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geekhack Projects => Making Stuff Together! => Topic started by: wlhlm on Sat, 25 July 2015, 11:29:33

Title: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: wlhlm on Sat, 25 July 2015, 11:29:33
Background:
GMK Triumph Adler (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=70278.0) is around the corner. The original keyset came with the keyboard of the TA Dario computer system. For the keyboard, the Cherry G8*-3000 case was used. The case had a blue LED overlay matching the blue keycaps, which due to a manufacturing defect turned more to a teal over time.

intelli78's GMK Replica set aims to make the super rare, but wonderfully looking teal-colored keys more accessible and affordable with the successful group buy.

I'm a fan of the keyset and I think it looks great on a keyboard with a G8*-3000 case. I've also seen other community members looking for 3000 cases specifically for the TA set. The problem is, there's no 3000 case with a teal LED overlay matching the Replica set in a similar way as the original had a blue overlay for the blue keycaps.

[attachimg=1 width=600]
Original case on the left; normal 3000 case on the right

My Goal:
I want to recreate the LED overlay in GMK Triumph Adler-colors for the perfect match. This means drawing and producing them.

What I've done so far:
I've redrawn the overlays as a vector graphic using Inkscape based on the the Samples I have and high resolution photographs.
[attachimg=2 width=100]

Here are my drawings:
[attachimg=4 width=500]

The vector files are available as attachement to this post (best viewed in Inkscape).
Thanks hashbaz for providing the vector drawings of the Cherry legends!

The colors I've used:
Grey/Beige overlay
(those are purely from eye-balling and I would need to test multiple combination IRL)

TA overlay
(colors used for the GMK TA keyset, source (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=70278.msg1805353#msg1805353))

What I need help with:
Drawing:
It would be awesome to make overlay for other cases like the G8*-1800. I only have the two overlays from the 3000s, but maybe someone else can provide a scan/drawing of them.

The colors are by no means final and are purely based on guessing. I still have to see how they looked when printed out.

Production:
I ultimately want to produce the overlays. Unfortuantely, I don't have a clue on how to go about it.

From the inspection of my overlays, I gathered that the used plastic is rough on the front and smooth and shiny on the back. The base is transparent and is printed from the back. The first layer are the dark legends and frame and the second layer is the background infill in color of the case with open spots for the LEDs to shine through.
[attach=3]

What material are they made of?
Makrofol (which apparently is Polycarbonate)

How are they printed?
Screen printing

Where can I print them?
I'll try to print them myself and check the quality.

If anyone has some tips/experience/suggestions, please hit me up!

:thumb:
Title: Re: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: wlhlm on Sat, 25 July 2015, 11:49:54
I've asked Cherry, but haven't gotten a response yet. Maybe my inquiry sounded too crazy. :)) Not sure how helpful they are when asking about vintage/legacy stuff.

Unicomp sell Replacement overlays for Model Ms (http://www.pckeyboard.com/page/Misc/LED). Maybe they can help me... :rolleyes:
Title: Re: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: VinnyCordeiro on Sat, 25 July 2015, 13:32:44
I will want one of the English teal overlay, my 3000 will look nice with it. :D A cheap alternative would be printing a label on vinyl.
Title: Re: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: Photekq on Sun, 26 July 2015, 03:53:41
As requested ;)

(http://i.imgur.com/M4IszHt.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/ZhO8A5P.jpg)
Title: Re: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: wlhlm on Sun, 26 July 2015, 04:07:34
Quote from: Photekq on Sun, 26 July 2015, 03:53:41
As requested ;)

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/M4IszHt.jpg)


Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/ZhO8A5P.jpg)

Awesome. Thanks a lot!
Title: Re: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: kacase on Sun, 26 July 2015, 04:35:30
The easiest way to produce something like this would probably be the following:


For the paper i would suggest something glossy (so the glue works fine) with a heavier weight (min 140g/m^2) that is usable with printers. http://www.modulor.de/en/Paper-Cardboard-Paperboard/Drawing-and-Artist-Paper/White-drawing-Paper/Paper-board-white-glossy-coated.html this could be something that you could consider.

For the plastic sheet, this might do the job http://www.modulor.de/en/Plastics-Rubber/Sheets-Mats-Films/Polypropylene-Sheets-and-Films/Polypropylene-translucent-colourless-matte.html. It is rough on one side and flat on the other and only 1€ for an A4, so might as well be worth trying.

Also, this is a glue that could do the trick http://www.modulor.de/en/Adhesives-Adhesive-Tapes/Adhesives/Spray-Adhesive/3M-Display-Mount-spray-adhesive.html.


I hope I was at least a bit helpful and wish you good luck with your project!
Title: Re: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: 3K on Sun, 26 July 2015, 06:12:57
Quote from: kacase on Sun, 26 July 2015, 04:35:30
The easiest way to produce something like this would probably be the following:

  • Print the legends and frames on high-quality paper/foil gathering from the size about 20 per page should be easily feasible
  • Stencil the LED cutouts out of the paper/foil
  • Stick the printed paper/foil to the back of a plastic sheet (rough on one side, smooth on the other) using either a self adhesive sheet or spray glue
  • Stencil the finished parts out of the group foil. You could also just use a standard desk paper cutter and cut the rounded corners yourself (good luck!)

Wouldn't it be easier to leave out the paper and print just the foil?
This only would require a laser printer and foil, or some company who offers printing service.
Found some offers:
http://www.papier-und-mehr.de/folien/beratung/bedrucken_von_folien.html
http://www.selbstklebefolien.com/Klebefolie/Bedruckbare-Klebefolie---16_61.html
Title: Re: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: wlhlm on Sun, 26 July 2015, 06:24:03
Thanks for all the tips and links. :-*

I also was thinking about printing them myself.

I ordered those:
http://www.conrad.de/ce/de/product/529672/Frontplatten-Folie-Bogengroesse-DIN-A4-Transparent-Inhalt-2-St
http://www.conrad.de/ce/de/product/529443/Laminatfolie-matt-Schutzfolie-leicht-strukturiert-Bogengroesse-DIN-A4-Transparent

You have transparent foil on which you print the overlay and then put a second sheet with a matte surface over it.

I'm still looking for transparent foil which is smooth on one side and matte on the other.
Title: Re: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: kacase on Sun, 26 July 2015, 11:17:17
Quote from: wlhlm on Sun, 26 July 2015, 06:24:03

I'm still looking for transparent foil which is smooth on one side and matte on the other.

This is the one: http://www.modulor.de/en/Plastics-Rubber/Sheets-Mats-Films/Polypropylene-Sheets-and-Films/Polypropylene-translucent-colourless-matte.html
Title: Re: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: wlhlm on Sun, 26 July 2015, 13:27:20
I've added French and Italian overlays, so we now have English, German, French, Italian. The German overlay now has the "Rollen" legend. Minor corrections for the English overlay.

Special thanks to Photekq and mason for providing nice photographs! :-*

[attachimg=1 width=400]

(vectors attached to OP)
Title: Re: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: intelli78 on Sun, 26 July 2015, 14:40:35
This is awesome. Nice job!
Title: Re: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: wlhlm on Mon, 27 July 2015, 08:32:18
I heard back from Cherry! :eek: Never would've expected that.

Quote from: Cherry
vielen Dank für Ihr Interesse an unseren Produkten.

Leider werden diese Typschildaufkleber seit Jahren nicht mehr eingesetzt.
Ich kann Ihnen sagen, dass diese Aufkleber aus Makrofol gefertigt wurden.
Allerdings liegen mir keine Informationen zum Fertigungsprozess vor, da wir
diesen Aufkleber selbst von Fa. Siebpoint Druck bezogen haben.

Wieviele Aufkleber bräuchten Sie denn? Denn wenn Sie nur vereinzelte
Aufkleber bräuchten, so kann ich Ihnen anbieten, dass ich Ihnen paar Muster
der US Aufkleber (Num, Caps- und Scroll-Lock) zusende. Hiervon hätten
wir noch Restbestände auf Lager.

Gerne können Sie uns auch telefonisch unter der Nummer 07541/7749902
zurückrufen. Dann können Sie mir kurz schildern, was Sie genau vorhaben.

Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Ihr Cherry Support Team

For non-German speaking folks:
Title: Re: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: VinnyCordeiro on Mon, 27 July 2015, 08:47:08
That's nice! :D
Title: Re: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: CPTBadAss on Mon, 27 July 2015, 08:54:39
This is a fun little project. Didn't realize the original labels weren't just printed on paper.
Title: Re: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: azhdar on Mon, 27 July 2015, 08:55:27
Damn that's cool there still is stock.
Title: Re: Recreating Cherry LED overlays
Post by: wlhlm on Tue, 28 July 2015, 20:26:25
While waiting for the film to arrive, I've drawn some overlays with the Cherry logo and without LED holes as has been suggested by IvanIvanovich.

[attachimg=1 width=400]