geekhack
geekhack Community => Input Devices => Topic started by: Novus on Fri, 14 February 2014, 21:17:47
-
The IME 3 and the MX 518 have always been regarded as great, classic mouses that have been at the center of attention for enthusiasts.
However, for the past few years, the mouse market has been dominated by ambidextrous styled mouse.
Not that we don't enjoy classics like the WMO or the wonderful, new gimmicky mouses with a fat price tag but we've seen a lull in the development of right handed ergonomic mouse devices.
For the longest time, we've been stuck with a tiny selection like the DA, g400, Ikari optical and EC 1 out of a huge market of companies which produce gimmicky, jerky devices.
Considering how many mouse lines a company like Razer or Logitech release per year, it's disheartening to only see 1 right handed ergonomic device apiece.
We've also seen movement in developing smaller mouse devices with optical sensors from CM and other companies.
However, this past year and now we're finally seeing a resurgence of the right handed ergonomic mouse. We've also seen a great push towards more optical devices in general as well.
Just off the top of my head, for right handed ergonomic devices, we've got the Razer DA, Logitech G400s, Zowie EC 1/2, Mionix Naos 7000, SteelSeries Rival, Corsair M40, the upcoming Roccat XTD optical and CM storm Alcor.
This is a far greater selection and push then we've seen for a long time.
For those of us that like devices inspired by the IME 3 or MX 518:
How many right handed ergonomic mouse devices have you tried? What's your favorite? What sets it apart and why do you prefer it over something else?
[attachimg=1]
[attachimg=2]
-
Right handed ergonomic mice I've tried:
IE3.0 (originally bought back in '01 - Since then have purchased 3 more)
Habu
DeathAdder (original, 3.5, and 2013)
MX500
MX518
G400
G5
G500
Imperator
Rival
EC1
MX Revolution
Performance MX
Fatal1ty 2020
RAT 7 (I guess this qualifies)
SteelSeries WOW Cataclysm
Logitech M505
Logitech MX600
That's all I can remember off the top of my head.
My favorite? To this day, still the IE3.0 (although the EC1 is rapidly gaining ground). I have large hands, and the IE3 fits absolutely perfectly. One of the best and most accurate sensors I've ever used. Plus the nostalgia factor. Even with its loose scroll wheel and side buttons, it's still the best.
-
My favorite? To this day, still the IE3.0 (although the EC1 is rapidly gaining ground). I have large hands, and the IE3 fits absolutely perfectly. One of the best and most accurate sensors I've ever used. Plus the nostalgia factor. Even with its loose scroll wheel and side buttons, it's still the best.
Did you also know that currently on Taobao there are more IE 3.0 modded mice than any other input device available :thumb: . I fancy buying a few off there and trying them out, the IE 3.0 is still the BEST mouse ever created followed by the mx500/518 (the first and best logitech gamer mouse).
-
I love the Steelseries Rival the most, but apparently the sensor has substantial smoothing :/
-
Logitech G602
-
I love the Steelseries Rival the most, but apparently the sensor has substantial smoothing :/
Weird. I thought the Rival was way solid. Although, I've never been really good at detecting smoothing.
-
All mouses do have smoothing so your perceptions might vary depending on what you are used to.
I personally do think the Rival does have some noticeable smoothing but it's not to the point where it's egregiously bad like some products.
So I'm curious between let's say the Rival, DA 2013, g400s, evo cl or non cl and Naos 7000 ...basically all the modern IME 3s and MX 518 clones. How would you guys compare them to each other?
-
qpad 5k ;D
-
Quite a few of the mice mentioned in this thread have laser sensors rather than optical.
(I suppose technically speaking; all sensors are optical but there's no need to make this needlessly confusing)
-
Quite a few of the mice mentioned in this thread have laser sensors rather than optical.
(I suppose technically speaking; all sensors are optical but there's no need to make this needlessly confusing)
Yea, hahaha.
What's your favorite Vun?
I'm really interested in what you guys think of the build quality between the ergonomic devices (or any particularly notable experiences). I didn't want to turn this into a shootout between the DA 2013, G400s, Rival, Zowie and the Naos (but these are the most common right handed ergonomic devices with optical sensors).
-
Quite a few of the mice mentioned in this thread have laser sensors rather than optical.
(I suppose technically speaking; all sensors are optical but there's no need to make this needlessly confusing)
Yea, hahaha.
What's your favorite Vun?
I'm really interested in what you guys think of the build quality between the ergonomic devices (or any particularly notable experiences). I didn't want to turn this into a shootout between the DA 2013, G400s, Rival, Zowie and the Naos (but these are the most common right handed ergonomic devices with optical sensors).
I don't really have a clear favourite, but if I said the G400 that wouldn't be too far off at least. Sadly, mine is the one with prediction.
-
I.E 3.0
Logitech MX510/518/G400
DeathAdder
-
I wouldn't call any of these mice "ergonomic".
For a mouse to be called "ergonomic", it needs to be vertical or slanted at least 30° and the buttons need to be light. Otherwise it is just marketingspeak.
I use a modified Wowpen Joy - that is my favourite ergonomic mouse right now. The unmodified mouse has too stiff buttons. It does not have any super-fancy high-DPI sensor or such features, but it doesn't have angle-snapping either, like the Evoluent.
-
I wouldn't call any of these mice "ergonomic".
For a mouse to be called "ergonomic", it needs to be vertical or slanted at least 30° and the buttons need to be light. Otherwise it is just marketingspeak.
I use a modified Wowpen Joy - that is my favourite ergonomic mouse right now. The unmodified mouse has too stiff buttons. It does not have any super-fancy high-DPI sensor or such features, but it doesn't have angle-snapping either, like the Evoluent.
Well yea, as you've said, these devices are way too normal to be "ergonomic".
Anyways, in this case ergonomic is just synonymous with right handed as opposed to ambidextrous.
-
"Ergonomic" as in the meaning of the word when found on product packaging or promotional materials.
Not the actual literal definition of the word "ergonomic".
-
MX518 is & always be, the best mouse I have ever used. The thing is an utter work horse! I've had mine now in excess of 6 -7 years.
Currently using a Razer Mamba 4G, but I still prefer the feel of the 518.
-
MX518 is & always be, the best mouse I have ever used. The thing is an utter work horse! I've had mine now in excess of 6 -7 years.
Currently using a Razer Mamba 4G, but I still prefer the feel of the 518.
Totally agree, I've dropped mine on the tiled floor numerous times yet it still works without fail. Imagine making an input device so strong it lasts and lasts through vicious use that no other mouse could withstand and it was by pure accident, in that Logitech developed it that way. Thank gawd for innocent mistakes because I bet they dread the thought of ever making the mx500 and mx518 series because us loonies are still using them years later.
-
Roccat Kone* for palm grip, CM Storm Xornet/Spawn and Roccat Savu for fingertip grip.
However, it has very little to do with actual ergonomics and I'd strongly prefer a good ambidextrous mouse, because asymmetry is anti-ergonomic for me (my issues are caused by overuse of /right/ index finger).
-
I like my Deathadder, but I have really come to love the Anker Vertical. 1600dpi is plenty for me.
[attachimg=1]
Quick pic with my phone just now.
-
Totally agree, I've dropped mine on the tiled floor numerous times yet it still works without fail. (...) Thank gawd for innocent mistakes because I bet they dread the thought of ever making the mx500 and mx518 series because us loonies are still using them years later.
I've bought one of those in 2006, sold it last year to a friend who was in dire need of a sturdy/durable and good mouse, bought its younger brother (G400 without prediction/angle snapping) and left my 3.5G deathadder to rot in one of my peripheral doom drawers, lol. just by comparison, the 3.5G deathadder thumb buttons caved in after about 1 year of use and the right trigger stopped making the click noise... and I take pride in keeping my gaming gear in pristine conditions (cleaning them often, using quality mousepads, replacing mouse feet, etc.)
-
ROCCAT Kone Pure Optical
It's smaller in size.. and it's a bit slippery if you have really dry hands, due to the texture. But it's still an excellent mouse and probably the best I've ever owned.
It also sports the famed Avago 3090 optical sensor.
-
Did you also know that currently on Taobao there are more IE 3.0 modded mice than any other input device available :thumb: . I fancy buying a few off there and trying them out, the IE 3.0 is still the BEST mouse ever created followed by the mx500/518 (the first and best logitech gamer mouse).
What kind of mods? Could you post some links please?
Using G400 right now (with the better sensor - has to have a part id over a certain number). I would get a G400s but I don't like the looks. Next up I want to try a CM Storm Alcor or a Steelseries Rival.
-
Did you also know that currently on Taobao there are more IE 3.0 modded mice than any other input device available :thumb: . I fancy buying a few off there and trying them out, the IE 3.0 is still the BEST mouse ever created followed by the mx500/518 (the first and best logitech gamer mouse).
What kind of mods? Could you post some links please?
Here's a try;
http://s.taobao.com/search?q=IE+3.0+MOD&searcy_type=item&s_from=newHeader&source=&ssid=s5-e&search=y&initiative_id=itemz_20140218 (http://s.taobao.com/search?q=IE+3.0+MOD&searcy_type=item&s_from=newHeader&source=&ssid=s5-e&search=y&initiative_id=itemz_20140218)
Only down side everything is in their language hence better get someone to translate it for you. I only use Firefox hence it's near impossible to find a reliable app to change everything into plain english. But really they provide the pics and you know what they''re selling hence no need for any translating ;) .
With the IE 3.0 and WMO 1.1 they replace the original mouse switches with Japanese Omron's (seen some pics) and may even swap out sensors with another model brand (forgot which seller did that). Of course they provide every colour under the sun you just need to choose which one.
-
Did you also know that currently on Taobao there are more IE 3.0 modded mice than any other input device available :thumb: . I fancy buying a few off there and trying them out, the IE 3.0 is still the BEST mouse ever created followed by the mx500/518 (the first and best logitech gamer mouse).
What kind of mods? Could you post some links please?
Here's a try;
http://s.taobao.com/search?q=IE+3.0+MOD&searcy_type=item&s_from=newHeader&source=&ssid=s5-e&search=y&initiative_id=itemz_20140218 (http://s.taobao.com/search?q=IE+3.0+MOD&searcy_type=item&s_from=newHeader&source=&ssid=s5-e&search=y&initiative_id=itemz_20140218)
Only down side everything is in their language hence better get someone to translate it for you. I only use Firefox hence it's near impossible to find a reliable app to change everything into plain english. But really they provide the pics and you know what they''re selling hence no need for any translating ;) .
With the IE 3.0 and WMO 1.1 they replace the original mouse switches with Japanese Omron's (seen some pics) and may even swap out sensors with another model brand (forgot which seller did that). Of course they provide every colour under the sun you just need to choose which one.
Do you know how much DPI they have?
-
These are my two favorite ergonomic optical mice
(http://i.imgur.com/JfNX0W6.jpg)
The deathadder is the transformers edition (3.5G) because that is the only glossy version of a deathadder available. I find it infinitely more comfortable to hold and use than the stock coating on the deathadders. My number one favorite is the Zowie EC1 Evo white, with the deathadder number two and the IME 3.0 a distant third. There are a lot of great optical ergonomic mice out there, but there are a couple of reasons why I prefer the EC1 over everything else.
-The coating: I really like glossy mice, especially the glossy coating that Zowie uses. The best complement I can give it is that I can just use it and forget about it. It feels nice and grippy on my dry hands. Much better than any of the (many) rubberized coatings that I have tried. Even though I previously thought any glossy coating was basically the same, the Zowie glossy coating somehow seems to stick to my hands even better.
-The weight: One drawback of using relatively large ergonomic mice is that they are typically heavier than small ambidextrous mice. Not only that, but their weight is typically also distributed in a weird way. The EC1 does not really suffer from this though. Weight feels evenly distributed, and it manages to be under 100 grams, which is kind of the limit for me where mice are starting to feel heavy.
-The shape. I really like the shape of the Deathadder, but the EC1 is very similar and even improves it a little in my opinion. The front is not so fanned out which makes the mouse easier to grab. The left side is more sloped which makes it easier to to grab and lift as well. The mouse-wheel sticks out more and is placed more towards the front, making it extremely easy to use. Finally, the side-buttons are placed a little higher, which prevents them from getting in the way during normal gameplay.
-The sensor. I appreciate the low lift of distance and the fact that the mouse is driverless. I like the performance of the sensor. I can not say I can feel the rumored lag/delay on the 450Dpi setting. While I can easily replicate the scroll wheel problem that the EC series has, with normal use I have not once had an issue with the wheel in hundreds of hours of gameplay, making it a non-issue for me personally.
-Overall feel. I like the huano switches, even though they are not for everyone. The large mouse-feet provide a good glide. Comparing them right next to a WMO 1.1, DA 3.5G and even the Zowie FK that I have lying around here, it gives the smoothest glide on my Qck heavy. The side-buttons feel really similar to the side-buttons on the deathadder. They have quite a lot of travel and are very light to press. Even though I like the way they feel (I actually prefer it to the more firm switches and less travel like in the FK), it does make them also feel a little flimsy.
-
Zowie EC eVo CL, fo sho
-
SteelSeries Rival is mine, the Zowie EC2 evo CL being the runner-up. The rubberized sides are more comfy /grippy than Zowie mice, and the buttons don't have as much resistance, just enough to prevent accidental clicks; quieter, too. The feet glide more easily, and it's slightly lighter than the EC1, which I prefer. The DPI button being on top of the mouse rather than the bottom is much more convenient, and 6500 DPI with 50 increment adjustments is nice to have versus 2300 max with 3 steps.
I will say the mouse wheel on the EC evo CL (CL! Regular evo's wheel is inferior) is superior, though. Clickier with smaller rotations, while the Rival's feels rather mushy and fails to register on occasion. The Zowie cord is more limp than the Rival's, which gives it minor points, as well. Not as important pluses as the Rivals, all in all.
Apparently the Rival's 3011 sensor has more smoothing than the Zowie's A095, but it seems enthusiasts at Overclockers.com prefer it. Personally I find the smoothing to be barely perceptible.
-
SteelSeries Rival is mine, the Zowie EC2 evo CL being the runner-up. The rubberized sides are more comfy /grippy than Zowie mice, and the buttons don't have as much resistance, just enough to prevent accidental clicks; quieter, too. The feet glide more easily, and it's slightly lighter than the EC1, which I prefer.
Are you sure the Rival is lighter? The EC1 is 98 grams. The rival is listed at 128 grams. People on OCN have put it on a scale and found 128.7 without the cord. This makes it a whopping 30 grams heavier than mice like the EC1 or IME 3.0. You list the weight here as a strong point of the rival, however, it is actually a very (very) heavy mouse and a lot of people stay away from it just for this reason.
-
ROCCAT Kone Pure Optical
It's smaller in size.. and it's a bit slippery if you have really dry hands, due to the texture. But it's still an excellent mouse and probably the best I've ever owned.
It also sports the famed Avago 3090 optical sensor.
I have the Roccat kone pure colour. I haven't tried the optical version and I agree that it is truely a mouse worthy of the title of "Ruddy Good Mouse".
-
ROCCAT Kone Pure Optical
It's smaller in size.. and it's a bit slippery if youSteelSeries Rival is mine, the Zowie EC2 evo CL being the runner-up. The rubberized sides are more comfy /grippy than Zowie mice, and the buttons don't have as much resistance, just enough to prevent accidental clicks; quieter, too. The feet glide more easily, and it's slightly lighter than the EC1, which I prefer.
Are you sure the Rival is lighter? The EC1 is 98 grams. The rival is listed at 128 grams. People on OCN have put it on a scale and found 128.7 without the cord. This makes it a whopping 30 grams heavier than mice like the EC1 or IME 3.0. You list the weight here as a strong point of the rival, however, it is actually a very (very) heavy mouse and a lot of people stay away from it just for this reason.
have really dry hands, due to the texture. But it's still an excellent mouse and probably the best I've ever owned.
It also sports the famed Avago 3090 optical sensor.
I have the Roccat kone pure colour. I haven't tried the optical version and I agree that it is truely a mouse worthy of the title of "Ruddy Good Mouse".
Oh weird! I guess it feels lighter because it glides more easily on it's smaller feet.