geekhack
geekhack Community => Off Topic => Topic started by: dragonxx21 on Thu, 10 October 2013, 17:07:35
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With no heatware score, refusing to pay with paypal gift, and only just getting 60 posts, I'm going to say good luck with buy! Too many flags.
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With no heatware score, refusing to pay with paypal gift, and only just getting 60 posts, I'm going to say good luck with buy! Too many flags.
Yeah this... Its just common courtesy to pay using gift. I almost always pay using gift and I'm a pretty respected member.
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With no heatware score, refusing to pay with paypal gift, and only just getting 60 posts, I'm going to say good luck with buy! Too many flags.
There are certain circumstances when paying with Paypal gift is acceptable. Like intagible/digital goods. (there is no other way as far as that's concerned as a seller) However, for physical items there is no reason if you're using Paypal. NONE. There is buyer/seller protection, are you saying you don't trust Paypal? You do? Then stop threadcrapping.
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With no heatware score, refusing to pay with paypal gift, and only just getting 60 posts, I'm going to say good luck with buy! Too many flags.
Yeah this... Its just common courtesy to pay using gift. I almost always pay using gift and I'm a pretty respected member.
I've been scammed paying with gift. Wont do it again.
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With no heatware score, refusing to pay with paypal gift, and only just getting 60 posts, I'm going to say good luck with buy! Too many flags.
Yeah this... Its just common courtesy to pay using gift. I almost always pay using gift and I'm a pretty respected member.
I've been scammed paying with gift. Wont do it again.
I assume the opposite is the same, and why people may be hesitant.
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With no heatware score, refusing to pay with paypal gift, and only just getting 60 posts, I'm going to say good luck with buy! Too many flags.
Yeah this... Its just common courtesy to pay using gift. I almost always pay using gift and I'm a pretty respected member.
I've been scammed paying with gift. Wont do it again.
I assume the opposite is the same, and why people may be hesitant.
You sir, do not know anything about Paypal Seller Protection. I use it often, had several punks pay with bad checks. They footed it.
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Wow... I say this so many times, but here we go again:
Paying as a Goods payment protects both the buyer AND the seller. The buyer is protected because there should be some sort of tracking showing the item being shipped. If they don't get this, then they can dispute the transaction for not receiving the item (thus, it's important as a seller to get tracking; make your buyer pay for it if you must). The seller is protected in that they have provided tracking, and shipped to a verified address of a confirmed buyer. This is how the protection system works.
If you don't do one of these things, you lose the protection. For instance, taking money as a Gift puts you at risk. The buyer may not be able to dispute through PayPal, but they can talk to their credit card company or bank and claim the charge was fraudulent. Without any proof, because you didn't have tracking or anything for a Gift, because it's a gift, you lose your money. If a buyer did this with a Goods payment, well you have proof showing the item was shipped and delivered to a verified address, and you are now covered.
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Wow... I say this so many times, but here we go again:
Paying as a Goods payment protects both the buyer AND the seller. The buyer is protected because there should be some sort of tracking showing the item being shipped. If they don't get this, then they can dispute the transaction for not receiving the item (thus, it's important as a seller to get tracking; make your buyer pay for it if you must). The seller is protected in that they have provided tracking, and shipped to a verified address of a confirmed buyer. This is how the protection system works.
If you don't do one of these things, you lose the protection. For instance, taking money as a Gift puts you at risk. The buyer may not be able to dispute through PayPal, but they can talk to their credit card company or bank and claim the charge was fraudulent. Without any proof, because you didn't have tracking or anything for a Gift, because it's a gift, you lose your money. If a buyer did this with a Goods payment, well you have proof showing the item was shipped and delivered to a verified address, and you are now covered.
THANK YOU! Someone that knows what they're talking about. Sheesh. I repeat unless you're selling something not covered by Seller protection (intangible/digital goods) to unverified locations* there is no reason to gift payments. A physical item can be tracked, that's YOUR responsibility to prove it was shipped. Just horrible misinformation. Oh, and my address IS verified. :)
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Tracked postage can be bordering on extortion for something as small as 1 item.
Also I know tracking once it hits my country from alot of countries just stops. What happens then with paypal protection.
Just a few other things to consider and reasons people may prefer gift payments.
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Tracked postage can be bordering on extortion for something as small as 1 item.
Also I know tracking once it hits my country from alot of countries just stops. What happens then with paypal protection.
Just a few other things to consider and reasons people may prefer gift payments.
Then you get signed mail. Extortion? Are we talking about this on a Click Clack WTB? EDIT : If it's worth significant money you make sure to cover yourself. Welcome to the internet my friend.
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Tracked postage can be bordering on extortion for something as small as 1 item.
Also I know tracking once it hits my country from alot of countries just stops. What happens then with paypal protection.
Just a few other things to consider and reasons people may prefer gift payments.
Then you get signed mail. Extortion? Are we talking about this on a Click Clack WTB?
Would cost me $25 for a tracked international letter. 1 keycap.
Apologies for thread crapping, was just showing reasons why people may prefer gift that is all and it is between seller/buyer to agree on gift payment or not. Will not waste anymore of your time.
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paying with gift is bull****. easy to scam.
but paying as goods is bull**** also, because paypal almost always sides with the buyer.
point is, **** paypal.
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paying with gift is bull****. easy to scam.
but paying as goods is bull**** also, because paypal almost always sides with the buyer.
point is, **** paypal.
Unfortunately, it's a necessary evil. :\
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This exchange was split off from this WTB thread (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=49472). If more pay as gift discussion wants to happen, let it happen here plz.
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I insist on gift payment if they are international and refuse to pay the cost to get tracking/insured postage since any seller protection counts on being able to prove paypal that it was sent, and where it went. If it gets lost or destroyed it's not going to be my problem or loss.
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I insist on gift payment if they are international and refuse to pay the cost to get tracking/insured postage since any seller protection counts on being able to prove paypal that it was sent, and where it went. If it gets lost or destroyed it's not going to be my problem or loss.
^^ But as mentioned above what happens if they then do a chargeback with their credit card company or bank?
I have asked gift payment for people who are brand new etc. But also have done gifts with many geekhackers to save on fees! (is paypal watching :eek:)
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If they are going to scam you on purpose they will find a way. I guess you can make people pay in bitcoins, send you a money order or something else that is not possible to reverse if you are that worried about it.
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If they are going to scam you on purpose they will find a way. I guess you can make people pay in bitcoins, send you a money order or something else that is not possible to reverse if you are that worried about it.
I'm not concerned really, if people seem too untrustworthy I just ignore them :P
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Gold Bullion only for me.
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I insist on gift payment if they are international and refuse to pay the cost to get tracking/insured postage since any seller protection counts on being able to prove paypal that it was sent, and where it went. If it gets lost or destroyed it's not going to be my problem or loss.
^^ But as mentioned above what happens if they then do a chargeback with their credit card company or bank?
I have asked gift payment for people who are brand new etc. But also have done gifts with many geekhackers to save on fees! (is paypal watching :eek:)
Paypal is always watching.
Ive been warned by them to not accept gift payments anymore or else theyd close my account because they werent making money off me.
I told them yolo.
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Gold Bullion only for me.
shipping would suck :P
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Payment methods accepted: authenticated gold doubloons delivered by bonded courier.
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For some countries like India, there is no gift payment option. Also we don't get a lot of other benefits on PayPal. :(
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Paypal is always watching.
Ive been warned by them to not accept gift payments anymore or else theyd close my account because they werent making money off me.
I told them yolo.
But they get a cut of the gift payment on the sender's end.
Paypal is weird.
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paying with gift is bull****. easy to scam.
I'm always wary of it, because you can't dispute gift paid items, yet everyone always insists on paying gift just to save a couple bucks. On the upside, I haven't been scammed yet.
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paying with gift is bull****. easy to scam.
I'm always wary of it, because you can't dispute gift paid items, yet everyone always insists on paying gift just to save a couple bucks. On the upside, I haven't been scammed yet.
I actually require gift payments with some people because they're new users, they have no heatware or any other kind of feedback, or they're international and aren't willing to pay for a tracked package.
In those cases, I always request gift payments because there's no real way to cover my ass for some of them since Paypal will almost always side with the buyer. I've seen too many people get scammed by new users who either paid with an account that wasn't theirs, had little invested in the community, scammed a ton of people, started disputes or chargebacks, and disappeared, or, in the case of international buyers, claimed it never arrived. That latter part is why keypop stopped shipping to China. It "never arrived" but would appear for sale on Taobao.
Generally, there's no need to do gift payments and if those few couple of cents/dollars matter to you, charge the buyer the Paypal fees, but there are some instances where it's justified.
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paying with gift is bull****. easy to scam.
I'm always wary of it, because you can't dispute gift paid items, yet everyone always insists on paying gift just to save a couple bucks. On the upside, I haven't been scammed yet.
I actually require gift payments with some people because they're new users, they have no heatware or any other kind of feedback, or they're international and aren't willing to pay for a tracked package.
In those cases, I always request gift payments because there's no real way to cover my ass for some of them since Paypal will almost always side with the buyer. I've seen too many people get scammed by new users who either paid with an account that wasn't theirs, had little invested in the community, scammed a ton of people, started disputes or chargebacks, and disappeared, or, in the case of international buyers, claimed it never arrived. That latter part is why keypop stopped shipping to China. It "never arrived" but would appear for sale on Taobao.
Generally, there's no need to do gift payments and if those few couple of cents/dollars matter to you, charge the buyer the Paypal fees, but there are some instances where it's justified.
I see your points, I had one guy try that "it never arrived" bit. Then I showed Paypal the signature confirmation and they dealt with it. I know on small keycaps for $3-4 a piece like keypop does it can be prohibitive to ship everything out with signature confirmation and insurance/tracking etc. However a clack is a different story, the value should be enough to motivate the seller to protect their investment during the exchange. If a buyer doesn't want to pay it then another buyer out there will. I would, I want both sides to be comfortable but just like you don't know me, I don't know you. There has to be some push and give and I think the buyer covering the cost of shipping/tracking/signature if international is a reasonable request.
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HEY I NEVER GAVE PERMISSION TO MOVE MY REPLIES HERE.
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Payment methods accepted: authenticated gold doubloons delivered by bonded courier.
Still better than Paypal!
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Doesn't Amazon have a Paypal type system?
I heard it's better.
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No gift payments through Amazon--only payments for goods/services. Similar otherwise (but no fees, not sure if in all circumstances).
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Paypal is not nearly so evil as ebay itself (and Paypal is part of ebay, of course).
They have jerked me around as much as anybody else over the years, but I still marvel at the beauty and simplicity of it. Want to send $100 to somebody in the Australian outback from Atlanta, Georgia? The money will be in his account in seconds.
If you want to use "gift" to avoid the transfer fees, you are making a mistake. Yes, you might get dinged for a couple of percentage points, but it is not an onerous cut (unlike ebay's tribute, which has ballooned to a full 10% on the last couple of items I sold!).
If a seller is seeking to protect himself, then it makes a bit more sense, but you are still "gaming" a system outside of its standard playing field. But until ebay/Paypal chooses to make transactions safer for sellers (don't hold your breath) there are few options, especially international.
Ebay/Paypal has surely weighed the annoyances of gifting against their need to always protect buyers. They know perfectly well that the laws of supply and demand revolve around the demand side. As long as a demand exists, suppliers will be lined up to satisfy it.
I got in trouble with Paypal a couple of years ago after accepting a series of "gift" payments (and I am talking about perhaps a dozen small transactions, max, over a couple of weeks) where they locked up my account and put a 21-day hold on everything. Even conventional ebay sales, by the book, they were holding it back even after items were sold, shipped, received, and positive feedback had been left for me.
So, I don't mess with the gift thing, as a rule. If I am providing goods and/or services to a stranger for money, that is a business transaction and I don't want to have to defend it as something else.
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No gift payments through Amazon--only payments for goods/services. Similar otherwise (but no fees, not sure if in all circumstances).
I really enjoy Amazon Payments, but it has it's drawbacks. For example, you can't buy shipping through Amazon like you can Paypal/eBay unless you have a merchant account with them and those aren't always the easiest to get. So to pay for shipping from the money you got, you'll have to withdraw the money, which is where you're hit with fees. Overall, it's nice, but there are some drawbacks with it.