more color options for ABS caps and the colors are more vibrant with ABS. If you are buying keycaps based on their appearance, I suppose it is logical to get the best-looking ones.
Actually many people prefer doubleshot ABS cherry profile keys, whether they are original cherry or from the newer group buys from GMK because of the feel, profile and legend. And these are not cheap whatsoever. ;)
And before the recent TaiHao group buy there were not cheap ABS doubleshots and most of the cheap ABS key caps you see are not doubleshots but pad printed.
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Feng is having a doubleshot pbt group buy now
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Feng is having a doubleshot pbt group buy now
So tempted to grab a white/red set. Only problem is I don't know where I could get 4 remainder keys for my YOTS board that's coming soon...
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SP doubleshots are both cheap and they allow for custom legends. SP dyesub isnt as common because they don't have pbt spacebars which makes for a mismatching set mostly.
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I know GMK has a much higher MOQ but do they do PBT and if so will hey do PBT space bars?
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SP wont do PBT spacebars
SP PBT isn't high texture
I would still buy a SP dyesub set if they did the space in the same material.
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DS PBT Creamsicle GB NOW! TJ get on this!
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DS PBT Creamsicle GB NOW! TJ get on this!
Does TJ mean Time Jump? If not, then I don't know what you're talking about cause there's no Creamsicle GB on this site nor google.
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he means there SHOULD be one aka he really wants it lol
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DS PBT Creamsicle GB NOW! TJ get on this!
Does TJ mean Time Jump? If not, then I don't know what you're talking about cause there's no Creamsicle GB on this site nor google.
Is another member here.
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DS PBT Creamsicle GB NOW! TJ get on this!
Does TJ mean Time Jump? If not, then I don't know what you're talking about cause there's no Creamsicle GB on this site nor google.
See this thread for more info. Maybe if you all PM TJ and flood his inbox he'll start this up where he left off ;)
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=39251.0 (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=39251.0)
[attach=1]
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SP wont do PBT spacebars
SP PBT isn't high texture
I would still buy a SP dyesub set if they did the space in the same material.
They will make PBT spacebars:
http://deskthority.net/keyboards-f2/sp-pbt-spacebars-t6500.html?hilit=sp%20pbt%20spacebar
I know GMK has a much higher MOQ but do they do PBT and if so will hey do PBT space bars?
Again, GMK can only make Double shot ABS, I don't know if they also carry an inventory of PBT key caps but if so, they will only be either pad printed or laser etched. Dye sub on PBT is made by BSP Europe.
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DS PBT Creamsicle GB NOW! TJ get on this!
Does TJ mean Time Jump? If not, then I don't know what you're talking about cause there's no Creamsicle GB on this site nor google.
See this thread for more info. Maybe if you all PM TJ and flood his inbox he'll start this up where he left off ;)
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=39251.0 (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=39251.0)
(Attachment Link)
Ahhhhh, looks pretty
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the PBT kit is like 40, 35 if you get into a group buy.
I got mine for 17...