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geekhack Projects => Making Stuff Together! => Topic started by: greath on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:01:53

Title: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: greath on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:01:53

Hey,

I'm considering putting together my own custom board. I was hoping to get some critiques on my layout.

(http://i.imgur.com/FrAklUC.jpg)
Here is a link to the Layout Editor (http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/8d0fcd89ae389ab581b5be6ef53dd3f1)

Thoughts for some of the layout:

• I use a numpad a decent amount for work, and so I wanted to build a keyboard has a numpad, but does not take up as much desk realestate as a 100% format.
• I like being able to use older keysets, so I set up for 1.5x modifiers which I can get on many modern keysets, but are the only option on many older keysets. I maintained a 6.25x spacebar for ease of acquisition, but shifted the entire bottom row right by 0.75x both for ease of hitting Alt while on the WASD cluster (when gaming), and for aesthetics.
• I set up the arrow cluster on the numpad's 8,4,5,6. My thinking here is that I will be able to press the Fn key with my thumb and then use the numpad in a similar manner to the standard arrow cluster. The enter key on the numpad I have a set to WinKey on the Fn layer. This is so I can hit Winkey with my pinkey when I use my most commonly used WinKey shortcuts (Winkey + directional arrow). Note: the ↓ does not show up properly on the layout editor with side labeling so it is cut off in the picture.
• I set up media controls based on the layout that is so highly regarded on a HHKB.
• NumLock I have replaced with PrtScn as I never use NumLock.
• Scroll Lock and Pause Break have been completely removed, again because I do not use them
• Caps Lock was replaced with control, as I'm sure many of you already do this.

Let me know where you see any room for improvement. Thanks!

Title: Re: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: cmadrid on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:06:45

Maybe put the numpad on the left side so your mouse isn't so far out to the side of you?

Title: Re: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:08:36

Short right shift is tricky. Maybe go with the full shift and move FN to print screen? Do you actually use print screen that often?

Title: Re: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: greath on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:09:47

Quote from: cmadrid on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:06:45

Maybe put the numpad on the left side so your mouse isn't so far out to the side of you?

How are you envisioning that working with the Fn key? Move the arrow keys to the standard HHKB layout?

Title: Re: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: cmadrid on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:14:29

Quote from: greath on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:09:47

Quote from: cmadrid on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:06:45

Maybe put the numpad on the left side so your mouse isn't so far out to the side of you?

How are you envisioning that working with the Fn key? Move the arrow keys to the standard HHKB layout?

Yeah, pretty much.. I just like the benefit of the TKL moving the mouse in closer, but there is no reason not to have a numpad on the left side (or switch to using left hand for mouse I guess, but nooooo)

Title: Re: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: greath on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:14:45

Quote from: CPTBadAss on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:08:36

Short right shift is tricky. Maybe go with the full shift and move FN to print screen? Do you actually use print screen that often?

Really? I've never used one but I feel like from watching myself type I almost exclusively I use the center or left side of the right shift key. Seeing how popular they are I imagined this was similar for many people which is why I assumed I would be ok with one.

I use print screen some, more than delete. I don't know what else I would want to put there. If I put Fn there instead the arrow cluster I feel would be difficult to hit, no?

Title: Re: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: greath on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:16:23

Quote from: cmadrid on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:14:29

Quote from: greath on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:09:47

Quote from: cmadrid on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:06:45

Maybe put the numpad on the left side so your mouse isn't so far out to the side of you?

How are you envisioning that working with the Fn key? Move the arrow keys to the standard HHKB layout?

Yeah, pretty much.. I just like the benefit of the TKL moving the mouse in closer, but there is no reason not to have a numpad on the left side (or switch to using left hand for mouse I guess, but nooooo)

I'm going to try using the numpad with my left hand later today to see if I could get accustom to it.  :))

Title: Re: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:17:55

Quote from: greath on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:14:45

Quote from: CPTBadAss on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:08:36

Short right shift is tricky. Maybe go with the full shift and move FN to print screen? Do you actually use print screen that often?

I use print screen some, more than delete. I don't know what else I would want to put there. If I put Fn there instead the arrow cluster I Feel would be difficult to hit, no?

I think print screen is a waste but I'm not 100% sure what should go there. FN might be hard to hit (I don't think so). But who exactly are you making this for? You? Or a GB?

Quote from: greath on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:14:45

Really? I've never used on but I feel like from watching myself type I almost exclusively I use the center or left side of the right shift key. Seeing how popular they are I imagined this was similar for many people which is why I assumed I would be ok with one.

I'm not really sure what you're referring to here. I meant that short right shift can be tricky to source. I don't think it's covered in *every* buy.

Title: Re: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: greath on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:18:08

I see. I thought you where saying a short right shift key is tricky to type on. I haven't used one but was explaining why I thought I would be ok with typing on it. That is what I was referring to in that sentence.

I'm making this for me. No real plans to expand beyond that, I just wanted feedback to make sure I'm not overlooking anything :)

Title: Re: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: mecano on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:29:02

3 control keys!?
Why not then move a fn to one of them?
I use 2U shifts keys, tried 1U and couldn't make it while touch typing, 2U works well here, but I don't move too far on the right having relocated enter to ctrl-j and backspace to ctrl-l (with ctrl at caps lock).

Title: Re: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: greath on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:36:54

Quote from: mecano on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:29:02

3 control keys!?
Why not then move a fn to one of them?
I use 2U shifts keys, tried 1U and couldn't make it while touch typing, 2U works well here, but I don't move too far on the right having relocated enter to ctrl-j and backspace to ctrl-l (with ctrl at caps lock).

Hmmmm, I guess if I made the left Ctrl a Fn key I could use a standard sized right shift... Could also make right Crtl into WinKey... I'll have to think about that.

Title: Re: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:42:31

Quote from: greath on Wed, 20 May 2015, 13:18:08

I see. I thought you where saying a short right shift key is tricky to type on. I haven't used one but was explaining why I thought I would be ok with typing on it. That is what I was referring to in that sentence.

I'm making this for me. No real plans to expand beyond that, I just wanted feedback to make sure I'm not overlooking anything :)

Ohhh gotcha. No no, I just meant you said in the OP that you want to maximize the sets you can use with the board and I don't think short right shift isn't in every buy. Typing on it is no issue at all :).

Title: Re: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: jdcarpe on Wed, 20 May 2015, 15:02:11

Just for balance, I think I would do something like this:

(http://i.imgur.com/YnurCo4.png)

Title: Re: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: greath on Wed, 20 May 2015, 18:35:06

Quote from: jdcarpe on Wed, 20 May 2015, 15:02:11

Just for balance, I think I would do something like this:

Show Image

(http://i.imgur.com/YnurCo4.png)

So what you're suggesting: F1-F10 on the left, 7u spacebar, add dedicated Winkeys. Why did you split the + on the numpad though?

Title: Re: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: Findecanor on Wed, 20 May 2015, 19:58:20

The biggest problem with your layout is that the Red Scarf II GH+DT Edition (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=57948) never got made. That would have provided pretty much your layout, only with the bottom row being slightly different.

There may be PCBs or kits left from previous editions on Asian trading sites though.

Title: Re: Layout Critiques Wanted
Post by: greath on Wed, 20 May 2015, 20:26:25

Gahh, that would have been great. TBH the more I look at the lightsaver the more I realize that would have worked well too, it just would have ad a slightly wider bottom row and would have keyp the F keys, which wouldn't be too big of a deal. Hopefully I can snag something similar some day soon :)