Post by: Lpwl on Sun, 20 July 2014, 10:40:50
-- Round 1 --
[22/08] I've ordered more than 5000 O-rings and paid for it all upfront.
[27/08] Half has been already produced. Everything should be here in a week or two.
[13/09] I've received half of the products but one package was held at the Airport for a week.
[17/09] Everything is here and should be available in Classifieds in a day or two.
[19/09] Sale thread is live (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=62935.0).
[25/10] SOLD OUT !
-------------
Not long after buying my CODE keyboard, I started looking for O-rings in order to obtain the lowest possible price while ensuring that they have adequate characteristics. I was able to test some O-rings of different thickness and hardness and make my own opinion on this subject (more info : here (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=40227.msg1387293#msg1387293)).
In my opinion, 40A hardness (aka "soft") O-rings are the best. They are also difficult to find.
WASDKeyboards are selling some but it is expensive : 20$ shipped (USA) or 24$ shipped (Europe). This is why I would like to help this community benefit from my experience with some manufacturers in China.
(http://i.imgur.com/9WCeQ66.jpg)
Gallery : http://imgur.com/a/xIGNO
Video :
∼ Specs :
More
Quantity :
- Tenkeyless = 90 pcs / bag
- Full size = 110 pcs / bag
- Full size + extras = 125 pcs / bag
- Other sizes...
Hardness : 40A
Material : Silicone
"Slim" O-rings dimensions :
[ID] = 0.196 inch (⇔ 5mm )
[OD] = 0.314 inch (⇔ 8mm )
[CS] = 0.059 inch (⇔ 1.5mm )
"Fat" O-rings dimensions :
[ID] = 0.196 inch (⇔ 5mm )
[OD] = 0.393 inch (⇔ 10mm )
[CS] = 0.098 inch (⇔ 2.5mm )
MOQ : 2000 pcs for each size.
ID = Inner diameter / OD = Outer diameter / CS = Cross section (thickness) / MOQ = Minimum Order Quantity.
∼ Pricing (in €) :
More
"Slim" O-rings bag price :
- 90 pcs : 6,70€ (⇔ $9 )
- 110 pcs : 8,20€ (⇔ $11.10 )
- 125 pcs : 9,30€ (⇔ $12.50 )
|| These "slim" O-rings are exactly the same as those sold by KeyboardCo (http://www.keyboardco.com/product/o-ring-switch-dampeners-for-filco-keyboards.asp) (125 pcs per bag - 14,40€ / $19.50 ... without shipping :eek:).
Quote
It has a very small key travel reduction, so you may or may not notice it. It dampens the noise pretty well, and eliminates almost all of the “shock” you feel when the key hits the bottom. If you can’t decide which pack to get, try these ones first. Can’t go wrong with these ones, they’re good all around || source : WhiteFireDragon’s GB (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=25714.msg524147;topicseen#msg524147)
"Fat" O-rings bag price :
- 90 pcs : 8€ (⇔ $10.75 )
- 110 pcs : 9,80€ (⇔ $13.25 )
- 125 pcs : 11,10€ (⇔ $15 )
|| These "fat" O-rings were sold here 2 years ago. They are not sold anywhere else to my knowledge.
Quote
This one is my personal favorite, but I know it’s not for everyone. It’s the max thickness you can have in an O-ring. It bottoms out just after the key’s registration point. This simulates scissor switches on laptops or thin membrane keyboard, but still retains the “mechanical” feel from MX switches. || source : WhiteFireDragon’s GB (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=25714.msg524147;topicseen#msg524147)
∼ Shipping :
More
Shipping will be from France in padded envelopes.
Add to bag price for :
• shipping within France (J+1) : 1,4 €
• shipping within Europe (J+2/3) : 1,65 €
• delivery in other countries : 2€
|| Shipping cost could be lowered if you were only interested by a few bags of "slim" O-rings (max : 250 pcs) or by one bag of "fat" O-rings (max : 100 pcs).
Post by: myrddin on Mon, 21 July 2014, 07:43:49
Post by: Lpwl on Mon, 21 July 2014, 09:35:04
Are these special in some way? I picked up 150 slim ones here (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/201094420491?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649) for $2 a couple weeks ago.
Yeap, they are ... softer !
Also, a thicker O-ring is something that everyone should try : some people will hate it - some will love it.
∼ More info :
Quote
A thicker ring will reduce key travel more than a thinner ring.
A softer ring will make a switch quiet more effectively than a harder ring.
source : KeyboardCo blog (http://www.keyboardco.com/blog/index.php/2014/06/red-blue-black-o-rings-arrive-at-keyboard-co/)
Quote
It depends on what effect you are trying to achieve.
If you want to quiet down the keyboard and soften the landing, get soft o-rings, ie in 40A or 50A durometer.
If you want to quiet down the keyboard but keep a hard landing, get hard ones (70 - 90A durometer)... however their noise dampening won't be as good as the soft ones'.
source : DeskThority (http://deskthority.net/workshop-f7/o-ring-modification-t2219.html)
Those you bought are probably harder (because it's cheaper to produce) - something around 60A. You should ask the vendor about it.
Post by: Vitaly on Tue, 22 July 2014, 11:01:35
Are these special in some way? I picked up 150 slim ones here (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/201094420491?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649) for $2 a couple weeks ago.Bought in red color from ebay http://goo.gl/GpaKBM works well and pretty soft (if put 2 o-rings on keycap actuation point works (~3mm thickness? it's like fat I think), I use 2 o-rings on fn keys and mouse buttons).
Post by: Data on Tue, 22 July 2014, 14:37:48
I'd be down for minimum 2x slim orders at that price point.
Post by: Lpwl on Wed, 23 July 2014, 14:00:17
I filled out your survey.
I'd be down for minimum 2x slim orders at that price point.
Great !
I just added more info (including MOQ).
Post by: Chicken Chaser on Wed, 13 August 2014, 19:34:01
Post by: Lpwl on Thu, 14 August 2014, 01:59:02
At the moment, the poll shows :
- 16 packs of "slim" O-rings.
- 8 packs of "fat" O-rings.
MOQ is around 20 packs for each size.
We need more people ! Spread the word.
Post by: taylordcraig on Thu, 14 August 2014, 15:00:38
You'll meet MOQ no problem with it being that low.
Post by: Lpwl on Sat, 16 August 2014, 05:10:02
EDIT : Waiting for approval for the last
Still
Post by: Lpwl on Wed, 20 August 2014, 08:20:02
- 19 packs of "slim" O-rings.
- 11 packs of "fat" O-rings.
Everything is ready.
Post by: Lpwl on Fri, 22 August 2014, 01:53:19
I'm willing to pay for it all upfront and let you guys grab them in Classifieds in a few weeks !
Post by: Lpwl on Thu, 28 August 2014, 03:10:34
[22/08] I've ordered more than 5000 O-rings.
[27/08] Half has been already produced.
Everything should be here in a week or two.
Soon tm in Classifieds (http://geekhack.org/index.php?board=59.0) ...
Post by: AKmalamute on Thu, 28 August 2014, 13:31:39
Soon tm in Classifieds (http://geekhack.org/index.php?board=59.0) ...
Keep the discussion up ... or find an interesting thread in MakingStuff or something.
You don't meet the requirements yet to open a thread in the classifieds, either ... although you're nearly there.
Post by: Lpwl on Thu, 28 August 2014, 14:40:08
From *** NEW CLASSIFIEDS RULES (5/17/14) - *** AKA "Why isn't my thread approved?!" (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=56284.msg1270020#msg1270020) :
Quote
Creating sale / trade threads in the Classifieds subforum is limited to Geekhack.org users who have been members of the forum for at least 2 months and have 25 or higher post count.
Feel free to correct me
Post by: justspeechless on Thu, 28 August 2014, 14:47:33
Post by: SpAmRaY on Thu, 28 August 2014, 14:53:49
Moderator Team has denied me their approval - It seems that I do not meet the requirements to start a groupbuy anytime soon (new rules are still being discussed).
I'm willing to pay for it all upfront and let you guys grab them in Classifieds in a few weeks !
This is interesting seeing as how http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=profile;u=34862 (http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=profile;u=34862) is running a group buy...he is newer than you are ???
Also I don't see why they would stop a group buy before the rules are made public. ::)
Just saw your OP edit..post count....really? :facepalm:
Post by: Lpwl on Thu, 28 August 2014, 14:59:10
It's kinda confusing because the rules are saying ≥ 25 post count is ok, but the new rules (which are not yet public) are saying something like : "You need moooore".
It would be great if someone would be able to shed some light on this !
Post by: SpAmRaY on Thu, 28 August 2014, 15:10:19
PS: I want to buy one pack each of your o-rings that you so graciously purchased and are giving us the opportunity to try out. :thumb:
Post by: Lpwl on Fri, 29 August 2014, 04:34:31
Looking forward to buying dem fat o-rings for my tkl :)
Guess its time for me to post my how-to article on increasing your post count. :facepalm:
PS: I want to buy one pack each of your o-rings that you so graciously purchased and are giving us the opportunity to try out. :thumb:
Great ! I'll keep you updated.
All those double/triple post I've seen this morning are saying to me : "You can do dis bro !"
Ahah ;D
Post by: Chicken Chaser on Tue, 16 September 2014, 00:07:52
Post by: Lpwl on Tue, 16 September 2014, 02:14:03
I've already received a few thousands of "slim" O-rings but I'm still waiting for the "fat" ones. The package got stuck at the airport.
Everything should be available in a week (max).
I'll send you a PM ;)
Post by: kitsun8 on Tue, 16 September 2014, 04:42:44
I will probably forget so it'd be appreciated if you can send me a PM :p
Post by: Lpwl on Tue, 16 September 2014, 05:27:51
Hey man could I grab 90 of each type of o-ring when your gb goes up?
I will probably forget so it'd be appreciated if you can send me a PM :p
No worries, I'll keep you updated.
Post by: Lpwl on Wed, 17 September 2014, 07:10:44
Everything is here and looks great !
I'm already making packages of 90 - 110 - 125 "fat" O-rings.
Post by: telegraphist on Thu, 18 September 2014, 16:50:50
I have poor experience with the "008 Silicone O-rings 70A Durometer, Red, 3/16 ID. They are 1/16 width" purchased at Amazone (I think this is 1/16 thickness, not width).
These ones, and slightly thicker black ones (I lost their specs) were not holding for long and spitted, while remaining on the keys.
The WASDkeyboards 40A blue ones, on the other hand, are very good: softer, of course and their elasticity is superb.
I have none of them yet broken for a period of about a year of use.
I wish there were rings offered, made of the same strong and elastic material, but with 150% - 170% thickness of the WASDkeyboards 40A blue ones. I think such thicker O-rings would be perfect for my CM QuickFire linear MX reds.
Post by: Lpwl on Thu, 18 September 2014, 18:06:26
Just a note: not all of O-rings are created equal.
I have poor experience with the "008 Silicone O-rings 70A Durometer, Red, 3/16 ID. They are 1/16 width" purchased at Amazone (I think this is 1/16 thickness, not width).
I'm sorry you had bad experiences with O-rings but you know it took me a long time - thinking, reading and many tries with various thickness and hardness - to finally being able to bring this to you.
(http://i.imgur.com/7kqWQ8g.png)
There is a fundamental difference of durometer between the product you tried and mine.
Yours : 70A (= hard).
Mine : 40A (= soft).
They feel completely different even if they share more or less the same size !
These ones, and slightly thicker black ones (I lost their specs) were not holding for long and spitted, while remaining on the keys.
The WASDkeyboards 40A blue ones, on the other hand, are very good: softer, of course and their elasticity is superb.
I have none of them yet broken for a period of about a year of use.
I'm using these "fat" and "slim" O-rings without ANY problems for months.
To be honest, I can not enjoy typing on my CODE keyboard anymore without them and this is getting me nervous because I've recently ordered new keycaps (Granite R2 - DSA profile) that do not work well with O-rings.
I'm pretty sure WASDkeyboards's O-rings feel good but they are also very expensive.
This is exactly why I'm trying to bring these products to you.
I wish there were rings offered, made of the same strong and elastic material, but with 150% - 170% thickness of the WASDkeyboards 40A blue ones. I think such thicker O-rings would be perfect for my CM QuickFire linear MX reds.
You should really try my "fat" O-rings as they seem to fit exactly what you are looking for.
The ball is in your court
Post by: Rodgaroon on Fri, 19 September 2014, 00:19:41
I have the 60A slim model and I'm also worried about them not working so well with my Granite R2. Keep me updated when you get your Granite set. If you feel that these o-rings work well with SP DSA keycaps I will more then happy to buy a package of o-rings off you.
Post by: telegraphist on Fri, 19 September 2014, 02:22:13
...The ball is in your court...I am confused here.
I understand that those WASDkeyboards 40A rings are quite expensive to you.
I also felt they were expensive, so I saved a little and purchased the same brand rings with free Prime shipping on Amazon and quite happy with them so far.
My question, though, was: whether you, or someone else could possibly offer the O-rings, which are while as elastic and durable as those WASDkeyboards blue ones, are just a little (50% - 60%) thicker?
I don't, by the way, am saying that your rings are of inferior quality, simply because I never tried them.
Just read my post closely, will you? I was talking about my bad experience with other O-rings, I have purchased elsewhere.
Post by: Lpwl on Fri, 19 September 2014, 04:37:18
OP,
I have the 60A slim model and I'm also worried about them not working so well with my Granite R2. Keep me updated when you get your Granite set. If you feel that these o-rings work well with SP DSA keycaps I will more then happy to buy a package of o-rings off you.
No problem !
I'll do some research and I'll keep you updated.
...The ball is in your court...I am confused here.
I understand that those WASDkeyboards 40A rings are quite expensive to you.
I also felt they were expensive, so I saved a little and purchased the same brand rings with free Prime shipping on Amazon and quite happy with them so far.
My question, though, was: whether you, or someone else could possibly offer the O-rings, which are while as elastic and durable as those WASDkeyboards blue ones, are just a little (50% - 60%) thicker?
I don't, by the way, am saying that your rings are of inferior quality, simply because I never tried them.
Just read my post closely, will you? I was talking about my bad experience with other O-rings, I have purchased elsewhere.
Sorry if I misunderstood your post buddy.
WASDkeyboards are made of EPDM rubber, mine are made of Silicone MVQ but they share the same hardness which is 40 Shore A (aka "soft" O-rings). If you need more information between these two materials, feel free to take a look here (http://www.dmrseals.co.uk/EP%20DATA%20SHEET.pdf) (EPDM) and there (http://www.dmrseals.co.uk/MVQ%20DATA%20SHEET.pdf) (MVQ).
Let's compare my "fat" O-rings with WASDkeyboards blue ones :
- Are they as elastic and durable ?
- Yes, even if they are not made of the same material (EPDM vs Silicone) they share the same "softness". - Are they thicker ?
- Yes, it’s the max thickness you can have in an O-ring. - Are they cheaper ?
- Yes.
Maybe swill (http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=profile;u=24130) could help us as I know he is writing an O-ring guide.
I've send him some "fat" and "slim" O-rings a month ago but I think he is still pretty busy working on his new house (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=45656.msg1463419#msg1463419).
;D
Post by: Data on Fri, 19 September 2014, 08:56:49
Post by: swill on Fri, 19 September 2014, 09:34:02
OP,
I have the 60A slim model and I'm also worried about them not working so well with my Granite R2. Keep me updated when you get your Granite set. If you feel that these o-rings work well with SP DSA keycaps I will more then happy to buy a package of o-rings off you.
No problem !
I'll do some research and I'll keep you updated....The ball is in your court...I am confused here.
I understand that those WASDkeyboards 40A rings are quite expensive to you.
I also felt they were expensive, so I saved a little and purchased the same brand rings with free Prime shipping on Amazon and quite happy with them so far.
My question, though, was: whether you, or someone else could possibly offer the O-rings, which are while as elastic and durable as those WASDkeyboards blue ones, are just a little (50% - 60%) thicker?
I don't, by the way, am saying that your rings are of inferior quality, simply because I never tried them.
Just read my post closely, will you? I was talking about my bad experience with other O-rings, I have purchased elsewhere.
Sorry if I misunderstood your post buddy.
WASDkeyboards are made of EPDM rubber, mine are made of Silicone MVQ but they share the same hardness which is 40 Shore A (aka "soft" O-rings). If you need more information between these two materials, feel free to take a look here (http://www.dmrseals.co.uk/EP%20DATA%20SHEET.pdf) (EPDM) and there (http://www.dmrseals.co.uk/MVQ%20DATA%20SHEET.pdf) (MVQ).
Let's compare my "fat" O-rings with WASDkeyboards blue ones :
- Are they as elastic and durable ?
- Yes, even if they are not made of the same material (EPDM vs Silicone) they share the same "softness".- Are they thicker ?
- Yes, it’s the max thickness you can have in an O-ring.- Are they cheaper ?
- Yes.
Maybe swill (http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=profile;u=24130) could help us as I know he is writing an O-ring guide.
I've send him some "fat" and "slim" O-rings a month ago but I think he is still pretty busy working on his new house (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=45656.msg1463419#msg1463419).
;D
I have been buried recently with 2 jobs, a renovation and a 1 year old. I will try to find a few minutes to give you some calculations comparing the 'fat' and 'slim' with the wasd o-rings...
Post by: Lpwl on Fri, 19 September 2014, 14:23:59
So are these available and you're just waiting on the fat ones to be delivered?
Everything is now ready.
All bags are checked and counted by hand (piece by piece). Sale thread in Classifieds is live (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=62935.0) !
[...]
I have been buried recently with 2 jobs, a renovation and a 1 year old. I will try to find a few minutes to give you some calculations comparing the 'fat' and 'slim' with the wasd o-rings...
Many thanks swill.
Post by: Lpwl on Sat, 04 October 2014, 04:01:35
I am still in talks with my contact in China to see if it can be produced but I think this could really work well with backlighting keyboards.
.... who said RGB backliiiiiiiiighting ?!!! :))
Post by: kitsun8 on Sun, 05 October 2014, 07:49:57
Would you guys be interested if I was able to get some "clear" O-rings in soft rubber material ?Hmmm I'm gonna need some more information but potentially interested here ;p
I am still in talks with my contact in China to see if it can be produced but I think this could really work well with backlighting keyboards.
.... who said RGB backliiiiiiiiighting ?!!! :))
Post by: Lpwl on Tue, 21 October 2014, 11:42:23
Just a note: not all of O-rings are created equal.
I have poor experience with the "008 Silicone O-rings 70A Durometer, Red, 3/16 ID. They are 1/16 width" purchased at Amazone (I think this is 1/16 thickness, not width).
I'm sorry you had bad experiences with O-rings but you know it took me a long time - thinking, reading and many tries with various thickness and hardness - to finally being able to bring this to you.Show Image(http://i.imgur.com/7kqWQ8g.png)
There is a fundamental difference of durometer between the product you tried and mine.
Yours : 70A (= hard).
Mine : 40A (= soft).
They feel completely different even if they share more or less the same size !These ones, and slightly thicker black ones (I lost their specs) were not holding for long and spitted, while remaining on the keys.
The WASDkeyboards 40A blue ones, on the other hand, are very good: softer, of course and their elasticity is superb.
I have none of them yet broken for a period of about a year of use.
I'm using these "fat" and "slim" O-rings without ANY problems for months.
To be honest, I can not enjoy typing on my CODE keyboard anymore without them and this is getting me nervous because I've recently ordered new keycaps (Granite R2 - DSA profile) that do not work well with O-rings.
I'm pretty sure WASDkeyboards's O-rings feel good but they are also very expensive.
This is exactly why I'm trying to bring these products to you.I wish there were rings offered, made of the same strong and elastic material, but with 150% - 170% thickness of the WASDkeyboards 40A blue ones. I think such thicker O-rings would be perfect for my CM QuickFire linear MX reds.
You should really try my "fat" O-rings as they seem to fit exactly what you are looking for.
The ball is in your court
I bought some WASD 40A blue & red O-rings for proper comparison !
(http://i.imgur.com/N8KuVxb.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/Giz2zpK.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/cop0BtU.jpg)
You'll find out more about them soon tm
Post by: Vitaly on Tue, 21 October 2014, 12:03:19
You'll find out more about them soon tmAlso interesting to compare cheap o-rings from ebay and ali.
Post by: Lpwl on Tue, 21 October 2014, 12:53:45
I can do that !
I'll just need links and some information about hardness with these cheap O-rings.
Post by: Vitaly on Tue, 21 October 2014, 13:18:55
I didn't find info about hardness, that's why I suggest to compare them :) I'm interested in fat but as I posted previously they maybe work like 2 thin orings on each other (thickness about the same + soft edges because circular section and thin edges = soft fat o-ring).
I can do that !
I'll just need links and some information about hardness with these cheap O-rings.
http://goo.gl/jMgffg http://goo.gl/w5Mu4X
Post by: Art of Payce on Sat, 28 February 2015, 16:21:36
Post by: Evo_Spec on Sat, 28 February 2015, 19:51:52
Put in an order for 90 Fat O-rings... A little disappointed in myself for not ordering a full set before they sold out. Lpwl, let me know if there's any inventory left for a 110 or 125... Thanks!
This is actually a really old thread, he has an actual FS thread in his signature.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=62935.0