geekhack
geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: bondonin on Sat, 30 November 2013, 22:58:16
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I came across this http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=35447.msg658492#msg658492 (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=35447.msg658492#msg658492) which said:
"no, he said even if they had the same switches. mionix and steelseries uses the same switch (black)
lots of people are ignorant to the fact that the type of mount can affect different switches very much. plate mounted blacks for example are much, much harder to press down than PCB mounted blacks that feel almost like reds.
razer black widow (plastic mounted blues) are also lighter than plate mounted browns."
Do plates make such a difference in pressure?
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No they don't.
But I like the feeling when jiggling a switch that it doesn't move.
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I do think plate mount versus PCB mount have a different feel, I would not describe it as described in the OP however.
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It depends on how sensitive you are to slight differences. An audiophile can tell the difference between two headsets even though the average person could barely even identify that there is a difference (if at all). It's similar with keyboards.
It comes down to what you can notice and what your preference is.
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One big thing you will definitely notice is a huge difference when you start removing key caps.
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They differ in feeling. You should consider plate mounted switches will be always more rigid because the switches are hold by their bodies and bases, while PCB mounted are hold by the base and just keep in place by two pass through pins only.
Also the plate material will make a difference. If it is a metal plate the rigidity of the overall assembly, that you will actually be pushing your fingers on, will be a more firm structure.
I have a PCB mounted Poker and a plate mounted Leopold. The last feel more firm and solid, of course.
The switch type will come second, in my opinion, to the plate+switch or PCB+switch foundation. At the end the force, if you bottom down, will stop against the foundation. However if you are a soft writer that does not bottom down the difference in both will be minimal.
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One big thing you will definitely notice is a huge difference when you start removing key caps.
First time removing PCB mounted caps, I almost pulled the switch out instead of the cap. Luckily I figured out what I was doing wrong before I pulled an entire switch out of the PCB
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One big thing you will definitely notice is a huge difference when you start removing key caps.
First time removing PCB mounted caps, I almost pulled the switch out instead of the cap. Luckily I figured out what I was doing wrong before I pulled an entire switch out of the PCB
You need to reduce your chi.
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Also the plate material will make a difference. If it is a metal plate the rigidity of the overall assembly, that you will actually be pushing your fingers on, will be a more firm structure.
+1 and the sound will be quite different too.
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I notice a big difference personally. I think plates make the feeling more 'dead' but many others choose to describe this as 'solid'. PCB mount allows switch feeling personality to come through more and notice the subtleties. PCB mount feeling is more natural to me, with a softer typing experience. Plates also make switches more noisy as they often echo the springs when top out. Even more so with clicky switch amplify the noise they make and seem to give them a more annoying pitch.
I'm always wishing there was more choices for PCB mount. For now I am still mostly content with my GH60 and Cherry G80 models.
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Even different batches of the same keyboard can be different, due to inconsistency in switches themselves. Therefore, I wouldn't be so quick to jump to any conclusions, even though case construction and plate certainly do matter.
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It depends on how sensitive you are to slight differences. An audiophile can tell the difference between two headsets even though the average person could barely even identify that there is a difference (if at all). It's similar with keyboards.
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When did the discussion turn to minute differences?
I thought my OP was clear that it was about pressure (how hard to press the keys down) because someone in the past asserted that blacks will feel nearly like reds without plate mounting and nobody replied to that post so I assumed either everyone agreed or perhaps they didn't see that post.
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It depends on how sensitive you are to slight differences. An audiophile can tell the difference between two headsets even though the average person could barely even identify that there is a difference (if at all). It's similar with keyboards.
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When did the discussion turn to minute differences?
I thought my OP was clear that it was about pressure (how hard to press the keys down) because someone in the past asserted that blacks will feel nearly like reds without plate mounting and nobody replied to that post so I assumed either everyone agreed or perhaps they didn't see that post.
you title asks in general how do plates change the feel, but in the op you asked the question of pressure which is different from the title
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It depends on how sensitive you are to slight differences. An audiophile can tell the difference between two headsets even though the average person could barely even identify that there is a difference (if at all). It's similar with keyboards.
....
When did the discussion turn to minute differences?
I thought my OP was clear that it was about pressure (how hard to press the keys down) because someone in the past asserted that blacks will feel nearly like reds without plate mounting and nobody replied to that post so I assumed either everyone agreed or perhaps they didn't see that post.
Looking at that post, I suppose I was responding more to the title of the thread than to the OP. I have not tried blacks on both PCB and plate mount, so I cannot properly answer your OP, however, from what I have felt in blues, there isn't a weight difference unless you bottom out. When you hit the bottom on a PCB mount, there's a small bit of give. On a plate mount, it's solid. I've also noticed that different cases can also effect how the switches feel, but that may be getting off topic.
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This weekend I tried a CM Storm QFR and XT at Fry's - both with MX Blues. The switches on the XT felt ever so slightly more crisp.
Plate thickness? Switch batch? I don't know. If it's within your power try to purchase a board you can test first.
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This weekend I tried a CM Storm QFR and XT at Fry's - both with MX Blues. The switches on the XT felt ever so slightly more crisp.
Plate thickness? Switch batch? I don't know. If it's within your power try to purchase a board you can test first.
Maybe because the XT is more new than the QFR?
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It depends on how sensitive your fingers are. Yes, they do.
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This weekend I tried a CM Storm QFR and XT at Fry's - both with MX Blues. The switches on the XT felt ever so slightly more crisp.
Plate thickness? Switch batch? I don't know. If it's within your power try to purchase a board you can test first.
Maybe because the XT is more new than the QFR?
I opened up both keyboards out of the box at the store. Fry's seems to want you to spend $90+ on some of these without any testing.
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This weekend I tried a CM Storm QFR and XT at Fry's - both with MX Blues. The switches on the XT felt ever so slightly more crisp.
Plate thickness? Switch batch? I don't know. If it's within your power try to purchase a board you can test first.
Maybe because the XT is more new than the QFR?
I opened up both keyboards out of the box at the store. Fry's seems to want you to spend $90+ on some of these without any testing.
Should be due to batch. QFR has a steel plate just like a Filco TKL, and I'd safely assume that if the XT is built in the same factory as it's QFR brother (and Filco cousins), the plate design in that should be very similar to a fullsize Filco. To quote the CM site: "Exhibiting the same extremely solid construction that won the hearts of QuickFire Rapid owners..."
The case you are describing ideally shows the variance between switch batches, something people definitely notice on the clicky family of Cherry: Green/Blue/White. You're not just relying on the manufacturing tolerances of fitting the stem inside the switch, but also mating the slider to the stems.