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geekhack Projects => Making Stuff Together! => Topic started by: nubbinator on Fri, 20 February 2015, 01:42:29

Title: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Fri, 20 February 2015, 01:42:29: Since it seems like Alps sets are stupid hard to get made, I decided to see if it would be possible to make some MX to Alps converters and, if viable, produce them affordably. Since Alps stabilizer wire can fit into Costar stabilizers, they should theoretically let you use Costar stabs on MX caps and use MX caps on Alps switches. The main issue is that you'll want to use lower profile caps.

To see if it's even viable, I've gone ahead and ordered several models from Shapeways in a variety of materials to see if any of them work better as a master than others.

(http://i.imgur.com/199bDjj.png)

(http://i.imgur.com/kAnU7K4.png)

If that works out, I plan getting another model made up that's more suitable for molding and casting (sorry for the tiny pic):

(http://i.imgur.com/auyBcVG.png)

(http://i.imgur.com/lHmvVEO.png)

Alps stems are something I've been thing about for a while now since they also seem like the perfect stepping point for a modular stem system. If you do Alps stems, you could also make snap on MX and Topre stems, making it cheaper and easier to produce a cap or caps that work on multiple platforms. There aren't a ton of Alps caps out there, so it's less important for cap sets and more of an interesting project for novelty caps.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: bueller on Fri, 20 February 2015, 01:51:35: I would definitely be keen to buy a hundred of these if they make it to mass production, always wanted to do a 60% complicated white board but lack of caps is a major downer for me.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: CommonCurt on Fri, 20 February 2015, 02:13:27: Nice. Can't wait to see how these turn out.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: Smasher816 on Fri, 20 February 2015, 02:27:05: Sign me up. I would love to swap these mx blues out with some clicky style alps in my infinity. At the meetups I found I like alps a lot better but the lack of keycaps was kind of off putting.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Thu, 26 February 2015, 23:21:27: Still waiting on the adapters to come from shapeways so I can test fitment, but I rethought my sprueing and layout I originally had for the mold and redid it in a way that I think will generally work better. Now to get the prototypes to make sure they work and see what material I'll need to use for the master.

(http://i.imgur.com/ByVR2Ui.jpg)
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: bueller on Thu, 26 February 2015, 23:28:28: Quote from: nubbinator on Thu, 26 February 2015, 23:21:27
Still waiting on the adapters to come from shapeways so I can test fitment, but I rethought my sprueing and layout I originally had for the mold and redid it in a way that I think will generally work better. Now to get the prototypes to make sure they work and see what material I'll need to use for the master.

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/ByVR2Ui.jpg)

Looks great man!Í
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Thu, 26 February 2015, 23:32:38: Oh, and forgot to add, I added some beveling on the Alps side.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: Badwrench on Thu, 26 February 2015, 23:35:40: (https://p.gr-assets.com/540x540/fit/hostedimages/1380415700/820696.gif)
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: FrostyToast on Thu, 26 February 2015, 23:39:41: I wonder how the increased height will play out.
SA with these? Sounds like torture.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: bueller on Thu, 26 February 2015, 23:42:08: Quote from: FrostyToast on Thu, 26 February 2015, 23:39:41
I wonder how the increased height will play out.
SA with these? Sounds like torture.

Good thing GMK caps are already lower profile :)
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: CommonCurt on Thu, 26 February 2015, 23:57:49: Quote from: FrostyToast on Thu, 26 February 2015, 23:39:41
I wonder how the increased height will play out.

The added keycap height was the the first thing I thought about.

It will be interesting to see how it turns out.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: Hak Foo on Thu, 26 February 2015, 23:59:45: You might want to compare notes with MrInterface on Deskthority-- he's been doing a lot of this work already and has actually gotten some adapters produced.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Fri, 27 February 2015, 00:11:47: I forgot he was doing those. I may have to hit him up and compare notes.

With that out of the way, I do want to discuss some of the differences and why I did it differently. I did mine a little different for a couple of reasons. I added the disc in between the two parts to make it easier to remove them. Having the two mounts butted up against each other makes it potentially problematic with some of the tighter stems like DSA. The disc gives a little something extra to grip onto. I also added a bevel to make it easier to insert the Alps side.

Once I'm sure they work, I'm going to put it up on Shapeways so that people can either print them or cast them. I plan on casting mine. If I'm certain it works well, I'll entertain the possibility of getting a mold made and getting it done in POM. I'd have to have enough people interested to offset the cost though.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: Melvang on Fri, 27 February 2015, 00:17:04: I remember seeing someone at DT doing this a while ago and they said while it did work, it raised the caps a long ways and stab wires proved problematic.

That being said, I do wish you the best of luck in this endeavor.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Fri, 27 February 2015, 00:21:37: If there's a problem with the stabs, it's easy to make a similar MX to MX adaptor for the stabilizers.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: MOZ on Fri, 27 February 2015, 04:45:11: Looking good nubs. Following keenly!
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Thu, 05 March 2015, 19:42:13: I got my prototypes today. The Alps side fits perfectly in Detail and Ultra Detail Plastic. It's nice and snug. It's not so great with other materials, so I'll be sticking with those two for prototypes. I'll try to keep it as cheap as possible. The disc is also perfect for pulling the stem. It makes it much easier to remove than one without a spacer.

That said, the MX side is a hair too narrow. It looks like I erred too far on the side of caution. I'll thicken up the MX side and get another prototype made. Once I do that, and get the MX to MX adaptors made for the stabilized keys, I'll get the models up on Shapeways for people to use. Now that I know how it is, I'll probably get my MCS prototypes made up at the same.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: faceyourfaces on Thu, 05 March 2015, 20:01:45: Quote from: nubbinator on Thu, 05 March 2015, 19:42:13
I got my prototypes today. The Alps side fits perfectly in Detail and Ultra Detail Plastic. It's nice and snug. It's not so great with other materials, so I'll be sticking with those two for prototypes. I'll try to keep it as cheap as possible. The disc is also perfect for pulling the stem. It makes it much easier to remove than one without a spacer.

That said, the MX side is a hair too narrow. It looks like I erred too far on the side of caution. I'll thicken up the MX side and get another prototype made. Once I do that, and get the MX to MX adaptors made for the stabilized keys, I'll get the models up on Shapeways for people to use. Now that I know how it is, I'll probably get my MCS prototypes made up at the same.

Exciting! ;D
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: Touch_It on Thu, 05 March 2015, 20:04:18: Hmm, I might have to get some. I have multiple alps boards. Ideally I want to throw blue alps into a dell a dell at101w.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Thu, 05 March 2015, 23:07:47: Just for ****s and giggles, I decided to see how much it would cost to make enough for an Infiniti keyboard in one go, excluding the stabilizer extenders. It looks like it will be around $25 + shipping for a set of 72. As such, I'm giving up the mold idea. While it would likely be a little cheaper for someone who wanted to make enough for a couple of keyboards, it would be much more time intensive.

Once I confirm that the stabilizer extender dimensions are right, I'll go ahead and buy myself a set and offer them on Shapeways in all the detail acrylics since the strong and flexible plastics and metal plastics don't have good enough fidelity. And for full disclosure, I'm going to tack on $0.50-1 (Shapeways also has an additional 3.5% fee) for the full set just to offset my prototyping costs a little.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: Hak Foo on Thu, 05 March 2015, 23:26:55: Suggestion: Packages in sizes to fit common keyboards-- packages of, say, 25, 75, 90 and 110-- for numpad, 60%, TKL, and full-size, with generous overcount for the ones people break or to fit into extra caps.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: Badwrench on Thu, 05 March 2015, 23:51:47: How much taller is this making the cap sit? Does it still feel pretty stable?
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Thu, 05 March 2015, 23:59:58: It looks like it adds ~4.5-5mm (~0.2") to the height. The caps still feel stable to me. They're a little less so due to the added height, but not at all unpleasant or to the point where you really notice the difference. It's still pretty subtle.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: whentheclouds on Fri, 06 March 2015, 20:53:33: this is super cool. you didn't mention Cherry stabs so i assume they won't be compatible?
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Fri, 06 March 2015, 21:12:05: Quote from: whentheclouds on Fri, 06 March 2015, 20:53:33
this is super cool. you didn't mention Cherry stabs so i assume they won't be compatible?

These are straight Alps to MX adaptors, not the stabilizers. I'm getting MX to MX and Costar style extended stabilizers printed to see how they work and if I need to make any size changes. The MX to MX should be Cherry stab compatible.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: whentheclouds on Fri, 06 March 2015, 21:24:48: right, important distinction. keeping a close eye on this
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Sat, 14 March 2015, 20:22:56: Sppn

(http://i.imgur.com/LySwY6k.png)

Just waiting on the parts from my other project to finish printing. Hopefully the MX stem is right this time. If it is, I'll get models up for 80, 100, and 120 with the appropriate number of MX to MX extenders in both types. It really shouldn't add much to the price to run both types of extenders and it's cheaper than having to buy each one separately.

And I forgot I haven't uploaded pics of the extenders yet.

(http://i.imgur.com/ssWMYSJ.png)

(http://i.imgur.com/lPhSWPr.png)
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: engicoder on Sun, 15 March 2015, 16:39:06: There was a similar thread on Deskthority with some pictures of a board with adapters on for those interested.

http://deskthority.net/workshop-f7/cherry-to-alps-adapters-t4934.html
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Thu, 19 March 2015, 19:55:19: They arrived today. The Alps stem is still perfect, but the male MX stem is a little too loose. The female stem is nice and tight, but I'll have to widen the male stem again. I was going small and steady, but I'm going to have to reprint it in two more sizes to see if I get it nice and snug.

Other good news, the MX to MX adaptor is the perfect height and appears to be working perfectly.

The other bad news is that the Costar style stabilizer is too brittle to use. As such, you'll need Costar inserts if you plan on doing Costar stabilizers, you won't be able to use a single solid piece.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: engicoder on Thu, 19 March 2015, 20:17:56: Thanks for the update. I think your approach is a good one and will ensure a perfect fit. I will pick up a set of these to play with once you finalize everything.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Sun, 29 March 2015, 02:42:41: I widened the MX cruciforms to two different sizes so I can test them both out. Hopefully one of them works. I'll know in a week or so. Not that you can tell the changes, but updated pics are in my MCS thread (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=69433.0).
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: zombimuncha on Sun, 29 March 2015, 07:45:46: Quote from: nubbinator on Thu, 19 March 2015, 19:55:19
The other bad news is that the Costar style stabilizer is too brittle to use. As such, you'll need Costar inserts if you plan on doing Costar stabilizers, you won't be able to use a single solid piece.

Does this mean no stabilized MX caps on Alps switches? [edit: with Alps stabilizers, I mean]
Even assuming Matias' magical mystery balance bars are a real thing?
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Sun, 29 March 2015, 10:46:35: No, it means you'll use Cherry stabilizers with the extensions or the extensions with Costar stabilizer inserts. There won't be a solid one piece Costar style insert.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: zombimuncha on Sun, 29 March 2015, 11:09:29: Quote from: nubbinator on Sun, 29 March 2015, 10:46:35
No, it means you'll use Cherry stabilizers with the extensions or the extensions with Costar stabilizer inserts. There won't be a solid one piece Costar style insert.

I haz confuze. Is there a way to install Cherry stabs on a keyboard that already has Alps stabs?
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Sun, 29 March 2015, 11:13:36: This is to use MX caps on Alps keyboards (like the Infinity). If it already has Alps stabilizers, you can use the insert from the Alps caps in the MX extensions.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: zombimuncha on Sun, 29 March 2015, 11:21:50: the rectangular Alps insert fits into the cruciform MX-MX extension/adaptor? Spooky!
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Sun, 29 March 2015, 11:27:09: Depends on which ones you're talking about. There are closed stabilizers similar to Costar, those should fit no problem. I forgot about the open ones, but they should work as well with a simple edit or by including a second extension made for them.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: zombimuncha on Sun, 29 March 2015, 11:32:34: ok cool. but we still need the magical matias balance bars, right? because the insert mounts are in different positions on the keycap, MX vs Alps.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Sun, 29 March 2015, 11:53:52: Maybe, but the focus of this has never really been making something that will work with all old Alps boards since there are so many variations in Alps board. It's more to make it so you can use MX caps with contemporary Alps stuff.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: zombimuncha on Sun, 29 March 2015, 13:32:40: AFAIK most contemporary Alps boards use Alps stabs, except on the spacebar (Matias / KBParadise). I guess the Infinity is the exception here.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: jacobolus on Sun, 29 March 2015, 16:21:36: zombimuncha: you’re getting confused. The part nubbinator was trying to print is only usable on the Infinity, old Chicony boards from the 90s, possibly Ducky 1087XM (I can’t find a good picture of the stabilizers), and a small handful of other boards. It’s not relevant for Matias, KBParadise, or the great majority of old Alps boards.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: zombimuncha on Sun, 29 March 2015, 16:46:58: Hi Jacobolus, I appreciate your skepticism regarding the balance bars Matias has mentioned, and I note that you've been in the mechanical keyboard game much longer than I, and have vastly more knowledge and experience. I however prefer to remain optimistic, after all, at the risk of hijacking the thread (sorry!) this is Matias saying things like:
Quote from: Matias on Sat, 21 February 2015, 10:52:12
If you add a 2u Backspace and 2.75u Shift, then these would fit pretty much all ALPS keyboards. (I can supply stab wires.)
This is a man with a professional reputation to uphold. I don't think he'd be saying these kinds of things if he didn't have an honest expectation of being able to supply the aforementioned balance bars.

Furthermore, if Matias' balance bars and Nubbinators adaptors both turn into real usable products it could open up a whole new avenue of custom keycaps for Alps keyboards (bigass enter notwithstanding!) Is it a long shot? Maybe. But if it all comes together it could be extremely cool! GMK on Orange Alps could be amazing, even if it is "on stilts".
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: jacobolus on Sun, 29 March 2015, 17:54:10: Quote from: zombimuncha on Sun, 29 March 2015, 16:46:58
Hi Jacobolus, I appreciate your skepticism regarding the balance bars Matias has mentioned,
Huh? We’re talking about nubbinator’s 3d-printed insert, not Matias’s stabilizer wires.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: zombimuncha on Mon, 30 March 2015, 00:50:17: Quote from: jacobolus on Sun, 29 March 2015, 17:54:10
Quote from: zombimuncha on Sun, 29 March 2015, 16:46:58
Hi Jacobolus, I appreciate your skepticism regarding the balance bars Matias has mentioned,
Huh? We�re talking about nubbinator�s 3d-printed insert, not Matias�s stabilizer wires.

Right. I'm just pointing out that altho on their own the inserts can only be used on the keyboards you mentioned, if used together with the soecial stabilizer wires they could potentially be used on all Alps keyboards.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: jacobolus on Mon, 30 March 2015, 01:42:54: Quote from: zombimuncha on Mon, 30 March 2015, 00:50:17
Right. I'm just pointing out that altho on their own the inserts can only be used on the keyboards you mentioned, if used together with the soecial stabilizer wires they could potentially be used on all Alps keyboards.
I think Matias has brand new specially-made keycap inserts to get his new stabilizers working with keycaps with MX-shaped stab insert mounts. Whenever he finally mails me some samples I can tell you for sure. :-)
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Thu, 02 April 2015, 20:23:45: Good news. I received them today from Shapeways and they are good to go. I will likely be getting them up for order tonight.

Just a little warning, the MX stem is tight, like tighter than a Clear tight. If you're worried about them, you can scrape them down a little with a blade. I'm probably going to make them 0.02mm thinner, but those are some small tolerances. With my sizes I've tried, 0.1mm smaller is too loose and 0.1mm bigger won't fit at all. 0.02-0.4mm thinner may make it less tight, but I'm afraid to go any smaller than 0.02mm thinner since it may make things too loose.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: engicoder on Thu, 02 April 2015, 20:50:48: Quote from: nubbinator on Thu, 02 April 2015, 20:23:45
Good news. I received them today from Shapeways and they are good to go. I will likely be getting them up for order tonight.

Just a little warning, the MX stem is tight, like tighter than a Clear tight. If you're worried about them, you can scrape them down a little with a blade. I'm probably going to make them 0.02mm thinner, but those are some small tolerances. With my sizes I've tried, 0.1mm smaller is too loose and 0.1mm bigger won't fit at all. 0.02-0.4mm thinner may make it less tight, but I'm afraid to go any smaller than 0.02mm thinner since it may make things too loose.

I prefer tight :p
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Sun, 05 April 2015, 00:39:25: Okay. I modified the stem and made it 0.02mm thinner. That's the smallest change I felt comfortable making. I also uploaded them to Shapeways in various size packs. I'm willing to make the slightly cheaper detail plastic available if someone wants to try it, but I cannot guarantee that it will work.

65 stems + 4 stabilized keys (https://www.shapeways.com/product/LPA7AYPYV/alps-to-mx-65-stems-4?key=0a136c033d8b92a2b903d73eab19a1e2)

70 stems + 5 stabilzed keys (https://www.shapeways.com/product/45JMHRP2K/alps-to-mx-70-stems-5?key=e4d416c42410dac625e42e0883ed8e4b)

80 stems + 6 stabilzed keys (https://www.shapeways.com/product/HP2LBJLJF/alps-to-mx-80-stems?key=30cb5547cc2edfcba47fca2ff812a5fd)

120 stems + 6 stabilzed keys (https://www.shapeways.com/product/9J3P8UFW7/alps-to-mx-120-stems)

Hopefully the links work.

And before anyone asks, yes, I added a little to the cost to try and help cover my R&D costs. It's $1-1.90, depending on the model. Once my costs are recouped, I plan on making them at cost.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: Badwrench on Sun, 05 April 2015, 01:23:11: Quote from: nubbinator on Sun, 05 April 2015, 00:39:25
Okay. I modified the stem and made it 0.02mm thinner. That's the smallest change I felt comfortable making. I also uploaded them to Shapeways in various size packs. I'm willing to make the slightly cheaper detail plastic available if someone wants to try it, but I cannot guarantee that it will work.

65 stems + 4 stabilized keys (https://www.shapeways.com/product/LPA7AYPYV/alps-to-mx-65-stems-4?key=0a136c033d8b92a2b903d73eab19a1e2)

70 stems + 5 stabilzed keys (https://www.shapeways.com/product/45JMHRP2K/alps-to-mx-70-stems-5?key=e4d416c42410dac625e42e0883ed8e4b)

80 stems + 6 stabilzed keys (https://www.shapeways.com/product/HP2LBJLJF/alps-to-mx-80-stems?key=30cb5547cc2edfcba47fca2ff812a5fd)

120 stems + 6 stabilzed keys (https://www.shapeways.com/product/9J3P8UFW7/alps-to-mx-120-stems)

Hopefully the links work.

And before anyone asks, yes, I added a little to the cost to try and help cover my R&D costs. It's $1-1.90, depending on the model. Once my costs are recouped, I plan on making them at cost.

Awesome! Looking forward to giving these a run. :thumb:
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: engicoder on Sun, 05 April 2015, 19:41:22: Back when I made some angled adapters, I found it cheaper if I linked all the parts with a very thin link, so that it was considered a single part. Then they could be cut apart on arrival. I'm not sure if this is still valid since they changed their pricing model. Have you considered this?
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Sun, 05 April 2015, 20:06:53: Quote from: engicoder on Sun, 05 April 2015, 19:41:22
Back when I made some angled adapters, I found it cheaper if I linked all the parts with a very thin link, so that it was considered a single part. Then they could be cut apart on arrival. I'm not sure if this is still valid since they changed their pricing model. Have you considered this?

They're slightly more expensive. I just tried it out.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: engicoder on Sun, 05 April 2015, 20:14:43: Good to know. I re-quoted mine with want without the connections and it comes out as you said, slightly higher for the connected model (but cheaper than I paid early last year), so it looks like they fixed their pricing, for the better.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Wed, 15 April 2015, 20:28:14: I got my Alps revisions in to day and Alps are all good to go on everything. The MX to MX are solid for Costar and Cherry stabilizers and the Alps adapters all work and the minor size reduction of 0.02mm made them perfect.

I didn't tell anyone I was working on these, but I also made some MX to old school Alps stabilizers. They work perfect, but may need to be shortened by a hair (if it's possible). In the following photos note that I was didn't feel like pulling the stabilizers out again since it's a tight fit, so they're not pressed in all the way.

(http://i.imgur.com/9eEmZ3Y.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/ZihLreZ.jpg)

And video of the goods in action:
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: zombimuncha on Fri, 17 April 2015, 12:39:23: I'm thinking the Alps stab wire wont reach the insert on a MX right-shift. Other stabilized keys should all be fine.
Maybe you could compensate for narrower mount-points on the MX rShift with a specially designed inset that relocates the mountpoint horizontally as well as vertically?
[attachimg=1]
(sorry I don't have a 2.75u MX keycap handy - the mountpoint positions are the same as on the MX 2.25u tho)
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: dante on Sun, 19 April 2015, 12:00:22: Very interested to hear if these work on a KBP V60MTS.

I'm going to imagine that DSA is going to be the optimum keycap height for these?
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: zombimuncha on Sun, 19 April 2015, 13:02:19: Based on current evidence I'm thinking they'll work great for every key on the v60mts except the right shift. I'd also love to see video of these in operation on a full keyboard, rather than just a single key.
Mainly I'm waiting for my GMK-Triumph Adler set to arrive before I splurge on a set of these.

Edit: you may just be able to bend the stab wire in a bit so it reaches the inserts on the right-shift.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sun, 19 April 2015, 13:07:52: Quote from: nubbinator on Wed, 15 April 2015, 20:28:14
I got my Alps revisions in to day and Alps are all good to go on everything. The MX to MX are solid for Costar and Cherry stabilizers and the Alps adapters all work and the minor size reduction of 0.02mm made them perfect.

I didn't tell anyone I was working on these, but I also made some MX to old school Alps stabilizers. They work perfect, but may need to be shortened by a hair (if it's possible). In the following photos note that I was didn't feel like pulling the stabilizers out again since it's a tight fit, so they're not pressed in all the way.

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/9eEmZ3Y.jpg)

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/ZihLreZ.jpg)

And video of the goods in action:

Oooo these are looking good :D
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Sun, 19 April 2015, 13:34:32: I can look at making a special one for the right shift since I hadn't tried it yet there. I'll also need to thicken up the walls a little and make the insert hole 0.02mm bigger or so as the frosted detail plastic can get brittle and break easily.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: zombimuncha on Thu, 07 May 2015, 16:44:41: Did anyone try these out yet? I'd love to see a slightly more thorough video than the one above.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Thu, 07 May 2015, 20:44:58: I'm actually looking about small number production with epoxy injection molds since I'm not 100% sure of the durability of the stems.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: dante on Thu, 07 May 2015, 22:00:44: If you used DSA caps with this adapter what height would that be like? Cherry? OEM? SP SA?
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: micr0n on Wed, 10 June 2015, 15:01:12: I'm kind of excited if this option works as planned. I don't really want to source out used keycaps all the while I have tones of pretty MX keycaps I can use while they are in idle state.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: Blaise170 on Thu, 11 June 2015, 10:42:36: Quote from: nubbinator on Thu, 07 May 2015, 20:44:58
I'm actually looking about small number production with epoxy injection molds since I'm not 100% sure of the durability of the stems.

Have you considered one of the cheap metals? Polished bronze steel isn't too much more than frosted ultra on Shapeways and actually cheaper on some of the models I've seen.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Thu, 11 June 2015, 11:28:53: Quote from: Blaise170 on Thu, 11 June 2015, 10:42:36
Quote from: nubbinator on Thu, 07 May 2015, 20:44:58
I'm actually looking about small number production with epoxy injection molds since I'm not 100% sure of the durability of the stems.

Have you considered one of the cheap metals? Stainless steel isn't too much more than frosted ultra on Shapeways.

Tolerances are too loose, price is too high (from what I've seen), and I seem to remember the parts being too small to print in that material.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: Blaise170 on Thu, 11 June 2015, 11:46:28: Ah I se. I'm definitely going to keep my eye on these. Thanks for all the work nubb. :thumb:
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: Texchappy on Wed, 04 November 2015, 05:24:34: When I asked a question over on Reddit finding out what ever happened to these someone linked the shapeways purchase portal. As much as I've spent on a keyboard and various keycap sets I don't have a lot to spend on anything keyboard related. These could help me solve the issue of having a few MX sets and only one Alps set. How have they been working over the longer term?
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Wed, 04 November 2015, 08:50:08: I've only made test samples, I haven't been using them regularly, so I can't say. I do want to try and get then injection molded in POM, but I've had no luck there.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: Scalarmotion on Tue, 22 March 2016, 18:14:06: Hey, I ordered a pack of adapters off shapeways (http://www.shapeways.com/product/45JMHRP2K/alps-to-mx-70-stems-5) and I'm afraid they don't fit my Matias V60.

(http://i.imgur.com/T68YpXP.jpg)
^ a photo of a stock Matias keycap stem side by side with the adapter's Alps stem, which is noticeably larger and doesn't fit the Matias sliders. The MX side fits just fine, so I'm inclined to put this down to a design mistake rather than printing imperfections. Any chance of a fix?
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Tue, 22 March 2016, 18:24:14: What did you print them in? It should only be the frosted detail. I've tried them on Orange, White, Blue, and both Green Alps, so there's no reason it should not work with Matias Alps.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: Scalarmotion on Tue, 22 March 2016, 20:42:45: Frosted ultra detail was the only option so I don't think that's the issue. I feel like trying my luck with another batch but the $20 shipping is a bit too inhibitive for me.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: shadowdude777 on Wed, 18 May 2016, 13:50:56: Just wanna confirm that I also printed out a set (that exact one on Shapeways) and mine are working great! Got them on my Infinity right now and I'm using DSA Granite with them. They do feel noticeably higher than DSA does without the adapters, but I usually use SA, so this is not so bad.

Pics:

From top: http://i.imgur.com/OEHEt49.jpg
From side (shows how the adapter sits): http://i.imgur.com/HeggUHY.jpg
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: ipreferpie on Wed, 25 May 2016, 03:57:04: Quote from: shadowdude777 on Wed, 18 May 2016, 13:50:56
Just wanna confirm that I also printed out a set (that exact one on Shapeways) and mine are working great! Got them on my Infinity right now and I'm using DSA Granite with them. They do feel noticeably higher than DSA does without the adapters, but I usually use SA, so this is not so bad.

Pics:

From top: http://i.imgur.com/OEHEt49.jpg (http://i.imgur.com/OEHEt49.jpg)
From side (shows how the adapter sits): http://i.imgur.com/HeggUHY.jpg (http://i.imgur.com/HeggUHY.jpg)

I too tried it and printed out a set. But I'm quite worried about now tight the adapters are. I frequently change caps (1/wk) and worried about snapped adapter stems. I tested on some spare keys and tried removing it with my fingers. I can pull it off the switch relatively easy, but pulling it off MX caps is a problem. I needed Leatherman pliers for that -- and 50% of the time, I snapped the adapter. I then shaved the MX side and lubed it (very time consuming) and still resulted in snapped stems 1:4 times. Am I doing anything wrong?
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: shadowdude777 on Thu, 26 May 2016, 00:15:55: Quote from: ipreferpie on Wed, 25 May 2016, 03:57:04
Quote from: shadowdude777 on Wed, 18 May 2016, 13:50:56
Just wanna confirm that I also printed out a set (that exact one on Shapeways) and mine are working great! Got them on my Infinity right now and I'm using DSA Granite with them. They do feel noticeably higher than DSA does without the adapters, but I usually use SA, so this is not so bad.

Pics:

From top: http://i.imgur.com/OEHEt49.jpg (http://i.imgur.com/OEHEt49.jpg)
From side (shows how the adapter sits): http://i.imgur.com/HeggUHY.jpg (http://i.imgur.com/HeggUHY.jpg)

I too tried it and printed out a set. But I'm quite worried about now tight the adapters are. I frequently change caps (1/wk) and worried about snapped adapter stems. I tested on some spare keys and tried removing it with my fingers. I can pull it off the switch relatively easy, but pulling it off MX caps is a problem. I needed Leatherman pliers for that -- and 50% of the time, I snapped the adapter. I then shaved the MX side and lubed it (very time consuming) and still resulted in snapped stems 1:4 times. Am I doing anything wrong?

My recommendation is honestly... don't switch your caps that often. :)

I was switching my Granites to the mono legends the other day and snapped a few, too, because I was trying to pry between the flange on the adapter and the keycap. Eventually I learned how to do it without snapping them but it still gets me nervous. Pulling it off the MX caps I found was easiest with small pliers, as you said (I used the ones on my Swiss Army Knife, I'm sure a Leatherman's plier will be good too). I just used it to get a firm grip on the Alps-stem part and pulled straight outwards. I never snapped one trying to pull them off like that. But still, I wouldn't do it every week or anything. I'm worried about ruining my nice Granite caps by doing this, which is why I didn't use even harder-to-find caps with these adapters!

We really need to get some of these injection-molded. Better yet, is there a way to make replacements for the Alps stem itself that fit inside the Alps switch (like Novatouch sliders do for Topre)? Then we also don't have to have the keycaps sit higher because of the adapter's added height.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Thu, 26 May 2016, 01:06:46: Quote from: shadowdude777 on Thu, 26 May 2016, 00:15:55
We really need to get some of these injection-molded. Better yet, is there a way to make replacements for the Alps stem itself that fit inside the Alps switch (like Novatouch sliders do for Topre)? Then we also don't have to have the keycaps sit higher because of the adapter's added height.

That was the plan to do injection molding, but I don't have the money for it and I can't seem to get anyone on board. I know there does exist a mold from way back when somewhere that did the same thing for some TTY phones, but I can't get in touch with anyone about it.

The stem replacement would not work. It was something I considered, but the dimensions don't play well.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: ipreferpie on Thu, 26 May 2016, 05:36:02: Quote from: nubbinator on Thu, 26 May 2016, 01:06:46
Quote from: shadowdude777 on Thu, 26 May 2016, 00:15:55
We really need to get some of these injection-molded. Better yet, is there a way to make replacements for the Alps stem itself that fit inside the Alps switch (like Novatouch sliders do for Topre)? Then we also don't have to have the keycaps sit higher because of the adapter's added height.

That was the plan to do injection molding, but I don't have the money for it and I can't seem to get anyone on board. I know there does exist a mold from way back when somewhere that did the same thing for some TTY phones, but I can't get in touch with anyone about it.

The stem replacement would not work. It was something I considered, but the dimensions don't play well.

Injection molded adapters would be wonderful. The printed ones are so brittle and rough. It's either using them as is and risk broken stems. Or filing them down but with loose or twisted seating of the keys. I spent hours manually filing them but not with 100% satisfactory results. If there's a GB on better ones, I'm down for at least 300.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: MOZ on Thu, 26 May 2016, 06:07:21: Someone on DT was working on injection molded version, but haven't been online for a while.
Title: Compatibility w/ Matias switches
Post by: NadavCE on Tue, 21 June 2016, 09:55:19: I made an account here solely because of this thread (even though I've lurked here for a while).

I'd love to order a set of these adapters, but I need to confirm that they're compatible with Matias switches (Scalarmotion's post discouraged me a bit). Are there any Matias owners who've tried these out?
Title: Re: Compatibility w/ Matias switches
Post by: menuhin on Wed, 07 September 2016, 09:53:27: Quote from: NadavCE on Tue, 21 June 2016, 09:55:19
I made an account here solely because of this thread (even though I've lurked here for a while).

I'd love to order a set of these adapters, but I need to confirm that they're compatible with Matias switches (Scalarmotion's post discouraged me a bit). Are there any Matias owners who've tried these out?

It seems like everyone involved in this project has been busy working on something else.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: dilbertprogrammer on Sat, 22 October 2016, 08:09:56: A friend of mine and I were looking at the 65-count offering of adapters on shapeways: http://www.shapeways.com/product/LPA7AYPYV/alps-to-mx-65-stems-4?optionId=56261661

Is this the latest revision of these?

Thanks!
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: nubbinator on Sat, 22 October 2016, 10:46:36: I haven't done any new revisions.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: menuhin on Thu, 03 November 2016, 11:42:49: The member from the thread "Cherry to Alps adapters" at DT holding an work-in-progress adapter injection mold didn't log in since November 2015.

There are some antique injection molded adapter from the old days:
(https://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=49639.0;attach=38826;image)
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=49639.0

To harvest 40 adapters, one can mutilate the whole TTY Ultratec hearing impaired phone.
Title: Re: MX to Alps adaptor
Post by: dilbertprogrammer on Wed, 16 November 2016, 17:56:56: Quote from: nubbinator on Sat, 22 October 2016, 10:46:36
I haven't done any new revisions.

Thanks! Will recommend he purchase these then!