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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: bigDave on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:05:28

Title: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: bigDave on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:05:28: After having a browse on ebay today I found an IBM Model M (UK ISO) in mint condition and with a current bid of £29 (inc postage).

At the moment I am using a Cherry g80 3000 with MX Blues. How do buckling springs compare for gaming and typing?
Blues are not considered an optimal switch for gaming however neither are buckling springs.

Any help and opinions are appreciated.

Thanks

Dave
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: snoopy on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:07:26: Yes, you will like Buckling Spring.

For typing awesome... not sure about gaming...
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: madhias on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:08:17: I can't tell that much about gaming with BS, but you will definitely love the click sound and also the switch feeling. Compared to MX Blues BS sound for me much more mature, and the overall sound is way better. Afterwards i did not really like MX Click sound anymore :)
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: bigDave on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:10:24: Quote from: snoopy on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:07:26
Yes, you will like Buckling Spring.

For typing awesome... not sure about gaming...

Do you game at all on your BS keyboards?
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: sleepy916 on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:14:14: I used my model F for games, mainly for SC2. It works fine for me but then again I'm not a pro or anything.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: madhias on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:14:21: I played Tomb Raider, and had no big problems. Civilization does not count i think :) I have problems with some shortcuts in Photoshop at work, for example i can only use the RIGHT SHIFT and CMD (caps lock) and S, and not LEFT SHIFT and CMD and S.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: Geroximo on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:20:44: Will you like buckling spring?
Will I never be able to own a SSK?
Well, ... probably yes.
But in the end ... nobody knows.
Try it! You can always resell the Model M again.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: Melvang on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:23:49: Buckling springs are what blues are trying to be like. Chances are if you like blues you will like buckling springs. Fair warning though the M is only 2KRO. If you really want to game on buckling springs I would recommend picking up an F and converting it.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: Defect on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:37:28: Buckling Spring will make the return to MX blue very difficult.

I mean, blues try to emulate BS within cherry housing. But plastic slapping plastic doesn't compare to that spring in barrel.

Add in the sturdiness of M's.

You'll like buckling spring. I guarantee it.

(Unless noise is bothersome to you)
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: bigDave on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:51:57: Quote from: Melvang on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:23:49
Buckling springs are what blues are trying to be like. Chances are if you like blues you will like buckling springs. Fair warning though the M is only 2KRO. If you really want to game on buckling springs I would recommend picking up an F and converting it.

Does 2kro mean that you can only press a maximum of two keys at the same time and am I right in thinking that modifies don't count? If you do press more than 2 does you keyboard glitch out or is there just a delay?
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: Computer-Lab in Basement on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:57:27: buckling spring = god tier switch
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: Melvang on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:59:20: Quote from: bigDave on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:51:57
Quote from: Melvang on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:23:49
Buckling springs are what blues are trying to be like. Chances are if you like blues you will like buckling springs. Fair warning though the M is only 2KRO. If you really want to game on buckling springs I would recommend picking up an F and converting it.

Does 2kro mean that you can only press a maximum of two keys at the same time and am I right in thinking that modifies don't count? If you do press more than 2 does you keyboard glitch out or is there just a delay?

Essentially yes. The way I understand it when a board is labeled as 2KRO that is the fewest number of keys that every combination will work. Modifiers are something else though as usually they are separate, but from what I have heard people that map caps lock to control run into issues with that while gaming on an M.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: Snowdog993 on Mon, 26 January 2015, 14:08:53: No problem. Just get one. Decide for yourself.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: Firebolt1914 on Mon, 26 January 2015, 14:48:12: Buckling spring is so much more organic and alive than MX Blues. It's very hard to describe over the internet what these feel like. They're probably my favorite switch.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: chyros on Mon, 26 January 2015, 14:55:26: I play a fair amount of games, including with my model M. I find it works well, and it's amazing for typing, but it feels obvious from the feel of the keyboard that it was not designed for gaming, as nice as the keys sound and feel when you press them. Particularly if you play very twitchy games that require very quick fingerwork and tapping, it's not ideal. Not bad at all, just not ideal. I would say that if the majority of the use of your keyboard is going to be gaming, you would probably be disappointed. I also gamed a fair amount with an MX blue board, and found it non-ideal for gaming either, but for completely different reasons. The sound of MX blues is horrible though, and the feel doesn't even come close. Nonetheless, neither are important when you're gaming.

If you can get a model M for a cheap price, it's probably worth it regardless of whether you turn out to like them or not - at worst, you can re-sell them.

I made a review of my model M recently - hope it helps.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: bigDave on Mon, 26 January 2015, 16:32:36: Quote from: chyros on Mon, 26 January 2015, 14:55:26
I play a fair amount of games, including with my model M. I find it works well, and it's amazing for typing, but it feels obvious from the feel of the keyboard that it was not designed for gaming, as nice as the keys sound and feel when you press them. Particularly if you play very twitchy games that require very quick fingerwork and tapping, it's not ideal. Not bad at all, just not ideal. I would say that if the majority of the use of your keyboard is going to be gaming, you would probably be disappointed. I also gamed a fair amount with an MX blue board, and found it non-ideal for gaming either, but for completely different reasons. The sound of MX blues is horrible though, and the feel doesn't even come close. Nonetheless, neither are important when you're gaming.

If you can get a model M for a cheap price, it's probably worth it regardless of whether you turn out to like them or not - at worst, you can re-sell them.

I made a review of my model M recently - hope it helps.

I have watched your videos already! I've watched your video about the dell at101w. Thanks for the link regardless.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: hwood34 on Mon, 26 January 2015, 16:51:24: There's definitely a much more pronounced "snap" the clicks in buckling spring. Just remember that they are a little heavier than MX Blues
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: Touch_It on Mon, 26 January 2015, 17:23:28: I game on my model F. I have also on my M. Mostly bfbc2 bf3 and l4d2. F is nkro m is 2kro. No issues and enjoyable on both.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: meztek on Mon, 26 January 2015, 19:13:39: Quote from: Melvang on Mon, 26 January 2015, 13:23:49
Buckling springs are what blues are trying to be like. Chances are if you like blues you will like buckling springs.

I agree with this point. I use an IBM M13 for daily computing, typing, novel writing, and occasional gaming. I have tried blues and they are very much like a "softer" buckling springs. Buckling springs are louder, have a more distinct sound (the keystrokes have a bit of a ringing sound to them), and are a bit heaver than blues. Not to mention, IBM keyboards are built to last. Consider that you're buying a keyboard build decades ago which still functions. You don't get that degree of quality out of Cherry switches.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: 1391406 on Mon, 26 January 2015, 21:08:50: In my opinion, one of the the biggest considerations will be the actuation force, which is definitely lighter with MX Blues. As mentioned, Buckling Spring is a heavier switch. It's actually a bit too heavy for me. The Model F's slightly lighter actuation force feels more comfortable to me. I'm also not crazy about the M's hollow metallic ping after each keystroke, but that's me.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: meztek on Mon, 26 January 2015, 23:31:11: Quote from: 1391406 on Mon, 26 January 2015, 21:08:50
I'm also not crazy about the M's hollow metallic ping after each keystroke, but that's me.

I to quite the contrary find myself rather fond of that hollow metallic ping sound, it's like each keystroke rings. Initially it sounded a little weird to me since I had never heard it in person before (recordings don't do it justice) but it grew on me.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: Heliosphere on Tue, 27 January 2015, 02:58:20: The Model M has a fairly heavy keypress compared to MX blues and it could tire you out, as was the case with me. The Model F keypress is lighter, and I enjoy typing on it rather than the Model M, but the M has a more reasonable modern layout.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: 1391406 on Tue, 27 January 2015, 03:26:14: Quote from: Heliosphere on Tue, 27 January 2015, 02:58:20
the M has a more reasonable modern layout.

Though as a side note, the AT and 122-key Model F variants can be modded to closely replicate the Model M's layout. Especially the 122-key.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: rowdy on Tue, 27 January 2015, 03:56:11: You will like buckling spring.

Or else ...

:p

I go all sorts of things with mine - no worries at all. I do have stronger fingers, and tend to bottom out all my keyboards including BS, MX blacks and MX greens.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: Clix on Tue, 27 January 2015, 04:03:29: You will like buckling spring
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: snoopy on Tue, 27 January 2015, 06:06:16: And I bet after you got a normal M, you will start hunting for a SSK or Model F... ;D
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: meztek on Tue, 27 January 2015, 08:43:29: Quote from: snoopy on Tue, 27 January 2015, 06:06:16
And I bet after you got a normal M, you will start hunting for a SSK or Model F... ;D

No! Don't encourage anyone to do this! The 101 key layout is practically perfect in every way and I'm done buying keyboards!
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: 1391406 on Tue, 27 January 2015, 09:23:40: Quote from: meztek on Tue, 27 January 2015, 08:43:29
Quote from: snoopy on Tue, 27 January 2015, 06:06:16
And I bet after you got a normal M, you will start hunting for a SSK or Model F... ;D

No! Don't encourage anyone to do this! The 101 key layout is practically perfect in every way and I'm done buying keyboards!

I love the layout, but once you've tried Capacitive Buckling Springs, it's hard or impossible to go back.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: snoopy on Tue, 27 January 2015, 10:06:25: Quote from: meztek on Tue, 27 January 2015, 08:43:29
Quote from: snoopy on Tue, 27 January 2015, 06:06:16
And I bet after you got a normal M, you will start hunting for a SSK or Model F... ;D

No! Don't encourage anyone to do this! The 101 key layout is practically perfect in every way and I'm done buying keyboards!

Look how cute a SSK is:

(http://i.imgur.com/onhKW.jpg)

Can you really resist?

And man, you should try a Model F... feels so good... ;)

:)) :p
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: Geroximo on Tue, 27 January 2015, 11:28:03: Why you doing this :'(
Don't remind us of not having a SSK.
Thanky you :'(
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: snoopy on Tue, 27 January 2015, 12:17:36: Sorry, I'm pure evil. >:D
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: bigDave on Tue, 27 January 2015, 13:35:04: Quote from: snoopy on Tue, 27 January 2015, 10:06:25
Quote from: meztek on Tue, 27 January 2015, 08:43:29
Quote from: snoopy on Tue, 27 January 2015, 06:06:16
And I bet after you got a normal M, you will start hunting for a SSK or Model F... ;D

No! Don't encourage anyone to do this! The 101 key layout is practically perfect in every way and I'm done buying keyboards!

Look how cute a SSK is:

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/onhKW.jpg)

Can you really resist?

And man, you should try a Model F... feels so good... ;)

:)) :p

Nice board! I really want an SSK now, also the model M on ebay keeps going up in price, now it is £53 inc shipping.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: user 18 on Tue, 27 January 2015, 13:41:08: Quote from: bigDave on Tue, 27 January 2015, 13:35:04
Quote from: snoopy on Tue, 27 January 2015, 10:06:25
Quote from: meztek on Tue, 27 January 2015, 08:43:29
Quote from: snoopy on Tue, 27 January 2015, 06:06:16
And I bet after you got a normal M, you will start hunting for a SSK or Model F... ;D

No! Don't encourage anyone to do this! The 101 key layout is practically perfect in every way and I'm done buying keyboards!

Look how cute a SSK is:

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/onhKW.jpg)

Can you really resist?

And man, you should try a Model F... feels so good... ;)

:)) :p

Nice board! I really want an SSK now, also the model M on ebay keeps going up in price, now it is £53 inc shipping.

Model Ms tend to go for much more than they're worth on ebay. It would be better to look at local electronics recyclers, classified ads, etc.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: LouisHjelmslev on Tue, 27 January 2015, 14:23:01: I recently purchased a Unicomp, and I have to say that BS is my preferred switch type (comparing to Browns, Blues, Clears), especially for typing.
Personally, I remember when first using BS, that I had to exert more force, but as with most switches, I got used to this pretty quickly.
Perhaps the only down side to this is that whenever my wife is at home, she does prefer that I switch over to any other board, as the sound really travels far.

Something about the crisp snap, combined with the needed force... I feel like I type with more assertiveness, and that my typing rhythm is cleaner. Maybe I'm just imagining things, but hey, it gets me through papers.

On the other hand, I did play FPS briefly with BS, and I have to say that I much preferred using brown/clears/even membrane. Somehow I felt that the snap that I like so much for typing, gets in the way of less consistent and less predictable key pressing in gaming.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: Snowdog993 on Tue, 27 January 2015, 14:26:38: You didn't get it? I thought that was a buy it now or something. Well, good luck in your search. I hope you find one.
Title: Re: Will I like buckling spring?
Post by: bigDave on Tue, 27 January 2015, 15:52:45: Quote from: Snowdog993 on Tue, 27 January 2015, 14:26:38
You didn't get it? I thought that was a buy it now or something. Well, good luck in your search. I hope you find one.

Nope, its in the mid 50 ATM, might be cheaper to importa buy it now model m from America.