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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: Xarmydis on Fri, 28 March 2014, 01:30:36
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I love the crisp feeling of blues, oh so much, but these are too gosh darned noisy for me. Browns are softer, yes, and are still tactile, but they just don't find as crisp as blues to me, and I'm looking to go heavier.
So, pretty much, I'm looking for crisp, tactile, soft, and at least the weight of blues, but harder definitely preferred.
I was looking at whites/clears, is there anything else I should be looking at? How soft are those really? These blues are so freaking loud. Like, obnoxiously so.
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What about a brown with a heavier spring?
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Maybe ergo-clears?
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you're looking for clears or 55g topre.
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I would suggest Clears as well. They are nicely tactile and not as loud as Blues, and also heavier, so pretty much everything you want. Whites is another option but they can be tricky (because sometimes their click is uneven) and they are fairly rare.
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So, pretty much, I'm looking for crisp, tactile, soft, and at least the weight of blues, but harder definitely preferred.
It definitely sounds like you're describing clears. They're roughly 65g compared to the blues' and browns' 55g.
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It definitely sounds like you're describing clears. They're roughly 65g compared to the blues' and browns' 55g.
I'm not sure where you're getting those numbers from, but the don't match up with any of mine...
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I'm not sure where you're getting those numbers from, but the don't match up with any of mine...
They're based on doing the nickel test, which is admittedly crude.
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They're based on doing the nickel test, which is admittedly crude.
Here are some exact measurements: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=46449.0
The nickel test should not be used if you have more exact measurements.
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Here are some exact measurements: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=46449.0 (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=46449.0)
The nickel test should not be used if you have more exact measurements.
Ummmm… All I see there is measurement of the bare springs. The bumps in the stem pressing against the leaf spring to produce the tactile feel necessarily changes the force needed.
I also noticed that in that chart, the middle of the light (blue, brown) spring is 50g and the clear spring is 65g, right in line with what I said.
That said, I would like to see that level of measurement of full switch assemblies. I even looked into what it would take to get force plus distance measurements, but I don't have the 5 to 7 thousand dollars to buy the kind of equipment needed to do it right, especially just for testing a few switches. :o I've been trying to figure out if anyone I know already has the right gear.
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Matias Quiet Pro?
Drawback is you can't customize it as readily as Cherry MX.
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Matias Quiet Pro?
Drawback is you can't customize it as readily as Cherry MX.
Good point. Matias is selling their switches individually (though they're not pin compatible with the MX series) and has openly talked about selling custom key caps for them. (See their forum.) They've also announced an ergonomic keyboard too.
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Ummmm… All I see there is measurement of the bare springs. The bumps in the stem pressing against the leaf spring to produce the tactile feel necessarily changes the force needed.
Only for activation force. The bottom out force will stay the same.
I also noticed that in that chart, the middle of the light (blue, brown) spring is 50g and the clear spring is 65g, right in line with what I said.
You were 5g off, but yes they were close. However activation forces are documented, see below, therefore the nickel tests are really not needed.
That said, I would like to see that level of measurement of full switch assemblies. I even looked into what it would take to get force plus distance measurements, but I don't have the 5 to 7 thousand dollars to buy the kind of equipment needed to do it right, especially just for testing a few switches. :o I've been trying to figure out if anyone I know already has the right gear.
Cherry has the activation forces well documented, you can find them in the Deskthority wiki, for example here: http://deskthority.net/wiki/Cherry_MX_Blue
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Cherry has the activation forces well documented, you can find them in the Deskthority wiki, for example here: http://deskthority.net/wiki/Cherry_MX_Blue (http://deskthority.net/wiki/Cherry_MX_Blue)
True, but those are only for stock Cherry switches. It would be nice to know what the curves are for modified switches, as well as different designs, such as the Alps in my old AEK. And of course, for the best head-to-head comparison, all the switches should be tested under the same conditions to eliminate variables, such as any potential differences between Cherry's procedure and the one used for testing other switches. And let's not forget the theories about variations over Cherry's production history.
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True, but those are only for stock Cherry switches. It would be nice to know what the curves are for modified switches, as well as different designs, such as the Alps in my old AEK. And of course, for the best head-to-head comparison, all the switches should be tested under the same conditions to eliminate variables, such as any potential differences between Cherry's procedure and the one used for testing other switches. And let's not forget the theories about variations over Cherry's production history.
Jesus that would be a lot of measuring :eek:
I think for heavier springs you could just scale the graphs accordingly. On the other hand, I don't think numbers really express how a switch feels after all ;)
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Clears aren't very "crisp", otherwise I'd say they're the best.
Whites seem to be a good idea. They're stiffer than blues, more tactile, IMO more crisp, and they're definately quiter.