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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: WhenIWasYourAge on Mon, 27 February 2017, 21:54:47

Title: Unicomp 104-key Right Alt/Windows Key Reversed
Post by: WhenIWasYourAge on Mon, 27 February 2017, 21:54:47
Hi, new lurker and first time poster.  I caught the disease a few weeks ago and am about to open the wallet and go nuts.  I want a new buckling spring so thought I'd start with a Unicomp.  (At this point just want off the shelf stuff instead of buying used Model Ms and restoring).

If I go with their modernized 104-key layout, I notice that the right Alt and right Windows keys are switched around.  On pretty much every other keyboard, the two Alt keys surround the space bar.  I asked if they could customize the keyboard and switch them, but they said it wasn't feasible.

I've seen pics on geekhack where the layout is correct and was wondering how you guys accomplished that.  Is it as simple as switching the keycaps and then using some kind of keymapping software or hardware?

If there's no way around this, I'll get the old school 101-key layout.

[attachimg=1]
Title: Re: Unicomp 104-key Right Alt/Windows Key Reversed
Post by: opensecret on Mon, 27 February 2017, 22:42:55
Reversing the keys in software is pretty straightforward -- Keytweak or Autohotkey can both do what you want on a Windows PC.  (Keytweak is easier to use; Autohotkey is more powerful but it takes a little study to understand how to write scripts that do what you want.)  But it looks as if those two keycaps aren't the same size, so switching them wouldn't work. But you can buy blank replacement keycaps in your choice of width and color from Unicomp.  I use a couple  of modifier keycaps from Unicomp on my Model M to get the layout the way I want it.
Title: Re: Unicomp 104-key Right Alt/Windows Key Reversed
Post by: WhenIWasYourAge on Mon, 27 February 2017, 23:57:49
Thanks for the Keytweak or Autohotkey suggestions.  Those may come in handy in the future.  Looks like the 103-key may be a good compromise.  All it takes off is the right Windows key, but it's the correct layout.  No mods on my end would be needed.
Title: Re: Unicomp 104-key Right Alt/Windows Key Reversed
Post by: y11971alex on Tue, 28 February 2017, 02:56:49
I think Unicomp designed it this way so that they only need to introduce a new barrel for the Windows key on the right side and shorten the spacebar.

The alternative would be to redesign the entire bottom row, since the 104 layout has 7 keys of the same width; this would necessitate moving all the barrels.
Title: Re: Unicomp 104-key Right Alt/Windows Key Reversed
Post by: chyros on Tue, 28 February 2017, 08:15:01
The 2006 Unicomp I have has a very normal layout, but apparently they don't do that anymore. I've been told this is because of keycap compatibility or something, but I think it's a pretty poor decision.

Title: Re: Unicomp 104-key Right Alt/Windows Key Reversed
Post by: keytohopiness on Tue, 28 February 2017, 10:00:07
Why don't they reprint the caps? 
Title: Re: Unicomp 104-key Right Alt/Windows Key Reversed
Post by: y11971alex on Tue, 28 February 2017, 10:35:51
Unicomp has been known to produce caps with questionable legend alignment.  It is suspected that this is a problem due to the age of their equipment.
Title: Re: Unicomp 104-key Right Alt/Windows Key Reversed
Post by: fohat.digs on Wed, 01 March 2017, 18:45:48
Quote from: chyros on Tue, 28 February 2017, 08:15:01

The 2006 Unicomp I have has a very normal layout,


I also have a 2006 Unicomp, plain ordinary beige model, and it is laid out like this one. I would not want it different.

I think that lot_lizard's project will mix 1.0u and 1.5u caps on the bottom row, but it will be worth it.
Title: Re: Unicomp 104-key Right Alt/Windows Key Reversed
Post by: Tactile on Fri, 03 March 2017, 08:51:57
Some time back Unicomp changed the available layouts in order to streamline their production and reduce the different parts required for different layout keyboards.
[attach=1]
Title: Re: Unicomp 104-key Right Alt/Windows Key Reversed
Post by: chyros on Fri, 03 March 2017, 13:02:58
Quote from: Tactile on Fri, 03 March 2017, 08:51:57
Some time back Unicomp changed the available layouts in order to streamline their production and reduce the different parts required for different layout keyboards.
(Attachment Link)
All the more reason why 101/102-key is best! :D
Title: Re: Unicomp 104-key Right Alt/Windows Key Reversed
Post by: ander on Fri, 03 March 2017, 16:10:15
Or just buy a used correct-layout 104 on eBay, wipe down the keys with alcohol, and have the same thing. It's not like these are going to stop working anytime soon.
Title: Re: Unicomp 104-key Right Alt/Windows Key Reversed
Post by: Snowdog993 on Fri, 03 March 2017, 23:22:27
Quote from: chyros on Fri, 03 March 2017, 13:02:58
Quote from: Tactile on Fri, 03 March 2017, 08:51:57
Some time back Unicomp changed the available layouts in order to streamline their production and reduce the different parts required for different layout keyboards.
(Attachment Link)
All the more reason why 101/102-key is best! :D
That's why I like the 103.
It actually kept with the traditional 101.
(http://i.imgur.com/YEIA2Ul.jpg)
Title: Re: Unicomp 104-key Right Alt/Windows Key Reversed
Post by: happylacquer on Sat, 04 March 2017, 04:37:49
Quote from: WhenIWasYourAge on Mon, 27 February 2017, 21:54:47
Hi, new lurker and first time poster.  I caught the disease a few weeks ago and am about to open the wallet and go nuts.  I want a new buckling spring so thought I'd start with a Unicomp.  (At this point just want off the shelf stuff instead of buying used Model Ms and restoring).

If I go with their modernized 104-key layout, I notice that the right Alt and right Windows keys are switched around.  On pretty much every other keyboard, the two Alt keys surround the space bar.  I asked if they could customize the keyboard and switch them, but they said it wasn't feasible.

I've seen pics on geekhack where the layout is correct and was wondering how you guys accomplished that.  Is it as simple as switching the keycaps and then using some kind of keymapping software or hardware?

If there's no way around this, I'll get the old school 101-key layout.

(Attachment Link)

It's dead simple to pull those two caps off and switch them. So is remapping them in software.

My unicomp is software mapped to have no caps lock, but ctrl where caps is. And it's 103 key. Which, there's no reason to buy a 103 key from them for a $10 fee, unless you really think you can't figure out popping off one the spacebar and putting another one on (you probably can even if you're worried you can't) which saves you $7 and you can switch between 104 and 103 as you please.

103 key is superior because the longer space bar gets more use than those two dummy keys. I literally never use right side win key.

Don't forget to get a geek hack key when you place a unicomp order. They're only 80 cents and very cool.

(http://i.imgur.com/nmYaFFW.jpg)
Title: Re: Unicomp 104-key Right Alt/Windows Key Reversed
Post by: fohat.digs on Sat, 04 March 2017, 07:32:09
Quote from: Snowdog993 on Fri, 03 March 2017, 23:22:27

That's why I like the 103.
It actually kept with the traditional 101.
Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/YEIA2Ul.jpg)


As I understand it, lot_lizard's layout will be this style.