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geekhack Community => Ergonomics => Topic started by: cnnx on Sat, 24 January 2015, 16:53:36
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So I'm looking to replace my current 7 year old staples leather chair that I paid 300$ for either a new leap or aeron. The other night I went to a store and they let me try the size B and C Aeron, it was pretty nice. I haven't tried the steelcase leap yet. Which one should I buy? I've read many mixed reviews online and the sales guy didn't even know that the steelcase leap existed until I told him about it. What are your experiences? I'm 6'1, 260lbs and want a chair that won't hurt after long hours in front of the computer yet still comfortable.
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I don’t personally like any of these low office chairs. :-)
There are a whole bunch of more interesting seating options here: http://www.ergodepot.com/category_s/168.htm
I like tall saddle stool type seats (I really enjoy the HÅG Capiso chair which supports many different sitting positions), and adjustable-height (“sit–stand”) desks, mixed with occasional reclining on a couch or slouchable chair with a laptop.
But more generally, I’d say you should see if you can try each chair you’re considering for a couple of days, or at least a few hours, before making a decision. Personal preferences in seating vary quite a bit depending on sitting position, body shape, etc.
Have you looked at this thread? https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=37338
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I say leap has better coccyx arrangement
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I have a Leap. The store I went to had several models including the Leap and Aeron. I didn't try them for an extended period of time, but I liked the Leap enough to buy it.
As jacobolus mentioned, you should definitely try it out before you buy. Especially considering how expensive these chairs are and how long you are likely to be sitting in one.
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Also with the Aeron specifically, there's the inevitable sagging issue.. They make similar chairs without the mesh though.. so you could always still get those.
The Leap won't sag.
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I wouldn’t worry about Aeron seat sagging: (1) I know folks who have been using them daily for at least 5–6 years with absolutely no signs of wear, (2) Herman Miller puts ridiculously long warranties on their chairs (10 years or something?), so if it starts sagging anytime soon you can just get them to replace the seat part.
Just buy the chair you like better when you try it.
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I would not go with the Aeron, I currently have one and I'm looking for another chair.
Why people say its an ergo chair is beyond me because you cannot adjust anything...
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Leap V2. I liked mine so much I replaced our Ethan Allen POS kitchen table chairs with the as well. Super comfortable, supportive, highly adjustable chair. Better than the Humanscale which I also own. The Aeron just looks cool, but sit in both and you'll immediately feel the difference.
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I've used and satisfied with Aeron for long time and its warranty expired completely now. I like particularly its mesh seat that prevents sweat in ass :D
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Okay thanks everyone for your opinions, sounds like I need to go try a steelcase leap :)
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I have both of the chairs you mentioned. I like the customization of the leap v2 over the Aeron, however in the comfort area, it's the Aeron for me. 5 yrs so far and no sagging. If going Aeron, pick the right size. Recently tried the Mirra 2, it's also very comfy.
Leap: "Nice comfy and supportive"
Aeron: "Wait, am I sitting and on a chair? Whoa it's like I'm floating"
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I sat in a HM Aeron everyday for 4 years when I was working in NJ. I am still contemplating asking someone on my team to disassemble and ship one to me for my office here in Dallas.
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I have an Aeron. It's nice but I wish I had the head rest. I've never tried the Leap so I can't really compare, but I've heard great things.
This post isn't very useful. :(
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I'm an Aeron fan and will likely never buy another chair that doesn't have a mesh seat (can't stand sitting on fabric seats now). Floating on air is a good analogy, but only once it's adjusted correctly -- which is why the fully adjustable model is kinda important.
I would not go with the Aeron, I currently have one and I'm looking for another chair.
Why people say its an ergo chair is beyond me because you cannot adjust anything...
Do you have the fully-loaded model?
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The fully-loaded version of the Aeron is not very adjustable.
A chair where you cannot change the back height is not adjustable nor ergonomic
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The fully-loaded version of the Aeron is not very adjustable.
A chair where you cannot change the back height is not adjustable nor ergonomic
To be honest no standard low office chair can really be called “ergonomic”. Sitting statically in a chair for hours on end every day is a terrible idea. Saddle stools, kneeling chairs, bouncy chairs, etc. are slightly better, but switching positions frequently is better still.
As standard office chairs go, I think the Aeron is fairly comparable to the Leap and others. The relevant adjustments are the “posture fit” knob, the height of the lumbar support pad, and the thickness of the pad (it can be flipped around to stick out more or less). It’s not really necessary to adjust the height of the whole back, those 3 existing adjustments cover most body shapes and standard office chair preferences.
For me personally, any regular wooden chair (like the ones you might see at a 19th century desk or kitchen table) is actually about as comfortable and “ergonomic” as these $1000 low office chairs. You just have to learn to sit properly, and not spend too much time sitting.
This lady is a little too focused on self promotion for my taste, but some of what she says is pretty interesting:
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A new Aeron comes with 12 years warranty but the warranty cannot be transferred (it's great if you can buy a $300 one out of a failed startup but you won't have any warranty). I've got mine since 4 years : I use it daily and for extended period of time and it looks brand new. No wear whatsoever. Should it break in more than 8 years and hence be out of warranty, I'd buy a new one in a heartbeat.
Also there are many pieces you can buy on eBay for your Aeron: for example I added a coat-hanger on mine. But you can also buy replacement / refurbished part.
I don't know what the person saying you cannot configure a Aeron is smoking but I'd like to have some. I took me 30 minutes to configure everything the day I received it, following the instruction in the manual and the setup is perfect and the setup never ever moved. Basically if you put your hands behind your head with your feet slightly of the ground (say one inch above the ground), the chair must lean back. If you then put your hands back on your keyboard, the chair must lean forward. This is pure perfection IMHO.
You can configure how far the chair leans back, how fast it leans back and how easily it leans back. Pretty sweet.
Anyway you cannot tell if you like a chair or not until you've sweat enough in the chair: to me the pellicle mesh on the Aeron is the single best thing ever invented to prevent excessive sweating and that's why I could never ever go back working on a chair which doesn't have the same kind of mesh (both for the back and for the butt: some chairs have a mesh but only for the back, that's not good enough). To me the ultimate chair fail is saying you have a comfortable chair and then putting a towel on the chair: sad.
My sister-in-law had an Aeron at her job and told me she didn't like it. it's a huge company so I told her to call someone to help her setup the Aeron correctly... She then bought one for her home too ; )
Most criticism I read about the Aeron are from people who don't know how to set it up correctly: you cannot just sit in the Aeron of someone who doesn't have the same weight as you and make an opinion about the chair without first configuring it to your size/weight. For example if you sit in the Aeron of someone weighting more than you, you'll have the impression that the chair pushes to heavily in your back and that's not comfortable.
Truth is: many people know how to setup their Aeron correctly and there are more people who tried an Aeron correctly set up which like the Aeron a lot than people who do not like it.
I don't have much to say about the Steelcase Leap: I keep hearing good things about it but without a pellicle mesh "for the butt", this chair simply ain't for me :)
Hope you find something that you like, good luck and let us know what you eventually settled for!
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A new Aeron comes with 12 years warranty but the warranty cannot be transferred (it's great if you can buy a $300 one out of a failed startup but you won't have any warranty). I've got mine since 4 years : I use it daily and for extended period of time and it looks brand new. No wear whatsoever. Should it break in more than 8 years and hence be out of warranty, I'd buy a new one in a heartbeat.
Also there are many pieces you can buy on eBay for your Aeron: for example I added a coat-hanger on mine. But you can also buy replacement / refurbished part.
I don't know what the person saying you cannot configure a Aeron is smoking but I'd like to have some. I took me 30 minutes to configure everything the day I received it, following the instruction in the manual and the setup is perfect and the setup never ever moved. Basically if you put your hands behind your head with your feet slightly of the ground (say one inch above the ground), the chair must lean back. If you then put your hands back on your keyboard, the chair must lean forward. This is pure perfection IMHO.
You can configure how far the chair leans back, how fast it leans back and how easily it leans back. Pretty sweet.
Anyway you cannot tell if you like a chair or not until you've sweat enough in the chair: to me the pellicle mesh on the Aeron is the single best thing ever invented to prevent excessive sweating and that's why I could never ever go back working on a chair which doesn't have the same kind of mesh (both for the back and for the butt: some chairs have a mesh but only for the back, that's not good enough). To me the ultimate chair fail is saying you have a comfortable chair and then putting a towel on the chair: sad.
My sister-in-law had an Aeron at her job and told me she didn't like it. it's a huge company so I told her to call someone to help her setup the Aeron correctly... She then bought one for her home too ; )
Most criticism I read about the Aeron are from people who don't know how to set it up correctly: you cannot just sit in the Aeron of someone who doesn't have the same weight as you and make an opinion about the chair without first configuring it to your size/weight. For example if you sit in the Aeron of someone weighting more than you, you'll have the impression that the chair pushes to heavily in your back and that's not comfortable.
Truth is: many people know how to setup their Aeron correctly and there are more people who tried an Aeron correctly set up which like the Aeron a lot than people who do not like it.
I don't have much to say about the Steelcase Leap: I keep hearing good things about it but without a pellicle mesh "for the butt", this chair simply ain't for me :)
Hope you find something that you like, good luck and let us know what you eventually settled for!
Have you sat in the Leap V2? The chair is awesome!! I bought 5 of them since they're so comfortable. No back pain or shoulder strain used in combination with a Humanscale keyboard mount and mouse clip.
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I recently ordered a Steelcase Leap so I might post a small review of it in the future even tho I don't have much of a baseline. Never figured I'd get a 350€ chair but then again I'd rather have a good chair for a long ass time than 50-200€ chairs with questionable durability.
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I bought a Steelcase Think and have nothing but nice things to say about it. I tried the Leap, but it was a bit outside my price range at the time.
Either way, I have nothing but bad to say about Aeron chairs. They just don't feel great to me at all. They're mushy and uncomfortable. I don't get it. At my previous employer, we had Think and Aeron chairs and everyone clamored for the Aeron, which left me with the much more comfortable Think chairs.
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I recently ordered a Steelcase Leap so I might post a small review of it in the future even tho I don't have much of a baseline. Never figured I'd get a 350� chair but then again I'd rather have a good chair for a long ass time than 50-200� chairs with questionable durability.
Leap V2 right? It's more adjustable and comfortable from what I recall.
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Wirecutter likes the Leap: http://thewirecutter.com/reviews/best-office-chair-is-the-steelcase-leap/ (http://thewirecutter.com/reviews/best-office-chair-is-the-steelcase-leap/)
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I recently ordered a Steelcase Leap so I might post a small review of it in the future even tho I don't have much of a baseline. Never figured I'd get a 350� chair but then again I'd rather have a good chair for a long ass time than 50-200� chairs with questionable durability.
Leap V2 right? It's more adjustable and comfortable from what I recall.
V1 I think, I think they'd mention if it was V2, newer model being a better selling point and such. I'm not one for ergonomics. Yet anyway. I just wanted a chair that'll last me a good 10-x years.
And since there are not too many HM or Steelcase distributors here (unless you're a firm) so getting a used chair will be easier and obviously cheaper.
Originally I was looking for a HM Mirra but the Leap seems like a sound investment too.
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For me personally, any regular wooden chair (like the ones you might see at a 19th century desk or kitchen table) is actually about as comfortable and �ergonomic� as these $1000 low office chairs. You just have to learn to sit properly, and not spend too much time sitting.
I somehow get the feeling that you're not as old as I am. I used to think the same thing, but I can tell you from experience that as you age your opinion changes on this front. Also as things like arthritis and other age related problems start cropping up that changes your opinion as well.
I personally don't think that any of the backless type chairs are ergonomic at all. Healthy? Maybe. Ergonomic (meaning that they promote good posture, give you proper support and doesn't do you any harm)? Not a chance. Ergonomic chairs should offer you proper support and be very adjustable in order to fit to your personal needs and give you proper support where required ... those high stool and/or kneeling chairs or wooded kitchen style chairs do none of the above, they just give you a place to plant your behind and maybe raise of lower it -- and also maybe crinkle up your legs into positions that don't promote proper blood flow (like kneeling). So while they may be potentially "good for you" they are certainly not really ergonomic -- I think this is something that people mix up all the time. Also it's a very personal thing, what works for one person might be the worst thing for the next -- we're all setup very differently.
I do agree with what you say about moving frequently though, that's essential. Sitting in any position for hours and hours and hours without moving is a bad thing, always.
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I've got an Aeron at home, and have always used them at work. I think they are extremely comfortable.
That said, I used to work with interior designers and they would talk about furniture all the time. Aerons were never designed to be 'egronomic' chairs. This was pure marketing schtick that was slapped onto them much more recently.
My Aerons are super comfortable, but do nothing to promote a 'heathly' posture. They are great for slouching back in though.
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I never tried an Aeron or a Leap but I'll echo slip84's comment above. I got a Think last month and the support and comfort levels are superb. The chair basically makes it very hard to slouch, which is a great thing once you admit that it's bad for your back in the long run. I can sit straight for hours in front of my screen and no feel pain in the back or neck at the end of the day (no headrest needed by the way, it's all in the back support) or recline and watch a 3-hour movie without discomfort (although the chair was not specifically designed with leisure in mind, it still holds up pretty well).
Consiedering it's not hard to find in very good condition under $200, I think it's a great choice if you want an ergonomic chair on a budget.
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I have chronic back pain with all kinds of stuff wrong with my back. My desk chair bit the dust several years ago and I researched the Aeron and Leap endlessly. Both have their fervent followers so I decided to try them out. I went to the Steelcase store and tried the Leap, Amia, and the chair that preceded the Gesture - they were OK but they weren't much more comfortable than any other office chair. Then I went to our local Herman Miller store - the Aeron looked neat but really didn't feel that special to sit in. I noticed these weird fabric covered plastic and metal chairs all over the place with a back with multiple articulations similar to our spine and a seat hard to describe. It was called the Embody chair (http://store.hermanmiller.com/Products/Embody-Chair?device=c&network=g&matchtype=b&gclid=CK3x9e3T3cMCFYgdgQodVogAHA (http://store.hermanmiller.com/Products/Embody-Chair?device=c&network=g&matchtype=b&gclid=CK3x9e3T3cMCFYgdgQodVogAHA) ) and I've never sat in a chair like it before. The back molds to the contour of your spine with the ability to adjust the lumbar support and the amount it reclines, and the other typical features you look for in a desk chair. If you are looking for good support, adjust-ability, durability, and simply a great chair with a great warranty check the Embody out. I bought mine 5 or so years ago and the chair has been worth the cost. If price is an issue check for office furniture liquidators and you can find Aeron and Leap chairs for great prices.
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I bought an Aeron C size back in 1998 or 1999 brand new. It was a great chair and HM support was superb.
After I started working from home, I realized I could not spend all day in the chair - it was fine for an evening gaming session but after most of a day, it hurt my legs - likely due to sagging after a good 12 years. I sold it for $300
I'm considering a Leap - probably the Leap Plus - possibly the Criterion Plus. I don't think I would buy another mesh chair.
I'm about the size of your average NFL lineman and I just have not had a chair I like for a couple years and it's pretty miserable.
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heard good things about the aeron