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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: dario on Mon, 30 November 2015, 16:10:40

Title: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: dario on Mon, 30 November 2015, 16:10:40
If you take a look at all the different reviews of Topre based boards, let's say Realforce 87/88UB, one of the most common points is a try to compare them to the most widespread type of a mechanical switch - and that would be Cherry MX switch, of course.

Almost everyone will start to draw a parallel to Cherry MX brown as the closest equivalent to the feeling Topre boards deliver, since browns don't have loud clicks, and yet they are still somewhat tactile.

However, what I don't like about this comparison is the fact that literally everyone who ever tried Topre board, including the softer 45g version, has come to a conclusion that these are quite a bit stiffer to press than any of the  softer types of Cherry switches, even though they are marketed as 45g or 55g as well. I guess this has to do something with different force curves, among other factors.

I will quote a few parts of the review I found on DT (http://deskthority.net/review-f45/realforce-88ub-topre-45g-t9976.html).

Quote
I love MX reds and really appreciate the fact that they're a very light switch. Reading that both MX reds and Realforce 88UB had 45g force, I was hoping them to be very similar. The Topre 45g feels considerably heavier than MX reds, close to blacks I would say. Whenever I get home type on my MX reds I feel like I'm smashing the keyboard, at least in the first couple of minutes. I'd like the Topres to be a bit lighter but I enjoy them non the less.

Quote
Beware what people say on the internet, though. Anyone who thinks 45g (regular) Topre is close to MX red is deluded. There's various ways to measure switch weights out there (the right way and the wrong way, evidently…) but in all reality 45g Topre is in between MX red and black, leaning towards black. A lot of non-MX switches are right in that range actually, it's something of a sweet spot. Most Alps switches are right around there too.

Here we come to my question. Since I basically have two home locations and routinely switch between them, I had an idea to buy Cherry MX board which is as close to a Realforce 88 as Cherry MX can get, because I don't want to simply buy another Topre board since they are so damn expensive, and I don't want to carry this one around like some desperate IT camper. Of course, I already own one of the Cherry MX blue boards, and I am aware they are a different world entirely from a Topre, but non the less idea is to come as close as one can.

So, obviously, browns are not the right choice simply because they are too soft, but since we are speaking about non-clicky tactile type of a switch, perhaps clears would be the right choice? What do you think?
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: inanis on Mon, 30 November 2015, 16:16:52
I often carry my board home from work with me. I am not a desperate IT camper.  :rolleyes:

To answer your question though, there is no direct comparison, they are just different. However you might want to look into the Zealios. The 67g tactile switches have been said to have torpe-like feel. It is probably as close as you are going to get. I spent all day typing on a HHKB, and I'm typing this post an some 67g Zealios. They don't really feel the same at all, but I can see where people draw the comparison. You'd have to do a custom build if you were interested in those tho.

My advice...buy an hhkb and call it day.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ctm on Mon, 30 November 2015, 16:32:52
I think Cherry MX brown is the Cherry MX switch that is most similar to Topre, but they are still very different. They are just similar in the sense that they are tactile, but the feeling is totally different. I think the different between Topre and MX brown is the different between apple juice and orange juice: they are both juice, but do not taste like each other. Orange juice is more similar to apple juice compared to coffee, but it's not apple juice.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: dario on Mon, 30 November 2015, 16:44:27
I often carry my board home from work with me. I am not a desperate IT camper.  :rolleyes:

To answer your question though, there is no direct comparison, they are just different. However you might want to look into the Zealios. The 67g tactile switches have been said to have torpe-like feel. It is probably as close as you are going to get. I spent all day typing on a HHKB, and I'm typing this post an some 67g Zealios. They don't really feel the same at all, but I can see where people draw the comparison. You'd have to do a custom build if you were interested in those tho.

My advice...buy an hhkb and call it day.

Well, thanks for the idea, but buying Zealios would include plenty of soldering, and I would certainly like to avoid that part of the story. It's not like I'am necessarily against it, but if I was about to do that amount of work, I'd like it to be for a good reason... and this it ain't.  ;D

And as I already mentioned, I would like to avoid buying another torpe board too. I don't spend that much time at my parents so I don't need really high-end keyboard there, I just need it to be decent and somewhat torpe-like. Since I live in Europe, everything is more expensive than in the US, so I could buy let's say good MX browns board + very good Ducky PBT keycaps for less than 150€. I would need at least 2,5X of that amount for a Topre board.

Soooo... browns or clears? Maybe even greens if their stiffness is about the same as 45 Topre, I don't mind the clickyness, I love my loud MX blue board after all, which sound more like a weapon than a keyboard really.

I think Cherry MX brown is the Cherry MX switch that is most similar to Topre, but they are still very different. They are just similar in the sense that they are tactile, but the feeling is totally different. I think the different between Topre and MX brown is the different between apple juice and orange juice: they are both juice, but do not taste like each other. Orange juice is more similar to apple juice compared to coffee, but it's not apple juice.

That's a good thing since browns are the cheapest one.
But can anyone perhaps compare Topre to clears of maybe greens?
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: bbrotha on Mon, 30 November 2015, 16:57:36
Hi, I have a Realforce 87U with 45g switches, as some Tactile zealios 65g on a 60% build and also Cherry Blues on a numpad. In this case Greens and Blues are definitely different than topre switches by a lot, starting with the clicky sound. I guess it would be really hard to find a similar MX feel to topre, but as the previous post above, zealios might provided you a feeling close to it, but I really prefer my Realforce. I in fact tried already every topre keyboard out there including the RF hi Pro and Leopold, and my favorite, mostly for the build sturdiness is the RF87, follow by the HHKB. I couldn't get the layout at first, but it would be my next topre buy without a doubt.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ctm on Mon, 30 November 2015, 17:03:37
When I said brown was most similar, I was comparing to 45g Topre and not taking non-standard Cherry MX (like ergo-clear) into consideration. I think brown is more similar because brown is of similar weight to 45g Topre while clear is heavier. Also green is not similar to Topre at all. Green is clicky.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ideus on Mon, 30 November 2015, 18:23:12
The switch only comparison may defeat you, because the case, and particularly the plate of the board will affect the overall feeling of it. You should consider that Topre is a system keyboard, not discrete switches put together like an MX one.


I am typing right now on purple Zealios installed on an acrylic plate and they feel very close to a Topre board, they are more responsive and less mushy, though, but close.


I read that you want to avoid soldering, that is ok, however to answer your question fairly I'd say plate mounted purple Zealios are close in feeling to Topre.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: Altis on Mon, 30 November 2015, 23:25:47
I concur with above that purple Zealios are the closest MX switch to Topre. If you want stock MX, then yes MX Clears would be it.

MX Clear is pretty gritty by comparison and fairly heavy, but perfect if you're trying to avoid bottoming out.

Topre and Zealios both have a fairly smooth and large tactile bump, though Topre is still smoother and more tactile, IMO. The hump seems longer.

Dat one cupness.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: raymogi on Mon, 30 November 2015, 23:34:57
If you prefer not to do the hard work (soldering) like me, then stock clears is as close as you can get to that Topre feeling.

I'm waiting for my new board to be assembled with the purple 67g Zealios cause from what I've read, that is the closest you can get to Topre.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: fknraiden on Mon, 30 November 2015, 23:39:02
I used browns for 2 tears before switching to clears for that better part of the last 3 years. I now replaced them with my 55g topre. At first I didn't know if I was going to be able to get used to the topre. But I love it so much. I'd say get topre even if they are less customization.
Shout out to AirTree for always staying true to the topre master switch. You truly are correct.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: deductivemonkee on Mon, 30 November 2015, 23:39:33
Definitely Blue Alps or BS.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: mikes41720 on Tue, 01 December 2015, 00:17:04
There's just no comparison, really. The way the switch activates in Topre and Cherry MX are just totally different.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: fknraiden on Tue, 01 December 2015, 00:21:54
Definitely Blue Alps or BS.

was asking for MX
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: Charizard on Tue, 01 December 2015, 00:22:19
While I agree that there isn't really an MX switch that feels just like topre, ergo clears are definitely the closest in my opinion. I haven't tried the zelios switches but as they are close to the feel of ergo clears, I imagine they are similar to topre as well.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: zombimuncha on Tue, 01 December 2015, 00:26:35
I know you said cherry MX, but you might want to look into Matias Quiet Click switches. They're nice and quiet like Topre, and have a good solid and precise tactile bump.

Also, you said you don't want to do any soldering without good reason - Purple Zealios are great switches, there's your "good reason"
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: henz on Tue, 01 December 2015, 02:52:34
id totally say mx blues. but mx blues has a loud click :) Other than that i think they are pretty similar
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: rowdy on Tue, 01 December 2015, 03:55:48
Even the closest MX switch will not give you a feeling of oneness with cup rubber.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: absyrd on Tue, 01 December 2015, 04:23:45
My advice...buy an hhkb and call it day.

How did youknowwho not see this and applaud you?

And quality post above that, tbh.

Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: bocahgundul on Tue, 01 December 2015, 04:28:05
No switch give the same feeling as topre. Buy hhkb nao and you will know why its so good
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: Oobly on Tue, 01 December 2015, 04:32:22
I know you said cherry MX, but you might want to look into Matias Quiet Click switches. They're nice and quiet like Topre, and have a good solid and precise tactile bump.

Also, you said you don't want to do any soldering without good reason - Purple Zealios are great switches, there's your "good reason"

This... The Matias switches also have their tactile bump at the top like Topre. Zealios are worth learning to solder for :)

However: Topre, Alps, Buckling spring and MX (including Zealios) all have different force curves, so will feel different. There's no way around this besides severe modding.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: sth on Tue, 01 December 2015, 04:44:51
NUH
THEEN
CUM
PEARS

2 U*




*topre
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ideus on Tue, 01 December 2015, 07:16:52
A mechanism with a metal spring and a plastic stem will never be the same as one based on a rubber part. This discussion seems going into the same as most Topre vs Cherry comparisons do: Some like rubber, some do not. Again, if you like Topre, then go and buy one, and do not complain on price. If you want to try Cherry or ALPS go and choose the switch that best fit your likes, but trying to get something similar to something else is futile.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: keshley on Tue, 01 December 2015, 08:01:09
I agree with most here that there really is no comparison, but I've found the MX switches that feel the nicest after using Topre are Zealio Tactile, and MX Whites (I've never tried ErgoClears).
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: jamster on Tue, 01 December 2015, 08:09:02
As pretty much everyone else has been saying, Ergo Clear or Zealio. Browns very, very vaguely if you need to go standard MX, but even then that's more like a Royal Kludge version of Topre. I would argue that Clears are not like Topre at all, the ramped up bottom out makes it feel very different (and for me, highly frustrating).

The original question is like asking "which variety of apple is most like an orange?"
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: Firebolt1914 on Tue, 01 December 2015, 17:30:38
Nothing comes close, however that doesn't mean it's the best :p
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: inanis on Tue, 01 December 2015, 17:36:08
My advice...buy an hhkb and call it day.

How did youknowwho not see this and applaud you?

And quality post above that, tbh.

I know! I get no love sometimes. Second rate, I tell ya.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: Karura on Tue, 01 December 2015, 20:10:31
Zealios 67g, I've tested all of these, you must try for yourself. MX Clear is way too gritty, MX Brown bump is way too small.

Topre has large bump (dome) feeling, smooth, and requires a bit of force.

Zealios 67g has large bump, smooth, and requires a bit of force, but not too much, just right I'd say.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: Latin00032 on Tue, 01 December 2015, 22:34:29
Where can I get these 67 zealios for cheap?
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: raymogi on Tue, 01 December 2015, 22:37:24
Where can I get these 67 zealios for cheap?

zealpc.net :D
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ideus on Tue, 01 December 2015, 22:38:33
Where can I get these 67 zealios for cheap?


Here (http://zealpc.net/collections/switches), they are a buck each.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: KaminKevCrew on Wed, 02 December 2015, 00:36:08
Where can I get these 67 zealios for cheap?


Here (http://zealpc.net/collections/switches), they are a buck each.
Which is hardly cheap, for a whole board, but hey, there isn't really any other option for them at the moment... I think I saw some on the Classifieds a while ago. (I'm typing on some 67g Zealios right now, and loving it!!!)
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: swimmingbird on Thu, 03 December 2015, 07:20:55
Where can I get these 67 zealios for cheap?


Here (http://zealpc.net/collections/switches), they are a buck each.
Which is hardly cheap, for a whole board, but hey, there isn't really any other option for them at the moment... I think I saw some on the Classifieds a while ago. (I'm typing on some 67g Zealios right now, and loving it!!!)

Well if you think about the time and effort it takes to get cherry mx clears, open them up, swap out the springs and replace them with clear tops and so forth I'd definitely say they are worth it

They fill out a nice gap in the market for what I am going to call "semi custom switches" - modded to a certain extent but without lube/stickers etc
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ideus on Thu, 03 December 2015, 07:24:29
Where can I get these 67 zealios for cheap?


Here (http://zealpc.net/collections/switches), they are a buck each.
Which is hardly cheap, for a whole board, but hey, there isn't really any other option for them at the moment... I think I saw some on the Classifieds a while ago. (I'm typing on some 67g Zealios right now, and loving it!!!)

Well if you think about the time and effort it takes to get cherry mx clears, open them up, swap out the springs and replace them with clear tops and so forth I'd definitely say they are worth it

They fill out a nice gap in the market for what I am going to call "semi custom switches" - modded to a certain extent but without lube/stickers etc


But modding switches is very funny and entertaining.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: keshley on Thu, 03 December 2015, 07:31:45
Where can I get these 67 zealios for cheap?


Here (http://zealpc.net/collections/switches), they are a buck each.
Which is hardly cheap, for a whole board, but hey, there isn't really any other option for them at the moment... I think I saw some on the Classifieds a while ago. (I'm typing on some 67g Zealios right now, and loving it!!!)

Well if you think about the time and effort it takes to get cherry mx clears, open them up, swap out the springs and replace them with clear tops and so forth I'd definitely say they are worth it

They fill out a nice gap in the market for what I am going to call "semi custom switches" - modded to a certain extent but without lube/stickers etc


But modding switches is very funny and entertaining.

(http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/074/461/I-SEE-WHAT-YOU-DID-THERE_HOLY****.jpg)
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: SpAmRaY on Thu, 03 December 2015, 07:33:49
Where can I get these 67 zealios for cheap?


Here (http://zealpc.net/collections/switches), they are a buck each.
Which is hardly cheap, for a whole board, but hey, there isn't really any other option for them at the moment... I think I saw some on the Classifieds a while ago. (I'm typing on some 67g Zealios right now, and loving it!!!)

Well if you think about the time and effort it takes to get cherry mx clears, open them up, swap out the springs and replace them with clear tops and so forth I'd definitely say they are worth it

They fill out a nice gap in the market for what I am going to call "semi custom switches" - modded to a certain extent but without lube/stickers etc


But modding switches is very funny and entertaining.
For me opening dozens and dozens of switches and swapping parts around gets really old after a while.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: qwack on Thu, 03 December 2015, 07:43:22
Has anybody here tried both jailhouse blues and Topre ? I never tried the latter, but I am curious about how the former, with its high tactile bump, would compare.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ideus on Thu, 03 December 2015, 07:50:04
Where can I get these 67 zealios for cheap?


Here (http://zealpc.net/collections/switches), they are a buck each.
Which is hardly cheap, for a whole board, but hey, there isn't really any other option for them at the moment... I think I saw some on the Classifieds a while ago. (I'm typing on some 67g Zealios right now, and loving it!!!)

Well if you think about the time and effort it takes to get cherry mx clears, open them up, swap out the springs and replace them with clear tops and so forth I'd definitely say they are worth it

They fill out a nice gap in the market for what I am going to call "semi custom switches" - modded to a certain extent but without lube/stickers etc


But modding switches is very funny and entertaining.
For me opening dozens and dozens of switches and swapping parts around gets really old after a while.


I keep one of my keyboards with PCB mounted switched only with the purpose of the chance of experimenting with several combinations of stems and springs.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: jamster on Thu, 03 December 2015, 09:40:47
For me opening dozens and dozens of switches and swapping parts around gets really old after a while.

If by a while you mean a single keyboard, I'd agree wholeheartedly.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: SpAmRaY on Thu, 03 December 2015, 09:47:57
For me opening dozens and dozens of switches and swapping parts around gets really old after a while.

If by a while you mean a single keyboard, I'd agree wholeheartedly.

Ha! I've still got a phantom that I need to finish swapping springs and stems in, I only got though ~40 switches before I was done.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: minh278 on Fri, 04 December 2015, 01:17:44
Jailhouse greens. Feels quite similar to topre. The main problem is getting consistency when making them.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: jamster on Fri, 04 December 2015, 01:25:09
For me opening dozens and dozens of switches and swapping parts around gets really old after a while.

If by a while you mean a single keyboard, I'd agree wholeheartedly.

Ha! I've still got a phantom that I need to finish swapping springs and stems in, I only got though ~40 switches before I was done.

I've done a conversion on one full keyboard, and ran out of interest halfway through the next. The second keyboard has been sitting around for weeks waiting for the second half of a Zelio transplant.

I'd rate swapping out switch internals as slightly more engaging than watching paint dry :)
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: Macsmasher on Fri, 04 December 2015, 21:11:58
If you want a Topre board to feel like a Cherry board, it's easy. Just buy a Topre board, pull the keycaps and pour sand in the switch housings. Conversion to Cherry, done!
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ideus on Fri, 04 December 2015, 23:03:27
It is time to lock this thread.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: dario on Fri, 04 December 2015, 23:41:38
It is time to lock this thread.

(http://memecrunch.com/meme/Q4D5/get-off-my-lawn/image.jpg)
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: byker on Fri, 04 December 2015, 23:58:10
If you want a Topre board to feel like a Cherry board, it's easy. Just buy a Topre board, pull the keycaps and pour sand in the switch housings. Conversion to Cherry, done!

L O L
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: Karura on Sat, 05 December 2015, 00:03:53
If you want a Topre board to feel like a Cherry board, it's easy. Just buy a Topre board, pull the keycaps and pour sand in the switch housings. Conversion to Cherry, done!

Sounds like someone hasn't been fortunate enough to try lubed Vintage Blacks, or lubed Zealios. :P
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ideus on Sat, 05 December 2015, 00:14:53
It is time to lock this thread.

Show Image
(http://memecrunch.com/meme/Q4D5/get-off-my-lawn/image.jpg)



I love Grand Torino the movie as well.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: Michael on Sat, 05 December 2015, 00:16:47
Cherry.

(http://i.imgur.com/nGs9CZw.gif)
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: Karura on Sat, 05 December 2015, 00:35:18
Cherry.

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/nGs9CZw.gif)


(https://media.giphy.com/media/14ynvxqdwZ4WOc/giphy.gif)
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ideus on Sat, 05 December 2015, 06:50:49
(http://i.imgur.com/J7fscDr.gif)
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: dario on Mon, 07 December 2015, 02:43:05
I just wonder is there a Topre Church and how many of you declared themselves as Toprerian ethnicity during the last Census.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: Macsmasher on Mon, 07 December 2015, 17:24:07
If you want a Topre board to feel like a Cherry board, it's easy. Just buy a Topre board, pull the keycaps and pour sand in the switch housings. Conversion to Cherry, done!

L O L


Haha, I'm honored to be quoted in your signature.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: Macsmasher on Mon, 07 December 2015, 17:44:02
If you want a Topre board to feel like a Cherry board, it's easy. Just buy a Topre board, pull the keycaps and pour sand in the switch housings. Conversion to Cherry, done!

Sounds like someone hasn't been fortunate enough to try lubed Vintage Blacks, or lubed Zealios. :p


No, I've never tried Vintage Blacks or Zealios boards. I am partial to lighter switches. My favorite board is my RF 87U silent variable. I also have a RF 87U 55g uni, but find it a bit too tiring for extended typing. However, I do appreciate any fine keyboard regardless of switch type.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ander on Wed, 09 December 2015, 06:16:10
As most people will tell you, they're completely different approaches to switch design. It's like asking, "What kind of ice cream is most like a hamburger?"

The obvious solution is to have one of everything, and rotate between them as you please. Some people on here actually do this.  :?O
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ideus on Wed, 09 December 2015, 07:19:14
In the mechanical keyboard realm there has been a long and never ending fight between Topre users and the rest of us, discrete switches based keyboards users; even, within the Topre group there is a subgroup of those that praise the HHKB Pro as the only board that worth having. Sometimes there are connections, like galactic worm holes within GH, where the two worlds meet, like this thread. The fact is that each group can live well and enjoy their keyboard passion at their own world, but when the two join they may clash. This thread is a classic example, some times these encounters are entertaining, other are just nasty discussions with no argumentation, nor warrants, empty bezels of idiosyncratic thoughts.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: swimmingbird on Wed, 09 December 2015, 07:27:04
In the mechanical keyboard realm there has been a long and never ending fight between Topre users and the rest of us, discrete switches based keyboards users; even, within the Topre group there is a subgroup of those that praise the HHKB Pro as the only board that worth having. Sometimes there are connections, like galactic worm holes within GH, where the two worlds meet, like this thread. The fact is that each group can live well and enjoy their keyboard passion at their own world, but when the two join they may clash. This thread is a classic example, some times these encounters are entertaining, other are just nasty discussions with no argumentation, nor warrants, empty bezels of idiosyncratic thoughts.

I don't think there is that much of a "never ending fight"

Most people I see who are Topre owners typically own quite few MX boards as well. There aren't that many Topre only people out there
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: losing_ctrl on Wed, 09 December 2015, 07:33:32
As most people will tell you, they're completely different approaches to switch design. It's like asking, "What kind of ice cream is most like a hamburger?"

The obvious solution is to have one of everything, and rotate between them as you please. Some people on here actually do this.  :?O

Owning one of everything that interests me (which is almost everything), then rotating between them is my goal. As a keyboard enthusiast, I find that rotating between different boards to be great fun. I've got my first Topre kb being shipped to me right now so I am eager to make the Cherry MX vs Topre switch comparison.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: qwack on Wed, 09 December 2015, 07:34:04
In the mechanical keyboard realm there has been a long and never ending fight between Topre users and the rest of us, discrete switches based keyboards users; even, within the Topre group there is a subgroup of those that praise the HHKB Pro as the only board that worth having. Sometimes there are connections, like galactic worm holes within GH, where the two worlds meet, like this thread. The fact is that each group can live well and enjoy their keyboard passion at their own world, but when the two join they may clash. This thread is a classic example, some times these encounters are entertaining, other are just nasty discussions with no argumentation, nor warrants, empty bezels of idiosyncratic thoughts.

... and within this group, there is a subgroup of those who praise the Type-S as the only HHKB Pro worth having.

And within this subgroup, there may be yet another subgroup that found a reason to feel superior to the rest of them  ;D
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: Ludovician on Wed, 09 December 2015, 07:35:16
What about someone who uses Topre switches and discrete switches all the time and likes both?

Not Cherry MX; I think those suck. But Alps and Topre are my favourites.

Welcome to the rubber dome club, losing_ctrl
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ideus on Wed, 09 December 2015, 07:40:29
In the mechanical keyboard realm there has been a long and never ending fight between Topre users and the rest of us, discrete switches based keyboards users; even, within the Topre group there is a subgroup of those that praise the HHKB Pro as the only board that worth having. Sometimes there are connections, like galactic worm holes within GH, where the two worlds meet, like this thread. The fact is that each group can live well and enjoy their keyboard passion at their own world, but when the two join they may clash. This thread is a classic example, some times these encounters are entertaining, other are just nasty discussions with no argumentation, nor warrants, empty bezels of idiosyncratic thoughts.

I don't think there is that much of a "never ending fight"

Most people I see who are Topre owners typically own quite few MX boards as well. There aren't that many Topre only people out there


Those are the renegades, a different breed of keyboard users.


(http://i.imgur.com/ezHPmJT.gif) (http://imgur.com/ezHPmJT)
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: swimmingbird on Wed, 09 December 2015, 08:02:52
In the mechanical keyboard realm there has been a long and never ending fight between Topre users and the rest of us, discrete switches based keyboards users; even, within the Topre group there is a subgroup of those that praise the HHKB Pro as the only board that worth having. Sometimes there are connections, like galactic worm holes within GH, where the two worlds meet, like this thread. The fact is that each group can live well and enjoy their keyboard passion at their own world, but when the two join they may clash. This thread is a classic example, some times these encounters are entertaining, other are just nasty discussions with no argumentation, nor warrants, empty bezels of idiosyncratic thoughts.

I don't think there is that much of a "never ending fight"

Most people I see who are Topre owners typically own quite few MX boards as well. There aren't that many Topre only people out there

I think as long as you don't think a Razer or Corsair keyboard is the best thing ever you'll get along here pretty well regardless of what you end up using
Those are the renegades, a different breed of keyboard users.


(http://i.imgur.com/ezHPmJT.gif) (http://imgur.com/ezHPmJT)
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: Macsmasher on Wed, 09 December 2015, 14:08:48
I'm not really a keyboard enthusiast. I work on them and they're a tool for me. I don't mod mine other than adding a few different color keycaps. I would rather stand buck naked and be pressure washed than take a keyboard apart and add some rubber bands or solder some switches. However, I have grown to appreciate a fine keyboard just like a carpenter appreciates a fine hammer.


I have no vested interest or allegiance to a particular switch or keyboard manufacturer. The only thing I care about is using the best keyboard for the 12+ hours per day I spend on it. Aside from quantifiable quality assessments, we all know 'the best' is mostly subjective opinion and personal preference. I had used Cherry browns, blues and reds for years until I discovered Topre keyboards. I now have three Topre boards and zero cherry boards. If Cherry would actually innovate something that is better than Topre, I'd be all over it. But until then, I see no reason to own anything Cherry. That's like a Lexus owner buying a Kia just so he could be reminded of why he bought the Lexus in the first place. And, that last statement is my subjective opinion.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: kekman on Thu, 10 December 2015, 05:34:15
If you want to try topre, go get your closest rubber dome and then imagine a version of it that you would actually like  :p
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: swimmingbird on Thu, 10 December 2015, 06:25:46
If you want to try topre, go get your closest rubber dome and then imagine a version of it that you would actually like  :p

lies lies lies
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: jamster on Thu, 10 December 2015, 07:29:04
I have to agree with the rubberdome statement. I've got a *good* RB keyboard sitting here next to a Realforce 55. Actuation and force/distance feel almost exactly the same, but the Realforce is more solid in travel (keys don't rattle about) and sounds nicer.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ideus on Thu, 10 December 2015, 07:33:45
I have to agree with the rubberdome statement. I've got a *good* RB keyboard sitting here next to a Realforce 55. Actuation and force/distance feel almost exactly the same, but the Realforce is more solid in travel (keys don't rattle about) and sounds nicer.


This is one of the more objective statement about Topres that I have read so far.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: keshley on Thu, 10 December 2015, 07:58:13
I have to agree with the rubberdome statement. I've got a *good* RB keyboard sitting here next to a Realforce 55. Actuation and force/distance feel almost exactly the same, but the Realforce is more solid in travel (keys don't rattle about) and sounds nicer.


This is one of the more objective statement about Topres that I have read so far.

Certainly more accurate than MX vs Topre, for sure.

A better analogy is probably something along these lines;

Comparing MX and Topre is like comparing Whiskey and Vodka. They're both spirits, but they're completely different otherwise.

Comparing a rubber dome to Topre is like comparing a cheap $10 bottle of scotch, and a bottle of Macallan 21. They're both scotch, and share some inherit traits because of that, but they're still so very different.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: kekman on Thu, 10 December 2015, 08:03:33
If you want to try topre, go get your closest rubber dome and then imagine a version of it that you would actually like  :p

lies lies lies

pfft, you can't tell me that.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: swimmingbird on Thu, 10 December 2015, 08:12:16
If you want to try topre, go get your closest rubber dome and then imagine a version of it that you would actually like  :p

lies lies lies

pfft, you can't tell me that.

there can be only one spike spiegel
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: kekman on Thu, 10 December 2015, 08:18:08
If you want to try topre, go get your closest rubber dome and then imagine a version of it that you would actually like  :p

lies lies lies

pfft, you can't tell me that.

there can be only one spike spiegel

i'm the real one, believe me D:
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ideus on Thu, 10 December 2015, 08:21:08
I have to agree with the rubberdome statement. I've got a *good* RB keyboard sitting here next to a Realforce 55. Actuation and force/distance feel almost exactly the same, but the Realforce is more solid in travel (keys don't rattle about) and sounds nicer.


This is one of the more objective statement about Topres that I have read so far.



Certainly more accurate than MX vs Topre, for sure.

A better analogy is probably something along these lines;

Comparing MX and Topre is like comparing Whiskey and Vodka. They're both spirits, but they're completely different otherwise.

Comparing a rubber dome to Topre is like comparing a cheap $10 bottle of scotch, and a bottle of Macallan 21. They're both scotch, and share some inherit traits because of that, but they're still so very different.


+1
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: jamster on Thu, 10 December 2015, 19:48:54
I have to agree with the rubberdome statement. I've got a *good* RB keyboard sitting here next to a Realforce 55. Actuation and force/distance feel almost exactly the same, but the Realforce is more solid in travel (keys don't rattle about) and sounds nicer.


This is one of the more objective statement about Topres that I have read so far.

Certainly more accurate than MX vs Topre, for sure.

A better analogy is probably something along these lines;

Comparing MX and Topre is like comparing Whiskey and Vodka. They're both spirits, but they're completely different otherwise.

Comparing a rubber dome to Topre is like comparing a cheap $10 bottle of scotch, and a bottle of Macallan 21. They're both scotch, and share some inherit traits because of that, but they're still so very different.

That analogy only serves to highlight how switches are  a completely personal preference- I much prefer the simple Macallan 12 to any of the older versions :)
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: kekman on Fri, 11 December 2015, 02:35:31
I have to agree with the rubberdome statement. I've got a *good* RB keyboard sitting here next to a Realforce 55. Actuation and force/distance feel almost exactly the same, but the Realforce is more solid in travel (keys don't rattle about) and sounds nicer.


This is one of the more objective statement about Topres that I have read so far.

Certainly more accurate than MX vs Topre, for sure.

A better analogy is probably something along these lines;

Comparing MX and Topre is like comparing Whiskey and Vodka. They're both spirits, but they're completely different otherwise.

Comparing a rubber dome to Topre is like comparing a cheap $10 bottle of scotch, and a bottle of Macallan 21. They're both scotch, and share some inherit traits because of that, but they're still so very different.

That analogy only serves to highlight how switches are  a completely personal preference- I much prefer the simple Macallan 12 to any of the older versions :)

Of course they are a preference. But people still like to argue about how the switches feel, not just how good they feel. It's something that numbers can't explain, you really have to try it to know it.
Title: Re: What is the closest Cherry MX equivalent of a Topre switch?
Post by: ander on Fri, 11 December 2015, 06:44:42
In the mechanical keyboard realm there has been a long and never ending fight between Topre users and the rest of us...

I don't think there is that much of a "never ending fight"...

Now you're even fighting about whether there's a fight or not.  :?D

The obvious solution is to have one of everything, and rotate between them as you please...

Owning one of everything that interests me (which is almost everything), then rotating between them is my goal. As a keyboard enthusiast, I find that rotating between different boards to be great fun...

It's the greatest! It really makes you understand why harems and bigamy were so popular.

I'm not really a keyboard enthusiast. I work on them and they're a tool for me. I don't mod mine other than adding a few different color keycaps. I would rather stand buck naked and be pressure washed than take a keyboard apart and add some rubber bands or solder some switches.

Are we limited to just one type of thing or the other, though? Because the pressure washing sounds really good to me, especially if I could get a tall, muscular babe dressed up like Wonder Woman to do it.

I've got a *good* RB keyboard sitting here next to a Realforce 55. Actuation and force/distance feel almost exactly the same, but the Realforce is more solid in travel (keys don't rattle about) and sounds nicer.

I have here some examples of a Dell QuietKey RT7D5JTW (one of the good ones, made in Thailand) and an H-P C3758A (designed by HP, made by Key Tronic). They're high-quality, pleasant-sounding RD boards with crisp, responsive, wobble-free travel. I got them NIB on eBay, and they were about $200 less than your RealForce. That was for both of them.

I might like the Topre a bit more, but not that much more. If I did like it more, it's probably be because I could sit there thinking, "Hah! I'm typing on a goofily expensive keyboard that lots of other people would like to have, if they didn't prefer stuff like food and clothing."

Okay, I agree, the Topre sound is cool. But hey, you don't have to buy something that can be digitized. That's so 20th century. Just download an audio sample of a Topre and set it up as your keypress sound. Voila. I even have a friend who can do a convincing Topre impression with his mouth—thok, thok! It's silly spending all that dough for something that's so easily simulated. Right now, there's a bunch of guys in an executive suite in Tokyo laughing about that and getting ready to jet off to their private islands.

Comparing MX and Topre is like comparing Whiskey and Vodka. They're both spirits, but they're completely different otherwise. Comparing a rubber dome to Topre is like comparing a cheap $10 bottle of scotch, and a bottle of Macallan 21. They're both scotch, and share some inherit traits because of that, but they're still so very different.

I realize there are lots of people who can tell what a "good" scotch is. But I don't actually know any of them. They were the people I used to play piano music for at country clubs and secluded resorts. They smoked $20 cigars and wore $1000 shoes. Give me a glass of Canadian Club on ice with a splash, and I'm just as happy as I could possibly be with a glass of 18-year-old aged-in-the-cask Wee Bonnie Dew o' the Heath.

I think a lot of that is just the power of suggestion, salesmanship and snobbery. A few years ago, I actually switched the remaining "good" scotch my wife had brought back from a trip with some CC (thinking I'd appreciate the difference—which I couldn't). At our next party, she served it around to her teacher, lawyer and doctor friends, and they were all smiling and complimenting it, telling her what a "full taste" it had, and so forth.

I bet I could put my HP's innards in a Topre case, take it to a KB meet and say, "Hey, Topre sent us this new prototype—check it out!", and everyone would crowd around and ooh and aah. "Wow, it's quieter, but it still has that cool rubbery sound—it'll be great for the office!" "I really like the retro white keys with brown legends!" They've shortened the travel so you can type faster!" LOL. People are so suggestible.

Of course they are a preference. But people still like to argue about how the switches feel, not just how good they feel. It's something that numbers can't explain, you really have to try it to know it.

I understand the same is true about Jesus. It's not enough to read a bunch of numbered bible verses; you must invite Jesus into your heart and try Him. At least that's what people tell me. As it happens, I have some imaginary friends I've had since I was a kid, so I already know them well and it doesn't make sense to switch to someone else's. They also give me candy, and whisper winning lottery numbers in my ear. Let's see Jesus do that.