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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: 1pq on Sun, 29 December 2013, 00:49:07
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Just got a batch of new clears. Although I haven't installed them on my board, once I get my soldering equipment I'm going swap the stems with my filco (currently mx blues). I was planning to lube them, but I've heard lubing mx switches can affect their break-in time. Can anyone verify this? Should I type on the ergo clears for >1 month to break them in before lubing them? I'm installing a plate that allows taking the switch top off, so that wouldn't be a problem.
Any advice?
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Just got a batch of new clears. Although I haven't installed them on my board, once I get my soldering equipment I'm going swap the stems with my filco (currently mx blues). I was planning to lube them, but I've heard lubing mx switches can affect their break-in time. Can anyone verify this? Should I type on the ergo clears for >1 month to break them in before lubing them? I'm installing a plate that allows taking the switch top off, so that wouldn't be a problem.
Any advice?
use it for a YEAR, before you lube for maximum smoothness..
If you consistently play typing games for 30mins per day... you may consider lubing in 4-6 months...
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That ^
They need friction to wear them smoother. Lubing them will decrease the friction and will lessen the wear.
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Try your Clears as single switches: do you feel any grittiness/friction pressing on a switch? If they are fairly smooth to start with, I think you can lube right away. I have a super gritty MX Red switch in my CM switch tester, and if I had to use switches like that, I'd definitely give them a month or two of use without any lubricants. Clears I've tried from a few batches have been fairly smooth vs. Some particularly gritty batches of linear switches and Browns. I'm guessing you'll be ok to lube your Clears right away.
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use it for a YEAR, before you lube for maximum smoothness..
:(
Try your Clears as single switches: do you feel any grittiness/friction pressing on a switch? If they are fairly smooth to start with, I think you can lube right away. I have a super gritty MX Red switch in my CM switch tester, and if I had to use switches like that, I'd definitely give them a month or two of use without any lubricants. Clears I've tried from a few batches have been fairly smooth vs. Some particularly gritty batches of linear switches and Browns. I'm guessing you'll be ok to lube your Clears right away.
No, the clears are not gritty at all. I obsessively actuated one in particular (I'd say a couple hundred times) just to see the immediate difference in smoothness. The tactile bump feels a bit nicer, a bit smoother, but in general they don't really feel gritty at all.
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Also, in this lubing video, DanGWanG does not lube the part of the switch with the physical bump (that wears down after use). If I lube using this method, the smoothness is just from eliminating extra friction from the sliders/other moving parts, correct?
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bump
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You don't need to bump your own threads, especially after such a short time.
See this video
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You don't need to bump your own threads, especially after such a short time.
See this video
I bumped it because it was already getting buried.
Did you read my original post? And the first few responses? I don't think you understand my question. I'm not just trying to understand how to lube switches.
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I bumped it because it was already getting buried.
Did you read my original post? And the first few responses? I don't think you understand my question. I'm not just trying to understand how to lube switches.
I have and I understand your question perfectly well--have you seen my first reply? :rolleyes: We have a sticky for a thread about switch lubrication and related--you can post there.
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I have ergo clears right now. I typed on the stock clears for about 2 weeks before switching to lubed ergo clears. I wasn't thinking so much about wearing them in, but instead that I wanted to see what clears felt like before switching to ergo clears.
I'm sure they're not maximally worn in now that they're already lubed, but I'm having trouble imagining the world in which I can tell the difference; they're exceptionally smooth.
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I have ergo clears right now. I typed on the stock clears for about 2 weeks before switching to lubed ergo clears. I wasn't thinking so much about wearing them in, but instead that I wanted to see what clears felt like before switching to ergo clears.
I'm sure they're not maximally worn in now that they're already lubed, but I'm having trouble imagining the world in which I can tell the difference; they're exceptionally smooth.
Good to know. Thanks! How long have you had these lubed ergos?
Also, did you lube everything (like in WFD's video) or did you lube just the sliders/spring location (as in Dan's video)?
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Lube what you feel is necessary, a lot of people don't even lube their switches. I think lubing is probably a huge hassle to do, and is really only necessary on ergo clears if you are using 62g springs or below.
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Lube what you feel is necessary, a lot of people don't even lube their switches. I think lubing is probably a huge hassle to do, and is really only necessary on ergo clears if you are using 62g springs or below.
A lot of people don't lube their switches. I've been spoiled by topre though, I can't handle the scratchiness of unlubed MXes :P
I'm also using stock springs from a mx blue board, so I may need to lubricate in order to get proper switch returns.
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I have ergo clears right now. I typed on the stock clears for about 2 weeks before switching to lubed ergo clears. I wasn't thinking so much about wearing them in, but instead that I wanted to see what clears felt like before switching to ergo clears.
I'm sure they're not maximally worn in now that they're already lubed, but I'm having trouble imagining the world in which I can tell the difference; they're exceptionally smooth.
Good to know. Thanks! How long have you had these lubed ergos?
Also, did you lube everything (like in WFD's video) or did you lube just the sliders/spring location (as in Dan's video)?
I've only had the ergos for a bit more than a month, I'd think. As far as lubing locations go, it was more like Dan's video. I lubed the springs with Victorinox multi-tool oil and the sliders/stems with a Krytox GPL 103/205 mix.
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I have ergo clears right now. I typed on the stock clears for about 2 weeks before switching to lubed ergo clears. I wasn't thinking so much about wearing them in, but instead that I wanted to see what clears felt like before switching to ergo clears.
I'm sure they're not maximally worn in now that they're already lubed, but I'm having trouble imagining the world in which I can tell the difference; they're exceptionally smooth.
Good to know. Thanks! How long have you had these lubed ergos?
Also, did you lube everything (like in WFD's video) or did you lube just the sliders/spring location (as in Dan's video)?
I've only had the ergos for a bit more than a month, I'd think. As far as lubing locations go, it was more like Dan's video. I lubed the springs with Victorinox multi-tool oil and the sliders/stems with a Krytox GPL 103/205 mix.
See, if you did it using Dan's method, you didn't lube the bump at all, so you should still be wearing it down, making it smoother...I think. I'd just be curious of tp4 or PointyFox have anything to say about that.
How do you like the feel of lubed ergo clears? Supposed to be god-tier for mx :P
I hope it will get as much use as my topre boards since I'm spending so much time modding it haha
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See, if you did it using Dan's method, you didn't lube the bump at all, so you should still be wearing it down, making it smoother...I think. I'd just be curious of tp4 or PointyFox have anything to say about that.
How do you like the feel of lubed ergo clears? Supposed to be god-tier for mx :P
I hope it will get as much use as my topre boards since I'm spending so much time modding it haha
Sorry, I didn't watch the video all the way through. I did lube the bump.
I love my ergo clears. 67g, so a bit heavier than usual (nubbinator's excitement for 67g convinced me), but still very smooth and pleasant.
I'm trying ergo whites next, which is a bit of an experiment and is not, to my knowledge, something commonly done. We'll see how they hold up compared to ergo clears.
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See, if you did it using Dan's method, you didn't lube the bump at all, so you should still be wearing it down, making it smoother...I think. I'd just be curious of tp4 or PointyFox have anything to say about that.
How do you like the feel of lubed ergo clears? Supposed to be god-tier for mx :P
I hope it will get as much use as my topre boards since I'm spending so much time modding it haha
Sorry, I didn't watch the video all the way through. I did lube the bump.
I love my ergo clears. 67g, so a bit heavier than usual (nubbinator's excitement for 67g convinced me), but still very smooth and pleasant.
I'm trying ergo whites next, which is a bit of an experiment and is not, to my knowledge, something commonly done. We'll see how they hold up compared to ergo clears.
How does the tactility of the 67g clears compare to 62g and stock springs?
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See, if you did it using Dan's method, you didn't lube the bump at all, so you should still be wearing it down, making it smoother...I think. I'd just be curious of tp4 or PointyFox have anything to say about that.
How do you like the feel of lubed ergo clears? Supposed to be god-tier for mx :P
I hope it will get as much use as my topre boards since I'm spending so much time modding it haha
Sorry, I didn't watch the video all the way through. I did lube the bump.
I love my ergo clears. 67g, so a bit heavier than usual (nubbinator's excitement for 67g convinced me), but still very smooth and pleasant.
I'm trying ergo whites next, which is a bit of an experiment and is not, to my knowledge, something commonly done. We'll see how they hold up compared to ergo clears.
How does the tactility of the 67g clears compare to 62g and stock springs?
I think that the stock springs and the 67g springs should feel the same
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See, if you did it using Dan's method, you didn't lube the bump at all, so you should still be wearing it down, making it smoother...I think. I'd just be curious of tp4 or PointyFox have anything to say about that.
How do you like the feel of lubed ergo clears? Supposed to be god-tier for mx :P
I hope it will get as much use as my topre boards since I'm spending so much time modding it haha
Sorry, I didn't watch the video all the way through. I did lube the bump.
I love my ergo clears. 67g, so a bit heavier than usual (nubbinator's excitement for 67g convinced me), but still very smooth and pleasant.
I'm trying ergo whites next, which is a bit of an experiment and is not, to my knowledge, something commonly done. We'll see how they hold up compared to ergo clears.
How does the tactility of the 67g clears compare to 62g and stock springs?
Generally, the stiffer springs you go, the less tactility. If you want maximum tactility, I would go as low as 55g lubed but no lower. 55g feels amazing for typing but not so much for gaming because slower key releases can lead to the "sticking" feeling. If you lube however, it won't stick with 55g, at least for 1x1 keys. I find 62g to be the perfectly balanced spring for lubed ergo clears when typing/gaming.
Regarding break-in, pretty much what tp4 said. I'd say if you want to cut corners, just use/try for about a two months stock, at least, and then lube later.
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Generally, the stiffer springs you go, the less tactility. If you want maximum tactility, I would go as low as 55g lubed but no lower. 55g feels amazing for typing but not so much for gaming because slower key releases can lead to the "sticking" feeling. If you lube however, it won't stick with 55g, at least for 1x1 keys. I find 62g to be the perfectly balanced spring for lubed ergo clears when typing/gaming.
Regarding break-in, pretty much what tp4 said. I'd say if you want to cut corners, just use/try for about a two months stock, at least, and then lube later.
Very good to know, thank you!
I guess I'll just have to tough it out for a couple of months (or more) before I lube 'em. Since I don't game a lot, though, I might try some 55g springs. Will stock blue springs (~60g I think) stick without lube?
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Generally, the stiffer springs you go, the less tactility. If you want maximum tactility, I would go as low as 55g lubed but no lower. 55g feels amazing for typing but not so much for gaming because slower key releases can lead to the "sticking" feeling. If you lube however, it won't stick with 55g, at least for 1x1 keys. I find 62g to be the perfectly balanced spring for lubed ergo clears when typing/gaming.
Regarding break-in, pretty much what tp4 said. I'd say if you want to cut corners, just use/try for about a two months stock, at least, and then lube later.
Very good to know, thank you!
I guess I'll just have to tough it out for a couple of months (or more) before I lube 'em. Since I don't game a lot, though, I might try some 55g springs. Will stock blue springs (~60g I think) stick without lube?
Sigh.... (http://www.cute-factor.com/images/smilies/onion/7f5341cc.gif)
stick is not "often" an issue.. How often do you "rely" on a double tap anyway.. almost never...
if you lube everything "but" the bump, under the intention that you'll lube the bump later.... that means you've opened and closed the switch TWICE...
1__remove key cap, open switch, remove stem, remove spring, apply lube, close, reapply keycap
2_____remove key cap, open switch, remove stem, apply lube, close
THAT is 2x the ton of work..Freaking 2-3 hours each time if you don't rush it.. if you want to do that to yourself... by all means...
NO it's NOT fun... and it hurts ur finger tips.
(http://www.cute-factor.com/images/smilies/onion/th_057_.gif)
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if you lube everything "but" the bump, under the intention that you'll lube the bump later.... that means you've opened and closed the switch TWICE...
These two times will be separated by >4 months though...lol
So...would this method make the switches as smooth as wearing them in unlubed?
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I just started modding the switches. Unfortunately, with the stock blue springs, the clear stems tend to stick on the return. Should I wear them in on the stock springs, and only change to the lighter springs when I lube, after they have been sufficiently worn down from use?
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I just started modding the switches. Unfortunately, with the stock blue springs, the clear stems tend to stick on the return. Should I wear them in on the stock springs, and only change to the lighter springs when I lube, after they have been sufficiently worn down from use?
The sticking issue is one of the main reasons ergo clears are almost always lubed. I personally used the stock springs for a while and lubed them when I switched to a lighter spring.
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Aww man. I'm not much of a heavy typist, but I guess I'll just have to break these in on stock springs :(
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Yeah, you might as well. Less work, and you'll get to appreciate the finished product more too :) Who knows, you might even learn to love stiffer switches :P
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I find blacks break in about 1 month or so. Granted that's on a work board, so that might see more use on a normal basis... probably less than most guys here. I think a similar time frame for the tactile switches, after two days at work my gf's Poker II in browns already felt much better than when they arrived. I have another brown board sitting at my mom's computer, and that one feels great for tactility (1~ year with me, 1+ with her). I cannot speak from a modded perspective (or a Topre user), but I really don't think MX needs lubing for a good while. Arguably my filco might need some soon because its about a year old now, but I wouldn't do that on the "tactile" arms, rather just on the slider sides.
Had a couple of sampler keys, and I will stress that lubing the bump TOO much will cause the bump to "disappear". My clear tester is now nearly linear because the grease I used (Superlube, teflon based) seems to be taking ALL tactility out of it.
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Yeah, you might as well. Less work, and you'll get to appreciate the finished product more too :) Who knows, you might even learn to love stiffer switches :P
Unfortunately, the clears I bought are pcb mounted, so I have to take each one apart and swap the springs and stems into the board's original housings. So, just as much work lol
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Yeah, you might as well. Less work, and you'll get to appreciate the finished product more too :) Who knows, you might even learn to love stiffer switches :P
Unfortunately, the clears I bought are pcb mounted, so I have to take each one apart and swap the springs and stems into the board's original housings. So, just as much work lol
Could you not just chop the extra legs off?
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Yeah, you might as well. Less work, and you'll get to appreciate the finished product more too :) Who knows, you might even learn to love stiffer switches :P
Unfortunately, the clears I bought are pcb mounted, so I have to take each one apart and swap the springs and stems into the board's original housings. So, just as much work lol
Could you not just chop the extra legs off?
Oh I hadn't considered that. What would you use to do that, a knife?
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Yeah, you might as well. Less work, and you'll get to appreciate the finished product more too :) Who knows, you might even learn to love stiffer switches :P
Unfortunately, the clears I bought are pcb mounted, so I have to take each one apart and swap the springs and stems into the board's original housings. So, just as much work lol
Could you not just chop the extra legs off?
Oh I hadn't considered that. What would you use to do that, a knife?
flush cutters
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lol thanks guys. I'm a total noob at modding mx switches, and you just saved me SOOO much time opening up switches.