geekhack
geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: jacobolus on Thu, 04 December 2014, 12:35:42
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Over at Reddit, QWERTim suggests (http://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/2o97i3/possible_cherry_mx_switch_shortage_in_2015/) that MX switches are all going to be in severe shortage this year:
I've had this confirmed by two suppliers now, that they either have no stock of several [types of MX] switches, or very limited. Cherry are quoting lead times out to 2016 for new stock on all variants and this is unlikely to change!
The year of Matias / Kaihua / Gateron?
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I've heard this from some people as well. I'll look deeper into it.
No real super legit source from me, but QWERtim has higher people than I do.
Really nothing confirmed at this point, at least as far as I can see.
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I guess the popularity of mechanical keyboards is really starting to take off!
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The year of Matias / Kaihua / Gateron?
Would love to see someone bring back the Space Invaders / Gundam switches. They feel like a luxurious version of MX Greens.
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Would love to see someone bring back the Space Invaders / Gundam switches. They feel like a luxurious version of MX Greens.
If you mean black clicky space invaders, those are quite a bit lighter than MX green. Maybe slightly heavier than MX blue though. Anyway, I don’t think NMB still makes them. I wonder if the Hi-Tek division of NMB still exists.
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I've heard this from some people as well. I'll look deeper into it.
No real super legit source from me, but QWERtim has higher people than I do.
Really nothing confirmed at this point, at least as far as I can see.
What are they high on?
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This is not news. It is the reason why some manufacturers (Razer, TECK, ...) switched to Kailh.
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This is not news. It is the reason why some manufacturers (Razer, TECK, ...) switched to Kailh.
Could also be the other way around, though.
Them all switching to Kailh might have caused this. Fewer clients, fewer keyboards, fewer switches.
Waiting to hear back from some people then maybe I'll get a better picture.
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Right then, time for Matias/Tai-Hao/Gaote/Gateron/Greetech/Kailh/Omron/whoever else is in the keyboard switch business these days (and if you look on alibaba and the like, there are plenty of other companies claiming to make keyboard switches, though who knows whether or not they are for real) to step up.
This is not news. It is the reason why some manufacturers (Razer, TECK, ...) switched to Kailh.
Could also be the other way around, though.
Them all switching to Kailh might have caused this. Fewer clients, fewer keyboards, fewer switches.
Waiting to hear back from some people then maybe I'll get a better picture.
There have been MX supply shortages since long before Kailh switches were widely adopted, though.
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This is not news. It is the reason why some manufacturers (Razer, TECK, ...) switched to Kailh.
Could also be the other way around, though.
Them all switching to Kailh might have caused this. Fewer clients, fewer keyboards, fewer switches.
Waiting to hear back from some people then maybe I'll get a better picture.
There have been MX supply shortages since long before Kailh switches were widely adopted, though.
[/quote]
:triangle:
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Right then, time for Matias/Tai-Hao/Gaote/Gateron/Greetech/Kailh/Omron/whoever else is in the keyboard switch business these days (and if you look on alibaba and the like, there are plenty of other companies claiming to make keyboard switches, though who knows whether or not they are for real) to step up.
This is not news. It is the reason why some manufacturers (Razer, TECK, ...) switched to Kailh.
Could also be the other way around, though.
Them all switching to Kailh might have caused this. Fewer clients, fewer keyboards, fewer switches.
Waiting to hear back from some people then maybe I'll get a better picture.
There have been MX supply shortages since long before Kailh switches were widely adopted, though.
At least the shortages are generally only one switch at a time, and are fulfilled later on anyway.
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I think if an alternate switch takes off, it'll have to be Cherry compatible. For that reason, I don't foresee Matias and Alps taking off.
Gateron is interesting because of the entirely see-through switch design, and I seem to recall they innovated a bit with their RGB led placement.
Khail is interesting because of their established nature already as an alternative to Cherry.
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This is not news. It is the reason why some manufacturers (Razer, TECK, ...) switched to Kailh.
Well I’ve been hearing keyboard makers complaining about switch availability for years, but I don’t think they’ve had >12 month lead times on every variety of MX switch before.
Could also be the other way around, though. Them all switching to Kailh might have caused this. Fewer clients, fewer keyboards, fewer switches.
No way. All these guys would keep using MX switches if they thought they had a reliable source. As Findecanor said, the big reason they switched away is because they can get guaranteed supply from Kaihua. That the switches are a bit cheaper is just an extra bonus.
I think if an alternate switch takes off, it'll have to be Cherry compatible. For that reason, I don't foresee Matias [..] taking off.
Why do you think it has to be MX-compatible? If it’s just for the keycaps, then (a) I have a bigger variety of nice Alps-compatible keycaps pulled from old boards than anyone I know has of MX-compatible ones, and (b) there are various folks currently working on making new Alps/Matias–compatible keycaps.
I think most people buying keyboards don’t really care/worry about what the switches are, even people buying mechanical keyboards. Among the people who are more knowledgeable and picky (and among people selling keyboards), there currently isn’t such great awareness of Matias switches, but I think that will change substantially in the next 1–2 years. The switches are so much better than MX switches that I think they’re going to start seeing more sales once there’s a wider variety of keyboards available.
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>Why do you think it has to be MX-compatible? If it’s just for the keycaps, then (a) I have a bigger variety of nice Alps-compatible keycaps pulled from old boards than anyone I know has of MX-compatible ones, and (b) there are various folks currently working on making new Alps/Matias–compatible keycaps.
Mainly due to mass-production and ease of continuation. The tooling for the keycaps are all based on the cruciform design. If manufacturers switch to another cruciform design, the cap makers don't have to change their tooling one bit. Any other switch and a lot of changes would be involved during production causing higher prices.
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shortage of mx switches is indeed confirmed, apparently there are some issues with some of the manufacturing machines, and there are some unconfirmed whispers that they're upgrading the machinery this year as well
this comes from 2 chinese suppliers and a taiwanese supplier
unless QWERtim is working with the same few guys i'm talking with and they're BSing us both (>1% chance), this seems like a real issue
:triangle:
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Mainly due to mass-production and ease of continuation. The tooling for the keycaps are all based on the cruciform design. If manufacturers switch to another cruciform design, the cap makers don't have to change their tooling one bit. Any other switch and a lot of changes would be involved during production causing higher prices.
Sure, but for the types of keycaps most keyboards are sold with today, tooling already exists for Alps mount and keycaps are easily available. So you must be talking about double-injection-molded or dye-sublimated aftermarket keycaps, or perhaps small batch artisan novelty caps. I just don’t think that many buyers care, outside the “enthusiast” community, which is still pretty small compared to the overall keyboard market, or even the mechanical keyboard market.
As for those enthusiasts: well, discerning ones should also prefer Matias switches, and shouldn’t have too much trouble sourcing old Alps boards from the 80s–90s. Then as I mentioned, there are various folks trying to come up with better Alps-mount caps, including Matias themselves. I’m sure the novelty keycap producers will catch up if need-be.
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shortage of mx switches is indeed confirmed, apparently there are some issues with some of the manufacturing machines, and there are some unconfirmed whispers that they're upgrading the machinery this year as well
this comes from 2 chinese suppliers and a taiwanese supplier
unless QWERtim is working with the same few guys i'm talking with and they're BSing us both (>1% chance), this seems like a real issue
:triangle:
Ouch!
If it is the machines in general, this could lead to a shortage of all switches, at least until they repair/upgrade the machines and get back to full speed. During the festive season.
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At DreamHack Ive spoke to CoolerMaster, Qpad, Razer, TurtleBeach, Xtify and Gigabyte and they all said the same thing. It seems to take longer and longer to get each batch and Cherry isnt very easy to deal with
Guess this opens up the market, Razer already moved on
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The real question is… who actually cares?
Vendors that sell gaming garbage will happily switch to the cheapest possible crap from China, and their customers won't even notice.
The enthusiast community still has plenty of vintage keyboards to discover and recover, and it's better&cheaper to harvest switches for DIY projects.
VIP customers like bureaucracy or businesses will probably get their orders anyway.
Keyboards aren't a priority for Cherry Corp. themselves.
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The real question is… who actually cares?
Vendors that sell gaming garbage will happily switch to the cheapest possible crap from China, and their customers won't even notice.
The enthusiast community still has plenty of vintage keyboards to discover and recover, and it's better&cheaper to harvest switches for DIY projects.
VIP customers like bureaucracy or businesses will probably get their orders anyway.
Keyboards aren't a priority for Cherry Corp. themselves.
Well, I think one down side could be that companies that would use Cherry switches might be hesitant to release a new product if they can't fulfill the demand. The Poker 3 is scheduled for release in Q1 of 2015. It will be a bummer if supply can't meet demand, and that seems like it would be a pretty popular release. I could see how it could hinder other manufactures from experimenting with new features and layouts if they don't have product to work with. I suppose they could switch to an alternative (like Matias), and I would welcome more options, but I don't want a Cherry clone.
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The real question is� who actually cares?
Vendors that sell gaming garbage will happily switch to the cheapest possible crap from China, and their customers won't even notice.
The enthusiast community still has plenty of vintage keyboards to discover and recover, and it's better&cheaper to harvest switches for DIY projects.
VIP customers like bureaucracy or businesses will probably get their orders anyway.
Keyboards aren't a priority for Cherry Corp. themselves.
Well, I think one down side could be that companies that would use Cherry switches might be hesitant to release a new product if they can't fulfill the demand. The Poker 3 is scheduled for release in Q1 of 2015. It will be a bummer if supply can't meet demand, and that seems like it would be a pretty popular release. I could see how it could hinder other manufactures from experimenting with new features and layouts if they don't have product to work with. I suppose they could switch to an alternative (like Matias), and I would welcome more options, but I don't want a Cherry clone.
A Poker 3 w/ Matias switches? Yes Please!
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Well, I can see how it might hurt some smaller "semi-enthusiast" companies, but yeah, there's nothing stopping them from using Matias switches (perhaps even Omron like Logitech) or even working with OEMs on higher-quality clones (see the mentions of ergo-clear-like switches by Matias' OEM in the Axios thread), but they would better refrain from advertising it like Razer. Vendor lock-in is a pretty lame excuse.
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You know it just occured to me - wasn't there a 'custom' keyboard company coming out that is a subsidiary of GMK? How is that going to play out? Are they going to get preferential treatment due to their association with Cherry - or - will a custom German keyboard company go Kailh on them? :)
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You know it just occured to me - wasn't there a 'custom' keyboard company coming out that is a subsidiary of GMK? How is that going to play out? Are they going to get preferential treatment due to their association with Cherry - or - will a custom German keyboard company go Kailh on them? :)
MX-compatible Topre ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
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You know it just occured to me - wasn't there a 'custom' keyboard company coming out that is a subsidiary of GMK? How is that going to play out? Are they going to get preferential treatment due to their association with Cherry - or - will a custom German keyboard company go Kailh on them? :)
Unikey (which is what I'm calling it from now on, no matter what it's actually pronnounced) is pretty much just a name and a keyboard at this point. I have no idea what it is, and the guy I talk to at GMK won't tell me what it is.
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#AuthenticCherries4Lyf
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(http://i.imgur.com/zrbBPTI.jpg)
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Over at Reddit, QWERTim suggests (http://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/2o97i3/possible_cherry_mx_switch_shortage_in_2015/) that MX switches are all going to be in severe shortage this year:
I've had this confirmed by two suppliers now, that they either have no stock of several [types of MX] switches, or very limited. Cherry are quoting lead times out to 2016 for new stock on all variants and this is unlikely to change!
The year of Matias / Kaihua / Gateron?
I don't know if this is down to the manufacturer or the supplier that I'm using, but I was going to go ahead and buy a new Noppoo choc mini to replace my current one that has a few chattering issues, I made the order on amazon, but I made the order from a different supplier than what I normally use, I then get an email from Amazon a few days later saying that my order has failed because the item I ordered is now out of stock and what not, despite it saying there was 2+ left in stock.
I was ordering MX Cherry reds though, it seems as if Reds are become more and more popular in certain keyboards, as with the noppoo for example, there is always plenty of browns and blacks available.
I certainly hope this not the year of Kailh switches.