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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: joneslee85 on Sun, 15 November 2009, 20:53:05

Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: joneslee85 on Sun, 15 November 2009, 20:53:05
So so happy that the reception call me up to let me know there is a parcel delivery waiting downstair. I rushed downstair with my heart beating fast and yes there it lies the a box with mystery, the label reads 'From EliteKeyboard...'. YAY! It's here, my new wife, she will replace my old black widow Das Keyboard. I quickly compile a rough unboxing clip and hope all Topre fans here share my little happiness right now :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e82s2Q8Dt0U (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e82s2Q8Dt0U)
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Sun, 15 November 2009, 21:07:21
When did EliteKeyboard's start selling the white version? They only have the Black listed on the site or did you ask them to get you the white one? The only place I have seen the white for sale has been in Korea.

Oh Congrats
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: joneslee85 on Sun, 15 November 2009, 21:11:27
I placed order for the black one then it is going out of stock till 3rd week of December. so yeah I was angry and then they offer me the White one, since it is rare and uncommon, i just go with it. Contact sales@elitekeyboards.com if you want to place order.

One question: does the black keycap set of HHKB work with Realforce? And where could I get the blue and yellow cap?
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: hyperlinked on Sun, 15 November 2009, 21:20:39
What variant of Eclipse are you running there in the background?
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: joneslee85 on Sun, 15 November 2009, 21:27:50
Quote from: hyperlinked;132769
What variant of Eclipse are you running there in the background?


I do not use Eclipse, it's Textmate only for me. At the background is the GUI of Kerio Mailserver.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Sun, 15 November 2009, 21:34:20
Quote from: joneslee85;132767
I placed order for the black one then it is going out of stock till 3rd week of December. so yeah I was angry and then they offer me the White one, since it is rare and uncommon, i just go with it. Contact sales@elitekeyboards.com if you want to place order.

One question: does the black keycap set of HHKB work with Realforce? And where could I get the blue and yellow cap?

Yes the black HHKB Pro keys will fit on the 87U but the right shift key is not the same size and of course you don't get the keys for the Function keys or the edit block. But just doing the alpha keys does look good. The blue WSAD keys you can get from EliteKeyboards Topre does not make a full set of blue keys. The yellow's for the 91U while they would mostly fit (some of the bottom row keys would not fit) I'm not sure if Topre is selling them at this point. You could ask EliteKeyboards if they could get you a set.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: patrickgeekhack on Mon, 16 November 2009, 08:48:10
Quote from: rdjack21;132765
When did EliteKeyboard's start selling the white version? They only have the Black listed on the site or did you ask them to get you the white one? The only place I have seen the white for sale has been in Korea.

Oh Congrats


I think Elitekeyboards had the white one for short while, didn't they?
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: didjamatic on Mon, 16 November 2009, 09:23:26
If anyone has a white 87u they would part with, I may be interested
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: joneslee85 on Mon, 16 November 2009, 16:05:13
Quote from: rdjack21;132771
Yes the black HHKB Pro keys will fit on the 87U but the right shift key is not the same size and of course you don't get the keys for the Function keys or the edit block. But just doing the alpha keys does look good. The blue WSAD keys you can get from EliteKeyboards Topre does not make a full set of blue keys. The yellow's for the 91U while they would mostly fit (some of the bottom row keys would not fit) I'm not sure if Topre is selling them at this point. You could ask EliteKeyboards if they could get you a set.


Thanks, I just got reply from ELiteKeyboard, unfortunately they could not get me the cap set. Now I think I should ask anyone here want to trade their 87U black keycap set for my white one.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Mon, 16 November 2009, 20:59:31
Quote from: joneslee85;132971
Thanks, I just got reply from ELiteKeyboard, unfortunately they could not get me the cap set. Now I think I should ask anyone here want to trade their 87U black keycap set for my white one.


I assume you mean the Yellow keys which I did not think you could get. You can get the black keys and white keys I think out of Korea but I don't think you want to pay what it would cost to get them (I know I wouldn't). Or you can get the HHKB Pro keys which will fit.

And I think just doing the alpha section with blank black keys looks good. While this shot is not complete you get the idea.

86U with some of the alpha keys Plasti-Diped black.
(http://geekhack.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=4901&stc=1&d=1254427343)
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: AndrewZorn on Mon, 16 November 2009, 21:01:40
dye them!
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: HungryPillow on Mon, 16 November 2009, 22:41:13
Wow, that white 86U with black keys looks amazing!

I was sure I wanted an 87U in black for my first step into this mechanical/capacitive keyboard world that is hell ;) But after seeing that I'm not so sure anymore... plus the fact that I can't find a new 87U anywhere isn't helping...
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: AndrewZorn on Mon, 16 November 2009, 23:21:07
what about rdjack?  his avatar...
im sure ive seen others, too

just because IM not willing to do it doesnt mean that HE shouldnt be willing to...

besides, im just saying if you are going to risk the key just to make it black, mind as well do it right and use dye
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: lmnop on Mon, 16 November 2009, 23:26:34
I sanded down my Ikari Laser, repainted it and used a clear coat of Plasti Dip. not easy to get in Canada but possible. nice product. don't think it will give the rubber texture the Razer Lycosa keys have it's more of a satin or leather texture.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Mon, 16 November 2009, 23:35:17
Quote from: lmnop;133102
I sanded down my Ikari Laser, repainted it and used a clear coat of Plasti Dip. not easy to get in Canada but possible. nice product. don't think it will give the rubber texture the Razer Lycosa keys have it's more of a satin or leather texture.


If you did not get a good rubber texture then you did not use enough coats. The keys I did have held up for about 3 months of heavy use. As soon as I get some time I'm going to do the whole board. As you can see from the picture above I have all the colors now except clear. I'm really just debating what colors I want for what keys now.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Mon, 16 November 2009, 23:37:32
Quote from: HungryPillow;133095
Wow, that white 86U with black keys looks amazing!

I was sure I wanted an 87U in black for my first step into this mechanical/capacitive keyboard world that is hell ;) But after seeing that I'm not so sure anymore... plus the fact that I can't find a new 87U anywhere isn't helping...


You can still get them out of Korea but you are really going to pay for it though. I would wait and see if EliteKeyboards get them back in stock or not before spend around $400 on one out of Korea.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: lmnop on Mon, 16 November 2009, 23:55:22
I tried it on a old ball mouse in my closet for trial and error before using it on my Ikari Laser. I gave my Ikari Laser 3 coats and it cured perfectly. it's just not the rubber texture people envision.

(http://i35.tinypic.com/23kri3s.jpg)

this is where I got the idea to plasti dip the housing on my Ikari Laser.

Quote
Whole mouse was first coated with spray Plasti Dip. After that the buttons got dipped into liquid Plasti Dip. Both surfaces give a good grip but the rubber on buttons feels more "rubbery". The texture seems almost like leather. Sprayed coat is thinner so perhaps additional coats could make it feel more soft. Nevertheless the grip is there and the whole mouse just stucks to your hand.

mine came out exactly the same.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Mon, 16 November 2009, 23:57:05
Quote from: AndrewZorn;133100
what about rdjack?  his avatar...
im sure ive seen others, too


Megarat did mine :) And I have to say he did one hell of a job.

Quote from: AndrewZorn;133100

just because IM not willing to do it doesnt mean that HE shouldnt be willing to...

besides, im just saying if you are going to risk the key just to make it black, mind as well do it right and use dye


I have a black key that Megarat did and it is not the same color as the keys on the 87U. It is darker the 87U keys are more of a charcoal color. I'm not really sure that it is worth doing black keys because you have to buy a set of keys to dye. If you are going to do that you might as well just buy the black ones and save yourself the trouble. You can get the black keys out of Korea at leopold (http://www.leopold.co.kr/?doc=cart/item.php&it_id=1215396631) and seeing that this is the only place you can get a full set of keys that will fit the 87U why dye them. Same goes if you are going to use HHKB key sets if you want black just get the black keys and be done with it.

Oh if anyone is wondering the keys for the 87U and the 86U are interchangeable the only difference is that you will lose the through key led's which may be an issue for some.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: joneslee85 on Tue, 17 November 2009, 00:22:17
Check this out, leopold shop has the Orange ASWD. sexy, I am going to place order one of this cap set:

http://www.leopold.co.kr/?doc=cart/item.php&it_id=1244426282

(http://www.leopold.co.kr/data/item/1244426282_l1)
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: HungryPillow on Tue, 17 November 2009, 01:19:11
Quote from: rdjack21;133107
You can still get them out of Korea but you are really going to pay for it though. I would wait and see if EliteKeyboards get them back in stock or not before spend around $400 on one out of Korea.


Do they just charge more or is it the shipping? I'm in Singapore currently so maybe it will be cheaper? I want English keys though without any Korean or Japanese on them... :)
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Tue, 17 November 2009, 10:24:11
Leopold will ship international if you can figure out how to actually order the item you want and they do take a credit card. I keep thinking I need to find someone that can read Korean so they can show me how to actually place an order. Their have been a few people that have emailed them and every time they have said they will ship international if you pay with a credit card. The problem is figuring out how to actually place the order.

I will most likely follow up on doing this early next year.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Tue, 17 November 2009, 10:29:11
Quote from: HungryPillow;133124
Do they just charge more or is it the shipping? I'm in Singapore currently so maybe it will be cheaper? I want English keys though without any Korean or Japanese on them... :)


I think mostly it is currency conversions that makes the price so high. For instance the 87U converts to ~$315 plus shipping. But I  think they only sell the 87U with Korean/English characters on the keys. I would try getting it out of Japan where you can find both Japanese and English keyboards plus quite a few of the vendors will ship international if you can figure out how to order what you want and you pay by credit card.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Tue, 17 November 2009, 10:32:56
Quote from: joneslee85;133118
Check this out, leopold shop has the Orange ASWD. sexy, I am going to place order one of this cap set:

http://www.leopold.co.kr/?doc=cart/item.php&it_id=1244426282

Show Image
(http://www.leopold.co.kr/data/item/1244426282_l1)


Yea I saw those and those purple keys and the double shot cherry keys. The problem is I don't know what keyboard those keys fit on. Are they Topre keys or cherry keys?
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: xyzzy on Tue, 17 November 2009, 10:33:11
Quote from: rdjack21;133111
You can get the black keys out of Korea at leopold (http://www.leopold.co.kr/?doc=cart/item.php&it_id=1215396631) and seeing that this is the only place you can get a full set of keys that will fit the 87U why dye them.


Quote from: ripster;133121
Well, if you can order from Leopold why not buy the Black 86 key set there (they're blanks).
Link. (http://www.leopold.co.kr/?doc=cart/item.php&it_id=1215396631)


It's not the full set, it's only 29 keycaps: 26 A-Z + 1 CTRL + 1 ALT + 1 "|\". It's not meant as a full replacement, rather it is a set to convert your korean/english Realforce board (like the 55g 87u) to all english keys.

Check photo #2 in the Leopold page and the  translated description (http://babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_url?doit=done&tt=url&intl=1&fr=bf-home&trurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.leopold.co.kr%2F%3Fdoc%3Dcart%2Fitem.php%26it_id%3D1215396631&lp=ko_en&btnTrUrl=Translate):
Quote
Is an option product to change existing Realforce 86/103 Hangul (Korean alphabet) petal with English.
[kays] of the height which is included know keyboard one earning A~Z, the right side until Alt and Ctrl height and height
Is composed with total 29 descriptions below.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: sixty on Tue, 17 November 2009, 13:56:37
Leopold only accepts KOREAN credit cards. Foreign cards are not accepted. They do ship international, but payment has to come from inside Korea.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Tue, 17 November 2009, 14:17:59
Quote from: sixty;133304
Leopold only accepts KOREAN credit cards. Foreign cards are not accepted. They do ship international, but payment has to come from inside Korea.

Wonder why they would only take a Korean CC. Wonder if they have had charge back issues in the past and find it hard to fight those when the card issuer is overseas.

Any ways good information. May have to look up stlensbar and see if he can get some things for me.

EDIT: Looks like he is still listing the 55g 87U (http://cgi.ebay.com/Brand-New-Topre-Realforce-87U-all-55g-Keyboard_W0QQitemZ220490869402QQcmdZViewItemQQptZPCA_Mice_Trackballs?hash=item335647aa9a) and he has the price about where I thought it would be. I keep thinking I need to pick one of those up.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: sixty on Tue, 17 November 2009, 14:32:49
Quote from: rdjack21;133322
Wonder why they would only take a Korean CC. Wonder if they have had charge back issues in the past and find it hard to fight those when the card issuer is overseas.

Any ways good information. May have to look up stlensbar and see if he can get some things for me.

EDIT: Looks like he is still listing the 55g 87U (http://cgi.ebay.com/Brand-New-Topre-Realforce-87U-all-55g-Keyboard_W0QQitemZ220490869402QQcmdZViewItemQQptZPCA_Mice_Trackballs?hash=item335647aa9a) and he has the price about where I thought it would be. I keep thinking I need to pick one of those up.


I think it might have to do with chargeback policies or protection on their side, yeah. The guy who runs the site (it seems to be one guy only doing most of the work..) is actually a good guy though. When I wanted to buy one of the Leopold branded boards he offered to throw in a set of orange keys for free. These are made to fit Filco/Costar/Strongman boards btw.. However I ended up cancelling the deal since my friend in Korea got too busy with work and I could not bother her too much to help me out back then.

I have a set of the Korean double shot keys though (http://geekhack.org/showpost.php?p=115471&postcount=1649). I don't know which company made these, but they used the same molds that WYSE used on their Terminal boards in the 80s/90s, since they are fully compatible in height with the WYSE keys and even have the same molding patterns on the bottom. These keys are damn fine and have really crisp characters. Even though they are thinner the quality even beats Cherry's keycaps.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: joneslee85 on Tue, 17 November 2009, 21:16:51
I confirm that they only take Korean CC. Too bad. :(
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 08:16:32
Quote from: rdjack21;133322
Wonder why they would only take a Korean CC. Wonder if they have had charge back issues in the past and find it hard to fight those when the card issuer is overseas.

Any ways good information. May have to look up stlensbar and see if he can get some things for me.

EDIT: Looks like he is still listing the 55g 87U (http://cgi.ebay.com/Brand-New-Topre-Realforce-87U-all-55g-Keyboard_W0QQitemZ220490869402QQcmdZViewItemQQptZPCA_Mice_Trackballs?hash=item335647aa9a) and he has the price about where I thought it would be. I keep thinking I need to pick one of those up.


Hello everyone!  This is my first post here.  I found this forum via some posts made to my keyboard thread on candlepowerforums (http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=160982).  I started out with an AEK II that I picked up at a church rummage sale for $2.  Then later I got an IBM Model M for work.  But, after a while, I got a little tired of the loudness of it and the height of the keys, and it just seemed a bit "heavy" to me--my slight dissatisfaction with it was subtle and built up over months--I still like it a lot, but I've come to the conclusion that it's not the best keyboard for me.

Anyway, I was intrigued by the Topre keyboards.  I had been thinking about a HHKB, but I really didn't want to lose the arrow keys and the function keys.  I work at Cornell University's particle accelerator--I'm the lead accelerator operator and head of the survey & alignment group--and one of the main survey software apps uses the F2 key RELENTLESSLY!  Then I found the Realforce keyboards over at elitekeyboards and I decided to give a 103U a try.

If you read the last several posts in my CPF thread (don't bother unless you really want to) you can see that my initial impression was underwhelming.  I was like "what's so special about this?"  But I was also very aware that I was coming from a Model M and needed to give myself time to just live with the new board and to adjust to it and to just use it and see how I really liked it, and not just go by what my harebrained intellectual initial reaction was.

And, after an hour or so of using it, I was thinking "Hmmm.  Not bad at all.  A lot to like here.  Very precise.  But . . . but very light.  I'm not sure, but I'm starting to like it more".

Then, that night after work I noticed I kinda wanted to type on the Topre.  I was missing it.  The action was intriguing me and was appealing.

Then, after the next day, I was like "OK.  This IS something special."

Now, after a week, I'm thinking "OH . . . MY . . . GOD!  I love this thing!"

The 103U is now my favorite keyboard.  It's amazing.

*****

OK.  Sorry for the preamble.  Just a bit of an intro.

OK.  So the deal is this.  I want to know about the black 87U.  In all the pictures, it seems as if it would be a bit difficult to read the black on grey lettering.  I really want to try a keyboard without the number pad, as I rarely use it and I bet I would like having the mouse closer to me.  But the black 87U's just don't look as nice to me as the whites, IN THE PICTURES that I've seen.

Does the black look better "in real life" as it were?

Finally, that stlensbar ebay listing says that "We just have the white board in stock.  No black now."  I assume that the white one would look the same as on the leopold site?  Also, I assume that another $50 would buy you WHITE english keycaps?  Obviously, I can just ask these questions on ebay, but since I'm already asking questions here, just thought I'd throw them in--if it's not too much trouble.

Thanks everyone!  From what I've read here so far, I think the membership makeup of this forum is something special.  Nice atmosphere here!
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 08:22:57
Actually, never mind about the ebay questions.  I was just testing my escape key on my 103U and there is no way I would want an entire keyboard of 55g Topres.  I like the 45g.  I think I would chose an all 45g (with 55g esc) over what I have now.  But I wouldn't know until I tried it.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: AndrewZorn on Fri, 20 November 2009, 09:56:54
candlepower forums.  glad that mini-hobby didnt get as out of hand as this one is.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 10:31:19
Quote from: ripster;134493
One of the better pictures out there - this time in daylight from dear Lammy.
Show Image
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v331/laurie47/happyhacker2-1.jpg)


Candlepower is cool but those guys are even weirder than us.

I got a few LED flashlight pointers, a Green LED hack to burn rubber, some pointers on rechargers for my photo flash equipment, and then got out of there.


Thanks for the photo.  That gives me a pretty good idea.

As for CPF guys being even "weirder" than you guys, I can't yet say, but I can tell you that there are all sorts over at CPF.  For some reason, flashlights as a hobby seems to attract people across all demographics.  In fact, if there is some unusal, odd, specialized question that I need answered, I'll post it in the CAFE over there, and within days, someone who is an expert or at least someone who is quite knowledgeable in that area, will post an answer.  So, it'd be hard to say that the weirdness quotient is high over there, as there are so many different types of people over there, from so many different countries.  All hobbies look weird from the outside, right?  I mean most "normal" people think paying a lot of money for a keyboard is pretty weird.  And most normal people think paying a lot of money for a flashlight is pretty weird.  And most normal people think that audiophiles who pay lots of money for cables are pretty weird.

It doesn't mean they ARE in fact "weird" (whatever that means).  I think it just means that they're into a specialized hobby (or two or three).
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: wordfool on Fri, 20 November 2009, 10:42:06
Quote from: AndrewZorn;134482
candlepower forums.  glad that mini-hobby didnt get as out of hand as this one is.


Heh heh... trying to decide between a new keyboard and a new Surefire light is a *****.

I think it's the gun'n'knife crowd that kinda weirds me out on CPF.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 10:58:34
Quote from: wordfool;134502
Heh heh... trying to decide between a new keyboard and a new Surefire light is a *****.

I think it's the gun'n'knife crowd that kinda weirds me out on CPF.


Yeah.  I hear you there.  Despite what my avatar over at CPF might suggest, I am not into guns and knives (I'm just a huge Kate Beckinsale / Underworld fan).  I have a pocket knife, and it's a good one, but it's just a utility knife, not a tactical knife or combat knife or anything like that, and it's the only one I own.  Well, except for a keychain knife my brother gave me.  And kitchen knives.  And I definitely have no taste for guns, especially not for handguns.  I enjoy them in movies and TV shows and fiction and what-not, but not to own in real life.  Plus, my wife would NOT stand for it.  Period.  No way, no how.

Also, in terms of politics, the people on CPF do definitely tend towards the right and towards republican/conservative.  I myself would definitely be pigeonholed a lot more towards the left/democrat.  A lot of people at CPF went freaking nuts when Obama was elected, in point of fact.

But, they're almost all really good people, regardless of their politics or attitude towards guns and gun control.  Heck, my own father is a far right-wing type of guy.

Tolerance is key.  That and just not discussing politics.  Which, I suppose I just violated with this post.  Sorry.  Just meant for illustrative purposes, not to start a political discussion.

*****

So, back OT, I wonder if jonesless85 might be interested in trading me white for black if I buy an 87U in black from elitekeyboards when they come out next month?
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 10:59:54
Quote from: ripster;134507
This is from their site.   I would recommend some other forum for knives.


Jeeesh!  Where was THAT posted?  I'm a moderator over at CPF.  I'd like to know.  Could you provide a link?
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:08:27
Quote from: ripster;134511
Link. (http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=247766)


Oh, great.  Really great.  That figures.

I'm sorry everyone.  I'm embarrassed.  Now I wish I just hadn't mentioned CPF.

Ah well, here's a link to my latest review thread to balance things out:

The LunaSol 20 (http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=219071)
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:09:37
Quote from: ripster;134511
Link. (http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=247766)

Maybe they do know what they are talking about.   I have the knive mentioned in the last post too - very handy little bugger.
Show Image
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/21RQ272938L._SL500_AA280_.jpg)


Oh, the people taking part in that thread almost certainly DO know what they're talking about.  I'd bet money on it.

But that doesn't change the poor judgment shown in posting those pictures.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: wordfool on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:10:46
What scares me most about CPF (other than the folks who "EDC" a gun) is how is has resulted in me being able to rattle off a phrase like "bored out 6P with nailbender SST-50 dropin" with nary a blink.  So far I've not seen that level of geektalk here about keyboards, even in the mods section. It's refreshing.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:12:59
Quote from: wordfool;134514
What scares me most about CPF (other than the folks who "EDC" a gun) is how is has resulted in me being able to rattle off a phrase like "bored out 6P with nailbender SST-50 dropin" with nary a blink.  So far I've not seen that level of geektalk here about keyboards, even in the mods section. It's refreshing.


What is refreshing?  The fact that there IS that level of geek talk over at CPF?  OR that there is NOT that level of geek talk here at geekhack?
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: wordfool on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:22:15
Quote from: _js_;134515
What is refreshing?  The fact that there IS that level of geek talk over at CPF?  OR that there is NOT that level of geek talk here at geekhack?


refreshing that there's not so much of that here because much as I love talking geek about stuff it opens me up to even more ridicule from my better half (she's convinced I'm into flashlights because I'm stumbling around in the dark trying to find my true path in life).

Mind you, when I try to explain to her the wonder of Topre keyboards and how they're a hybrid of mechanical and rubber dome mechanisms her eyes do tend to glaze over, perhaps as she dreams of finding a normal partner.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: itlnstln on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:22:35
At least we are not AVSForum.  You can't find **** in there. This a summary of a typical AVS thread:
 
Person in need of help/Douche1: I am having trouble with [device]/I found a insignificant bug in [device]
Douche2: Me, too!
Douche3: Me, too!
Douche4: Me, too!
Douche5: Me, too!
Douche6: Me, too!
Douche7: Me, too!
Douche8: Me, too!
.
.
.
(some significant amount of time later)
Person in need of help/Douche1: Has anyone found a fix, yet?
Douche2: Yeah, has anyone found a fix?
Douche3: Yeah, has anyone found a fix?
Douche4: Yeah, has anyone found a fix?
Douche5: Yeah, has anyone found a fix?
Douche6: Yeah, has anyone found a fix?
Douche7: Yeah, has anyone found a fix?
Douche8: Yeah, has anyone found a fix?
.
.
.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: AndrewZorn on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:32:47
no, AVS is all about ongoing debate over whether or not cabling matters
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: itlnstln on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:39:58
Yeah, there's that, too, but that's a long fought debate in the HT/Audiophile community and not unique to AVS.  You're right, though, it's tired an annoying.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:40:40
Quote from: _js_;134462

And, after an hour or so of using it, I was thinking "Hmmm.  Not bad at all.  A lot to like here.  Very precise.  But . . . but very light.  I'm not sure, but I'm starting to like it more".

Then, that night after work I noticed I kinda wanted to type on the Topre.  I was missing it.  The action was intriguing me and was appealing.

Then, after the next day, I was like "OK.  This IS something special."

Now, after a week, I'm thinking "OH . . . MY . . . GOD!  I love this thing!"

The 103U is now my favorite keyboard.  It's amazing.

Yes the Topre takes a little time to actually get it. And once you do you either Love it or Hate it.

Quote from: _js_;134462

OK.  So the deal is this.  I want to know about the black 87U.  In all the pictures, it seems as if it would be a bit difficult to read the black on grey lettering.  I really want to try a keyboard without the number pad, as I rarely use it and I bet I would like having the mouse closer to me.  But the black 87U's just don't look as nice to me as the whites, IN THE PICTURES that I've seen.

As you saw in ripster's picture the keys are actually more of a charcoal color with black lettering. If you have decent lighting they are actually pretty easy to read. But if you are in dim lighting you really can't read them at all.

I have both a Black 87U and a white 86U. To me the black 87U has a stealth keyboard look to it and really does look good. But on the other hand I also like the white 86U board as well. If you know your way around a keyboard really well the black 87U will not cause any problems but if you don't it just may frustrate you when you can't remember where the !@#$%^&*()_+ keys are.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:49:32
Quote from: ripster;134516
That's because in real life we're not Geeks.  At least I'm not.  I think.  Maybe.


What would your definition of a "geek" be?  (And this is an honest, sincere question--don't read any defensiveness or I'm-setting-you-up tone into it)

I'm just thinking that I may or may not be a geek depending on the definition.  Like, for example, I usually know what's going on with the LHC.  Does that make me a geek?  Does it matter that people from my lab are on the LHC machine advisory panel and I can get inside info?

Does it make me a geek that I did a heat flow calculation on a flashlight?  Does it make me a geek that I love sci-fi?  Does it make me a geek that I'm into good coffee and nice keyboards and computers (especially Apple stuff)?

Or do you need to live in your parents basement and be inept with the opposite sex and socially incompetent?

Because, if any of the former, I'm a geek and proud of it.  But if the latter, I'm definitely not a geek.  I have a lot going on in my life, socially and otherwise, I'm married, and I have a lot of interests.  And some of those interests take me pretty far into issues of quality and details and fine differences.  But I like that a lot.  I don't see that that should have a negative connotation.  But maybe that's 'cause I'm a geek.  LOL!  (or maybe not).
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: AndrewZorn on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:49:57
with all the BS BS and cherry blue fanaticism, topreans have to work together too
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:52:48
Quote from: AndrewZorn;134536
with all the BS BS and cherry blue fanaticism, topreans have to work together too


Why?

What would happen if we didn't?
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: AndrewZorn on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:54:35
a wipeout of the tribe?
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:56:00
Quote from: rdjack21;134530
Yes the Topre takes a little time to actually get it. And once you do you either Love it or Hate it.


As you saw in ripster's picture the keys are actually more of a charcoal color with black lettering. If you have decent lighting they are actually pretty easy to read. But if you are in dim lighting you really can't read them at all.

I have both a Black 87U and a white 86U. To me the black 87U has a stealth keyboard look to it and really does look good. But on the other hand I also like the white 86U board as well. If you know your way around a keyboard really well the black 87U will not cause any problems but if you don't it just may frustrate you when you can't remember where the !@#$%^&*()_+ keys are.


Excellent info!  Thank you very much!

I do know my way around a keyboard, and rarely need to look at it, so the low-level readability wouldn't be much of an issue.  But it would totally be a non-issue either.  Right now, I'm still unsure as to how much I like the look of the black on gray.  I'm liking it more and more as I see it more.  So far I've only ever had white/tan keyboards.  So there's some inertia to overcome.  I'll just have to mull it over between now and when elitekeyboards has the 87U in stock.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:57:11
Quote from: AndrewZorn;134539
a wipeout of the tribe?


LOL!

You know what?  Yer right.  I'll go right over to that frickin' FILCO cherry blue thread and join the fight.  Stupid Cherry blue switches.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:57:47
Quote from: ripster;134541
If we didn't have all the tribal fanaticism we'd be a better community.


Oh.  Oh.  Yeah.  Fine.  Be that way.  All mature and stuff and speaking reason.  I see how you are.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:58:05
Quote from: _js_;134464
Actually, never mind about the ebay questions.  I was just testing my escape key on my 103U and there is no way I would want an entire keyboard of 55g Topres.  I like the 45g.  I think I would chose an all 45g (with 55g esc) over what I have now.  But I wouldn't know until I tried it.


Yea the 55g keys are a little stiff. I have a short throw Topre that has 55g keys and I really wish it had 45g keys instead. Other than the key weight I really like it though and I'm trying to find one that has lighter keys but not sure I will. Oh if you are wondering it's the MD01B0 in my sig if you want to take a look at it.

For an all 45g board take a look at ripster's Mod your key weighting (http://geekhack.org/showwiki.php?title=Island:6402) make sure and read the discussion part because that is where he actually goes into the mod.

The other option is the HHKB Pro but like you mentioned it does not have function keys. And like you that is the one thing that bothers me about it. I can live without the cursor keys mostly because the way the HHKB does them is not bad. But also like you I use my function keys quit a bit. That is what has lead me down the path to search out and get some of the other Topre boards I have. I really like my MD01B0 and HE0100 but would prefer that they had lighter keys. I also have this one sitting in Japan waiting to ship:

(http://geekhack.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=5836&stc=1&d=1258739555)

According to what I have been able to find out about it. It should have lighter keys but I will not believe it until I get it. But it is getting pretty close to what I want (layout wise) in a mini keyboard.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: itlnstln on Fri, 20 November 2009, 11:58:38
Quote from: ripster;134532
I don't care senior members fooling around but Didjamatic must think we're a bunch of *******s.

We're not?
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:04:00
rdjack21,

Very cool.  I'll be interested to see how you like it.  I like the look of the layout.

ripster,

Errr.  For the record, I was just kidding!  I totally agree with you about less tribal bickering making for a better community.  And I agree that in a thread devoted to some particular switch, it's rude for people to jump in and try to champion a different switch.  Or even worse, try to diss the switch under discussion.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: itlnstln on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:04:46
Quote from: ripster;134545
Sigh.....
 
Maybe Geekhack IS going downhill.

Damn kids.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:05:42
Quote from: ripster;134532

What's with everybody just jumping into their Switch Tribes.   Even my 14 years old son knows better to tell someone that just got a new keyboard they should have gotten something else.  I don't care senior members fooling around but Didjamatic must think we're a bunch of *******s.

Link. (http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?t=7785)


What did you expect when you opened that thread with a lego picture? I think everyone thought it was a joke thread so we joined in to have a little fun :)
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: AndrewZorn on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:07:03
yeah, even YOU said "more fun"
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:08:35
rdjack21,

By the way, that keyboard in your avatar pic is just about the coolest thing I've ever seen!  Awesome color combos!
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:11:14
Quote from: AndrewZorn;134536
with all the BS BS and cherry blue fanaticism, topreans have to work together too


Quote from: _js_;134538
Why?

What would happen if we didn't?


Really this all got started when another member who we have not seen around here in a while really started bashing people who purchased Topre boards. Including those that where asking questions about them. So some really felt the need to defend Realforce/Topre boards.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: itlnstln on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:14:47
Quote from: rdjack21;134559
Really this all got started when another member who we have not seen around here in a while really started bashing people who purchased Topre boards. Including those that where asking questions about them. So some really felt the need to defend Realforce/Topre boards.

Does his name start with an "L," end with an "L," and have an "A" in the middle?  I was just thinking we hadn't seen him in awhile.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:14:53
Quote from: ripster;134557
It's not the only thread like that.  I'm not going to QFT them all.  Gets tiring when the OP is a noobie.


Yea I've seen that happen as well. I try really hard to stay on topic and in the same switch category that is the topic of discussion.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:18:28
Quote from: _js_;134556
rdjack21,

By the way, that keyboard in your avatar pic is just about the coolest thing I've ever seen!  Awesome color combos!


Thanks! I like it allot as well but I can't take credit for the creation of it. I bought it off another Geekhacker. I have to say he did a really good job with it and I really feel lucky that I got it. The link in my sig has a picture of it where you can really see it better.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:18:54
Quote from: rdjack21;134559
Really this all got started when another member who we have not seen around here in a while really started bashing people who purchased Topre boards. Including those that where asking questions about them. So some really felt the need to defend Realforce/Topre boards.


Yeah.  I hear that.  I get pretty reactionary in the face of that type of bashing myself.  ESPECIALLY if the person doing the bashing has little or NO experience with the thing he or she is bashing.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: rdjack21 on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:19:02
Quote from: itlnstln;134565
Does his name start with an "L," end with an "L," and have an "A" in the middle?  I was just thinking we hadn't seen him in awhile.


yea I wonder what happened to him.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: itlnstln on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:24:44
I don't really care what switches people use.  Hell, I have at least one 'board with all the major types (except Topres).  As long as people find what they like, that's enough for me. I just don't really find anything to get all emotional about.  I'm not a geek, either, though, so that might be it.  I was just looking for a place to hang out during down time at work.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: itlnstln on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:25:15
Quote from: ripster;134575
I never expect Germans to be polite. I miss Huha's reviews.

Yeah, speaking of tribal members.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:32:34
Quote from: ripster;134579
Here it is.  One of Huha's Classics. (http://geekhack.org/showpost.php?p=93993&postcount=11)


Wow.  All that wisdom, all those brilliant suggestions and summations and judgments.  All for free.  And so polite.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: itlnstln on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:34:36
That was one amazing wall of text.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: ch_123 on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:41:34
Quote from: ripster;134579
Here it is.  One of Huha's Classics. (http://geekhack.org/showpost.php?p=93993&postcount=11)


In fairness, the criticism was all valid. That guy had some ludicrous 'facts' in his text, for example, claiming that Model Ms were made back in the 60s.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: ch_123 on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:49:31
Time to troll his comments section. Maybe I should link the IBM wiki as a source...
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: _js_ on Fri, 20 November 2009, 12:59:40
Quote from: ch_123;134591
In fairness, the criticism was all valid. That guy had some ludicrous 'facts' in his text, for example, claiming that Model Ms were made back in the 60s.


That's good to know.  Put things in a different light.  Still . . .
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: ch_123 on Fri, 20 November 2009, 13:57:18
Well, he wanted some feedback on what he wrote. He got feedback appropriate for someone who had done almost no research and then expected some people really interested in IBM keyboards to like it.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: microsoft windows on Fri, 20 November 2009, 16:30:56
Quote from: ch_123;134596
Time to troll his comments section. Maybe I should link the IBM wiki as a source...


I thought trolling was MY job.
Title: Just get my hand on Topre Realforce 87U
Post by: ricercar on Thu, 31 December 2009, 17:52:05
Quote from: AndrewZorn;133073
dye them!


Don't you mean "Kill them"? :bolt: