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geekhack Community => Off Topic => Topic started by: nubbinator on Tue, 14 July 2015, 22:04:12

Title: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Tue, 14 July 2015, 22:04:12
So part of me really wants a new camera.  I'm still using a D70 I got before going to college, so it's something like 10 years old with tens of thousands of shutter actuations.  Something came loose inside, so the CF slot doesn't always work right without some jiggling (a common problem, but worth more than the camera to fix).  It's still completely functional, but showing its age.

One one hand, I really want a new camera and was looking at a D3200 (a huge step back in function and only 90 day warranty, but cheap and better quality photos) or a D7000 body (~$450, but more functionality, internal focusing motor, and a 3 year warranty).  On the other hand, that's a lot of money to be dropping when $500 a month is going to car payments, $2000+ is going to student loans, plus food and gas.  It's not like the camera is dead yet, but it's getting there.

Now that I wrote this, I'm not even sure if I wrote this to ask for opinions or for confirmation of my slowly growing decision to just wait until the camera is dead to buy a replacement.

Edit:  Also, this feels like nubs thread is tp thread.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Dreamre on Tue, 14 July 2015, 22:16:56
I also feel you...not sure if I should get a Sony A7II or a 5D Mark 3...or just save and stick with my 40D.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Badwrench on Tue, 14 July 2015, 22:39:41
I would hold out until it dies.  You are still able to get great photos with it.  Pay the bills and get what you really want when the $$ is there. 
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: tbc on Tue, 14 July 2015, 22:47:02
2k a month fir student loans?!!!!!?

if you're fasttracking the payments, then you're fine taking a break for one month.  just do the standard 'cost / hours of fun' calculation. nothing special.

if those are mandatory payments, then i would imagine a new camera would eat up quite an uncomfortably large part of your fun budget. 

Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: njbair on Tue, 14 July 2015, 22:48:20
Get a new camera, but not a new camera.

I just picked up a Nikon D7000 body, which is a 2010 model, for $560 new in box. By comparison, the D7200 which replaced it is currently selling for about $1,200 for just the body. Here's a comparison (http://snapsort.com/compare/Nikon-D7200-vs-Nikon_D7000/specs).

Really the only differences are some 1080p video frame rates (I only ever use 24p so I don't care), and a slightly better low-light ISO score (but both cameras score over 1000 ISO which is really good).

EDIT: I just noticed you mentioned the D7000 by name. I suppose you can take my advice as a glowing endorsement, then.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: dwk396 on Tue, 14 July 2015, 23:53:04
If I were you, I would not make any big purchases.
If it is a very critical, or job related, you have to, but if not, just wait till your camera just dies.

Or get a credit card that will give you no interest for ~20 months, like citi ones, and then you can make minimum automatic payments every month and get less financial hit.

But if you don't like credit cards, I guess just wait till the camera dies.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: tp4tissue on Wed, 15 July 2015, 05:11:48
Get a new camera, but not a new camera.

I just picked up a Nikon D7000 body, which is a 2010 model, for $560 new in box. By comparison, the D7200 which replaced it is currently selling for about $1,200 for just the body. Here's a comparison (http://snapsort.com/compare/Nikon-D7200-vs-Nikon_D7000/specs).

Really the only differences are some 1080p video frame rates (I only ever use 24p so I don't care), and a slightly better low-light ISO score (but both cameras score over 1000 ISO which is really good).

EDIT: I just noticed you mentioned the D7000 by name. I suppose you can take my advice as a glowing endorsement, then.

Wellllll.... if Nubb wants to start doing nature documentaries,  He might want something that does 1080i60 or 1080p60...  at least 1080p30

This is also true, if Nubbs wishes to get into the pr0n-circuit..
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: jerue on Wed, 15 July 2015, 06:09:23
when $500 a month is going to car payments, $2000+ is going to student loans, plus food and gas.

 :eek: ...those student loan payments  :eek: , I pay a little over 1/4 of that per month, wow if I made those sorts of payments I could finish off in no time....

Anyways, I think that most people just post ?'s like these so they can get confirmation of their own thoughts, so it's OK - I too would wait for the camera to die. By then maybe you can get a closeout deal on a D3300 or something more amazing will be out. The entry level Nikons are in desperate need of a major refresh.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: tp4tissue on Wed, 15 July 2015, 06:44:52
Also, most important..

Cameras sit around and do jack nothing MOST of the time..


Let's say you can invest $1000 and get a girlfriend vs $1000 on a camera...


Which would you pick..


A girlfriend usually has significantly more utility.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: PunksDead on Wed, 15 July 2015, 07:21:06
Also, most important..

Cameras sit around and do jack nothing MOST of the time..


Let's say you can invest $1000 and get a girlfriend vs $1000 on a camera...


Which would you pick..


A girlfriend usually has significantly more utility.

Whoa whoa whoa mr.TP

Idk where you are finding these $1000 girlfriends but I can tell you your calculations are way off. If we factor in just birthdays and Holiday gifts for said gf that's about a grand right there. These girls eat at the bank account like some sort of ravenous Marc Jacobs buying machines. Diners/movies/etc, not to mention you might want to spruce up your own wardrobe to keep her wanting a piece of that everyday. The sex may seem worth it in the beginning but as the time moves on and you realize how much $$$ you are actually spending you may want to reconsider.

My vote is for a reasonably priced escort and a D3300
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: iamtootallforthis on Wed, 15 July 2015, 07:26:34
Also, most important..

Cameras sit around and do jack nothing MOST of the time..


Let's say you can invest $1000 and get a girlfriend vs $1000 on a camera...


Which would you pick..


A girlfriend usually has significantly more utility.

Whoa whoa whoa mr.TP

Idk where you are finding these $1000 girlfriends but I can tell you your calculations are way off. If we factor in just birthdays and Holiday gifts for said gf that's about a grand right there. These girls eat at the bank account like some sort of ravenous Marc Jacobs buying machines. Diners/movies/etc, not to mention you might want to spruce up your own wardrobe to keep her wanting a piece of that everyday. The sex may seem worth it in the beginning but as the time moves on and you realize how much $$$ you are actually spending you may want to reconsider.

My vote is for a reasonably priced escort and a D3300

Hahaha. You also need to calculate all the dates before officially dating and all that.

Back on topic though, I would say wait till your camera dies.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Jokrik on Wed, 15 July 2015, 08:32:34
Hi Nub,
From reading your case I can see that you've the lust for a new camera
I've always ended up with the same problem, recently with Drones (DJI Phantom)

I love photography and really wanna try the new trend of drone photography, but than again I've lack of time and object (since I live in a small city)
That is why, from worthy pov I retracted my intention

Now to your problem, I might suggest you to see it from functionality point of view
Does spending on a new camera would tripled the quality of the result? IMO photography does not rely 100% on most expensive camera, BUT I can also assure you a good camera would help a lot
but it's the play with lighting, ambient, moment and object

so if you have products to showcase/sale like your keycaps (which I adores dolly so much), yes a new camera would help
if no, you still have obligations to do, unless you get a huge bonus at the end of the year :D

one last thing, how about waiting for boxing day? still half a year to go and dont you Americans get crazy discounts at that time?
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: VoteForDavid on Wed, 15 July 2015, 22:02:48
Speaking as someone who upgraded from a D70 to a D7000:

If you get the newer camera you will be happy with it.  You may not like the financial situation into which it puts you, but that is a separate concern. 

The camera is not 100x better as the model might imply, but it is nice.  The feature set is similar, the buttons are a little different.  In theory it can shoot video.  But sometimes it's magic where the D70 would blow a shot or blow out highlights.  The auto mode is smarter.  The improved autofocus is very nice.  The larger screen and the easier zooming and scrolling are very nice.  If you make use of both the control dials on your D70 don't compromise and get a D3x00 or D5x00 series.  Save up and get the D7x00 series.

Prices are falling all the time on previous-generation equipment.  Mouse out somewhere between $0 and $500 a month.  Try for the low end of that if your budget is tight.  Put it in a clear vessel so you can see it building up.  When you get around $500 go camera shopping.  If you find a nikon-refurbished body from an authorized distributor, it will be as-new and work perfectly.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: hwood34 on Wed, 15 July 2015, 22:07:07
With cameras, it's not really about the camera body itself as it is the lenses. Your best bet would probably be to pick an older model DSLR for cheap.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Wed, 15 July 2015, 22:19:23
With cameras, it's not really about the camera body itself as it is the lenses. Your best bet would probably be to pick an older model DSLR for cheap.

It's both, and if I'm going to buy a camera, I'd rather spend $400-500 on a body with a warranty than $200-300 on something without one that has an unknown number of shutter actuations and where I have no clue how the internals are.

I saw it's both because many older models don't have the same color range or handle colors as well as others.  Older DSLRs (like my D70) have a very difficult time with the color orange.  More modern DSLRs do better with orange.  Older DSLRs have a lot more grain at ISO over 400-800, modern (in the last 4 years or so) handle low light dramatically better and have more aesthetically pleasing grain.

The lenses do play a role, but the $100-200 difference between a nicer DSLR with a better feature set and an older one or one with worse features is not enough to buy some really nice glass. 
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: hwood34 on Wed, 15 July 2015, 22:20:17
With cameras, it's not really about the camera body itself as it is the lenses. Your best bet would probably be to pick an older model DSLR for cheap.

It's both, and if I'm going to buy a camera, I'd rather spend $400-500 on a body with a warranty than $200-300 on something without one that has an unknown number of shutter actuations and where I have no clue how the internals are.

I saw it's both because many older models don't have the same color range or handle colors as well as others.  Older DSLRs (like my D70) have a very difficult time with the color orange.  More modern DSLRs do better with orange.  Older DSLRs have a lot more grain at ISO over 400-800, modern (in the last 4 years or so) handle low light dramatically better and have more aesthetically pleasing grain.

The lenses do play a role, but the $100-200 difference between a nicer DSLR with a better feature set and an older one or one with worse features is not enough to buy some really nice glass.

Well then then Rebels are certainly a good camera in the $400-500 range
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Wed, 15 July 2015, 22:25:25

Well then then Rebels are certainly a good camera in the $400-500 range

I already have Nikon glass.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: tp4tissue on Wed, 15 July 2015, 22:26:17
Also, most important..

Cameras sit around and do jack nothing MOST of the time..


Let's say you can invest $1000 and get a girlfriend vs $1000 on a camera...


Which would you pick..


A girlfriend usually has significantly more utility.

Whoa whoa whoa mr.TP

Idk where you are finding these $1000 girlfriends but I can tell you your calculations are way off. If we factor in just birthdays and Holiday gifts for said gf that's about a grand right there. These girls eat at the bank account like some sort of ravenous Marc Jacobs buying machines. Diners/movies/etc, not to mention you might want to spruce up your own wardrobe to keep her wanting a piece of that everyday. The sex may seem worth it in the beginning but as the time moves on and you realize how much $$$ you are actually spending you may want to reconsider.

My vote is for a reasonably priced escort and a D3300



I've seen guys that spend quite alot on dates..  But I think they're doing it wrong..


I usually get where I want to be after a simple lunch date..   couldn't be more than $40


so.... I can get almost a month and a half of -relationship- for $1000.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: njbair on Thu, 16 July 2015, 00:18:07
With cameras, it's not really about the camera body itself as it is the lenses. Your best bet would probably be to pick an older model DSLR for cheap.

It's both, and if I'm going to buy a camera, I'd rather spend $400-500 on a body with a warranty than $200-300 on something without one that has an unknown number of shutter actuations and where I have no clue how the internals are.

I saw it's both because many older models don't have the same color range or handle colors as well as others.  Older DSLRs (like my D70) have a very difficult time with the color orange.  More modern DSLRs do better with orange.  Older DSLRs have a lot more grain at ISO over 400-800, modern (in the last 4 years or so) handle low light dramatically better and have more aesthetically pleasing grain.

The lenses do play a role, but the $100-200 difference between a nicer DSLR with a better feature set and an older one or one with worse features is not enough to buy some really nice glass.

Well then then Rebels are certainly a good camera in the $400-500 range

FWIW In my comparison shopping, I found that the Nikons in that price range have much better low-light ISO performance (like, double) than their Canon counterparts.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: dwk396 on Thu, 16 July 2015, 06:43:11
Also, most important..

Cameras sit around and do jack nothing MOST of the time..


Let's say you can invest $1000 and get a girlfriend vs $1000 on a camera...


Which would you pick..


A girlfriend usually has significantly more utility.

Whoa whoa whoa mr.TP

Idk where you are finding these $1000 girlfriends but I can tell you your calculations are way off. If we factor in just birthdays and Holiday gifts for said gf that's about a grand right there. These girls eat at the bank account like some sort of ravenous Marc Jacobs buying machines. Diners/movies/etc, not to mention you might want to spruce up your own wardrobe to keep her wanting a piece of that everyday. The sex may seem worth it in the beginning but as the time moves on and you realize how much $$$ you are actually spending you may want to reconsider.

My vote is for a reasonably priced escort and a D3300



I've seen guys that spend quite alot on dates..  But I think they're doing it wrong..


I usually get where I want to be after a simple lunch date..   couldn't be more than $40


so.... I can get almost a month and a half of -relationship- for $1000.

Hi, is this pot talking again??
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: tp4tissue on Thu, 16 July 2015, 07:11:16


Hi, is this pot talking again??

Tp4 no do drugs..

How could you afford to go on dates + do drugs..
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Sed8op8 on Sun, 19 July 2015, 02:12:32
Oh come one we expect gifts to punks, drinks when we go out and to be taken out to do something interesting on a fairly regular basis  :))

For real  though you find the right one of us and we will put in just as much or more as the guy in the relationship 8)

That being said the camera is definitely the safer easier less complicated purchase by far !!!!
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: PunksDead on Sun, 19 July 2015, 02:18:20
Oh come one we expect gifts to punks, drinks when we go out and to be taken out to do something interesting on a fairly regular basis  :))

On a real basis though you find the right one of us and we will put in just as much or more as the guy in the relationship 8)

That being said the camera is definitely the safer easier less complicated purchase by far !!!!

(http://i.imgur.com/yhQU9cZ.jpg)
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Sed8op8 on Mon, 20 July 2015, 11:10:26
Oh come one we expect gifts to punks, drinks when we go out and to be taken out to do something interesting on a fairly regular basis  :))

On a real basis though you find the right one of us and we will put in just as much or more as the guy in the relationship 8)

That being said the camera is definitely the safer easier less complicated purchase by far !!!!

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/yhQU9cZ.jpg)

geez I learn2 spill wit deardliest ofz precisionz (http://bitterblend.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/bubbles.png)
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Binge on Mon, 20 July 2015, 12:18:43
With cameras, it's not really about the camera body itself as it is the lenses. Your best bet would probably be to pick an older model DSLR for cheap.

...It's both...

qft-  My father has always tried to tell me that the lenses will create the greatest difference.  I find this to be partially true but slightly dated in thought.  Back in his day you had film... got the right film and the lense basically did all the work while the body allowed you to set the parameters.  Not all sensors are created equal, not all firmware/software are created equal.

I've seen what a good lense can do on a great camera, but I've seen what a great lense can do on a dated camera... the results are just not very impressive.

If your body is starting to crap out save for yourself first and because you have lenses sticking with Nikon is a great choice.

I've recently purchased a 5300 which will not be as fast as the D7000, but I am enjoying a number of the other features.  In the shop the D7000 was not as easy to adjust on the fly, and I liked how the external screen on the 5300 played a greater role in recording video/previewing the effect (live view) ISO/shutter/aperture on a subject.

That all being said... the 5300 body can be about $400 new if you find the right deal.  I've seen that Massdrop is starting to work with DSLRs, so a deal might pop up there for a nice camera body GB.  The D3300 that HP mentioned is also a great great great purchase if you plan on doing photo work only.  The reason I went with the 5300 was to do more with video as well as photo work.

Best of luck to you in the future with finding a new camera body that has all its ports working, but timing is important...  Gotta be comfortable with where you are at with your finances or a new camera will go out just as soon as it came in.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: tp4tissue on Mon, 20 July 2015, 14:33:27
Oh come one we expect gifts to punks, drinks when we go out and to be taken out to do something interesting on a fairly regular basis  :))

On a real basis though you find the right one of us and we will put in just as much or more as the guy in the relationship 8)

That being said the camera is definitely the safer easier less complicated purchase by far !!!!

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/yhQU9cZ.jpg)

geez I learn2 spill wit deardliest ofz precisionz
Show Image
(http://bitterblend.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/bubbles.png)



Not sure if spelling mistakes were on purpose..

Could be a medical condition..

(http://www.cute-factor.com/images/smilies/onion/014.gif)
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Sed8op8 on Mon, 20 July 2015, 14:52:42
Oh come one we expect gifts to punks, drinks when we go out and to be taken out to do something interesting on a fairly regular basis  :))

On a real basis though you find the right one of us and we will put in just as much or more as the guy in the relationship 8)

That being said the camera is definitely the safer easier less complicated purchase by far !!!!

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/yhQU9cZ.jpg)

geez I learn2 spill wit deardliest ofz precisionz
Show Image
(http://bitterblend.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/bubbles.png)



Not sure if spelling mistakes were on purpose..

Could be a medical condition..

Show Image
(http://www.cute-factor.com/images/smilies/onion/014.gif)

just a bit of self deprecating humor 8p
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Mon, 20 July 2015, 15:03:24
Thanks for the input everyone.. though that's probably the wrong phase given the lady user to say that...

I may look more at the D5300.  The pentamirror v pentaprism, smaller viewfinder, no AF motor, single dial for shutter speed and aperture, and a few other features got to me on the D5000 series, but it may be worth rehashing.

I'll probably be selling some keyboard stuff (my Leitch G81 and G80 phone system board) to help fund it.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: dustinhxc on Mon, 20 July 2015, 15:12:05
I say stick with your current camera bro! Im still using my Nikon D60 and I love it. I use this macro lens with it:
http://photojojo.com/store/awesomeness/wide-angle-macro-lens/ (http://photojojo.com/store/awesomeness/wide-angle-macro-lens/)

 :thumb:
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Mon, 20 July 2015, 15:17:24
The D70 is slowly dying or I would.  I think I have around 200k on the shutter.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Sed8op8 on Mon, 20 July 2015, 15:21:43
Thanks for the input everyone.. though that's probably the wrong phase given the lady user to say that...

I may look more at the D5300.  The pentamirror v pentaprism, smaller viewfinder, no AF motor, single dial for shutter speed and aperture, and a few other features got to me on the D5000 series, but it may be worth rehashing.

I'll probably be selling some keyboard stuff (my Leitch G81 and G80 phone system board) to help fund it.
You take really nice pics as is Nubbz . However given the amount of money you have dedicated to Bills and loans I'm not really sure how hard a $500 camera would hit your wallet. I guess I would say if you could sell something In your collection your not completely enamored with to help mitigate the cost go for it.m
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Mon, 20 July 2015, 15:43:32
Your photos are really good already, so you don't need to upgrade for that reason.  I'd wait til it dies and buy then.  But maybe start saving now to make that easier.  ;)

Also, it's great to see someone else with that much a month in student loan payments!   :rolleyes:
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Mon, 20 July 2015, 20:18:04
You take really nice pics as is Nubbz . However given the amount of money you have dedicated to Bills and loans I'm not really sure how hard a $500 camera would hit your wallet. I guess I would say if you could sell something In your collection your not completely enamored with to help mitigate the cost go for it.m


That was kind of the plan.  I have keyboards that I'm not using and don't plan on using, so I'm going to try and sell them to fund a new (to me at least) camera and/or lenses.  I figure I could most likely raise a couple hundred doing that.


Your photos are really good already, so you don't need to upgrade for that reason.  I'd wait til it dies and buy then.  But maybe start saving now to make that easier.  ;)

Also, it's great to see someone else with that much a month in student loan payments!   :rolleyes:

Thanks man.  I convinced myself I didn't need a new one yet, then decided I did, so I'm all screwed up.  I was looking at a new one not just for the pictures on here but because I've been thinking about some of the features and how the camera and features may encourage me to start hiking or going on walks again.  Grad school got me out of shape and my job didn't help, so I'm looking at it to help encourage me to get off my ass a little more.

Sorry to make you sad about the loan payments Hoff.  I started at ~$30k last January or February and I've been paying them off as quickly as I could and I'm now down to $3500...or will be once the payment from my last paycheck clears.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: njbair on Mon, 20 July 2015, 20:25:58
I've recently purchased a 5300 which will not be as fast as the D7000, but I am enjoying a number of the other features.  In the shop the D7000 was not as easy to adjust on the fly, and I liked how the external screen on the 5300 played a greater role in recording video/previewing the effect (live view) ISO/shutter/aperture on a subject.

The D5300 was the other one I looked at really hard before buying the D7000. Your comparison is pretty spot-on, and I liked some of the firmware features (like built-in HDR) but at the end of the day, I figured it was better to spend the money on more sensor in exchange for fewer features.

That said, it's an awesome camera you've got there and I don't think there's one right answer for everyone.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Binge on Mon, 20 July 2015, 22:30:35
You take really nice pics as is Nubbz . However given the amount of money you have dedicated to Bills and loans I'm not really sure how hard a $500 camera would hit your wallet. I guess I would say if you could sell something In your collection your not completely enamored with to help mitigate the cost go for it.m


That was kind of the plan.  I have keyboards that I'm not using and don't plan on using, so I'm going to try and sell them to fund a new (to me at least) camera and/or lenses.  I figure I could most likely raise a couple hundred doing that.

Your photos are really good already, so you don't need to upgrade for that reason.  I'd wait til it dies and buy then.  But maybe start saving now to make that easier.  ;)

Also, it's great to see someone else with that much a month in student loan payments!   :rolleyes:

Thanks man.  I convinced myself I didn't need a new one yet, then decided I did, so I'm all screwed up.  I was looking at a new one not just for the pictures on here but because I've been thinking about some of the features and how the camera and features may encourage me to start hiking or going on walks again.  Grad school got me out of shape and my job didn't help, so I'm looking at it to help encourage me to get off my ass a little more.

Sorry to make you sad about the loan payments Hoff.  I started at ~$30k last January or February and I've been paying them off as quickly as I could and I'm now down to $3500...or will be once the payment from my last paycheck clears.

Feeling you about getting out more and wanting to make it as fun as staying in.  Cameras are amazing with daylight :)

I've recently purchased a 5300 which will not be as fast as the D7000, but I am enjoying a number of the other features.  In the shop the D7000 was not as easy to adjust on the fly, and I liked how the external screen on the 5300 played a greater role in recording video/previewing the effect (live view) ISO/shutter/aperture on a subject.

The D5300 was the other one I looked at really hard before buying the D7000. Your comparison is pretty spot-on, and I liked some of the firmware features (like built-in HDR) but at the end of the day, I figured it was better to spend the money on more sensor in exchange for fewer features.

That said, it's an awesome camera you've got there and I don't think there's one right answer for everyone.

Big sensors are teets.  Right you are.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: demik on Mon, 20 July 2015, 23:21:48
Wait are you deciding between a gf and a camera?

Camera. Then just pretend you run a blog and start nailing fake suicide girls.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Mon, 20 July 2015, 23:25:13
nubs needs to remember how to make friends and women outside of school.  Grad school sucks your life. 

In other words, camera now, girlfriend later.  And the suicide girl look is my type.  How'd you know demik?
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: demik on Mon, 20 July 2015, 23:27:21
i understand the hipster mindset.

And I like them also.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Mon, 20 July 2015, 23:28:07
nubs is not a hipster.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: demik on Mon, 20 July 2015, 23:28:48
Hipster has gone meta
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: heedpantsnow on Mon, 20 July 2015, 23:34:23
I'd wait. Never buy a piece of tech until you absolutely need it due to falling prices.

The megapixel race causes the situation that used stuff  is adequate and gets cheaper and cheaper.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Mon, 20 July 2015, 23:34:53
Unless the keyboard hobby is considered ironic, I'm not well enough dressed or ironic enough to be a hipster.  The vegetarian thing does count against me though.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: demik on Mon, 20 July 2015, 23:37:04
And the nose ring

Don't know about the keyboard thing. I tried to tell my new car buddies about GH and like 2 sentences into it I just gave up. Didn't even make it to the wacky world of click clacks
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: njbair on Tue, 21 July 2015, 19:35:35
Speaking of hipsters and cameras, this video is probably the best way ever to spend 20 minutes.

Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: GL1TCH3D on Tue, 21 July 2015, 19:51:04
I might be selling my camera setup xP

Having a camera you enjoy using is good but what really matters are the lenses.

A very sharp and clear lens in a focal length you use is FAR more satisfying than getting a nice camera body (unless you need the features from the new body or something is disrupting the picture taking from the old body).

Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: njbair on Tue, 21 July 2015, 20:31:24
I might be selling my camera setup xP

Having a camera you enjoy using is good but what really matters are the lenses.

A very sharp and clear lens in a focal length you use is FAR more satisfying than getting a nice camera body (unless you need the features from the new body or something is disrupting the picture taking from the old body).

My only lens right now is a 35mm prime. People are surprised when they see my camera and then find out it "doesn't even have zoom," but the lens is super fast and tack-sharp:

(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/329/19712948070_24dec8b595_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/w2Y1F1)
Drew on a Boat (https://flic.kr/p/w2Y1F1) by Nick Bair (https://www.flickr.com/photos/njbair/), on Flickr

(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3784/19714615319_0492c1b0db_h.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/w37yhF)
At the Helm (https://flic.kr/p/w37yhF) by Nick Bair (https://www.flickr.com/photos/njbair/), on Flickr

(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/516/19313574711_6f89c8b1fd_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/vqF7Tr)
IBM Model M SSK (https://flic.kr/p/vqF7Tr) by Nick Bair (https://www.flickr.com/photos/njbair/), on Flickr

(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/469/19308701025_4430efa4a2_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/vqf97n)
Sadsters (https://flic.kr/p/vqf97n) by Nick Bair (https://www.flickr.com/photos/njbair/), on Flickr
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: GL1TCH3D on Tue, 21 July 2015, 20:38:25
Prime lenses are the best for quality.

I'm hoping to move to the new Sony A7 body and get some other nice primes
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: njbair on Tue, 21 July 2015, 20:41:11
Prime lenses are the best for quality.

I'm hoping to move to the new Sony A7 body and get some other nice primes

The Sony A7 is no joke. I just...Sony...I just can't.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: GL1TCH3D on Tue, 21 July 2015, 20:42:17
Prime lenses are the best for quality.

I'm hoping to move to the new Sony A7 body and get some other nice primes

The Sony A7 is no joke. I just...Sony...I just can't.

I've had good experiences with some of sony's stuff. They tend to be hit or miss with some products but the Sony A7 is definitely a hit.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: njbair on Tue, 21 July 2015, 20:48:03
Prime lenses are the best for quality.

I'm hoping to move to the new Sony A7 body and get some other nice primes

The Sony A7 is no joke. I just...Sony...I just can't.

I've had good experiences with some of sony's stuff. They tend to be hit or miss with some products but the Sony A7 is definitely a hit.

I never thought I would see the day when real pro's would abandon SLR in favor of mirrorless. In fact, I never even considered it as a possibility. But leave it to Sony, they've always been the pioneers in digital imaging.

The really nice thing about the A7 is that they seem to be really good with non-Sony lens support, which is something decidedly un-Sonylike.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: GL1TCH3D on Tue, 21 July 2015, 21:04:55
Prime lenses are the best for quality.

I'm hoping to move to the new Sony A7 body and get some other nice primes

The Sony A7 is no joke. I just...Sony...I just can't.

I've had good experiences with some of sony's stuff. They tend to be hit or miss with some products but the Sony A7 is definitely a hit.

I never thought I would see the day when real pro's would abandon SLR in favor of mirrorless. In fact, I never even considered it as a possibility. But leave it to Sony, they've always been the pioneers in digital imaging.

The really nice thing about the A7 is that they seem to be really good with non-Sony lens support, which is something decidedly un-Sonylike.

Sony has made some really interesting headphones in the past. Unfortunately their current line up pretty much sucks. They can do some things really well but other things are meh.

I think the killer about the A7 is the size convenience along with the full frame sensor. I know that the lenses can make up a lot of the bulk when travelling but a nice slim Sony A7 with a couple of lenses is a lot more doable than let's say the Canon 5d
(http://bloghammonphoto.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/DSC48281.jpg)
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: njbair on Tue, 21 July 2015, 21:09:17
I think the killer about the A7 is the size convenience along with the full frame sensor. I know that the lenses can make up a lot of the bulk when travelling but a nice slim Sony A7 with a couple of lenses is a lot more doable than let's say the Canon 5d
Show Image
(http://bloghammonphoto.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/DSC48281.jpg)


Wow, I knew it was smaller but I didn't realize how much smaller it really is.

Won't be long now before cameras are just little discs with some buttons around the edge and an optional "full body" grip attachment.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: demik on Tue, 21 July 2015, 21:12:09
<3 my a6k
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: VoteForDavid on Tue, 21 July 2015, 21:13:51
There's more to cameras than sensor size.  As an SLR shooter who got tired of not seeing images in the EVF in bright light, I don't think I'm going to be shooting a point-and-shoot anytime soon.  And that includes the sony alpha line and all the 4/3 crowd.

Plus a few other words I wrote about this, before: https://votefordavid.wordpress.com/2011/11/28/dont-be-a-dummy-dont-buy-an-evil-camera/
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: tbc on Tue, 21 July 2015, 21:21:24
I think the killer about the A7 is the size convenience along with the full frame sensor. I know that the lenses can make up a lot of the bulk when travelling but a nice slim Sony A7 with a couple of lenses is a lot more doable than let's say the Canon 5d
Show Image
(http://bloghammonphoto.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/DSC48281.jpg)


Wow, I knew it was smaller but I didn't realize how much smaller it really is.

Won't be long now before cameras are just little discs with some buttons around the edge and an optional "full body" grip attachment.

last year for the record

http://store.sony.com/interchangeable-lens-style-camera-zid27-ILCEQX1/B/cat-27-catid-All-Cyber-shot-Q-Series-Cameras
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Lain1911 on Tue, 21 July 2015, 21:21:38
So part of me really wants a new camera.  I'm still using a D70 I got before going to college, so it's something like 10 years old with tens of thousands of shutter actuations. 

I stopped there. If you have tens of thousands of pictures taken in ten years that means you qualify for a new camera, because you use it enough.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: njbair on Tue, 21 July 2015, 21:26:05
There's more to cameras than sensor size.  As an SLR shooter who got tired of not seeing images in the EVF in bright light, I don't think I'm going to be shooting a point-and-shoot anytime soon.  And that includes the sony alpha line and all the 4/3 crowd.

Plus a few other words I wrote about this, before: https://votefordavid.wordpress.com/2011/11/28/dont-be-a-dummy-dont-buy-an-evil-camera/

I get what you're saying, but it's not really fair to call the A7 a point-and-shoot. SLR really only refers to the shutter mechanism, but it also traditionally delineates a lot of other high-end features (sensor quality, better software, interchangeable lenses, overall build quality, etc.). Because people willing to spend on an SLR were the same people who wanted those features. By calling it a mirrorless camera instead of a point-and-shoot, you're basically saying it's an SLR in the product marketing sense, just not in the literal sense. But even the eyepiece EVF is supposed to be pretty decent. I wouldn't dismiss it, even though the Sony brand just rubs me the wrong way.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: VoteForDavid on Tue, 21 July 2015, 21:41:46
Nikon has a recent point-and-shoot with a lens that will zoom in and you can exchange obscene gestures with the man on the Moon.  And?  Sony has an EVIL camera with an APS-C sized sensor.  And?  I fail to see the superiority, but then my ideal camera is a D4-series until they come out with a D5.  I deride the entire genre, on principle - but it would be silly not to acknowledge they are decent cameras, for what they are.

From my linked article: "If you like automatic transmissions in your cars, pay with the EZ-pass on your keychain, and like compact fluorescent bulbs – AND you want to be able to change out your camera lenses, then the EVIL is perfect for you. . . . The fact of the matter is, for most people, image quality is going to be about the same, regardless of what kind of camera they buy." 

Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: jamster on Tue, 21 July 2015, 21:43:46
If photos are important to you, get a camera. Good images should last you the rest of your life. Keyboards in all probability will not.

I ran a Canon 30D for absolutely ages (same era as a D70, iirc). Enthusiast friends kept telling to to upgrade as sensor tech had moved on, but I ignored them.

A year or two ago I bought a Canon SL1 because it's super small and comfortable to hold. I don't care about the body, it just sits at the back of my primes and L zooms. So it was either the smallest body, or go the other way with a full frame sensor for low light performance and a stupidly heavy body. Even on the SL1, the sensor quality really is noticeably better than on the old 30D, despite the new one being Canon's lowest-end DSLR.

I travel a lot and use photos to trigger old memories, so a good camera is important. I have kept 22,000 images, taken digitally and converted from slides. I've taken a *lot* more as my keep rate from is under well under 10%.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Thu, 23 July 2015, 23:20:58
Now I'm even more torn with this refurbished deal:  http://www.adorama.com/INKD5300BK1R.html

I was really leaning toward a refurbed D7100, but this deal makes it tougher to choose.

How quickly did you adjust to the controls Binge?  Any quibbles with the camera?  I'm really used to the discrete aperture and SS controls and prefer a camera with an onboard lens motor, but it's almost $150 cheaper than most refurbs I've seen and it comes with a lens.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Fri, 24 July 2015, 00:12:26
Now I'm even more torn with this refurbished deal:  http://www.adorama.com/INKD5300BK1R.html

I was really leaning toward a refurbed D7100, but this deal makes it tougher to choose.

How quickly did you adjust to the controls Binge?  Any quibbles with the camera?  I'm really used to the discrete aperture and SS controls and prefer a camera with an onboard lens motor, but it's almost $150 cheaper than most refurbs I've seen and it comes with a lens.

That's my main beef with mirrorless (the lack of discrete aperture and SS controls) so that would probably bug me.  :-/  That is a good deal though...
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Spopepro on Fri, 24 July 2015, 01:39:32
It's always easy to spend other people's money, but as a fellow D70s owner, I fully understand your strong desire to upgrade (I hate saying need when it's just stuff).  I went through nearly the same search a while ago and ended up getting this:
(https://dl.dropbox.com/s/8p25gesi6ziz7rz/2015-01-19%2016.06.14-1.jpg?dl=0)
OK, that probably doesn't help.  But in all honesty, I ended up deciding that if I wasn't going to buy a FX sensor body, it probably wasn't really worth it.  I got a F3 body for pennies, then the rollei and have done nothing but shoot film.  Granted, I'm helped by having a studio that does group-darkroom membership.
(https://dl.dropbox.com/s/e9p8tvl9evmbaoe/2015-01-24%2019.39.18sm.jpg?dl=0)
Which has absolutely worked out better for me considering that nature and street photography is 99% of what I tend to do.

Which is the *actual* point that I'm going to.  I think you mentioned that you shoot surf competitions.  Sports stuff needs big glass and the bigger sensor the better.  If the D70 wasn't dead, I'd say wait until the funds existed for a d600, or even take a flyer on a well cared for D2x.  Otherwise, I'm not entirely sure that the other options will actually feel like an upgrade.  Sure, they will have more features (but probably most will be unused), and the sensors and software are better, but not massively so.  It's a tough call at that point, which is probably why you keep going back and forth.

Oh, and film... so you have been out-hipstered.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Fri, 24 July 2015, 01:47:02
Only out-hipstered by the camera you use.  I still like to do cross-process film sometimes.

(http://i.imgur.com/hWBv1WO.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/55GrQXR.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/QpXK1FK.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/SxHACin.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/WuLLOd8.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/u3nf5C4.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/ftcM7hw.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/W06hFO3.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/g2VzrDm.jpg)
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Spopepro on Fri, 24 July 2015, 02:13:41
 :)
Those are very good.  I've been wanting to do some, but just the fact of needing gloves and a quality respirator for developing color has kept me away.  For now. 
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: heedpantsnow on Fri, 24 July 2015, 10:12:49

Now I'm even more torn with this refurbished deal:  http://www.adorama.com/INKD5300BK1R.html

I was really leaning toward a refurbed D7100, but this deal makes it tougher to choose.

How quickly did you adjust to the controls Binge?  Any quibbles with the camera?  I'm really used to the discrete aperture and SS controls and prefer a camera with an onboard lens motor, but it's almost $150 cheaper than most refurbs I've seen and it comes with a lens.

That's my main beef with mirrorless (the lack of discrete aperture and SS controls) so that would probably bug me.  :-/  That is a good deal though...

What do you mean by "lack of discrete aperture and SS controls"?  My Oly E-M5 and E-P3 both have them, as well as most other higher-end Olys and Pannys. And the Sony mirrorless models have them too I think...
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Fri, 24 July 2015, 10:23:55

Now I'm even more torn with this refurbished deal:  http://www.adorama.com/INKD5300BK1R.html

I was really leaning toward a refurbed D7100, but this deal makes it tougher to choose.

How quickly did you adjust to the controls Binge?  Any quibbles with the camera?  I'm really used to the discrete aperture and SS controls and prefer a camera with an onboard lens motor, but it's almost $150 cheaper than most refurbs I've seen and it comes with a lens.

That's my main beef with mirrorless (the lack of discrete aperture and SS controls) so that would probably bug me.  :-/  That is a good deal though...

What do you mean by "lack of discrete aperture and SS controls"?  My Oly E-M5 and E-P3 both have them, as well as most other higher-end Olys and Pannys. And the Sony mirrorless models have them too I think...

Perhaps my sweeping generalization of "mirrorless" was a bit too sweeping.  My NEX-F3 has one dial on the back that controls both aperture and SS, toggled by a push button.  I just don't like that.  :P  I much prefer controlling aperture with a lens dial, but that doesn't seem to be a thing in the digital world.   :rolleyes:
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Binge on Fri, 24 July 2015, 10:29:22

Now I'm even more torn with this refurbished deal:  http://www.adorama.com/INKD5300BK1R.html

I was really leaning toward a refurbed D7100, but this deal makes it tougher to choose.

How quickly did you adjust to the controls Binge?  Any quibbles with the camera?  I'm really used to the discrete aperture and SS controls and prefer a camera with an onboard lens motor, but it's almost $150 cheaper than most refurbs I've seen and it comes with a lens.

That's my main beef with mirrorless (the lack of discrete aperture and SS controls) so that would probably bug me.  :-/  That is a good deal though...

What do you mean by "lack of discrete aperture and SS controls"?  My Oly E-M5 and E-P3 both have them, as well as most other higher-end Olys and Pannys. And the Sony mirrorless models have them too I think...

Perhaps my sweeping generalization of "mirrorless" was a bit too sweeping.  My NEX-F3 has one dial on the back that controls both aperture and SS, toggled by a push button.  I just don't like that.  :P  I much prefer controlling aperture with a lens dial, but that doesn't seem to be a thing in the digital world.   :rolleyes:

More smooth but overrated.  Just like your pancakes.

Now I'm even more torn with this refurbished deal:  http://www.adorama.com/INKD5300BK1R.html

I was really leaning toward a refurbed D7100, but this deal makes it tougher to choose.

How quickly did you adjust to the controls Binge?  Any quibbles with the camera?  I'm really used to the discrete aperture and SS controls and prefer a camera with an onboard lens motor, but it's almost $150 cheaper than most refurbs I've seen and it comes with a lens.

Hey man I'm sorry about not responding yesterday.  I've sent you a PM but I'll respond here as well.  First, I totally understand the want for a lense motor.  The old Nikons that my father has let me have from my grandfather's collection are a little more work, but I am able to take fine photos quickly and locate my focus easily with assistance from the live-view and other settings which make this camera a joy to use.

The wheel for manual mode can be adjusted to change between shutter/aperture/ISO and a few other settings very easily.  I have a couple basic and "inexpensive" lenses suited for the DX formfactor of the camera which autofocus very quickly and quietly for use in video and prime shooting.  Coming from a Canon 20D this was a dream in terms of use.  I had the camera for less than an hour before I felt comfortable adjusting the settings on the fly and the image quality in low-light was superb.  I can hop around about 1600 ISO all day and not even feel like I'm doing something naughty.  The better the light the easier it gets to take the right photo the first shot which is a great feeling...

I wish I could easily and quickly send you mine or that it wasn't under so much use.  My wife takes a lot of live photography with our birds and I am getting my feet wet with the very basics of photography, so contextually these shots we take are mostly for utility, but I'm sure that it can create beautiful shots with the right know-how/experience.  We commonly take photos like these,

[attach=1]
[attach=2]
(http://i.imgur.com/nZlNLJY.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/oCVvMvn.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/pLcYtDm.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/ZtGBlOS.jpg)
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Fri, 24 July 2015, 10:31:33

Now I'm even more torn with this refurbished deal:  http://www.adorama.com/INKD5300BK1R.html

I was really leaning toward a refurbed D7100, but this deal makes it tougher to choose.

How quickly did you adjust to the controls Binge?  Any quibbles with the camera?  I'm really used to the discrete aperture and SS controls and prefer a camera with an onboard lens motor, but it's almost $150 cheaper than most refurbs I've seen and it comes with a lens.

That's my main beef with mirrorless (the lack of discrete aperture and SS controls) so that would probably bug me.  :-/  That is a good deal though...

What do you mean by "lack of discrete aperture and SS controls"?  My Oly E-M5 and E-P3 both have them, as well as most other higher-end Olys and Pannys. And the Sony mirrorless models have them too I think...

Perhaps my sweeping generalization of "mirrorless" was a bit too sweeping.  My NEX-F3 has one dial on the back that controls both aperture and SS, toggled by a push button.  I just don't like that.  :P  I much prefer controlling aperture with a lens dial, but that doesn't seem to be a thing in the digital world.   :rolleyes:

More smooth but overrated.  Just like your pancakes.

 :(
Title: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: heedpantsnow on Fri, 24 July 2015, 10:36:35

Now I'm even more torn with this refurbished deal:  http://www.adorama.com/INKD5300BK1R.html

I was really leaning toward a refurbed D7100, but this deal makes it tougher to choose.

How quickly did you adjust to the controls Binge?  Any quibbles with the camera?  I'm really used to the discrete aperture and SS controls and prefer a camera with an onboard lens motor, but it's almost $150 cheaper than most refurbs I've seen and it comes with a lens.

That's my main beef with mirrorless (the lack of discrete aperture and SS controls) so that would probably bug me.  :-/  That is a good deal though...

What do you mean by "lack of discrete aperture and SS controls"?  My Oly E-M5 and E-P3 both have them, as well as most other higher-end Olys and Pannys. And the Sony mirrorless models have them too I think...

Perhaps my sweeping generalization of "mirrorless" was a bit too sweeping.  My NEX-F3 has one dial on the back that controls both aperture and SS, toggled by a push button.  I just don't like that.  :P  I much prefer controlling aperture with a lens dial, but that doesn't seem to be a thing in the digital world.   :rolleyes:

Ah ok. I have a trio of Hexanons with aperture on the lens, quite nice. But these days I'm lazy and just use the front dial on the body for aperture and rear dial for SS. Then 4 way buttons are drive mode, ISO, etc.

Edit: and I just remembered my Nocticron had aperture on the lens as well.

I can't remember for sure, but I think the original reason why I hated Nikon was because their lens dials went backwards?  Does anyone else know what I'm talking about?

Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Fri, 24 July 2015, 17:28:44
I just played with a D5300 and D7100 and the choice is even tougher.  The 7100 has a better layout, more intuitive controls, built in lens motor, bigger viewfinder, and easily navigated menu.  The D5300 feels comfortable and takes a little more work to make adjustments, but isn't too hard to do though it is a little clunky.  The viewfinder is just as bright, the options are all pretty much there and, while slower, can still be adjusted pretty easily on the fly.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Binge on Fri, 24 July 2015, 18:10:24
I just played with a D5300 and D7100 and the choice is even tougher.  The 7100 has a better layout, more intuitive controls, built in lens motor, bigger viewfinder, and easily navigated menu.  The D5300 feels comfortable and takes a little more work to make adjustments, but isn't too hard to do though it is a little clunky.  The viewfinder is just as bright, the options are all pretty much there and, while slower, can still be adjusted pretty easily on the fly.

Good to know you got to play with one.  Hopefully I wasn't over exaggerating at all... it's such a huge improvement from the 20D I used to use.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Fri, 24 July 2015, 18:17:58
Yeah, I can definitely see how you could get used to it.  The D7100 felt more natural, but the size and weight of the D5300 definitely was a bit nicer too.  I'm still on the fence.  I know the D7100 has a bunch of features I probably wouldn't use, but at the same time, I feel more comfortable with it.  The D5300 is a much better deal and offers everything I really need.  The lens motor, bigger viewfinder, extra dial, and weather sealing are more wants than needs.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: heedpantsnow on Fri, 24 July 2015, 18:23:25

Yeah, I can definitely see how you could get used to it.  The D7100 felt more natural, but the size and weight of the D5300 definitely was a bit nicer too.  I'm still on the fence.  I know the D7100 has a bunch of features I probably wouldn't use, but at the same time, I feel more comfortable with it.  The D5300 is a much better deal and offers everything I really need.  The lens motor, bigger viewfinder, extra dial, and weather sealing are more wants than needs.

If it was me I would pay a bit for the extra ergonomics.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Spopepro on Fri, 24 July 2015, 18:26:37
Yeah, that extra dial might not be just a nice thing to have.  Depending on what you're shooting (again, you mentioned sporting events), not having to go through soft menus is worth a ton to me.  Like worth so much I wouldn't consider a body where a critical adjustment I potentially would need to make was in a soft-menu.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: heedpantsnow on Fri, 24 July 2015, 18:33:28

Yeah, that extra dial might not be just a nice thing to have.  Depending on what you're shooting (again, you mentioned sporting events), not having to go through soft menus is worth a ton to me.  Like worth so much I wouldn't consider a body where a critical adjustment I potentially would need to make was in a soft-menu.

Absolutely. 2 dials +discrete buttons for drive and ISO is a minimum for me.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: njbair on Fri, 24 July 2015, 20:54:21
Yeah, I can definitely see how you could get used to it.  The D7100 felt more natural, but the size and weight of the D5300 definitely was a bit nicer too.  I'm still on the fence.  I know the D7100 has a bunch of features I probably wouldn't use, but at the same time, I feel more comfortable with it.  The D5300 is a much better deal and offers everything I really need.  The lens motor, bigger viewfinder, extra dial, and weather sealing are more wants than needs.

FWIW, don't count the lens into the equation. That 18-55mm kit lens is just that, a kit lens.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: VoteForDavid on Fri, 24 July 2015, 21:53:10
People who have become accustomed to 2 dials, used them a bunch . . . it just sucks having to push a button and simultaneously twirl the dial.  I'd rather have an old camera than a one-dial camera.  One big D7x00 upgrade over the D70 is related: to zoom in, you push the zoom button.  No more D100-era push, push-and-twirl to zoom.  Very nice.

The 18-50 is a kit lens that makes unreasonably good pictures until dropped once.  Then it's scrap but hey at least it's cheap.

The lens that stays on my camera is the 50mm f/1.8D.  It's a great compromise between too close (the 35mm 1.8 is great for indoors) and not close enough (an 80 or 105mm would be great for outdoors).  And there is no beating a <$100 razor-sharp lens you don't have to worry about, that can take pictures in the dark.  The D version requires a focus motor.  The newer one lacks an aperture dial AND costs twice as much for slightly more distortion.  At D7000/7100 resolution, old glass with focus screws is still plenty good enough, and it's getting cheaper the older it gets.

Save a little longer and get the body you want, says the guy whose money it isn't.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Fri, 24 July 2015, 22:02:34
Well, I have the 50mm f/1.8D and the 18-70mm DX kit lens from my D70 is still a pretty solid lens.  Not an amazing lens, but not bad either.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: njbair on Fri, 24 July 2015, 22:03:07
The lens that stays on my camera is the 50mm f/1.8D.

+1 for prime lenses. The 35mm is so super fast and sharp that it may have ruined all other lenses for me.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: heedpantsnow on Fri, 24 July 2015, 22:09:37

The lens that stays on my camera is the 50mm f/1.8D.

+1 for prime lenses. The 35mm is so super fast and sharp that it may have ruined all other lenses for me.

Me too. I don't ever use my kit zoom, I prefer my 7.5, 25, 45, 55, & 135 primes. And all of those, together, take up the same amount of space as my 2x Canon L zooms did. :thumb:
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: VoteForDavid on Fri, 24 July 2015, 22:15:00
If you have the 50mm 1.8D and 18-70, you're pretty well set until your budget affords a MUCH better set of lenses.  Unless you get a body without a focusing motor for the 50.


I use a 35mm 1.8 at work all day and it is a very, very easy lens to get used to - especially when I have to go shoot in the warehouse!
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: njbair on Fri, 24 July 2015, 22:23:09
Lucky for me, a photographer friend warned me about the kit lens and instead advised me to buy the body only and the 35mm 1.8. So as of right now I literally cannot zoom, but I hardly miss it in light of the photo quality.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Fri, 24 July 2015, 22:42:10
Lucky for me, a photographer friend warned me about the kit lens and instead advised me to buy the body only and the 35mm 1.8. So as of right now I literally cannot zoom, but I hardly miss it in light of the photo quality.

Primes are fun because they force you to think and move.  I found that my photography dramatically improved when I forced myself to only use a prime. In fact, many of my favorite shots were done with a prime.

Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: njbair on Fri, 24 July 2015, 22:53:36
Primes are fun because they force you to think and move.

Exactly this! There is almost always a better angle than the zoomed in one. You just need the motivation to look for it.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Binge on Sat, 25 July 2015, 13:57:11
Yeah, that extra dial might not be just a nice thing to have.  Depending on what you're shooting (again, you mentioned sporting events), not having to go through soft menus is worth a ton to me.  Like worth so much I wouldn't consider a body where a critical adjustment I potentially would need to make was in a soft-menu.
I have not encountered a need to use soft menus in full manual mode on the D5300.  Complete control with one dial.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: VoteForDavid on Sat, 25 July 2015, 20:59:57
Quote
Complete control with one dial and a modifier button you sometimes have to look away from the shot to use.

FTFY

Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Binge on Sat, 25 July 2015, 21:21:38

FTFY



You did no such thing.  You can't use a single dial to adjust 3+ settings so of course there would be modifiers to adjust the function of the dial.  All settings adjustable by the dial are visible through the viewfinder when the modifier is pressed.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: tbc on Sun, 26 July 2015, 02:45:27
Or you know...

Evfs that show you your menus and allow chimping in your viewfinder?  So you never lose your framing/positioning no matter what body you use :)
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: VoteForDavid on Sun, 26 July 2015, 15:08:35
Sometimes I will take a shot on automatic exposure to get a close/baseline for the settings but usually that's followed up by going right back to manual control.  Exactly 99.37% of the time I control my camera by using one dial for aperture and one dial for shutter speed.  That puts it at (approximatly) 47.59% of the time when I would have to reach to the top of the camera to find one of three buttons (in the case of the D5300), to adjust whichever doesn't have a dedicated dial on a one-dial body.   The shooting grip has to be changed, which is a risk to framing the shot, even if you are good enough to hit the proper button every time.

Or you could just get a dedicated dial for each of the two most frequently-used settings.

The other 0.63% of the time I am changing a setting, it's either ISO or white balance . . . both of which have dedicated buttons that are adjusted with a dial, neither of which require diving into menus.  For more-direct controls alone, it might be worth it for a getting-serious photographer to buy the 7x00 series instead of the D3x00 or D5x00 series.

tbc, a teensy EVF is not going to show you depth of field as well as a 3" one . . . and the 3" one on the back won't show you jack in bright sunlight.  All cameras fall down in some areas.  Speaking strictly for myself, I prefer one that doesn't fall down in the area of having dedicated aperture and speed controls, or optical viewfinding.   

Optical viewfinders save a lot of battery power, by the way.  Once when I had brand-spanking new batteries I went through no-**** about 3000 frames when shooting a fight night and I only changed the battery out because I was getting nervous about the potential for the next bout to go long.  I usually change batteries out around 1000 shots, because I don't like looking at a battery indicator that's not "full" on the LCD.  Cameras with EVFs tend to be a decimal place shy in this department (which is perfectly okay if you don't intend to make thousands of exposures in a single session).
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: madhias on Sun, 26 July 2015, 15:21:18
[...]bigger viewfinder[...]

Very good, bigger viewfinders are always better!

Primes are fun because they force you to think and move.
Exactly this! There is almost always a better angle than the zoomed in one. You just need the motivation to look for it.

I also do think that primes are much more fun to use, you are forced to walk around, and have to try to find the perfect frame. I only have two lenses, a 35mm - which is the lens I always have on the cam - and a 100mm macro.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: tbc on Sun, 26 July 2015, 22:20:26

tbc, a teensy EVF is not going to show you depth of field as well as a 3" one . . . and the 3" one on the back won't show you jack in bright sunlight.  All cameras fall down in some areas. 

thats why you can use focus peaking + focus magnification

Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: nubbinator on Sun, 26 July 2015, 22:53:05
Welp, finally bit on a refurbished Nikon D7100 (http://www.adorama.com/INKD7100R.html?utm_source=EMW&utm_medium=Email&utm_campaign=AdoramaOrderConfirmation).  Definitely hurt to drop the money, but looking forward to it.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: TastaturenAuslese on Sun, 26 July 2015, 23:12:14
Welp, finally bit on a refurbished Nikon D7100 (http://www.adorama.com/INKD7100R.html?utm_source=EMW&utm_medium=Email&utm_campaign=AdoramaOrderConfirmation).  Definitely hurt to drop the money, but looking forward to it.

Was just about to chime in on some advice and stuff, but congrats! :D Take pics of your new camera when you get it. Haha.
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Mon, 27 July 2015, 08:37:37
Welp, finally bit on a refurbished Nikon D7100 (http://www.adorama.com/INKD7100R.html?utm_source=EMW&utm_medium=Email&utm_campaign=AdoramaOrderConfirmation).  Definitely hurt to drop the money, but looking forward to it.

Congrats!  :D  We expect some nice new pics to hit the 'hack soon.   :cool:
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Sed8op8 on Mon, 27 July 2015, 08:49:30
Welp, finally bit on a refurbished Nikon D7100 (http://www.adorama.com/INKD7100R.html?utm_source=EMW&utm_medium=Email&utm_campaign=AdoramaOrderConfirmation).  Definitely hurt to drop the money, but looking forward to it.
NICE I'm sure the extra money hurt but unlike A LOT of people who make knee jerk purchases (like me) it sounds like you put a lot of thought into this and what features to $$ different models had etc....

I am super excited as this decision actually affected me considering how much you contribute here ! Haha for me that's the best money you have spent I love your photos. Last night i was doing searches for Nubbinator keycaps and was looking at a lot of your photos and you have some really great shots  :)) I'm super excited !!!
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: Binge on Mon, 27 July 2015, 10:29:01
Welp, finally bit on a refurbished Nikon D7100 (http://www.adorama.com/INKD7100R.html?utm_source=EMW&utm_medium=Email&utm_campaign=AdoramaOrderConfirmation).  Definitely hurt to drop the money, but looking forward to it.

Glad you got what made you the most comfortable and you got a good deal!  I hope it works well. :)
Title: Re: To new camera or not to new camera...
Post by: njbair on Mon, 27 July 2015, 14:38:52
Welp, finally bit on a refurbished Nikon D7100 (http://www.adorama.com/INKD7100R.html?utm_source=EMW&utm_medium=Email&utm_campaign=AdoramaOrderConfirmation).  Definitely hurt to drop the money, but looking forward to it.

#DXMasterRace