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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: zangetsu on Sun, 05 April 2015, 16:23:24

Title: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: zangetsu on Sun, 05 April 2015, 16:23:24
Hi,
I have bought a german Model M (due to terribly expensive shipping from US to europe),
but I like the US layout much more. Is it possible to replace german layout of left shift, return etc with the US one (attaching pictures of particular keycaps)?
and are the Unicomp (I am gonna also order OS X specfic ones) keycaps compatible with 1391403?

From what I saw the backplate is common for 1391401 and 1391403 so it should be possible, but I'm not sure...

Thank You!
Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: Huxley2500 on Sun, 05 April 2015, 16:26:53
Sure, I have seen that at /r/mK.
Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sun, 05 April 2015, 16:30:16
Fohat.digs (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=48288.0) has a nice guide on how to do ANSI conversions. Essentially, you open the board up, swap out the little white stabilizers pins to be in the right location, and pull out the hammers in the locations you want to change caps in. I did this modification so that my 6019284 could have the standard 60% ANSI layout with 1.25x - 1x - 1.25x mods.
Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: Snowdog993 on Sun, 05 April 2015, 17:59:32
I believe the question was for a Model M ISO to ANSI conversion.  I would think there would need to be a controller swap and (I would think) rearrangement of the springs for the keys.  (So it would need to be torn down and bolt-modded to swap the springs.)

I am not sure if that is correct or not being as I have never owned an ISO model M.
Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: zangetsu on Sun, 05 April 2015, 18:09:50
Thank you for answers.
Controller is certainly compatible (but I am going to make Bluetooth controller anyway)

I have found this (it is ANSI to ISO though) of /r/MK so i'm sure it is possible:
http://imgur.com/a/fmqXG
Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sun, 05 April 2015, 18:13:36
I believe the question was for a Model M ISO to ANSI conversion.  I would think there would need to be a controller swap and (I would think) rearrangement of the springs for the keys.  (So it would need to be torn down and bolt-modded to swap the springs.)

Does the M membrane not allow for swaps like the F capacitive PCB?
Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: fohat.digs on Sun, 05 April 2015, 18:14:55
When doing a bolt-mod, swapping springs is trivial.

There may be a difference of a spring or 2, but I think ISO uses more, if I remember correctly.

If you have the new keys, just look at the back and you can see what you need to do.

Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: Snowdog993 on Sun, 05 April 2015, 18:17:13
The membrane should be fine.  I believe all the keys in the matrix are on it.  The question is whether or not the controller would be compatible?  (I guess it is??)  It was German ISO....
It still would need to have the springs rearranged for ANSI.
Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: fohat.digs on Sun, 05 April 2015, 18:32:16
I believe all the keys in the matrix are on it.  The question is whether or not the controller would be compatible? 

Aren't they all the same?

Isn't it a matter of selecting the appropriate "language" in the keyboard control panel under Windows?
Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: Snowdog993 on Sun, 05 April 2015, 18:34:16
If that is the case, then yes, there would be no need to change the controller at all.  I thought they were hard-coded for the language, is all.
Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: Ludovician on Sun, 05 April 2015, 20:12:22
Does anyone here know for sure whether it'll work just by swapping springs and stabs around? I've been wondering about this for a while.
Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: fohat.digs on Sun, 05 April 2015, 20:36:15
Yes (I think), any mod that I have ever tried has worked. IBM made parts interchangeable and used the same ones everywhere, as far as I know. That is why people get excited about activating the "secret keys" and squeezing in things like Windows.
Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sun, 05 April 2015, 20:38:08
Does anyone here know for sure whether it'll work just by swapping springs and stabs around? I've been wondering about this for a while.

I'll test it when I get an ISO M in hand. Should be soon.
Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: rowdy on Mon, 06 April 2015, 05:46:33
Does anyone here know for sure whether it'll work just by swapping springs and stabs around? I've been wondering about this for a while.

I'll test it when I get an ISO M in hand. Should be soon.

I'll be keeping a look out for this - I am considering an M122, which are only available in ISO (locally, too!) and would need an ANSI conversion.
Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: Ludovician on Mon, 06 April 2015, 05:48:41
Where did you find one of those locally, Rowdy?
Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: rowdy on Mon, 06 April 2015, 05:56:38
Where did you find one of those locally, Rowdy?

http://www.a1usedcomputers.com.au/shop/prodList.asp?idCategory=97
Title: Re: Modify german (1391403) Model M to US (1391401) layout?
Post by: E TwentyNine on Mon, 06 April 2015, 08:01:04
Does anyone here know for sure whether it'll work just by swapping springs and stabs around? I've been wondering about this for a while.

Yes, definitely.  No controller swap is necessary.