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geekhack Community => Off Topic => Topic started by: BurgerBum on Mon, 16 March 2015, 03:39:46

Title: Terminology...
Post by: BurgerBum on Mon, 16 March 2015, 03:39:46
posting this here, because..... i dont know where else to put it. its less keyboard more language+keyboard so yee.


So, ive been lurking around here for a while, and i have a question for you all.

why are you all so silly with your naming of keys and thier functions?

what in oblivion is spacebar?!?!? its called 'Main'
enter??? thats 'Return' to you!!!
oh, and the silliest of them all... windows. (psssssst.... some of us use linux. xP thats why i call it 'OS' )
oh, and backspace/delete (for mac users)... the word erase takes care of both. *scratching head wondering why there are two names and oh may the devines forbid a key for both....)


i was just thinking, state my opinion and get a ball rolling.
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: rowdy on Mon, 16 March 2015, 03:59:39
Probably just convention based on how the keys were labelled on some of the earlier keyboards.

A lot of terminal keyboards called Enter Return because they were emulating the carriage return on a manual typewriter.  Hence Return.  Later on the user would fill in an entire page of information and enter it all at once, hence Enter.

The Windows key was added really because Microsoft.  However other operating systems made use of the scan code.  On non-Microsoft platforms it is sometimes called Meta.

Backspace moves the cursor back one space.

Erase, back in the day, would have erased a field or the entire screen (on a terminal), hence it is not much in use these days.
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: paicrai on Mon, 16 March 2015, 04:08:03
(https://33.media.tumblr.com/db458d59487202992f17d9d14e52d410/tumblr_ncu972KzaL1ten6hqo2_250.gif)
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: tbc on Mon, 16 March 2015, 04:11:20
how many god damn accounts does teepee have?
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: BurgerBum on Mon, 16 March 2015, 04:14:04
Probably just convention based on how the keys were labelled on some of the earlier keyboards.

A lot of terminal keyboards called Enter Return because they were emulating the carriage return on a manual typewriter.  Hence Return.  Later on the user would fill in an entire page of information and enter it all at once, hence Enter.

The Windows key was added really because Microsoft.  However other operating systems made use of the scan code.  On non-Microsoft platforms it is sometimes called Meta.

Backspace moves the cursor back one space.

Erase, back in the day, would have erased a field or the entire screen (on a terminal), hence it is not much in use these days.
*attempting to wrap my mind around everything but Meta*
but...... why not change it x'D (well.. i guess thats like asking every school in every city of every province to just  get new text books.. :/ )
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: rowdy on Mon, 16 March 2015, 04:14:33
how many god damn accounts does teepee have?

This one's not tp4.
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: BurgerBum on Mon, 16 March 2015, 04:14:58
how many god damn accounts does teepee have?
.......?
wut.
me no understando.
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: tp4tissue on Mon, 16 March 2015, 04:29:58
how many god damn accounts does teepee have?

This one's not tp4.

psssh...

My level of enigmatic eloquence is not something so easily forged..

Even if one were able to reproduce my syntactical excellence, they do not have the immense associative knowledge behind the mere language to draw forth that Unrivaled-standard of Conceived Truths.

Tp4 is a pillar of profoundly congruent facts.

(http://textemoticons.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/th_0pride.gif)
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: rowdy on Mon, 16 March 2015, 04:44:19
how many god damn accounts does teepee have?

This one's not tp4.

psssh...

My level of enigmatic eloquence is not something so easily forged..

Even if one were able to reproduce my syntactical excellence, they do not have the immense associative knowledge behind the mere language to draw forth that Unrivaled-standard of Conceived Truths.

Tp4 is a pillar of profoundly congruent facts.

Show Image
(http://textemoticons.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/th_0pride.gif)


At least every second word is not ErgoDox these days :p
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: tp4tissue on Mon, 16 March 2015, 04:52:46
how many god damn accounts does teepee have?

This one's not tp4.

psssh...

My level of enigmatic eloquence is not something so easily forged..

Even if one were able to reproduce my syntactical excellence, they do not have the immense associative knowledge behind the mere language to draw forth that Unrivaled-standard of Conceived Truths.

Tp4 is a pillar of profoundly congruent facts.

Show Image
(http://textemoticons.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/th_0pride.gif)


At least every second word is not ErgoDox these days :p

Lets not forget that every word is Channeled through the Egdx.

For without that bridge, you would not have been able to witness my light.


(http://www.msgking.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/onion-avatar013.gif)
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: Air tree on Mon, 16 March 2015, 04:54:20
how many god damn accounts does teepee have?

This one's not tp4.

psssh...

My level of enigmatic eloquence is not something so easily forged..

Even if one were able to reproduce my syntactical excellence, they do not have the immense associative knowledge behind the mere language to draw forth that Unrivaled-standard of Conceived Truths.

Tp4 is a pillar of profoundly congruent facts.

Show Image
(http://textemoticons.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/th_0pride.gif)


At least every second word is not ErgoDox these days :p

Lets not forget that every word is Channeled through the Egdx.

For without that bridge, you would not have been able to witness my light.


Show Image
(http://www.msgking.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/onion-avatar013.gif)

I still need to get my hands on a "Egdx" just to try it, at the very least.
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: paicrai on Mon, 16 March 2015, 05:29:11
how many god damn accounts does teepee have?
.......?
wut.
me no understando.
(https://31.media.tumblr.com/ad4bcf389edca1bab34f292bae503927/tumblr_n96fz8JifC1qa1uazo1_r1_500.png)
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: Coreda on Mon, 16 March 2015, 06:17:41
what in oblivion is spacebar?!?!? its called 'Main'

The what?

oh, and backspace/delete (for mac users)... the word erase takes care of both. *scratching head wondering why there are two names and oh may the devines forbid a key for both....)

Haven't ever read a Mac user refer to the backspace key as the erase key - edit, actually I think I may have once, but not both. The most I've heard to disambiguate is 'Delete' for backspace and 'forward delete' for Del.
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: fohat.digs on Mon, 16 March 2015, 07:10:42
"Carriage Return" (and its Siamese twin "Line Feed"), along with "Space(bar)" all harken back to the typewriter days.

"Enter" makes far more sense than "Return" because you are entering much more often than you are returning.

"Backspace" and "Delete" are different and opposite functions, both necessary. Apple screwed up big-time, there.
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: tp4tissue on Mon, 16 March 2015, 11:05:47
"Carriage Return" (and its Siamese twin "Line Feed"), along with "Space(bar)" all harken back to the typewriter days.

"Enter" makes far more sense than "Return" because you are entering much more often than you are returning.

"Backspace" and "Delete" are different and opposite functions, both necessary. Apple screwed up big-time, there.


Maybe Burgerbum is a time-traveler.. (http://www.cute-factor.com/images/smilies/onion/th_053_XD.gif)
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: Smasher816 on Mon, 16 March 2015, 19:52:39
The Windows key was added really because Microsoft.  However other operating systems made use of the scan code.  On non-Microsoft platforms it is sometimes called Meta.

I know on linux based systems it is called "Super". The USB spec and thus projects like Hasu's tmk call it Left/Right "GUI".
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: rowdy on Mon, 16 March 2015, 19:58:37
The Windows key was added really because Microsoft.  However other operating systems made use of the scan code.  On non-Microsoft platforms it is sometimes called Meta.

I know on linux based systems it is called "Super". The USB spec and thus projects like Hasu's tmk call it Left/Right "GUI".

All hail winkeyless keyboards (like the classic SSK) :p
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: Oobly on Tue, 17 March 2015, 07:25:33
What language / locale are you from? It makes a difference as to what is called what. Keyboard terms have been a little different from company to company, system to system, but they have somewhat standardised over time. So the "correct" terms are:

Space or Spacebar: pretty obvious, it makes a space.
Backspace: It removes the previous character and moves the cursor BACK one SPACE.
Delete: It deletes the character in the cursor position without moving the cursor.
Windows key: This is only called the Win key on boards that have it labeled as such. The more universal terms are OS, Super, Meta and GUI, but since it was first introduced by Microsoft, they named it first and it sort of stuck, despite not being meaningful on other systems.
Enter: Used for when you have completed an entry and wish to ENTER it into the system. Return is still sometimes seen (usually on retro style keycap sets wishing to emulate terminal boards, but Enter is the more modern and accurate term) and refers to Carriage RETURN from typewriters which returns the cursor to the beginning of the line.

Using the most universally accepted terms gives you the highest chance of being understood by the largest number of people when talking about keyboards.
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: taylordcraig on Tue, 17 March 2015, 10:56:20
What language / locale are you from? It makes a difference as to what is called what. Keyboard terms have been a little different from company to company, system to system, but they have somewhat standardised over time. So the "correct" terms are:

Space or Spacebar: pretty obvious, it makes a space.
Backspace: It removes the previous character and moves the cursor BACK one SPACE.
Delete: It deletes the character in the cursor position without moving the cursor.
Windows key: This is only called the Win key on boards that have it labeled as such. The more universal terms are OS, Super, Meta and GUI, but since it was first introduced by Microsoft, they named it first and it sort of stuck, despite not being meaningful on other systems.
Enter: Used for when you have completed an entry and wish to ENTER it into the system. Return is still sometimes seen (usually on retro style keycap sets wishing to emulate terminal boards, but Enter is the more modern and accurate term) and refers to Carriage RETURN from typewriters which returns the cursor to the beginning of the line.

Using the most universally accepted terms gives you the highest chance of being understood by the largest number of people when talking about keyboards.

Yeah I'm with oobly, seems pretty self explanatory.
SPACE BAR makes a SPACE in your document. The key is more a bar than any key on the board. Main holds no real meaning in English.
Backspace and delete are different keys... entirely... They do different things and their names are much more explanatory than "erase".
You have to accept that 80%+ of computers are Windows OS, argument over.
Enter is the only one I might agree on, where return is more accurate.
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: fohat.digs on Tue, 17 March 2015, 15:42:58
Enter is the only one I might agree on, where return is more accurate.

No way!

The "Carriage Return/Line Feed" operation is probably the MOST obsolete of the typewriter holdovers.

"Enter" is precisely what always happens when the "Enter" key is pressed, EXCEPT when creating a text document.
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: rowdy on Tue, 17 March 2015, 16:06:12
^G = BELL is also very obsolete.
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: smknjoe on Tue, 17 March 2015, 16:33:53
What language / locale are you from?

I'm curious about this too. His avatar say Portland (Oregon), USA...but...these are odd questions coming from an American. Unless, like the on the show "Portlandia", he's actually stuck in the 1890's where "Return" and "Main" are all the rage on newfangled type-writing machines. Steampunk rulz!
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: iri on Tue, 17 March 2015, 17:00:39
The Windows key was added really because Microsoft.  However other operating systems made use of the scan code.  On non-Microsoft platforms it is sometimes called Meta.

I know on linux based systems it is called "Super". The USB spec and thus projects like Hasu's tmk call it Left/Right "GUI".

All hail winkeyless keyboards (like the classic SSK) :p
tsk tsk. windows keys are great for switching layouts.
Title: Re: Terminology...
Post by: taylordcraig on Wed, 18 March 2015, 21:08:35
Enter is the only one I might agree on, where return is more accurate.

No way!

The "Carriage Return/Line Feed" operation is probably the MOST obsolete of the typewriter holdovers.

"Enter" is precisely what always happens when the "Enter" key is pressed, EXCEPT when creating a text document.

I guess I'm mostly writing text/coding when I'm on a computer. I only really enter things like commands in games or searches in google.