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geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: didjamatic on Sun, 21 March 2010, 08:51:38

Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: didjamatic on Sun, 21 March 2010, 08:51:38: This is a tribute to nipple nubs which are a prominent, raised bump in the center of the key, rather than a bar at the base of the key. This helps you feel your way to home row very easily. At first you might think they would be an annoyance, but you quickly get used to them and are annoyed at keyboards that lack them after a while. Some Compaq MX1800's have them. I made a similar thread (http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?t=8122) in ebay finds a while ago but wanted to make a separate thread as a tribute to MX1800 nipple nubs and to hopefully find a solution for other keyboards that lack them.

Nipple Nubs:
(http://pds2.egloos.com/pds/1/200510/29/06/c0025306_10172712.jpg)

Bar Nubs:
(http://www.soulshadow.com/ebay/compaq/100_2472.JPG)

I'm sure this person appreciates them due to their layout choice. F J and 5 on the keypad are properly nubbed.
(http://pds5.egloos.com/pds/200707/10/35/b0037335_11073774.jpg)

I have been trying to find some very small stainless steel half BB's (like some shot for shotgun shells, but half-spheres instead of full spheres) to experiment with super-gluing them to the center of keys on home row. But haven't had luck. Grinding down a regular BB would be a task my finger tips are not up for. I suppose you could heat them up and press them into the key.

Anyone have ideas on making nipple nubs on non-nubbed or bar nubbed keys? It would be easy enough to grind or sand a bar nub down so you have a smooth key to install the nipple nub.

Maybe someone makes some small plastic dome stickers of some kind that could be used, or something similar to Braille stickers?
(http://www.hooleon.com/miva/graphics/00000001/ov-0610-200.jpg)
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: Rajagra on Sun, 21 March 2010, 09:04:25: I agree, the nubs on that Compaq are the best I've ever encountered. They aren't big, but they are so obvious to the touch, almost as if they are sharp (but they aren't.)
I think the trick is they poke right into the ridges of your fingerprints and tickle your fingertips. Sheer bloody genius. The 'bar' style can't do that, so they feel less obvious even though they are larger.

As an alternative I had good results using domed stick-on rubber feet (http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?p=118500#post118500). Just find a size that suits your taste.

EDIT> Here's a thought. You know those round-headed pins they use when packing shirts? You could heat one up while holding it in pliers, and melt an opening through the middle of the keycap. Once you are through, or have made a hole deep enough, you could insert another one of the pins that has been cut short.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: hyperlinked on Sun, 21 March 2010, 10:22:48: What the bump is or where the bump is doesn't seem to really be a problem for me as long as I take a little time to get used to it. I like the bar better because it feels less obtrusive.

Back when Apple used to put the nub on the middle finger instead of the index finger, I had to switch the f/g and h/j keycaps on PC keyboards until I got tired of doing so and just decided to get used to it. It didn't take long, but now I can't type on an old AEK II without switching keycaps for the opposite reason. In a week it'd probably be no big deal again.

Like Ripster, I use my left pinky sometimes, but it's rarely a problem for me to have to find position again with my left hand. It's harder to use your right pinky to center because the adjacent keys are the same shape. I need a bar or nub more on my right and given I do a fair amount of Photoshop sometimes, I do need to move back and forth to the mouse quickly on a regular basis.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: Rajagra on Sun, 21 March 2010, 10:46:39: Quote from: hyperlinked;165859
I like the bar better because it feels less obtrusive.

My issue with the bars - especially when they are placed too close to the edge of the key - is that they work OK for confirming you are in the right place, but are pretty useless for getting there quickly. They are too subtle for that, though some are worse than others (cough DAS3 cough.)

Compare the DAS3 bar below with either of the 2 Compaq keycaps above. (The rubber foot is what I was compelled to add.)

(http://geekhack.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=4570&d=1253127052)
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: didjamatic on Sun, 21 March 2010, 14:00:02: Rajara, both of those mods are great options - I like the pin because it would be pretty easy to center vs. gluing a BB. And those silicone pads look like a great option, I think I might try that.

What was Welly trying to accomplish with that Velcro?
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: didjamatic on Sun, 21 March 2010, 14:19:16: I think that worn down one Ripster posted was from a Next keyboard. I've been wanting one of those for some time but now I have another reason to get one... I never noticed their nubs.
(http://farm1.static.flickr.com/70/157914408_dfc43b84e0_o.jpg)
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: kishy on Sun, 21 March 2010, 14:35:57: Quote from: ripster;165868
Plus there's Welly's Velcro mod.

Shagadelic Baby!
Show Image
(http://www.gesticulations.com/public/gallery/Images/endurapro/DSCN0248%20%28Medium%29.JPG)

Hmmmm.

Something's missing here. Red abrasive knob.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: hyperlinked on Sun, 21 March 2010, 14:38:00: BTW, anyone know how the fingertip nub got started and how it ended up as a bar later on?
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: whininggit on Sun, 21 March 2010, 14:38:18: I wonder what dicates the round nub vs bar on the MX-11800. It doesn't appear to be age - I have one with the non-colour-coded connectors (like the top one) but it has bars.

Personally, I'm a fan of the deep-scooped keys that Cherry use.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: didjamatic on Sun, 21 March 2010, 14:58:05: Yep, I just checked my Apple Extended M0115 and it has nipple nubs (though not nearly as prominent as on the Compaq's) on D and K for middle fingers instead of F and J for index fingers.

So Next and Apple Extended are 2 ALPS sources for nipple nubs and Compaq MX1800 for Cherry.

Quote from: whininggit;165928
I wonder what dicates the round nub vs bar on the MX-11800. It doesn't appear to be age - I have one with the non-colour-coded connectors (like the top one) but it has bars.

I can check the digits on the Compaq's I have at work, they all have nipple nubs. I just sold a MX-1800 but it had bars on it.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: DreymaR on Mon, 22 March 2010, 03:18:47: You mentioned the Braille stickers. If you get a set of those from Hooleon, you could use the one that has a single dot I guess? Or are they too expensive for you?
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: didjamatic on Mon, 22 March 2010, 08:42:15: The braille stickers could work but stickers wouldn't be very durable. I think the 2 ideas Raj posted would work really well. Or you could give your board pubes with the Welly velcro mod but that's not my cup of tea. I'm particularly tempted to try melting the pins into the keys, that would be what I envisioned - having 2 metal shiny nubs on the centers of F and J. There might be some small earrings that you could do that with as well, diamond studs would work well on a Topre.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: itlnstln on Mon, 22 March 2010, 09:11:31: Quote from: Rajagra;165846
I agree, the nubs on that Compaq are the best I've ever encountered. They aren't big, but they are so obvious to the touch, almost as if they are sharp (but they aren't.)
I think the trick is they poke right into the ridges of your fingerprints and tickle your fingertips. Sheer bloody genius. The 'bar' style can't do that, so they feel less obvious even though they are larger.

QFT. The MX11800 nubs are the greatest.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: Rajagra on Mon, 22 March 2010, 09:45:19: I did a quick test, and the idea with the pins can work:

You can see where my aim was bad at one point. :smile:

When I tried heating the rounded end to create a countersink hole in the keycap, it burst into flames! Seems the head is really quite small and coated with a blob of plastic for pushing on.

That actually works out well, the flatter head is about the right size. A 1mm drill bit should create a perfect countersink.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: didjamatic on Mon, 22 March 2010, 10:13:42: Rajagra, that is awesome! That standard pin looks great!
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: itlnstln on Mon, 22 March 2010, 10:19:03: So what do you do with the "excess" pin once you get it in the keycap?
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: Rajagra on Mon, 22 March 2010, 11:08:01: Quote from: itlnstln;166135
So what do you do with the "excess" pin once you get it in the keycap?

That's easy. Just photograph it at an angle so it can't be seen. :laugh:
Best thing would be to use sidecutters to cut it short, just leaving enough pin to fill the hole, then glue it in.

Unless you can find a way to bend some of the pin over to secure it.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: ricercar on Mon, 22 March 2010, 11:37:38: Cut the pin short before you glue it in place.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: itlnstln on Mon, 22 March 2010, 11:39:22: Quote from: ripster;166139
The proper response is, "You KNOW where to stick it".

The pin is mightier than the... uh... nevermind.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: EverythingIBM on Mon, 22 March 2010, 17:23:17: Quote from: ripster;165923
Yep, that one was from a NeXT.

Here's that Apple D. That Steve Jobs was such a Joker.
Show Image
(http://geekhack.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=8627&stc=1&d=1269200040)

lol on the D. Blind people could get confused if they were used to it being on F.

I personally hate nubs or bars, I like all of my keys nice and flat. I orientate my fingers by looking at my keyboard.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: DreymaR on Tue, 23 March 2010, 02:56:17: Hooleon claim that their stickers are durable. Never tried them myself, but I suspect that noone else here have either. :)

That pinhead looks fun though.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: itlnstln on Tue, 23 March 2010, 08:23:00: I think Welly and another member used the Hooleon stickers. IIRC, they liked them.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: fastbuck on Tue, 23 March 2010, 15:14:25: Quote from: itlnstln;166304
I think Welly and another member used the Hooleon stickers. IIRC, they liked them.

Can you give the like to Hoolean stickers, I'd like to try some stick on nipples on my Model F and a few Cherry boards and can't find them anywhere
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: didjamatic on Tue, 23 March 2010, 15:22:27: I've never tried them but I would imagine those Hoolean pasties would attract gunk on their edges. But they are a great idea for disabled people looking to use a variety of keyboards and layouts.

I'm pretty stoked to try some pin heads. You could even do multiple pins in a pattern.

(http://etc.usf.edu/clipart/42100/42142/die_03_03_42142_lg.gif)
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: fastbuck on Tue, 23 March 2010, 15:29:33: Quote from: ripster;166126
Ow. I said OWWW!
Show Image
(http://i.ytimg.com/vi/NNYN9WOEqYY/0.jpg)

Where can I see more pictures of her? Need her cell too, thanks!
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: itlnstln on Tue, 23 March 2010, 15:48:51: Quote from: fastbuck;166386
Can you give the like to Hoolean stickers, I'd like to try some stick on nipples on my Model F and a few Cherry boards and can't find them anywhere

Check it (http://www.hooleon.com/menu-accessories.htm#bumps).
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: fastbuck on Tue, 23 March 2010, 16:03:56: Quote from: itlnstln;166403
Check it (http://www.hooleon.com/menu-accessories.htm#bumps).

Thanks, ordered. Now how bout the girl :)
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: didjamatic on Tue, 23 March 2010, 16:30:00: I retract my comment about the Hoolean stickers, they look pretty good. I was thinking they went clear to the edge of the key which often means they hang over in spots which then means they pull up and collect gunk. Those look like they might stay put.

Though I think the pin heads would look better.
Title: Re: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: bsvP585hUO2Y6 on Mon, 29 March 2010, 11:10:49: whininggit wrote on 6045 September 1993:

> I wonder what dicates the round nub vs bar on the MX-11800. It doesn't
> appear to be age - I have one with the non-colour-coded connectors
> (like the top one) but it has bars.

I took a sample everytime I've come across a MX-11800 label and -
according to the resulting table - the discerning factor actually is
age. However, Cherry didn't switch nubs and plugs at the same time:

Code: [Select]
| model | datecode | nub | plugs | keycaps | |---------------+----------+-----+---------+---------| | 11801LPADE/06 | I51 | dot | plain | thick | | 11801LPAUS/11 | J45 | dot | plain | | | 11801LPAUS/11 | J51 | dot | plain | | | 11801LPAUS/12 | K20 | bar | | | | 11801LPAUS/12 | K26 | bar | plain | | | 11802 | L22 | bar | plain | | | 11802LPAUS/01 | L35 | bar | colored | | | 11802LPAUS/01 | L35 | bar | colored | | | 11802LPAUS/01 | L35 | bar | | | | 11802LPADE/01 | L36 | bar | colored | thin | | 11802LPADE/01 | L36 | bar | colored | thin | | 11802LPAUS/02 | L40 | bar | colored | | | 11802LPAUS/03 | M21 | bar | colored | | | 11802LPADE/03 | M25 | bar | colored | thin | | 11802LPAUS/03 | M26 | bar | | | | 11802LPACH/03 | M30 | | colored | | | 11802LPAUS/04 | M42 | bar | colored | |
I guess round nubs automatically come on thick (>1g) keycaps, but
there's not much data in the table to prove this.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: didjamatic on Mon, 29 March 2010, 11:35:33: Here are 3 more. I haven't checked key caps.

11801LPAUS/06 | J03 | Dot | Plain
11801LPAUS/06 | J03 | Dot | Plain
11801LPAUS/12 | K26 | Bar | Plain
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: bitflipper on Mon, 29 March 2010, 18:11:27: Two more:

G80-11801LPAUS/09 | J18 | Dot | Plain
G80-11801LPAUS/12 | K24 | Bar | Plain
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: didjamatic on Mon, 29 March 2010, 18:25:42: So it seems that the Jxx and earlier date code models have dots, Kxx and newer have bars.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: Computer-Lab in Basement on Mon, 29 March 2010, 18:33:52: Quote from: didjamatic;165845
Some Compaq MX1800's have them. I made a similar thread (http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?t=8122) in ebay finds a while ago but wanted to make a separate thread as a tribute to MX1800 nipple nubs and to hopefully find a solution for other keyboards that lack them.

Nipple Nubs:
Show Image
(http://pds2.egloos.com/pds/1/200510/29/06/c0025306_10172712.jpg)

Bar Nubs:
Show Image
(http://www.soulshadow.com/ebay/compaq/100_2472.JPG)

I should see if my MX11800 has those. Chances are it doesn't. But I do believe my Chicony KB-5161 has those nipple nubs. I will have to check that too.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: Computer-Lab in Basement on Mon, 29 March 2010, 18:38:03: Quote from: ripster;166126
Ow. I said OWWW!
Show Image
(http://i.ytimg.com/vi/NNYN9WOEqYY/0.jpg)

Quote from: fastbuck;166394
Where can I see more pictures of her? Need her cell too, thanks!

Agree with fastbuck. Why didn't I read this thread earlier?!?
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: Computer-Lab in Basement on Mon, 29 March 2010, 20:58:19: Quote from: ripster;167937
You're supposed to be looking at the Spreadsheet.

Here she is thinking whether to do the J as well as the F.
Show Image
(http://geekhack.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=8778&stc=1&d=1269908615)

More details please...
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: spolia optima on Tue, 30 March 2010, 19:06:17: I <3 sexually suggestive keyboard features
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: Computer-Lab in Basement on Fri, 02 April 2010, 15:36:22: Ok I have something interesting about these nipple nubs here. My Chicony KB-5161 has bars on the home keys, but a nipple nub on the num pad. I found this to be quite odd.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: didjamatic on Fri, 02 April 2010, 15:38:16: Quote from: Computer-Lab in Basement;169022
Ok I have something interesting about these nipple nubs here. My Chicony KB-5161 has bars on the home keys, but a nipple nub on the num pad. I found this to be quite odd.

As long as your date doesn't have both, you should be ok.
Title: Nipple Nub Tribute
Post by: mrbill on Wed, 28 April 2010, 10:50:01: G80-11802LPAUS / 00 L20 : bars not nubs.

I'm debating ordering some of the stick-on dots for when I put doubleshot keys on my incoming Filco Brown Tenkeyless, to avoid having to do this again:

(http://www.mrbill.net/gh/filco.jpg)