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geekhack Community => Other Geeky Stuff => Topic started by: bhtooefr on Sun, 31 January 2010, 21:50:20

Title: Unix workstations
Post by: bhtooefr on Sun, 31 January 2010, 21:50:20
I figure there's gotta be appreciation for Unix workstations around here.

What I've got is all Sun, but...

leydenjar - RDI PowerLite 50. It's a laptop clone of the SPARCclassic. 50 MHz microSPARC, 32 MiB RAM, two 525 MB SCSI hard drives, cgthree framebuffer with a 640x480 LCD, and a full-stroke keyboard that doesn't feel half bad, with some form of Alps switches, but they're not the normal Alps. I'm running Solaris 2.5.1, the last supported version for the PowerLite, on it, although the only thing that 2.5.1 really gets me over newer versions is the power management software... that I don't even use. Go figure. I've also got two more PowerLites with... issues... One's a parts donor, the other's probably fixable.

sparcgap - This was my first Unix workstation. A Sun Ultra 1 200E, so 200 MHz UltraSPARC I, 832 MiB RAM, a 50 GB drive, Creator3D FFB1 framebuffer, a Sun Type 5c (rubber dome, but a pretty good one) keyboard, and Solaris 9.

brescia - Sun Blade 2500 silver. Dual 1.6 GHz UltraSPARC IIIis, 8 GiB RAM, 73 GB 10k RPM SCSI drive, my Scorpius M10 for a keyboard, and right now an XVR-600 graphics card, although I've got a Radeon 7000 Mac Edition on the way, to convert into an XVR-100. It's running Solaris Express Community Edition build 130 right now, but that's rather unstable - once I get an XVR-100 in here, I'll be able to run OpenSolaris, which should be more stable.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: kishy on Sun, 31 January 2010, 22:02:54
...which gives me a good opening to ask what the heck I should do with my Blade 1000?!?

Dual 700MHz UltraSPARC IIIs, 2GB RAM, 36GB 10k RPM FCAL HDD, Xpert 3D Lite graphics (fortunately granting me a normal VGA connector). Has a clean Solaris 10 install, not sure of build. Even have SunPCi II card available but the fan motor screams.

It's rated for peak power consumption of 9 amps so I'm concerned about what idle might be...it's a beast. Wouldn't want to run up the electricity bill too high lol.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: D-EJ915 on Sun, 31 January 2010, 22:13:59
you can stick the newer blade 2000 procs in the 1000s just FYI

you can check out my website for my ridiculous amount of Unix machines :)
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: bhtooefr on Sun, 31 January 2010, 22:32:13
Annoyingly, that Expert3D means... no OpenSolaris for you.

You can use it like a normal desktop, although those 700 MHz CPUs might hold you back. There is a current Flash Player for Solaris SPARC.

You can obviously play around with Unix on it, or run a server off of it.

And, they're useful for heat, when you want heat. ;)

D-EJ915: You're on Nekochan, too, right?

Anyway, IIRC, early Blade 1000 motherboards have problems with the Blade 2000 procs. But, most of them are the same revision, IIRC.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: kishy on Mon, 01 February 2010, 04:35:17
Quote from: D-EJ915;155266
you can stick the newer blade 2000 procs in the 1000s just FYI

you can check out my website for my ridiculous amount of Unix machines :)


Bah, that would cost money.

Supposedly these machines are valuable and I got it for a Kishy-approved price :)

Quote from: bhtooefr;155268
Annoyingly, that Expert3D means... no OpenSolaris for you.

You can use it like a normal desktop, although those 700 MHz CPUs might hold you back. There is a current Flash Player for Solaris SPARC.

You can obviously play around with Unix on it, or run a server off of it.

And, they're useful for heat, when you want heat. ;)

D-EJ915: You're on Nekochan, too, right?

Anyway, IIRC, early Blade 1000 motherboards have problems with the Blade 2000 procs. But, most of them are the same revision, IIRC.


There's a rather dumb problem (more likely with my understanding of things than anything) where the ethernet interface isn't being recognized by Solaris as existing at all. Server use was what I was thinking, but I wouldn't want to do that because it has the potential to double our electric bill (which is why I started trying to repurpose a thin client to do that instead since it should be less than 6 bucks per month in electricity if I did the math right).

Ultimately, it's quite likely I'll sell the beast...at 70lbs I'll have difficulty shipping it though.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: kode on Mon, 01 February 2010, 05:59:22
Quote from: kishy;155265
...which gives me a good opening to ask what the heck I should do with my Blade 1000?!?

Dual 700MHz UltraSPARC IIIs, 2GB RAM, 36GB 10k RPM FCAL HDD, Xpert 3D Lite graphics (fortunately granting me a normal VGA connector). Has a clean Solaris 10 install, not sure of build. Even have SunPCi II card available but the fan motor screams.

It's rated for peak power consumption of 9 amps so I'm concerned about what idle might be...it's a beast. Wouldn't want to run up the electricity bill too high lol.


At the computer club I think we run two of them on the same 10A line as a bunch of other computers, and I don't think it's ever tripped from that.

Pretty nice machines, but they sure aren't quiet.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ch_123 on Mon, 01 February 2010, 07:02:44
I have an Indy. It's an awesome machine, but it needs a load more RAM, which I don't have the money for at the moment.

There's loads of Sun machines around my college... Seem kind of boring to be honest.

I'd love to have either an RS/6000, or some sort of AlphaStation.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: kode on Mon, 01 February 2010, 08:52:45
Might as well list what I own personally... An SGI O2 and two Sun Ultra10. The Ultra10s run without monitors because I use them as servers, or at least plan to. I don't really feel the need for solaris as a desktop OS and I don't really have a 13W3 converter handy. The O2 I could theoretically run framebuffer on, but I figure it'll be some sort of server too, because if I were to run it for workstation purposes, I'd run IRIX on it, and I'm not really willing to risk it, seeing as IRIX isn't really secure these days. OpenBSD works fine on it, though :)
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: iMav on Mon, 01 February 2010, 10:57:24
I was a UNIX admin in a former life (managing a variety of OS's including:  AIX, UNICOS, Irix, HP/UX, Solaris, etc)...The last UNIX workstation I used/owned personally was an Ultra 5.  It currently sits on my desk as a stand for my printer.  :)

Modern PC hardware + Linux simply provides me much more horsepower / $$ / watt then I can get with anything else.  Although I completely understand the appeal of keeping these old beasts alive and functional.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ch_123 on Mon, 01 February 2010, 14:15:20
I think I might convert my Indy into a terminal for the servers I connect into in college. Even if only for the start up jingle -

> type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="425" height="344">[/YOUTUBE]

Much more dramatic sounding IRL.

EDIT: Damn, why wont the embed work...
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ricercar on Mon, 01 February 2010, 14:17:11
Quote from: imav's .sig
En casa de herrero, cuchillo de palo


In house of blacksmith, wood knife?
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: itlnstln on Mon, 01 February 2010, 14:18:53
Quote from: ricercar;155386
In house of blacksmith, wood knife?

Close, there is a little lost in the translation.  It's one of the many takes on "the cobbler's children go barefoot" cliches.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: LaCap on Tue, 02 February 2010, 08:31:07
Ahhhh I want a Sparc Workstation :(
But in France it's a little bit hard to find a Sun Workstation...
Still Waiting.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ch_123 on Wed, 03 February 2010, 18:59:07
I actually threw one out in a skip this morning =P

There's a few problems with them, first is that everything is proprietary. I dont want to use their crappy keyboards and mice etc. Also, as Solaris is open source, you can run it on anything and get the same effect.

Still waiting on that Alphastation... Native VMS here I come!
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: D-EJ915 on Wed, 03 February 2010, 20:34:59
Sun mice rule, not sure what you're talking about lol.  I do agree their rubber domes are rather lackluster but my compact 1 is super cool at least haha.

If you have a correct older sparcstation (10,20, etc.) you can run NextStep on it which I have on mine along with Solaris 7.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ch_123 on Wed, 03 February 2010, 20:39:48
Ok, they're alright, but nothing to write home about really.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: bhtooefr on Wed, 03 February 2010, 20:53:41
I find the Type 5c to be quite decent for a rubber dome.

But, if you have a USB Sun, you don't need a Sun keyboard except to issue Stop-A, and my Blade 2500 has that particular issue worked around with a quick setenv auto-boot? false.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: kishy on Wed, 03 February 2010, 21:16:10
Sun Crossbow USB = a surprisingly good ball mouse. It's one of not a whole lot that I can tolerate using (I have a small shoebox of acceptable ones, so maybe I put up with more than most).

Type 6 USB keyboard = a surprisingly bad rubber dome keyboard, considering the near-$10,000 price tag on the computer when it was new.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: megarat on Sun, 07 February 2010, 22:43:17
While I got out of the game a long time ago, I used to be pretty big into playing around with and/or restoring old Unix workstations, particularly SGIs.  Going from memory, my random retrocomputing walk brought into my life:

SGI:


(http://www.megarat.com/technojournal/onyx/onyxparty/im000025.jpg)

(http://www.megarat.com/technojournal/onyx/onyxparty/im000048.jpg)

Other:


I'm not counting generic Linux boxes or experiments with putting NetBSD on older Macs (including a pair of Quadra 700s that worked as rock-solid DNS servers, and a tricked-out quad-boot SE/30 (System 6.08, System 7.1, System 8.1, and NetBSD ... ah, what a machine).
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ricercar on Sun, 07 February 2010, 23:13:53
Quote from: kishy;156099
Sun Crossbow USB = a surprisingly good ball mouse.



S'okay. I just bought one out of a dollar bin, 'cause I needed a 3 button USB controller. I might not destroy this one after all. It's very low.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ch_123 on Mon, 08 February 2010, 04:12:40
Quote from: megarat;156993
While I got out of the game a long time ago, I used to be pretty big into playing around with and/or restoring old Unix workstations, particularly SGIs.  Going from memory, my random retrocomputing walk brought into my life:

SGI:

  • Indigo:  Many of them (6+), R3k through R4.4k, and incorporated almost every option board available, including the Chyron Centaur and Galileo Video (this was a fabulously fun hobby computer, and even I built a web site about SGI Indigo fun facts (http://www.megarat.com/indigo/) which has been up for over a decade and still gets a fair amount of traffic today)
  • Indy, R5k Webforce (first a home development box for prototyping a project with some friends, then a long-standing web server)
  • Challenge S, R4600 Webforce (my home firewall for many, many years)
  • Power Series 4D/310 VGX (33MHz R3k) (project computer, went nowhere)
  • Onyx, 2xR4400 RE (I had four of these that I procured from Boeing Surplus, for the sake of restoring them and selling them back to the SGI hobbyist community; the project had mixed results, but was very memorable)


Nice stuff. I've become quite interested in SGI stuff myself recently (seems to be a pretty trendy thing to do amongst UNIX nerds). I was considering upgrading my Indy, but the parts are so expensive that it would be more worthwhile to buy a new one... I'm thinking of getting a Fuel at some point.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ironcoder on Mon, 08 February 2010, 05:03:57
Quote from: megarat;156993
While I got out of the game a long time ago, I used to be pretty big into playing around with and/or restoring old Unix workstations, particularly SGIs.  Going from memory, my random retrocomputing walk brought into my life:



SparcBook- cool!
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ch_123 on Mon, 08 February 2010, 13:53:21
Quote from: megarat;156993
Show Image
(http://www.megarat.com/technojournal/onyx/onyxparty/im000048.jpg)


Is that large red thing a fire extinguishing unit?
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ironcoder on Mon, 08 February 2010, 13:55:40
No, it's an air compressor.

I have one, and air tools are the cat's meow. Unbelievable torque and super quality if you get good stuff.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: kode on Mon, 08 February 2010, 14:01:47
Speaking of the Onyx, I'm sort of trying to get rid of two Onyx racks at the moment... Which is sort of proving harder than it really should be. Unfortunately, it seems few SGI enthusiasts around here really have the space required anymore...
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ironcoder on Mon, 08 February 2010, 14:03:00
That's what outbuildings are for.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: kishy on Mon, 08 February 2010, 14:04:27
Wow...I thought a Blade 1000 was big (and indeed they are; they make good seating in fact).
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ch_123 on Mon, 08 February 2010, 14:15:56
Quote from: ironcoder;157068
No, it's an air compressor.

I have one, and air tools are the cat's meow. Unbelievable torque and super quality if you get good stuff.


Now see, I was thinking of this -



It's a fire extinguishing unit in my college's HPC centre. The picture is taken at a weird angle, which makes it and myself look smaller than they really are, but bare in mind that I'm about 6.2' - 6.3' tall, and that should give you an idea of how big it was.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ricercar on Mon, 08 February 2010, 14:28:56
The Indigo has the BEST setup documentation in the history of Mankind. You open up the box, and there's a poster, no words, with a clearly defined pictorial setup. I've aspired to write such a perfect doc ever since I opened up an Indigo the first time.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ironcoder on Mon, 08 February 2010, 14:34:42
Quote from: ch_123;157077
Now see, I was thinking of this -

It's a fire extinguishing unit in my college's HPC centre. The picture is taken at a weird angle, which makes it and myself look smaller than they really are, but bare in mind that I'm about 6.2' - 6.3' tall, and that should give you an idea of how big it was.


Yeah well you're looking very pale there matey, get some sun!
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: itlnstln on Mon, 08 February 2010, 14:39:55
What sun?  I didn't the sun for the whole four years I lived in the UK.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: itlnstln on Mon, 08 February 2010, 14:40:47
Quote from: ch_123;157077
Show Image
(http://geekhack.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=7780&d=1265659967)

Don't you EVER show your face around here again!
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ch_123 on Mon, 08 February 2010, 14:55:07
Quote from: ironcoder;157087
Yeah well you're looking very pale there matey, get some sun!


You're obviously unaware of our climate :P
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ch_123 on Mon, 08 February 2010, 14:56:35
Quote from: itlnstln;157092
What sun?  I didn't the sun for the whole four years I lived in the UK.


This. Our recent summers have been defined by monsoon-like weather.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: megarat on Mon, 08 February 2010, 17:48:20
Quote from: ironcoder;157013
SparcBook- cool!

Actually ... I think I still have this kicking around someplace if you want it.  You'd pay for shipping only, assuming I can dig it up.  I can't vouch for it's working condition, however, although I can probably test it, and you'll need to reinstall the OS or otherwise hack root.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: megarat on Mon, 08 February 2010, 17:57:12
Quote from: ricercar;157082
The Indigo has the BEST setup documentation in the history of Mankind. You open up the box, and there's a poster, no words, with a clearly defined pictorial setup. I've aspired to write such a perfect doc ever since I opened up an Indigo the first time.


Ah yes ... while technically they did also include printed, spiral-bound manuals with the Indigo, that poster was legendary.  For a jog down memory lane, here's a pic of the one I had:



I bought my first Indigo second-hand in 1996 ($2k for an R3k Entry!); it was pristine and still in the box, and included everything original.  Just a lovely piece of kit, it still brings smiles to my face.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: megarat on Mon, 08 February 2010, 18:00:59
Quote from: ironcoder;157068
No, it's an air compressor.

I have one, and air tools are the cat's meow. Unbelievable torque and super quality if you get good stuff.

What he (she?) said.  Not mine, but I wish it was.

(On that night, a friend and I cloned some hard disks via network installation and tested all the units.  My house didn't have a trustworthy 20A outlet in my workshop at the time, so my friend volunteered his place.  It's not the only time his tools/workshop have come in handy.  I'll be using his plasma cutter on Wednesday for a keyboard project, in fact.)
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: megarat on Mon, 08 February 2010, 18:05:11
Quote from: kode;157069
Speaking of the Onyx, I'm sort of trying to get rid of two Onyx racks at the moment... Which is sort of proving harder than it really should be. Unfortunately, it seems few SGI enthusiasts around here really have the space required anymore...

Bummer, dude.  You should probably just start rigging one of those up to serve as your coffin.

Getting rid of those four desksides was enough of a PITA (and that was back in 2003-04, when I could still sell them for a few hundred bucks) ... I can't imagine trying to part with a pair of full-size racks.

(Re: "trying to part with a pair of full-size racks" ... is this where ripster responds with an image-joke?)
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: msiegel on Mon, 08 February 2010, 18:15:36
Quote from: megarat;157133
I'll be using his plasma cutter on Wednesday for a keyboard project


:) yay
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: megarat on Mon, 08 February 2010, 18:16:32
Quote from: ch_123;157008
Nice stuff. I've become quite interested in SGI stuff myself recently (seems to be a pretty trendy thing to do amongst UNIX nerds).

And who can blame them?  :)

From a user point of view, those computers are still enormously fun a decade-plus later.  I don't know of any other retrocomputing platform that has such a large hobbyist community as that of older SGIs*.

*I mean this in proportion to the size of its original customer/user base.  There are probably heaps more Amiga/etc. enthusiasts out there today, but those computers also moved 1-2 orders of magnitude more units than SGIs.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: bhtooefr on Mon, 08 February 2010, 18:30:24
Right, but SGI had a much smaller userbase. (Then again, the name SGI is still being used for modern, non-retrocomputing market hardware.)
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: megarat on Mon, 08 February 2010, 18:33:33
Quote from: webwit;157138
Google trends (http://www.google.com/trends?q=amiga%2Csgi&ctab=0&geo=all&date=all&sort=0).


That's a cool facility, I didn't know about that.  Thanks for the reference.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: megarat on Mon, 08 February 2010, 18:34:24
Quote from: bhtooefr;157139
(Then again, the name SGI is still being used for modern, non-retrocomputing market hardware.)


Alas.  It's like watching a friend die of TB.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: bhtooefr on Mon, 08 February 2010, 19:00:05
Quote from: megarat;157141
Alas.  It's like watching a friend die of TB.


I didn't say that SGI was still around, for a reason.

I've never gotten into SGI stuff, but maybe I should play with some of it some time...
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ricercar on Mon, 08 February 2010, 21:06:10
thanks a TON for the Indigo poster pics. I've never gone looking for online pics, now I don't have to.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: D-EJ915 on Mon, 08 February 2010, 21:41:54
Quote from: bhtooefr;157145
I didn't say that SGI was still around, for a reason.

I've never gotten into SGI stuff, but maybe I should play with some of it some time...
I've got a few I don't use if you want one
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: megarat on Mon, 08 February 2010, 23:25:01
Quote from: ricercar;157161
thanks a TON for the Indigo poster pics. I've never gone looking for online pics, now I don't have to.


Da nada, happy to help.  Those photos were just from when I put my final Indigo on eBay ... I should've taken proper photos of them, because I think they're now scarcer than the proverbial hen's teeth.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ch_123 on Tue, 09 February 2010, 04:27:01
Has anyone used a Fuel? I was thinking of getting a second SGI at some point, and the Fuel seems to be the best value for money option.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: ironcoder on Tue, 09 February 2010, 04:53:43
Quote from: megarat;157130
Actually ... I think I still have this kicking around someplace if you want it.  You'd pay for shipping only, assuming I can dig it up.  I can't vouch for it's working condition, however, although I can probably test it, and you'll need to reinstall the OS or otherwise hack root.

Thanks for the generous offer, I didn't see this post until now.

I will have to take a raincheck, I have too many projects and not enough time (or space). I wouldn't want to take it and then not do anything with it.

Thank you.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: megarat on Tue, 09 February 2010, 10:25:26
Quote from: ch_123;157206
Has anyone used a Fuel? I was thinking of getting a second SGI at some point, and the Fuel seems to be the best value for money option.


I haven't, although I've always been more attracted to the Octane2.  While it's an older computer, it's SMP, it supports more memory, and has more expansion potential (i.e., it would probably be more fun).

But that's just me.  You probably know this already, but the Nekochan forum would be the best place to get a recommendation in this area.
Title: Unix workstations
Post by: bhtooefr on Tue, 09 February 2010, 17:37:52
BTW, on a Tadpole machine, if you don't hack root, and instead do a clean install, you'll need (IIRC) the latest release of Solaris 2.6 - nothing older, nothing newer - unless you can obtain Tadpole media. And, I'm not sure if that'll work on something older than a SPARCbook 3.