geekhack
geekhack Community => Off Topic => Topic started by: wangbwhz on Sat, 10 December 2016, 21:57:59
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I am running a small group buy on GH. Recently a few customers requested a refund. I told them it is not allowed to do refund after group buy and i suggested selling his spot on mechmarket, but he asked for a group buy agreement for this. As i thought this is a general rule so i did not write this on my thread.
I even can not find this rule on the Geekhack. Is it a common rule that everyone knows? Anyone encounter such kind of issue?
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It's not a hard rule. Usually a GB leader will let people know that refunds cannot be given after the order has been placed with whomever is fulfilling, posted in the OP of the thread. It's not so much as being allowed to refund, as there is no money to refund once orders are placed. I've never seen an issue like this though. Good luck.
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removed.
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It's up to the runner. If you've specified no refunds, then they have to wait and do what they can. If you have already spent their money on getting their product, then they have to wait. If you can help them sell the spot, do it.
Generally, they should wait, as they know what a GB entails.
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It's not a hard rule. Usually a GB leader will let people know that refunds cannot be given after the order has been placed with whomever is fulfilling, posted in the OP of the thread. It's not so much as being allowed to refund, as there is no money to refund once orders are placed. I've never seen an issue like this though. Good luck.
It's up to the runner. If you've specified no refunds, then they have to wait and do what they can. If you have already spent their money on getting their product, then they have to wait. If you can help them sell the spot, do it.
Generally, they should wait, as they know what a GB entails.
Thanks for the reply.I have done refund for him. It is very frustrating. He complained in paypal with the reason non-receipt. I never consider people doing things like this.I think i will put the rule in the group buy thread next time.
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It's not a hard rule. Usually a GB leader will let people know that refunds cannot be given after the order has been placed with whomever is fulfilling, posted in the OP of the thread. It's not so much as being allowed to refund, as there is no money to refund once orders are placed. I've never seen an issue like this though. Good luck.
It's up to the runner. If you've specified no refunds, then they have to wait and do what they can. If you have already spent their money on getting their product, then they have to wait. If you can help them sell the spot, do it.
Generally, they should wait, as they know what a GB entails.
Thanks for the reply.I have done refund for him. It is very frustrating. He complained in paypal with the reason non-receipt. I never consider people doing things like this.I think i will put the rule in the group buy thread next time.
Pretty **** move imo, but you'll have those kind of people regardless if you state it or not. Good luck in the future.
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What an *******
Sorry about that man
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PayPal disputed should be a last resort when a GB runner goes missing/unresponsive AND the end of the 180day period is nearing.
This can also have an impact on your PayPal account ... very ruthless move.
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I think you should out him... prevent him from doing that to another GB runner. If you just make MOQ and someone backs out, it threatens the whole buy unless the runner is willing to take up the slack.
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Huh. Weird. Usually if people don't want their product anymore they just wait until the item arrives and sell it themselves. I've seen some cancellations on other GBs before, but it's usually completed by selling their spot to someone else.
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I usually don't encourage this, but it's time to name a shame the fool.
Having a rule in your GB will not protect you. They can still open a dispute and PayPal will not care about your rules. PayPal doesn't want to deal with GBs, and last I checked they are actually against the PP terms of service. The GB format only works if everyone understands it is not a retail transaction (except of course, when it is... companies running "group buys").
So future GB organizers need to be able to deny this person upfront.
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PayPal doesn't understand what a group buy is, and the same goes for new users/first-time members of a group buy.
A group buy is NOT someone selling keycaps (for example) to a bunch of other people. It is a bunch of people pooling their money to buy something that has a minimum order quantity (MOQ). Therefore, when someone send money in to the leader, they are joining the group buy, not buying anything from the leader.
So when someone asks for a refund, what they are really doing is saying to the person collecting money on everyone's behalf, "can you give me some of YOUR money because I changed my mind?"
Can you get a "refund" from Massdrop?
If the drop is still active, you can cancel your order from the transactions page in your Massdrop account. If the drop has ended, we are unable to cancel your order because the group's order has already been submitted to the vendor and cannot be revised.
https://helpdesk.massdrop.com/hc/en-us/articles/212495708-How-can-I-cancel-my-order-
That means that before MOQ has been met and the order placed, a member can back out. The same should apply here. But once MOQ has been met, anyone who thinks they made a mistake should, IMHO, try to sell their position and/or the goods from the group buy.
People join a Group Buy. Once they have joined, and the money has been collected, they are in.
People who don't want to join should buy their keycaps from a vendor who can sell (and make refunds) on a retail basis.
The person who asked for a refund from the OP either was mistaken or took advantage of a first-time group buy leader. Since he went the PayPal route let's assume the latter. In that case, the OP is doing no favors to future group buy leaders by keeping the offender's name a secret.
YMMV; the above was my opinion after running a some of the biggest group buys ever.
- Ron | samwisekoi
Auto-typed by my GH-122 keyboard.
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After the Ivan fiasco, the mods attempted to solicit suggestions on improving the group buy system. Most of the suggestions were on how to ensure the buyer was reasonably protected (which was understandable considering what had just happened), but I had tried to advocate for the leader too. To me, if the leader has done their bit correctly and the money is already sent to the manufacture, then it's not ok for the buyer to ask for a refund. But with Paypal rules being what they are and the lack of community support for banning that practice, I don't think you currently have a lot of choice.
Unfortunately I don't think any of the suggestions ever got implemented.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=80867.msg2119768#msg2119768