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geekhack Community => Input Devices => Topic started by: ironcoder on Sun, 27 September 2009, 05:36:10

Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ironcoder on Sun, 27 September 2009, 05:36:10: In my neverending quest to get my office straightened out...

Can you guys please recommend a good middle of the road mouse or trackball for a guy who spends most of his time actually on his keyboard and just uses the pointing device for those damnable webpages that require some kind of mouse to select stuff?

I don't game or have many demands of the mouse. I actually have a cheap one I really like because it has a one-touch double-click. It cost me 5 bucks but I don't remember where I got it. I'm open to learning to use a trackball. Thanks guys.

P.S. If Unicomp reads these forums, I sent you an email last Thursday and I didn't receive any reply. I suspect my email address went into your spam folders. Maybe filter on the subject line instead? Please send me a PM if you are on the forum. Thank you.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ch_123 on Sun, 27 September 2009, 05:42:24: The Logitech Trackman Wheel is a great all-rounder and good value for money -

(http://3ecomputer.com/cart/catalog/images/trackman%20wheel.jpg)
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: 1839cc on Sun, 27 September 2009, 16:23:19: Quote from: ch_123;120929
The Logitech Trackman Wheel is a great all-rounder and good value for money
I like it although I've never tried it with modern screen resolutions.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ch_123 on Sun, 27 September 2009, 16:33:48: I'm referring to the modern variant, not the white one that everyone around here loves (I also have one of those, but I prefer the newer one) which has quite low sensitivity. When using the newer variant with the default sensitivity in Windows, it's perfectly usable on my 1600x1200 desktop.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: 1839cc on Sun, 27 September 2009, 22:18:29: I have the one pictured. I don't think there is a newer one than that.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: Hak Foo on Sun, 27 September 2009, 22:41:07: Logitech MX400 is nice; good shape, nicely tactile side buttons (a 'how did I live without 'em" thing)
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: rdjack21 on Sun, 27 September 2009, 23:46:16: Quote from: ch_123;120929
The Logitech Trackman Wheel is a great all-rounder and good value for money -

Show Image
(http://3ecomputer.com/cart/catalog/images/trackman%20wheel.jpg)

Second the Logitech Trackman Wheel. I have a few (dozen lol) of them around here. I have one on every computer I use plus I have a travel one just in case I have to use someone else's computer that does not have one attached. I have a few of the older models as well and a Mac ADB one. You have to cover all the bases you know. I haven't used a mouse in I don't know how many years. Hmm that reminds me I need to get a few more spares...
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: 1839cc on Mon, 28 September 2009, 00:18:30: Do any of yours light up? They have LEDs inside, but I've never seen one lit.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: rdh on Mon, 28 September 2009, 01:16:56: Quote from: 1839cc;121080
Do any of yours light up? They have LEDs inside, but I've never seen one lit.

I betcha they're lit most of the time but are emitting UV, instead of visible light, to illuminate the ball for the sensors.
I'm just guessing, based on my TrackMan Marble+, which is similar but older:

Got a video camera? The sensors in 'em can usually see a bit into the UV range, so you can probably use it to tell if the LEDs are lit or not. (You can test it's UV sensitivity by using it to look at a remote control while you press the buttons.)

EDIT: added pic, corrected capitalization
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ch_123 on Mon, 28 September 2009, 12:21:32: Quote from: 1839cc;121080
Do any of yours light up? They have LEDs inside, but I've never seen one lit.

There was a variant of the trackman wheel that lit up, Dan's Data has a review of one. I think it has been discontinued... They seem to have made some minor variations to the model over the years.

Link. (http://www.dansdata.com/ltcontrollers.htm)
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: timw4mail on Mon, 28 September 2009, 15:17:53: For a mouse, I would recommend a Logitech MX 400.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ch_123 on Mon, 28 September 2009, 16:19:37: Based on what the OP has said, I think a trackball would be a better idea. Less obtrusive than a mouse.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: itlnstln on Mon, 28 September 2009, 16:27:51: Free boob. Nice.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ironcoder on Tue, 29 September 2009, 01:14:38: Thanks guys, that one ch_123 posted looks like a winner. Now let me see if I can find it locally (groan!)
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: itlnstln on Tue, 29 September 2009, 07:33:18: Quote from: ripster;121303
I thought iMav said this was a family friendly forum?

That's probably why iMav hasn't been around as much lately. We took over the forum with our filth and profanity, and he got disgusted and left. We have desecrated his work and the life he gave us. We need to pay for our sins.

Wait...
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: Shawn Stanford on Tue, 29 September 2009, 08:14:04: Quote from: rdjack21;121078
Second the Logitech Trackman Wheel.

I've had one on my desk at work for years; never a glitch or snag (other than occassionally cleaning the gunk out). Works like a champ and it doesn't give me 'mouse arm'. Highly recommended.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: skriefal on Tue, 29 September 2009, 08:59:39: The one on my desk at work has been in near-daily use for more than a decade. It's yellowed a bit, but still works great as long as I clean out the gunk every 3-4 months. And it's the old design (obviously) which fits my hands better than the newer, slightly smaller design.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: rdjack21 on Tue, 29 September 2009, 09:53:05: Quote from: skriefal;121398
The one on my desk at work has been in near-daily use for more than a decade. It's yellowed a bit, but still works great as long as I clean out the gunk every 3-4 months. And it's the old design (obviously) which fits my hands better than the newer, slightly smaller design.

Yea I prefer the older design better myself as well. The new one is just slightly to small for my hand as well. But I do have to say the new one does not need to be cleaned as often as the older ones because it does not trap as much lint as the older ones do.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ironcoder on Tue, 29 September 2009, 13:42:18: Oh damn, I see it mentions driver software. Any of you guys using these on Linux or any non-Winbloze OS?
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: rdjack21 on Tue, 29 September 2009, 14:23:43: Only run Linux myself don't have a windows box in the house. The TrackMan Wheel and all of the older ones work just fine.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: microsoft windows on Tue, 29 September 2009, 16:01:55: I'd recommend a Trackpoint for you.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: rdjack21 on Tue, 29 September 2009, 16:44:06: I actually prefer a trackball over the trackpoint. Maybe I'm just getting a few to many grey hairs to figure out how to use it LOL.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ironcoder on Wed, 30 September 2009, 01:43:54: Thanks Jack.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ironcoder on Wed, 30 September 2009, 01:45:31: Quote from: microsoft windows;121516
I'd recommend a Trackpoint for you.

If I could find keyboards that had one that would also be a good bet.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: rdjack21 on Wed, 30 September 2009, 09:04:05: Quote from: ironcoder;121601
If I could find keyboards that had one that would also be a good bet.

IBM Model M13 and preferably the Black one or the M4 (rubber dome) I think ripster did a review of them a while back. He seems to like them because he has bought quite a few of them.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ironcoder on Wed, 30 September 2009, 10:15:58: I could buy from the main ebay site, the only problem is sometimes our customs service gets a little nuts. I'm trying to convince majestouch to sell me a couple of Filcos in the meantime. That should tide me over for a while or maybe I'll also get one Unicomp. That should be enough for 3 of my boxes and I have a rubber dome in need of serious dust removal for box #4.

And I'm still looking for a reasonable source for the trackman you guys mentioned. I found them here for 59 bucks equivalent. (they're on newegg for 29 bucks)

Not!
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: rdjack21 on Wed, 30 September 2009, 12:40:09: Quote from: ripster;121651
Lots of black M4-1s on US Ebay right now but if I remember right Ironcoder is in Indonesia.

How's the trackpoint on those? I have my M13 plugged in right now trying to decide if I want to sell it. I can see the appeal of the trackpoint but I really want a smaller foot print and a lighter key action.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: microsoft windows on Wed, 30 September 2009, 17:53:19: The M4-1's have OK trackpoints, but they're not the most sensitive things in the world. Their keys also feel interesting.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: InSanCen on Thu, 01 October 2009, 16:17:07: I'll second looking into an M13.

I have recently acquired one (Cheers ragnarock!) and it is lovely. I find myself using the MX518 a lot less, and as it sits on the shelf above my M13, that's good (I get mouse arm after a while, and the M13's trackpoint encourages me to keep my hands much nearer the KB for much longer).

Bear in mind though, that mine was virtually new, and a lot of M13's out there will have seen some heavy use.

IIRC, ironcoder is not in indonesia, though I am not sure if he wants his location published. I'm sure he will say if he doesn't mind.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ironcoder on Fri, 02 October 2009, 02:50:52: Yeah where I am is a lot drier and hotter!
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: TWX on Fri, 09 October 2009, 20:01:23: I have a Kensington Orbit at work. Two buttons, small, decent. Ball is in the center so you use it by rolling your fingers over it and you click with the thumb and ring or pinkie depending on the size your hand is.

http://us.kensington.com/html/4771.html

I have one at work and I like it. The only complaint that I've ever had has been a lack of wrist rest, but that was in part due to the crappy ergonomics of my desk. I also have occasional problems with one of the buttons sticking, but putting 64oz of Mountain Dew™ through it didn't help it any.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ironcoder on Tue, 13 October 2009, 13:33:14: I just noticed this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826104156

Do you have to go wireless to get a 3 button model? The 4 and 5 button mice are freakin abominations gawd I HATE them!
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ironcoder on Sun, 01 November 2009, 11:21:39: The Trackmen finally showed up today. I went back to my Filco 87 Brown and have the Trackman next to my keyboard on a nice gel pad.

At the beginning I really didn't get it. I was like that's great, I just wasted 125 bucks on a bunch of mice. I decided to give it a week and a few hours later I'm already liking it alot more. Certain things like moving all the way across the screen still suck but maybe I need to adjust my X server settings. My old 5 dollar special roared across the screen but it takes mucho hitchhiking on the Trackman to go the distance. OTOH stuff like moving browser tabs or navigating menus on Fluxbox seems much more positive and quicker on the Trackman. I didn't expect that.

Cosmetically they did a pretty good job on these. The color is a lot darker than the photo in the start of the thread. Mine is an attractive grey. The ball is darkish red and has a nice sparkly look to it. The only thing they should have done was make the buttons sit flush with the housing. It looks bad the way they are now.

Thanks to ch_123 (I have to check but I think he was the first to answer) and the rest of you guys for chiming in on this thread. I notice a get a lot of good advice on this forum, pretty damn good S/N ratio.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ironcoder on Sun, 01 November 2009, 11:53:36: I must have missed those. I'm good at skipping over stuff lol. Otherwise I would never make it to the end of the multi-thousand page manuals I'm supposed to read.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ricercar on Sun, 01 November 2009, 18:55:45: Quote from: ironcoder;129747
never make it to the end of the multi-thousand page manuals I'm supposed to read.

Try writing them for a living. *snicker*

Master of Noise to Signal,
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: rdjack21 on Sun, 01 November 2009, 20:38:09: Quote from: ironcoder;129738
The Trackmen finally showed up today. I went back to my Filco 87 Brown and have the Trackman next to my keyboard on a nice gel pad.

Congratulations on the Trackman they are great trackballs. I have more than my fair share of them :)

Quote from: ironcoder;129738

At the beginning I really didn't get it. I was like that's great, I just wasted 125 bucks on a bunch of mice. I decided to give it a week and a few hours later I'm already liking it alot more. Certain things like moving all the way across the screen still suck but maybe I need to adjust my X server settings. My old 5 dollar special roared across the screen but it takes mucho hitchhiking on the Trackman to go the distance. OTOH stuff like moving browser tabs or navigating menus on Fluxbox seems much more positive and quicker on the Trackman. I didn't expect that.

I have mine on a 24" 1920x1200 LCD and there are a couple of things you really have to do:
1) Learn how to spin the ball. Quick flick of the thumb and the pointer is on the other side of the screen. The trick is can you do it such that the pointer goes across the screen in a strait line? or how about corner to corner.
2) You really have to dial in the mouse parameters.

The more you use it the better you will get with your thumb thus the higher you can set the acceleration or sensitivity. But even after using them for many years I find I like at about 3/4 to max and sensitivity in the 1/3 to 1/2 range.

Quote from: ironcoder;129738

Cosmetically they did a pretty good job on these. The color is a lot darker than the photo in the start of the thread. Mine is an attractive grey. The ball is darkish red and has a nice sparkly look to it. The only thing they should have done was make the buttons sit flush with the housing. It looks bad the way they are now.

Don't get to used to the paint job it comes off especially on the back where you rest your palm.

Quote from: ironcoder;129738

Thanks to ch_123 (I have to check but I think he was the first to answer) and the rest of you guys for chiming in on this thread. I notice a get a lot of good advice on this forum, pretty damn good S/N ratio.
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ironcoder on Mon, 02 November 2009, 01:56:39: Quote from: ricercar;129820
Try writing them for a living. *snicker*

Bwahaha everybody knows you guys just cut and paste until you have a few thousand pages and then yell "print it!"

"You pretend to write them, and we'll pretend to read them"

:argue:
Title: Good middle of the road trackball or mouse?
Post by: ironcoder on Mon, 02 November 2009, 02:00:19: Quote from: rdjack21;129833
Congratulations on the Trackman they are great trackballs. I have more than my fair share of them :)

Thanks for your comments earlier in the thread rdjack.

Quote from: rdjack21;129833
I have mine on a 24" 1920x1200 LCD and there are a couple of things you really have to do:
1) Learn how to spin the ball. Quick flick of the thumb and the pointer is on the other side of the screen. The trick is can you do it such that the pointer goes across the screen in a strait line? or how about corner to corner.
2) You really have to dial in the mouse parameters.

I found xmset this morning and it made a big difference. Now I can go across the screen in one flick and when I move it slow it's still accurate enough. Now it's down to fine tuning and practice.

Quote from: rdjack21;129833
The more you use it the better you will get with your thumb thus the higher you can set the acceleration or sensitivity.

No doubt.

Quote from: rdjack21;129833
But even after using them for many years I find I like at about 3/4 to max and sensitivity in the 1/3 to 1/2 range.

Thanks that's a good data point.

Quote from: rdjack21;129833
Don't get to used to the paint job it comes off especially on the back where you rest your palm.

Uh oh...here we go again ;)

Actually I don't rest my hand on the mouse because my gel mousepads have a big rise where my hand rests. My fingers are on the mouse but the rest of my hand floats like a butterfly...