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geekhack Community => Off Topic => Topic started by: tp4tissue on Fri, 23 March 2018, 09:08:21

Title: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: tp4tissue on Fri, 23 March 2018, 09:08:21: Yo Chyros,

If you put bread under Super Heated water 350C in one of those pressure vessels.

Will it toast ?

Does it require oxygen and other gasses ? what if the toast is floating in the space above the super heated water *still inside the vessel*
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: chyros on Fri, 23 March 2018, 09:45:29: I'm having difficulty imagining the setup, and I'm not completely sure about your definition of "toast", but if you mean that the bread acquires that characteristic brown colour and flavour, you do not need oxygen, as this process is a result of intramolecular reactions and not molecular oxidation.

I suspect that at 350 C it might take a while because a toaster gets considerably hotter than that.
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: tp4tissue on Fri, 23 March 2018, 10:10:10: Quote from: chyros on Fri, 23 March 2018, 09:45:29
I'm having difficulty imagining the setup, and I'm not completely sure about your definition of "toast", but if you mean that the bread acquires that characteristic brown colour and flavour, you do not need oxygen, as this process is a result of intramolecular reactions and not molecular oxidation.

I suspect that at 350 C it might take a while because a toaster gets considerably hotter than that.

Hrmm

does super heating vessels have to be clean except for the water inside ?

Or would the introduction of the bread make it unstable..
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: noisyturtle on Fri, 23 March 2018, 11:15:08: Now I actually want to know if a toaster would work in a zero-oxygen environment. I don't see why not, but the act of burning something in that way may actually require oxygen.
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: chyros on Fri, 23 March 2018, 13:22:50: Quote from: tp4tissue on Fri, 23 March 2018, 10:10:10
Quote from: chyros on Fri, 23 March 2018, 09:45:29
I'm having difficulty imagining the setup, and I'm not completely sure about your definition of "toast", but if you mean that the bread acquires that characteristic brown colour and flavour, you do not need oxygen, as this process is a result of intramolecular reactions and not molecular oxidation.

I suspect that at 350 C it might take a while because a toaster gets considerably hotter than that.

Hrmm

does super heating vessels have to be clean except for the water inside ?

Or would the introduction of the bread make it unstable..
Wait, you want the bread actually INSIDE the thing?
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: tp4tissue on Fri, 23 March 2018, 13:27:04: Quote from: chyros on Fri, 23 March 2018, 13:22:50
Quote from: tp4tissue on Fri, 23 March 2018, 10:10:10
Quote from: chyros on Fri, 23 March 2018, 09:45:29
I'm having difficulty imagining the setup, and I'm not completely sure about your definition of "toast", but if you mean that the bread acquires that characteristic brown colour and flavour, you do not need oxygen, as this process is a result of intramolecular reactions and not molecular oxidation.

I suspect that at 350 C it might take a while because a toaster gets considerably hotter than that.

Hrmm

does super heating vessels have to be clean except for the water inside ?

Or would the introduction of the bread make it unstable..
Wait, you want the bread actually INSIDE the thing?

So take the bread, put it in the distilled water, ALL inside the super-heating vessel..
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: dead_pixel_design on Fri, 23 March 2018, 13:40:07: You don't need oxygen to make toast, because heat doesn't require oxygen to radiate. But you can't do it in water. Toasting bread removes the moisture, it's a key part of the process, if you put toast in super heated water you would just be cooking the bread. You would end up with either gross milky bread water, or disgusting cooked, soaked bread.
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: tp4tissue on Fri, 23 March 2018, 13:46:44: Quote from: dead_pixel_design on Fri, 23 March 2018, 13:40:07
You don't need oxygen to make toast, because heat doesn't require oxygen to radiate. But you can't do it in water. Toasting bread removes the moisture, it's a key part of the process, if you put toast in super heated water you would just be cooking the bread. You would end up with either gross milky bread water, or disgusting cooked, soaked bread.

Hrrmm.. i suppose we need to define the Toast part more carefully.

My query is more specifically, will the toast turn brown/blackish when sealed in along with super heated water @ 350 C.
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: emenelopee on Fri, 23 March 2018, 13:47:23: Wait, toasting is not an oxidation process?

Also bread is already cooked. Making it wet and hot would make a bread-y soup.
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: tp4tissue on Fri, 23 March 2018, 13:48:25: Quote from: emenelopee on Fri, 23 March 2018, 13:47:23
Wait, toasting is not an oxidation process?

Also bread is already cooked. Making it wet and hot would make a bread-y soup.

The question here is, will it be Brownish/black soup, or Beige soup..
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: dead_pixel_design on Fri, 23 March 2018, 14:17:43: Quote from: emenelopee on Fri, 23 March 2018, 13:47:23
Wait, toasting is not an oxidation process?

Also bread is already cooked. Making it wet and hot would make a bread-y soup.

Nah, toasting food is not the same thing as making toast, and making toast isn't an oxidation process. And a lot of the ingredients you cook with are already cooked, you can still cook them again.
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: chyros on Fri, 23 March 2018, 14:28:53: Quote from: emenelopee on Fri, 23 March 2018, 13:47:23
Wait, toasting is not an oxidation process?
No, it's an amino acid reaction known as the Maillard process: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maillard_reaction .
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: emenelopee on Fri, 23 March 2018, 14:33:17: Well colour me educated, I have learned something today.

Also: Bread Soup:

(https://cook.fnr.sndimg.com/content/dam/images/cook/fullset/2011/12/21/0/CCFFA306_Bread-Soup_s4x3.jpg.rend.hgtvcom.616.462.suffix/1351629819896.jpeg)
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: dead_pixel_design on Fri, 23 March 2018, 14:43:53: Quote from: emenelopee on Fri, 23 March 2018, 14:33:17
Well colour me educated, I have learned something today.

Also: Bread Soup:

Show Image
(https://cook.fnr.sndimg.com/content/dam/images/cook/fullset/2011/12/21/0/CCFFA306_Bread-Soup_s4x3.jpg.rend.hgtvcom.616.462.suffix/1351629819896.jpeg)

Oohh, and Bread Pudding! A personal favorite!
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: noisyturtle on Fri, 23 March 2018, 14:48:42: You could easily do a water extraction method to separate the bread molecules into a much purer form, but it would need to be done in ice cold water not hot water. Getting the bread wet and breaking down it's structure does not in any way mean you cannot reform it into a more pure bread.
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: tp4tissue on Fri, 23 March 2018, 15:04:50: Quote from: noisyturtle on Fri, 23 March 2018, 14:48:42
You could easily do a water extraction method to separate the bread molecules into a much purer form, but it would need to be done in ice cold water not hot water. Getting the bread wet and breaking down it's structure does not in any way mean you cannot reform it into a more pure bread.

Here's how I'd imagine this would be done..

ASSSUMING the bread COULD brown in the super heated water..

You'd DO THAT,

Then freeze dry the bread..

You would end up with what's essentially just toast. .
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: emenelopee on Fri, 23 March 2018, 15:17:53: I'm sure reconstituted superheated then freeze-dried bread is as delicious as it sounds, but, and this is just a thought, have you tried a toaster?
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: tp4tissue on Fri, 23 March 2018, 15:20:24: Quote from: emenelopee on Fri, 23 March 2018, 15:17:53
I'm sure reconstituted superheated then freeze-dried bread is as delicious as it sounds, but, and this is just a thought, have you tried a toaster?

That's no fun.. !!

Which would you rather have, Microwave smores, or Campfire smores, OR Volcano Smores..
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: noisyturtle on Fri, 23 March 2018, 15:30:55: you cannot make s'mores in a microwave, no matter what lies you've heard
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: emenelopee on Fri, 23 March 2018, 15:42:19: I like my smores blended with beet juice as the liquid base.
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: dead_pixel_design on Fri, 23 March 2018, 16:16:16: Quote from: tp4tissue on Fri, 23 March 2018, 15:04:50
ASSSUMING the bread COULD brown in the super heated water..

You would probably end up with a ****ty psuedo-bagel. It wouldn't be toast. The closest you could come would be some sort of sous vide process, but the bread 'pouch' would need to be some sort of high temp poly or a metal; congratulations, you just made a toaster that is more expensive, and less functional than this: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00N8XFFDI/ref=psdc_289938_t2_B0015XGNEI
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: Halverson on Fri, 23 March 2018, 17:11:32: Ugh, TP: Church of Halverson Science and Research Branch
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: SpAmRaY on Fri, 23 March 2018, 17:47:27: Here you go TP4, a toaster that uses water....

https://www.wired.com/2016/10/review-balmuda-toaster/

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: tp4tissue on Fri, 23 March 2018, 17:55:25: Quote from: Halverson on Fri, 23 March 2018, 17:11:32
Ugh, TP: Church of Halverson Science and Research Branch

Just today, Tp4 is testing pureed celery Leaves and Orange peels.. BOILED in water..

About to drink it right now.. Hope I don't get Assplosion.. !!
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: chyros on Sat, 24 March 2018, 04:46:51: This thread is hurting my science gland.
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: tp4tissue on Sat, 24 March 2018, 07:59:15: Quote from: chyros on Sat, 24 March 2018, 04:46:51
This thread is hurting my science gland.

But the main mystery remains unsolved chyros. !!
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: chyros on Sat, 24 March 2018, 09:16:07: Quote from: tp4tissue on Sat, 24 March 2018, 07:59:15
Quote from: chyros on Sat, 24 March 2018, 04:46:51
This thread is hurting my science gland.

But the main mystery remains unsolved chyros. !!
It will not "toast". Toasting involves the material becoming crispy. Putting bread in water makes it soggy.
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: tp4tissue on Sat, 24 March 2018, 09:19:48: Quote from: chyros on Sat, 24 March 2018, 09:16:07
Quote from: tp4tissue on Sat, 24 March 2018, 07:59:15
Quote from: chyros on Sat, 24 March 2018, 04:46:51
This thread is hurting my science gland.

But the main mystery remains unsolved chyros. !!
It will not "toast". Toasting involves the material becoming crispy. Putting bread in water makes it soggy.

Right, but will it brown in the super heated water ?

If that can happen, and then we freeze dry it afterwards, it's --essentially-- like toast.
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: chyros on Sat, 24 March 2018, 12:15:30: Quote from: tp4tissue on Sat, 24 March 2018, 09:19:48
Quote from: chyros on Sat, 24 March 2018, 09:16:07
Quote from: tp4tissue on Sat, 24 March 2018, 07:59:15
Quote from: chyros on Sat, 24 March 2018, 04:46:51
This thread is hurting my science gland.

But the main mystery remains unsolved chyros. !!
It will not "toast". Toasting involves the material becoming crispy. Putting bread in water makes it soggy.

Right, but will it brown in the super heated water ?

If that can happen, and then we freeze dry it afterwards, it's --essentially-- like toast.
Yes, it should still brown, although the temperature might not be ideal.

Also, freeze-dried toast doesn't sound great, either.
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: dead_pixel_design on Sat, 24 March 2018, 16:04:50: I regret ever being a part of this discussion. I knew better. I am sad that blocking TP4 does not stop his posts from appearing when I browse the forum.
Title: Re: Underwater Toast [Paging Chyros]
Post by: tp4tissue on Sat, 24 March 2018, 16:53:55: Quote from: dead_pixel_design on Sat, 24 March 2018, 16:04:50
I regret ever being a part of this discussion. I knew better. I am sad that blocking TP4 does not stop his posts from appearing when I browse the forum.

Muahahahahhahahahaha