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geekhack Community => Keyboard Keycaps => Topic started by: Karura on Fri, 05 December 2014, 00:45:21

Title: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Karura on Fri, 05 December 2014, 00:45:21
Just wondering, what do you guys prefer to have, Control or Ctrl on your keycaps?

The reason why I'm asking is because I've noticed that lately almost all keycaps being produced are using "Control", but what about "Ctrl", is there still any desire for it?

Some argue that "Ctrl" and "Alt" match up nicely when you look at it, but others have counter-argued that when we actually say it out loud, we say "Control, Alt", not "Control, Alternative"

So... with all that said, what does everyone prefer?

This is really trivial, but so is a lot of things in this hobby, so I thought I'd ask anyway  :p
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: mozaiq on Fri, 05 December 2014, 01:27:35
Well for me it's just that I don't like long names/printings on caps in general. So if I had the chance , I would go for CTRL. Maybe this is a matter of habit, since here in Germany, almost all native keyboards use "STRG" as a caption for the control key. So in that way I'm much more used to the abbreviation in this case. But I wouldn't rule out a keyset just because it uses Control instead of CTRL.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Oobly on Fri, 05 December 2014, 03:36:47
Depends on the profile and font used.

I like "Control" on GMK / Cherry sets, but most DCS profile sets I prefer "Ctrl", depending on the theme / colour scheme. For SA profile I like "CTRL", also "RETURN" on the Enter key :)

"Alternative" is a bit long to fit and I do feel that "Control" and "Alt" are okay together.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Coreda on Fri, 05 December 2014, 04:32:47
others have counter-argued that when we actually say it out loud, we say "Control, Alt", not "Control, Alternative"

'Ker-Tarl' all the way. Gotta be consistent. 'Ker-Tarl Alt Dell' just rolls off the tongue.

Macs as usual have the superior modifier - Kimm'd.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Puddsy on Fri, 05 December 2014, 06:57:25
Control = ANSI

ctrl = I SO
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: yasuo on Fri, 05 December 2014, 06:59:05
i like control than ctrl and eraser than backspace :))
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: hwood34 on Fri, 05 December 2014, 08:17:25
Control looks nice on all the GMK sets like Dolch and OG cherry, but not on anything else
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Findecanor on Fri, 05 December 2014, 09:17:32
It should say "Control".
"Ctrl" is an abbreviation for when the key is smaller than 1.5 wide and "Control" does not fit.

Similarly, the right Alt key in some layouts should say "Alt Graph" if that fits, not just "Alt Gr".
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: hwood34 on Fri, 05 December 2014, 10:04:21
It should say "Control".
"Ctrl" is an abbreviation for when the key is smaller than 1.5 wide and "Control" does not fit.

Similarly, the right Alt key in some layouts should say "Alt Graph" if that fits, not just "Alt Gr".
TIL
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: margo baggins on Fri, 05 December 2014, 10:09:12
Control = ANSI

ctrl = I SO

That's not true - I have a winkey cherry ISO set, control's say control.

It should say "Control".
"Ctrl" is an abbreviation for when the key is smaller than 1.5 wide and "Control" does not fit.

Similarly, the right Alt key in some layouts should say "Alt Graph" if that fits, not just "Alt Gr".

I don't think that's true either, for the same reason as above. I have cherry sets with 1.25x that say control.

See - G80-3000HQMGB

(http://i.imgur.com/fQu4c.jpg)
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: IvanIvanovich on Fri, 05 December 2014, 11:13:51
Control is pretty much the standard on Cherry stuff... I can only think of a few that used Ctrl or CTRL besides later 1800/11900 with 1x mods. As for personal preference, I don't really care much.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: ideus on Fri, 05 December 2014, 11:52:32
I'd prefer * as an icon for control.  :)
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: 0100010 on Fri, 05 December 2014, 15:23:26
Ctrl and Alt is what I am used to, but nothing wrong with Control and Alt, or Control and Alt Gr.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: HydraDyne on Fri, 05 December 2014, 16:33:32
I rather Ctrl, I personally like how the letters work together in such a way.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: rowdy on Sun, 07 December 2014, 01:30:31
Doesn't really bother me either way. I guess Control if there is room, Ctrl otherwise.  NEVER CTRL.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Hak Foo on Sun, 07 December 2014, 01:31:51
ISTR the Atari ST used "Alternate" on their Alt keys
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: jacobolus on Sun, 07 December 2014, 01:52:23
IBM’s keyboard layouts and legends were okay on beam spring keyboards (pretty symbols and full words), but the little hat keys (1u wide pressable area with steps on both sides or top/bottom of the keys) on the PC XT were stupid, and forced them to use abbreviated legends,[1] which were also stupid. For that matter, all of IBM’s subsequent keyboard layout ideas were also pretty stupid IMO, right up through the 101-key layout we all have to live with today.

Because all the hardware in the IBM/Wintel computing world was made to be clones, valuing compatibility over thoughtful design or any kind of innovation, we still have to live with many of IBM’s crappy choices from the 80s today.

Anyway, to answer your question, the correct legends are “Command”, “Option”, “Control”.

[1] No room on here for full words:
(http://deskthority.net/w/images/8/81/83key.jpg)
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: jacobolus on Sun, 07 December 2014, 01:56:48
Similarly, the right Alt key in some layouts should say "Alt Graph" if that fits, not just "Alt Gr".
Should be “Alternate” and “Alternate Graph”. Though to be honest the word “graph” was a poor choice, since that’s a technical term in linguistics no one who isn’t a linguist ever uses in any context.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: jonathanyu on Sun, 07 December 2014, 12:35:02
I like CTRL rather than Control because it give a more consistent feel since Alternative, Alternative Graph, Delete are also written in short form.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Findecanor on Sun, 07 December 2014, 13:55:10
ISTR the Atari ST used "Alternate" on their Alt keys
Thanks. I knew there was a keyboard that did it, but I couldn't quite remember which.
The Atari ST keyboard (and the rest of the computer also, btw) was quite horrible, and worth forgetting ...
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: jacobolus on Sun, 07 December 2014, 15:35:19
ISTR the Atari ST used "Alternate" on their Alt keys
Thanks. I knew there was a keyboard that did it, but I couldn't quite remember which.
NeXT keyboards also used “Alternate”.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: SpicyLobotomy on Mon, 08 December 2014, 20:44:21
I'd rather have CTRL, or just a symbol. Minimalism is beautiful on a keyboard IMO.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: PocoLoco on Sat, 13 December 2014, 10:14:08
I personally prefer ctrl over control i think it all depends on the space available and personal preferance
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: user 18 on Sat, 13 December 2014, 20:09:23
If I'm picking, I prefer to see CTRL over anything else. If it's on a set someone else designed, it wouldn't be enough to stop me from getting the set either way.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: gravenshard on Sat, 13 December 2014, 23:40:42
CTRL > Control
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: rowdy on Sun, 14 December 2014, 19:29:48
I've just realised Nuclear Data Green has CTRL legends.  Scrub my earlier comment about CTRL :p
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Artonkn on Mon, 22 December 2014, 12:15:36
CTRL imo, Control feels too squeezed
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Dongulator on Sun, 28 December 2014, 20:47:47
Both work for me.. everything I have does have Ctrl though. Maybe I should change that.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Karura on Wed, 20 May 2015, 02:27:53
Reviving this thread from the dead, since it's been a long time.

Lately we've had a lot of GMK group buys, with the majority opting for Control over Ctrl or other alternatives, so I was curious:

Do you still prefer Control on your 1.25 keys or do I sense some need for the Ctrl legend?
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Matias on Wed, 20 May 2015, 02:51:08
Similarly, the right Alt key in some layouts should say "Alt Graph" if that fits, not just "Alt Gr".
Should be “Alternate” and “Alternate Graph”. Though to be honest the word “graph” was a poor choice, since that’s a technical term in linguistics no one who isn’t a linguist ever uses in any context.


I always figured that "Alt Gr" stood for "Alternate Graphic" or "Alternate Graphics" -- as in the extended character set by extending ASCII from 7 to 8 bits.


Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: baldgye on Wed, 20 May 2015, 04:32:47
Ctrl Atl is life
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: rowdy on Wed, 20 May 2015, 06:19:35
Ctrl Atl is life

QFT
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: nubbinator on Wed, 20 May 2015, 09:55:23
Ctrl for consistency with Alt, Control if it's replacing Caps Lock.  It's not a big thing to me though, unlike some others that can kill a set for me.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: hwood34 on Wed, 20 May 2015, 09:59:27
Depends on the profile and font used.

I like "Control" on GMK / Cherry sets, but most DCS profile sets I prefer "Ctrl", depending on the theme / colour scheme. For SA profile I like "CTRL", also "RETURN" on the Enter key :)

"Alternative" is a bit long to fit and I do feel that "Control" and "Alt" are okay together.
This. May be that I've just become accustomed to seeing each this way but it just feels better.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: againer on Wed, 20 May 2015, 15:59:49
I'd rather have CTRL, or just a symbol. Minimalism is beautiful on a keyboard IMO.

Since I can never find matching keycaps for a swiss layout. I am used to blank keycaps. I started to like blank keycaps. You should try blanks too, they are even more minimalistic :p
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Karura on Thu, 21 May 2015, 02:00:05
Does anyone have photos of an OG Cherry keyboard that has the "Ctrl" legends? I know that there are boards like OG Olivetti that had "CTRL" on it, but was wondering if "Ctrl" was ever a thing. Almost all OG boards I've seen, including TA, OG dyesub, all had Control on it.

Even OG dyesub german ISO ones have "Control" on it.

Just curious to see if anyone has anything :)
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: nightdriver on Thu, 21 May 2015, 18:50:33
i like the all caps CTRL on the triumph adler set!
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: nightdriver on Thu, 21 May 2015, 18:51:17
oh, i also like the "escape" keycaps that have the whole word on them.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Megaweapon on Thu, 21 May 2015, 19:13:09
Control = ANSI

ctrl = I SO

I love Ctrl but hate ISO.  What's wrong with me??
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: KnivesM on Thu, 21 May 2015, 19:42:10
I prefer Control over CTRL/Ctrl but it's not really a big issue.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Findecanor on Thu, 21 May 2015, 22:52:05
I think CTRL in all-caps should be used only if all other textual legends are all-caps. It is an abbreviation, not an initialism.

I always figured that "Alt Gr" stood for "Alternate Graphic" or "Alternate Graphics" -- as in the extended character set by extending ASCII from 7 to 8 bits.
When I was in typing class back in 8th grade, I was taught that "Alt Gr" stood for "Alt Grande" ... and that I should think of it as the "Big Alternate" where as the left Alt key was the "Small Alternate" key. When looking back I think that it was only meant as a mnemonic, but I had interpreted it as gospel. I was under this false belief for a number of years ... :mad:

BTW, we had IBM PCs with clicky Model Ms back then. And nobody complained about the noise. The school official who got us them was very proud of having got "proper" computers and not Compis (http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?st=1&c=358).
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: nubbinator on Thu, 21 May 2015, 23:15:43
For some unknown reason to me, Alt Gr always became Alt Greel in my head.  No clue where Greel came from or what it means, just that what it be.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: baldgye on Fri, 22 May 2015, 08:08:21
For some unknown reason to me, Alt Gr always became Alt Greel in my head.  No clue where Greel came from or what it means, just that what it be.

YES
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: SamFlynn on Sat, 23 May 2015, 00:21:18
I always felt as if Control/Ctrl should have its own symbol like Caps:

(https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR7rZCBuxygxaP0XvPdomgSLexC611E8vMbu7ddacXxFbYG2qRs)
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Findecanor on Sat, 23 May 2015, 01:22:32
The common symbol for Control is ^.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Eszett on Sat, 23 May 2015, 02:40:12
Why do you mix up Alt with Alt Gr, aren't both different keys?
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: nubbinator on Sat, 23 May 2015, 12:51:37
For some unknown reason to me, Alt Gr always became Alt Greel in my head.  No clue where Greel came from or what it means, just that what it be.

YES

umm, ok (http://mtgsalvation.gamepedia.com/Greel).
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Eszett on Sun, 24 May 2015, 15:21:57
Both "CTRL" and "CONTROL" are common. As a stilistic rule, write (print) a word out whenever possible. If you can't write it out due to lack of space, shorten it. Collapsed abbreviations as "CTRL", where letters inside are left out, are rather ugly, don't you think so? Or do you want to read something like "BCKSPCE"? I would rather prefer to read something like "BACK", "BACKSP." oder even "BS". If practically necessary, as for an 1u for example, "CTRL" is tolerable, though.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Monophonic on Tue, 02 June 2015, 02:49:49
I prefer to see full words. It's one thing I like about the Mac keyboards more. So I guess that falls into line with the counter argument you said.

I also like seeing a space between Caps and Lock
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: chive_ on Tue, 02 June 2015, 17:55:51
It doesn't matter that much to me, I'd go with either if I wanted the keyset.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: Lengradde on Fri, 05 June 2015, 10:37:55
I have no preference, as long as it is consistent throughout the keyboard.
Title: Re: Ctrl or Control Legends?
Post by: metal369 on Fri, 05 June 2015, 19:48:26
I like CTRL too, but it is rare. lol