There has to be something that could be done. It is really obvious when someone posts 60 posts in two days and then immediately puts up a thread then leaves as soon as they sell/buy or whatever.
I say make the entire classifieds a hidden forum that only members who have reached whatever milestones that are set can see.
The problem with a hidden forum is that some users who are sub-60 and brand new wouldn't be able to see items for sale, and thus wouldn't be able to buy those items via PM
The problem with a hidden forum is that some users who are sub-60 and brand new wouldn't be able to see items for sale, and thus wouldn't be able to buy those items via PM
I'm not so sure this is a bad thing. I'd rather sell the an established member of the community than someone who could run a paypal scam on me with nothing to lose. I'm not firm on the 3 months limit but I do think making it time based is a good idea.
Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/NhzdfBE.gif)
Maybe a second classifieds forum that is more restrictive?
"Double-secret Classifieds"
I agree change is necessary but I doubt anything will be done.
The classifieds is probably the biggest reason people come to geekhack.
And shill bids won't matter as soon as auctions are banned.
Bueller, how about 2 or 1 months? I remember 3 months in, I was pretty well off and involved with the classifieds..Idk where i would be if i was only allowed 3 months in.
I think 2 months is a better amount of timeThere has to be something that could be done. It is really obvious when someone posts 60 posts in two days and then immediately puts up a thread then leaves as soon as they sell/buy or whatever.
I say make the entire classifieds a hidden forum that only members who have reached whatever milestones that are set can see.
I wanted to address you spam in that old thread, but rowdy suggested that it would be taken here so I didn't want to drag it on :p
The problem with a hidden forum is that some users who are sub-60 and brand new wouldn't be able to see items for sale, and thus wouldn't be able to buy those items via PM
And sure it is obvious, but it still happens and not much really happens...
I mean this just happened todayShow Image(http://i.imgur.com/yIvSvOk.pngp)
credit to Photekq for screencap
First, what's wrong with loving Geekhack? I love it and thus I post.
Second, I have over twice the amount of posts needed to post in classifieds. I'm not "spamming" to get to 60.
Third, I haven't made a classifieds thread yet. I don't have anything to sell or buy. I am here to enjoy the keyboards and community.
Fourth, I would like to bring into attention dustinhxc. I remember seeing him getting 30ish posts on his first day. He now has 440 after 20 days, a 22 per day post count. Somebody even called him out on that, and no one batted an eye.
First, what's wrong with loving Geekhack? I love it and thus I post.
Second, I have over twice the amount of posts needed to post in classifieds. I'm not "spamming" to get to 60.
Third, I haven't made a classifieds thread yet. I don't have anything to sell or buy. I am here to enjoy the keyboards and community.
Fourth, I would like to bring into attention dustinhxc. I remember seeing him getting 30ish posts on his first day. He now has 440 after 20 days, a 22 per day post count. Somebody even called him out on that, and no one batted an eye.
I guess the screenshot was taken out of context to prove a point, but you have to admit that succession of posts is a bit extreme...
No personal attack at all, very clearly taken out of context ;D
I lurked here for quite a while before finally signing up.. I signed up because I wanted to buy something in the classifieds. I think it would be a shame to cut off new members from the classifieds, or have a second 'special' classified.
stahp with the personal attacks guize.
I respect the people who spam to 60 in order to post in classifieds, better than people who spam for no ****ing reason other than to do it...
I have no problem with users who post a lot if they are quality posts. But we see it all the time, they get super spammy and try and justify saying that they are making quality posts and what happens? As soon as they hit 60 it drops off to a snails pace.
So they're not posting to try and add something beneficial to the conversation, they're just trying to hit some arbitrary number.
I have no problem with users who post a lot if they are quality posts. But we see it all the time, they get super spammy and try and justify saying that they are making quality posts and what happens? As soon as they hit 60 it drops off to a snails pace.
So they're not posting to try and add something beneficial to the conversation, they're just trying to hit some arbitrary number.
The screenshot of me was taken today. I had way over 60 yesterday. I'm trying to add to the conversation, and I'm definitely not trying to hit some arbitrary number, and my posts aren't dropping off to a snail's pace, in fact you may even say its increasing, as I have learned more and thus can add more to the conversation.
I have no problem with users who post a lot if they are quality posts. But we see it all the time, they get super spammy and try and justify saying that they are making quality posts and what happens? As soon as they hit 60 it drops off to a snails pace.
So they're not posting to try and add something beneficial to the conversation, they're just trying to hit some arbitrary number.
The screenshot of me was taken today. I had way over 60 yesterday. I'm trying to add to the conversation, and I'm definitely not trying to hit some arbitrary number, and my posts aren't dropping off to a snail's pace, in fact you may even say its increasing, as I have learned more and thus can add more to the conversation.
LOL I just noticed the irony of this
I hope this wasn't intended...it's funny either way, but wow.....what a personal attack right there :))
Wow, stop trying to start **** nubsgalore.
stahp with the personal attacks guize.
I respect the people who spam to 60 in order to post in classifieds, better than people who spam for no ****ing reason other than to do it...
Bueller, how about 2 or 1 months? I remember 3 months in, I was pretty well off and involved with the classifieds..Idk where i would be if i was only allowed 3 months in.
I think 2 months is a better amount of timeThere has to be something that could be done. It is really obvious when someone posts 60 posts in two days and then immediately puts up a thread then leaves as soon as they sell/buy or whatever.
I say make the entire classifieds a hidden forum that only members who have reached whatever milestones that are set can see.
I wanted to address you spam in that old thread, but rowdy suggested that it would be taken here so I didn't want to drag it on :p
The problem with a hidden forum is that some users who are sub-60 and brand new wouldn't be able to see items for sale, and thus wouldn't be able to buy those items via PM
And sure it is obvious, but it still happens and not much really happens...
I mean this just happened todayShow Image(http://i.imgur.com/yIvSvOk.pngp)
credit to Photekq for screencap
First, what's wrong with loving Geekhack? I love it and thus I post.
Second, I have over twice the amount of posts needed to post in classifieds. I'm not "spamming" to get to 60.
Third, I haven't made a classifieds thread yet. I don't have anything to sell or buy. I am here to enjoy the keyboards and community.
Fourth, I would like to bring into attention dustinhxc. I remember seeing him getting 30ish posts on his first day. He now has 440 after 20 days, a 22 per day post count. Somebody even called him out on that, and no one batted an eye.
Fifth, look at John's thread: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=50991.0 . Its filled with people under 60 posts, yet they are actively buying items.
I have no problem with users who post a lot if they are quality posts. But we see it all the time, they get super spammy and try and justify saying that they are making quality posts and what happens? As soon as they hit 60 it drops off to a snails pace.
So they're not posting to try and add something beneficial to the conversation, they're just trying to hit some arbitrary number.
The screenshot of me was taken today. I had way over 60 yesterday. I'm trying to add to the conversation, and I'm definitely not trying to hit some arbitrary number, and my posts aren't dropping off to a snail's pace, in fact you may even say its increasing, as I have learned more and thus can add more to the conversation.
To be clear, the screenshot is from today, and he has well over 60, and he's not racing thus to 60. however it still is spam..
Just an example, whenever someone is racing to 60, it looks exactly like that, and they are usually short little replies that don't contribute much.
I'm relatively new here and I do have an impression that trades here are pretty safe. If we start seeing scams, the confidence will be shaken. I think we need to ensure that this is being taken care of considering the increasing popularity of mech keyboards.
The uniqueness of this trade is that the items are all pretty expensive. And with Clacks, people may claimed that it is lost in post. This is getting scary. A combo of time in board and post count is a good idea. But how much and how long is something the mods has to decide.
What about ratings of each individual? Do we even want to go to that path?
Bueller, how about 2 or 1 months? I remember 3 months in, I was pretty well off and involved with the classifieds..Idk where i would be if i was only allowed 3 months in.
I think 2 months is a better amount of timeThere has to be something that could be done. It is really obvious when someone posts 60 posts in two days and then immediately puts up a thread then leaves as soon as they sell/buy or whatever.
I say make the entire classifieds a hidden forum that only members who have reached whatever milestones that are set can see.
I wanted to address you spam in that old thread, but rowdy suggested that it would be taken here so I didn't want to drag it on :p
The problem with a hidden forum is that some users who are sub-60 and brand new wouldn't be able to see items for sale, and thus wouldn't be able to buy those items via PM
And sure it is obvious, but it still happens and not much really happens...
I mean this just happened todayShow Image(http://i.imgur.com/yIvSvOk.pngp)
credit to Photekq for screencap
First, what's wrong with loving Geekhack? I love it and thus I post.
Second, I have over twice the amount of posts needed to post in classifieds. I'm not "spamming" to get to 60.
Third, I haven't made a classifieds thread yet. I don't have anything to sell or buy. I am here to enjoy the keyboards and community.
Fourth, I would like to bring into attention dustinhxc. I remember seeing him getting 30ish posts on his first day. He now has 440 after 20 days, a 22 per day post count. Somebody even called him out on that, and no one batted an eye.
Fifth, look at John's thread: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=50991.0 . Its filled with people under 60 posts, yet they are actively buying items.
Lol dude I'm still hitting a 25 a day post average! Maybe because.... I love this forum and it's my new favorite place to spend time? Nothing wrong with enjoying a place! Ps people did give me **** at first! ;)
I do agree heatware would be helpful, I set mine up and need to get some reviews in it. It's scary trading so I have only done it with people that I've noticed are semi long time members.
I do agree heatware would be helpful, I set mine up and need to get some reviews in it. It's scary trading so I have only done it with people that I've noticed are semi long time members.
I dont even have heatware :)) Never understood the usefulness of it
I blame nubs for the fight about to break out, he mocked the message I was trying to portray. tsk tsk.
You were accusing me of personally attacking someone, when in the first place there wasn't any personal attack, and then at the same time you personally attacked someone, so I pointed out the irony. Ever since, you haven't dropped it and are becoming delusional now :P
I don't even know what you are talking about anymore, so I am done here Kirk
when you can no longer argue, pretend you have rustled the jimmies of the person you were arguing with. that way it seems as if you've won the argument. trust me, i'm 12 years old and i spend a lot of my time on the internet, i know about these things.
One big problem is people like Mickey Mo: http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=profile;u=30435
6 posts that count. 23 actual posts. A bunch are just hi hi hi hi hello. The rest are obviously irrelevant and make no sense.
I'm surprised he hasn't noticed that his post count is still 6.
when you can no longer argue, pretend you have rustled the jimmies of the person you were arguing with. that way it seems as if you've won the argument. trust me, i'm 12 years old and i spend a lot of my time on the internet, i know about these things.
you don't even know the 1/5th of it
Care to fill us in with the other 4/5th?
Care to fill us in with the other 4/5th?
http://webchat.freenode.net/?channels=geekhack
I think a combination of 30 posts and 1 month will suffice to take out all the people trying to abuse classifieds.
I think a combination of 30 posts and 1 month will suffice to take out all the people trying to abuse classifieds.
Yeah that sounds pretty good to me. Means users have a month to get their 30 posts which should cut down on some people's spammy nature too.
I think a combination of 30 posts and 1 month will suffice to take out all the people trying to abuse classifieds.
Yeah that sounds pretty good to me. Means users have a month to get their 30 posts which should cut down on some people's spammy nature too.
At one post a day its a good rationer.
I wanted to address you spam in that old thread, but rowdy suggested that it would be taken here so I didn't want to drag it on :p
The problem with a hidden forum is that some users who are sub-60 and brand new wouldn't be able to see items for sale, and thus wouldn't be able to buy those items via PM
I respect the people who spam to 60 in order to post in classifieds, better than people who spam for no ****ing reason other than to do it...
Once you start imposing too many restrictions, you will put people off from joining at all.
What about this captcha before every post for a while? I think this must have come in way after I joined, but it has frustrated quite a few people.
Throw one post per day (or whatever) on top, plus extra restrictions to classifieds, and we might miss out on some good people joining up and staying around.
EDIT: darn, double post ::)
EDIT: darn, double post ::)
Does that kinda prove the point? ;) :))
EDIT: darn, double post ::)
Does that kinda prove the point? ;) :))
I'm an overachiever, what can I say ;)
Don't derail this thread guys, I think it's a good conversation to have.
I don't have a sense for whether this is an actual problem, or merely something that _could_ be a problem. Like, how many 60-posters are there that sell something and then leave? And how many of the people that bought from them got burned?
On another forum I am a member of, there is a dedicated section with one post for each member, and when someone trades with that person they post in that thread describing how the sale/purchase went. Kinda like a Heatware but localised to that forum. Then if you want to buy something from someone, you can browse that thread to see how their previous trades went.
On another forum I am a member of, there is a dedicated section with one post for each member, and when someone trades with that person they post in that thread describing how the sale/purchase went. Kinda like a Heatware but localised to that forum. Then if you want to buy something from someone, you can browse that thread to see how their previous trades went.
We used to do that here, a couple of years ago. Then there was an integrated transaction score/history feature (which I think worked reallyw ell), but we lost it when we transitioned to SMF post-rootworm.
Since nobody seems to be using heatware very much, I would be up for trying the user review subforum again.
On another forum I am a member of, there is a dedicated section with one post for each member, and when someone trades with that person they post in that thread describing how the sale/purchase went. Kinda like a Heatware but localised to that forum. Then if you want to buy something from someone, you can browse that thread to see how their previous trades went.
We used to do that here, a couple of years ago. Then there was an integrated transaction score/history feature (which I think worked reallyw ell), but we lost it when we transitioned to SMF post-rootworm.
Since nobody seems to be using heatware very much, I would be up for trying the user review subforum again.
Newbie chiming in!
I'm trying not to spam to get to my 60 posts, but I also feel like 60 posts is high for someone new to the keyboard scene who wants to make meaningful posts.
Like if I already had a crazy amount of keyboard stuff I could imagine getting there sooner, but, alas, I do not have a ton of keyboard information or pictures that I want to share!
That and when I have a question, I use the search to find the answer rather than making a post about it.
In-fact, the only reason I did sign up was to use the advanced search feature. Once I found out I might be able to sell a keycap set/keyboard or buy a cool keycap set in the classifieds, I started working my way to 60 posts.
Even so, I was able to buy a set of DDR caps off of the classifieds with too-few posts ($6... lol).
I notice that the mechmarket reddit doesn't have any kind of rep limit, and I haven't heard of anyone scamming on there. Plus to make an account here is already more difficult.
Anyways, I guess my 2 cents is that 60 posts seems kinda high. I do like the idea of someone being an active member for some period of time (3 months seems reasonable)...
I think there should definitely be "private" sections of the forum, to keep out people who can't even be troubled to register an account. 4Grabs comes to mind...
And I agree with something like a 30-day, 30-post rule for classifieds. New members should try to introduce themselves, build some relationships, etc., before we go trusting them with our money/goods.
I think there should definitely be "private" sections of the forum, to keep out people who can't even be troubled to register an account. 4Grabs comes to mind...
And I agree with something like a 30-day, 30-post rule for classifieds. New members should try to introduce themselves, build some relationships, etc., before we go trusting them with our money/goods.
what about an approval process to be allowed to use the Classifieds. Maybe a Peer review sort of thing. The majority decides? This system has flaws as well but would promote building relationships with others on the forums.
I'm still a firm supporter of either 30 posts+1 month or 60 posts, with the mods giving extreme warnings to those obviously spamming their way to 60.
60 posts is fine as it is, prevents a lot of people who just come here to get a keyboard and leave.
30 posts+1 month is a better option.
But now I feel 60 posts+1 month is the best option because 1. it prevents spam from people doing 60 in a day
2. the 60 post thing hasn't severely affected people yet
3. The 1 month timeframe allows people to learn more about the forums and flourish their lives after 60
I'm still a firm supporter of either 30 posts+1 month or 60 posts, with the mods giving extreme warnings to those obviously spamming their way to 60.
60 posts is fine as it is, prevents a lot of people who just come here to get a keyboard and leave.
30 posts+1 month is a better option.
But now I feel 60 posts+1 month is the best option because 1. it prevents spam from people doing 60 in a day
2. the 60 post thing hasn't severely affected people yet
3. The 1 month timeframe allows people to learn more about the forums and flourish their lives after 60
Whats wrong with people coming and buying a board and leaving?
Its more likely for those that buy customs to stick around, coz its a lot of money to blow for kicks. also where do you think they'd sell it should they not want it anymore?
...back to GH...
how about increasing the post count requirement to 6000 for posting in the classifieds so that my friend Spamy has some competition ;D
how about increasing the post count requirement to 6000 for posting in the classifieds so that my friend Spamy has some competition ;D
FTFY :P
how about increasing the post count requirement to 6000 for posting in the classifieds so that my friend Spamy has some competition ;D
FTFY :P
how about increasing the post count requirement to 1000 for posting in the classifieds so that my friend Spamy has some competition ;D
Yea, why are less than 60 post people allowed to comment in classifieds, but not make their own post?
They can just look around the classifieds and abuse existing threads right now.
So at the very least, we should make classifieds hidden until a new person hits whatever requirement we ultimately decide
how about increasing the post count requirement to 6000 for posting in the classifieds so that my friend Spamy has some competition ;D
FTFY :P
you should start posting for me to get my post count up off one per day
how about increasing the post count requirement to 1000 for posting in the classifieds so that my friend Spamy has some competition ;D
Dang. I'll need another 9 months before I can even sell anything!Yea, why are less than 60 post people allowed to comment in classifieds, but not make their own post?
They can just look around the classifieds and abuse existing threads right now.
So at the very least, we should make classifieds hidden until a new person hits whatever requirement we ultimately decide
I'll throw in my opinion at this point. When I first joined GH, I bought something from someone in the classifieds when I had only 5 or 10 posts. I actually only joined GH mainly to participate in a group buy, and bought some keycaps to go along with it from a user in the classifieds. I didn't just bail, but instead became incredibly invested in the community and this hobby. Maybe I'm an exception, but I doubt it. Most people in this hobby enjoy showing their gear off and get a kick out of seeing everyone else's stuff. People rarely buy a set of keycaps for $80+ and just bail without becoming invested in the community.
Like I said, maybe I'm an exception. But I'm glad this rule didn't exist when I joined. I agree that new users shouldn't be able to create their own posts, but what's the harm in letting them buy stuff that others are selling? Maybe they'll get some cool stuff and stick around.
The bigger issue is the zero posters who join to shill bid in auctions.
The bigger issue is the zero posters who join to shill bid in auctions.
Mods should take care of that. If a user sees someone with really little posts doing something that looks a lot like shill bidding, then they should be at least muted.
how about increasing the post count requirement to 6000 for posting in the classifieds so that my friend Spamy has some competition ;D
FTFY :P
Two days and its over, there will be no competition to get to 6000
Anyway, the classifieds is supposed to be a service to members of the GH community. Someone who just joins, sells and departs is not really contributing to the community.
Similarly someone who joins, spams to 60, then buys or sells and then departs, the same.
If someone had to join, had to reach 60 posts, and had to do this over the period of, say, a month, would then more or less be a part of the community.
Classifieds should be restricted a bit further IMO. 60 posts required to even POST in the classifieds, and 100 posts to start a thread.
After reading much of this thread I find the same argument several times: that adding more restrictions will make people not want to join GH or will make people want to leave.
Can someone explain to me why this is a problem? If someone actually wants to be a decent, contributing member of this community they will put up with the added restrictions, for the sole purpose of contributing. And if they feel like it's not worth the effort, then they probably didn't have much to contribute in the first place...
Classifieds should be restricted a bit further IMO. 60 posts required to even POST in the classifieds, and 100 posts to start a thread.
But on the other hand, someone before touched on the fact that it may be hard for some people to even post meaningful comments when they are new to the world of mechanical keyboards. I feel for these people because even I felt as if I had nothing useful, or important to contribute to this community when I first joined. It is a little intimidating and some people are afraid of getting shot down if their posts aren't up to unwritten standards.
After reading much of this thread I find the same argument several times: that adding more restrictions will make people not want to join GH or will make people want to leave.
Can someone explain to me why this is a problem? If someone actually wants to be a decent, contributing member of this community they will put up with the added restrictions, for the sole purpose of contributing. And if they feel like it's not worth the effort, then they probably didn't have much to contribute in the first place...
Classifieds should be restricted a bit further IMO. 60 posts required to even POST in the classifieds, and 100 posts to start a thread.
I like this idea. Like a few people said before, people can post in the classifieds without having 60 posts. Buying is possible, and so is selling by PMing people who are looking for an item they have.
But on the other hand, someone before touched on the fact that it may be hard for some people to even post meaningful comments when they are new to the world of mechanical keyboards. I feel for these people because even I felt as if I had nothing useful, or important to contribute to this community when I first joined. It is a little intimidating and some people are afraid of getting shot down if their posts aren't up to unwritten standards.
After reading much of this thread I find the same argument several times: that adding more restrictions will make people not want to join GH or will make people want to leave.
Can someone explain to me why this is a problem? If someone actually wants to be a decent, contributing member of this community they will put up with the added restrictions, for the sole purpose of contributing. And if they feel like it's not worth the effort, then they probably didn't have much to contribute in the first place...
Classifieds should be restricted a bit further IMO. 60 posts required to even POST in the classifieds, and 100 posts to start a thread.
After reading much of this thread I find the same argument several times: that adding more restrictions will make people not want to join GH or will make people want to leave.
Can someone explain to me why this is a problem? If someone actually wants to be a decent, contributing member of this community they will put up with the added restrictions, for the sole purpose of contributing. And if they feel like it's not worth the effort, then they probably didn't have much to contribute in the first place...
Classifieds should be restricted a bit further IMO. 60 posts required to even POST in the classifieds, and 100 posts to start a thread.
I like this idea. Like a few people said before, people can post in the classifieds without having 60 posts. Buying is possible, and so is selling by PMing people who are looking for an item they have.
But on the other hand, someone before touched on the fact that it may be hard for some people to even post meaningful comments when they are new to the world of mechanical keyboards. I feel for these people because even I felt as if I had nothing useful, or important to contribute to this community when I first joined. It is a little intimidating and some people are afraid of getting shot down if their posts aren't up to unwritten standards.
You're a perfect example really, only been a member for 3 months and you've got over 200 posts.
^^ What I was saying is I'm not sure if the 'people in charge' will make any changes they think might keep traffic away, but I could be wrong.
^^ What I was saying is I'm not sure if the 'people in charge' will make any changes they think might keep traffic away, but I could be wrong.
But I don't see how this could possibly be a major issue. If that is the only thing the "people in charge" are worried about then they're obviously part of the problem (sorry admins).
Seriously though, if that's the case, and high traffic volume is the real goal of this forum, then this community will continue to be over-run by large numbers of low-posters who are here just to obtain goodies; all while contributing nothing but butthurt and debate among the true, devoted members of the community.
I am seriously hoping that this isn't the case and that the admins are willing to make changes that will benefit this community.
The priority of iMav and the rest of the staff is to have a cool place to collaborate on projects and discuss keyboards. I don't see numbers regularly (one of the other admins might know more) but my impression is that traffic is way up. That's a good thing but it's not our focus.
The priority of iMav and the rest of the staff is to have a cool place to collaborate on projects and discuss keyboards. I don't see numbers regularly (one of the other admins might know more) but my impression is that traffic is way up. That's a good thing but it's not our focus.
Well obviously we are getting a huge influx from reddit, where people here about the circus and have to come see if the bearded lady is hot or not, whether that is a good or bad thing remains unseen.
The priority of iMav and the rest of the staff is to have a cool place to collaborate on projects and discuss keyboards. I don't see numbers regularly (one of the other admins might know more) but my impression is that traffic is way up. That's a good thing but it's not our focus.
Well obviously we are getting a huge influx from reddit, where people here about the circus and have to come see if the bearded lady is hot or not, whether that is a good or bad thing remains unseen.
So Ripster is (still) part of the problem? Actually makes a lot of sense.
Also, does DT have similar issues? Or have they been isolated to GH?
The priority of iMav and the rest of the staff is to have a cool place to collaborate on projects and discuss keyboards. I don't see numbers regularly (one of the other admins might know more) but my impression is that traffic is way up. That's a good thing but it's not our focus.
Well obviously we are getting a huge influx from reddit, where people here about the circus and have to come see if the bearded lady is hot or not, whether that is a good or bad thing remains unseen.
So Ripster is (still) part of the problem? Actually makes a lot of sense.
Also, does DT have similar issues? Or have they been isolated to GH?
I don't think DT gets many noobs.
Why not make access to the Classifieds (and 4Grab events) the cost of a background check -- in order to get that access you pay GH a token amount, and your personal details are verified using a PayPal transaction. Every existing GH member in good standing is grandfathered in. This would:
1. Give GH some additional operating funds. This is a good place, a success -- successes deserve to be funded.
2. A 13-year-old dunce who just wants a Clack won't be able to have a Paypal account for verification purposes. Sorry, kid.
3. An adult with a genuine interest in buying their first mechanical keyboard won't mind paying a token amount to do so in confidence.
4. People who just want to talk about keyboards as opposed to buying/selling still can at no cost.
5. If the buying and selling does generate some amount of unrest, at least that unrest will be offset by the additional funds.
Again, to be clear: grandfather in the existing members. That means someone who has been here for a year contributing to the discussion doesn't have to pay -- only new members who insist on access to the Classifieds. This would also keep 4Grabs events within the GH family. So if the Paypal donation is $3, and 300 people register two days before the 4Grabs, well, that's a nice chunk of change for the site. That will help a lot of Groupbuys, a lot of worthwhile projects. That kind of money funds forum and server upgrades. So someone who's been lurking can register, have no posts, but be verified as having a valid PayPal account, and immediately participate in the Classifieds. And if there's a fraud issue, lack of payment, etc. -- let PayPal handle it.
As things are now, 4Grabs events are like free lottery tickets -- why should they be free? Access to the Classifieds is also very nearly free -- why should that be?
No offence, but putting a price on the ability to post in the classifieds is just a horrible idea. Admins are already skeptical of implementing too harsh of a restriction on the classifieds, but I think charging people for it just puts it over the top.
And how would this change anything? Not all newbies are kids, so they'd be more than willing to pay the $3 for classifieds posting rights, and then we're right back where we started. Except with more money for GH (the only good thing about this idea).
No offence, but putting a price on the ability to post in the classifieds is just a horrible idea. Admins are already skeptical of implementing too harsh of a restriction on the classifieds, but I think charging people for it just puts it over the top.
Is a $2-$3 PayPal confirmation really so harsh? Would it cut down on the new members? Only the ones that are here solely (possibly) for the free lottery tickets (4Grabs), and shill bidding. People who just want to talk about their projects, about keyboards, etc. -- nothing changes. They can still lurk, they can register when they're ready; they can contribute to projects, discussions. At their discretion they can decide to take the plunge and purchase access to the Classifieds, or be gifted access, or make the donation out of pure goodwill. GH is well worth a $2-$3 donation that not only supports the forum but decreases the likelihood of fraud.Quote from: C-L-i-BAnd how would this change anything? Not all newbies are kids, so they'd be more than willing to pay the $3 for classifieds posting rights, and then we're right back where we started. Except with more money for GH (the only good thing about this idea).
As Ray correctly pointed out, it's not a perfect solution. There can still be some fraud, in any system. There will still be punks with daddy or mommy's credit card, or a stolen card, etc. -- but it would reduce the likelihood of fraud by at least some degree. So if 300 new members would normally join in preparation for a 4Grabs, or access to the Classifieds, and they immediately begin posting crap in order to make the post threshhold -- under my proposal most would say screw it (200 of them?) and the other 100 would pay. That's 200x50+ useless posts we don't have to store and serve up and scroll past. And some useful funds in the process, and 100 new users who are verified/validated.
Then that money can go towards projects, forum upgrades, etc. -- which would likely only drive the success of the forum further.
I agree that any system will have it's flaws, but I feel that the one you are proposing makes it too easy for new members to "buy in" and be able to use the classifieds without restriction. A time/post restriction is easier to implement and much more efficient at deterring shill bidders, profiteers, and newbs who are here just for Clack sales.
I agree that any system will have it's flaws, but I feel that the one you are proposing makes it too easy for new members to "buy in" and be able to use the classifieds without restriction. A time/post restriction is easier to implement and much more efficient at deterring shill bidders, profiteers, and newbs who are here just for Clack sales.
They wouldn't be completely anonymous anymore, at the very least. What I notice is that the profile of a "good" GH user is exactly the sort who won't make 60 useless posts. Why should they have to wait months, patiently waiting for a chance to make useful posts while less scrupulous members just make 60 useless posts in 4 weeks, and then they get to participate more fully than the "better" user?
I agree fully with you CLiB, that a time/post restriction is far, far easier to implement. I don't think it is more efficient at deterring the "problem" or less desired users and the behavior they bring. There's a reason companies announce "this phone call will be recorded for training purposes" -- once someone knows they will not be completely anonymous, that there will be some concrete record of their behavior, the bad behavior is more likely to stop.
Oh, and the extra money for GH. There's that too. :thumb:
But how will charging to open the classifieds for new members make them less anonymous? It's not like the mods/admins have the legal basis to release their personal information (i.e. PayPal account info) to the public, so they're just as anonymous to us as they would have been before.
The only people who they wouldn't be anonymous to would be the mods/admins.
And now that I think about it, mods already have the power to stop people from spamming their way to 60 posts. It's called MODERATING! If they notice a new member that is blatantly spamming their way to 60 posts, they can simply delete the spam, their post count is reduced, and they have to actually post something worth while.
And if the typical "good" new GH user isn't trying to get their 60 posts as fast as possible, then isn't it obvious that they aren't here just for the classifieds and are perfectly content to wait it out until they reach that milestone?
It seems that shill bidding is a real threat, but that's really easy to moderate. Heck, the person running the auction could just put in the OP "ignore all bids by users with under 60 posts". And if you don't feel comfortable selling to someone with under 60 posts, just don't do it.
Newbie chiming in!Then learn about the keyboard scene. Get involved in the community. It isn't particularly tough.
I'm trying not to spam to get to my 60 posts, but I also feel like 60 posts is high for someone new to the keyboard scene who wants to make meaningful posts.
Like if I already had a crazy amount of keyboard stuff I could imagine getting there sooner, but, alas, I do not have a ton of keyboard information or pictures that I want to share!
That and when I have a question, I use the search to find the answer rather than making a post about it.
In-fact, the only reason I did sign up was to use the advanced search feature. Once I found out I might be able to sell a keycap set/keyboard or buy a cool keycap set in the classifieds, I started working my way to 60 posts.
Even so, I was able to buy a set of DDR caps off of the classifieds with too-few posts ($6... lol).
I notice that the mechmarket reddit doesn't have any kind of rep limit, and I haven't heard of anyone scamming on there. Plus to make an account here is already more difficult.
Anyways, I guess my 2 cents is that 60 posts seems kinda high. I do like the idea of someone being an active member for some period of time (3 months seems reasonable)...
It seems that shill bidding is a real threat, but that's really easy to moderate. Heck, the person running the auction could just put in the OP "ignore all bids by users with under 60 posts". And if you don't feel comfortable selling to someone with under 60 posts, just don't do it.
I guess I was thinking the shill bidding might be from the person running the auction :eek:
I don't understand why some people are so against even a 30 day restriction on the classifieds. Are people really in that much of a hurry to buy stuff? People have no patience these days.I want it to be 90 days.
I don't understand why some people are so against even a 30 day restriction on the classifieds. Are people really in that much of a hurry to buy stuff? People have no patience these days.I want it to be 90 days.
From the point of view of someone who's been here for about a year (can't remember exactly) but doesn't post all that often:
What is wrong with the 30 posts +1 month for access to the classifieds idea? I like geekhack, the people here seem nice and the things that get achieved in making stuff (I'm amazed by how quickly things go from concept to working prototype here) and the stuff that gets put through IC and GB is often incredible - these aspects of the forum were what made me join, rather than lurking. I don't really understand all the talk of "turning away new members because of too many restrictions". Surely, it would be better to have a forum made of members who stuck around for a month before even considering buying things from the classifieds than one that exists purely as a market place where they can pick up things that are hard to find on eBay?
Fair enough if there have been plenty of successful sales to low post count people, that's nice but envision a scenario where you need 30 posts/1 month to even see the classifieds: "Dear <<new poster>>, you have now hit 30 posts and 1 month membership of the forum meaning you now have access to the classifieds section of the forum, congrats and welcome to geekhack."
"Ooh, I wonder what they have for sale there."
*checks classifieds, realises they missed a sale of a poker 2 for $80*
Now, after <<new poster>> has been here a month and contributed 30 posts, are they going to rage-quit because they missed a good deal? Not likely, they'll hang around for the reason they joined the forum in the first place and in future, maybe buy something in the classifieds. As for selling, no idea, I have nothing to sell so haven't thought about it.
Anyway, to close. I think what people need to think about is this: Do you want geekhack to be a marketplace where invisible, nameless people come to buy your stuff OR do you want it to be a community where you sell things to people you know (or are at least vaguely aware of their existence) while discussing things you enjoy?
Anyway, to close. I think what people need to think about is this: Do you want geekhack to be a marketplace where invisible, nameless people come to buy your stuff OR do you want it to be a community where you sell things to people you know (or are at least vaguely aware of their existence) while discussing things you enjoy?
Just found a loophole with the 30 day 30 post theoryShow Image(http://i.imgur.com/sNfBGW5.png)
http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=profile;u=23673
This person has been here since 2012, but hasn't really posted until now. Now they're just spamming the same copy pasted thing into the classifieds, most likely to get to 60
Just found a loophole with the 30 day 30 post theoryShow Image(http://i.imgur.com/sNfBGW5.png)
http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=profile;u=23673
This person has been here since 2012, but hasn't really posted until now. Now they're just spamming the same copy pasted thing into the classifieds, most likely to get to 60
Just found a loophole with the 30 day 30 post theoryShow Image(http://i.imgur.com/sNfBGW5.png)
http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=profile;u=23673
This person has been here since 2012, but hasn't really posted until now. Now they're just spamming the same copy pasted thing into the classifieds, most likely to get to 60
Let em keep it up, classifieds posts don't count anyways hahaha :P
Just found a loophole with the 30 day 30 post theoryShow Image(http://i.imgur.com/sNfBGW5.png)
http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=profile;u=23673
This person has been here since 2012, but hasn't really posted until now. Now they're just spamming the same copy pasted thing into the classifieds, most likely to get to 60
Let em keep it up, classifieds posts don't count anyways hahaha :P
Just found a loophole with the 30 day 30 post theoryShow Image(http://i.imgur.com/sNfBGW5.png)
http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=profile;u=23673
This person has been here since 2012, but hasn't really posted until now. Now they're just spamming the same copy pasted thing into the classifieds, most likely to get to 60
Let em keep it up, classifieds posts don't count anyways hahaha :P
hahaha maybe he is really nice and wishing every single seller a good Sale. :P lmao
That fool has been dealth with.Show Image(http://uncoolghoul.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/burns.gif)
Just found a loophole with the 30 day 30 post theoryShow Image(http://i.imgur.com/sNfBGW5.png)
http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=profile;u=23673
This person has been here since 2012, but hasn't really posted until now. Now they're just spamming the same copy pasted thing into the classifieds, most likely to get to 60
Let em keep it up, classifieds posts don't count anyways hahaha :P
hahaha maybe he is really nice and wishing every single seller a good Sale. :P lmao
It's possible but posting the same canned response?
I am not long in GH. Started in Sept 2013. But I remember the first two months - Sept/Oct, there were some really good discussion when I go to "Unread". These days, "Unread" are dominated mainly by classified posts. Is GH turning into craiglist? Ha ha .. I am not sure if it's fun to shift through all these classifieds. Is there an easier way to read the threads? What's the difference between Unread and Spy?
Do you mean Spy is auto refresh? Let me go check...
Spy updates automatically and updates everything. Unread shows everything you haven't looked at that has new posts in them. Most people use spy but I prefer unread
What about me guys? I've been lurking for almost 3 years. Someone sell me some posts.
Do you mean Spy is auto refresh? Let me go check...
Spy updates automatically and updates everything. Unread shows everything you haven't looked at that has new posts in them. Most people use spy but I prefer unread
EDIT: wow, Spy does auto refresh, which is pretty cool - meaning if you have a dual monitor set up you can see what's happening on the second screen. Although, one irritation is that when you click on an updated post, it goes to page number 1 instead of the last read page.
Edit: I am an idiot. Click on the icon on the first column of Spy and it brings you to last unread post.
What about me guys? I've been lurking for almost 3 years. Someone sell me some posts.
I seriously think we should make the classifieds invisible to any lurkers and anyone without the current 60 post minimum. They should show that they are interested in GeekHack and want to stay here and be a member before they touch any money. This way people just don't sign up to use the classifieds and just leave.
Currently people without 60 posts can comment in classifieds and can look at them, but not make their own thread. I don't see a point of letting them comment in classifieds if they can't even make their own thread because they can still buy and sell things through comment or PM on other people's threads. And thus letting them comment on classifieds just bypasses the 60 post rule in a sense.
In addition, they can still conduct trades via PM. The only way to guarantee that someone comes to GH for the community and forums instead of the classifieds is if they can't even see the classifieds. They can see them once they get their 60 and show that they are here for the community, but before that, there is no reason for them to be there.
Now to a newbie they might think they missed out on some awesome sale, but if they invest their time into GH and become part of the community, they will still be here when the next bigger sale pops up. This system just makes the community stronger. There are many more forums they can go on to see keyboard content, and if they need to buy something, they can join a group buy or buy from our vendors.
We shouldn't be here just for the classifieds. New people shouldn't come here for the classifieds. We are here as a community, and to ensure that more people join us and don't flake off is to make classifieds 100% off limits until they have proven that they are a member of the community.
I seriously think we should make the classifieds invisible to any lurkers and anyone without the current 60 post minimum. They should show that they are interested in GeekHack and want to stay here and be a member before they touch any money. This way people just don't sign up to use the classifieds and just leave.
Currently people without 60 posts can comment in classifieds and can look at them, but not make their own thread. I don't see a point of letting them comment in classifieds if they can't even make their own thread because they can still buy and sell things through comment or PM on other people's threads. And thus letting them comment on classifieds just bypasses the 60 post rule in a sense.
In addition, they can still conduct trades via PM. The only way to guarantee that someone comes to GH for the community and forums instead of the classifieds is if they can't even see the classifieds. They can see them once they get their 60 and show that they are here for the community, but before that, there is no reason for them to be there.
Now to a newbie they might think they missed out on some awesome sale, but if they invest their time into GH and become part of the community, they will still be here when the next bigger sale pops up. This system just makes the community stronger. There are many more forums they can go on to see keyboard content, and if they need to buy something, they can join a group buy or buy from our vendors.
We shouldn't be here just for the classifieds. New people shouldn't come here for the classifieds. We are here as a community, and to ensure that more people join us and don't flake off is to make classifieds 100% off limits until they have proven that they are a member of the community.
Kid, please, shut up. You've been here 3 months. There is nothing wrong with letting people see and post in classifieds. Just because some new guy is trying to get free **** doesn't mean that everyone under 60 posts is a douchebag scammer.
Just because someone comes here asking for stuff, doesn't mean everyone will come to their aid and they will be showered with a thousand clacks, if someone just want's a wasd set to make their new keyboard look unique, and someone is willing to give it to him, how does that even remotely concern you. If he takes the wasd and runs, who cares.
60 posts also doesn't help **** with if someone will really stick around and contribute the community. I could easily spam to 60 posts in 24 hours and make each one look somewhat legitimate, does that mean I'll stick with that account? **** no.
Look I understand you've been on the internet since the 5th grade, but that doesn't mean you know how to conduct yourself.
So I'm asking you, please, shut the **** up.
nice use of language
So I'm asking you, please, shut the **** up.
Kid, please, shut up. You've been here 3 months. There is nothing wrong with letting people see and post in classifieds. Just because some new guy is trying to get free **** doesn't mean that everyone under 60 posts is a douchebag scammer.
Just because someone comes here asking for stuff, doesn't mean everyone will come to their aid and they will be showered with a thousand clacks, if someone just want's a wasd set to make their new keyboard look unique, and someone is willing to give it to him, how does that even remotely concern you. If he takes the wasd and runs, who cares.
60 posts also doesn't help **** with if someone will really stick around and contribute the community. I could easily spam to 60 posts in 24 hours and make each one look somewhat legitimate, does that mean I'll stick with that account? **** no.
This applies to all parts of classifieds. From what I've read on this thread, people have come just for classifieds.
Hell, we even have a bad rap from reddit and KBDmania for our outrageous clack prices. While the clack prices have been made primarily by deep people in the community, people who don't understand the context blow it out of hand.
People can put their money wherever they want. But giving it to bad causes just further supports those bad people from doing what they do.
For example, after disasters, there are a plethora of people scamming donations to the people in trouble.
It may not directly affect me, but its pretty immoral and continuing to allow it just breeds a further bad rap for GH
Which is also why I support the 30 day 30 post requirement, it solves it more. We can't 100% prevent abuse, but we can try to discourage it as much as we can.
yes, because people with 4 posts are the ones driving clack prices, certainly not the people who've been here the longest looking for specific items. Clack prices have absolutely nothing with you wanting to hate new people. Which is ironic since you've been here 3 months.
Yes I'm sure, those *******s on geekhack, giving out stuff for free, everyone go make new accounts and ask for wasd sets, that'll show them! If a $6 wasd set really means that much to someone, they probably shouldn't be giving it out for free.
Which is also why I support the 30 day 30 post requirement, it solves it more. We can't 100% prevent abuse, but we can try to discourage it as much as we can.
Sitting on something for a month before trying to sell it isn't exactly discouraging, maybe we should only let certain people sell things after they've been here a minimum 18 months. zzz
Seriously dude, I don't know what kind of white-knight powertrip you're on, but just let it go. GH has been fine the last 4 years without having someone yell at people every 20 minutes.
Just a suggestion, I am a new member over on 405th.com (forum relating to spartan (Halo) Armour creations) and I joined for the information, and the pictures and the community of people who had similar interests to myself. What I have discovered is that after you hit 100 posts the classified section becomes viewable.I like that honestly. A lot of people think GH has become just a classifieds site. I would rather have one member who is a contributing part of the community than 100 members who are just here for classifieds.
I didn't even know there was a classified section, it was a nice surprise. I can now buy cool things on that forum which I wasn't aware of before. It works out quite well.
Again it all depends if it was Ceteris Paribus then it would work. But this is a different site so things will always ahve variables.
They also have way less users ;)
Just a suggestion, I am a new member over on 405th.com (forum relating to spartan (Halo) Armour creations) and I joined for the information, and the pictures and the community of people who had similar interests to myself. What I have discovered is that after you hit 100 posts the classified section becomes viewable.I like that honestly. A lot of people think GH has become just a classifieds site. I would rather have one member who is a contributing part of the community than 100 members who are just here for classifieds.
I didn't even know there was a classified section, it was a nice surprise. I can now buy cool things on that forum which I wasn't aware of before. It works out quite well.
Again it all depends if it was Ceteris Paribus then it would work. But this is a different site so things will always ahve variables.