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geekhack Projects => Making Stuff Together! => Topic started by: tjcaustin on Thu, 25 April 2013, 21:46:12

Title: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Thu, 25 April 2013, 21:46:12
Big thanks to jdcarpe for the initial help

I'm making this as a repository/dump for basic soldering advice with the influx of custom boards (gh60, phantom r2, kmac 2/happy, gh60++) for those of us interested in trying our hand at doing this ourselves.

I plan on keeping this fairly up-to-date with people's suggestions, tips and tricks but here's at least a basic shopping list to start.

Recommended for good soldering:
Soldering stuff store - http://sra-solder.com/

Soldering wick - http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=341-550

Soldering flux

Kester 44 .032 diameter solder(.020 for SMD) -
63/37 - http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=370-074
.020 - http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=370-072

Solder spool holder - http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=370-345

Helping Hands soldering too - http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=360-670

Magnifying lamp (I say requirement, but really you can get away without this, but anything to reduce eye strain is a good) - http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200514197_200514197

Jeweler's Visor - http://www.amazon.com/Jewelers-Lighted-High-Power-Magnifier-Visor/dp/B005VR19ES/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1388723286&sr=8-1&keywords=jeweler%27s+glasses

Multimeter - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA04E0BA8503&nm_mc=KNC-GoogleMKP&cm_mmc=KNC-GoogleMKP-_-pla-_-Electrical+Testers-_-9SIA04E0BA8503

Solder Smoke Absorber - http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=370-358

Heat gun - http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=360-386

Budget ($50):
Edsyn CL1481 kit (includes tips/tools/soldapullt) - http://www.edsyn.com/product/ST/CL1481-K.html
NOTE - mkawa will be making a better version of this kit with more robust stuff through the geekhackers store, but it won't be anywhere close to this bargan basement pricing

Mid-range ($100 - 300):
Soldering
Edsyn 951SX - http://www.edsyn.com/index.php?Mode=piw&pn=951SX
Hakko FX888D- http://www.ebay.com/itm/170990362664?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649

Desoldering -
Edsyn soldapullt III - http://www.edsyn.com/index.php?Mode=piw&pn=DS017 OR
Universal soldapullt - http://www.edsyn.com/index.php?Mode=piw&pn=US140


Baller (the rest):
Soldering

Edsyn 2020 (what I use for work) - http://www.edsyn.com/index.php?Mode=piw&pn=2020

Desoldering -
Hakko FR-300 - http://www.amazon.com/Hakko-FR300-05-FR300-De-soldering-carrying/dp/B00KWM69C4/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1413769433&sr=8-4&keywords=hakko+desoldering


Thread Update with new links (June 17, 2017):

http://www.edsyn.com/product/CL1481-K1.html - $93.50
http://www.edsyn.com/product/951SX.html - $168.50
http://www.edsyn.com/product/PT109.html - $16.80
http://www.edsyn.com/product/US140.html - $10.64
http://www.edsyn.com/product/2020.html - $466.20
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: metalliqaz on Thu, 25 April 2013, 21:55:24
Tip tinner.  Need that tip tinner.
Also let me put in my vote for the fantastic, all American Weller WES51
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: L4yercake on Thu, 25 April 2013, 21:57:01
Something I've been wondering is what replacement tips should I get for the Hakko FX-888?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: metalliqaz on Thu, 25 April 2013, 21:58:35
Something I've been wondering is what replacement tips should I get for the Hakko FX-888?

Any tool worth anything should come with a manual that lists proper replacement part numbers.  If you don't have it, try Hakko's website.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Thu, 25 April 2013, 22:00:14
Both suggestions added to appropriate sections.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Thu, 25 April 2013, 22:02:38
Not a fan of soldering wick, I like suckers more.

The best:
http://www.amazon.com/Edsyn-Deluxe-Soldapullt-DS017LS-Static-Safe/dp/B0019V5HRA/ref=sr_1_17?ie=UTF8&qid=1366945331&sr=8-17&keywords=solder+sucker
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bavman on Thu, 25 April 2013, 22:07:02
Need to add flux. That stuff works magic
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Thu, 25 April 2013, 22:17:49
For the people completely new to soldering...
A quick tip that I learned real early in class, but a bit after I first began soldering:

Don't just heat up the solder enough to melt it and then touch it to the metal hoping it will stick - it will stick, but you will likely get a cold solder joint (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soldering#Electronics).  You should ideally heat up the component enough to make the solder melt when you touch the solder to the metal.  This will give a nice looking solder joint.

Take this with a grain of salt when soldering PCBs (which is what you'll be doing when soldering switches).  If you overheat the metal pad it can spread heat to the board and cause warping or melting.  There's a sweet spot of heat to apply and it may take some time and practice to get good at this.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: keymaster on Thu, 25 April 2013, 22:30:35
I'll be monitoring this thread :) thanks for the info
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Thu, 25 April 2013, 22:44:30
Not a fan of soldering wick, I like suckers more.

The best:
http://www.amazon.com/Edsyn-Deluxe-Soldapullt-DS017LS-Static-Safe/dp/B0019V5HRA/ref=sr_1_17?ie=UTF8&qid=1366945331&sr=8-17&keywords=solder+sucker

I have, literally, two different soldapullts in the mid tier.  Sure, neither are the ESD safe ones, but still :P
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SmallFry on Thu, 25 April 2013, 23:02:39
Cheap solder wick is like cheap hookers, they look nice until they don't suck. Nice wick is VERY good at sufficient temperatures. I prefer it to a sucker, but you can't just wash a roll of wick out like you can a solder sucker
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Gupgup on Thu, 25 April 2013, 23:05:31
Cheap solder wick is like cheap hookers, they look nice until they don't suck. Nice wick is VERY good at sufficient temperatures. I prefer it to a sucker, but you can't just wash a roll of wick out like you can a solder sucker

Man, you love that joke :p

Not a fan of soldering wick, I like suckers more.

The best:
http://www.amazon.com/Edsyn-Deluxe-Soldapullt-DS017LS-Static-Safe/dp/B0019V5HRA/ref=sr_1_17?ie=UTF8&qid=1366945331&sr=8-17&keywords=solder+sucker

Agreed, and I just ordered this one yesterday :D


Gupgup
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SmallFry on Thu, 25 April 2013, 23:08:52
Cheap solder wick is like cheap hookers, they look nice until they don't suck. Nice wick is VERY good at sufficient temperatures. I prefer it to a sucker, but you can't just wash a roll of wick out like you can a solder sucker

Man, you love that joke :p
Gupgup
Yeah... well, I made it up the other day, though I'm sure someone has said it before me. Still funny. :))
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mistakemistake on Thu, 25 April 2013, 23:10:56
I don't know if I'd consider the Aoyue 'baller'..  Nice list otherwise though :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Thu, 25 April 2013, 23:32:39
I don't know if I'd consider the Aoyue 'baller'..  Nice list otherwise though :)

It was an easy descriptor of price.  Is it worthwhile?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: esoomenona on Thu, 25 April 2013, 23:36:22
cheap hookers, they look nice until they don't suck.
Something tells me you're not too aware of how hookers work...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mistakemistake on Thu, 25 April 2013, 23:38:55
I don't know if I'd consider the Aoyue 'baller'..  Nice list otherwise though :)

It was an easy descriptor of price.  Is it worthwhile?

I've used that model specifically not too long ago. I feel that the weller wes51 performs much better. The the 968 is actually a budget/entry level setup for rework stations.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Fri, 26 April 2013, 00:59:23
I don't know if I'd consider the Aoyue 'baller'..  Nice list otherwise though :)

It was an easy descriptor of price.  Is it worthwhile?

I've used that model specifically not too long ago. I feel that the weller wes51 performs much better. The the 968 is actually a budget/entry level setup for rework stations.

Would you say that a rework station would be a good idea for those that want to do light SMD stuff plus other soldering or should that be left to more experienced people?

(I'm asking these questions in as much as to get them out for people to read as anything.)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Fri, 26 April 2013, 01:06:18
Aoyue in general is well priced for what it offers, but it's not really a high end brand, especially that model you linked. I have a Aoyue rework station, but a higher end one. A hakko or weller with similar features would be in the thousand $ range.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: damorgue on Fri, 26 April 2013, 01:14:57
I would pick eutectic solder instead. I might include flux in that list as well, and I would move most of what you have put under required to recommended.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Fri, 26 April 2013, 01:20:13
I would pick eutectic solder instead. I might include flux in that list as well, and I would move most of what you have put under required to recommended.

Flux added and header changed to recommended.

Aoyue in general is well priced for what it offers, but it's not really a high end brand, especially that model you linked. I have a Aoyue rework station, but a higher end one. A hakko or weller with similar features would be in the thousand $ range.

That's fair, and like I said (and could stand to be more clear in OP, admittedly) the baller tag was solely for the amount of money more than anything else.

Again, though, is a rework station too much for a typical geekhacker?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Fri, 26 April 2013, 02:02:22
Yeah, rework station is overkill for keyboards. Hot air is great and all, but there are not a lot of opportunities to use it for keyboards. You won't be able to solder or desolder with hot air when switches are around, because they'll melt. There are not many cases where you're forced to do SMD soldering, and even if you are, you can do it perfectly fine with just an iron. The only thing you really need for good soldering is ~$40 variable temp iron, rosin-core solder, and a sponge. Add in a solder sucker or desoldering iron if you ever desolder switches. Separate flux is highly recommeded, but everything else is just accessories (helping hands, magnifying glass, spool holder, etc).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SmallFry on Fri, 26 April 2013, 07:46:47
I agree. I seldom use a spool holder as well as a magnifying glass, but they're nice to have when needed.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: metalliqaz on Fri, 26 April 2013, 08:07:33
One of these tip cleaners is much better than a sponge, IMHO
http://www.amazon.com/Hakko-Cleaner-599B-02-Non-Corrosive-Needed/dp/B000PDQORU
I would never use a sponge on my nice fine tips.

Also, that reminds me, you need very small soldering tips for SMD work, get good ones.  Also always chisel or screwdriver tip.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mashby on Fri, 26 April 2013, 10:15:09
Surprised no one has suggested the Hakko 808 Desoldering Kit (http://www.amazon.com/Hakko-Desoldering-Kit-With-808/dp/B000ARPULW/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1366989249&sr=8-1&keywords=hakko+desoldering). Probably overkill for most folks, but I think it could be listed as "baller".  :p
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Fri, 26 April 2013, 10:17:44
FWIW, that 808 is used at Mechanical Keyboards
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 26 April 2013, 10:22:47
I did suggest it! :P

It's not overkill. It's the best time saver if you do much desoldering.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: xavierblak on Fri, 26 April 2013, 10:50:37
As another desoldering option I like the spring-loaded plunger style vs the blub. But it's probably all what you get used too.

http://www.amazon.com/Tenma-21-8240-Vacuum-Desoldering-Iron/dp/B008DJRYIG/ref=sr_1_18?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1366990910&sr=1-18&keywords=Desoldering
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SmallFry on Fri, 26 April 2013, 10:51:32
For first time solders I suggest an old alarm clock or VCR or some similar product that will have lots of through hole components. You will have the opportunity to rip something apart, as well as learn to desolder, and resolder if you're ambitious. Better to screw over a VCR than a $100+ keyboard.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 26 April 2013, 11:01:54
If you want to buy an Edsyn Soldapullt for desoldering, please buy it direct from Edsyn. Their customer service phone number is 818-989-2324. Their customer service reps are very friendly, knowledgeable, and helpful. They will also usually quote you a lower price than what is listed on their web site (www.edsyn.com). The DS017 is the one I bought from them.

I have a hunch that some of the "Soldapullt" tools sold by Techni Tool through Amazon are knockoffs. Also, I know Amazon is convenient, but they are evil. Don't buy from Amazon, buy direct!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: damorgue on Fri, 26 April 2013, 13:53:01
Also, no one took note of eutectic solder. Why do you keep using 60/40? Perhaps there is a reason I have missed there?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 26 April 2013, 13:55:41
Also, no one took note of eutectic solder. Why do you keep using 60/40? Perhaps there is a reason I have missed there?

I use 63/37 Kester "44" now. I used to use 60/40, but now I know better. :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Fri, 26 April 2013, 14:27:00
If you want to buy an Edsyn Soldapullt for desoldering, please buy it direct from Edsyn. Their customer service phone number is 818-989-2324. Their customer service reps are very friendly, knowledgeable, and helpful. They will also usually quote you a lower price than what is listed on their web site (www.edsyn.com). The DS017 is the one I bought from them.

I have a hunch that some of the "Soldapullt" tools sold by Techni Tool through Amazon are knockoffs. Also, I know Amazon is convenient, but they are evil. Don't buy from Amazon, buy direct!
the silverstat deluxe st least isnt a knock off someone contacted edsyn and they said they brand if for them.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SmallFry on Fri, 26 April 2013, 14:27:31
Also, no one took note of eutectic solder. Why do you keep using 60/40? Perhaps there is a reason I have missed there?

I use 63/37 Kester "44" now. I used to use 60/40, but now I know better. :)
63/37=60/40 solder.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Fri, 26 April 2013, 14:27:34
Ok so i need some good which what brand shout i be looking at maye some other specs
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Fri, 26 April 2013, 14:29:29
Also, no one took note of eutectic solder. Why do you keep using 60/40? Perhaps there is a reason I have missed there?

I use 63/37 Kester "44" now. I used to use 60/40, but now I know better. :)
63/37=60/40 solder.
4% silver solder>62/36/2>63/37>60/40
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Fri, 26 April 2013, 14:29:35
this is right up my alley. Looking to do some small electronics work this summer. better believe i've got this thread on notify

Related note, how bad for you IS solder smoke? I'm sort of planning on getting set up in an attic becuase it's otherwise unused (sort of like alone time) but there are no windows, and running any sort of venting would require crawling through the rafters which really isn't my cup of tea. Is it possible to use lead free solder and not worry about the fumes, or is there some sort of air purifier that I could invest in that would clean the crap out of the air as I work? Maybe a mask?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 26 April 2013, 14:32:49
I ordered one of those cheap "Yihua 936" Hakko clones from HobbyKing. I'll let you guys know how it goes.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Fri, 26 April 2013, 14:37:06
Also, no one took note of eutectic solder. Why do you keep using 60/40? Perhaps there is a reason I have missed there?

I have several sizes of 63/37 for PCBs and electronics, and one small roll of 60/40 in size 0.040" just to tin my iron tips. It's a good practice to use 63/37 composition for all PCB related stuff, but it's not really mission critical to do so, so 60/40 will be ok. Price difference between 63/37 and 60/40 is only a few bucks for a whole roll, so might as well get the better one.

The composition with silver is just an utter waste of money for keyboard soldering.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dreamre on Fri, 26 April 2013, 14:52:23
Great thread.

I will need to pick up a couple of these to change my switches.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Fri, 26 April 2013, 15:31:50
this is right up my alley. Looking to do some small electronics work this summer. better believe i've got this thread on notify

Related note, how bad for you IS solder smoke? I'm sort of planning on getting set up in an attic becuase it's otherwise unused (sort of like alone time) but there are no windows, and running any sort of venting would require crawling through the rafters which really isn't my cup of tea. Is it possible to use lead free solder and not worry about the fumes, or is there some sort of air purifier that I could invest in that would clean the crap out of the air as I work? Maybe a mask?

http://www.thebgawarehouse.com/Aoyue-486-ESD-safe-Benchtop-Solder-Smoke-Absorber?ref=lexity&_vs=google&_vm=productsearch&adtype=pla&gclid=CL2Zl6uW6bYCFQVV4AodKjYAPg I'll put this here tentatively for discussions for now.

Added 63/37 solder.

Also, will be getting my soldering equipment plus materials to build a dedicated soldering area soon and will post pictures if I remember.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Fri, 26 April 2013, 16:12:55
http://www.thebgawarehouse.com/Aoyue-486-ESD-safe-Benchtop-Solder-Smoke-Absorber?ref=lexity&_vs=google&_vm=productsearch&adtype=pla&gclid=CL2Zl6uW6bYCFQVV4AodKjYAPg I'll put this here tentatively for discussions for now.

Duly noted. Thanks.

Might I suggest throwing a multimeter on the OP as well? for a lot of DIY projects if you're dealing with soldering, you might have to know power flow too.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: metalliqaz on Fri, 26 April 2013, 17:18:11
I use eutectic solder (63/37) myself.  I like Kester 245 with the no-clean rosin, 0.020".
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sat, 27 April 2013, 00:37:53
I'll gladly put popular multimeter options up.  I like fluke, but they're expensive.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Gupgup on Sat, 27 April 2013, 00:40:19
Hey WFD or anyone that knows, I'm looking for a flux pen similar to the one WFD uses in his SMD video, anyone know a good one?


Gupgup
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Sat, 27 April 2013, 01:01:36
I'm surprised no one mentioned flux yet. There are several types: Rosin, water soluble, an no-clean. Just get the no-clean stuff because it's volatile and the excess just evaporate after a certain time. The other fluxes should be cleaned because they're corrosive to the contact points. And if you're going to clean flux, use isopropyl alcohol (99% if you can find it, available on amazon). I use SRA no-clean flux pen.

tjcaustin, maybe list SRA in the OP. It's a go-to place for all soldering products, and they have a lot of in-house stuff.

http://sra-solder.com/
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Gupgup on Sat, 27 April 2013, 01:08:19
http://sra-solder.com/product.php?xProd=7040

This one? Thanks for the quick reply bud.


Gupgup
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sat, 27 April 2013, 01:09:36
I'm surprised no one mentioned flux yet. There are several types: Rosin, water soluble, an no-clean. Just get the no-clean stuff because it's volatile and the excess just evaporate after a certain time. The other fluxes should be cleaned because they're corrosive to the contact points. And if you're going to clean flux, use isopropyl alcohol (99% if you can find it, available on amazon). I use SRA no-clean flux pen.

tjcaustin, maybe list SRA in the OP. It's a go-to place for all soldering products, and they have a lot of in-house stuff.

http://sra-solder.com/

People have mentioned flux, but discussions haven't really solidified into recommendations of what to get.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SmallFry on Sat, 27 April 2013, 01:14:12
I use plumbers flux when I really need flux. Otherwise I just don't use flux.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Sat, 27 April 2013, 01:35:39
Not sure if you're just stating that or recommending, but you shouldn't use plumbing flux for PCBs. Or at least clean it completely off afterwards. Plumber flux is acidic so it works well for very oxidized and corroded surfaces, but the flux itself causes corrosion over time. Flux is cheap, just get the correct kind.


http://sra-solder.com/product.php?xProd=7040 (http://sra-solder.com/product.php?xProd=7040)

This one? Thanks for the quick reply bud.

Yeah that's the one. It's basically the same thing as the Kester 951 flux pen.

http://www.amazon.com/Kester-951-Soldering-Low-Solid-No-Clean/dp/B004X4KOWS (http://goo.gl/hZKDj)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SmallFry on Sat, 27 April 2013, 01:36:35
I seldom use it, not recommended, but it works.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mashby on Sat, 27 April 2013, 09:04:39
I seldom use it, not recommended, but it works.

And for the noobs monitoring this thread, when and how do you use the flux?

It doesn't appear to be necessary on keyboards, but apparently it "cleans things up". What exactly does it clean and how do you use it to clean?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sat, 27 April 2013, 09:11:59
Related note, how bad for you IS solder smoke? I'm sort of planning on getting set up in an attic becuase it's otherwise unused (sort of like alone time) but there are no windows, and running any sort of venting would require crawling through the rafters which really isn't my cup of tea. Is it possible to use lead free solder and not worry about the fumes, or is there some sort of air purifier that I could invest in that would clean the crap out of the air as I work? Maybe a mask?

Leaded solder used to give me ridiculous headaches if I didn't use the vents in the room after like 15 minutes. I would HIGHLY recommend you don't solder in an enclosed space until you figure out how to ventilate the area. I think Kawa posted how to make some cheap fume sucker/blow/fan things made out of cheapo Walmart fans and ducting. Let me go see if I can find it...or maybe Smallfry will see this post and link it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: metalliqaz on Sat, 27 April 2013, 09:46:59
I use plumbers flux when I really need flux. Otherwise I just don't use flux.

You'd better get a proper flux pen to do that SMD work, bro.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sun, 28 April 2013, 16:56:45
Hm, to build a manly table out of wood, sweat and blood or buy a plastic folding table like I use for my bedroom desk...

This is a question that you all should answer here.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Sun, 28 April 2013, 17:11:29
Hm, to build a manly table out of wood, sweat and blood or buy a plastic folding table like I use for my bedroom desk...

This is a question that you all should answer here.
Make one yourself. I built one in like 2-3 hours out of wood and used an MDF sheet as a top. Sturdiest desk I have ever owned and only cost about £30. + It's huge
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sun, 28 April 2013, 17:18:03
Hm, to build a manly table out of wood, sweat and blood or buy a plastic folding table like I use for my bedroom desk...

This is a question that you all should answer here.
Make one yourself. I built one in like 2-3 hours out of wood and used an MDF sheet as a top. Sturdiest desk I have ever owned and only cost about £30. + It's huge

That's exactly what I'm planning (I have a "scrap" piece of 3cm MDF that's a little over 1 sq meter).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Sun, 28 April 2013, 17:20:06
Hm, to build a manly table out of wood, sweat and blood or buy a plastic folding table like I use for my bedroom desk...

This is a question that you all should answer here.
Make one yourself. I built one in like 2-3 hours out of wood and used an MDF sheet as a top. Sturdiest desk I have ever owned and only cost about £30. + It's huge

That's exactly what I'm planning (I have a "scrap" piece of 3cm MDF that's a little over 1 sq meter).

Melamine fiberboard should make a good top, just try not to burn through it
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Sun, 28 April 2013, 17:21:35
Hm, to build a manly table out of wood, sweat and blood or buy a plastic folding table like I use for my bedroom desk...

This is a question that you all should answer here.
Make one yourself. I built one in like 2-3 hours out of wood and used an MDF sheet as a top. Sturdiest desk I have ever owned and only cost about £30. + It's huge

That's exactly what I'm planning (I have a "scrap" piece of 3cm MDF that's a little over 1 sq meter).
Sweet. How're you planning to do the frame?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sun, 28 April 2013, 22:11:02
Hm, to build a manly table out of wood, sweat and blood or buy a plastic folding table like I use for my bedroom desk...

This is a question that you all should answer here.
Make one yourself. I built one in like 2-3 hours out of wood and used an MDF sheet as a top. Sturdiest desk I have ever owned and only cost about £30. + It's huge

That's exactly what I'm planning (I have a "scrap" piece of 3cm MDF that's a little over 1 sq meter).
Sweet. How're you planning to do the frame?

2x4s.  Pics will come as I actually build. Gotta rearrange garage.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Sun, 28 April 2013, 22:31:51
Leaded solder used to give me ridiculous headaches if I didn't use the vents in the room after like 15 minutes. I would HIGHLY recommend you don't solder in an enclosed space until you figure out how to ventilate the area. I think Kawa posted how to make some cheap fume sucker/blow/fan things made out of cheapo Walmart fans and ducting. Let me go see if I can find it...or maybe Smallfry will see this post and link it.

Incidentally I got a couple large lab tables from a school sale (they were demoing it and selling everything that wasn't being replaced, 2 high quality tables for 10 bucks each, woot.) so I just set the whole thing up where my PC is now located.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sun, 28 April 2013, 23:44:39
(http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae270/tjcaustin/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0183_zps0d7030d7.jpg) (http://s978.photobucket.com/user/tjcaustin/media/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0183_zps0d7030d7.jpg.html)

Today's work included cleaning, reorganizing the garage and getting power to where I wanted to set up my work area.  Here's where I stopped:
(http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae270/tjcaustin/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0184_zps77ecd47f.jpg) (http://s978.photobucket.com/user/tjcaustin/media/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0184_zps77ecd47f.jpg.html)

Tomorrow, I'll either be running to a fry's/wherever else to get the rest of my equipment and then building the table itself.  Expect a basic write-up with materials used when it's finished.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: keymaster on Mon, 29 April 2013, 13:01:21
If you want to buy an Edsyn Soldapullt for desoldering, please buy it direct from Edsyn. Their customer service phone number is 818-989-2324. Their customer service reps are very friendly, knowledgeable, and helpful. They will also usually quote you a lower price than what is listed on their web site (www.edsyn.com). The DS017 is the one I bought from them.

I have a hunch that some of the "Soldapullt" tools sold by Techni Tool through Amazon are knockoffs. Also, I know Amazon is convenient, but they are evil. Don't buy from Amazon, buy direct!

I'm just letting everyone know that I ordered mine from Amazon, received it today, and can confirm that it comes with the original Edsyn packaging. Thus, I think it's safe to assume that the ones sold on Amazon are original, not knock offs.

Edit: I took a pic of the unopened product

(http://i.imgur.com/2lySkNo.jpg)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Mon, 29 April 2013, 18:14:17
here's the same magnifying lamp as the one in the OP for a buck cheaper, and if you have Prime you get free 2 day shipping.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0038D8O7W/ref=oh_details_o02_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

and is this thing worth it over the damp sponge?

http://www.amazon.com/Hakko-Cleaner-599B-02-Non-Corrosive-Needed/dp/B000PDQORU/ref=pd_sim_hi_4
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bearcat on Mon, 29 April 2013, 19:55:57
the damp sponge causes a sharp drop in temp at the tip, whether that's damaging or not is up to you.  At $10, i think it's a no-brainer but YMMV.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bearcat on Mon, 29 April 2013, 20:00:15
And to answer a question from earlier in the thread:

Flux is used to help make solder "flow" onto the hot sides of the joint.  The flux melts at a lower temperature than the solder, and it basically cleans the impurities/oxidization/whatever off the metal, which lets the solder bond against the metal.  It's usually some kind of pine or spruce rosin.  Exposure to fumes is not really good -- beyond the obvious things it would do to you like irritate your lungs, it makes you more sensitive to the fumes, which sets up the kind of feedback loop you want to avoid on your body.  Have a window open or a fan.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Mon, 29 April 2013, 20:05:13
Might I suggest throwing a multimeter on the OP as well? for a lot of DIY projects if you're dealing with soldering, you might have to know power flow too.

As TJ mentioned, Fluke is the cream of the crop for multimeters.

Here's my input.
I purchased this multimeter awhile back: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000JQ4O2U/ref=oh_details_o02_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

It works really well and is a good price, currently at $33.  One thing I like about it is that the terminals light up to indicate which ones the leads should be connected to.  This is really helpful if you're anything like me and cannot for the life of you remember to switch terminals when switching from voltage to current.  A minor feature, but appealing nonetheless.
In addition to that, it reads voltages, currents, and confirms continuity.  Everything I want it to.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Tue, 30 April 2013, 20:30:02
60/40 solder link was busted, so that was deleted.

Replaced the hakko fx888d and magnifying lamp link with cheaper options for both.  Added a hakko fx808 link that was from same seller as the 888d
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: wcass on Tue, 30 April 2013, 21:14:40
do we have anyone here that does fine SMD work for pay? i have a project that need more skill then what i have. i need to mount 1.5mm square package on 7 pads (x14). the PCB is 12" x 6".
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Tue, 30 April 2013, 21:25:50
I'm sure there are a handful that will give you a shout.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Glissant on Tue, 30 April 2013, 22:33:37
Weller WLC100, extra tips and flux ordered.
Thanks a lot for this guide, tjcaustin! Really came in handy, and I am sure it will continue to come in handy for me in the future too.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 01 May 2013, 05:53:46
To echo what Glissant said, I think I've referred a ton of ppl to this thread already and I'm going to be buying a Weller soon myself. Thanks for compiling all this into one thread TJ
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Wed, 01 May 2013, 09:56:01
Because flames make everything cooler faster...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hakko-FX888D-23BY-FX888-Digital-Soldering-Station-W-Flame-Decals-RC-Slot-Racers-/171029853721

(http://i.ebayimg.com/t/Hakko-FX888D-23BY-FX888-Digital-Soldering-Station-W-Flame-Decals-RC-Slot-Racers-/00/s/ODgxWDE2MDA=/z/3S8AAOxyJs5RZFSp/$T2eC16NHJHYE9nzpcw03BRZFSozog!~~60_57.JPG)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 01 May 2013, 09:57:45
JD, does that mean you solder faster too?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Parak on Wed, 01 May 2013, 10:44:17
Pace howto - uses $silly tools and tips but is still of interest:

NASA soldering requirements - good for everyone: http://workmanship.nasa.gov/lib/insp/2%20books/links/sections/601%20General%20Requirements.html
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mashby on Wed, 01 May 2013, 10:47:24
Because flames make everything cooler...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hakko-FX888D-23BY-FX888-Digital-Soldering-Station-W-Flame-Decals-RC-Slot-Racers-/171029853721

If I could get just the decals, I would totally buy that.  :p They're silly and I'd probably regret doing it, but I still think it's fun.

BTW, I setup my soldering station over the weekend.

(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8403/8695426887_5e601d361c.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mashby/8695426887/)
Ready To Solder (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mashby/8695426887/) by Michael Ashby (http://www.flickr.com/people/mashby/), on Flickr
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Wed, 01 May 2013, 11:31:32
I found branded decals for the Hakko 936 (or it's clone, the Yihua 936).

Purchase 936 decals here:
(blue) http://www.hakkousa.com/detail.asp?CID=70,289&PID=4564&Page=1 $17.37 + tax
(orange) http://www.hakkousa.com/detail.asp?PID=4565&Page=1

HobbyKing has the Yihua 936: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__19240__Soldering_Station_with_Adjustable_Heat_Range_USA_Warehouse_.html $16.51 + $13.11 shipping

(http://www.hakkousa.com/AHPDirect/images/936-skins2.jpg)



mashby found the Hakko branded decals for the FX-888 on HakkoUSA.com.

Purchase FX-888 decals here: http://www.hakkousa.com/detail.asp?PID=5027&Page=1 $16.67 + tax

(http://www.hakkousa.com/AHPDirect/images/DECAL-FXBY.jpg)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Wed, 01 May 2013, 13:24:48
Because flames make everything cooler faster...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hakko-FX888D-23BY-FX888-Digital-Soldering-Station-W-Flame-Decals-RC-Slot-Racers-/171029853721

Show Image
(http://i.ebayimg.com/t/Hakko-FX888D-23BY-FX888-Digital-Soldering-Station-W-Flame-Decals-RC-Slot-Racers-/00/s/ODgxWDE2MDA=/z/3S8AAOxyJs5RZFSp/$T2eC16NHJHYE9nzpcw03BRZFSozog!~~60_57.JPG)


The carbon fiber is the fast maker
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: domoaligato on Wed, 01 May 2013, 13:44:24
I do not see any cutters mentioned  yet and thought this might help others

Xcelite 170M General Purpose Shearcutter, Diagonal, Flush Jaw, 5" Length, 3/4" Jaw length, Red Grip
http://www.amazon.com/Xcelite-170M-General-Shearcutter-Diagonal/dp/B0002BBZIS/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1367433764&sr=8-1&keywords=xcelite+170m


edit: 100th post! w00t!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Wed, 01 May 2013, 13:46:16
I do not see any cutters mentioned  yet and thought this might help others

Xcelite 170M General Purpose Shearcutter, Diagonal, Flush Jaw, 5" Length, 3/4" Jaw length, Red Grip
http://www.amazon.com/Xcelite-170M-General-Shearcutter-Diagonal/dp/B0002BBZIS/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1367433764&sr=8-1&keywords=xcelite+170m

Not really needed for keyboards other than cutting LED wires, but still extremely useful


Another item to add might be a precision screw driver set
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: keymaster on Wed, 01 May 2013, 13:55:31
I couldn't find the branded decals yet for the Hakko FX-888, but I did find some for the Hakko 936 (or it's clone, the Yihua 936).

Purchase 936 decals (only blue available) here: http://www.hakkousa.com/detail.asp?CID=70,289&PID=4564&Page=1 $17.37 + tax

HobbyKing has the Yihua 936: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__19240__Soldering_Station_with_Adjustable_Heat_Range_USA_Warehouse_.html $16.51 + $13.11 shipping

More
Show Image
(http://www.hakkousa.com/AHPDirect/images/936-skins2.jpg)

LOL it's like Hotwheels for grown-ups
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mashby on Wed, 01 May 2013, 15:35:25
They have the decals for the solder holder - http://www.hakkousa.com/detail.asp?PID=5027&Page=1
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Wed, 01 May 2013, 15:47:28
They have the decals for the solder holder - http://www.hakkousa.com/detail.asp?PID=5027&Page=1

That will actually cover an entire FX-888. It just shows half the decals. I just ordered one!

Nice find! Did you go through all their part numbers or something? I couldn't find it linked in their system, but I didn't dig too deep, I guess.

Edit: I guess I could have searched on the site for "DECAL" huh?  :confused:
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Wed, 01 May 2013, 16:31:11
NASA soldering requirements - good for everyone: http://workmanship.nasa.gov/lib/insp/2%20books/links/sections/601%20General%20Requirements.html

Man NASA sure has a lot of rules. . . what do they think this is, Rocket Sci. . . oh.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Thechemist on Thu, 02 May 2013, 01:37:24
At ~$56 best bang for your buck is the UNI-T UT61E DMM. Just make sure you clean the leads with alcohol when you receive it.
Some reviews show it overshoots but others don't, it could be fixed on newer revisions?
It is one of the best DC and AC DMM that also has TRUE RMS.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/UNI-T-UT61E-AC-DC-Modern-Digital-Multimeter-gl-/251267628025?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a80b7bbf9

It has nice feature that tests smd components and  resistors with ease .

(http://lygte-info.dk/pic/UNI-T/UT61E/DSC_1413.jpg)(http://lygte-info.dk/pic/UNI-T/UT61E/DSC_1428.jpg)

Quote
The test socket that is included can be used when measuring resistors and capacitors, both SMD and leaded components. It can also be used for transistor test, but not on this DMM model. Including this type of test socket is much safer than making extra holes in the meter for test connections.
Note: This socket uses the mAuA terminal, instead of the COM terminal, i.e. it requires that the meter supports this.

Some reviews.
More

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: domoaligato on Thu, 02 May 2013, 10:33:10
could someone suggest a flux pen? I know there are alot of different types of flux and wanted to make sure I didn't get the wrong kind.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Thu, 02 May 2013, 11:08:15
If anyone is interested in a quality soldering station, but you can't really afford more than $50 for an iron, some used Hakko 936 soldering bases with iron holders just popped up on eBay for $25 plus shipping each. There are 6 left as of now, since I bought 2 of them. This is the discontinued predecessor to the Hakko FX-888, which is also now discontinued, replaced by the Hakko FX-888D. You will need to purchase a Hakko 907 soldering iron to go with it, which you can get for $9 shipped.

You could get the Weller WLC100 soldering station brand new for about the same price, but the WLC100 doesn't have an actual temp control, it only varies the wattage to the iron.

Hakko 936 base (http://www.ebay.com/itm/281102057599) $25 + shipping

Hakko 907 iron (http://www.ebay.com/itm/251077570894) $8.99 + FS



could someone suggest a flux pen? I know there are alot of different types of flux and wanted to make sure I didn't get the wrong kind.

This one looks good to me: http://sra-solder.com/product.php/7045/141/sra_99_20_rma_rosin_flux_pen_refillable
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: nubbinator on Thu, 02 May 2013, 12:07:36
If anyone is interested in a quality soldering station, but you can't really afford more than $50 for an iron, some used Hakko 936 soldering bases with iron holders just popped up on eBay for $25 plus shipping each. There are 6 left as of now, since I bought 2 of them. This is the discontinued predecessor to the Hakko FX-888, which is also now discontinued, replaced by the Hakko FX-888D. You will need to purchase a Hakko 907 soldering iron to go with it, which you can get for $9 shipped.

You could get the Weller WLC100 soldering station brand new for about the same price, but the WLC100 doesn't have an actual temp control, it only varies the wattage to the iron.

Hakko 936 base (http://www.ebay.com/itm/281102057599) $25 + shipping

Hakko 907 iron (http://www.ebay.com/itm/251077570894) $8.99 + FS

That's pretty nifty.  Right now I'm using a Weller with a homemade wattage adjuster made from a rotary dimmer.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: keymaster on Thu, 02 May 2013, 13:25:14
I just desoldered and soldered my first switch. Feels good, man. :)

I'm using the  Weller WLC100 40-Watt Soldering Station (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000AS28UC/ref=oh_details_o04_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) and the Edsyn Deluxe Soldapullt (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0019V5HRA/ref=oh_details_o03_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1).

Thanks for all the info guys, WFD especially.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Thu, 02 May 2013, 13:25:44
If your looking for some nice pliers and cutters look no further than lindstrom, the yellow 80 series is the way to go.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Fri, 03 May 2013, 01:05:57
BTW, I setup my soldering station over the weekend.
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8403/8695426887_5e601d361c.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mashby/8695426887/)

Ready To Solder (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mashby/8695426887/) by Michael Ashby (http://www.flickr.com/people/mashby/), on Flickr

I know that's not my youtube video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQ_2GxeR4Es#t=9s) on your notebook's screen...



could someone suggest a flux pen? I know there are alot of different types of flux and wanted to make sure I didn't get the wrong kind.

It was just on the previous page:

http://www.amazon.com/Kester-951-Soldering-Low-Solid-No-Clean/dp/B004X4KOWS (http://goo.gl/hZKDj)
http://sra-solder.com/product.php?xProd=7040 (http://sra-solder.com/product.php?xProd=7040)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Fri, 03 May 2013, 12:55:43
so looking at some Kester no clean flux solder whats better 245, 275, or 285
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Fri, 03 May 2013, 13:30:37
BTW, I setup my soldering station over the weekend.
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8403/8695426887_5e601d361c.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mashby/8695426887/)

Ready To Solder (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mashby/8695426887/) by Michael Ashby (http://www.flickr.com/people/mashby/), on Flickr

I just noticed that diskman in the background.  Way to rep it old school.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mashby on Fri, 03 May 2013, 16:05:08
BTW, I setup my soldering station over the weekend.
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8403/8695426887_5e601d361c.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mashby/8695426887/)

Ready To Solder (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mashby/8695426887/) by Michael Ashby (http://www.flickr.com/people/mashby/), on Flickr

I know that's not my youtube video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQ_2GxeR4Es#t=9s) on your notebook's screen...

You better BELIEVE it!  :cool:  I needed a refresher before I started.


I just noticed that diskman in the background.  Way to rep it old school.

LOL! I was wondering if anyone was going to catch that. I totally forgot that thing was still around. The funniest part was that there was a disc in it -- the soundtrack from Hackers (http://www.amazon.com/Hackers/dp/B000005OMF). ROTFLMAO!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Fri, 03 May 2013, 16:08:19
LOL! I was wondering if anyone was going to catch that. I totally forgot that thing was still around. The funniest part was that there was a disc in it -- the soundtrack from Hackers (http://www.amazon.com/Hackers/dp/B000005OMF). ROTFLMAO!


Your walkman doesn't have a PCI Bus to make it faster.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 03 May 2013, 16:09:14
Ha! I was just about to post this:

Quote
                                KATE
                    What the hell are you doing?

                                DADE
                    It's cool, I'm just looking.

                                KATE
                    It's too much machine for you.

                                DADE
                    Yeah?

        Dade starts working furiously on it.

                                KATE
                    I hope you don't screw like you type.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Fri, 03 May 2013, 16:10:03
Ha! I was just about to post this:

Quote
                                KATE
                    What the hell are you doing?

                                DADE
                    It's cool, I'm just looking.

                                KATE
                    It's too much machine for you.

                                DADE
                    Yeah?

        Dade starts working furiously on it.

                                KATE
                    I hope you don't screw like you type.

Great minds think alike, I guess :p
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Fri, 03 May 2013, 16:15:08
LOL! I was wondering if anyone was going to catch that. I totally forgot that thing was still around. The funniest part was that there was a disc in it -- the soundtrack from Hackers (http://www.amazon.com/Hackers/dp/B000005OMF). ROTFLMAO!
At least it's not a cassette player or records. Now those are ancient


so looking at some Kester no clean flux solder whats better 245, 275, or 285

Any reason why you need no-clean if you're using solder wire? For keyboard application, it won't matter much between those 3. Just get the cheapest one. No-clean is good for liquid flux doing SMD work because most of it will just evaporate away.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: metalliqaz on Fri, 03 May 2013, 16:32:50
The hackers soundtrack was AWESOME.  I still listen to it.  The movie was lame, lets be honest, but definitely a cult classic.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sat, 04 May 2013, 01:45:39
Work area is ready and waiting for the soldering stuff that should have gotten here today, I'll post pics and a how-to if anyone cares.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sat, 04 May 2013, 07:56:00
Yes please TJ. I'd like some pics and refreshers ^_^
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sun, 05 May 2013, 14:40:47
Table ingredients:

   1 - 33” x 49” sheet of .25” MDF (part a) (It doesn’t have to be exactly this, I had it laying around and build the rest to a 24” x 48” surface)

   3 - 2” x 4” x 144” woodstuff
   Specific cuts:
      4 - 24” length (part b)

                4 - 30” length (part c)
      
      4 - 48” length (part d)

   72 - 3” wood screws (connector e)

Solder spool ingredients:

   1 - .25” dowel

   2 - 4” eye screws

   2 - Hitch pin clips
 
Miscellaneous station ingredients:

   1 - 24” under cabinet light (I may add another)
   
   2 - 6 plug surge protectors (or any you’d prefer)

   1 - 2” hook screw (to hang heat gun on)

   1 - Focal XS Bookshelf speaker set up (or whatever speakers you want to use.  Music is important)
   
   1 - monitor with hdmi input

   1 - roku


How to Put Table Together (derived from - http://www.artofmanliness.com/2012/04/04/how-to-make-a-work-bench/):

   1. Screw everything together in a logical manner that resembles a table, if you’ve somehow managed to make anything that isn’t table-esque, continue to step 2.

   2. Take one (1) part D and caress it tenderly, but be careful for splinters (not the sensei).  Butt it perpendicularly at one end with an end of one (1) part B.

   3. Use three (3) of connector E to join these two pieces of wood together in wooden matrimony.
(http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae270/tjcaustin/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0255_zps89bea1df.jpg) (http://s978.photobucket.com/user/tjcaustin/media/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0255_zps89bea1df.jpg.html)

   4. At the other end of the currently stroked part D, intersect another part B and use three (3) more screws to turn this into a three-way of woodiness.

   5. As you have now began the frame for your table top, it is time to complete it by first taking one (1) part D and six (6) of connector E to repeat steps three (3) twice (two times) at the opposing end of parts B.

   6.  Time for center support, take one (1) of your remaining to (2) part D and gently slide it into place halfway between the other tue (2) part Ds (heh, double Ds) that are already attached.  This should be at approximately twelve (12) inches from either edge of parts B.
(http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae270/tjcaustin/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0265_zps8c467b6b.jpg) (http://s978.photobucket.com/user/tjcaustin/media/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0265_zps8c467b6b.jpg.html)
(http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae270/tjcaustin/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0264_zps17b37763.jpg) (http://s978.photobucket.com/user/tjcaustin/media/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0264_zps17b37763.jpg.html)

   7.  Congrats, you’ve finished the basic frame for the tabletop to attach to.  You deserve a reward and break, but not beer, though.

   8. Back from your break?  Good, it’s time to complete the bottom leg supports and attach the legs of your table to it, and then attach that to what you just finished.

   9.  Remember back when you started, how you followed the directions numbered two through four?  Go do it again, but remember you only have one more of part D left.

   10. Take one (1) of part C and firmly push it into the left corner of the C shape (get it?) that you’ve just created.  Use three (3) of connector E to ensure that it does not, and cannot, fall over in the lure of that mistress of mistresses, gravity.
(http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae270/tjcaustin/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0258_zps63a0fb51.jpg) (http://s978.photobucket.com/user/tjcaustin/media/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0258_zps63a0fb51.jpg.html)

   11.  Do step ten (10) again on the right side of your C shape.

   12. At the left side of the open end of your C, use three (3) of connector E to attach another (this is number three (3) (four (4), if you’re back from step thirteen (13)) of part C to this end.  Be sure to space it back just far enough to be able to smoothly slide into the top frame later.
(http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae270/tjcaustin/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0268_zps2931b1a6.jpg) (http://s978.photobucket.com/user/tjcaustin/media/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0268_zps2931b1a6.jpg.html)

   13. Go do that again on the last corner that doesn’t have a thirty (30) inch vertical piece of timber attached to it.

   14.  Oh boy, are you excited?  You should be, it’s time to put the frame of your tabletop on the reinforced legs you just made.  Read on to find out how.

   15. Follow the rule “Work smarter, not harder” by having your top frame laying flush on the ground.

   16. Take your table legs and rotate them one hundred eighty (180) degrees so as your C shape is up in the air, as if it just don’t care.

   17.  Did you make sure those leg ends were in the corners of the top piece, where everything would be nice and flush and ready for a lot (12 at least) of connector E to join it all together?  Why not?  Do that now.
(http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae270/tjcaustin/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0269_zps6ed79d51.jpg) (http://s978.photobucket.com/user/tjcaustin/media/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0269_zps6ed79d51.jpg.html)
(http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae270/tjcaustin/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0267_zps5185f77f.jpg) (http://s978.photobucket.com/user/tjcaustin/media/Soldering%20workbench/IMG_0267_zps5185f77f.jpg.html)

   18. Welp, good job building an upside-down table, genius.  Go buy something prebuilt from a hardware store and cry.  Or be a man and flip dat shiii pi (π) radians (don’t worry, I’ll wait for you to figure it out.  Be sure to use at least 180 digits of the number that represents pi(π) to calculate what it would be in degrees).

   19.  Hey, you have a table skeleton and it’s the correct side up now.  High five, you’re almost at the finish line.

   20. Place part A (eyyyy!) on top of table, but do not celebrate just yet as that could just slide off at any time of its own accord (not the car).  Use ten (10) to fifteen (15) (fourteen (14) is good, too) of connector E to ensure that your tabletop will never run away as part of your neighbor’s subwoofer box.

   21.  Know how I said you couldn’t celebrate just a few minutes ago (it was just a few, right?  It’s just screws. BTW, I should have mentioned this before, but if you don’t have a powered screwdriver (also known as a drill, electric screwdriver or that green thing that spins the fake dong in those special videos you watch), you’re going to have a bad time.  Seriously, screwing all these screws manually?  What are you, a heathen?)  You should celebrate the fact that you have completed a table and now may die a complete man (or lady).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Sun, 05 May 2013, 14:43:47
Nice butt....


























...joints that is (it's funny because those are butt joints)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sun, 05 May 2013, 14:47:32
I like butt joints and I cannot lie.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: samwisekoi on Sun, 05 May 2013, 15:32:39
Good thread.

No one has mentioned all of the little hand tools that make a complicated soldering job so much easier.  Mine are at work, so I'll add them tomorrow.

Also, heat guns are worth getting quality to make heat shrink shrink instead of melt or burn.  And continuity testers, which used to be built into every DMM, but now are a hard to find extra item.  But again, they make some jobs (e.g. testing a hard-wired keyboard matrix) so much easier.

Finally, somewhere on the bench should be a variable power supply.  Most circuits eventually need electricity, and having a source for 1.5, 3.3, 5, 7, 12v, etc. is totally handy.

A window is good, too.  Mmmm, lead smoke...

 - Ron I samwisekoi
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sun, 05 May 2013, 15:52:12
Good thread.

No one has mentioned all of the little hand tools that make a complicated soldering job so much easier.  Mine are at work, so I'll add them tomorrow.

Also, heat guns are worth getting quality to make heat shrink shrink instead of melt or burn.  And continuity testers, which used to be built into every DMM, but now are a hard to find extra item.  But again, they make some jobs (e.g. testing a hard-wired keyboard matrix) so much easier.

Finally, somewhere on the bench should be a variable power supply.  Most circuits eventually need electricity, and having a source for 1.5, 3.3, 5, 7, 12v, etc. is totally handy.

A window is good, too.  Mmmm, lead smoke...

 - Ron I samwisekoi

Thoughts about something like this? http://www.adafruit.com/products/184?gclid=COP5pZnp_7YCFYtT4AoddhYAWg I'm thinking I can build a variable power supply what with how I've built this nice set up and all.

I continually forget to add a smoke absorber link, but that's done now, too.  Heat gun and dmm are added, as well.  I'll add tools later.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: pentype on Sun, 05 May 2013, 16:06:11
I have this:
Radio Shack de-soldering iron w/bulb - http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062731

I can report that it works well for larger solder joints, however for smaller joints on the bottomside of the pcb, i have found it more effective to "blow" the solder by pushing the bulb instead of sucking it in. It usually turns up on the other side as a solder bead, cools quickly enough not to harm anything.

Iron Works in reverse also, but you have to melt down some solder in a ceramic container, and suck into the top chamber and let it reheat. Solder flows from tip to heated components pretty nicely.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Thechemist on Sun, 05 May 2013, 16:56:33
That Sinometer is junk a cheap rebrand ( can't calibrate and not very accurate ), I was doing research on which is the best DMM to buy and the one i posted earlier is the best bang for your buck and not that much more than that junky meter.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: linziyi on Sun, 05 May 2013, 17:05:10
How long does it take to process the whole keyboard? (assuming it is a TKL)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Aranair on Mon, 06 May 2013, 09:43:07
Gonna try and get into soldering but having a hard time finding some of these equipment in Singapore since shipping is way too expensive for a station lol. hopefully i'll be able to find some of these in hardware stores. D:
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Aranair on Mon, 06 May 2013, 09:44:35
quick question: whats the difference between the 63/37 solder vs no clean ones? No clean ones are nearly twice as expensive :/
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Mon, 06 May 2013, 11:00:24
standard 63/37 have rosin as flux, which leaves a residue after you solder. No-clean has a different type of flux. Just get the normal rosin-core one and leave the flux on there. It doesn't really damage keyboards.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Parak on Mon, 06 May 2013, 11:39:54
So I'm considering getting a Honeywell HPA-050 for an alternative take on filtering solder fumes. There are papers (http://annhyg.oxfordjournals.org/content/42/8/511.abstract?maxtoshow=&HITS=10&hits=10&RESULTFORMAT=1&andorexacttitle=and&andorexacttitleabs=and&fulltext=lead+oxide+fumes&andorexactfulltext=and&searchid=1&FIRSTINDEX=0&sortspec=relevance&fdate=1/1/1844&tdate=6/30/2007&resourcetype=HWCIT) which suggest that filtration of flux smoke and such are not sufficient with just a regular carbon filter, and that a combination of activated carbon and 99.97+ HEPA is needed.

Professional units do exactly that, but cost $ludicrous. I'm thinking that placing such a desktop filter a few inches away from the soldering area will work just as well, though. If anyone else knows of an approach that combines the two types of filtering in a compact format (DIY or othewise) on the cheap, speak up!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: samwisekoi on Tue, 07 May 2013, 08:58:26
standard 63/37 have rosin as flux, which leaves a residue after you solder. No-clean has a different type of flux. Just get the normal rosin-core one and leave the flux on there. It doesn't really damage keyboards.

And soap and water and a toothbrush cleans it off if you dislike the discoloration.

So I'm considering getting a Honeywell HPA-050 for an alternative take on filtering solder fumes. There are papers (http://annhyg.oxfordjournals.org/content/42/8/511.abstract?maxtoshow=&HITS=10&hits=10&RESULTFORMAT=1&andorexacttitle=and&andorexacttitleabs=and&fulltext=lead+oxide+fumes&andorexactfulltext=and&searchid=1&FIRSTINDEX=0&sortspec=relevance&fdate=1/1/1844&tdate=6/30/2007&resourcetype=HWCIT) which suggest that filtration of flux smoke and such are not sufficient with just a regular carbon filter, and that a combination of activated carbon and 99.97+ HEPA is needed.

Professional units do exactly that, but cost $ludicrous. I'm thinking that placing such a desktop filter a few inches away from the soldering area will work just as well, though. If anyone else knows of an approach that combines the two types of filtering in a compact format (DIY or othewise) on the cheap, speak up!

Fan.  Window.  Keep children away.  Done.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Aranair on Tue, 07 May 2013, 09:06:51
aights lol, thanks :D

Still having a hard time scouting all the equip here!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Parak on Tue, 07 May 2013, 09:18:31
Fan.  Window.  Keep children away.  Done.

Not an option - my soldering equipment will be far away from a window, can't have heat loss in winters, and I sleep in the same room. Also I'm still a child (mentally).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: keymaster on Tue, 07 May 2013, 12:16:54
My makeshift soldering station :p
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: gnubag on Tue, 07 May 2013, 13:01:19
My makeshift soldering station :p

until a swich pops off in a weird angle and you will never find it again :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: keymaster on Tue, 07 May 2013, 13:04:27
My makeshift soldering station :p

until a swich pops off in a weird angle and you will never find it again :)

High stakes soldering. Casuals need not apply.  ;D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Tue, 07 May 2013, 16:17:24
FYI in the OP the link to the 888D links to the 888. Not complaining as the digital display seems like a PITA.

Is the Weller really worth 15 bucks more than the Hakko? Not that I know anything about anything, but it looks less impressive to me.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Tue, 07 May 2013, 16:22:14
FX-888 is discontinued. FX-888D is the replacement. Although, you might still be able to find some new old stock 888's somewhere.

FWIW, I don't have a problem using the 888D...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Tue, 07 May 2013, 16:33:49
FX-888 is discontinued. FX-888D is the replacement. Although, you might still be able to find some new old stock 888's somewhere.

That's what i'm saying, in the OP he states the link is for the 888D, but it links to an ebay listing for the 888.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Tue, 07 May 2013, 16:38:39
FX-888 is discontinued. FX-888D is the replacement. Although, you might still be able to find some new old stock 888's somewhere.

That's what i'm saying, in the OP he states the link is for the 888D, but it links to an ebay listing for the 888.

That seller (niosales), still has the item listing for the 888. But they send you the 888D. So why not save the $8? :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Tue, 07 May 2013, 16:43:34
I understand now. Really confusing that he didn't change the name of the listing, but noted that he'll send you the D in the description.

To be honest, I think the analog dial and the fact that it's 'MURICA make me lean towards the Weller. It looks clunky and weird, but that's exactly the style that would seem to have high build quality. American Made seems to mean it's either bull**** garbage, or somebody actually took pride in producing it, and from the reviews this doesn't look like garbage.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Tue, 07 May 2013, 16:46:26
Is the Weller WES51 still in production? I thought it had also been replaced by a digital version, the WESD51.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: winged mantis on Tue, 07 May 2013, 18:49:02
Is the Weller WES51 still in production? I thought it had also been replaced by a digital version, the WESD51.

The WES51 is on Amazon. I have one and it works nicely for keyboards as long as you set the heat low enough.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Wed, 08 May 2013, 12:32:12
as far as the solder goes, I can't see myself needing a full pound of it at any time in the near future. are there smaller packs available for a reasonable price? Brands to look for?  as far as solder goes, are all brands more or less the same thing? I can hit up my local RadioShack and look  for some 63/37 .31 solder, if that's what most suggest for switches.

Basically I only need a 5 dollar small pack of the stuff, not a 30 dollar pound box. I understand that the pound is a better value, I just can't see when i'd need it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Wed, 08 May 2013, 13:24:03
Most places where your going to get a good price only sell the pound as they mostly do sell to individuals. If you want I can sell you some off my roll.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Wed, 08 May 2013, 15:32:15
Most places where your going to get a good price only sell the pound as they mostly do sell to individuals. If you want I can sell you some off my roll.

Would it still be worth it after shipping?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Michael on Wed, 08 May 2013, 16:01:36
SHAMELESS SELF-PLUG:


High quality soldering gear available here at a bargain price ;) (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=43174.0)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Wed, 08 May 2013, 16:07:27
SHAMELESS SELF-PLUG:


High quality soldering gear available here at a bargain price ;) (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=43174.0)

^
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Wed, 08 May 2013, 16:58:04
Just ordered a Hakko FX-888D.  Seems like a solid machine, despite looking a bit like a toy.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Wed, 08 May 2013, 17:00:29
Just ordered a Hakko FX-888D.  Seems like a solid machine, despite looking a bit like a toy.


AMG!

SHAMELESS SELF-PLUG:


High quality soldering gear available here at a bargain price ;) (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=43174.0)

^

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 08 May 2013, 17:20:15
regular 888 is an excellent station, the best hobbyist station that's been released in the last 20 years. i expect the 888d to only be better (calibration, their n2 pseudo-hot-air prework unit, etc)...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Wed, 08 May 2013, 19:49:25
Just ordered a Hakko FX-888D.  Seems like a solid machine, despite looking a bit like a toy.


AMG!

SHAMELESS SELF-PLUG:


High quality soldering gear available here at a bargain price ;) (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=43174.0)

^

Are you posting that because I should have gotten BroCaps' deal?  I definitely wanted to, but he wanted 325 for the whole set and wouldn't split it up.  Nothing wrong with that, I just don't have cash like that with all these keyboards I've been buying.  :P
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Wed, 08 May 2013, 20:16:45
Well, I bet you could have worked it out with one of the two people that want the desoldering gun.  But that's neither here nor there, enjoy the station.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Wed, 08 May 2013, 21:11:57
Oh, bummer!  Wish I had seen that people wanted the desolderer!  Ahhh well, too late, like you said.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Wed, 08 May 2013, 22:09:20
For someone who has never ever even attempted soldering and just wants to get started what do you all recommend as far as initial equipment?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: i3oilermaker on Wed, 08 May 2013, 22:20:06
So I ordered a "Weller WES51 Analog Soldering Station" from amazon and it came in a box that was taped shut.

When I took of the tip, it looked like there was some evidence of usage.  Can anyone confirm if this is normal for a brand new iron?


[attach=1][attach=2]
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: samwisekoi on Wed, 08 May 2013, 22:35:17
For someone who has never ever even attempted soldering and just wants to get started what do you all recommend as far as initial equipment?


Me, personally, I'd say a simple 25 watt Weller with a pencil tip, some good rosin-core solder, a sponge and an old VCR.  Maybe a de-soldering bulb too.  Then get some copper wire and maybe some resistors and start soldering stuff together and melting it apart.  Your goal is to make the solder flow like silver without touching it directly with the iron.

Get a little bit of solder on the iron, then touch it to the wire. Then touch the solder to the wire.  At first your solder joints wil be blobby, ugly, and grey.  That is a cold solder joint and you have to melt it away and try again.

This will go on for a while until suddenly you will see the solder flow like a living thing into the spot where you want it.  That is your first good solder joint, and it is really satisfying.  Keep practicing until they always look like that.

Then toss that starter gear into a tool chest and go buy some nice gear.  But go learn with a good-enough little 25 watt Weller.

 - Ron I samwisekoi
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SmallFry on Wed, 08 May 2013, 23:56:33
So I ordered a "Weller WES51 Analog Soldering Station" from amazon and it came in a box that was taped shut.

When I took of the tip, it looked like there was some evidence of usage.  Can anyone confirm if this is normal for a brand new iron?


(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
Appears to be used. I'd wait for another conformation though.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Thu, 09 May 2013, 00:01:07
Yeah it looks slightly used to me, too. Someone probably used it to solder a few things, then RMA'd it back to where you bought it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheQsanity on Thu, 09 May 2013, 00:10:44
Who has a Dremel and knows what grinding tip is used for aluminum? All the stones I have just get clogged up.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Thu, 09 May 2013, 04:12:08
Never done alu all i know it stainless eat those stones like crazy :(
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Thu, 09 May 2013, 08:56:42
there's a diamond coated grinding tip in the dremel catalog. it's small though, more of an engraver than a grinder. there's also a slightly larger version that i have, but i don't remember offhand how big it is. nowhere near as big as the stones. since the diamond is just straight up harder than the alu it should last quite a bit longer.

hmmmmmmmm... anyone want to trade an 888 for an 888d? :D i want dat calibration :P
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: metalliqaz on Thu, 09 May 2013, 08:56:52
For someone who has never ever even attempted soldering and just wants to get started what do you all recommend as far as initial equipment?

That's, like, the entire point of this thread dude.  OP!!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Thu, 09 May 2013, 09:13:40
For someone who has never ever even attempted soldering and just wants to get started what do you all recommend as far as initial equipment?

That's, like, the entire point of this thread dude.  OP!!


I gotta remember to read the OP more often  ::)

 
For someone who has never ever even attempted soldering and just wants to get started what do you all recommend as far as initial equipment?


Me, personally, I'd say a simple 25 watt Weller with a pencil tip, some good rosin-core solder, a sponge and an old VCR.  Maybe a de-soldering bulb too.  Then get some copper wire and maybe some resistors and start soldering stuff together and melting it apart.  Your goal is to make the solder flow like silver without touching it directly with the iron.

Get a little bit of solder on the iron, then touch it to the wire. Then touch the solder to the wire.  At first your solder joints wil be blobby, ugly, and grey.  That is a cold solder joint and you have to melt it away and try again.

This will go on for a while until suddenly you will see the solder flow like a living thing into the spot where you want it.  That is your first good solder joint, and it is really satisfying.  Keep practicing until they always look like that.

Then toss that starter gear into a tool chest and go buy some nice gear.  But go learn with a good-enough little 25 watt Weller.

 - Ron I samwisekoi

Thanks Ron! I've actually got a cordless phone I might attempt to repair just for kicks, once I get an idea of what I'm doing.  8)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Sai on Thu, 09 May 2013, 10:10:42
For someone who has never ever even attempted soldering and just wants to get started what do you all recommend as far as initial equipment?


Me, personally, I'd say a simple 25 watt Weller with a pencil tip, some good rosin-core solder, a sponge and an old VCR.  Maybe a de-soldering bulb too.  Then get some copper wire and maybe some resistors and start soldering stuff together and melting it apart.  Your goal is to make the solder flow like silver without touching it directly with the iron.

Get a little bit of solder on the iron, then touch it to the wire. Then touch the solder to the wire.  At first your solder joints wil be blobby, ugly, and grey.  That is a cold solder joint and you have to melt it away and try again.

This will go on for a while until suddenly you will see the solder flow like a living thing into the spot where you want it.  That is your first good solder joint, and it is really satisfying.  Keep practicing until they always look like that.

Then toss that starter gear into a tool chest and go buy some nice gear.  But go learn with a good-enough little 25 watt Weller.

 - Ron I samwisekoi

For someone who has never ever even attempted soldering and just wants to get started what do you all recommend as far as initial equipment?


Me, personally, I'd say a simple 25 watt Weller with a pencil tip, some good rosin-core solder, a sponge and an old VCR.  Maybe a de-soldering bulb too.  Then get some copper wire and maybe some resistors and start soldering stuff together and melting it apart.  Your goal is to make the solder flow like silver without touching it directly with the iron.

Get a little bit of solder on the iron, then touch it to the wire. Then touch the solder to the wire.  At first your solder joints wil be blobby, ugly, and grey.  That is a cold solder joint and you have to melt it away and try again.

This will go on for a while until suddenly you will see the solder flow like a living thing into the spot where you want it.  That is your first good solder joint, and it is really satisfying.  Keep practicing until they always look like that.

Then toss that starter gear into a tool chest and go buy some nice gear.  But go learn with a good-enough little 25 watt Weller.

 - Ron I samwisekoi

Thank you Ron. I am going to practice this weekend. :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Thu, 09 May 2013, 11:30:07
I had read (maybe even in this thread, who knows), that getting an old 2 dollar VCR, etc., at a garage sale, and desoldering a bunch of stuff, then attempting to "fix" it is a good way to get some experience with soldering. Doesn't really net you much, but if you break the VCR who cares.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: metalliqaz on Thu, 09 May 2013, 11:58:23
Forget the dusty old VCR.  Build a GH60!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Thu, 09 May 2013, 11:59:17
Or an Epsilon  ;)

The hottest new custom around ^__^
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Thu, 09 May 2013, 14:01:57
Forget the dusty old VCR.  Build a GH60!

Isn't the GB closed? If I could get my hands on one I'd consider it. A lot to know about layouts, mapping of switches (unless you do your whole board the same, but where's the fun in that) cases, etc.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Fri, 10 May 2013, 16:36:11
I want to start to solder...laugh at me and all,

but is the WLC100 a good start?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Fri, 10 May 2013, 16:37:31
I want to start to solder...laugh at me and all,

but is the WLC100 a good start?

Yes, but you could spend like $30 bucks more and have a hakko instead
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: i3oilermaker on Fri, 10 May 2013, 16:38:05
I got 2 from amazon that had beat up boxes and burn marks...sent them both back

Trying the Hakko 888D (on order)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: keymaster on Fri, 10 May 2013, 16:39:37
I want to start to solder...laugh at me and all,

but is the WLC100 a good start?

I just started soldering and I have the WLC 100. I've had an easy time soldering with it. You may want to get an Edsyn Desoldering Pump because it made my desoldering effortless.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Fri, 10 May 2013, 16:42:44
Yes, but you could spend like $30 bucks more and have a hakko instead
I got 2 from amazon that had beat up boxes and burn marks...sent them both back
Trying the Hakko 888D (on order)

Sounds like i should wait until summer, so i will have a job and can pay for the hakko. Thanks for the advice

I just started soldering and I have the WLC 100. I've had an easy time soldering with it. You may want to get an Edsyn Desoldering Pump because it made my desoldering effortless.

shall look into that as well
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: i3oilermaker on Fri, 10 May 2013, 16:49:07
Sounds like i should wait until summer, so i will have a job and can pay for the hakko. Thanks for the advice

The Hakko was only like $15 more on amazon than the weller
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: i3oilermaker on Fri, 10 May 2013, 16:56:23
Are weller and hakko tips different?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: gnubag on Sat, 11 May 2013, 00:29:04
Are weller and hakko tips different?

yes as far as i know.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Sat, 11 May 2013, 05:01:40
This was just asked to me, so I figured I also mention it in this thread since it hasn't been brought up yet: if you want to clean up all the rosin and flux after soldering, you can use kimwipes with isopropyl alcohol.

Kimwipes are really for lab environment, but I use it because they're disposable microfiber tissues to prevent scratching, and also won't leave any lint fibers. For the cleaning solution, 99% isopropyl alcohol works well. Spray on a decent amount, and let it sit for a minute or two to disolve all the flux, then scrub with a brush or Q-tips, and finally finish it off with kimwipes. Alternatively, you can also literally submerge the whole PCB under a bowl (or bucket) of isopropyl alcohol, then take it out and air dry. Try not to use buy the cheapo isopropyl alcohol you find in walmart type stores. Those are weak and diluted.


http://www.amazon.com/Kimtech-Science-KimWipes-Delicate-Wiper/dp/B0013HT2QW (http://goo.gl/oS2e6)
http://www.amazon.com/MG-Chemicals-Isopropyl-Alcohol-Cleaner/dp/B005DNQX3C/ref=pd_sim_indust (http://goo.gl/azolZ)



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Z7nCAxS2Rg#t=28m12s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Z7nCAxS2Rg#t=28m12s)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: metalliqaz on Sat, 11 May 2013, 12:02:23
I need to get myself some 99% isopropyl.  I have 75% from the grocery, but I can only use it very carefully with qtips
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Thechemist on Sat, 11 May 2013, 12:55:48
I need to get myself some 99% isopropyl.  I have 75% from the grocery, but I can only use it very carefully with qtips

Anything 91% and above is great since it has <10% of water ( and dries cleaner ) and the 91% is more accessible than the 99%. You can visit your local drugs store and see if you can score some 99% and if you live in the states you can get one here (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Brand-NEW-99-Isopropyl-Rubbing-Alcohol-16-oz-PINT-EXP-09-2015-/140929545956?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20d00e36e4) and save some gas money.

Edit:

I also suggest taking off that rebranded DMM from OP, i wouldn't suggest that meter since it isn't accurate and the quality isn't much better than the $20 DMMs out there. Sure it has some features but it isn't a good entry point DMM.

This meter would be considered a much better suggestion and competes with $100+ DMMs out there.

At ~$56 best bang for your buck is the UNI-T UT61E DMM. Just make sure you clean the leads with alcohol when you receive it.
Some reviews show it overshoots but others don't, it could be fixed on newer revisions?
It is one of the best DC and AC DMM that also has TRUE RMS.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/UNI-T-UT61E-AC-DC-Modern-Digital-Multimeter-gl-/251267628025?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a80b7bbf9

It has nice feature that tests smd components and  resistors with ease .

Show Image
(http://lygte-info.dk/pic/UNI-T/UT61E/DSC_1413.jpg)
Show Image
(http://lygte-info.dk/pic/UNI-T/UT61E/DSC_1428.jpg)


Quote
The test socket that is included can be used when measuring resistors and capacitors, both SMD and leaded components. It can also be used for transistor test, but not on this DMM model. Including this type of test socket is much safer than making extra holes in the meter for test connections.
Note: This socket uses the mAuA terminal, instead of the COM terminal, i.e. it requires that the meter supports this.

Some reviews.
More
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sat, 11 May 2013, 15:51:33
That would hold water if not for every review of the meter I have posted, while admitting it's a rebranded MASTECH, saying that it's a fine multimeter with good accuracy, range and durability.

Oh and "it competes well with 100+ DMMs", too.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Thechemist on Sat, 11 May 2013, 18:08:07
That would hold water if not for every review of the meter I have posted, while admitting it's a rebranded MASTECH, saying that it's a fine multimeter with good accuracy, range and durability.

Oh and "it competes well with 100+ DMMs", too.

Hahahaha, that brought tears to my eyes, I needed that laugh. Thanks.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Mandolin on Sat, 11 May 2013, 18:11:49
For the ones that speak spanish, rosin is called "pez/P de castilla". Also one could make flux directly out of tree resin with isopropylic alcohol, ideally pine because it is specially acid and a weak acid is needed to dissolve the outer corrosion layer of soldering. If too rusted, use some sandpaper.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sat, 11 May 2013, 18:24:39
That would hold water if not for every review of the meter I have posted, while admitting it's a rebranded MASTECH, saying that it's a fine multimeter with good accuracy, range and durability.

Oh and "it competes well with 100+ DMMs", too.

Hahahaha, that brought tears to my eyes, I needed that laugh. Thanks.

That's cool, don't suggest that DMM again, thanks.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Thechemist on Sat, 11 May 2013, 18:40:13
I guess this is communist Russia time or better yet China  :)) where information is a no-no.

I'll just leave this here for others to read since I assume, I still have that right and maybe next time post some proper reviews. That meter might be good at a $20 price point but not when it is in the price range of the meter i suggested and trust me i have done my research and can back it up.

http://www.eevblog.com/forum/beginners/good-budgetish-multimeter/
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sat, 11 May 2013, 18:42:31
Listen, you can be ****ty somewhere else, I don't really care.  But the fact remains that every time you brought up that other DMM, I looked into and compared the two and found nothing tangible for the usage that would justify the price difference.

Call it whatever you want, just call it that somewhere else and stop ****ting in my thread.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Thechemist on Sat, 11 May 2013, 18:48:39
Listen, you can be ****ty somewhere else, I don't really care.  But the fact remains that every time you brought up that other DMM, I looked into and compared the two and found nothing tangible for the usage that would justify the price difference.

Call it whatever you want, just call it that somewhere else and stop ****ting in my thread.

All I am trying to do is inform my fellow GHackers that there are other options out there with much better precision and actual options that are used in real world, I would expect someone to do the same for me. You may not think it but this thread will influence many readers and i just want them to have their facts straight before they purchase something they might regret later.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sat, 11 May 2013, 19:04:08
See:  Be ****ty elsewhere.

To imply that I don't think this thread will have any influence is borderline insulting as that's exactly why I wrote it.  Just because I didn't fall over myself to add your suggestion, doesn't mean the opposite.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Glissant on Sat, 11 May 2013, 19:10:09
I think it was more the fact that you laughed at what tjcaustin said, Thechemist. It shows very little respect for what tjcaustin is doing in this thread, and it contributes nothing to the conversation other than to show that you are another person to claim that his own research is the only research.

The DMM that has been suggested is fine. The one you suggested is also fine.
I suggest that we go back to the serious business of the keyboards and solder now.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Thechemist on Sat, 11 May 2013, 19:11:55
Well, I was giving you the benefit of the doubt that you were intelligent enough to do your homework before you post things here.  You either don't think this thread will influence people, which you already admitted that it does, than the only other thing left is to assume you are ..........
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sat, 11 May 2013, 19:16:56
Well, come on then, you had the balls to get that far.  Call me stupid, *******.

I would think the one that is clearly acting like he doesn't know what the phrase "reading comprehension" means shouldn't be talking down about someone else's intelligence.

Especially since it's based off of some rather bold assumptions that I didn't research your suggestion three (3) separate times and made the same judgement call that the additional umph was worth muddling the choices.  I feel like I just said this, too...

So again, go be ****ty elsewhere.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Thechemist on Sat, 11 May 2013, 19:20:50
I think it was more the fact that you laughed at what tjcaustin said, Thechemist. It shows very little respect for what tjcaustin is doing in this thread, and it contributes nothing to the conversation other than to show that you are another person to claim that his own research is the only research.

The DMM that has been suggested is fine. The one you suggested is also fine.
I suggest that we go back to the serious business of the keyboards and solder now.

I tried to suggest nicely at first that there are better options out there and my suggestions were just dismissed when i was just trying to help others. I also posted thorough reviews from reputable sources as you will see below. Tjcaustin was actually disrespecting me with his language and tone not I.

At ~$56 best bang for your buck is the UNI-T UT61E DMM. Just make sure you clean the leads with alcohol when you receive it.
Some reviews show it overshoots but others don't, it could be fixed on newer revisions?
It is one of the best DC and AC DMM that also has TRUE RMS.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/UNI-T-UT61E-AC-DC-Modern-Digital-Multimeter-gl-/251267628025?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a80b7bbf9

It has nice feature that tests smd components and  resistors with ease .

Show Image
(http://lygte-info.dk/pic/UNI-T/UT61E/DSC_1413.jpg)
Show Image
(http://lygte-info.dk/pic/UNI-T/UT61E/DSC_1428.jpg)


Quote
The test socket that is included can be used when measuring resistors and capacitors, both SMD and leaded components. It can also be used for transistor test, but not on this DMM model. Including this type of test socket is much safer than making extra holes in the meter for test connections.
Note: This socket uses the mAuA terminal, instead of the COM terminal, i.e. it requires that the meter supports this.

Some reviews.
More

That Sinometer is junk a cheap rebrand ( can't calibrate and not very accurate ), I was doing research on which is the best DMM to buy and the one i posted earlier is the best bang for your buck and not that much more than that junky meter.

I need to get myself some 99% isopropyl.  I have 75% from the grocery, but I can only use it very carefully with qtips

Anything 91% and above is great since it has <10% of water ( and dries cleaner ) and the 91% is more accessible than the 99%. You can visit your local drugs store and see if you can score some 99% and if you live in the states you can get one here (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Brand-NEW-99-Isopropyl-Rubbing-Alcohol-16-oz-PINT-EXP-09-2015-/140929545956?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20d00e36e4) and save some gas money.

Edit:

I also suggest taking off that rebranded DMM from OP, i wouldn't suggest that meter since it isn't accurate and the quality isn't much better than the $20 DMMs out there. Sure it has some features but it isn't a good entry point DMM.

This meter would be considered a much better suggestion and competes with $100+ DMMs out there.

At ~$56 best bang for your buck is the UNI-T UT61E DMM. Just make sure you clean the leads with alcohol when you receive it.
Some reviews show it overshoots but others don't, it could be fixed on newer revisions?
It is one of the best DC and AC DMM that also has TRUE RMS.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/UNI-T-UT61E-AC-DC-Modern-Digital-Multimeter-gl-/251267628025?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a80b7bbf9

It has nice feature that tests smd components and  resistors with ease .

Show Image
(http://lygte-info.dk/pic/UNI-T/UT61E/DSC_1413.jpg)
Show Image
(http://lygte-info.dk/pic/UNI-T/UT61E/DSC_1428.jpg)


Quote
The test socket that is included can be used when measuring resistors and capacitors, both SMD and leaded components. It can also be used for transistor test, but not on this DMM model. Including this type of test socket is much safer than making extra holes in the meter for test connections.
Note: This socket uses the mAuA terminal, instead of the COM terminal, i.e. it requires that the meter supports this.

Some reviews.
More

I guess this is communist Russia time or better yet China  :)) where information is a no-no.

I'll just leave this here for others to read since I assume, I still have that right and maybe next time post some proper reviews. That meter might be good at a $20 price point but not when it is in the price range of the meter i suggested and trust me i have done my research and can back it up.

http://www.eevblog.com/forum/beginners/good-budgetish-multimeter/


Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Thechemist on Sat, 11 May 2013, 19:24:42
Well, come on then, you had the balls to get that far.  Call me stupid, *******.

I would think the one that is clearly acting like he doesn't know what the phrase "reading comprehension" means shouldn't be talking down about someone else's intelligence.

Especially since it's based off of some rather bold assumptions that I didn't research your suggestion three (3) separate times and made the same judgement call that the additional umph was worth muddling the choices.  I feel like I just said this, too...

So again, go be ****ty elsewhere.

Please stop, I never called you stupid, you called yourself that.  :p
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sat, 11 May 2013, 19:25:48
Cool story bro.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: metalliqaz on Sun, 12 May 2013, 09:26:07
I have the world's crappiest meter from back in my poor college days and for simple keyboard work it is plenty.  It seriously doesn't matter... The electronics aren't sensitive enough.  If anyone wants a really good one that will be dependable for many years,  get a Fluke and be done with it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Mon, 13 May 2013, 12:04:32
(http://www.hearth.com/talk/attachments/derailment-jpg.96771/)

So I picked up "Getting started in Electronics" by Forrest M. Mims III over the weekend, already about 50 pages in. It's all pretty basic stuff so far, but it's pretty useful information if you're looking to do work with circuitry and electronics. Others who are looking to get a foothold in the electronics world might do well to start here.

http://www.amazon.com/Getting-Started-Electronics-Forrest-Mims/dp/0945053282/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1368464739&sr=8-1&keywords=getting+started+in+electronics+by+forrest+m.+mims+iii
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Mon, 13 May 2013, 16:57:57
I want to start to solder...laugh at me and all,

but is the WLC100 a good start?

Yes, but you could spend like $30 bucks more and have a hakko instead

which hakko should i be looking for?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: i3oilermaker on Mon, 13 May 2013, 16:58:59


which hakko should i be looking for?

888D - mine should come today.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Mon, 13 May 2013, 17:01:18

which hakko should i be looking for?

888D - mine should come today.

the WLC100 is like ~$30
the 888D is like ~$90

am i looking at the wrong 888D?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Mon, 13 May 2013, 17:03:08


which hakko should i be looking for?

888D - mine should come today.

So is there some debate on the digital versus analog and proper temperature control? I was just reading some reviews on both and it seemed like some prefer one over the other but I wasn't sure if that was a personal preference or an actual real world use issue.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: i3oilermaker on Mon, 13 May 2013, 17:06:06

which hakko should i be looking for?

888D - mine should come today.

the WLC100 is like ~$30
the 888D is like ~$90

am i looking at the wrong 888D?

Perhaps TJ was thinking of the Weller WES51 not the 100
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Mon, 13 May 2013, 17:23:45
I want to start to solder...laugh at me and all,

but is the WLC100 a good start?

Yes, but you could spend like $30 bucks more and have a hakko instead

which hakko should i be looking for?

The current base model Hakko is the FX-888D. The previous model was the analog FX-888. You might also be able to pick up a nice used Hakko 936. The 936 was around for years, and there are plenty of nice used ones around.

Also, the Weller WLC100 is a little basic. It's just above a Radio Shack iron. The WLC100 has no real temperature control, just a dial from 1-5 which controls the wattage to the iron.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Mon, 13 May 2013, 17:41:49
So is there some debate on the digital versus analog and proper temperature control? I was just reading some reviews on both and it seemed like some prefer one over the other but I wasn't sure if that was a personal preference or an actual real world use issue.

That's what i'm concerned about. It seems like the actual adjustment is the issue, as the 888D only has 2 buttons, making precision temperatures hard to pinpoint. It also (ironically) apparently doesn't show you the actual temperature (like an oven) but rather just the target temp, which would be a huge plus on a digital iron.

At the moment i'm thinking of going with the manual weller, it looks like less of a toy, and it's 'MURICAN
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Mon, 13 May 2013, 17:49:00
So is there some debate on the digital versus analog and proper temperature control? I was just reading some reviews on both and it seemed like some prefer one over the other but I wasn't sure if that was a personal preference or an actual real world use issue.

That's what i'm concerned about. It seems like the actual adjustment is the issue, as the 888D only has 2 buttons, making precision temperatures hard to pinpoint. It also (ironically) apparently doesn't show you the actual temperature (like an oven) but rather just the target temp, which would be a huge plus on a digital iron.

At the moment i'm thinking of going with the manual weller, it looks like less of a toy, and it's 'MURICAN

I had also read somewhere that the 888D doesn't show the actual temperature, but rather the target temp.  Then I watched this review,
t=3m43s and at the time I've linked to it seems to be showing the actual temperature.
Maybe someone who owns one can comment further.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Mon, 13 May 2013, 17:56:15
My Hakko FX-888D appears to show the actual temperature, as it shows the temp on the display as the iron is heating up. Also, it will drop a couple degrees if you wipe the tip on a sponge with water.

The digital adjustment is precise, and not hard to set. The adjustment button only goes in one direction, up, so if you miss your target temp, you just have to go back around again. :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Mon, 13 May 2013, 18:14:19
Good to hear it from the horse's mouth.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: remedyhalopc on Mon, 13 May 2013, 18:47:50
What technique do you guys use for freeing bent pins that are soldered on in between the pin and the PCB?

Just hold the tip on the leg until the solder underneath melts?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Mon, 13 May 2013, 21:34:15
I use my teeth.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Mon, 13 May 2013, 22:24:09
What technique do you guys use for freeing bent pins that are soldered on in between the pin and the PCB?

Just hold the tip on the leg until the solder underneath melts?

after desoldering a WYSE terminal board today, I really want to know why they bent the pins on some of the switch legs. It's annoying.

Ahh, so that's what you meant in the soldering thread. :)  I couldn't quite get what you were asking. Yeah, just remove the solder from the joint. Then, to remove the switch from the PCB/plate, put the tip of a phillips head screwdriver on the little nub where the switch pokes out of the PCB, and push...hard! It will pop right out of there.

I recently desoldered 12 WYSE terminal boards over a couple days. About half of them were made in Taiwan. On those boards, it looked as if they were soldered by hand, not by machine. Every solder joint had textbook solder fills that covered 100% of the solder pad and were perfectly concave. I have no idea why they bent those pins, though.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: remedyhalopc on Mon, 13 May 2013, 23:00:35
The one I desoldered tonight didn't. It had the gross round solder on the bent pins instead of the concave ones.

I use my teeth.

Dang girl, you naughty.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: dorkvader on Tue, 14 May 2013, 01:33:23
I recently got in an OKI PS900 soldering iron, and it's excellent. You can hot change tips with the base, which is really nice. The "smart heat" makes a lot of sense to me, but I know many are skeptical. I haven't tried the famous Hakko FX888[D] so I can't compare there.

The only thing I can think of about those bent pins on WYSE is that it'd help keep it in place a little better. I still have yet to try desoldering, but the last time I used my edsyn soldapullt, it was a disaster, I couldn't get it to work at all!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Tue, 14 May 2013, 11:12:05
looking to make an exhaust pipe for my solder work, thinking one of those wire and paper ducts and a 120 mm fan would work fine, eh? Just set it up to pull air and stick it out the window?

You guys figure any hardware store should have that paper ducts? Is it a good idea to use that or is there something else I should consider?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Tue, 14 May 2013, 11:13:27
looking to make an exhaust pipe for my solder work, thinking one of those wire and paper ducts and a 120 mm fan would work fine, eh? Just set it up to pull air and stick it out the window?

You guys figure any hardware store should have that paper ducts? Is it a good idea to use that or is there something else I should consider?

You can do that, or you can make an activated carbon filter and stick that on the back of your fan.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Tue, 14 May 2013, 13:23:16
looking to make an exhaust pipe for my solder work, thinking one of those wire and paper ducts and a 120 mm fan would work fine, eh? Just set it up to pull air and stick it out the window?

You guys figure any hardware store should have that paper ducts? Is it a good idea to use that or is there something else I should consider?

I've been thinking about dealing with fumes lately as well here are a few things I've found

thread by mkawa -> http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=40060.0 (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=40060.0)

http://www.instructables.com/id/DIY-Fume-Extractor/ (http://www.instructables.com/id/DIY-Fume-Extractor/)

http://hackaday.com/2008/08/05/how-to-the-hackers-soldering-station/

this is I think is just cool not sure how much good it would really do

http://blog.makezine.com/2008/03/30/diy-fume-extractor-1/ (http://blog.makezine.com/2008/03/30/diy-fume-extractor-1/)

[attach=1]
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 14 May 2013, 16:45:48
that reminds me i forgot to post a picture for that thread

(http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=42824.0;attach=22042;image)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Tue, 14 May 2013, 18:16:39
Is the burger king crown needed for proper operation of the fanbox?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 14 May 2013, 18:19:41
yes. such a fume extractor only works if it is coronated king of the desk.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: dndlmx on Tue, 14 May 2013, 18:46:00
I specifically ordered a Hakko FX-888 (analog) from vendor linked by OP, and received a digital instead.  ;D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Tue, 14 May 2013, 18:49:07
I ordered a Hakko FX-888 (analog) from vendor linked by OP, and received a digital instead.  ;D

Yes, I think it's in the OP now, but I posted a while back that you can get the new digital version for the price of the analog by ordering through niosales on eBay. It's a nice little discount. :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: dndlmx on Tue, 14 May 2013, 20:09:08
It's kinda confusing. I watched videos on the Hakko site, all I actually know how to do, is go up/down manually. I did manage to change to Celcius though.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 14 May 2013, 20:26:39
anyone want to trade their 888d for an 888? :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: metalliqaz on Tue, 14 May 2013, 21:11:46
Are they different enough to take the trouble?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 14 May 2013, 23:52:50
i might be crazy enough to get the tip thermometer and calibrate a digital unit. i will add some cash if you want it. and tips! i have tons of tips (even repeats for a dumb reason; reason: i am dumb).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Tue, 14 May 2013, 23:56:15
*This* one? http://www.ebay.com/itm/DIGITAL-THERMOMETER-SOLDERING-IRON-TESTER-Hakko-FG-100-new-/330917638576?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4d0c3a71b0
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 14 May 2013, 23:58:57
that's a fake, but yes. the real one is an extremely accurate tip thermometer and retails for 200$.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 15 May 2013, 00:01:34
geez. on second thought maybe i should just buy a high end hakko station with hot air and sell you guys my 888
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: dndlmx on Wed, 15 May 2013, 00:19:24
*This* one? http://www.ebay.com/itm/DIGITAL-THERMOMETER-SOLDERING-IRON-TESTER-Hakko-FG-100-new-/330917638576?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4d0c3a71b0

Seems pretty legit.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 15 May 2013, 00:38:17
a single type K thermometer lead costs more than that ebay product. sorry, not legit :(
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Wed, 15 May 2013, 00:40:42
Maybe it's just stolen, bro. It could be real... :(
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: dndlmx on Wed, 15 May 2013, 00:41:48
a single type K thermometer lead costs more than that ebay product. sorry, not legit :(

I know, the FG-100 is like $200.  :))
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Wed, 15 May 2013, 00:42:14
For keyboards, do you really need to be that accurate with temperature?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 15 May 2013, 00:46:15
no, i'm totally just anal beyond belief.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 15 May 2013, 00:52:34
ahaah i just remembered how much an fm-206 costs. yah, that's not happening for a while

still open to trading for an 888d! :D like old school analog dials? boy have i got a dial for you :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheFlyingRaccoon on Wed, 15 May 2013, 10:45:22
Does anyone have any experience with the Weller WLC100? I am considering buying it but I'm worried about the fact it does not have a temperature control but rather 1-5 levels instead. Any  thoughts?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Wed, 15 May 2013, 10:49:05
Does anyone have any experience with the Weller WLC100? I am considering buying it but I'm worried about the fact it does not have a temperature control but rather 1-5 levels instead. Any  thoughts?

I personally wouldn't recommend it, but it is better than an unregulated cheapo iron.

If you're looking for something cheap, get this: Yihua 936 (https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=19240) from HobbyKing.

I bought one for testing purposes, but there is a breakdown of it here:
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Wed, 15 May 2013, 10:52:11
I prefer the analogue myself but I just picked one up but it seems I have to do an unexpected repair to it, so I have a question for you all how do they expect you to repair your soldering iron when the fix requires you to desolder and solder something?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Thechemist on Wed, 15 May 2013, 11:15:16
Does anyone have any experience with the Weller WLC100? I am considering buying it but I'm worried about the fact it does not have a temperature control but rather 1-5 levels instead. Any  thoughts?

I personally wouldn't recommend it, but it is better than an unregulated cheapo iron.

If you're looking for something cheap, get this: Yihua 936 (https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=19240) from HobbyKing.

I bought one for testing purposes, but there is a breakdown of it here:

If you set idle on the above link it will pop up with a message ( bottom right ) telling you that you can buy it for ~$15 instead of a the ~16 ( i think it takes ~5 minutes ) as a one time offer if you want to save additional $1.  ;D

here is the message:

Quote
Hello shopper!
We noticed you've been looking at this product for a while and we would like to offer you a discount. If you click on the add to cart button below we can offer you this product for $15.62.
This offer will only show once.
If you leave this page or close this window you will not see this offer again.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: metalliqaz on Wed, 15 May 2013, 11:15:34
Another soldering iron.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Wed, 15 May 2013, 11:17:44
I prefer the analogue myself but I just picked one up but it seems I have to do an unexpected repair to it, so I have a question for you all how do they expect you to repair your soldering iron when the fix requires you to desolder and solder something?

You just picked one up, but it already needs a repair? I would RMA it under warranty. Or you could use another soldering iron, like metalliqaz said. :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Wed, 15 May 2013, 11:43:47
Another soldering iron.

I prefer the analogue myself but I just picked one up but it seems I have to do an unexpected repair to it, so I have a question for you all how do they expect you to repair your soldering iron when the fix requires you to desolder and solder something?

You just picked one up, but it already needs a repair? I would RMA it under warranty. Or you could use another soldering iron, like metalliqaz said. :)


Well I got it used so I dont think I can RMA it and yes I do have another 888 I can repair it with but what if I didnt? It was more of a conundrum as you can buy replacement parts but you still need a second soldering iron to fix it. This reminds me of computers now days for the most part you need a computer to easily diagnose and fix another one.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Wed, 15 May 2013, 11:49:36
OP can be updated, the weller is 100 bucks+shipping on partsexpress, but it's only 86+free shipping on amazon. (Technically you can get 5-10 day shipping for free on P.E. but I think the super saver shipping is 5 or 3 day on Amazon and 2 day on Amazon Prime.)

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000BRC2XU/ref=dra_a_cs_lb_hn_it_P1400_1000?tag=dradis-20

Shame I already ordered mine from P.E, live and learn.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Wed, 15 May 2013, 12:36:53
I would also recommended getting your solder from all-spec http://goo.gl/bLf3j they also have the best prices that I can find on the lindstrom tools. The only thing I would but from parts express is the WBT 4% silver solder http://goo.gl/xR3Jh as their the only one that I can find that carries it as a licensed distributor. All-Spec has also had every replacement part or accessory that ive need for and of my Hakko stuff.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Wed, 15 May 2013, 14:04:28
dang man, I already placed my full order from PE (I did end up caving and buying the roll of solder) now i'm finding that I could have saved like 25 bucks ordering from a couple of different stores. I guess it pays to price check.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Wed, 15 May 2013, 14:45:44
dang man, I already placed my full order from PE (I did end up caving and buying the roll of solder) now i'm finding that I could have saved like 25 bucks ordering from a couple of different stores. I guess it pays to price check.

yea all-spec has the best prices on solder that ive found online but wasnt easy to find. I actually found it when I was looking for my lindstrom wire cutters and they has the best price of the places that would sell to a normal old consumer like me.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 15 May 2013, 19:04:25
Does anyone have any experience with the Weller WLC100? I am considering buying it but I'm worried about the fact it does not have a temperature control but rather 1-5 levels instead. Any  thoughts?
had one for years, did not like. bad temp recovery, takes forever to heat up, etc. etc.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: dndlmx on Wed, 15 May 2013, 19:11:27
FX-888 is crazy, coming from a cheap Weller iron. It heats up in like 20 seconds, not even. MFW first time turning it on ->  :eek:
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: aggiejy on Wed, 15 May 2013, 21:00:08
<3 my 888D. :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: keymaster on Wed, 15 May 2013, 21:03:00
Does anyone have any experience with the Weller WLC100? I am considering buying it but I'm worried about the fact it does not have a temperature control but rather 1-5 levels instead. Any  thoughts?
had one for years, did not like. bad temp recovery, takes forever to heat up, etc. etc.

It heats up within a minute if you pre-heat on level 5, then drop it down to level 3 to use for soldering. I just finished soldering my QFR today and only had to heat it up at the start of the process.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: i3oilermaker on Wed, 15 May 2013, 21:08:07
Just fired up my 888D for the first time...works like a dream.

Dropped 3 diodes on my phantom.  Got a couple left to go :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Sifo on Wed, 15 May 2013, 21:10:05
Does anyone have any experience with the Weller WLC100? I am considering buying it but I'm worried about the fact it does not have a temperature control but rather 1-5 levels instead. Any  thoughts?
had one for years, did not like. bad temp recovery, takes forever to heat up, etc. etc.

It heats up within a minute if you pre-heat on level 5, then drop it down to level 3 to use for soldering. I just finished soldering my QFR today and only had to heat it up at the start of the process.

I do the exact same thing here. WLC100 is good.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: aggiejy on Wed, 15 May 2013, 21:11:41
Just fired up my 888D for the first time...works like a dream.

Dropped 3 diodes on my phantom.  Got a couple left to go :)

Depending on the size of diodes, I recommend this tip (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004ORB8GK/ref=oh_details_o04_s02_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1). I was able to easily do 0603 size components with it. Maybe it's a little smaller than ideal for phantom diodes though... I just find the included standard tip huge for most keyboard work.  I originally got this (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00762AGTA/ref=oh_details_o06_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) for the super small stuff, but it was TOO small... it seemed to loose heat too fast at the end, even at full temp.

That said, there are so many hakko tips... if anyone has recommendations for keyboard work, I'd love to know!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheFlyingRaccoon on Wed, 15 May 2013, 21:18:59
Does anyone have any experience with the Weller WLC100? I am considering buying it but I'm worried about the fact it does not have a temperature control but rather 1-5 levels instead. Any  thoughts?
had one for years, did not like. bad temp recovery, takes forever to heat up, etc. etc.

It heats up within a minute if you pre-heat on level 5, then drop it down to level 3 to use for soldering. I just finished soldering my QFR today and only had to heat it up at the start of the process.

Well I ended up buying a Hakko 936. Super excited! And it has an actual temperature controller.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: i3oilermaker on Wed, 15 May 2013, 22:23:08
Just fired up my 888D for the first time...works like a dream.

Dropped 3 diodes on my phantom.  Got a couple left to go :)

Depending on the size of diodes, I recommend this tip (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004ORB8GK/ref=oh_details_o04_s02_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1). I was able to easily do 0603 size components with it. Maybe it's a little smaller than ideal for phantom diodes though... I just find the included standard tip huge for most keyboard work.  I originally got this (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00762AGTA/ref=oh_details_o06_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) for the super small stuff, but it was TOO small... it seemed to loose heat too fast at the end, even at full temp.

That said, there are so many hakko tips... if anyone has recommendations for keyboard work, I'd love to know!


Sold - Thanks for the....wait for it.... TIP
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Wed, 15 May 2013, 23:13:51
I use the smallest chisel tip i think it 0.8mm as I do SMD diodes fairly frequently and some other SMD stuff every now and then. If I didnt do smd i would have just kept using the standard tip I believe a 1.6mm chisel as it was quite nice for switch though maybe a tad big for leds buts when use vertically on its side it would get the job done.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: aggiejy on Wed, 15 May 2013, 23:21:23
Well, that second tip I linked was 0.2mm... so 0.8mm certainly isn't the smallest.  But really, it's too small to do anything with that I've come across.  And I doubt many people are doing stuff smaller than 0603 by hand anyway.  (I'm talking about SMT...)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 15 May 2013, 23:24:09
hakko 936 is the predecessor to the 888 series. basically the same thing in older plastic. all are good workhorse irons, as is the veneral wes51. seriously, those with the wlc100. you have NO IDEA WHAT YOU'RE MISSING. the element in the latter irons actually heats up in like 10s, STOPS heating up when it hits temp, and then recovers w/in like 2-3s after every joint. it just makes life measuably better.

also, hakko's brass ball tip cleaners are freaking awesome. sponges suck
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Wed, 15 May 2013, 23:24:36
Well, that second tip I linked was 0.2mm... so 0.8mm certainly isn't the smallest.  But really, it's too small to do anything with that I've come across.  And I doubt many people are doing stuff smaller than 0603 by hand anyway.  (I'm talking about SMT...)

0.8 is the smallest chisel tip and even then only had a slight chisel very close to the tip but its there
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Wed, 15 May 2013, 23:27:46
also, hakko's brass ball tip cleaners are freaking awesome. sponges suck

ditto, though I think the one that comes with the 888 is too small and had too small a hole to get to it. Also people the wire sponge is to clean your tip not to put it in the back of your stand let your iron sit in to well its in the stand >.>
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Wed, 15 May 2013, 23:34:44
Also people the wire sponge is to clean your tip not to put it in the back of your stand let your iron sit in to well its in the stand >.>

Wut?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Thu, 16 May 2013, 00:09:57
umm

corrected: Also people the wire sponge is to clean your tip not to put it in the back of your stand let your iron sit in it well its in the stand >.>


basically the 888 i just bought used has the wire sponge where the tip of the iron ends up when you place the iron in the stand and the heat completely wrecked the wire sponge and who knows what it did to that tip. I just changed the tip right away when I got it because it looked very worn to me and i use a different size anyway.


EDIT: correcter. sorry, I made sure to give the cellular phone a talking to snf gave it a time out.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Thu, 16 May 2013, 02:33:53
basically the 888 i just bought used has the wire sponge where you tip of the iron ends up when you place the iron in the stand and the hear completely wrecked the wire sponge and who knows what it did to that tip I just changed it when I got it because it looked very worn to me and i use a different size anyway.

lol what? This is barely understandable. You need a keyboard with auto-correct.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: dndlmx on Thu, 16 May 2013, 02:42:12
... yes you're not supposed to have the metal sponge in the rear compartment.  :-X
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Thu, 16 May 2013, 03:02:55
... yes you're not supposed to have the metal sponge in the rear compartment.  :-X

no as constant heat wrecks it and there is a nice spot with a hole in the front and if you take the bottom off you have easy access to put the sponge in. I know no one reads manuals but im pretty sure that thats in there.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: dndlmx on Thu, 16 May 2013, 03:11:25
Hakko has videos online.
I didn't know the bottom came off, at first. I stuffed the wire sponge through the front hole.  ^-^
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Thu, 16 May 2013, 14:20:19
another thing is that I have bever had a helping hand that has lasted longer that a couple months they just seem to fall apart and it doesnt seem to matter at which price point I buy them either as their all mad just about the same. I bought a panavise instead http://goo.gl/WrQRF I havnt a clue if that a good price or not as I didnt get it from there. the one bad thing about the suction cup model os it only works on non porous surfaces since it a suction cup but now all the surfaces i work on are porous so im thinking about getting 2 of the ones your supposed to bolt to you workbench and mounting them to a board?

Also i would recommended good full spectrum lighting it makes everything so much easier to see I bought 2 of these http://amzn.to/19tQJSN but that was before you could just get light bulbs http://amzn.to/19tR1sO So now I would just buy a set of those bulbs and a pair of these http://amzn.to/19tRgUJ (they also have ones with stands for those of you cant clamp it to your table/desk/workbench.

for hand desoldering pumps I recommended either http://goo.gl/5r45g or http://goo.gl/4MhbZ they do also make which I would like but http://goo.gl/4qGAX but I havnt been able to find it anywhere but direct from them and their shipping is crazy high.

the Hakko 808 is a great desoldering iron from my experience but the price is steep compared to just a hand pump. But if you do get one I would recommend getting http://amzn.to/19tTyTJ so you have a stand to put it in and http://amzn.to/19tTNhR so you can tun it off without have to unplug the darn thing.

The Hakko 633-01 is also in my eyes a huge upgrade from the standard stand the comes with the 888 and the whole for the wire sponge and wire sponge it self is much larger. Another benefit is that paint chips dont come off and get stuck to your iron. i personally thought that it was a bit light when I received it so I added a bunch of lead weight to it since I had it lying around but I think that a personal preference thing. Also for those of you people that prefer a normal sponge the 633-02 is the same stand just with a standard sponge.

I have a multimeter and it seems pretty nice but I havnt a clue what brand or anything as i got it for a present one year, though it does support monitoring from a PC though a serial port. The heat gun that I have is just a standard milwaukee dual temp ehich I think is all I need right now and I was able to pick it up at the local Fleet Farm with a gift card I received. Its basically fool proof which most of their heat guns are, just dont get the digital read out one i know a few people that have had it and they only complain and usually returning it for one of their more simple models.

I also would recommend some nice hand tools as I had a crescent set and a set from radio shack that under regular use broke, dulled, or just plain wore out rather quickly. Lindstom was recommended to me so i bought a single wire cutter that I though fit what I  was using the old ones for and that was the model 8148 which has been wonderful not even a sign of wear yet. I plan to but a few more different pairs of cutters and pliers. But from what I have been told by a few people that use their products is stay from the ergonomic squishy handled blue ones as it feels like you have much less control well using them. They also have nice tweezers and though I havnt bought I assume their build is just as good as their pliers. As for screwsrivers i was recommended Moody Tools if your in the US their quality is supposedly bar none http://goo.gl/vCMIM this is the set i hope to purchase at some point http://amzn.to/12ekZhK replacing my craftsman set http://goo.gl/6gUwA which at the time was the only set i could find that had all the sizes I needed for ripping apart laptops. it is by no means great most of the chrome ones have lost their coating the rubber grip just spins on many of them bit I guess the do the job.

As for solder I use Kester 44 either 63/37 or 62/36/2. Also for some of my own projects I use WBT 4% silver solder http://goo.gl/xR3Jh


Hopefully this was all helpful and if you have any questions let me know.



on a side note I am looking for some nice solder wick and I was recommended chemtronics but i have no idea what kind I should get otherwise.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheFlyingRaccoon on Sat, 18 May 2013, 20:53:04
Just got my Hakko 936 today. It is everything I dreamt it would be  :p
(http://i.imgur.com/WAsmVCz.jpg)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 18 May 2013, 23:46:19
HAH! ebay. honestly, i think you got yourself a deal right there. iron is flawless and power source looks well loved -- probably well taken care of. just scrub the crap out of that holder and pick up a http://www.amazon.com/Hakko-599B-02-Solder-Cleaning-Sponge/dp/B000B6344M and you're good to go.

wiha makes the best small electronics hand tools in the world imo. snap on makes the best large mechanicals hand tools and compressor tools.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Wed, 22 May 2013, 00:07:53
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=43796.msg900769#msg900769

Nifty smd soldering video from GON.

Why isn't this a sticky?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Wed, 22 May 2013, 00:41:22
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=43796.msg900769#msg900769

Nifty smd soldering video from GON.

Why isn't this a sticky?

idk but it should be especially with my wall-o-text above ;)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: gnubag on Wed, 22 May 2013, 00:47:36
HAH! ebay. honestly, i think you got yourself a deal right there. iron is flawless and power source looks well loved -- probably well taken care of. just scrub the crap out of that holder and pick up a http://www.amazon.com/Hakko-599B-02-Solder-Cleaning-Sponge/dp/B000B6344M and you're good to go.

wiha makes the best small electronics hand tools in the world imo. snap on makes the best large mechanicals hand tools and compressor tools.

http://www.testequipmentdepot.com/weller/accessories/miscellaneous.htm

2 of the brass sponges but without a holder for much cheaper :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Wed, 22 May 2013, 00:48:22
Why isn't this a sticky?

Because it's a niche skill within a niche hobby. Stickies tend to be more general.

I've linked mine for building two GH60 in the actual GB thread, but since this is a soldering thread I'll link it here too. It's a comprehensive soldering of components, including the controller chip. I didn't have a bevel tip, so I couldn't do the drag method that GON did. Videos are a bit long though ;/



Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Wed, 22 May 2013, 00:50:24
Why isn't this a sticky?

Because it's a niche skill within a niche hobby. Stickies tend to be more general.



Because lubing switches is totes mainstream, right?

Whereas soldering, no one does that besides hardline keyboard modders
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Wed, 22 May 2013, 00:51:27
Why isn't this a sticky?

Because it's a niche skill within a niche hobby. Stickies tend to be more general.



Because lubing switches is totes mainstream, right?

Whereas soldering, no one does that besides hardline keyboard modders

hmm,done you have to desolder to properly lube in most cases?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Wed, 22 May 2013, 00:52:24
Because lubing switches is totes mainstream, right?

Whereas soldering, no one does that besides hardline keyboard modders

Yea you're right, not sure why that lubing thread is a sticky. It actually takes desoldering and soldering skill first before you can lube. Maybe PM a mod to take that lube thread off and replace with this thread.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Wed, 22 May 2013, 00:56:03
Because lubing switches is totes mainstream, right?

Whereas soldering, no one does that besides hardline keyboard modders

Yea you're right, not sure why that lubing thread is a sticky. It actually takes desoldering and soldering skill first before you can lube. Maybe PM a mod to take that lube thread off and replace with this thread.

Sticky them both? i mean you can lube without opening up the switches but its no where near as effective.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Wed, 22 May 2013, 01:04:15
Because lubing switches is totes mainstream, right?

Whereas soldering, no one does that besides hardline keyboard modders

Yea you're right, not sure why that lubing thread is a sticky. It actually takes desoldering and soldering skill first before you can lube. Maybe PM a mod to take that lube thread off and replace with this thread.

Sticky them both? i mean you can lube without opening up the switches but its no where near as effective.

I mean you can remove a plate without desoldering  but its no where near as effective.

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheProfosist on Wed, 22 May 2013, 01:08:16
Because lubing switches is totes mainstream, right?

Whereas soldering, no one does that besides hardline keyboard modders

Yea you're right, not sure why that lubing thread is a sticky. It actually takes desoldering and soldering skill first before you can lube. Maybe PM a mod to take that lube thread off and replace with this thread.

Sticky them both? i mean you can lube without opening up the switches but its no where near as effective.

I mean you can remove a plate without desoldering  but its no where near as effective.



nope ive lubed a bunch of keyboards back when ripster was still around using spray in lubes which were actually effective though I never used one of those keyboards long enough to see how long the lube lasted
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Aranair on Sat, 25 May 2013, 21:04:02
@anyone with experience on solder wicks: what width of a solder wick should I be looking at? Also how long should I be getting? (Should last me at least 10 keyboards of desoldering lol)

I gotta order online even for these (mainly due to my work schedules), so it would be best if I can get a set that would last me for abit..
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: kaiserreich on Sun, 26 May 2013, 00:50:36
@anyone with experience on solder wicks: what width of a solder wick should I be looking at? Also how long should I be getting? (Should last me at least 10 keyboards of desoldering lol)

I gotta order online even for these (mainly due to my work schedules), so it would be best if I can get a set that would last me for abit..

I am got some 2mm width wicks.
Seems like most, if not all of them are 1.5meters. I would say get 3-4 rolls. Try to also use a desoldering pump.
Using wicks exclusively might be a waste of resources.

Farnell/element14 has some for $3-$4 USD a roll.
Make sure the ones you get are laced with flux. The ones without are almost useless. Adding flux works but its a ton of mess to clean, and not as effective.

I got the Edsyn soldasip "lead free" . Not sure what are the difference between these and normal ones except that they are more suited for Pb free solder I guess. I chose it because it comes with rosin flux.

Previously was using chemtronics wick with no clean flux but my solder wires have rosin flux. So, while cleaning the rosin flux, the no clean ones came off as well and made a lot of sticky mess. A beginner mistake.

Hope this helps.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Aranair on Sun, 26 May 2013, 04:11:12
@anyone with experience on solder wicks: what width of a solder wick should I be looking at? Also how long should I be getting? (Should last me at least 10 keyboards of desoldering lol)

I gotta order online even for these (mainly due to my work schedules), so it would be best if I can get a set that would last me for abit..

I am got some 2mm width wicks.
Seems like most, if not all of them are 1.5meters. I would say get 3-4 rolls. Try to also use a desoldering pump.
Using wicks exclusively might be a waste of resources.

Farnell/element14 has some for $3-$4 USD a roll.
Make sure the ones you get are laced with flux. The ones without are almost useless. Adding flux works but its a ton of mess to clean, and not as effective.

I got the Edsyn soldasip "lead free" . Not sure what are the difference between these and normal ones except that they are more suited for Pb free solder I guess. I chose it because it comes with rosin flux.

Previously was using chemtronics wick with no clean flux but my solder wires have rosin flux. So, while cleaning the rosin flux, the no clean ones came off as well and made a lot of sticky mess. A beginner mistake.

Hope this helps.


Ah, thanks for pointing me to element14 again. I went there before while I was looking for the soldering station and found them to be expensive but their pumps/wick seems reasonably priced :D

I did find some 30metres wick from a Singapore website but thats probably overkill I guess :p
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Aranair on Sun, 26 May 2013, 04:16:14
Mmm, how do you tell if they are laced with flux or not?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Sun, 26 May 2013, 05:25:43
Found a solder similar to the Kester 44. There is much less of but at a similar price per ounce since I doubt anyone is really going to need 1lbs of solder for keyboards. And it's .020" thick so it should be thin enough in diameter for SMD work


http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=SMDSW.020_4ozvirtualkey63560000virtualkey910-SMDSW.0204OZ
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: kaiserreich on Sun, 26 May 2013, 06:34:45
Mmm, how do you tell if they are laced with flux or not?

Check the datasheet or the msds.
The msds will tell you what kind of chemical it contains.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Aranair on Sun, 26 May 2013, 07:39:53
Mmm, how do you tell if they are laced with flux or not?

Check the datasheet or the msds.
The msds will tell you what kind of chemical it contains.

I decided to just buy the one you bought lol. (soldasip)

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 28 May 2013, 11:55:30
this has officially reached epic sticky status

for the record, wfd, you pushed it right over the edge and dropped it into the seven seas of sticky
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: domoaligato on Tue, 28 May 2013, 13:53:04
yeah WFD's youtube channel is Boss. I subbed it over 3 months ago.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Tue, 28 May 2013, 14:33:39
I want somebody to double check my work before I go through with this, but I'm wanting to set up a window vent type deal by using a dryer vent hose, a PC fan (120 or 90mm) taped onto the end of it and an in-line normally open switch to turn the fan on or off.

First question. would the fan best be put on the front or back of the vent to "push" or "pull" air through it? I was thinking if it was on the back it would be more efficient, but if it were on the front it would be easier to set up.

Secondly, I have a scavenged 12V .3A  power adapter, and i'm going to run it through a toggle switch to the fan. Since the amperage is so low I shouldn't have to worry about what switch I use, pretty much anything should work, right?

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SmallFry on Tue, 28 May 2013, 16:39:04
the Simple questions, simple answers has officially reached epic sticky status

FTFY.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Thu, 30 May 2013, 01:18:50
this has officially reached epic sticky status

for the record, wfd, you pushed it right over the edge and dropped it into the seven seas of sticky

Cool, I just noticed this sticky now too. It's good to see more people venture into modding their own keyboards rather than just buy buy buy different ones.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Kayliss on Thu, 30 May 2013, 02:06:11
Any suggestions for a less expensive alternative to the Hakko 808? Just looking for something I can use with one hand.  :confused:
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Thu, 30 May 2013, 02:16:34
^ Only $48, but you need a $200 station for it to work :p

http://sra-solder.com/product.php/6470/81/b1003a_replacement_desoldering_gun_for_aouye_2702_2702a_2703a
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Aranair on Thu, 30 May 2013, 09:19:14
mmm, between the 60$ WLC100, and the hakko 888 for 160$.. is there alot of difference?:P

I have a number of keyboards that I would need to solder (some desolder first) but still wondering if I would need something so expensive mm. Is it a worthwhile investment to get the better one?:P
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Thu, 30 May 2013, 09:35:13
mmm, between the 60$ WLC100, and the hakko 888 for 160$.. is there alot of difference?:P

I have a number of keyboards that I would need to solder (some desolder first) but still wondering if I would need something so expensive mm. Is it a worthwhile investment to get the better one?:P

The WLC100 is decent, but from what I hear the Hakko is miles ahead. Where are you buying these? I just picked up a Hakko 888D for $87 shipped?


*Thanks esoomenona
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: esoomenona on Thu, 30 May 2013, 09:46:40
888, not 808...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Thu, 30 May 2013, 12:11:30
mmm, between the 60$ WLC100, and the hakko 888 for 160$.. is there alot of difference?:P

I have a number of keyboards that I would need to solder (some desolder first) but still wondering if I would need something so expensive mm. Is it a worthwhile investment to get the better one?:P

If you're only going to do a few keyboards, the WLC100 is fine. You can control how much power is fed to the iron, but it doesn't have true temperature readout and regulation like you would find in a hakko 888. If you plan on doing maybe 4 or more in the future, a hakko888 is a good investment, although they're not as cheap in Singapore.


I just picked up a Hakko 888D for $87 shipped?

Most of us in the US don't realize how dirt cheap the hakko 888 is here. You can find one for ~$85 shipped new, but in any other countries they're generally ~$160. HUGE price difference, so it might not be the best choice for someone really tight on money or just soldering a few keyboards here and there. However if you're in the US, might as well get the hakko over the weller.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Thu, 30 May 2013, 12:57:15
Everybody seems so caught up on the Hakko. I bought a Weller wes51 and I'm starting to get buyers remorse lol. I haven't even used it yet. I'm sure either way it's light years ahead of what I've used in the past (fleetingly)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Thu, 30 May 2013, 13:55:22
the 51 is good classic design
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Thu, 30 May 2013, 17:10:31
Does a soldapullt need to be broken in? I just got one today, but it takes 2-5 times of pushing the plunger to get it to lock. Every other soldapullt I've used it push once and lock....

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: domoaligato on Thu, 30 May 2013, 17:58:59
Does a soldapullt need to be broken in? I just got one today, but it takes 2-5 times of pushing the plunger to get it to lock. Every other soldapullt I've used it push once and lock....


maybe add more solder first to the joint?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Thu, 30 May 2013, 18:01:38
Does a soldapullt need to be broken in? I just got one today, but it takes 2-5 times of pushing the plunger to get it to lock. Every other soldapullt I've used it push once and lock....


maybe add more solder first to the joint?


Nope, it's not it's sucking ability I'm worried about, it's the tool itself. Every other soldapullt I've used, I depress the plunger once and it locks, ready to suck. On the one I got today, it seems to be 2-5 depressions before locking. However, now that I've cycled it, it seems like it's getting better,
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Thu, 30 May 2013, 18:24:31
Does a soldapullt need to be broken in? I just got one today, but it takes 2-5 times of pushing the plunger to get it to lock. Every other soldapullt I've used it push once and lock....


maybe add more solder first to the joint?


Nope, it's not it's sucking ability I'm worried about, it's the tool itself. Every other soldapullt I've used, I depress the plunger once and it locks, ready to suck. On the one I got today, it seems to be 2-5 depressions before locking. However, now that I've cycled it, it seems like it's getting better,

Did you get this from Amazon, or follow my advice and order direct from Edsyn?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Thu, 30 May 2013, 18:28:35
Does a soldapullt need to be broken in? I just got one today, but it takes 2-5 times of pushing the plunger to get it to lock. Every other soldapullt I've used it push once and lock....


maybe add more solder first to the joint?


Nope, it's not it's sucking ability I'm worried about, it's the tool itself. Every other soldapullt I've used, I depress the plunger once and it locks, ready to suck. On the one I got today, it seems to be 2-5 depressions before locking. However, now that I've cycled it, it seems like it's getting better,

Did you get this from Amazon, or follow my advice and order direct from Edsyn?

Bought from ebay. A couple hundred cycles, and it's now locking on almost ever depression. So it must have needed to be broke in
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Thu, 30 May 2013, 18:34:17
Does a soldapullt need to be broken in? I just got one today, but it takes 2-5 times of pushing the plunger to get it to lock. Every other soldapullt I've used it push once and lock....


maybe add more solder first to the joint?


Nope, it's not it's sucking ability I'm worried about, it's the tool itself. Every other soldapullt I've used, I depress the plunger once and it locks, ready to suck. On the one I got today, it seems to be 2-5 depressions before locking. However, now that I've cycled it, it seems like it's getting better,

Did you get this from Amazon, or follow my advice and order direct from Edsyn?

Bought from ebay. A couple hundred cycles, and it's now locking on almost ever depression. So it must have needed to be broke in

Ah, okay. Well, Edsyn's customer support is excellent, if you have any more problems with it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: 4LI4Z on Thu, 30 May 2013, 19:07:32
I don't know how it is in the US but in Europe you can get really high quality used Weller soldering stations for cheap. For example a Weller WS50 or WD50 or WECP-20. Those are soldering stations used in many companies for every day work. Some of them got used for over 10 years with no turning off during worktime and they work like on there first day.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: kaiserreich on Thu, 30 May 2013, 19:39:22
mmm, between the 60$ WLC100, and the hakko 888 for 160$.. is there alot of difference?:P

I have a number of keyboards that I would need to solder (some desolder first) but still wondering if I would need something so expensive mm. Is it a worthwhile investment to get the better one?:P

I have one from Taobao coming in. Hakko FX-888D
The Taobao price alone is 450RMB. 220V, China Plug

Seller provided teardown pictures of the inside and it looks like it is genuine. Non of the deal extreme crap.
Anyway, I will know for sure when I handle it myself.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Rayne on Thu, 30 May 2013, 20:15:50
just found this thread, i used to solder alot when i was in high school, this really makes me want to get back into it.
my equipment i still have is really bad radio shack stuff tho... Im so tempted to pick up some of this stuff, but there are other keyboard things i want to buy...

i dont know why i still come to this website lol

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SmallFry on Thu, 30 May 2013, 22:30:24
If you poke around the IRC, Parak occasionally has good deals on irons he finds on eBay.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Rayne on Thu, 30 May 2013, 23:47:52
If you poke around the IRC, Parak occasionally has good deals on irons he finds on eBay.
hmm... iv actually been thinking about idling irc more, to get to know people. Guess this is just more incentive.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Thu, 30 May 2013, 23:51:14
Ah, okay. Well, Edsyn's customer support is excellent, if you have any more problems with it.

I'm sure they are, and I would have bought from them, but they're a tab high. I think it was around $31 shipped for the same thing I got for $20 shipped.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Aranair on Fri, 31 May 2013, 08:58:46
mmm, between the 60$ WLC100, and the hakko 888 for 160$.. is there alot of difference?:P

I have a number of keyboards that I would need to solder (some desolder first) but still wondering if I would need something so expensive mm. Is it a worthwhile investment to get the better one?:P

The WLC100 is decent, but from what I hear the Hakko is miles ahead. Where are you buying these? I just picked up a Hakko 888D for $87 shipped?


*Thanks esoomenona

unfortunately I'm in Singapore D: almost all the soldering stations are pretty expensive here ):

Well, I'll have...two GH60s, tutu, kmac happy to assemble.. (plus one poker to desolder + solder to add a plate..). mmm Not exactly that tight on cash now but still hope to get my moneys worth nevetheless :P

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Fri, 31 May 2013, 09:00:36
mmm, between the 60$ WLC100, and the hakko 888 for 160$.. is there alot of difference?:P

I have a number of keyboards that I would need to solder (some desolder first) but still wondering if I would need something so expensive mm. Is it a worthwhile investment to get the better one?:P

The WLC100 is decent, but from what I hear the Hakko is miles ahead. Where are you buying these? I just picked up a Hakko 888D for $87 shipped?


*Thanks esoomenona

unfortunately I'm in Singapore D: almost all the soldering stations are pretty expensive here ):

Well, I'll have...two GH60s, tutu, kmac happy to assemble.. (plus one poker to desolder + solder to add a plate..). mmm Not exactly that tight on cash now but still hope to get my moneys worth nevetheless :P



I've used the WLC100 before to do a couple boards. It isn't bad, but it's not stellar either. It should be good enough for everything keyboard related (except maybe SMD since you don't have a lot of control over temp.)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Aranair on Fri, 31 May 2013, 09:05:13
does the hakko help to make up with being a noob on soldering?:P I'll be worried about burning stuff up since I'll be doing it for the first time lol.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 31 May 2013, 09:07:18
Not mine. Had it repaired for a customer.

(http://i.imgur.com/cO3jDoI.png)

Simpson 260-8P
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Fri, 31 May 2013, 09:09:50
does the hakko help to make up with being a noob on soldering?:P I'll be worried about burning stuff up since I'll be doing it for the first time lol.

On the first few boards I had it set on 5 because why not? I did mess up a trace and did some heat damage to the PCB. I backed off to around 3-4 and everything soldered and looked a lot better.

I can't really say if the Hakko will make you a better solderer, because I haven't used one yet. It should be here today tho!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Aranair on Fri, 31 May 2013, 09:17:58
mmm, a difficult decision. I wish it was as easy as deciding to buy a 100 usd keycap set D:
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SmallFry on Fri, 31 May 2013, 11:22:52
Not mine. Had it repaired for a customer.


Simpson 260-8P
Wow, cool stuff. How old is it? I see they manufactured them for a few years.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: eRadicatedZomBiE on Mon, 03 June 2013, 18:02:56
I'm stuck between this one:
http://www.amazon.com/Updated-Aoyue-Digital-Soldering-absorber/dp/B006FA481G (http://www.amazon.com/Updated-Aoyue-Digital-Soldering-absorber/dp/B006FA481G)

and this one:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00A2VQA24/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=AGZ57FCJFLOQQ (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00A2VQA24/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=AGZ57FCJFLOQQ)

I want to get an "in 1" type of setup I'm not sure if there is any real difference between these two or if it just comes down to user preference
I tried to see if there was anything that was really different the only thing I could find was that the  X-tronic has 110W as opposed to the Aoyue which is 70W

Help a brother out!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 04 June 2013, 00:36:48
litster has one of the Aoyue stations. iirc he says the only thing he really likes about it is the fume extractor on the iron.

the cheap all-in-one stations are definitely "get what you pay for", and the bigger problem with "all-in-one" is that they may very well be devoting too much of a meager budget to something you just don't do very often. how often are you going to desolder soic packages? do you really need hot tweezers at all? how often are you going to do smt reflow? do you really need hot air at all? etc.

over the years i've definitely found that accuracy, reliability and usability are #1 in tooling, especially high power precision tooling like soldering tools. even when you're careful and you know what you're doing it's still not that hard to burn things when you have a bunch of power flowing into a heater in your hand.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 04 June 2013, 10:12:15
folks with 888ds, i just got mine and i noticed that they made the the worst UI choice ever in that CALIBRATING the temperature and SETTING the temperature are almost exactly the same procedure, except that one of them requires pressing the enter button for ONE second (temp set) and the other for TWO seconds (calibration)

FACEPALM

you can tell which mode you're in by the temp display. if it has two dots at the bottom, you're setting the calibration, not the temperature. if it doesn't have two dots, you're setting the temperature. note that there is no "reset to factory" if you do mistakenly recalibrate. it may be possible to wipe the nvram or whatever it keeps the offset in, but i haven't gotten to that part of the manual yet.

my advice: search for amico thermometer on amazon and get a very cheap type K thermometer (25$) in case you need to recalibrate the regulator after mistakenly calibrating it instead of changing the regulator temperature. make sure the type K probe and thermometer you buy goes up to at least 250 deg C.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Tue, 04 June 2013, 11:43:06
folks with 888ds, i just got mine and i noticed that they made the the worst UI choice ever in that CALIBRATING the temperature and SETTING the temperature are almost exactly the same procedure, except that one of them requires pressing the enter button for ONE second (temp set) and the other for TWO seconds (calibration)

FACEPALM

makes me feel a bit better about going for the analog dial weller now.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Rayne on Tue, 04 June 2013, 12:20:07
folks with 888ds, i just got mine and i noticed that they made the the worst UI choice ever in that CALIBRATING the temperature and SETTING the temperature are almost exactly the same procedure, except that one of them requires pressing the enter button for ONE second (temp set) and the other for TWO seconds (calibration)

FACEPALM

makes me feel a bit better about going for the analog dial weller now.

yeah, i was almost 100% going to get an 888D, now im kinda second guessing that decision.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 04 June 2013, 13:38:03
the care and feeding of the 888d is definitely a bit higher than the analog meters. they cut some corners to get the insanely accurate regulator into the budget station. the accuracy on this thing is higher than the industrial-strength 951 station (which i assume they plan on updating at some point). the flip side to this accuracy is that it's been designed for people who care about accuracy and have the tooling (eg, a tip thermometer) to calibrate.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Tue, 04 June 2013, 17:55:37
folks with 888ds, i just got mine and i noticed that they made the the worst UI choice ever in that CALIBRATING the temperature and SETTING the temperature are almost exactly the same procedure, except that one of them requires pressing the enter button for ONE second (temp set) and the other for TWO seconds (calibration)

FACEPALM

you can tell which mode you're in by the temp display. if it has two dots at the bottom, you're setting the calibration, not the temperature. if it doesn't have two dots, you're setting the temperature. note that there is no "reset to factory" if you do mistakenly recalibrate. it may be possible to wipe the nvram or whatever it keeps the offset in, but i haven't gotten to that part of the manual yet.

my advice: search for amico thermometer on amazon and get a very cheap type K thermometer (25$) in case you need to recalibrate the regulator after mistakenly calibrating it instead of changing the regulator temperature. make sure the type K probe and thermometer you buy goes up to at least 250 deg C.

This really sucks. I don't remember if I ever saw two blinking periods or not. Could you maybe use a kitchen meat thermometer to calibrate?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 04 June 2013, 18:16:38
anything that can read up to 200C and is accurate to within 2C there it is about as accurate as the regulator, so you're good. honestly, the factory calibration probably isn't all that accurate as it is. a cheap IR thermometer placed really close to the tip will probably work fine to get it back within the ballpark (and about as accurate as the dial would have been).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Tue, 04 June 2013, 18:19:52
anything that can read up to 200C and is accurate to within 2C there it is about as accurate as the regulator, so you're good. honestly, the factory calibration probably isn't all that accurate as it is. a cheap IR thermometer placed really close to the tip will probably work fine to get it back within the ballpark (and about as accurate as the dial would have been).

Oh man, I forgot that my buddy has a IR thermometer, I'll borrow that and check to make sure I didn't mess up my calibration.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 04 June 2013, 18:39:55
also remember that anything that actually measures tip temperature is going to be more accurate than the factory calibration or wherever the regular has wandered since it left the factory. ideally you want a contact probe because the built up oxidization and tin or lack thereof can wildly change the temperature at the joint. but really, just remember that you're always guessing with materials and thermo (heisenberg or something)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: eRadicatedZomBiE on Tue, 04 June 2013, 19:33:30
also remember that anything that actually measures tip temperature is going to be more accurate than the factory calibration or wherever the regular has wandered since it left the factory. ideally you want a contact probe because the built up oxidization and tin or lack thereof can wildly change the temperature at the joint. but really, just remember that you're always guessing with materials and thermo (heisenberg or something)

Did you say Heisenberg?
(http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110817002356/breakingbad/images/e/ea/Season_4_-_Heisenberg.jpg)

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Tue, 04 June 2013, 20:24:37
Oh man, I forgot that my buddy has a IR thermometer, I'll borrow that and check to make sure I didn't mess up my calibration.

I don't think IR gun will be food for measuring tip temps. The readout is an average temp over a certain area, and the area it measures depends the distance away from the object. The tip is too small to point an IR gun at it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Tue, 04 June 2013, 20:25:57
Oh man, I forgot that my buddy has a IR thermometer, I'll borrow that and check to make sure I didn't mess up my calibration.

I don't think IR gun will be food for measuring tip temps. The readout is an average temp over a certain area, and the area it measures depends the distance away from the object. The tip is too small to point an IR gun at it.

Even with a large knife style tip and the IR gun held close to the tip?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Tue, 04 June 2013, 20:36:14
How large is the knife tip? I wouldn't imagine any soldering tip is large enough to measure with IR guns. These are more for measuring an area, not a single point, even though the gun has an aiming laser that shoots at a single point. You can try though, but I wouldn't trust accuracy doing this way because you'll pick up temps from the surrounding area as well.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Tue, 04 June 2013, 20:40:22
How large is the knife tip? I wouldn't imagine any soldering tip is large enough to measure with IR guns. These are more for measuring an area, not a single point, even though the gun has an aiming laser that shoots at a single point. You can try though, but I wouldn't trust accuracy doing this way because you'll pick up temps from the surrounding area as well.

It's this tip
(http://ec.hakko.com/imgs/det/900M-T-K.jpg)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 04 June 2013, 20:44:45
the temp the regulator uses isn't exactly in the tip either. (or more importantly, on the surface of the tip).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Wed, 05 June 2013, 19:00:20
Ok, what if you have 63/37 solder, could you ramp up the temperature until the solder melts and calibrate the station to 361F?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 05 June 2013, 19:05:36
sure. i mean the point of the point of the last N posts was that ultimately you're just twiddling some knob until you can solder stuff.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Wed, 05 June 2013, 19:55:24
Did you say Heisenberg?
Show Image
(http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110817002356/breakingbad/images/e/ea/Season_4_-_Heisenberg.jpg)


Stay out of my project room.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Rayne on Wed, 05 June 2013, 20:20:01
Ok, so I have some soldering experience, I'v been doing little projects here and there for some time. The only solder iron iv used is a cheap $10 radio shack one that i bought like 4 or 5 years ago. I want to upgrade and get one much better than what i have. I was looking into getting the Hakko FX888D, I dont want to spend any more than that. However, the posts above are kind of confusing me. Now this may be a stupid question, but what is the deal with calibrating the temperature? How exactly do you do this and why? I kinda makes me scared to buy a new solder machine because i feel like i wont know how to use it :x

again, sorry if this is a dumb question, i feel like such a noob :P
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Thu, 06 June 2013, 00:00:59
I assume it comes factory calibrated but you can recalibrate it by hand using the method listed above.


Beside that any tool worth it's salt should come with (or at least have available) a fairly extensive manual. I suspect most of them are available online now because it saves paper and/or is cheaper to produce
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Rayne on Thu, 06 June 2013, 01:02:20
oooh ok i get it now. i was thinking calibration was something that need to be done every time you use the machine... this all makes sense now... i feel so dumb lol
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Thu, 06 June 2013, 01:23:36
all the hakko documentation is available online. you have to register for it, which is weird, but yah, it's up there. docs.hakko.com or something.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: kaiserreich on Fri, 07 June 2013, 12:02:25
Just received my 888d 220v from taobao. For $75 before shipping, pretty good deal indeed.
The innards looks as real as the teardown pictures that I can find.

Pictures to follow.

Made in a factory 30km from where I stay.
Bought from Shanghai and still save a ton of money.
Globailization at its best.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 07 June 2013, 12:44:39
hah! hilarious. also remember that it was designed in japan :D

economic geography at its finest.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Fri, 07 June 2013, 12:50:48
reminds of me a bit of how rendering and processing plants will buy horse meat from americans for 50 cents a pound and sell it where horsemeat is a delicacy for 15 dollars a pound.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 07 June 2013, 13:35:11
contrary to popular belief, paul krugman did some really good work in this prior to globalization becoming a buzzword, and deserves the nobel as much as anyone else with a nobel -- it wasn't just political..
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: kaiserreich on Sat, 08 June 2013, 04:48:48
Here is the teardown of the FX888D from Taobao
Comparison to a FX888D from other sources
http://runawaybrainz.blogspot.com/2013/03/hakko-fx-888d-solder-station-hi-res.html

More
(http://i.imgur.com/s5i1zKo.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/nPCkx5a.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/P2oeOdG.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/ztAkliX.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/00dRI0y.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/j00XDgL.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/ufYXUZH.jpg)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bpiphany on Sat, 08 June 2013, 06:50:34
contrary to popular belief, paul krugman did some really good work in this prior to globalization becoming a buzzword, and deserves the nobel as much as anyone else with a nobel -- it wasn't just political..

Except there is no Nobel Prize in economics. I know nothing about economics though...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 08 June 2013, 09:10:00
Here is the teardown of the FX888D from Taobao
Comparison to a FX888D from other sources
http://runawaybrainz.blogspot.com/2013/03/hakko-fx-888d-solder-station-hi-res.html

More
Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/s5i1zKo.jpg)

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/nPCkx5a.jpg)

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/P2oeOdG.jpg)

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/ztAkliX.jpg)

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/00dRI0y.jpg)

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/j00XDgL.jpg)

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/ufYXUZH.jpg)
looks unsurprisingly like the same unit. good to know there's a cheaper source IN asia

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 08 June 2013, 14:38:24
DUDES! GREAT NEWS!

I've made a huge mistake. the process for TEMPERATURE CHANGE is to hold the ENTER button for 1 second.

The process for TEMPERATURE CALIBRATION is to hold the UP button for 2 seconds. phew!!!

ok, now the bad news. i tossed an older tip on my iron and then took an extremely accurate thermistor and stuck it on the tinned and brass-brushed tip. it was 20 degrees off the regulator thermistor. i then calibrated and ta-da! melted solder. this is cool for me because i have an extremely accurate contact thermometer that is rated up to 400C, but may not work for you if you plan on buying the 888d and then blindly trusting the number on the front.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Sat, 08 June 2013, 18:50:18
Just got done soldering my a.87. All the SMD stuff that came in the kit and all the SMD resistors. Big thanks to everyone in the thread. All I need to do is solder on the switches, diodes and LEDs, but I need a plate and a case to make first!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Sat, 08 June 2013, 19:27:23
The white A87 ps2avr? You might want to try and program it first before you install the plate in case any of the components don't work or needs reflow. You won't be able to take them off once the plate is on. I'm stuck at the programming phase before I can put on the plate.

http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=44504.0


Btw, when you said SMD resistors, I hope those are diodes instead, which is what the switches need. Unless you mean resistors for a backlit keyboard.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Sat, 08 June 2013, 19:32:29
The white A87 ps2avr? You might want to try and program it first before you install the plate in case any of the components don't work or needs reflow. You won't be able to take them off once the plate is on. I'm stuck at the programming phase before I can put on the plate.

http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=44504.0


Btw, when you said SMD resistors, I hope those are diodes instead, which is what the switches need. Unless you mean resistors for a backlit keyboard.

Yea, it's going to be a while for the white A87 ps2avr since I want to get my phantom completed first.


No, I did the SMD resistors tonight since I already have the LEDs. I didn't feel like doing the through hole diodes tonight so I'll probably do those tomorrow
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: kaiserreich on Sat, 08 June 2013, 22:07:10
DUDES! GREAT NEWS!

I've made a huge mistake. the process for TEMPERATURE CHANGE is to hold the ENTER button for 1 second.

The process for TEMPERATURE CALIBRATION is to hold the UP button for 2 seconds. phew!!!

ok, now the bad news. i tossed an older tip on my iron and then took an extremely accurate thermistor and stuck it on the tinned and brass-brushed tip. it was 20 degrees off the regulator thermistor. i then calibrated and ta-da! melted solder. this is cool for me because i have an extremely accurate contact thermometer that is rated up to 400C, but may not work for you if you plan on buying the 888d and then blindly trusting the number on the front.

How do you get the Presets? P1, P2, P3 etc?
I can change the temps but getting into the preset mode is pretty damn hard.

It's very interesting how Hakko can fit so many functions into the "UP" "Enter" and on/off switch combination.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 08 June 2013, 23:19:27
sign up for doc.hakko.com. the full manual is there (why? i have no idea)

to get to the parameter settings you have to turn the iron on with the enter key held down until it flashes "01" (which is the C or F parameter)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: i3oilermaker on Sun, 09 June 2013, 16:55:35
I have a Weller ST1 tip (recommended for switch/diode soldering) new that is of no use to me.

If anyone wants it all I ask is for shipping.  First to PM me gets it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Mon, 10 June 2013, 17:04:28
So I can't seem to find a proper manual for my Weller WES51 other than the 4 pages of toilet paper that comes in the box. Is that seriously it, or does somebody know better?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Mon, 10 June 2013, 17:09:44
So I can't seem to find a proper manual for my Weller WES51 other than the 4 pages of toilet paper that comes in the box. Is that seriously it, or does somebody know better?

http://www.testequipmentdepot.com/weller/pdf/wes51.pdf
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Internetlad on Mon, 10 June 2013, 17:36:25
Thanks. Looked and couldn't find it. Ended up on the page for the WES50.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: daerid on Thu, 13 June 2013, 00:50:55
Looks like I'm getting a FX888D as a father's day gift to myself and gonna finally be able to put my 'Dox together this weekend. W00t!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: daerid on Sat, 15 June 2013, 16:47:56
Got it! Quick question though (sorry if its been covered): what temp is the best for soldering this thing?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: kaiserreich on Mon, 17 June 2013, 09:39:18
Got it! Quick question though (sorry if its been covered): what temp is the best for soldering this thing?

I use 350 for Lead solder, and 450 for lead free.
That's in celcius by the way.

Try not to mix the tips used for Lead and lead-free solder.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 17 June 2013, 10:06:13
it depends on your alloy, and yes, do not mix tips across alloys. the standard hobbyist 63/37 (ie, 63% tin, 37% lead) melts at exactly 182C and is euctetic, meaning that there is no transition between solid and liquid (and v.v., there is no hysteresis). this alloy, with a core of rosin flux was by far the most popular solder for many many years. kester's 44 very small diameter solder is still one of the best and has exactly this construction.

with the change in EU regulations in 2000-ish (RoHS lead-free no-clean), non-euctetic formulations and lead-free alloys have been de rigeur in mass production, as leaded soldered items cannot be imported into the EU. the upside of this is of course that we don't have to landfill so much lead. the downside is that standard solders are no longer euctetic, and have much weirder material properties and larger ranges of melting temps. non-rosin flux is also less corrosive (flux is meant to attack and dissolve oxidization on metal surfaces) and hence harder to work with.

the wiki article on solder is quite complete and very information. highly suggest taking a look:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solder
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Aranair on Mon, 17 June 2013, 10:07:42
got all my soldering + desoldering gear.. and probably going to desolder my poker X to add a plate to it.

Anything I should REALLY take note before I start?:P
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Tue, 18 June 2013, 09:26:02
I've got the recommended desoldering iron from RadioShack so far.  Almost got my first switch out last night (but there's a skinny filament of solder left inside one of the holes, so waiting for other tools to arrive.

Ordered these from Amazon for my 2 Filco TKL projects :)


And of course my Prime ran out a couple days ago, so slow shipping...  But when it all gets here, I'll start desoldering in earnest!  Still need to get a tip tinner--probably at RadioShack on my way home from work today.  Do you think the stock Weller WLC100 tip is sufficiently narrow if I'm careful, or do I need to get a smaller one?

Thanks for everyone's tips in this thread!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Tue, 18 June 2013, 10:02:13
Thanks for everyone's tips in this thread!

pun ;)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Tarzan on Tue, 18 June 2013, 11:20:53
euctetic = eutectic.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 18 June 2013, 18:03:25
euctetic = eutectic.


Thanks for everyone's spelling tips in this thread!

:))
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: alaricljs on Tue, 18 June 2013, 18:10:00
Got it! Quick question though (sorry if its been covered): what temp is the best for soldering this thing?

I use 350 for Lead solder, and 450 for lead free.
That's in celcius by the way.

Try not to mix the tips used for Lead and lead-free solder.

Wow... part of this is likely to be tip dependent, however I prefer to use the lowest possible temp to get the job done.  I don't do lead free, but my 888 is set to 275C for SMD work.  For KB switches 275C works, sometimes bump it to 300C.  For wire work with 18ga or larger, 325C.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Tue, 18 June 2013, 18:20:33
I used to do everything on 5 on the weller WLC, now that I can control temps I use around 550F. It's a little bit hotter than alaricljs uses, but I find it a bit faster than if I'd use a lower temp.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Tue, 18 June 2013, 18:22:00
I used to do everything on 5 on the weller WLC, now that I can control temps I use around 550F. It's a little bit hotter than alaricljs uses, but I find it a bit faster than if I'd use a lower temp.

I run like 650...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Tue, 18 June 2013, 18:23:23
I used to do everything on 5 on the weller WLC, now that I can control temps I use around 550F. It's a little bit hotter than alaricljs uses, but I find it a bit faster than if I'd use a lower temp.

I run like 650...

I would have figured that you used 850F for everything
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 18 June 2013, 18:25:30
I was also running about 650 when I was soldering my Tofu101 over the weekend. I think it needs to be closer to 700 but I'm not sure.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Tue, 18 June 2013, 18:25:56
I used to do everything on 5 on the weller WLC, now that I can control temps I use around 550F. It's a little bit hotter than alaricljs uses, but I find it a bit faster than if I'd use a lower temp.

I run like 650...

I would have figured that you used 850F for everything

You caught me, I just plug the iron directly into a 110v plug and let the metal glow.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Tue, 18 June 2013, 18:30:43
You caught me, I just plug the iron directly into a 110v plug and let the metal glow.

(http://www.talkaudio.co.uk/ipb/uploads/72cb8e9fde34f1cab269d0a641807808.jpg)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Wed, 19 June 2013, 09:21:58
I still don't have a dedicated tip tinner, and I wonder if I can just use my solder line to tin the tip.  That way I wouldn't be mixing random compounds on the tip too.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: alaricljs on Wed, 19 June 2013, 09:26:32
I've never had a tip tinner, hasn't bothered me any.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 19 June 2013, 09:47:16
just use solder to tip the tip. tin tinner is just a little thing of solder paste (= ground up flux and solder)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Wed, 19 June 2013, 09:48:52
Cool--thanks.  Didn't seem worth $10 to get a dedicated tinner that was of a possibly different formulation than my solder anyway.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Fri, 21 June 2013, 19:02:18
Well, now that I'm making an ErgoDox I'm going to need a decent iron.

Was looking at either of these:

http://www.amazon.com/X-TRONIC-MODEL-4010-XTS-Centigrade-ANTI-MAGNETIC/dp/B0053491YO/ref=sr_1_4?s=power-hand-tools&ie=UTF8&qid=1371858166&sr=1-4&keywords=soldering+station#productDetails

http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-9378-Programmable-Digital-Soldering/dp/B00BSW69LI/ref=sr_1_5?s=power-hand-tools&ie=UTF8&qid=1371858166&sr=1-5&keywords=soldering+station

Anyone have any input about these or any alternative products (within a reasonable price range), I'd be interested.

Thanks.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: alaricljs on Fri, 21 June 2013, 19:03:46
http://www.amazon.com/Digital-FX888D-CHP170-bundle-cutter/dp/B00AWUFVY8/ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1371859401&sr=1-1&keywords=888d
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Fri, 21 June 2013, 19:06:42
Check out this thread for more info!

http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=42824.0
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Ed on Fri, 21 June 2013, 19:09:52
Weller WESD51 Digital Soldering Station.

I got mine when they were $129.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: BlueByLiquid on Fri, 21 June 2013, 20:02:32
I just got the FX888D. The price on amazon is pretty darn good. It is very solid and constant temp. it heats up really really fast and and just has a good feel to it. It also is pretty small which I find great.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheSoulhunter on Fri, 21 June 2013, 20:23:23
Weller, Ersa, Hakko, Pace...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Fri, 21 June 2013, 20:31:16
Ok, after researching a bit I went with the FX888D with some extra tips on the side.

Thanks everyone.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TD22057 on Sat, 22 June 2013, 14:10:06
How do you guys like the 888D?  I ended up grabbing the non-digital version (888) which I found for sale in a few places.  I thought the analog control might be easier to use than the digital...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: YoungMichael88 on Sat, 22 June 2013, 14:39:21
How do you guys like the 888D?  I ended up grabbing the non-digital version (888) which I found for sale in a few places.  I thought the analog control might be easier to use than the digital...
I just got my 888D last week. Never soldered before in my life and within an hour of practicing on an old telephone with through hole components I was confident enough to mod my poker. It works very well, heats up extremely fast and is a solid machine. My only complaint is the lack of a decent manual but MKAWA posted a link to one in the living soldering thread. I recommend this iron. The price is pretty great too.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: BlueByLiquid on Sat, 22 June 2013, 15:48:18
How do you guys like the 888D?  I ended up grabbing the non-digital version (888) which I found for sale in a few places.  I thought the analog control might be easier to use than the digital...

I have used more expensive ones friends have had and I love the 888D. Doesn't mean I wouldn't get a more expensive one if I did specific things but the size of the 888 makes it easy to keep on your desk unlike bigger sones where you end up putting them up because they are pretty big.

@YoungMichael88, THe 888D couldn't be easier to use. It starts up to 750 and you can easily adjust it but if you are using leaded solder thats what you want 9-10. maybe if you are doing something with drastic temp changes consistently it might be better to have a dial but I don't see this as a concern for those buying the 888.

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: YoungMichael88 on Sat, 22 June 2013, 16:00:51
How do you guys like the 888D?  I ended up grabbing the non-digital version (888) which I found for sale in a few places.  I thought the analog control might be easier to use than the digital...

I have used more expensive ones friends have had and I love the 888D. Doesn't mean I wouldn't get a more expensive one if I did specific things but the size of the 888 makes it easy to keep on your desk unlike bigger sones where you end up putting them up because they are pretty big.

@YoungMichael88, THe 888D couldn't be easier to use. It starts up to 750 and you can easily adjust it but if you are using leaded solder thats what you want 9-10. maybe if you are doing something with drastic temp changes consistently it might be better to have a dial but I don't see this as a concern for those buying the 888.
it's really not that hard to change the temperature either. Sure it's not as fast as turning a dial but you could change it to any temperature in about 7 seconds.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: samwisekoi on Sat, 22 June 2013, 16:17:53
So the 888 is nice and fancy, but the OP asked about decent. By which I think he means good, not fancy.

I think this standard is met by a Weller W60 with a couple of tips for medium to x-large work and a Weller 15W (red handled version) for delicate work.  And some good multi-core 60/40 solder (I like Ersin .050).  The PH60 is an excellent stand for the big iron.

With that pair of relatively inexpensive irons you can solder anything from 28g wire (tiny) up to 00 monster cable.  And the W60 will last decades.

I like to think of it as the Model F of soldering irons.  My W60 is certainly older than my Model F or any of my Model M keyboards.

Now if only I could get a Stomberg-Carlson VOIP phone for my desk...

 - Ron | samwisekoi
(http://www.samwisekoi.com/pixelart/M.png)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: BlueByLiquid on Sat, 22 June 2013, 16:33:00
So the 888 is nice and fancy, but the OP asked about decent. By which I think he means good, not fancy.

I think this standard is met by a Weller W60 with a couple of tips for medium to x-large work and a Weller 15W (red handled version) for delicate work.  And some good multi-core 60/40 solder (I like Ersin .050).  The PH60 is an excellent stand for the big iron.

With that pair of relatively inexpensive irons you can solder anything from 28g wire (tiny) up to 00 monster cable.  And the W60 will last decades.

I like to think of it as the Model F of soldering irons.  My W60 is certainly older than my Model F or any of my Model M keyboards.

Now if only I could get a Stomberg-Carlson VOIP phone for my desk...

 - Ron | samwisekoi
Show Image
(http://www.samwisekoi.com/pixelart/M.png)


So are you saying the OP wanted something lower cost than the 888D or that the 888D is just fancy and not "good". going by the general price range of the OP links I assumed he/she was looking for something in the 70-100 range and the 888D is around 85-95. I think the w60 is about 75-80 but also doesn't come with a stand or anything to hold the wire brush, etc. While you can get those cheap I would think it would add up to as much as the 888D. The 888D is the only one I have used in the sub $100 range (other than really really cheap ones) and I really enjoy it so that's what I recommended I could be wrong. I am sure there are other good ones around that range but it seemsed like for $90 or less it was the best choice.

Other note, I would imagine the w60 is difficult to maintain a continuous temp because it is just a handheld heating unit but again I could be wrong and am not saying bad things about it it just doesn't seem like the best value IMO.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheSoulhunter on Sat, 22 June 2013, 17:55:32
The Hakko 888 is a good choice imo, got the old analog version because I figured it's less prone to failure...
-> No LCD and additional control PCB -> Less parts that can break, plus it has been around for some time and proven.
Also got a bunch of chisel tips in different sizes and a second hand-piece in case the ceramic in the boxed one breaks some day.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: samwisekoi on Sat, 22 June 2013, 18:09:29
Good points.  Currently the W60 is the W60P, which is temperature controlled.  And it is no longer either inexpensive or as simple as it once was.  My preference is is to minimize electronics to improve longevity, and it is from that perspective I made the alternative recommendation.

I like simple tools that work well.  I'd rather have a set of good screwdrivers than a multi-driver with interchangeable bits, for example.  So for me, having a #0, #1, and #2 Phillips head is the same as having a 60W and a 15W iron on my bench.  My Weller is at least 30 years old, and works as well as it did when I bought it.

Go into a metal shop and you will almost always find a piece of equipment that is older than anyone who works there.  And it won't have dials, chips, or closed-loop feedback systems.  But it will work better -- in the right hands -- than the newer models that are available now.

I just bought a 'new' Fluke DMM.  It is only 10 years old.  I hope it lasts as long as my Weller will!

In the meantime, I should try an 888 just to see.  But instead I am probably going to get a Hakko with a desoldering pump built in!  Mostly because there is so much desoldering in this hobby that I am getting tired of using my Soldapullit.

But I'm not going to get rid of that Soldapullit either.  It might last a couple of decades itself.

 - Ron I samwisekoi
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 22 June 2013, 20:09:48
flukes don't die, sorry. if you wait long enough and enough buildings fall down and species go extinct, it might go slightly out of calibration, but i wouldn't be surprised if they throw in a free calibration every 20 years just for the heck of it. nikon pro cameras are also like this. if you bring them through enough war zones, the mount will eventually go out of spec (and of course all the rubber pieces will need to be replaced, but those are consumables), but only a tiny bit, and you have to have their test equipment to see the error. they also do flat rate repair pricing though, so you don't bother bringing it in for a CLA until you dropped it off a plane and cracked the body in half. then they charge you a hundred dollars and send you on your way (although they can take their sweet time if you don't bug them every few days)

Quote
I'd rather have a set of good screwdrivers than a multi-driver with interchangeable bits, for example.  So for me, having a #0, #1, and #2 Phillips head is the same as having a 60W and a 15W iron on my bench.
wiha for the drivers, and these are consumables by the way. i like having a steady supply of the standard wiha 000,00,0,1 small style drivers as well as a steady supply of the reversible and extendible drive-loc IV 1 + 2 bits and a reversible and extendible system 4 drive-loc 00 + 0

4mm and 1/4" bits are good, but imo only for power tools, and i like to go stainless with those because mild carbon steel is NOT TOOL STEEL and just strips itself and everything else out.

also, always have a JIC 0 and 1 driver on hand.

this reminds me. i just got a cheap (actually it was shockingly expensive) and ****ty chinese bit + handle 4mm set because i couldn't find any other Y0 and Y1 bits anywhere. if for some reason you want one of these without the Y0 and Y1 bits, it will probably go up on either free stuff or my very cheap stuff classifieds thread soon.

soldapullts are such simple machines it's not surprising that all they really need is a gasket and nozzle every once in a while, but soldering irons are these horribly nasty pieces of metal, ceramic, etc with mostly analog controls and constant insane heat cycling, so it's really a credit to hakko and weller's engineers that those two brands products never freaking die. same with fluke, frankly.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: dfj on Mon, 24 June 2013, 08:23:36
Sooth on the Nikon - I have a D (not a D-x or D-xx, the D). The addon light sensor needs to be rebuilt, but the body is nigh-indestructible (a hair of brass is showing here and there through the chrome and black layers).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: kaiserreich on Mon, 24 June 2013, 10:41:07
How do you guys clean the soldapult?
It clogs up pretty quickly after desoldering a few keyboards.
I tried to clean as best as I can, but it seems that I no longer get that round piece of solder whenever I cock it in place.
Instead, it is just flakes of solder now.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 24 June 2013, 11:00:38
Sooth on the Nikon - I have a D (not a D-x or D-xx, the D). The addon light sensor needs to be rebuilt, but the body is nigh-indestructible (a hair of brass is showing here and there through the chrome and black layers).
hundred bucks.
hah!

Quote
How do you guys clean the soldapult?
It clogs up pretty quickly after desoldering a few keyboards.
I tried to clean as best as I can, but it seems that I no longer get that round piece of solder whenever I cock it in place.
Instead, it is just flakes of solder now.
you may have to disassemble it and clean the pump by hand. edsyn also sells replacement parts if your vacuum unit is unsalvageable for some reason (solder contaminating the gasket or something). i would personally start with a solvent to get rid of any rosin that might be causing the thing to stick, then pump it by hand a few times then disassemble and take a look.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Mackem on Tue, 25 June 2013, 20:17:14
I want to learn to solder so I can swap out LEDs and such like on my keyboard but I haven't done it before. Anyone recommend any sites / equipment to buy (United Kingdom) to start me off? (Soldering iron, solder, that sort of thing)

Any advice is appreciated!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Tue, 25 June 2013, 22:32:58
Read this thread for lost of info on what equipment is good or not:
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=42824.0

And practice on an old VCR. If you've never soldered before, I'm sure there are videos on youtube laying out the basics
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Tue, 25 June 2013, 22:34:55
Wear eye protection and long pants; and never solder when you're tired.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Tue, 25 June 2013, 22:37:56
I think there are vids from whitefiredragon that are excellent, too

Also, that soldering comic is good.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: wcass on Wed, 26 June 2013, 09:07:28
sometimes the cheap tools are good enough - particularly if you are new to it or don't plan on using it a lot and forever. i have had my current $5 multi-meter for a couple of years already. i will lend it out to even casual acquaintances and would laugh if it did not get returned or came back in pieces.

i came late to soldering (late 40's actually) so i started with a $5 iron to learn on. i recently upgraded to a GQ 5200 rework station (same as a 952D+) with extra heating elements and tips for $80. this to mount some mighty small SMDs on my DIY PCBs.
[attach=1]
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 26 June 2013, 09:59:17
wcass, try one of these: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003UCODIA/ref=oh_details_o03_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

it's shockingly high quality, with a wide range of head fitment, stays where you put it, and uses some pretty clear optical plastic. for seven bucks including shipping i expected _much_ less. also, it clears one's prescription glasses, which can be a pain with other loupes.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: wcass on Wed, 26 June 2013, 10:27:40
wcass, try one of these: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003UCODIA/ref=oh_details_o03_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

thanks, i will.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: grips on Wed, 26 June 2013, 11:23:13
I've got the recommended desoldering iron from RadioShack so far.  Almost got my first switch out last night (but there's a skinny filament of solder left inside one of the holes, so waiting for other tools to arrive.

Ordered these from Amazon for my 2 Filco TKL projects :)

  • Weller WLC100 (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000AS28UC/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i03?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
  • Aoyue Soldering Iron Tip Cleaner with Brass (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005C789EU/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
  • MG Chemicals 4880 Series, Sn63/Pb37 Rosin Core Leaded Solder, 0.032" (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) - 0.6 oz cuts x 2
  • MG Chemicals 400 Series #3 Fine Braid Super Wick with RMA Flux, 5' Length x 0.075" (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008O9VX6O/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i02?ie=UTF8&psc=1)

And of course my Prime ran out a couple days ago, so slow shipping...  But when it all gets here, I'll start desoldering in earnest!  Still need to get a tip tinner--probably at RadioShack on my way home from work today.  Do you think the stock Weller WLC100 tip is sufficiently narrow if I'm careful, or do I need to get a smaller one?

Thanks for everyone's tips in this thread!

Well, it looks like I will be following Photoelectric's footsteps and purchasing pretty much the same items. I will need some equipment for putting together an Ergodox, and after reading the thread, his choices seem to have quite a good cost:performance ratio. I think I will need to find something to help remove the smoke on top of this.

How often does one tin the tip while soldering? After x minutes? After y joints soldered?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Wed, 26 June 2013, 11:28:36
Cool, yeah, I'd read the threads and read Amazon / google results for comments on my choices, and they seemed to be solid.  I like that you can buy smaller cuts of quality solder and braid from Amazon.  It should all arrive today, and I'll see how much solder is actually in those sections.  Might need to add one or two more cuts before my Prime membership runs out :)  I also ordered a Used Like New soldering iron (from Amazon Warehouse Deals) to save a few dollars.

From what I understand, you want to tin the tip every few minutes.   And a separate tip tinner is not required--just use your solder line.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 26 June 2013, 11:29:02
you will actually be able to see the oxidization form on the tip. a tinned tip without oxidization is shiny silver. as it oxidizes it will change color (usually to something nasty and brownish). just toss more solder and flux on. the flux will eat through the oxidization and the solder will form a thin coat over the surface. this coating stays pretty much constant thickness as long as you wipe the excess off or use it to make joints.

for the fumes, my diy fume extractor cookbook is here: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=40060.msg791820#msg791820

i'll append some of my newer LARGE PRIORITY BOX designs (ahahahahah).

but seriously, i'm actually going to make some proper ones now that i've found a good cheap source of carbon.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: grips on Wed, 26 June 2013, 11:40:51
Cool, yeah, I'd read the threads and read Amazon / google results for comments on my choices, and they seemed to be solid.  I like that you can buy smaller cuts of quality solder and braid from Amazon.  It should all arrive today, and I'll see how much solder is actually in those sections.  Might need to add one or two more cuts before my Prime membership runs out :)  I also ordered a Used Like New soldering iron (from Amazon Warehouse Deals) to save a few dollars.

From what I understand, you want to tin the tip every few minutes.   And a separate tip tinner is not required--just use your solder line.

Yes, I too went with the Amazon Warehouse choice :) I'd be interested in hearing how you like the tools when you get a chance to use them.

you will actually be able to see the oxidization form on the tip. a tinned tip without oxidization is shiny silver. as it oxidizes it will change color (usually to something nasty and brownish). just toss more solder and flux on. the flux will eat through the oxidization and the solder will form a thin coat over the surface. this coating stays pretty much constant thickness as long as you wipe the excess off or use it to make joints.

for the fumes, my diy fume extractor cookbook is here: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=40060.msg791820#msg791820

i'll append some of my newer LARGE PRIORITY BOX designs (ahahahahah).

but seriously, i'm actually going to make some proper ones now that i've found a good cheap source of carbon.

Thanks, mkawa, I will take a look at this.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Wed, 26 June 2013, 11:43:35
I have an air purifier I inherited from a friend.  What do you think if I'll put it immediately next to my soldering area with intake vents facing the spot where I'll be soldering?  I'm hoping that will draw some of the fumes away in a different direction.  Then I'll have to have all the windows open.  Soldering outside or in a garage is not an option for me.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 26 June 2013, 11:46:04
what kind of air purifier? the vast majority of "air purifiers" sold commercially are meant to extract money from hypochondriacs and not fumes or particulates from air
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Parak on Wed, 26 June 2013, 11:53:20
Most of the industrial type soldering fume filters that I've looked at are basically carbon prefilters with 99.97 or higher hepa after that. So if the air purifier is similar in that regard, then there shouldn't be too much of a difference aside from not having a hose that you can point directly at the soldering area. If you can solder right next to the intake of the purifier, that's fine too :P

Edit: Of course the industrial ones are built to higher quality standards, and are likely sealed better to prevent bypass. YMMV on the consumer grade stuff.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Wed, 26 June 2013, 12:03:13
It's probably a crappy one... Honeywell something with a washable filter.  I'll have to look.  I meant using it more for the purpose of drawing the solder fumes away from under my nose in a different direction, since it's pretty good at fanning air.  Then going for the best air circulation in a room with open windows.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: grips on Wed, 26 June 2013, 12:33:17
I've got the recommended desoldering iron from RadioShack so far.  Almost got my first switch out last night (but there's a skinny filament of solder left inside one of the holes, so waiting for other tools to arrive.

Ordered these from Amazon for my 2 Filco TKL projects :)

  • Weller WLC100 (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000AS28UC/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i03?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
  • Aoyue Soldering Iron Tip Cleaner with Brass (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005C789EU/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
  • MG Chemicals 4880 Series, Sn63/Pb37 Rosin Core Leaded Solder, 0.032" (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) - 0.6 oz cuts x 2
  • MG Chemicals 400 Series #3 Fine Braid Super Wick with RMA Flux, 5' Length x 0.075" (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008O9VX6O/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i02?ie=UTF8&psc=1)

And of course my Prime ran out a couple days ago, so slow shipping...  But when it all gets here, I'll start desoldering in earnest!  Still need to get a tip tinner--probably at RadioShack on my way home from work today.  Do you think the stock Weller WLC100 tip is sufficiently narrow if I'm careful, or do I need to get a smaller one?

Thanks for everyone's tips in this thread!

I just noticed the wick you chose has flux in it. That means the board would need to be cleaned after using it, correct? Would something like this:

http://www.amazon.com/MG-Chemicals-400-NS-Series-Desoldering/dp/B00424MWHO/ref=pd_luc_sim_01_03_t_lh?ie=UTF8&psc=1

be a better option? Or do wicks with flux perform better?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 26 June 2013, 12:34:18
the industrial SOLDER FUME EXTRACTOR units are largely made to extract money from factories and labs that need to get ISO certified. they do the job, because if they didn't you couldn't get certification, but they're usually overkill and SO SO EXPENSIVE

filtration 101 (abbrev):

self-contained filtering of gases and liquids consist of exactly two components. 1) a pump. 2) a filter. it is exactly that simple. pumps are pumps. in gases we typically use axial fans or centrifugal blowers/turbines. in liquids, we do exactly the same thing but with more torque :)). filters come in exactly two varieties: chemical and mechanical.

an example of a mechanical filter is a paper HEPA filter. HEPA N is a standard that says that a filter media (the paper), when put in some exact laboratory situation with a blower, will act as a particle diameter low pass filter with efficiency N. that is, at least N percent of the low-diameter particles will stop at the filter, the rest can go through. this is measured over some period of time in an airtight chamber, with a specification blower, i believe, but feel free to correct me on that.

hence, mechanical filters physical block particulates above a certain effective diameter with a certain efficiency.

note that there is no standardized testing committee that certifies hepa filters THAT I KNOW OF. i imagine there is some authorized set of ISO testers. i don't really know and don't own a factory so i don't care.

a chemical filter is a medium which _neutralizes_ airborne chemical compounds via some kind of reaction (hereafter rx). the rx is open, the bandwidth of compounds is open, and the meaning of neutralize is open. i am not familiar with any standards that apply to this action.

however, typically, the kinds of things that people worry about (that are bad for one's lungs to breathe) are organic compounds, because our lungs aren't very good at dealing with those for reasons i don't particularly care to understand (probably because we're made of carbon so they stick to our little oxygen absorber thingamajigs). by definition, an organic compound which can be vaporized and become airborne is called a volatile organic compound (VOC). recall that organic compounds are all compounds that contain the element carbon. hence, what we are worried about is airborne contaminants which have carbon somewhere in their chemical construction. hence, we've come up with a fantastic way to neutralize them. we produce more carbon, negatively charge it, and give it lots of surface area, and then pass the air over it. ta-da! some poor charcoal has taken the blow and had to become attached to this nasty compound instead of our lungs. NEUTRALIZED *****. there is a standard for this, because it's actually incredibly effective, and there are tons of organic compounds which are very nasty carcinogens. also lung cancer ****ing sucks, it grows quickly and kills you in the most painful possible way.

another type of chemical filter is a silver mesh. for reasons i can't remember at all, silver does nasty things to cell walls, so if you're a small enough airborn micro-organism and your cell wall is of a garden variety (tuberculosis and many other microorgs have weird hardened cell membranes), contact with the silver might kill you. again, no standardized testing really.

SOLDER FUMES:

are all fumes from the flux burning. the metal in the solder is very heavy and we don't solder at high enough temperatures to vaporize it (like 900K). rosin flux burns to a remarkably harmless compound which i can't remember at all, but is picked up most effectively by a chemical filter. hence, i'm going out now to buy 40lbs of ionized charcoal pellets. BYE EVERYONE!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Wed, 26 June 2013, 12:34:46
I just noticed the wick you chose has flux in it. That means the board would need to be cleaned after using it, correct? Would something like this:

http://www.amazon.com/MG-Chemicals-400-NS-Series-Desoldering/dp/B00424MWHO/ref=pd_luc_sim_01_03_t_lh?ie=UTF8&psc=1

be a better option? Or do wicks with flux perform better?

It will get flux onto it from the solder anyway.  Cleaning is not critical--just for neatness sake.  Flux will not harm anything.  I got the braid with flux to soak up solder better, so you don't have to add flux.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: grips on Wed, 26 June 2013, 12:42:07
I was watching WhiteFireDragon's ergodox assembly on YouTube. I noticed that he used some solder paste at one point. Does anyone recommend or recommend against using this?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 26 June 2013, 13:02:31
1) ROSIN flux is acidic and can eat away at things if you don't clean it. hence the invention of no-clean flux, which is inert.

2) flux is a dialectric. if you have uncleaned flux inside of a lot of joints then the joints can carry non-trivial amounts of capacitance, which can **** with your circuit. ideally you should actually reflow if this is the case, but cleaning the flux turns those into easier to see air gaps, so you KNOW you need to reflow

3) solder paste is just ground up solder and flux. it has a shelf life, because flux has a shelf life iirc. it's useful in situations where you want to apply flux and solder to only one end of very small joints, ie some smt work. otherwise, it doesn't tend to be very helpful.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: grips on Wed, 26 June 2013, 13:20:25
1) ROSIN flux is acidic and can eat away at things if you don't clean it. hence the invention of no-clean flux, which is inert.

2) flux is a dialectric. if you have uncleaned flux inside of a lot of joints then the joints can carry non-trivial amounts of capacitance, which can **** with your circuit. ideally you should actually reflow if this is the case, but cleaning the flux turns those into easier to see air gaps, so you KNOW you need to reflow

3) solder paste is just ground up solder and flux. it has a shelf life, because flux has a shelf life iirc. it's useful in situations where you want to apply flux and solder to only one end of very small joints, ie some smt work. otherwise, it doesn't tend to be very helpful.

Thanks. In that light, maybe I will consider getting a desoldering pump instead of a wick.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 26 June 2013, 13:24:50
nice to have both if you don't have a dedicated electromechanical unit like the hakko 808. i don't desolder a lot so i'm good with just an edsyn soldapullt classic and a couple widths of rosin wick, but ymmv. easy to clean solder off. get ****-grade iso alcohol from the drug store. costs a buck. find an old toothbrush - free. scrub board with toothbrush and alcohol. done
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 26 June 2013, 13:28:06
Thanks. In that light, maybe I will consider getting a desoldering pump instead of a wick.

FWIW, I have a desoldering bulb like what WFD uses in his Ergo-Clear mod video. I have had zero luck with getting the pumps (Soldapults) to work. I find the bulbs and the wicks to work better than the pumps.

And I used to work at an internship where I soldered/desoldered daily for hours.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Wed, 26 June 2013, 13:33:58
the industrial SOLDER FUME EXTRACTOR units are largely made to extract money from factories and labs that need to get ISO certified. they do the job, because if they didn't you couldn't get certification, but they're usually overkill and SO SO EXPENSIVE

More
filtration 101 (abbrev):

self-contained filtering of gases and liquids consist of exactly two components. 1) a pump. 2) a filter. it is exactly that simple. pumps are pumps. in gases we typically use axial fans or centrifugal blowers/turbines. in liquids, we do exactly the same thing but with more torque :)). filters come in exactly two varieties: chemical and mechanical.

an example of a mechanical filter is a paper HEPA filter. HEPA N is a standard that says that a filter media (the paper), when put in some exact laboratory situation with a blower, will act as a particle diameter low pass filter with efficiency N. that is, at least N percent of the low-diameter particles will stop at the filter, the rest can go through. this is measured over some period of time in an airtight chamber, with a specification blower, i believe, but feel free to correct me on that.

hence, mechanical filters physical block particulates above a certain effective diameter with a certain efficiency.

note that there is no standardized testing committee that certifies hepa filters THAT I KNOW OF. i imagine there is some authorized set of ISO testers. i don't really know and don't own a factory so i don't care.

a chemical filter is a medium which _neutralizes_ airborne chemical compounds via some kind of reaction (hereafter rx). the rx is open, the bandwidth of compounds is open, and the meaning of neutralize is open. i am not familiar with any standards that apply to this action.

however, typically, the kinds of things that people worry about (that are bad for one's lungs to breathe) are organic compounds, because our lungs aren't very good at dealing with those for reasons i don't particularly care to understand (probably because we're made of carbon so they stick to our little oxygen absorber thingamajigs). by definition, an organic compound which can be vaporized and become airborne is called a volatile organic compound (VOC). recall that organic compounds are all compounds that contain the element carbon. hence, what we are worried about is airborne contaminants which have carbon somewhere in their chemical construction. hence, we've come up with a fantastic way to neutralize them. we produce more carbon, negatively charge it, and give it lots of surface area, and then pass the air over it. ta-da! some poor charcoal has taken the blow and had to become attached to this nasty compound instead of our lungs. NEUTRALIZED *****. there is a standard for this, because it's actually incredibly effective, and there are tons of organic compounds which are very nasty carcinogens. also lung cancer ****ing sucks, it grows quickly and kills you in the most painful possible way.

another type of chemical filter is a silver mesh. for reasons i can't remember at all, silver does nasty things to cell walls, so if you're a small enough airborn micro-organism and your cell wall is of a garden variety (tuberculosis and many other microorgs have weird hardened cell membranes), contact with the silver might kill you. again, no standardized testing really.

SOLDER FUMES:

are all fumes from the flux burning. the metal in the solder is very heavy and we don't solder at high enough temperatures to vaporize it (like 900K). rosin flux burns to a remarkably harmless compound which i can't remember at all, but is picked up most effectively by a chemical filter. hence, i'm going out now to buy 40lbs of ionized charcoal pellets. BYE EVERYONE!

Sounds like you just need a gasmask :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: grips on Wed, 26 June 2013, 13:37:22
nice to have both if you don't have a dedicated electromechanical unit like the hakko 808. i don't desolder a lot so i'm good with just an edsyn soldapullt classic and a couple widths of rosin wick, but ymmv. easy to clean solder off. get ****-grade iso alcohol from the drug store. costs a buck. find an old toothbrush - free. scrub board with toothbrush and alcohol. done

You're right, it's pretty cheap. I will probably grab a wick as well. I don't plan on doing much desoldering, but I plan to make some mistakes.

Thanks. In that light, maybe I will consider getting a desoldering pump instead of a wick.

FWIW, I have a desoldering bulb like what WFD uses in his Ergo-Clear mod video. I have had zero luck with getting the pumps (Soldapults) to work. I find the bulbs and the wicks to work better than the pumps.

And I used to work at an internship where I soldered/desoldered daily for hours.

Thanks, I may pick that one up as it is fairly cheap. Hard to know what to get without having tried everything.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Wed, 26 June 2013, 13:44:12
Anybody try the hakko bit multipacks found on ebay that come from china?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Wed, 26 June 2013, 13:55:48
Anybody try the hakko bit multipacks found on ebay that come from china?

I think the_beast has
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 26 June 2013, 14:02:12
as long as you put something on there that conducts heat and does not warp the pencil barrel, you should be good. the only trick is that each tip will have its own thermal profile and ideally requires calibration of the regulator. then again, we've already covered the ghetto method of calibration earlier (10: turn temp up, does solder flow? if not, GOTO 10).

gas masks are just filters that use your lungs as the pump.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Parak on Wed, 26 June 2013, 15:17:52
the industrial SOLDER FUME EXTRACTOR units are largely made to extract money from factories and labs that need to get ISO certified. they do the job, because if they didn't you couldn't get certification, but they're usually overkill and SO SO EXPENSIVE

Yep, definitely overkill and expensive. But while activated charcoal by itself is sufficient, there is research that suggests that a HEPA postfilter can offer some additional benefit (and wouldn't hurt anyway). The foam type activated charcoal is definitely useless:

link (http://annhyg.oxfordjournals.org/content/42/8/511.abstract?maxtoshow=&HITS=10&hits=10&RESULTFORMAT=1&andorexacttitle=and&andorexacttitleabs=and&fulltext=lead+oxide+fumes&andorexactfulltext=and&searchid=1&FIRSTINDEX=0&sortspec=relevance&fdate=1/1/1844&tdate=6/30/2007&resourcetype=HWCIT)

Note that as per this (http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg248.pdf) flux fumes can definitely be harmful. But as per the link above, the ability to effectively draw them away from your face is just as important as its ability to filter.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 26 June 2013, 19:21:48
the industrial SOLDER FUME EXTRACTOR units are largely made to extract money from factories and labs that need to get ISO certified. they do the job, because if they didn't you couldn't get certification, but they're usually overkill and SO SO EXPENSIVE

Yep, definitely overkill and expensive. But while activated charcoal by itself is sufficient, there is research that suggests that a HEPA postfilter can offer some additional benefit (and wouldn't hurt anyway). The foam type activated charcoal is definitely useless:

link (http://annhyg.oxfordjournals.org/content/42/8/511.abstract?maxtoshow=&HITS=10&hits=10&RESULTFORMAT=1&andorexacttitle=and&andorexacttitleabs=and&fulltext=lead+oxide+fumes&andorexactfulltext=and&searchid=1&FIRSTINDEX=0&sortspec=relevance&fdate=1/1/1844&tdate=6/30/2007&resourcetype=HWCIT)

the foam type is just foam dyed black. seriously. it's foam that they dip in water with some carbon powder in it so that it comes out black. useless. yes, a paper media filter can never hurt. but if you're DIYing, don't think you need to go buy a paper media filter and figure out how to get your contraption to flow through it. literally flowing air through strong bags full of charcoal is basically as effective. one point to mention about hepa mechanical filters is that they produce a really large amount of backpressure (unless, of course, they don't work!).

Quote
Note that as per this (http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg248.pdf) flux fumes can definitely be harmful. But as per the link above, the ability to effectively draw them away from your face is just as important as its ability to filter.
assuming you're in a sufficiently aerated space. i happen to not be actually, so i be filling garbage bags full of carbon.

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 26 June 2013, 19:25:29
it occurs to me that one cool option is a diy air to fluid transfer mechanism. think bong but fill the water exchange part of the thing with charcoal, and of course, use a real pump, not your lungs. the air to liquid transfer slow the vocs WAY DOWN and exposes them to _all_ of the surface area of your charcoal. plus, it would look insanely cool.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Wed, 26 June 2013, 19:30:36
What about this:
(http://www.allergyasthmatech.com/ProdImages/M7000.jpg)

With the 99.7 hepa filters? or a military surplus gas mask?


Hardcore soldering!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 26 June 2013, 19:36:28
tdlr from above. hepa is a particulate standard. soldering gives off VOCs, not much in the way of particulates.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Wed, 26 June 2013, 20:53:26
  • Weller WLC100 (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000AS28UC/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i03?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
  • Aoyue Soldering Iron Tip Cleaner with Brass (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005C789EU/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
  • MG Chemicals 4880 Series, Sn63/Pb37 Rosin Core Leaded Solder, 0.032" (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) - 0.6 oz cuts x 2
  • MG Chemicals 400 Series #3 Fine Braid Super Wick with RMA Flux, 5' Length x 0.075" (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008O9VX6O/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i02?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
These finally arrived, and I successfully desoldered Filco LEDs, which were a pain due to the tiny solder-filled holes.  But that braid was quite nice.  I had to put some solder onto the soldering iron tip, and then press the tip against the braid.  Cleaned up the PCB with alcohol afterwards--nice and clean.  Was very satisfying!  I ordered another 5' section of the braid and yet another cut of the solder--just in case. 

I've got everything for my ergo-Clear mod now, just need to wait for the new steel universal TKL plates to start shipping...  Hope that won't be a terribly long wait. 
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: grips on Wed, 26 June 2013, 21:12:44
  • Weller WLC100 (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000AS28UC/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i03?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
  • Aoyue Soldering Iron Tip Cleaner with Brass (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005C789EU/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
  • MG Chemicals 4880 Series, Sn63/Pb37 Rosin Core Leaded Solder, 0.032" (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) - 0.6 oz cuts x 2
  • MG Chemicals 400 Series #3 Fine Braid Super Wick with RMA Flux, 5' Length x 0.075" (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008O9VX6O/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i02?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
These finally arrived, and I successfully desoldered Filco LEDs, which were a pain due to the tiny solder-filled holes.  But that braid was quite nice.  I had to put some solder onto the soldering iron tip, and then press the tip against the braid.  Cleaned up the PCB with alcohol afterwards--nice and clean.  Was very satisfying!  I ordered another 5' section of the braid and yet another cut of the solder--just in case. 

I've got everything for my ergo-Clear mod now, just need to wait for the new steel universal TKL plates to start shipping...  Hope that won't be a terribly long wait.

Good to hear that everything worked out well. I'm excited for my orders to arrive, although I still have a while to wait for the ergodox to ship. Maybe I can find something to solder around the house.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: stoic-lemon on Wed, 26 June 2013, 21:21:39
I have have a soldering related question that is totally keyboard unrelated.

My friend has a necklace she broke and wants repaired. Would it be possible to solder this back together? It is very small. Do you think it would hold up even if one could repair it in the first place? I'm afraid I'm not sure what it is made out of.

[attach=1]

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Thu, 27 June 2013, 00:27:31
yes and no. you don't use electronics solder for that, and you need to repair the mechanical break first. she needs to bring it to a jeweler
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: stoic-lemon on Thu, 27 June 2013, 00:33:03
Thank you! I'll let her know.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Thimplum on Thu, 27 June 2013, 14:39:26
never solder when you're tired.

Haha! So true.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Defying on Thu, 27 June 2013, 15:44:43
This is probably the wrong place for this, but I'm planning on buying a soldering iron and the requirements soon to replace switches on my QFR.

What would I need without going overboard on price? I'm looking to spend a little under $100 for everything.
I'm currently looking at the WLC100 and the desoldering bulb from RadioShack, but the solder and whatever else I need is where I'm lost.

Thanks!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Thu, 27 June 2013, 18:03:20
This is probably the wrong place for this, but I'm planning on buying a soldering iron and the requirements soon to replace switches on my QFR.

What would I need without going overboard on price? I'm looking to spend a little under $100 for everything.
I'm currently looking at the WLC100 and the desoldering bulb from RadioShack, but the solder and whatever else I need is where I'm lost.

Thanks!

Check out the stuff I got: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=42824.msg933875#msg933875

Plus I also got the desoldering iron from RadioShack.  The total was WELL below $100, and it's been working well so far.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: grips on Thu, 27 June 2013, 18:53:28
This is probably the wrong place for this, but I'm planning on buying a soldering iron and the requirements soon to replace switches on my QFR.

What would I need without going overboard on price? I'm looking to spend a little under $100 for everything.
I'm currently looking at the WLC100 and the desoldering bulb from RadioShack, but the solder and whatever else I need is where I'm lost.

Thanks!

Check out the stuff I got: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=42824.msg933875#msg933875

Plus I also got the desoldering iron from RadioShack.  The total was WELL below $100, and it's been working well so far.

Have you had a chance to use the desoldering iron as well? How does it compare to the wick?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Thu, 27 June 2013, 18:56:24
The desoldering iron was kind of hard to use.  I got pretty inconsistent amounts of solder socked in, especially if there was solder  deeper within the holes (which is a "feature" of Filco boards, they advertise having solder going all the way through the PCB onto the other side, and it's one of those lead-free solders too, so harder to melt).  I think I prefer the desoldering braid for greater control.  I'll still use the desoldering iron, but if I get frustrated with it in the process, I'll switch to the braid.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Thu, 27 June 2013, 20:42:54
I got my FX888D today and oh man, it is sweet.
I've been stuck using a weller soldering gun with a huge tip for the longest time.

Today I rewired my headphones, wanted a lighter and longer cord, the station made everything so quick in comparison, well, maybe that and I've soldered a few things here and there since I started.

Definitely worth the dosh, can't wait for the ergodox to come.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Defying on Thu, 27 June 2013, 20:59:25
This is probably the wrong place for this, but I'm planning on buying a soldering iron and the requirements soon to replace switches on my QFR.

What would I need without going overboard on price? I'm looking to spend a little under $100 for everything.
I'm currently looking at the WLC100 and the desoldering bulb from RadioShack, but the solder and whatever else I need is where I'm lost.

Thanks!

Check out the stuff I got: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=42824.msg933875#msg933875

Plus I also got the desoldering iron from RadioShack.  The total was WELL below $100, and it's been working well so far.
Awesome! I'll definitely look into buying these soon, the pricing for all of that is perfect.

Thanks for the help!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TD22057 on Thu, 27 June 2013, 23:09:27
I did a bunch of soldering last night w/ my new Hakko FX-888 and I have to say it's awesome.  I never realized how annoying my old cheap soldering irons were until I used the Hakko.  It heats up incredibly fast and the temperature control is fantastic.  I soldered 40 pins onto my teensy++ in rapid succession and every pin took the same amount of time to melt the solder.  My cheap irons would have required waiting for them to heat back up and watching carefully to see when the solder melts for each pin.  I can't believe I waited this long to get a nice iron...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: dorkvader on Sat, 29 June 2013, 00:10:05
So I just soldered up another ergoDOX, and I must say I'm getting better at those diodes. Noe thing that made the most difference was getting some tweezers. They make positioning the diode and holding it steady during soldering really easy! The tweezers were borrowed from my co-worker (we use them to extract broken off headphone jacks) so I'm going to order some ESD safe tweezers for myself now.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bpiphany on Sat, 29 June 2013, 01:57:46
Don't buy the plastic ones. They melt... My favorites are a pair in titanium. I don't think they are ESD safe, conductive of course, and you should be grounded yourself anyway for anything to be ESD safe...

I believe these are the ones I have http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/18037TT/243-1081-ND/1953884
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 29 June 2013, 02:01:02
wiha makes some extremely nice ones in tool steel that are actually esd safe (plated). about 20 dollars a piece, but will last a lifetime used properly.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bpiphany on Sat, 29 June 2013, 02:11:00
Titanium is naturally non-magnetic I think, which is nice, and quite non-corrosive. And the ones I have serrated grips, and ridges on the grip section.

You don't need the very pointiest tweezers if you aren't going to do very small stuff. I think mine are perfect for the 0603s I usually do with them. Needle point ones bend easy and poke you in the eyes...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Sat, 29 June 2013, 02:20:45
I bought a $4 pair of steel super fine tweezers


Should I feel bad?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bpiphany on Sat, 29 June 2013, 02:23:14
Not if you like them =) There is always use for super fine as well. You can never have enough tweezers...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: nubbinator on Sat, 29 June 2013, 02:28:16
I bought a $4 pair of steel super fine tweezers


Should I feel bad?

Nope, you should be stoked that they were only $4.

Edit:  Spelling eludes me at night.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Sat, 29 June 2013, 02:31:28
I bought a $4 pair of steel super fine tweezers


Should I feel bad?

Nope, you should be stocked that they were only $4.

Here's a link if your interested:
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Apex-Tool-Group-Formerly-Cooper-Tools/EROP3SA/?qs=%2fha2pyFadujs3EouTrRyqoLuRZox9NTz%2fuh41f7ezvw%3d
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: nubbinator on Sat, 29 June 2013, 02:35:12
I'm good with my cheapo anti-static ones I grabbed off of Amazon right now, but thanks for the link.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 29 June 2013, 07:56:46
Titanium is naturally non-magnetic I think, which is nice, and quite non-corrosive. And the ones I have serrated grips, and ridges on the grip section.

You don't need the very pointiest tweezers if you aren't going to do very small stuff. I think mine are perfect for the 0603s I usually do with them. Needle point ones bend easy and poke you in the eyes...
well you don't point them at eyes unless you really dislike the people you're point at. yeesh!

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Aranair on Sat, 29 June 2013, 08:21:57
mmm, quick question: what setting should I be using the WLC100 at? I remember seeing this somewhere but can't seem to find it anymore D:
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Sat, 29 June 2013, 10:44:31
mmm, quick question: what setting should I be using the WLC100 at? I remember seeing this somewhere but can't seem to find it anymore D:

Depends on for what solder and the task.  On setting "3", I was able to melt hard-to-melt solder on my Filco PCB.  Just start low and turn up the dial gradually until you reach the temperature range needed to do your soldering, and avoid going much higher.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Sun, 30 June 2013, 13:56:37
Now that it's summer things have been toned down a bit and i have more time and now some cash on my side for once xD

anyways, ive saved some up for some equipment, and i want to get into the soldering game.

there is a hobby shop near my current job, so i'm going to head over there in a bit to look to see what they have. if they don't have what i need, i'll order online i guess.

any advice on what to look for when at that hobby shop?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Poom on Tue, 02 July 2013, 06:55:20
hey, this may be a stupid question, but hey I ask dumb questions all the time, so here is another one.

buying a cheap soldering iron, though i understand that ideally it would be better to buy one with temparature control. but how bad can be buying a simple cheap one be?

would it burn the PCB? or taking a break after a few minutes because it will overheat? etc?

by the way I saw a battery powered soldering iron. is that a good idea or staying out of it?

Thanks for the input.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bueller on Tue, 02 July 2013, 07:23:39
Picked up a cheap soldering iron and some tools to get my skills back up to scratch after a 10 year break. Realising just how useless the $15 irons from hardware stores really are, it's been a pain in the neck de-soldering all the switches on my M0115. Will be investing in an FX888 next week along with a pack of 200 switches from Matias for my first custom  ;D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Poom on Tue, 02 July 2013, 07:47:07
umm.. i think ill pick up a soldering station then. but just to make sure would solder thickness of 0.5mm and 0.5mm tip do the job?

another thing, how hot should it be? around 150 degress celcius or 200?

Thanks
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 02 July 2013, 07:59:30
here are the melting point of common soldering alloys. keep in mind that you have to locally bring both ends of a solder joint up to these temperatures to complete a solder joint.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solder
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Tue, 02 July 2013, 08:06:37
When soldering in switches, to avoid cold solder joints, do I need to heat up a switch pin AND the metal ring around the hole that the pin protrudes through?  Or is it sufficient to heat the pin and let solder melt around it into the hole?  If the former, I need to invest into a thinner soldering iron tip than my Weller WC100 came stock with.

Also worried about flux residue from desoldering getting into the holes on the PCB.  Is it best to desolder and resolder right away--or better to clean the PCB thoroughly with alcohol, getting into every hole as much as possible, before resoldering?  I wonder about any impurities being stuck on the inner surfaces of the PCB holes where switch pins and LED pins will be connected.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tgujay on Tue, 02 July 2013, 08:45:08
Picked up a cheap soldering iron and some tools to get my skills back up to scratch after a 10 year break. Realising just how useless the $15 irons from hardware stores really are, it's been a pain in the neck de-soldering all the switches on my M0115. Will be investing in an FX888 next week along with a pack of 200 switches from Matias for my first custom  ;D

Really the radio shack $15 desoldering iron is the best thing when desoldering a ton of switches.  Completely desoldered my WYSE last night in about a half hour, and that was with taking breaks between rows to put the switches in my phantom plate to see how it looks :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Poom on Tue, 02 July 2013, 09:02:17
I want one of that desoldering iron too but we dont have Radio Shack in Europe.... >:D

and only lead free solder....
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Tue, 02 July 2013, 09:28:31
Speaking of tweezers I just got these in the mail.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00BG8WW2Y/ref=oh_details_o01_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

They seem really solid, and really freaking sharp. They come with caps for the ends.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 02 July 2013, 09:56:05
those look pretty good. and they're cheap enough that if they do start failing you just replace them. not bad! i've purchased quite a few useful little things from uxcell before...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: damorgue on Tue, 02 July 2013, 10:48:41
I got these a while back and they have worked fine:
http://dx.com/p/lodestar-anti-static-tweezer-tilted-pointy-tip-7042
http://dx.com/p/lodestar-professional-anti-static-tweezers-pointy-tip-7000
Cheapo chinese stuff but they always have free international shipping and their stuff usually works good enough.

Does anyone have any recommendations regarding amount of flux in the solder? What is suitable for PCB work, larger cables, SMD etc? Is it ever recommended that you use flux-free solder and apply it yourself or not at all? Most solder I have seen are in the 1.2% to 2% interval.

Edit: I have never bothered enough to care about which solder I use as I have never encountered it buut I figured I might as well try to get the most suitable.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Tue, 02 July 2013, 11:25:03
Huh, they look like the same tweezers.  ^-^
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 02 July 2013, 13:07:19
I got these a while back and they have worked fine:
http://dx.com/p/lodestar-anti-static-tweezer-tilted-pointy-tip-7042
http://dx.com/p/lodestar-professional-anti-static-tweezers-pointy-tip-7000
Cheapo chinese stuff but they always have free international shipping and their stuff usually works good enough.

Does anyone have any recommendations regarding amount of flux in the solder? What is suitable for PCB work, larger cables, SMD etc? Is it ever recommended that you use flux-free solder and apply it yourself or not at all? Most solder I have seen are in the 1.2% to 2% interval.

Edit: I have never bothered enough to care about which solder I use as I have never encountered it buut I figured I might as well try to get the most suitable.
especially with modern no-clean, you can never have too much flux (that stuff is such crap...). it would be too hard to get flux-free solder to flow onto a joint, as oxidization is pretty much instantaneous and the solder needs to bond to the metal under the oxidized layer.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Tue, 02 July 2013, 17:50:41
I have a sort of related question to soldering..

Does anyone know what the plastic looking tools are called that pry stuff apart (keyboards so I can solder them?) without breaking the clips?

I've had to use a plastic puddy knife to take a laptop apart, looking for something more professional for the next time.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Tue, 02 July 2013, 17:59:26
I have a sort of related question to soldering..

Does anyone know what the plastic looking tools are called that pry stuff apart (keyboards so I can solder them?) without breaking the clips?

I've had to use a plastic puddy knife to take a laptop apart, looking for something more professional for the next time.

Do you mean:

(https://griotsgarage.scene7.com/is/image/GriotsGarage/37850?$detail$)?

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: gnubag on Tue, 02 July 2013, 18:02:42
take random credit/debit/phone/gift cards.
that would be the cheapest tool you need to open cases.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Tue, 02 July 2013, 18:12:03
I have a sort of related question to soldering..

Does anyone know what the plastic looking tools are called that pry stuff apart (keyboards so I can solder them?) without breaking the clips?

I've had to use a plastic puddy knife to take a laptop apart, looking for something more professional for the next time.

Do you mean:

Show Image
(https://griotsgarage.scene7.com/is/image/GriotsGarage/37850?$detail$)
?

Maybe.. that wedge in the middle on the right looks like it could work. But I've seen the tools in disassembly videos, they look like some sort of composite plastic rounded wedge tools. No idea what they are called.

take random credit/debit/phone/gift cards.
that would be the cheapest tool you need to open cases.

Might try that next time.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Tue, 02 July 2013, 18:16:40
The middle right one is the one I use for everything keyboard.  The wedge tip does great for popping cases apart and the kinda forked end pops keycaps off faster and safer than anything else.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: YoungMichael88 on Tue, 02 July 2013, 18:18:13
I got these in from eBay today
(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/07/03/mehusesy.jpg)
Anti-magnetic too. I'll try find the link

EDIT: http://bit.ly/14M0Otc
Very happy with these I thought they were gonna be poorly built but they are not bad
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Tue, 02 July 2013, 19:49:23
Alright friends, after some research the tool is called a Spudger.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 03 July 2013, 09:01:58
spudgers are plastic or nylon tools used to pry things apart, push things around without scratching the surface below them, push things together, apply tape without those damned bubbles, anything you can use a plastic, nylon, silicone, etc. tool for. it's a pretty catch-all term. the point is that it's not metal, the goal is not to scratch anything, and ideally it shouldn't melt or conduct electricity.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Wed, 03 July 2013, 09:18:04
I have a sort of related question to soldering..

Does anyone know what the plastic looking tools are called that pry stuff apart (keyboards so I can solder them?) without breaking the clips?

I've had to use a plastic puddy knife to take a laptop apart, looking for something more professional for the next time.

I've had great success opening Filcos with an "iPod repair tool."

(http://www.powerbookmedic.com/xcart1/images/D/ipod-tool.gif)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 03 July 2013, 09:21:58
I used a screwdriver to open my Filco....then I slipped and poked myself with it. I managed to not draw blood so I wouldn't say I stabbed myself. I'm really lucky I didn't try using my pocket knife...

-10/10, would not use again. Be safe and use a small screw driver/plastic tool/spudger and definitely not your pocket knife....and don't try to open boards up in your lap.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 03 July 2013, 09:27:32
my favorite spudgers are these:

(http://thumbs3.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/mbhwgIEBeIliTagXnBIoXRw.jpg)

i usually find an OBO dealer on ebay and offer them like .5/ea for 20 of them. the great thing/problem with spudgers is that because they're made to be softer than the things they're spudging, they're super easy to tear up, so i usually keep a good dozen around and just toss them with they have so many little marks in them that they're not useful anymore. i've done all kinds of crazy crap to them. snapped off the sharp end, put huge holes into the flat end, melted one, etc. 's fine, just toss and grab a new one out of the box :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Wed, 03 July 2013, 11:03:49
I have had good experience with the spudger from iFixit. The ones I have are slightly bigger than ones I got from Dell.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 03 July 2013, 11:20:35
the ones that ifixit sells are exactly the ones in my post above. they are available for about an order of magnitude less money directly from HK or mainland china with relatively low MOQ
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Wed, 03 July 2013, 11:42:27

I've had great success opening Filcos with an "iPod repair tool."

Show Image
(http://www.powerbookmedic.com/xcart1/images/D/ipod-tool.gif)


I've been using one of those for o-ring placement and as a keycap remover :D  Regular old credit cards to open cases, though it's a pain either way.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: nubbinator on Wed, 03 July 2013, 12:21:45

I've had great success opening Filcos with an "iPod repair tool."

More
Show Image
(http://www.powerbookmedic.com/xcart1/images/D/ipod-tool.gif)

I found it incredibly easy to open my QFR and RK9000 with a putty knife.  If you're carefull, a good metal one won't scratch anything, but if you want to be safe, there are plenty of sturdy plastic ones that will do the trick.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Wed, 03 July 2013, 13:16:07
the ones that ifixit sells are exactly the ones in my post above. they are available for about an order of magnitude less money directly from HK or mainland china with relatively low MOQ

Good to know, I need to order some of these then!!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: VesperSAINT on Wed, 03 July 2013, 17:07:09
I have a sort of related question to soldering..

Does anyone know what the plastic looking tools are called that pry stuff apart (keyboards so I can solder them?) without breaking the clips?

I've had to use a plastic puddy knife to take a laptop apart, looking for something more professional for the next time.

I got this white plastic tool that was made specifically to remove the top case from Cooler Master, which works like a thing smooth wedge.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 03 July 2013, 18:32:08
speaking of putty knives. a putty knife for the purposes of clay sculpting sharped on 1000+ grit sandpaper (wet keeps the paper in the best shape) works extremely well as a spudger too. obviously you want the plastic or nylon ones not the metal ones.

i got mine for 0.75/ea at the art store. they seem very pbt, but i have not confirmed.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MKULTRA on Wed, 03 July 2013, 21:30:55
Just got all my soldering supplies today!  Can't wait for GON to ship my PCB and case and stuff.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Wed, 03 July 2013, 22:13:58
I have a sort of related question to soldering..

Does anyone know what the plastic looking tools are called that pry stuff apart (keyboards so I can solder them?) without breaking the clips?

I've had to use a plastic puddy knife to take a laptop apart, looking for something more professional for the next time.

I got this white plastic tool that was made specifically to remove the top case from Cooler Master, which works like a thing smooth wedge.

I have some of these, still in the packaging. Forgot all about them.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: kenmai9 on Wed, 03 July 2013, 22:26:47
If I want to just desolder switches and re solder new switches all I need is an iron, solder and wick right? Why does everyone keep buying de soldering irons? Is wick not sufficient enough?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Wed, 03 July 2013, 22:27:35
If I want to just desolder switches and re solder new switches all I need is an iron, solder and wick right? Why does everyone keep buying de soldering irons? Is wick not sufficient enough?

I hate wicks, suckers a better IMO
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bueller on Wed, 03 July 2013, 23:09:57
If I want to just desolder switches and re solder new switches all I need is an iron, solder and wick right? Why does everyone keep buying de soldering irons? Is wick not sufficient enough?

I hate wicks, suckers a better IMO

Totally agree, I can desolder a whole board in about 10 mins with a pump, braid would take far longer!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Thu, 04 July 2013, 13:52:50
Ok, I did something stupid and pulled out one of the copper rings around the PCB holes that gets soldered to a switch pin.  Is this fixable in any way?  The silver metal ring around the back of the PCB, connecting to traces, is still there and fine.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: nubbinator on Thu, 04 July 2013, 13:58:35
Ok, I did something stupid and pulled out one of the copper rings around the PCB holes that gets soldered to a switch pin.  Is this fixable in any way?  The silver metal ring around the back of the PCB, connecting to traces, is still there and fine.

Are you talking about a PCB land?  Do you have a picture?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Thu, 04 July 2013, 14:13:44
Yup, it's that one.  The rest are coming out neatly as I'm maneuvering with a desoldering braid to get all the small stuck bits disconnected.

Pause, left pin hole:
(http://i.imgur.com/FNQBLTC.jpg)

Same but from the back side--looks normal (except all the flux I've not yet cleaned off)
(http://i.imgur.com/g5zwyE3.jpg)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: nubbinator on Thu, 04 July 2013, 14:21:41
As long as the land isn't connected to a trace you should be ok.  You really need to get yourself a solder pump or bulb though. It makes it so much easier to desolder and you get nicer looking lands and don't have to worry as much about burning the land or trace.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Thu, 04 July 2013, 14:32:03
That's the problem--I have a desoldering pump/tool from Radioshack.  I got all the solder pools out fine, but some of the switches have tiny filaments of solder remaining.  That's where I've had to add solder and maneuver with a braid, because the pump won't get those out.  And they are not very visible either--have to look in carefully, and if the switches don't come out easily but look like they should, that's where those tiny filaments are :( 
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Thu, 04 July 2013, 14:34:24
That's the problem--I have a desoldering pump/tool from Radioshack.  I got all the solder pools out fine, but some of the switches have tiny filaments of solder remaining.  That's where I've had to add solder and maneuver with a braid, because the pump won't get those out.  And they are not very visible either--have to look in carefully, and if the switches don't come out easily but look like they should, that's where those tiny filaments are :( 

For those types of situations, I apply heat to the small joint and gently pull the component off
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Thu, 04 July 2013, 14:42:17
I've just been adding solder to all thinly-connected pins now and using desoldering braid.  Reliably good result.  Not a fan of the Radioshack sucker tool now =/  Much neater with a braid, and I wouldn't have had to desolder each difficult switch twice.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Thu, 04 July 2013, 14:47:26
I've just been adding solder to all thinly-connected pins now and using desoldering braid.  Reliably good result.  Not a fan of the Radioshack sucker tool now =/  Much neater with a braid, and I wouldn't have had to desolder each difficult switch twice.

I hated my radioshack bulb, to be fair. 

Absolutely love my fx-808, but that's not for everyone.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Thu, 04 July 2013, 15:01:16
It seems okay in theory, except that it left 2/3rds of my switches unremovable.  I even heated the pins for a while before using the suction bulb =/  The holes looked neat, but then it would turn out that there was still a thin filament of solder left somewhere inside.  Seems like it's partially a Filco-related annoyance too, as not all PCBs have those copper shafts all the way through to the other side, to trap solder.

How do you wiggle the switch while heating the pins, by the way?  It seems like a 3-hand job...  Unless you clamp the PCB+plate in some vertical position.  Would definitely be nice to not have to refill solder + use desoldering braid on everything--it's been a very slow process, sometimes I have to repeat it 2 or 3 times.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Thu, 04 July 2013, 16:56:53
It seems okay in theory, except that it left 2/3rds of my switches unremovable.  I even heated the pins for a while before using the suction bulb =/  The holes looked neat, but then it would turn out that there was still a thin filament of solder left somewhere inside.  Seems like it's partially a Filco-related annoyance too, as not all PCBs have those copper shafts all the way through to the other side, to trap solder.

How do you wiggle the switch while heating the pins, by the way?  It seems like a 3-hand job...  Unless you clamp the PCB+plate in some vertical position.  Would definitely be nice to not have to refill solder + use desoldering braid on everything--it's been a very slow process, sometimes I have to repeat it 2 or 3 times.

I had this exact problem with my Filco MJ-2. With a Hakko 808, not a RadioShack desoldering iron/bulb. So don't feel bad. As long as the land on the back is intact, the switch will still work fine.

FWIW, the singe-sided MJ-1 I desoldered had no such problems.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: khaangaaroo on Thu, 04 July 2013, 17:46:38
FWIW, the singe-sided MJ-1 I desoldered had no such problems.

Makes me even more glad I rolled with cheap single-sided QFRs instead of MJ2s now
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Thu, 04 July 2013, 17:59:15
Ok guys, thanks so much for the help / support!  I got most of the switches out now--a handful to go.  I did end up just heating up the stubborn pins and pushing on the switch from the other side with a flat screwdriver.  That pops them right out :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: gnubag on Thu, 04 July 2013, 19:01:09
Ok guys, thanks so much for the help / support!  I got most of the switches out now--a handful to go.  I did end up just heating up the stubborn pins and pushing on the switch from the other side with a flat screwdriver.  That pops them right out :D

if you do that try using a cheap  IC puller.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Thu, 04 July 2013, 19:11:04
Woohoo, it's done!  Thanks again!

(http://i.imgur.com/hYllLZw.jpg)

Such a beautiful color--my favorite.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bueller on Fri, 05 July 2013, 02:42:52
I'd avoid the solder bulbs, they're rubbish. I've got a de-soldering pump and it's so much quicker than using wick, desoldered 2 boards last night in about 15 minutes.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Fri, 05 July 2013, 09:24:47
Oh yes, forgot to mention, this is what happened to my desoldering tool from Radio Shack after one day of use (more precisely after a few hours of intermittent use):

(http://i.imgur.com/IOZk4S0.jpg)

I made sure to squeeze the bulb a few times after every switch to get all the solder out as much as possible.  Apparently the tip was not made to last at all.  Good thing it only cost me $5, and perhaps I can squeeze another PCB's worth of desoldering out of it, but I have my doubts!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheFlyingRaccoon on Fri, 05 July 2013, 09:34:03
Oh yes, forgot to mention, this is what happened to my desoldering tool from Radio Shack after one day of use (more precisely after a few hours of intermittent use):

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/IOZk4S0.jpg)


I made sure to squeeze the bulb a few times after every switch to get all the solder out as much as possible.  Apparently the tip was not made to last at all.  Good thing it only cost me $5, and perhaps I can squeeze another PCB's worth of desoldering out of it, but I have my doubts!

Wow same thing happened to mine after desoldering one board. I guess I'm not the only one! I took it back to Radioshack and they gave me a new iron and replacement tip.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Fri, 05 July 2013, 09:35:36
Hrm, I should try that... I think I tossed the packaging though :(  I got it to mod 2 Filco TKL keyboards, and it's dying after 1.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Fri, 05 July 2013, 09:37:21
When I worked at my internship, I used braid a lot. I got a little fed up with the braid because we had cheap stuff and it wasn't very good. I saw the pumps in the supply closet and someone told me what they did so I was so excited to use them. I figured it would make my life so much easier.

I spent the better part of a day trying to get it to work. I'm talking like 4-6 hours of soldering/de-soldering. When I finally got mad and tossed the pump out, the guys laughed at me so hard.

They soldered/de-soldered for a good portion of their jobs and they couldn't get the pumps to work. They had long since given up on them and let the dumb intern try it out.

With all the praise they get here, I kind of want to try out one. But there's no way I'm paying $30 for something that I've tested and deemed unusable for me.

And my bulb looks like that too. I really don't care how it looks as long as it keeps desoldering.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheFlyingRaccoon on Fri, 05 July 2013, 09:39:02
Hrm, I should try that... I think I tossed the packaging though :(  I got it to mod 2 Filco TKL keyboards, and it's dying after 1.

Yea these things really aren't high quality. Good luck getting a replacement!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 05 July 2013, 10:28:39
the 808 and compressor driven dedicated desoldering stations are really the only pumps worth their salt. (although it's a lot of salt). it depends on how much you make from desoldering. usually when i really need to get a part off, a combination of high quality appropriately sized (i keep a variety of widths around) and a soldapult can do the job, but there's usually a certain amount of destruction involved (ie, snipping the component off at the leads).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Fri, 05 July 2013, 10:38:28
How do you use those syringe-like pumps?  You pull with your left hand, while heating a pin with a soldering iron with your right hand?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bueller on Fri, 05 July 2013, 10:46:40
How do you use those syringe-like pumps?  You pull with your left hand, while heating a pin with a soldering iron with your right hand?

Soldering iron in dominant hand and then pump in the other. I usually rest the tip of the pump just a few mm away from the solder joint and then as I lift the iron off I move the pump over the solder and hit the button. Takes a bit of getting used to but once you get a rhythm going it's dead easy.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: damorgue on Fri, 05 July 2013, 10:47:55
How do you use those syringe-like pumps?  You pull with your left hand, while heating a pin with a soldering iron with your right hand?

They are spring loaded beforehand, you don't need to pull anything when you want to do the actual desolder. You just press the button on it when the solder is melted and it will suck.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Fri, 05 July 2013, 10:52:10
Hrm, that does sound very nice, especially if they have high suction force.  Thank you!  Are there any decent ones at RadioShack, in case I'm allowed to exchange mine?  Or only from places like Amazon.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 05 July 2013, 12:03:09
as has been mentioned several hundred times in this thread, the soldapullt DS017 is the gold standard for hand pumps. order directly from edsyn or easily available from fry's if you have one locally.

the nozzle is plastic, but quite cheap and replaceable (not that i've ever known anyone who needed to replace any part on a soldapullt..)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Fri, 05 July 2013, 12:20:59
I had a more specific question - don't get mad :)  I know that Soldapult is The recommended tool, but but I was checking about a local alternative,  especially with a possible exchange.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 05 July 2013, 12:26:22
are you asking if radioshack carries the soldapullt or will refund you? i have absolutely no idea. i can say that i've screwed around with all kinds of desoldering tools fo light use and just having a variety of good wick on hand and a soldapullt has generally worked for me. if you're MMB or alaricljs, you need to spring for either a compressor driven unit or a self-contained unit like the hakko 808. that's pretty much the end-all be-all of desoldering.

oh wait! there is one more option if you just want to recover a board and don't care about the components on it, you can point a hot air gun at the solder and go to town. the temps a good hot air gun hits generally will let the magic smoke out of everything on the board, but the solder will all go liquid at once and you can literally kick the board to make everything magically fall off.

i was pretty bored as a kid.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Fri, 05 July 2013, 12:37:23
Thank you.  And my exact question above was "Are there any decent ones at RadioShack, in case I'm allowed to exchange mine?"  I'm good though, I'll figure something out.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 05 July 2013, 12:54:59
OH! the answer to that is no, unfortunately. one of the horrible things i went through was a stupid bulb from radioshack.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bpiphany on Fri, 05 July 2013, 18:13:56
Pumps are good for removing large amounts of solder. Through hole plating makes the job a lot harder. The old single sided Filco PCBs are a breeze compared to newer ones. Braid is good for getting the last remaining solder off, and for SMD parts. It doesn't completely remove all solder completely either, parts are still often stuck somewhere...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 05 July 2013, 18:17:31
sometimes the old heat'n'pull is the only way to separate those suckers

a jig like the always-useful panavise pcb holder, extended vise, or even the jr can be quite helpful here.

for SMT a good pair of tweezers is quite useful, which is why we were discussing tweezers earlier.

the hakko 888d also supports a set of heated tweezers (that of course cost more than the unit itself :facepalm:) if you do a ton of smt rework.

what you don't want to do is ever EVER waste money on one of these "third hands" pieces of crap that are everywhere. here is an example of one: http://www.thinkgeek.com/product/a4bb/

DO NOT EVER BUY ONE OR TRY TO USE ONE

they are the biggest pieces of crap i swear to god..
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Fri, 05 July 2013, 18:20:12
Pumps are good for removing large amounts of solder. Through hole plating makes the job a lot harder. The old single sided Filco PCBs are a breeze compared to newer ones. Braid is good for getting the last remaining solder off, and for SMD parts. It doesn't completely remove all solder completely either, parts are still often stuck somewhere...

Yeah, I learned that the hard way :(  I followed the advice of heating up the pins and pulling on the swtich gently from the other side at the same time--that worked very well where tiny inaccessible filaments of solder were left.  Problem with using the soldering braid is that it can get hot enough to melt off the coating on the traces.  Even though it doesn't seem to have a detrimental effect (other than exposing the traces to oxidation), I was going for the neatest job possible.  Next time for my second Filco I'll just be using a suction tool + heating up pins and pulling--no desoldering braid.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 05 July 2013, 18:23:53
oftentimes a given job (and this doesn't just apply to soldering, but to the practice of taking everything in your life apart piece by piece, measuring it carefully and then putting it back together again OK I HAVE A PROBLEM OK???? I GET IT) requires a combination of tools. heat'n'pull is a great way to get the component out initially. now you have a blob of solder, and if it's thru-hole, possibly two sides to get at it. this is literally the perfect time for a pump like the soldapullt, heat one side with your iron and suck with the other. DONE.

in the process of doing this, you very possibly used an adjustable vice or two, coarse tweezers, some gloves (burning onesself on one's iron sucks!), a good temp controlled iron, etc. etc. etc.

this is the excuse i use for owning so many tools.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: gnubag on Fri, 05 July 2013, 18:36:34
what gloves are you using for soldering? regular white gloves?

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 05 July 2013, 18:43:16
whatever disposable polymer crap is at hand (hah hah glove joke .... :( )
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: calavera on Fri, 05 July 2013, 19:13:08
Alright I'm thinking of getting a Hakko 888 soldering kit. What tips should I get with it? I'll buy everything from amazon btw.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Fri, 05 July 2013, 19:42:25
Alright I'm thinking of getting a Hakko 888 soldering kit. What tips should I get with it? I'll buy everything from amazon btw.

I got a 1.2 chisel, another 1.6 (the one its comes with), and a 3.2, in case I need to do something big down the road.

For me, I feel like the 1.2 is small enough for SMD, anything smaller seems like it would just be like a needle point.

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Fri, 05 July 2013, 20:12:26
Alright I'm thinking of getting a Hakko 888 soldering kit. What tips should I get with it? I'll buy everything from amazon btw.

I got a 1.2 chisel, another 1.6 (the one its comes with), and a 3.2, in case I need to do something big down the road.

For me, I feel like the 1.2 is small enough for SMD, anything smaller seems like it would just be like a needle point.

I use needle points more than anything, but I also do admittedly different stuff than most here.

I'd say look for the 12 pack that floats around on ebay, it's solid tips and has a good selection for a great price.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 06 July 2013, 01:29:44
i don't know about the ebay tips because frankly i'd rather have a single tip that lasts 12 years than 12 tips that give me inconsistent heat transfer for one year each.

also because genuine tips are cheap.

i have one of the smaller needle points i never use, a d16, d32 (for big ****), and some other crap i never use. the d16 is pretty much going to be your go-to tip for almost everything except for joints that need a lot of power. the small tips like the d12 or the needle points are only really useful in situations where you need to be really careful about how much power you're putting into the joint. not that this doesn't include most SMD ICs, because you'll want enough surface area to be able to do a quick wipe downwards across the pins. a needle tip won't allow you to do that, but can be useful for really fine rework.

for wires or big components i break out the d32. the 888d has enough power to make quick work of those if you give it the surface area.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Melvang on Sat, 06 July 2013, 07:01:35
I got a question for your guys.  I was in the process of building a really custom cable for my secret project and bumped the tip of the iron on the insulation of the wire.  Now I have burnt on insulation on one side of the tip.  Any suggestions to get it off without removing the nickel plating?  I have already tried the brass sponge type tip cleaner and tinning the crap out of the tip with mounds of solder but i can't seem to cut through it.

HELP PLEASE.

Melvang
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheSoulhunter on Sat, 06 July 2013, 08:31:03
Alright I'm thinking of getting a Hakko 888 soldering kit. What tips should I get with it? I'll buy everything from amazon btw.

I use the d24 (2,4 mm chisel) for most trough-hole stuff...
More contact area than the d16 (better heat transfer) but not too big (like the d32).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Cafiend on Sat, 06 July 2013, 10:55:57
Has anyone used a butane soldering iron? I have been looking at them and I'm curious if there
 is a general preference when it comes to computer use.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 06 July 2013, 11:29:33
I got a question for your guys.  I was in the process of building a really custom cable for my secret project and bumped the tip of the iron on the insulation of the wire.  Now I have burnt on insulation on one side of the tip.  Any suggestions to get it off without removing the nickel plating?  I have already tried the brass sponge type tip cleaner and tinning the crap out of the tip with mounds of solder but i can't seem to cut through it.

HELP PLEASE.

Melvang
heat then use a bronze fibered brush

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 06 July 2013, 11:30:15
Has anyone used a butane soldering iron? I have been looking at them and I'm curious if there
 is a general preference when it comes to computer use.
useless. they're for joining copper pipes in plumbing
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bpiphany on Sat, 06 July 2013, 12:10:52
Has anyone used a butane soldering iron? I have been looking at them and I'm curious if there
 is a general preference when it comes to computer use.
useless. they're for joining copper pipes in plumbing

Not quite true... https://www.google.se/search?q=butane+soldering+pen&tbm=isch&biw=1700&bih=956

Very high effect, no temperature control. Only good for electronics in a pinch.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Sat, 06 July 2013, 12:58:29
What's the best way to remove LEDs?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sat, 06 July 2013, 14:30:21
Has anyone used a butane soldering iron? I have been looking at them and I'm curious if there
 is a general preference when it comes to computer use.
useless. they're for joining copper pipes in plumbing

Not quite true... https://www.google.se/search?q=butane+soldering+pen&tbm=isch&biw=1700&bih=956

Very high effect, no temperature control. Only good for electronics in a pinch.

Yeah, the pens are meant for heavier gauge electronic/wire work.  I've got one that has a crude temp control but I wouldn't use it for PCB stuff.

What's the best way to remove LEDs?


The best way is with a hakko fx-808, an acceptable way is with heat and a soldapullt
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Sat, 06 July 2013, 18:58:49
This is sort of soldering and keyboard-related...  Filco USB cables: does anyone know what is that paper-like stuff under the rubber outer insulation?  Just spliced a cable, going to see if I can sleeve it and solder it back together.  Some sort of an anti-static material?  Unsure if it's going to cause problems to have a section without it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sat, 06 July 2013, 19:05:32
This is sort of soldering and keyboard-related...  Filco USB cables: does anyone know what is that paper-like stuff under the rubber outer insulation?  Just spliced a cable, going to see if I can sleeve it and solder it back together.  Some sort of an anti-static material?  Unsure if it's going to cause problems to have a section without it.

Nah, it's just a cheap insulator, you'll be fine.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Sat, 06 July 2013, 19:09:17
Thank you--and since you possibly know about cables then, do you know what this thing is called?

(http://i.imgur.com/Htd8IEt.jpg)

(the "stopper"-like addon to make the cable sit tightly inside the case hole). 
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: gnubag on Sat, 06 July 2013, 19:26:31
Thank you--and since you possibly know about cables then, do you know what this thing is called?

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/Htd8IEt.jpg)


(the "stopper"-like addon to make the cable sit tightly inside the case hole).

cable strain relief
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Sat, 06 July 2013, 19:36:04
Thank you very much!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: ApocalypseMaow on Sat, 06 July 2013, 20:28:27
Where do you get those!!!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: calavera on Mon, 08 July 2013, 00:46:11
Thanks for the tips guys.

The Hakko 888 comes stock with D16 I think. So for just basic switch work I should get a D24? I don't think I'll ever need a D12/needle size.
Any recommendations on which solder wire to get? What's easier, desolder pump or desoldering wick?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: gnubag on Mon, 08 July 2013, 00:50:14
Thanks for the tips guys.

The Hakko 888 comes stock with D16 I think. So for just basic switch work I should get a D24? I don't think I'll ever need a D12/needle size.
Any recommendations on which solder wire to get? What's easier, desolder pump or desoldering wick?

for solder just get kester 44 (link in op)
and IMO a pump works better for me but I still have some wick around if I need it for what ever

i just bought a new edsyn pump
http://www.ebay.com/itm/181045394315?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Mon, 08 July 2013, 01:13:55
Thank you--and since you possibly know about cables then, do you know what this thing is called?

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/Htd8IEt.jpg)


(the "stopper"-like addon to make the cable sit tightly inside the case hole). 

That one is molded into the cable, so you can't replace that part without replacing the whole cable.  They do make types that you mount on the body of whatever the cord plugs into like this:
http://www.delcity.net/store/Strain-Relief-Cord-Connectors/p_800839.r_IF1003?gclid=CKr31fWen7gCFcmj4Aod2AIA0w
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 08 July 2013, 07:54:11
strain relief is available from any electronics shop

for general soldering work the d16 is great. it's really a jack of all trades. d24 for slightly bigger joints (it's a compromise for the impatient and careful basically), d32 for honkers. d16 can scale down to SMD, so i wouldn't bother going smaller. but d16s take forever to heat up huge joints, so a d32 is a good tip to have around.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Mon, 08 July 2013, 09:55:15
To those with the RadioShack desoldering iron w/bulb:

You don't have to replace the entire iron when the tip wears out. They sell replacement tips for like $1.99. When this was my primary desoldering tool, I would go into RadioShack about once a month and buy up all the tips they had in stock each time. Using a new tip really cuts down on the frustration factor. :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Mon, 08 July 2013, 09:56:36
Thank you, JD!  I'm going to stop by my local RadioShack today to get a new tip.

By the way, how long do the SoldaPult tools last?  I might be getting a used one from someone for a good price, but I don't know if it's a bad idea.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Mon, 08 July 2013, 09:58:16
JD You're my hero. Mine cracked from the thermal stresses, which makes no sense btw, and I was so mad.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Mon, 08 July 2013, 10:07:08
Thank you, JD!  I'm going to stop by my local RadioShack today to get a new tip.

By the way, how long do the SoldaPult tools last?  I might be getting a used one from someone for a good price, but I don't know if it's a bad idea.

:D

The Soldapullt should last just short of forever, if it's a genuine Edsyn. If it did break, you could just call their customer service at 818 989-2324 and they would probably repair or replace it. I called that number to place my order, and the rep was very helpful. She quoted me less than the listed prices for my order, and you don't even have to purchase their $25 minimum listed on their website. Mine is the trusty DS017.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 08 July 2013, 10:15:05
list price on the tips (at my fry's) is 3.99. sounds like edsyn will just send you a bunch if you ask though. great frickin company, that
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tgujay on Mon, 08 July 2013, 10:34:22
If you were to accidentally lift a pad off of a PCB while soldering... what would your options be to fix it?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 08 July 2013, 10:39:32
glue a new pad down. use an adhesive that won't burn at 200C+. then, widen the pad a little bit by etching away at the trace that the pad connects to. it's actually just a thin layer of dieletric covering a copper trace. to electrically connect your new pad to the trace, tin the entirety of the exposed metal at once.

another option if you're soldering a wire to the pad is to find another electrically connected pad to solder the wire to.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Melvang on Mon, 08 July 2013, 10:39:55
What I would do is the same thing I did when I did my HD activity LED mod on my Das keyboard.  Link for that build log is in my signature.

Essentially what I did was break the trace where I drilled the new holes for the LED and rotating the switch.  After that I just followed the traces to the end points and soldered in a jumper wire from pad to pad.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bueller on Mon, 08 July 2013, 10:46:00
Man never realised how much of a difference some tip tinner makes with a crappy soldering iron. After desoldering all the switches on a few old boards my tip was covered in crap and wouldn't even catch solder anymore, couple of runs through the tinner and it's good as new. Can't believe I've never bothered buying some before.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Mon, 08 July 2013, 11:03:37
I've been tinning with my solder line--it's always shiny as a result.  Did not get a dedicated tinner.
(Also got a used Soldapult DS017 for $16 shipped, woop!)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Mon, 08 July 2013, 11:08:05
http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-DS-017-Desoldering-Pump-Sucker-Solder-Irons-Removal-Remover-Tool-Blue-L-/181056125691?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a27c93afb (http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-DS-017-Desoldering-Pump-Sucker-Solder-Irons-Removal-Remover-Tool-Blue-L-/181056125691?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a27c93afb)

So I'm guessing this listing is a fake, considering the price and it doesn't say Soldapullt but does use the model number?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 08 July 2013, 11:09:14
tip tinner is just solder paste btw.

the hardcore way to clean your tips and heated parts of the iron off are to take some iso and a brass brush and scrub the **** out of everything.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 08 July 2013, 11:09:45
i also prefer liquid flux. totally up to personal preference though.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Mon, 08 July 2013, 11:12:22
http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-DS-017-Desoldering-Pump-Sucker-Solder-Irons-Removal-Remover-Tool-Blue-L-/181056125691?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a27c93afb (http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-DS-017-Desoldering-Pump-Sucker-Solder-Irons-Removal-Remover-Tool-Blue-L-/181056125691?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a27c93afb)

So I'm guessing this listing is a fake, considering the price and it doesn't say Soldapullt but does use the model number?

Looks legit, but lacking all Edsyn branding from the listing. My guess would be a clone. The pics are probably from an actual Edsyn DS017.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Mon, 08 July 2013, 11:26:59
Ok so here is an odd question, I know solder is usually talked about by weight...number of ounces etc, but I've seen some on ebay being sold in 15ft or 20ft rolls.

So my question is how many 'feet' of solder does it take to solder up say a phantom?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 08 July 2013, 11:31:21
depends on how clumsy you are and how you like to solder. i use 63/37 0.025 diam and it would probably take me anywhere about 6in? of solder, but that's with board prep and all kinds of weird stuff. personally what i did when i was a youngun was just buy a bunch of different varieties, a small pack each (oz or two by weight and then bought a gigantor roll of the one i liked the most. in my case it was a kester 63/37, but somehow i ended up losing that and ended up with an alphacore 63/37 i also like fine

*shrug*
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 08 July 2013, 11:32:41
my current roll, which will probably last until i die, btw, is 1lb of 0.025"
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Mon, 08 July 2013, 11:40:06
So 20ft of Kester 63/37 .031 Solder Rosin Core #44 should be plenty for messing around and just 'learning' how to solder then!!

Thanks for the info!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bpiphany on Mon, 08 July 2013, 12:07:01
I don't think my tip tinner is solder paste. It has some citric acidicy smell to it when I goo around in it. I think it does other things than solder paste does, more cleansing power. I use a brass bristle brush to get bulks of crap of the tip, then I use the tinner, a couple of times if necessary. Sometimes I also rub the extra persistent spots of burnt solder lightly with a scalpel tip to get them off.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Mon, 08 July 2013, 12:18:57
my current roll, which will probably last until i die, btw, is 1lb of 0.025"

Ya, I just got a 1lb roll of kester .02 (.5mm) on ebay for like 16 bucks a couple weeks ago.

I don't think I'll ever run out.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 08 July 2013, 12:19:14
it might also have some citric acid in it for degreasing? i use lab grade alcohol for that actually.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Mon, 08 July 2013, 12:43:52
My Filco PCB was kind of greasy after desoldering, and since I won't be soldering anything to it for at least a week (waiting on a universal plate), I decided to clean it.  It was a pain, but I think I got a good easy method in the end.  I scrubbed it with a clean toothbrush, dipping into pure alcohol, repeating the process a few times.  Eventually, there was some lint left from cotton swabs I initially used (they get caught on the resistors / diodes very easily), so I scrubbed the dry PCB with a clean toothbrush in a circular motion and used a can of compressed air.  Looks very clean now!  My only concern is for anything that got into the pin holes in the process.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 08 July 2013, 15:50:51
all that matters in any solder joint is that there is:

a) a sufficiently strong mechanical connection
b) a sufficiently low resistance electrical connection (ie, negligible resistance)

note that a and b aren't the same things!! for example, let's say you're soldering two solid core hookup wires together. my favorite method of making the mechanical connection is to make little j hooks at the end of each piece of wire, and then hook the two ends together like little pinky fingers. crimp that down with a pair of pliers or a press if you want less of a bulge at the joint. now, you have a solid mechanical connection (a). now, use a metal brush to clean off the oxidization from the wires or apply some flux. then, heat and solder. the hooky bits form the mechanical connection and the metal alloy which bonds the two pieces of metal carries the current (b). you now have a solder joint.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: quickcrx702 on Tue, 09 July 2013, 01:28:58
Don't buy the cheapest sodomy iron you can find, and practice on old motherboards or alarm clocks.  Soldering doesn't take too long to learn, but desoldering can be tough if you don't have the right equipment.  You can overheat a board and damage stuff.  Also, try not to breath in too much of the fumes, it's potentially bad for your health.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Charger on Tue, 09 July 2013, 01:35:58
Wear eye protection and long pants; and never solder when you're tired.
or naked... I have only burned my self soldering in my boxers lol. well not really i have also burned myself with clothes on and trying to grab the iron to low
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: YoungMichael88 on Tue, 09 July 2013, 01:39:39
Wear eye protection and long pants; and never solder when you're tired.
or naked... I have only burned my self soldering in my boxers lol. well not really i have also burned myself with clothes on and trying to grab the iron to low
pffff, I ONLY solder naked.

EDIT: outdoors

EDIT2: in public
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Tue, 09 July 2013, 02:02:21
Don't buy the cheapest sodomy iron you can find, and practice on old motherboards...

Oh my.  :-[
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: domoaligato on Tue, 09 July 2013, 02:55:40
what is the mat that wfd is always using in his youtube video's as part of his soldering station?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: domoaligato on Tue, 09 July 2013, 02:57:58
Wear eye protection

+1 the flux can pop up in your eye. wear safety glasses.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 09 July 2013, 09:35:08
could be a static dissipation mat, or could be temperature resistant. personally, my desk is covered with raw textile carbon woven carbon fiber (60x8" is 20 bucks at mcmaster hah!) so that even when i drop my iron on the table (which yes, i do... :() i don't light anything on fire. carbon fiber is also very minimally conductive, which is basically the deal with ESD safe stuff. so one corner is wired to earth ground basically
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Tue, 09 July 2013, 09:41:01
Are the Alvin cutting mats good to use?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Tue, 09 July 2013, 10:09:14
Anyone have knowledge / experience with proper cleaning [and possibly lubrication] of switch housing metal parts--like the leaf and such?  I need to clean some old switches, and will probably be using a CRC QD Electronics Cleaner to remove any oxidation initially (as it's cheap for a larger amount), but I'm wondering if lubrication is also going to be good in this case for longer-term corrosion and rust prevention.  Like say Deoxit has a formula that leave a greasy residue (plastic-safe).  CRC also makes a separate product (CRC 2-26 Multipurpose Lubricant) that could be applied after cleaning.  From what I've been googling, people say that cleaning contacts with no-residue cleaners is great, but on moving parts it's good to leave some film of conditioning substances. 

What do you think--excessive for MX Switches?  And moreover, could interact with Krytox lube somehow if used on the front slider parts?  I only took one year of chemistry, so I don't know the proper answer :)

Picture of what I'm talking about:
(http://i.imgur.com/mdCDns4.jpg)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 09 July 2013, 10:52:15
Are the Alvin cutting mats good to use?
the alvin cutting mats are great for cutting (i have a few well used ones, and they're brilliant) but they're completely nonconductive so they don't help with esd. also, they melt (ask me how i know ;))
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 09 July 2013, 10:54:46
Anyone have knowledge / experience with proper cleaning [and possibly lubrication] of switch housing metal parts--like the leaf and such?  I need to clean some old switches, and will probably be using a CRC QD Electronics Cleaner to remove any oxidation initially (as it's cheap for a larger amount), but I'm wondering if lubrication is also going to be good in this case for longer-term corrosion and rust prevention.  Like say Deoxit has a formula that leave a greasy residue (plastic-safe).  CRC also makes a separate product (CRC 2-26 Multipurpose Lubricant) that could be applied after cleaning.  From what I've been googling, people say that cleaning contacts with no-residue cleaners is great, but on moving parts it's good to leave some film of conditioning substances. 

What do you think--excessive for MX Switches?  And moreover, could interact with Krytox lube somehow if used on the front slider parts?  I only took one year of chemistry, so I don't know the proper answer :)

Picture of what I'm talking about:
Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/mdCDns4.jpg)

my favorite deoxidizer is MG chem's electrosolve. it's pretty insane. it's also terrible for you. CAIG (the deoxit guys) also sell a deoxidizer that i have heard good things about it.  if it _weren't_ switch components, i would say just use a brass brush, but i wouldn't risk an abrasive or pressure on a switch crosspoint.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Tue, 09 July 2013, 10:59:52
What about the lubrication part, leaving a corrosion-protective residue.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 09 July 2013, 11:00:08
hell, solder can pop into your eyes. last time i got an MRI they asked me if i ever soldered and i was like "all the time" and they were like did you wear eye protection?" and i was like "no." and they were like ":/"

but i wear prescription glasses so they ended up being fine with it. otherwise i would have had to do a route through a split lens to look for lead and silver specs that could potentially rip through my eyeballs. you don't want to to either do the split lens thing next time you end up getting imaging done OR have solder rip through your eyeball. wear eye protection. mcmaster, amazon and the usual machining and lab equipment suspects have nicer models that look more like oakleys than those things you wore in high school.

this is also true for light and heavy duty machine work obviously.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Tue, 09 July 2013, 11:08:01
On the topic of 'safety gear' do you guys wear any kind of gloves when assembling/disassembling/soldering ?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 09 July 2013, 11:10:35
i wear gloves when working with solvents, non-inert chemicals (like aforementioned electrosolve) and when i'm about to burn myself (usually what happens is i put my hand somewhere, burn myself, swear and then go put some nitrile gloves on). a 400pk is like 10 bucks at costco, and not giving yourself 3rd degree burns is worth 10 bucks.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 09 July 2013, 11:12:12
Sometimes I'll wear my perscription safety glasses with the amazing side shields. That's about it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Melvang on Tue, 09 July 2013, 12:00:43
i wear gloves when working with solvents, non-inert chemicals (like aforementioned electrosolve) and when i'm about to burn myself (usually what happens is i put my hand somewhere, burn myself, swear and then go put some nitrile gloves on). a 400pk is like 10 bucks at costco, and not giving yourself 3rd degree burns is worth 10 bucks.

Nitrile gloves melt pretty quick if i remember right so they won't protect you from burns but will protect you from some chemicals.  But the only thing i wear for saftey gear when soldering is 100% cotton shirt and pants with either my prescription glasses or safety glasses from work.  Whenever I am working with powered cutting or drilling tools of any size i wear safety glasses that meat ANSI z87.1 specs and hearing protection.  I have enough hearing damage from working on a flight deck of an aircraft carrier and don't want any more.  I enjoy my music to much. 

And I did wear hearing protection on the flight deck but the EA-6B Prowlers are just that freakin loud.  The exhaust on those points down at a slight angle and is the engines make enough noise to vibrate the 2" steel plate of the flight deck.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 09 July 2013, 12:04:52
your hands hurt like a ***** far before they melt ;)

Quote
Whenever I am working with powered cutting or drilling tools of any size i wear safety glasses that meat ANSI z87.1 specs and hearing protection
this is something i totally should do but don't.

amazon has great deals on peltor and leight earmuffs. they also have great deals on 200pks of all the leight earplugs (my favorites imo)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Melvang on Tue, 09 July 2013, 16:32:35
I get my earplugs from a local Campbells Supply.  It is an industrial contractor supply shop.  100 count of corded earplugs that I can actually wear for 12 hours.  I buy my own for work cause work won't buy the ones that I can wear that long at a shot.  Besides its a tax write off for me.  And it is only $20 every 3 to 4 months.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Wed, 10 July 2013, 13:12:46
depends on how clumsy you are and how you like to solder. i use 63/37 0.025 diam and it would probably take me anywhere about 6in? of solder, but that's with board prep and all kinds of weird stuff. personally what i did when i was a youngun was just buy a bunch of different varieties, a small pack each (oz or two by weight and then bought a gigantor roll of the one i liked the most. in my case it was a kester 63/37, but somehow i ended up losing that and ended up with an alphacore 63/37 i also like fine

*shrug*

Ok a few more solder questions.

 What's the deal with 'organic' solder?

And are you familiar with Kester SN63/PB37 245 vs 285 in the 0.02 variant? I've seen some on ebay listed as kester 245 and another as kester 285.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 10 July 2013, 22:56:31
285 and 245 are the rosins used in the core of the solder wire. 285 is a mildly corrosive rosin and 245 is a no-clean. kester 44 is the full on eats through oxidization rosin that imo is best for hobbyist usage. the complex fluxes are best for sensitive smd soldering where you need to pay attention to fine tolerances or meet materials requirements for products at retail (eg, rohs requires no-clean and lead-free). we just want to make a joint by any means necessary. and are perfectly happy cleaning flux off of boards and being exposed to small amounts of lead.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: vun on Thu, 11 July 2013, 14:28:35
Just picked up some soldering gear for when my r3 eDox kit gets here, and I have minimal prior experience with soldering so I was wondering if there's a quick list of do's and don'ts when soldering that I should be aware of, besides the obvious.

Also, will a chisel tip work better for keyboard soldering than a round tip?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Thu, 11 July 2013, 14:34:39
Just picked up some soldering gear for when my r3 eDox kit gets here, and I have minimal prior experience with soldering so I was wondering if there's a quick list of do's and don'ts when soldering that I should be aware of, besides the obvious.

Also, will a chisel tip work better for keyboard soldering than a round tip?

Go watch some youtube videos
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tgujay on Thu, 11 July 2013, 14:36:15
Just picked up some soldering gear for when my r3 eDox kit gets here, and I have minimal prior experience with soldering so I was wondering if there's a quick list of do's and don'ts when soldering that I should be aware of, besides the obvious.

Also, will a chisel tip work better for keyboard soldering than a round tip?

Go watch some youtube videos

No u.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Thu, 11 July 2013, 15:25:49
yes, chisel tips are preferred. the reason is that they have more usable surface area. thermal transmission is a function of materials at the junction and the area of the junction. think about it in terms of either quantum, power, or just oh **** i just touched the stove, and it makes perfect sense.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Thu, 11 July 2013, 16:06:34
Just picked up some soldering gear for when my r3 eDox kit gets here, and I have minimal prior experience with soldering so I was wondering if there's a quick list of do's and don'ts when soldering that I should be aware of, besides the obvious.

Also, will a chisel tip work better for keyboard soldering than a round tip?

Go watch some youtube videos

No u.

That's what I did  ;D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: vun on Thu, 11 July 2013, 16:16:18
Just picked up some soldering gear for when my r3 eDox kit gets here, and I have minimal prior experience with soldering so I was wondering if there's a quick list of do's and don'ts when soldering that I should be aware of, besides the obvious.

Also, will a chisel tip work better for keyboard soldering than a round tip?

Go watch some youtube videos

No u.

That's what I did  ;D

Currently in the process of doing so, I'll admit that I didn't really think about watching videos when I made the first post >_>

Gonna go pick up some more soldering gear tomorrow, I found out that I'd missed a few things the first time around.

Also, since the soldering gear isn't cheap I'd like to get more use out of it than an eDox and the occasional repair job; any suggestions for other soldering projects?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Melvang on Thu, 11 July 2013, 16:18:44
Teensy plus hardwired matrix keyboard
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: vun on Thu, 11 July 2013, 16:34:29
Teensy plus hardwired matrix keyboard

We'll see how keen I am on doing more keyboard work after I'm done with the eDox.

But more ontopic questions; I'm assuming that I'll want 0,56mm and 0,7mm solder since that's what's closest to the ones recommended(I live in a strange place called metric-land), but should I get some finer solder if I can?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: gnubag on Thu, 11 July 2013, 16:49:38
Teensy plus hardwired matrix keyboard

We'll see how keen I am on doing more keyboard work after I'm done with the eDox.

But more ontopic questions; I'm assuming that I'll want 0,56mm and 0,7mm solder since that's what's closest to the ones recommended(I live in a strange place called metric-land), but should I get some finer solder if I can?

I think you are good with only 0.7mm which is around 0.020" which is good for smd.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Thu, 11 July 2013, 17:33:55
Just picked up some soldering gear for when my r3 eDox kit gets here, and I have minimal prior experience with soldering so I was wondering if there's a quick list of do's and don'ts when soldering that I should be aware of, besides the obvious.

Also, will a chisel tip work better for keyboard soldering than a round tip?

Go watch some youtube videos

No u.

That's what I did  ;D

Currently in the process of doing so, I'll admit that I didn't really think about watching videos when I made the first post >_>

Gonna go pick up some more soldering gear tomorrow, I found out that I'd missed a few things the first time around.

Also, since the soldering gear isn't cheap I'd like to get more use out of it than an eDox and the occasional repair job; any suggestions for other soldering projects?

Well, I rewired some headphones, An xbox 360 fightstick, my mouse cord.

Things that I actually needed to fix to get to work again lol
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: vun on Thu, 11 July 2013, 17:37:09

Well, I rewired some headphones, An xbox 360 fightstick, my mouse cord.

Things that I actually needed to fix to get to work again lol

I've actually got a headphone repair lined up if it turns out I can't get them repaired/replaced under warranty, hoping I'll be able to get to that tomorrow, and I'm gonna look around if there are any forgotten things needing repair.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Thu, 11 July 2013, 22:34:14
Stuff is here. gonna attempt to desolder an old white alps board tomorrow. :) wish me luck
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Thu, 11 July 2013, 22:37:50
Stuff is here. gonna attempt to desolder an old white alps board tomorrow. :) wish me luck

Good luck!  An Alps project sounds like fun!  I'm dreading desoldering my second Filco, which needs to happen soon, but it should go smoother now after my lessons from the first one.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Thu, 11 July 2013, 22:40:14
Stuff is here. gonna attempt to desolder an old white alps board tomorrow. :) wish me luck

Good luck!  An Alps project sounds like fun!  I'm dreading desoldering my second Filco, which needs to happen soon, but it should go smoother now after my lessons from the first one.

I figure i can desolder the board to get some practice in before i tinker with my pure...I'm excited and will be posting questions here if i have them tomorrow  ^-^

special thanks to JD again :* thanks bro
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheSoulhunter on Fri, 12 July 2013, 08:11:34
Just picked up some soldering gear for when my r3 eDox kit gets here, and I have minimal prior experience with soldering so I was wondering if there's a quick list of do's and don'ts when soldering that I should be aware of, besides the obvious.

Also, will a chisel tip work better for keyboard soldering than a round tip?

I also think you should watch some videos, visual learning really is the way to go here!
Anyway, if you are really looking for a quick simple writeup, here is what I do...

- For switch or LED soldering I use a 2,4mm chisel tip
- Also I use leaded rosin core solder with 1mm diameter
- Make sure components sit flush against the PCB and pins sit right
- Set the temperature of the station to 300-350 degree Celsius and wait for heatup
- Make sure your solder tip is clean, if not clean it (repeat that periodically in the process)
- Put the tip in between pad and pin and feed a small amount of solder in the gap between tip an pin for better heat transfer
- Feed solder from the other side into the gap between pin and pad (enough that you get a solid cone shape bonding) and remove tip
- The two steps above should be done fast and finished when the molten solder completely stops smoking (then the flux is used up)
- Inspect the solder spots... You want a shiny uninterrupted cone shape which contacts the whole pad, best use a magnifying glass for that
- If there seems to be something wrong with the spot, desolder -> clean -> redo, or apply some flux (you can get it seperately) and let the spot reflow by heating it up again
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tgujay on Fri, 12 July 2013, 08:15:09
Stuff is here. gonna attempt to desolder an old white alps board tomorrow. :) wish me luck

Good luck!  An Alps project sounds like fun!  I'm dreading desoldering my second Filco, which needs to happen soon, but it should go smoother now after my lessons from the first one.

Desoldering iron from radioshack really is great, and tips are like $2.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Fri, 12 July 2013, 09:09:42
Can anyone recommend a good place to get replacement sponges for the hakko 888 holder?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Fri, 12 July 2013, 09:10:42
Target or Walmart? They're just sponges...

I would recommend you get a brass tip cleaner though. Those don't cause as much thermal shock and are better for your tips.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 12 July 2013, 09:13:00
i happent o like the hakko sponge shape

http://www.amazon.com/Hakko-A1559-Solder-Cleaning-Sponge/dp/B004P3IXUC/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1373638334&sr=8-2&keywords=hakko+sponge

i've also seen them at fry's for appx the same price minus ship
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 12 July 2013, 09:13:09
ebay should have them as well
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 12 July 2013, 09:14:52
http://www.ebay.com/itm/200942287295
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Fri, 12 July 2013, 09:26:28
http://www.ebay.com/itm/200942287295

i happent o like the hakko sponge shape

http://www.amazon.com/Hakko-A1559-Solder-Cleaning-Sponge/dp/B004P3IXUC/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1373638334&sr=8-2&keywords=hakko+sponge

i've also seen them at fry's for appx the same price minus ship

I think I would just go buy a pack of sponges and cut them into that shape...  :))
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Fri, 12 July 2013, 10:47:50
Thanks for the info guys.

I found some here

http://www.amainhobbies.com/product_info.php/cPath/89_142_2013/products_id/198221/n/Hakko-Replacement-Sponge-for-FX888-Soldering-Stations

They are $3.99 plus shipping....the shipping isn't too outrageous either.

I also found them here

http://www.qsource.com/p-3782-hakko-a1559-cleaning-sponge-for-hakko-fh-800-iron-holder.aspx

but they also have wire replacements

https://www.qsource.com/p-3783-hakko-a1561-cleaning-wire-for-hakko-fh-800-iron-holder.aspx

and a few other replacement parts and tips etc...

Shipping from them is fairly expensive however.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: vun on Fri, 12 July 2013, 13:56:17
And I have liftoff; just finished desoldering all the switches on my old WYSE terminal board. Tedious business, but great timekiller.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 13 July 2013, 09:31:50
hi5!!!

you are exactly why we are all here, sharing knowledge :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Sat, 13 July 2013, 09:45:15
How essential is applying grease to the o-ring on Soldapullt?  Just wondering because I cleaned mine really well, and it had no discernible grease on it to start with (came used), but it seems to have pretty good suction now when I tried it on my hand, though I've yet to desolder with it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Sat, 13 July 2013, 09:57:22
Where can I find chisel tips for the yihua 936 hakko knockoff? Preferrably within the uk/eu.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Sat, 13 July 2013, 10:07:59
Where can I find chisel tips for the yihua 936 hakko knockoff? Preferrably within the uk/eu.

I think the hakko 936 tips should work. Have you checked on ebay?

But hopefully someone can confirm that first.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: RabRhee on Sat, 13 July 2013, 11:02:15
Where can I find chisel tips for the yihua 936 hakko knockoff? Preferrably within the uk/eu.

I think the hakko 936 tips should work. Have you checked on ebay?

But hopefully someone can confirm that first.

There are Hakko tips on UK eBay for about £2, cheaper if you want copies from Hong Kong,  a guy on this page says he has both a hakko and a Yihua and the tips work for either.
Quote
'For either the Hakko or the Yihua 936, soldering iron assembly’s and tips are very low cost and available on e-bay.'

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1722684

I have an Aoyue 936 hakko clone, and aoyue sell tips for them on UK eBay and Amazon as well, as another possible source.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Sat, 13 July 2013, 11:08:55
Thanks for confirmation. I thought hakko tips would be compatible.. just wanted to check. What size of chisel tip would you recommend for keyboard soldering?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Sat, 13 July 2013, 11:12:15
Thanks for confirmation. I thought hakko tips would be compatible.. just wanted to check. What size of chisel tip would you recommend for keyboard soldering?

Here is some discussion from the other day on that topic!!

 
Alright I'm thinking of getting a Hakko 888 soldering kit. What tips should I get with it? I'll buy everything from amazon btw.

I use the d24 (2,4 mm chisel) for most trough-hole stuff...
More contact area than the d16 (better heat transfer) but not too big (like the d32).


Just picked up some soldering gear for when my r3 eDox kit gets here, and I have minimal prior experience with soldering so I was wondering if there's a quick list of do's and don'ts when soldering that I should be aware of, besides the obvious.

Also, will a chisel tip work better for keyboard soldering than a round tip?

I also think you should watch some videos, visual learning really is the way to go here!
Anyway, if you are really looking for a quick simple writeup, here is what I do...

- For switch or LED soldering I use a 2,4mm chisel tip
- Also I use leaded rosin core solder with 1mm diameter
- Make sure components sit flush against the PCB and pins sit right
- Set the temperature of the station to 300-350 degree Celsius and wait for heatup
- Make sure your solder tip is clean, if not clean it (repeat that periodically in the process)
- Put the tip in between pad and pin and feed a small amount of solder in the gap between tip an pin for better heat transfer
- Feed solder from the other side into the gap between pin and pad (enough that you get a solid cone shape bonding) and remove tip
- The two steps above should be done fast and finished when the molten solder completely stops smoking (then the flux is used up)
- Inspect the solder spots... You want a shiny uninterrupted cone shape which contacts the whole pad, best use a magnifying glass for that
- If there seems to be something wrong with the spot, desolder -> clean -> redo, or apply some flux (you can get it seperately) and let the spot reflow by heating it up again
i don't know about the ebay tips because frankly i'd rather have a single tip that lasts 12 years than 12 tips that give me inconsistent heat transfer for one year each.

also because genuine tips are cheap.

i have one of the smaller needle points i never use, a d16, d32 (for big ****), and some other crap i never use. the d16 is pretty much going to be your go-to tip for almost everything except for joints that need a lot of power. the small tips like the d12 or the needle points are only really useful in situations where you need to be really careful about how much power you're putting into the joint. not that this doesn't include most SMD ICs, because you'll want enough surface area to be able to do a quick wipe downwards across the pins. a needle tip won't allow you to do that, but can be useful for really fine rework.

for wires or big components i break out the d32. the 888d has enough power to make quick work of those if you give it the surface area.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Sat, 13 July 2013, 11:18:09
Thanks very much ray! I haven't been keeping up with this thread so I completely missed all that.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Sat, 13 July 2013, 11:43:36
Just ordered the yihua and a 2.4d hakko tip. Looking forward to it!  :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 13 July 2013, 17:11:32
i actually picked up a d24 after all the the people talking about it, and man, it's a really nice compromise. you can go from hookup wire to through-hole without changing tips. sweet ****!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheSoulhunter on Sat, 13 July 2013, 17:34:08
Someone else talked about the d24? ;)
Btw, someone knows where the Hakko 808 can be obtained in 220-240V configuration?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Sat, 13 July 2013, 18:35:35
I think it's so awesome that we are getting more people into soldering their own stuff now. This thread seems to be really helpful when people are first getting their equipment setup. I think HobbyKing is going to sell quite a few of those Yihuas now, as they are a really decent entry level station.

I'm torn between the Soldapullt and the Radio Shack desoldering iron with bulb for an entry level desoldering tool. I personally like the Radio Shack tool better, but it does fatigue your hand after a long session. And the Soldapullt is a high quality tool that I still use when I don't want to break out the Hakko 808 for whatever reason.

I don't have any hesitation recommending the Yihua over the Weller WLC-100, though.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Sat, 13 July 2013, 18:48:10
I'm torn between the Soldapullt and the Radio Shack desoldering iron with bulb for an entry level desoldering tool. I personally like the Radio Shack tool better, but it does fatigue your hand after a long session. And the Soldapullt is a high quality tool that I still use when I don't want to break out the Hakko 808 for whatever reason.

Definitely this.  I'll be attempting my next desoldering with a Soldapullt instead of the Radioshack iron, unless I can't master it as well.  Contrary to what was said here earlier, I did not overheat the Radioshack desoldering iron's tip by pressing it into the board or anything, and it still developed a hole after one session.  I just inserted it over a switch pin and then moved it down the touch the PCB just before releasing the suction bulb and did a gentle sweeping turn at the same time.  My left hand was very tired afterwards, and my back as well, as I had to really crouch over the PCB at a bad angle to squeeze the bulb.  Might just be me doing something wrong!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Sat, 13 July 2013, 18:59:04
Today went very well
i have a good grip on what actually is supposed to happen, and how to do it.
Tried to mess around with the alps board, but i was having trouble, so i (carefully) got my pure pcb and successfully desoldered/resoldered a few switches and LEDs.
(http://i.imgur.com/991rCiH.jpg)

then i swapped a blue stem and spring on the esc, which is pretty sweet imo :D
First time having a clicky switch on a keyboard of mine...feelsgoodbro
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Smeagol_RP on Mon, 15 July 2013, 17:47:45
I can't desolder the switches of my poker II. Those from QFR was pretty easy. :(
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Mon, 15 July 2013, 18:07:13
second time ever using the iron, spent 3 hours today, desoldered every switch in my poker, thinking i would need to do that to remove the plate, and swap out some stems. turns out i didn't ( :)) ) but it was great practice. desoldering is really, really tedious, but really rewarding and satisfying. took 4 mx whites i had, and put them in the right corner of my poker, aka the arrow cluster. the resoldered everything back on and everything worked. Really productive day, and feels great. very happy to be soldering.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tgujay on Mon, 15 July 2013, 18:15:22
second time ever using the iron, spent 3 hours today, desoldered every switch in my poker, thinking i would need to do that to remove the plate, and swap out some stems. turns out i didn't ( :)) ) but it was great practice. desoldering is really, really tedious, but really rewarding and satisfying. took 4 mx whites i had, and put them in the right corner of my poker, aka the arrow cluster. the resoldered everything back on and everything worked. Really productive day, and feels great. very happy to be soldering.

Radioshack desoldering iron is much nicer and faster if you were using braid.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Mon, 15 July 2013, 18:18:07
second time ever using the iron, spent 3 hours today, desoldered every switch in my poker, thinking i would need to do that to remove the plate, and swap out some stems. turns out i didn't ( :)) ) but it was great practice. desoldering is really, really tedious, but really rewarding and satisfying. took 4 mx whites i had, and put them in the right corner of my poker, aka the arrow cluster. the resoldered everything back on and everything worked. Really productive day, and feels great. very happy to be soldering.

Radioshack desoldering iron is much nicer and faster if you were using braid.

apparently it's preference...I'm digging this soldapullt for now
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: domoaligato on Mon, 15 July 2013, 18:19:22
second time ever using the iron, spent 3 hours today, desoldered every switch in my poker, thinking i would need to do that to remove the plate, and swap out some stems. turns out i didn't ( :)) ) but it was great practice. desoldering is really, really tedious, but really rewarding and satisfying. took 4 mx whites i had, and put them in the right corner of my poker, aka the arrow cluster. the resoldered everything back on and everything worked. Really productive day, and feels great. very happy to be soldering.

Radioshack desoldering iron is much nicer and faster if you were using braid.

apparently it's preference...I'm digging this soldapullt for now

+1
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Mon, 15 July 2013, 20:18:39
My padawan is learning quickly. ;D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Mon, 15 July 2013, 20:29:19
Today went very well
i have a good grip on what actually is supposed to happen, and how to do it.
Tried to mess around with the alps board, but i was having trouble, so i (carefully) got my pure pcb and successfully desoldered/resoldered a few switches and LEDs.
Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/991rCiH.jpg)


then i swapped a blue stem and spring on the esc, which is pretty sweet imo :D
First time having a clicky switch on a keyboard of mine...feelsgoodbro
I want to see pictures of your joints. I want to see how much you've improved :))
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Mon, 15 July 2013, 22:05:13
My padawan is learning quickly. ;D

learning from the best  :D

I want to see pictures of your joints. I want to see how much you've improved :))

good god...RIP '\' LED haha
maybe I can do a 'moose's mod' esque thread haha
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Smeagol_RP on Mon, 15 July 2013, 22:12:40
Took 3 hours to remove all switches from Poker II. I spent about 30min to do it in my QFR. That soldering job... :confused:
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Mon, 15 July 2013, 22:34:08
Finished my first keyboard soldering project today!  I was trying to get solder through those copper inserts in the Filco PCB, dunno if I succeeded or how far in the solder went.  Filco advertises their PCBs having solder going all the way through the PCB, so I was thinking about that while soldering.

before cleaning off the flux:
(http://i.imgur.com/F87XlVf.jpg)

Everything works well, woot!  Thans to everyone who's contributed to this thread with information :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Smeagol_RP on Mon, 15 July 2013, 22:36:34
Finished my first keyboard soldering project today!

before cleaning off the flux:
Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/F87XlVf.jpg)


Everything works well, woot!  Thans to everyone who's contributed to this thread with information :)

This PCB is from what keyboard?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Sifo on Mon, 15 July 2013, 22:47:09
It says Filco on it
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Mon, 15 July 2013, 22:47:28
The one I painted Copper.  Typing on it right now :D  It's pretty nice!  Still getting used to Clears, as 62g Clears are tougher than my normal Browns.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Smeagol_RP on Mon, 15 July 2013, 23:06:59
It says Filco on it

Sorry.
(http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lvv4jvx4xj1qemoij.png)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bueller on Tue, 16 July 2013, 06:44:31
It's official, I am the world worst solderer! Probably wouldn't have so much trouble but damn these micro-controllers are small, think I need a magnifying visor or something!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Poom on Tue, 16 July 2013, 08:12:45
I am the worse desolderer ever.... used a sucker and after sucking up all solder from all the switches, only 10% popped out the rest have to redo and about half, i have to solder then desolder again.. the tip of my sucker melted to half the lenght it came with.

but surprisingly everything went perfect when soldering..... :eek:
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bueller on Tue, 16 July 2013, 08:36:09
Yeah I found with de-soldering when I was having problems it was usually because I was using the sucker a tiny bit too early, solder would cool too much before I could get the pump on the joint. Actually went a lot better wiring the second row of the micro-controller. Started prepping each wire super methodically and making sure everything was perfect before applying solder, once I slowed down a bit everything went together nicely!

Wish I could source Teensy or similar locally, absolute pain in the arse waiting for them to ship from the US or Hong Kong  :(
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Poom on Tue, 16 July 2013, 08:41:02
another thing is that, there is no rasin core solder available, apparently only lead free solder is allowed in Europe. Flux is also banned, so I have to get them from China or UK.

feels like a drug dealer ordering a flux pen from the UK preying it wont get confiscated at the custom, lol   :))
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bpiphany on Tue, 16 July 2013, 08:52:51
another thing is that, there is no rasin core solder available, apparently only lead free solder is allowed in Europe. Flux is also banned, so I have to get them from China or UK.

feels like a drug dealer ordering a flux pen from the UK preying it wont get confiscated at the custom, lol   :))

I don't think you got that right... You are not allowed to sell stuff made with leaded solder (or something like that), you are still allowed to use it for your own pleasures. Rosin core solder is more or less standard, and nothing would work without flux...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Poom on Tue, 16 July 2013, 09:07:28
oh sorry, i wasnt sure if i wrote what i meant, :-X just that everywhere i go to buy solder, they are all lead free solder, and cannot find flux pen anywhere in Switzerland, then read somewhere that lead isnt allowed anymore or something, but i managed to get a flux pen from the UK which worked like a charm.

just need to work on sucking out soler as I seem to have such a big problem with it.

by the way, what can you use to clean off flux on the PCBs?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tgujay on Tue, 16 July 2013, 09:37:45
oh sorry, i wasnt sure if i wrote what i meant, :-X just that everywhere i go to buy solder, they are all lead free solder, and cannot find flux pen anywhere in Switzerland, then read somewhere that lead isnt allowed anymore or something, but i managed to get a flux pen from the UK which worked like a charm.

just need to work on sucking out soler as I seem to have such a big problem with it.

by the way, what can you use to clean off flux on the PCBs?

90% or higher isopropyl alcohol and a toothbrush.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Tue, 16 July 2013, 09:46:36
Yeah, that's what I use too^

A few rounds of dipping a dedicated toothbrush into alcohol and scrubbing the entire PCB.  Then I dab it with a paper towel, scrub with a dry brush to get all the lint loose, and use compressed air.  2-3 rounds of that, and the PCB gets pretty clean.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Poom on Tue, 16 July 2013, 10:11:57
isopropyl, isnt it the same as nail polish remover? can i use that instead?

another thing, is it necessary to actually clean the flux off? what if I cant or dont bother??
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Tue, 16 July 2013, 10:18:56
isopropyl, isnt it the same as nail polish remover? can i use that instead?

another thing, is it necessary to actually clean the flux off? what if I cant or dont bother??

Nail polish remover contains acetone or similar, which is not at all the same thing as alcohol.  Acetone can be damaging to the PCB.  Don't you have pharmacies or similar that have alcohol for wound cleaning?  That's all you really need--the highest concentration you can get.  No it's not necessary to clean off the flux after you've soldered everything in.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bpiphany on Tue, 16 July 2013, 10:30:18
I use regular rubbing alcohol, ethanol (mostly, that stuff isn't very clean...). It takes some scrubbing but it usually gets the flux off. I let my small stuff soak a while and use an ESD safe brush which is just like a larger version of a toothbrush..
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Poom on Tue, 16 July 2013, 10:31:08
ah ok, ill check the pharmacy out. Thanks for the input guys.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Wed, 17 July 2013, 06:36:47
Well my Yihua just arrived. I haven't used it yet but I must say for a $15 station the quality & feel of it is really good. It might be a knockoff but it doesn't feel like it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Wed, 17 July 2013, 09:23:30
Well my Yihua just arrived. I haven't used it yet but I must say for a $15 station the quality & feel of it is really good. It might be a knockoff but it doesn't feel like it.
Team Yihua!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Wed, 17 July 2013, 09:27:39
Well my Yihua just arrived. I haven't used it yet but I must say for a $15 station the quality & feel of it is really good. It might be a knockoff but it doesn't feel like it.

Where'd ya get it? I could use a cheap variable temp station :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tgujay on Wed, 17 July 2013, 09:38:36
Well my Yihua just arrived. I haven't used it yet but I must say for a $15 station the quality & feel of it is really good. It might be a knockoff but it doesn't feel like it.

Please tell me how you like it, I really need to get a not ****ty soldering iron.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Wed, 17 July 2013, 09:53:00
Well my Yihua just arrived. I haven't used it yet but I must say for a $15 station the quality & feel of it is really good. It might be a knockoff but it doesn't feel like it.

Where'd ya get it? I could use a cheap variable temp station :D

http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__19240__Soldering_Station_with_Adjustable_Heat_Range_USA_Warehouse_.html

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Wed, 17 July 2013, 09:54:38
Well my Yihua just arrived. I haven't used it yet but I must say for a $15 station the quality & feel of it is really good. It might be a knockoff but it doesn't feel like it.

Where'd ya get it? I could use a cheap variable temp station :D

http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__19240__Soldering_Station_with_Adjustable_Heat_Range_USA_Warehouse_.html



Thanks JD :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Wed, 17 July 2013, 09:57:32
Thanks JD :)

You're welcome. It's my vision to see a Yihua on every bench. :P
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Tarzan on Wed, 17 July 2013, 09:59:22
I used the Aoyue 937+ I got from Amazon on a small job over the weekend, very pleased with it so far.  I still have to master the knack of unsoldering LEDs, but it was perfect for tinning and soldering leads for a replacement cable.

Not super-cheap, it was about $60 shipped, but a little cheaper than the Hakko.

Now I need more tips, it only ships with one fine-point one.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Wed, 17 July 2013, 10:03:15
Thanks JD :)

You're welcome. It's my vision to see a Yihua on every bench. :P

Shipping is as much as the iron :p Before I snag this one, is there a better Yihua around $40 that I'd be better off with or is this one just fine?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Wed, 17 July 2013, 10:07:16
Thanks JD :)

You're welcome. It's my vision to see a Yihua on every bench. :P

Shipping is as much as the iron :p Before I snag this one, is there a better Yihua around $40 that I'd be better off with or is this one just fine?

Yes, it's around $30 shipped, as I have said before, but it is worth the $30.

This is the best option you're going to get for that price. There is a gap between this and the used genuine Hakko 936, which normally go for about $75 shipped. If you are looking for a bargain setup, go with the Yihua 936. If you can afford a bit more for a starter kit, go with a used Hakko 936, or a new Hakko 888 or Weller WES51.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Wed, 17 July 2013, 10:11:10
Thanks JD :)

You're welcome. It's my vision to see a Yihua on every bench. :P

Shipping is as much as the iron :p Before I snag this one, is there a better Yihua around $40 that I'd be better off with or is this one just fine?

Yes, it's around $30 shipped, as I have said before, but it is worth the $30.

This is the best option you're going to get for that price. There is a gap between this and the used genuine Hakko 936, which normally go for about $75 shipped. If you are looking for a bargain setup, go with the Yihua 936. If you can afford a bit more for a starter kit, go with a used Hakko 936, or a new Hakko 888 or Weller WES51.

Got any experience with the Weller WLC100? That one can be had for $40 shipped off Amazon.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Wed, 17 July 2013, 10:56:17
Got any experience with the Weller WLC100? That one can be had for $40 shipped off Amazon.

You will note that I deliberately excluded the WLC100 from my recommendations above. I personally wish the WLC100 would go off in a corner somewhere and die. The WLC100 has no real temperature control, only a variable setting of 1-5. There is no way to know what temp your iron is set at, unless you have an expensive thermal meter, which I'm assuming buyers of a $40 soldering station won't have.

I don't have any hesitation recommending the Yihua over the Weller WLC-100, though.

If you are thinking that the WLC100 must be better because it is $40, over the Yihua 936 which is $15, you are mistaken. The Yihua is almost identical to the Hakko 936 (discontinued), which was a $100 station.

Here is a teardown video comparing the Yihua to the Hakko:

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Wed, 17 July 2013, 11:00:21
Got any experience with the Weller WLC100? That one can be had for $40 shipped off Amazon.

You will note that I deliberately excluded the WLC100 from my recommendations above. I personally wish the WLC100 would go off in a corner somewhere and die. The WLC100 has no real temperature control, only a variable setting of 1-5. There is no way to know what temp your iron is set at, unless you have an expensive thermal meter, which I'm assuming buyers of a $40 soldering station won't have.

I don't have any hesitation recommending the Yihua over the Weller WLC-100, though.

If you are thinking that the WLC100 must be better because it is $40, over the Yihua 936 which is $15, you are mistaken. The Yihua is almost identical to the Hakko 936 (discontinued), which was a $100 station.

Here is a teardown video comparing the Yihua to the Hakko:


Looks like the Yihua it is :D Sorry for bringing up "it-which-shalt-not-be-named".
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 17 July 2013, 11:30:48
the wlc100 is a piece of crap. the yihua hakko 936 clones are 100x better.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 17 July 2013, 11:32:18
want to build your own wlc100? buy a light switch dimmer and connected it via twist-on joints to the AC in of the cheapest 55w weller fixed wattage iron. costs less, same damn thing
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Wed, 17 July 2013, 11:34:16
It seems like this thread goes to extremes sometimes.  WLC100 goes from being a recommended soldering iron for beginners to "a piece of crap".  I'd certainly not call it a piece of crap, as it does the job fine.  If the goal is to educate people about various options they have, it's best to not box them in with THE product to get, then just changing opinion a bit later and call that product a piece of crap and start recommending another.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 17 July 2013, 11:44:48
i don't think i ever commented on the wlc100 positively in the past. ask alaric. my opinion has been quite uniform on this one. THAT SAID, it's an iron, it gets hot (EVENTUALLY..... ... ..... no keep waiting ... .... .... .. ok let's try DAMNIT ... ... ..) and you can solder with it.

if you're really budget limited and want a brand name iron (many many years ago i heard a few bad stories about qc on the 936 clones, but they've been in continuous production for 20 years now, so i doubt they have any significant issues anymore..

ok, so if you want to get a brand name iron, go with samwisekoi's advice and get a high wattage weller or hakko fixed wattage, maybe 65w, break it out for big joints, and get a small pencil style 35w iron and use it for more sensitive gear. you will have to learn how to not overheat joints the old way, by trial and error, but you will become a better solderer for it.

i think what you may be thinking of is when i mentioned that alaric put together half the custom boards on this forum using a wlc100. he was just patient and used it expertly. so it's really up to you. knowing what i know now, i would go directly for a hakko 888d. it's a HUGE leap forward in hobbyist irons. a fantastic pencil, super precise regulator, comes with an incredibly useful and just plain nice stand.. it's really really amazing for the price.

that said, ymmv. some people like starting on fundamentals and are insistent on it. the wlc100 gives you the basic idea: it's basically a variable wattage iron. there's a light switch dimmer unit to get you the variable wattage, and it's attached to your basic weller workhorse 55w iron. people have been learning to solder on these things for 50 years and no one died because of it. that said, there are much better options now.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Glissant on Wed, 17 July 2013, 11:54:59
This doesn't have a lot to do with what was just talked about in the thread already, but I wanted to say a couple of things.

If you are a beginner and you are worried about having to pay a lot to get something nice; I have something to tell you. You don't have to spend an arm and a leg. Just get the Weller WLC100 because it's a great iron, and with a smaller tip you can even do SMD work pretty easily.
So consider this when you want to get a new iron from that old radioshack/$5 soldering iron.

I also want to want to hype the Edsyn Soldapullt (solder sucker) because it's a great product. It works awesomely well and is sturdy. It is a bit expensive getting it directly for edsyn because of the shipping, but if you can get a buddy to buy one too and combine your shipping that might help.
You could also order a bunch of wick from Edsyn.

After using lead free solder and a horribly cheap iron in Norway, I can't even express how awesome it is using Kester 44 solder and the WLC100 from Weller.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Wed, 17 July 2013, 12:01:13
Yes, and I'm not trying to catch you on your words, but WFD uses WLC100 in his ergo-Clear mod video, and a lot of people refer to that video for information, myself included.  WLC100 was listed in the recommended irons section in the first post here as well.  It's worked very well for me so far, I've done a full board with it.  It did not cost $15, but I got it for $36, which wasn't too bad.

But people who come in here browsing and read very polar opinions might well be put off or confused, when some people recommend a product and others call it a piece of crap.  Fact is, a high percent of people visiting this thread for information will want a budget iron to do a board or two at most and then something very occasional.  In that case, getting the best of the best (always subjective) might not be the goal anyway.  There's the "good enough" range that corresponds to a certain dollar range.  WLC100 is certainly good enough for $36 or so that you can get it from Amazon as used-like-new (and sometimes brand new, price fluctuates).

In general, it's less helpful to throw around extreme opinions than to constructively compare and say that THIS iron could do more (or less) than THAT iron for this much dollar difference for THESE different uses.

P.S.: I'd like to recommend this solder: very cheap for good-size cuts and worked really well.  After a full keyboard, I'm not through with one of these by far... I got 2 extra rolls, which turned out to be entirely unnecessary.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1

That's if you can't find Kester 44 cheaply.  Can get different diameters (thinner and thicker) but that's the one I got.  Their desoldering braid with flux is also useful and comes in cheap small sections.

(edited: thanks, fixed the link.  Had multiple pages opened)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tgujay on Wed, 17 July 2013, 12:06:05
Yes, and I'm not trying to catch you on your words, but WFD uses WLC100 in his ergo-Clear mod video, and a lot of people refer to that video for information, myself included.  WLC100 was listed in the recommended irons section in the first post here as well.  It's worked very well for me so far, I've done a full board with it.  It did not cost $15, but I got it for $36, which wasn't too bad.

But people who come in here browsing and read very polar opinions might well be put off or confused, when some people recommend a product and others call it a piece of crap.  Fact is, a high percent of people visiting this thread for information will want a budget iron to do a board or two at most and then something very occasional.  In that case, getting the best of the best (always subjective) might not be the goal anyway.  There's the "good enough" range that corresponds to a certain dollar range.  WLC100 is certainly good enough for $36 or so that you can get it from Amazon as used-like-new (and sometimes brand new, price fluctuates).

In general, it's less helpful to throw around extreme opinions than to constructively compare and say that THIS iron could do more (or less) than THAT iron for this much dollar difference for THESE different uses.

P.S.: I'd like to recommend this solder: very cheap for good-size cuts and worked really well.  After a full keyboard, I'm not through with one of these by far... I got 2 extra rolls, which turned out to be entirely unnecessary.
www.cnn.com/2013/07/17/tech/paypal-error/index.html?hpt=hp_t3

That's if you can't find Kester 44 cheaply.  Can get different diameters (thinner and thicker) but that's the one I got.  Their desoldering braid with flux is also useful and comes in cheap small sections.

Uh... that link is not what you think it is.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Wed, 17 July 2013, 12:06:46
I also want to want to hype the Edsyn Soldapullt (solder sucker) because it's a great product. It works awesomely well and is sturdy. It is a bit expensive getting it directly for edsyn because of the shipping, but if you can get a buddy to buy one too and combine your shipping that might help.
You could also order a bunch of wick from Edsyn.

I ordered straight from Edsyn, and shipping wasn't too horrible. i did call in about thte $25 order minimum and that helped the cost i think, but i got an extra tip and the soldapullt shipped to NJ for a total of $29

I love the thing though. It's so satisfying and fun to pump every single time....while being a bit tiring too  :))
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Wed, 17 July 2013, 12:10:30
But people who come in here browsing and read very polar opinions might well be put off or confused, when some people recommend a product and others call it a piece of crap.  Fact is, a high percent of people visiting this thread for information will want a budget iron to do a board or two at most and then something very occasional.  In that case, getting the best of the best (always subjective) might not be the goal anyway.  There's the "good enough" range that corresponds to a certain dollar range.  WLC100 is certainly good enough for $36 or so that you can get it from Amazon as used-like-new (and sometimes brand new, price fluctuates).
Yeah but the Yihua is cheaper and, according to what others have said, is better too. So because of those two things the Yihua might be a better purchase for newbies looking to get a new iron.

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with the weller. I'm sure it is, as you've said, good enough, but if you can get a better iron for cheaper.. Why not?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tgujay on Wed, 17 July 2013, 12:17:28
But people who come in here browsing and read very polar opinions might well be put off or confused, when some people recommend a product and others call it a piece of crap.  Fact is, a high percent of people visiting this thread for information will want a budget iron to do a board or two at most and then something very occasional.  In that case, getting the best of the best (always subjective) might not be the goal anyway.  There's the "good enough" range that corresponds to a certain dollar range.  WLC100 is certainly good enough for $36 or so that you can get it from Amazon as used-like-new (and sometimes brand new, price fluctuates).
Yeah but the Yihua is cheaper and, according to what others have said, is better too. So because of those two things the Yihua might be a better purchase for newbies looking to get a new iron.

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with the weller. I'm sure it is, as you've said, good enough, but if you can get a better iron for cheaper.. Why not?

So get the Yihua?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Wed, 17 July 2013, 12:19:44
So get the Yihua?
This seems to be what everyone has been saying. I haven't used mine as I don't have solder yet, but this thing does not have the feel of a budget iron, and I think it's well worth the $15+shipping.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 17 July 2013, 12:20:34
The Weller station I used and loved was the Weller WES51D. That being said, the Hakko 936 I've been using has been amazing.

I've also been having trouble with the desoldering bulb and wick so I guess it's time to try my nemesis...the Soldapult. The bulb tips aren't fine enough to desolder some things like LEDs. I'm mad because I was defending the bulb so hard and it's let me down multiples times now. :(
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Wed, 17 July 2013, 14:00:44
The Weller station I used and loved was the Weller WES51D. That being said, the Hakko 936 I've been using has been amazing.

I've also been having trouble with the desoldering bulb and wick so I guess it's time to try my nemesis...the Soldapult. The bulb tips aren't fine enough to desolder some things like LEDs. I'm mad because I was defending the bulb so hard and it's let me down multiples times now. :(

You want to know how you make moves with this, son? Hakko 808. BAM!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Wed, 17 July 2013, 14:23:41
The Weller station I used and loved was the Weller WES51D. That being said, the Hakko 936 I've been using has been amazing.

I've also been having trouble with the desoldering bulb and wick so I guess it's time to try my nemesis...the Soldapult. The bulb tips aren't fine enough to desolder some things like LEDs. I'm mad because I was defending the bulb so hard and it's let me down multiples times now. :(

You want to know how you make moves with this, son? Hakko 808. BAM!

It was expensive and I don't use it often, but GD, I love my fx-808
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: nubbinator on Wed, 17 July 2013, 22:40:59
If you want some Kester 44, it's hard to beat this roll of 0.020" solder for ~$21 shipped (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=111120618298).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Wed, 17 July 2013, 22:55:52
If you want some Kester 44, it's hard to beat this roll of 0.020" solder for ~$21 shipped (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=111120618298).

What about this Kester 44 for $16 shipped?  (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Kester-44-rosin-core-solder/231017972833?_trksid=p2047675.m1985&_trkparms=aid%3D444000%26algo%3DSOI.CURRENT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D13%26meid%3D9150890075728499624%26pid%3D100012%26prg%3D1014%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D3%26sd%3D231004163506%26=)  ;D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: YoungMichael88 on Wed, 17 July 2013, 23:14:51
The Weller station I used and loved was the Weller WES51D. That being said, the Hakko 936 I've been using has been amazing.

I've also been having trouble with the desoldering bulb and wick so I guess it's time to try my nemesis...the Soldapult. The bulb tips aren't fine enough to desolder some things like LEDs. I'm mad because I was defending the bulb so hard and it's let me down multiples times now. :(

You want to know how you make moves with this, son? Hakko 808. BAM!

It was expensive and I don't use it often, but GD, I love my fx-808
I would love an fx-808. I just HATE desoldering. I hope I never have to do it again (but I will)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mashby on Thu, 18 July 2013, 09:07:23
Didn't see anyone mention this product, but I thought it would be worth adding to the OP for magnification.

SE MH1047L Illuminated Multipower LED Binohead Magnifier (http://www.amazon.com/SE-MH1047L-Illuminated-Multipower-Magnifier/dp/B003UCODIA/ref=sr_1_1?sr=1-1&s=hi&keywords=magnifying+headset&qid=1374152646&ie=UTF8) is a magnifier headset. It's inexpensive and works well. We use it here at the office and for $7 it's pretty hard to beat. It's cheaply made, but it works.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Thu, 18 July 2013, 09:09:39
i did in fact mention it earlier, but it can't be given enough kudos. it's awesome. for 7 bucks it's completely unbeatable.

also, interesting fact i learned about kester solders from poking around some datasheets: kester solder actually has a shelf life. 2-3 years for thin rosin cores. for serious. so get the newest run of 44 that you can find.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Thu, 18 July 2013, 09:13:38
If you want some Kester 44, it's hard to beat this roll of 0.020" solder for ~$21 shipped (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=111120618298).

What about this Kester 44 for $16 shipped?  (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Kester-44-rosin-core-solder/231017972833?_trksid=p2047675.m1985&_trkparms=aid%3D444000%26algo%3DSOI.CURRENT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D13%26meid%3D9150890075728499624%26pid%3D100012%26prg%3D1014%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D3%26sd%3D231004163506%26=)  ;D

Got one thanks!  The guy relists more after you buy them.  I asked about condition, and he says it's good, he's had no complaints from his buyers about it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tgujay on Thu, 18 July 2013, 10:05:47
If you want some Kester 44, it's hard to beat this roll of 0.020" solder for ~$21 shipped (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=111120618298).

What about this Kester 44 for $16 shipped?  (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Kester-44-rosin-core-solder/231017972833?_trksid=p2047675.m1985&_trkparms=aid%3D444000%26algo%3DSOI.CURRENT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D13%26meid%3D9150890075728499624%26pid%3D100012%26prg%3D1014%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D3%26sd%3D231004163506%26=)  ;D

Got one thanks!  The guy relists more after you buy them.  I asked about condition, and he says it's good, he's had no complaints from his buyers about it.

What makes this stuff so good?  I mean I'm looking to get it since it's a damn pound of solder for only $16.  But whats so good about Kester 44?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Thu, 18 July 2013, 10:09:13
The Weller station I used and loved was the Weller WES51D. That being said, the Hakko 936 I've been using has been amazing.

I've also been having trouble with the desoldering bulb and wick so I guess it's time to try my nemesis...the Soldapult. The bulb tips aren't fine enough to desolder some things like LEDs. I'm mad because I was defending the bulb so hard and it's let me down multiples times now. :(

You want to know how you make moves with this, son? Hakko 808. BAM!

That's how it's going to be JD?? Damnit! Now I have to get one to live up to my motto :P
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Thu, 18 July 2013, 10:58:24
If you want some Kester 44, it's hard to beat this roll of 0.020" solder for ~$21 shipped (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=111120618298).
What about this Kester 44 for $16 shipped?  (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Kester-44-rosin-core-solder/231017972833?_trksid=p2047675.m1985&_trkparms=aid%3D444000%26algo%3DSOI.CURRENT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D13%26meid%3D9150890075728499624%26pid%3D100012%26prg%3D1014%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D3%26sd%3D231004163506%26=)  ;D

Got one thanks!  The guy relists more after you buy them.  I asked about condition, and he says it's good, he's had no complaints from his buyers about it.

What makes this stuff so good?  I mean I'm looking to get it since it's a damn pound of solder for only $16.  But whats so good about Kester 44?

 the kester 44 rosin flux is quite nice. flows well and is _really_ corrosive, especially compared to today's no-clean crap. that means the solder flows a bit easier and at lower temperature than most rosin solders. that said, it's not magic, and if you need more corrosion you can always just apply more rosin flux :P

personally, i have a squeeze bottle of mg chemicals generic rosin flux and an old roll of alpha metals 0.026" rosin core solder (the 1lb roll i was referring to earlier) and it works fine, even at ridic low temps (like 200C, 10C over the melting point of the metal itself :P)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Thu, 18 July 2013, 13:31:56
If you want some Kester 44, it's hard to beat this roll of 0.020" solder for ~$21 shipped (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=111120618298).

What about this Kester 44 for $16 shipped?  (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Kester-44-rosin-core-solder/231017972833?_trksid=p2047675.m1985&_trkparms=aid%3D444000%26algo%3DSOI.CURRENT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D13%26meid%3D9150890075728499624%26pid%3D100012%26prg%3D1014%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D3%26sd%3D231004163506%26=)  ;D

Got one thanks!  The guy relists more after you buy them.  I asked about condition, and he says it's good, he's had no complaints from his buyers about it.

Yeah I got one from him a couple weeks ago, ships flat rate.
Price is too good to pass up.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: kaiserreich on Fri, 19 July 2013, 07:43:19
I bought a roll of some MBO (METAUX BLANCS OUVRES) made solder.
SN62 PB AG2

The thing flows well, and I can see why eutectic solder is preferred.
But the choice of flux used is awful. It seems that the flux spits when the iron touches it, and it form very hard droplets on the PCB. They had to be scrubbed off using IPA.

Anyone knows whether there is a better solution to clean the flux, or whether the flux is fault?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Fri, 19 July 2013, 07:55:36
i did in fact mention it earlier, but it can't be given enough kudos. it's awesome. for 7 bucks it's completely unbeatable.

also, interesting fact i learned about kester solders from poking around some datasheets: kester solder actually has a shelf life. 2-3 years for thin rosin cores. for serious. so get the newest run of 44 that you can find.

I asked one of the ebay sellers about how old their solder was and if they ever had issues with it going bad and the impression I got was the 'vintage' new old stock is from circa 2002 but is sealed and has never been opened. The guy says he has never had a problem with any of it going bad. Of course YMMV.

But if it does half a shelf life of 2-3 years once opened then wouldn't most people's go bad? I mean for us regular guys a 1lb of solder should last a while.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 19 July 2013, 09:09:08
mg chems sells two varieties of flux cleaner, one that's plastics safe and one that's not. i've found that either solution and a nylon brush will clean ANYTHING

kester solder's shelf life can't be lengthened by sealing. it's from date of manufacture, period. sealing oxygen out will help with the oxidization problem that WFD mentioned, but i believe what's actually happening is that the kester fluxes are so active that they slowly eat through the solder. that's bad, and there's nothing you can really do about it except for not buy old solder.

that said, it's 16 bucks, and if it turns out to be bad, you can always buy a new roll of alpha, mg chem, newer kester, whatever. rosin flux solder is still alive and well in the states and being manufactured for hobbyist use, just not kester 44. however, there was never anything magic about kester 44, it was just really nice flux. those other companies i mentioned make nice flux too, and frankly, once you have your technique down, you can even solder good joints with *shudder* no clean and lead free.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Fri, 19 July 2013, 09:58:55
I've had very nice experience with MG Chemicals' rosin-core solder.  Did my first Filco with it, and it's great, flows really well.  Going to try Kester 44 when it arrives.  So storing in a tightly closed zip lock bag is a good idea then, I see.
----
I couldn't quite master using Soldapult over small solder-filled pools in which Filco PCBs suspend switch pins.  So I ended up using the Radioshack iron again.  Went much easier second time around, but the new RadioShack tip ended up decaying 2/3rds of the way through desoldering the PCB... so I barely finished.  Basically you're safe buying 2 of those tips per keyboard project :(  Pretty sad.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Fri, 19 July 2013, 11:52:23
mg chems sells two varieties of flux cleaner, one that's plastics safe and one that's not. i've found that either solution and a nylon brush will clean ANYTHING

kester solder's shelf life can't be lengthened by sealing. it's from date of manufacture, period. sealing oxygen out will help with the oxidization problem that WFD mentioned, but i believe what's actually happening is that the kester fluxes are so active that they slowly eat through the solder. that's bad, and there's nothing you can really do about it except for not buy old solder.

that said, it's 16 bucks, and if it turns out to be bad, you can always buy a new roll of alpha, mg chem, newer kester, whatever. rosin flux solder is still alive and well in the states and being manufactured for hobbyist use, just not kester 44. however, there was never anything magic about kester 44, it was just really nice flux. those other companies i mentioned make nice flux too, and frankly, once you have your technique down, you can even solder good joints with *shudder* no clean and lead free.

So the idea of a 2-3 year shelf life only applies to the kester 44? OR all solder?

Is it a better idea to buy solder in small amounts then? I don't see myself using much at all.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: gnubag on Fri, 19 July 2013, 12:23:12
mg chems sells two varieties of flux cleaner, one that's plastics safe and one that's not. i've found that either solution and a nylon brush will clean ANYTHING

kester solder's shelf life can't be lengthened by sealing. it's from date of manufacture, period. sealing oxygen out will help with the oxidization problem that WFD mentioned, but i believe what's actually happening is that the kester fluxes are so active that they slowly eat through the solder. that's bad, and there's nothing you can really do about it except for not buy old solder.

that said, it's 16 bucks, and if it turns out to be bad, you can always buy a new roll of alpha, mg chem, newer kester, whatever. rosin flux solder is still alive and well in the states and being manufactured for hobbyist use, just not kester 44. however, there was never anything magic about kester 44, it was just really nice flux. those other companies i mentioned make nice flux too, and frankly, once you have your technique down, you can even solder good joints with *shudder* no clean and lead free.

So the idea of a 2-3 year shelf life only applies to the kester 44? OR all solder?

Is it a better idea to buy solder in small amounts then? I don't see myself using much at all.

it's all solder and especially solder with flux in them.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Fri, 19 July 2013, 13:41:51
mg chems sells two varieties of flux cleaner, one that's plastics safe and one that's not. i've found that either solution and a nylon brush will clean ANYTHING

kester solder's shelf life can't be lengthened by sealing. it's from date of manufacture, period. sealing oxygen out will help with the oxidization problem that WFD mentioned, but i believe what's actually happening is that the kester fluxes are so active that they slowly eat through the solder. that's bad, and there's nothing you can really do about it except for not buy old solder.

that said, it's 16 bucks, and if it turns out to be bad, you can always buy a new roll of alpha, mg chem, newer kester, whatever. rosin flux solder is still alive and well in the states and being manufactured for hobbyist use, just not kester 44. however, there was never anything magic about kester 44, it was just really nice flux. those other companies i mentioned make nice flux too, and frankly, once you have your technique down, you can even solder good joints with *shudder* no clean and lead free.

Why are you saying was, did I miss the production stop?  Or just referring to it being non-US made
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Fri, 19 July 2013, 18:33:22
Anyone used this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/AC-220V-30W-Soldering-Irons-SOLDER-SUCKER-DESOLDERING-PUMP-tips-/141013644464?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20d51174b0
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Fri, 19 July 2013, 21:26:30
Anyone used this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/AC-220V-30W-Soldering-Irons-SOLDER-SUCKER-DESOLDERING-PUMP-tips-/141013644464?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20d51174b0
Looks dangerous lol.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Melvang on Sat, 20 July 2013, 02:41:46
Anyone used this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/AC-220V-30W-Soldering-Irons-SOLDER-SUCKER-DESOLDERING-PUMP-tips-/141013644464?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20d51174b0
Looks dangerous lol.

just from my quick look it appears to be only 220VAC not 120 for US use
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Kayliss on Sat, 20 July 2013, 03:51:22
Does anyone here use a Aoyue all in one? I'd love to hear from someone who does. :eek:

I'm looking for a 2nd iron, I already have a Hakko 888 and i'd rather not get anything worse than that, I also have a cheap hot air station which has been used alot more than I was expecting, I assume it will go up in smoke sooner rather than later.  A Hakko 888D is around $200 USD here, I can spend an extra $150 and get something like this http://tinyurl.com/knj7632 (sra solder).
I'd rather avoid all in ones but i'm on a limited budget. :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Sat, 20 July 2013, 04:27:34
Anyone used this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/AC-220V-30W-Soldering-Irons-SOLDER-SUCKER-DESOLDERING-PUMP-tips-/141013644464?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20d51174b0
Looks dangerous lol.

just from my quick look it appears to be only 220VAC not 120 for US use

I'm in India.

Anywho, the query was had anyone used something like that?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 20 July 2013, 09:00:44
mg chems sells two varieties of flux cleaner, one that's plastics safe and one that's not. i've found that either solution and a nylon brush will clean ANYTHING

kester solder's shelf life can't be lengthened by sealing. it's from date of manufacture, period. sealing oxygen out will help with the oxidization problem that WFD mentioned, but i believe what's actually happening is that the kester fluxes are so active that they slowly eat through the solder. that's bad, and there's nothing you can really do about it except for not buy old solder.

that said, it's 16 bucks, and if it turns out to be bad, you can always buy a new roll of alpha, mg chem, newer kester, whatever. rosin flux solder is still alive and well in the states and being manufactured for hobbyist use, just not kester 44. however, there was never anything magic about kester 44, it was just really nice flux. those other companies i mentioned make nice flux too, and frankly, once you have your technique down, you can even solder good joints with *shudder* no clean and lead free.

So the idea of a 2-3 year shelf life only applies to the kester 44? OR all solder?

Is it a better idea to buy solder in small amounts then? I don't see myself using much at all.

it's all solder and especially solder with flux in them.
all electronics solder has flux in it. the shelf life is due to the flux not the metal alloy. the metal alloy can oxidize, but an external source of flux can make short work of the oxidization on the solder as well as the oxidization on the joint.

the shelf life of the solder is afaik related to how corrosive the flux is. less corrosive flux like today's no-clean crap has a ridiculously long shelf life.

ps, a sealed bag going to do absolutely zilch to extend the life of your solder, sorry :(.

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 20 July 2013, 09:11:41
also this hand vacuum pump with a heater at the end looks completely insane and awesome. you should definitely try it out mohit ;)

i suspect it will have a useful service life in the 1s of hours; the fatal flaw seems to be that the iron heats up the entire hand-pump device as well as the solder. also, if you imagine how it's internally constructed, the solder has to run through a huge amount of tube before it makes it to the chamber. all of that tube is space that is ready t be occupied by junk, either solder or plastic or whatever that will refuse to melt and clog the whole device.

the basic idea is solid though. a desoldering pump is just an iron with a tubular opening connected to a source of vacuum. the 808 is just a very cool self-contained vacuum pump attached to the back of a high quality high powered hakko iron. however, look through the documentation for that device and you'll see how tricky it is to get this right. there are lots of considerations for clogging, separation of cold solder from hot, etc. it is a device with many many service parts that need to be replaced regularly.

frankly, the best solution in your part of the world, mohit, is a cheap compressor connects to a clone of an external compressor-driven desoldering station. i believe aoyue makes a clone of the canonical hakko shop air station. that would be the one to get.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Sat, 20 July 2013, 09:44:58
Thanks mkawa.

The one that I linked can be found here for $3. Will get that and try it out.

Are you referring to the Aoyue 474? If yes, I have found a couple f dealers, but all have been above $100. Looking for something cheaper.

Picked up a 936 clone for $12. Working well. Got a 2.4mm chisel tip as well for $.150.

It is hard to find 63/37 solder here as well as brass wool tip cleaner, thus ordered these from ebay global.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 20 July 2013, 10:19:57
quite hard to tell which hakko units have internal pumps and which ones rely on external pumps

474 - unclear. there is a nozzle, but i don't know whether that nozzle is an air intake or source of vacuum (NOW CLEAR -- this has an internal pump)
475 - very clear. the nozzle is for connection to a vacuum source
484 - internal vacuum pump. not a bellows unit, just a very compact compressor. looks nice.
808 - workhouse integrated vacuum pump unit with pistol grip that we all know and love.

the modern hakko stations are all designated FM-XXXX

FM-204 - modern version of 474. has an internal pump.
FM-203/206 - superpowered versions of the 204. COMPLETELY non-obvious from all the poorly translated product pages, but i believe both stations require an external compressor.

i think aoyue has only cloned the 474 and possible the 475 at this point. from all reports, the clones are close enough in construction that you can use the far superior hakko filters and tubes in these units - just the electronics and pump (if applicable have been cloned), as well as the pencil.

you may think these are expensive at 100$, but the hakko price is 1000$, so think on that for a bit ;)

note that the FM series tends to have full rework capability. that is, it can switch between soldering, desoldering and hot air (suck, blow, just temperator regulation mode). that and the improved analog section indicated by the insane thermal accuracy and recovery of the 888d are basically what differentiate the new models from the old.

(by the way, for those looking at the aoyue 474, check out the 474a++, it seems to obselete the 474. the basic design is the same but it looks like the A++ achieves better parity with the hakko 474. eg, the aoyue 474 cheaps out on the vacuum pump by using a dual chamber unit vs the single large chamber unit in the 474, etc..)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Sat, 20 July 2013, 12:40:13
Thanks for the elaborate explanation mkawa!

Really helpful.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Sun, 21 July 2013, 13:21:55
Got this station.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sun, 21 July 2013, 13:39:44
Got this station.

Solid set up, yo.

That's our budget recommendation in the soldering thread.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Sun, 21 July 2013, 13:47:10
Got it for $12. I tried my hand at making some cables earlier with an iron without temperature control, I sucked. With this, I feel like a pro, got the job done in no time.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Sun, 21 July 2013, 13:49:11
I actually read through all 24 pages last night and it seems that people didn't have too many problems picking up soldering, more of the desoldering that was the problem.  Makes me kinda confident in trying to pick it up and try to make my own 62g clears board.  Lubing looks a bit tedious though;  I'll have to look more into that later.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Sun, 21 July 2013, 13:59:37
Soldering is easy, desoldering is hard as solder tends to "stick" to the cables and other components, so you need to use something of higher affinity (Like copper braid) or a suction mechanism (Such as manual pump, bulb pump, electrical sucker).

Lubing doesn't look hard/require practice, more to do with time consuming.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: vun on Mon, 22 July 2013, 12:19:03
I actually read through all 24 pages last night and it seems that people didn't have too many problems picking up soldering, more of the desoldering that was the problem.  Makes me kinda confident in trying to pick it up and try to make my own 62g clears board.  Lubing looks a bit tedious though;  I'll have to look more into that later.

I found desoldering to be quite easy, the only trouble I had was when using the wick didn't work properly and I had to use a sucker, which ended up spewing bits solder everywhere.

Just repaired a pair of headphones that broke on me recently, one of the wires hadn't been properly soldered so I had to solder it back on. Went fairly smooth, the biggest problem was that I had to do it with the can pretty much assembled, so I had to open the can as much as I could and get the iron and solder in the crack. I did nick the plastic a bit, but it's barely noticeable so I'm not too fussed, specially since I'm going to replace them soon-ish anyway.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: nubbinator on Mon, 22 July 2013, 19:01:20
I found desoldering to be quite easy, the only trouble I had was when using the wick didn't work properly and I had to use a sucker, which ended up spewing bits solder everywhere.

Just repaired a pair of headphones that broke on me recently, one of the wires hadn't been properly soldered so I had to solder it back on. Went fairly smooth, the biggest problem was that I had to do it with the can pretty much assembled, so I had to open the can as much as I could and get the iron and solder in the crack. I did nick the plastic a bit, but it's barely noticeable so I'm not too fussed, specially since I'm going to replace them soon-ish anyway.

Are you religiously clearing the pump?  If you don't and don't take it apart every now and then and wash it out, it can start to do that.  I desoldered my entire RK9000 without issues like that though.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 23 July 2013, 11:07:35
ok now i'm super curious. someone buy one of these and report back!

http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1374592266&sr=8-1&keywords=aoyue+474a%2B%2B

looks like it's basically a hakko 474, with all the extra suction that implies. replace the tip, chamber and all the filters with the hakko parts. it should come in at about the same price as an 808 but have about 2-3x more suction
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Tue, 23 July 2013, 11:16:11
ok now i'm super curious. someone buy one of these and report back!

http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1374592266&sr=8-1&keywords=aoyue+474a%2B%2B

looks like it's basically a hakko 474, with all the extra suction that implies. replace the tip, chamber and all the filters with the hakko parts. it should come in at about the same price as an 808 but have about 2-3x more suction

If only I were in the US.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Tue, 23 July 2013, 14:13:24
ok now i'm super curious. someone buy one of these and report back!

http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1374592266&sr=8-1&keywords=aoyue+474a%2B%2B

looks like it's basically a hakko 474, with all the extra suction that implies. replace the tip, chamber and all the filters with the hakko parts. it should come in at about the same price as an 808 but have about 2-3x more suction

If I sell my 808, I might get it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: RabRhee on Tue, 23 July 2013, 14:49:07
ok now i'm super curious. someone buy one of these and report back!

http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1374592266&sr=8-1&keywords=aoyue+474a%2B%2B

looks like it's basically a hakko 474, with all the extra suction that implies. replace the tip, chamber and all the filters with the hakko parts. it should come in at about the same price as an 808 but have about 2-3x more suction

Looks like a bit lower power, and lower temp, than a real Hakko 474, 80w instead of 100w, 150-380 instead of 380-480 degrees C. Same with the Aoyue 936, its lower power, the number is an indication that the parts fit each other. Still, its probably a nice bit of kit for the price.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mashby on Tue, 23 July 2013, 15:45:19
This link (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001UDBGSQ/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&me=&seller=) has it for $99.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Tue, 23 July 2013, 15:54:23
This link (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001UDBGSQ/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&me=&seller=) has it for $99.

And $92 for shipping :eek:
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mashby on Tue, 23 July 2013, 16:12:26
This link (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001UDBGSQ/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&me=&seller=) has it for $99.

And $92 for shipping :eek:

Totally missed that!  :eek:

nevermind....
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Tue, 23 July 2013, 16:22:42
This link (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001UDBGSQ/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&me=&seller=) has it for $99.

And $92 for shipping :eek:

Totally missed that!  :eek:

nevermind....

Yeah...Amazon is screwy like that....you gotta watch it.

Out of my ignorance, I saw you posted you bought some stuff for your soldering station....what are the brushes for??
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mashby on Tue, 23 July 2013, 16:38:05
Out of my ignorance, I saw you posted you bought some stuff for your soldering station....what are the brushes for??

Lubing switches. I bought Sax True Flow Masters Finest Red Sable Brushes (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0042SZ0CE/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i04?ie=UTF8&psc=1).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Neal on Tue, 23 July 2013, 17:11:30
Really helpfull post A+
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Tue, 23 July 2013, 20:53:25
Out of my ignorance, I saw you posted you bought some stuff for your soldering station....what are the brushes for??

Lubing switches. I bought Sax True Flow Masters Finest Red Sable Brushes (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0042SZ0CE/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i04?ie=UTF8&psc=1).

That makes sense, I was trying to figure out what you were doing with brushes and solder. ;D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Wed, 24 July 2013, 02:27:02
Just ordered a yihua 936, some soldering wick, solder, head light/magnifier thing, safety glasses just incase, hakko tip cleaner(so i dont have to use sponge), some dupont lube, 62g and 65g springs (to see which I like), and mx clears.  Just need to pick up a 2nd board and possibly a radio shack desoldering iron?

Expect questions from me sometime in the near future!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: yasuo on Wed, 24 July 2013, 04:44:37
Goot pump desoldering also good? :D is $10
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Wed, 24 July 2013, 07:01:00
Goot pump desoldering also good? :D is $10

Huh?? More info please! ;)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: hasu on Wed, 24 July 2013, 07:46:06
I have goot GS-108 and it works. This small size one is easy to load spring by one hand.
It is better than cheap one got from dx.com but I've never used other pumps like SOLDAPULLT and hakko SPPON.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Wed, 24 July 2013, 11:57:15
I couldn't get Soldapullt to work with Filco PCBs.  The solder goes very deep, through the holes in the PCB to the opposite side, and RadioShack iron and the like seem to be ideal.  Not sure how others use Soldapullt to desolder switches from Filcos, but mine wasn't getting enough of the solder out (I think it was cooling off quickly by the time I'd get the suction tip over the hole completely.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: domoaligato on Wed, 24 July 2013, 12:33:05
I have used the radio shack desoldering pump for quite a bit now and I think I will get a 808.
the $180.00 USD to save my sanity will be worth it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Wed, 24 July 2013, 12:35:33
I couldn't get Soldapullt to work with Filco PCBs.  The solder goes very deep, through the holes in the PCB to the opposite side, and RadioShack iron and the like seem to be ideal.  Not sure how others use Soldapullt to desolder switches from Filcos, but mine wasn't getting enough of the solder out (I think it was cooling off quickly by the time I'd get the suction tip over the hole completely.

Are you sure that you're fully heating the joint? Also, the speed and distance at which you suck the solder matters. I have the tip of the pump on the PCB really close to the joint at which I'm desoldering. Once the joint is fully heated, I move the pump closer or even over the joint, forming a seal around it and then hit the button activating the pump.

I don't always get all of the solder, but it works quite well
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Wed, 24 July 2013, 12:50:48
I just bought one of those soldering pumps with built-in heating irons. Will test and report soon. No PCB to desolder from at the moment :/
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: gnubag on Wed, 24 July 2013, 14:42:02
I couldn't get Soldapullt to work with Filco PCBs.  The solder goes very deep, through the holes in the PCB to the opposite side, and RadioShack iron and the like seem to be ideal.  Not sure how others use Soldapullt to desolder switches from Filcos, but mine wasn't getting enough of the solder out (I think it was cooling off quickly by the time I'd get the suction tip over the hole completely.

Are you sure that you're fully heating the joint? Also, the speed and distance at which you suck the solder matters. I have the tip of the pump on the PCB really close to the joint at which I'm desoldering. Once the joint is fully heated, I move the pump closer or even over the joint, forming a seal around it and then hit the button activating the pump.

I don't always get all of the solder, but it works quite well

I used my solderpult on my filco and it worked flawlessly. there was no solder remains in the holes and the plate with the switches just fell of the pcb.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Wed, 24 July 2013, 14:49:18
I think today im going to put all my whites into my poker...i want to be able to see if i will even like whites for my gh60...if i dont, then i need to grab like 130 mx blacks soon lol
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Wed, 24 July 2013, 14:52:15
I think today im going to put all my whites into my poker...i want to be able to see if i will even like whites for my gh60...if i dont, then i need to grab like 130 mx blacks soon lol


You might as well get some of those 'old' blacks from whiskytango they are dirt cheap!!

And if you don't like the whites I'd like to buy them off you  8)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Wed, 24 July 2013, 14:54:25
I think today im going to put all my whites into my poker...i want to be able to see if i will even like whites for my gh60...if i dont, then i need to grab like 130 mx blacks soon lol


You might as well get some of those 'old' blacks from whiskytango they are dirt cheap!!
might as well :))

i think he's swamped right now..
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Rayne on Wed, 24 July 2013, 17:28:46
i just got my hakko fx888d in the mail! now i get to try it out on my phantom build :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Fri, 26 July 2013, 12:06:35
D: my soldering iron wont get here until next thursday, so sad.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Fri, 26 July 2013, 12:21:37
Where's a good place to get new tips for a 936 and what's a decent tip for switch soldering? If the stock tip will do just fine then I'll stick with it as I haven't ordered my 936 yet.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Fri, 26 July 2013, 12:39:48
Where's a good place to get new tips for a 936 and what's a decent tip for switch soldering? If the stock tip will do just fine then I'll stick with it as I haven't ordered my 936 yet.

If you want to be really cheap, theres tips for a couple bucks on ebay but they come from china.  I just went with a legit d24 hakko tip from amazon for like $8 and free 2 day shipping.  I think I've read both good and bad about the stock tip but I figured better safe than sorry.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Fri, 26 July 2013, 12:42:37
Where's a good place to get new tips for a 936 and what's a decent tip for switch soldering? If the stock tip will do just fine then I'll stick with it as I haven't ordered my 936 yet.

There was quite a bit of discussion a few pages back on tips, I would 'assume' they would be applicable, if they work with that iron.

Thanks for confirmation. I thought hakko tips would be compatible.. just wanted to check. What size of chisel tip would you recommend for keyboard soldering?

Here is some discussion from the other day on that topic!!

 
Alright I'm thinking of getting a Hakko 888 soldering kit. What tips should I get with it? I'll buy everything from amazon btw.

I use the d24 (2,4 mm chisel) for most trough-hole stuff...
More contact area than the d16 (better heat transfer) but not too big (like the d32).


Just picked up some soldering gear for when my r3 eDox kit gets here, and I have minimal prior experience with soldering so I was wondering if there's a quick list of do's and don'ts when soldering that I should be aware of, besides the obvious.

Also, will a chisel tip work better for keyboard soldering than a round tip?

I also think you should watch some videos, visual learning really is the way to go here!
Anyway, if you are really looking for a quick simple writeup, here is what I do...

- For switch or LED soldering I use a 2,4mm chisel tip
- Also I use leaded rosin core solder with 1mm diameter
- Make sure components sit flush against the PCB and pins sit right
- Set the temperature of the station to 300-350 degree Celsius and wait for heatup
- Make sure your solder tip is clean, if not clean it (repeat that periodically in the process)
- Put the tip in between pad and pin and feed a small amount of solder in the gap between tip an pin for better heat transfer
- Feed solder from the other side into the gap between pin and pad (enough that you get a solid cone shape bonding) and remove tip
- The two steps above should be done fast and finished when the molten solder completely stops smoking (then the flux is used up)
- Inspect the solder spots... You want a shiny uninterrupted cone shape which contacts the whole pad, best use a magnifying glass for that
- If there seems to be something wrong with the spot, desolder -> clean -> redo, or apply some flux (you can get it seperately) and let the spot reflow by heating it up again
i don't know about the ebay tips because frankly i'd rather have a single tip that lasts 12 years than 12 tips that give me inconsistent heat transfer for one year each.

also because genuine tips are cheap.

i have one of the smaller needle points i never use, a d16, d32 (for big ****), and some other crap i never use. the d16 is pretty much going to be your go-to tip for almost everything except for joints that need a lot of power. the small tips like the d12 or the needle points are only really useful in situations where you need to be really careful about how much power you're putting into the joint. not that this doesn't include most SMD ICs, because you'll want enough surface area to be able to do a quick wipe downwards across the pins. a needle tip won't allow you to do that, but can be useful for really fine rework.

for wires or big components i break out the d32. the 888d has enough power to make quick work of those if you give it the surface area.

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Fri, 26 July 2013, 12:45:17
Thought I'd share this while I'm here. 1lb spool of 63/37 Kester 44 only $21.80 and shipping isn't outrageous like the other site. http://www.all-spec.com/products/KW4410.html
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Fri, 26 July 2013, 12:50:28
Thought I'd share this while I'm here. 1lb spool of 63/37 Kester 44 only $21.80 and shipping isn't outrageous like the other site. http://www.all-spec.com/products/KW4410.html

Looks like they charge you a fee if your order is below $25 though.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Fri, 26 July 2013, 12:59:19
Thought I'd share this while I'm here. 1lb spool of 63/37 Kester 44 only $21.80 and shipping isn't outrageous like the other site. http://www.all-spec.com/products/KW4410.html

Looks like they charge you a fee if your order is below $25 though.

Yeah, mine isn't because I'm also getting a soldapullt and a tip cleaner from there. With shipping it all comes out to 48.90 or so.

You could just add a tip or two to get it above the $25 mark as well.

EDIT: It appears the FX888D is on sale for 80 bucks right now on that site.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Fri, 26 July 2013, 13:04:33
2.4mm chisel tip is best for keyboard hobby.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Fri, 26 July 2013, 13:05:21
I'm seriously contemplating just getting the FX888, a 1lb spool of kester 44, and a soldapullt for $120 shipped from this place right now.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 26 July 2013, 13:38:42
I'm seriously contemplating just getting the FX888, a 1lb spool of kester 44, and a soldapullt for $120 shipped from this place right now.

Probably can't go wrong with that setup. I don't know about that site, but those products are solid.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Fri, 26 July 2013, 13:45:39
I'm seriously contemplating just getting the FX888, a 1lb spool of kester 44, and a soldapullt for $120 shipped from this place right now.

Probably can't go wrong with that setup. I don't know about that site, but those products are solid.

They seem to have good reviews on places like BBB and such. Granted I just got paid, I think it's time I get a legitimate setup.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Fri, 26 July 2013, 13:47:40
The desoldering iron I linked earlier, has been tested and is working beautifully, this is so much better than a braid, so much faster and so much cleaner.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 26 July 2013, 13:49:05
The desoldering iron I linked earlier, has been tested and is working beautifully, this is so much better than a braid, so much faster and so much cleaner.

Awesome. Glad it's working good for you. Although, with shipping, the cheapest I could find them in the US was like $20 on eBay. You can get a genuine Soldapullt direct from Edsyn for that.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Fri, 26 July 2013, 13:52:44
The desoldering iron I linked earlier, has been tested and is working beautifully, this is so much better than a braid, so much faster and so much cleaner.

Awesome. Glad it's working good for you. Although, with shipping, the cheapest I could find them in the US was like $20 on eBay. You can get a genuine Soldapullt direct from Edsyn for that.

Soldapullt's tip isn't heated, unlike the one I linked and purchased, the advantage being, you don't have to worry about timing as such, melt and push the button. However I can't comment on suction power as I have never used a Soldapullt.

As far as application goes for me, it has worked quite well so far.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 26 July 2013, 13:55:20
The desoldering iron I linked earlier, has been tested and is working beautifully, this is so much better than a braid, so much faster and so much cleaner.

Awesome. Glad it's working good for you. Although, with shipping, the cheapest I could find them in the US was like $20 on eBay. You can get a genuine Soldapullt direct from Edsyn for that.

Soldapullt's tip isn't heated, unlike the one I linked and purchased, the advantage being, you don't have to worry about timing as such, melt and push the button. However I can't comment on suction power as I have never used a Soldapullt.

As far as application goes for me, it has worked quite well so far.

Oh, sorry. For some reason I thought you were talking about the Goot GS-108. Too many desoldering discussions going on at once, I guess. :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Fri, 26 July 2013, 14:01:31
Oh, sorry. For some reason I thought you were talking about the Goot GS-108. Too many desoldering discussions going on at once, I guess. :)

This is the one I was talking about: http://www.ebay.com/itm/AC-220V-30W-Soldering-Irons-SOLDER-SUCKER-DESOLDERING-PUMP-tips-/141013644464?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20d51174b0

Got one locally for around $4. Only the front metal part is heated, rest of it works pretty much like any other desoldering pump.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 26 July 2013, 14:16:38
The desoldering iron I linked earlier, has been tested and is working beautifully, this is so much better than a braid, so much faster and so much cleaner.
nice!! keep us updated on how it holds up over time. this is often the trick with things that create and attempt to hold vacuum ;)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Fri, 26 July 2013, 14:24:01
I did get some grease to lube it ever so often on when I use it. Also, after a long use, I just give the plunger a couple of swift hits without actually locking it in. This has resulted in the iron blowing out some hot solder which was on the inside of the tube as mkawa had earlier suggested.

But I wonder if this would wear down the rubber gaskets faster?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 26 July 2013, 15:36:12
no idea, but for 4 bucks, i don't think i'd care either ;)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Fri, 26 July 2013, 21:28:25
no idea, but for 4 bucks, i don't think i'd care either ;)

Hmmm :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Sat, 27 July 2013, 14:52:27
Ordered the FX888, a Soldapullt, and some Kester 44, should be in next week :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Mon, 29 July 2013, 20:28:18
Alright, maybe someone can help me with this issue I've just run into.  I have soldering experience, so I think I know what I'm doing, but maybe I'm missing something.

I'm soldering wires to very old and possibly oxidized connections.  This is a piece of equipment from the '60s. 

So what's happening is that firstly the piece of metal I'm soldering to is taking a really long time to heat up, which is expected because it's a rather large piece (not a small lead like you'd expect to see today).  That's fine.  But then once I heat it up I can't get solder to flow to it, or get wicked away from the iron onto it.  Is that due to oxidation?  I tried cleaning the metal with alcohol (all I've got for cleaning at the moment).  Any suggestions?  The wire gets nice and solder-covered, and I can stick it through and get it "stuck" through the metal piece, but it's certainly not physically connected to the metal in any sturdy way.  I need help!  :)

Thanks in advance for any help!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MJ45 on Mon, 29 July 2013, 20:44:34
Alright, maybe someone can help me with this issue I've just run into.  I have soldering experience, so I think I know what I'm doing, but maybe I'm missing something.

I'm soldering wires to very old and possibly oxidized connections.  This is a piece of equipment from the '60s. 

So what's happening is that firstly the piece of metal I'm soldering to is taking a really long time to heat up, which is expected because it's a rather large piece (not a small lead like you'd expect to see today).  That's fine.  But then once I heat it up I can't get solder to flow to it, or get wicked away from the iron onto it.  Is that due to oxidation?  I tried cleaning the metal with alcohol (all I've got for cleaning at the moment).  Any suggestions?  The wire gets nice and solder-covered, and I can stick it through and get it "stuck" through the metal piece, but it's certainly not physically connected to the metal in any sturdy way.  I need help!  :)

Thanks in advance for any help!
Try putting some flux on it with a flux pen or brush on type, that should make the solder stick and flow on it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 29 July 2013, 20:57:23
Alright, maybe someone can help me with this issue I've just run into.  I have soldering experience, so I think I know what I'm doing, but maybe I'm missing something.

I'm soldering wires to very old and possibly oxidized connections.  This is a piece of equipment from the '60s. 

So what's happening is that firstly the piece of metal I'm soldering to is taking a really long time to heat up, which is expected because it's a rather large piece (not a small lead like you'd expect to see today).  That's fine.  But then once I heat it up I can't get solder to flow to it, or get wicked away from the iron onto it.  Is that due to oxidation?  I tried cleaning the metal with alcohol (all I've got for cleaning at the moment).  Any suggestions?  The wire gets nice and solder-covered, and I can stick it through and get it "stuck" through the metal piece, but it's certainly not physically connected to the metal in any sturdy way.  I need help!  :)

Thanks in advance for any help!
sometimes flux just isn't enough and you need steel wool or a stainless steel brush. oxidization is a *****!

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Mon, 29 July 2013, 21:00:58
I'm soldering wires to very old and possibly oxidized connections.  This is a piece of equipment from the '60s. 

Solder won't bind to stuff that are heavily oxidized or corroded. If it's really bad, first try some physical abrasion, then use flux. RA flux works best, but must be cleaned off after soldering, otherwise it'll cause corrosion over time. The no-clean type works ok too.

Flux is magic :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Mon, 29 July 2013, 21:40:15
Solder won't bind to stuff that are heavily oxidized or corroded. If it's really bad, first try some physical abrasion, then use flux. RA flux works best, but must be cleaned off after soldering, otherwise it'll cause corrosion over time. The no-clean type works ok too.

Flux is magic :)

sometimes flux just isn't enough and you need steel wool or a stainless steel brush. oxidization is a *****!

Try putting some flux on it with a flux pen or brush on type, that should make the solder stick and flow on it.

Thanks for so many quick replies!!  This confirms my fear.  I really didn't want to clean so many contacts in that way...   :'(
Oh well.  Now I need to go buy some more flux!  (misplaced my old supply)

Once again, thanks a bunch!  Much appreciated.  :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 29 July 2013, 22:40:15
also keep in mind that there's more than one way to heat things. there is contact and there is LAMINAR FLOW OF VERY HOT FLUIDS. basically, take a huge effing hot air gun and heat those oxidated suckers up, then take something really abrasive and abrade the **** out of it while it's hot.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Mon, 29 July 2013, 23:34:23
also keep in mind that there's more than one way to heat things. there is contact and there is LAMINAR FLOW OF VERY HOT FLUIDS. basically, take a huge effing hot air gun and heat those oxidated suckers up, then take something really abrasive and abrade the **** out of it while it's hot.
Sand blaster?  ^-^
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 29 July 2013, 23:42:16
keep in mind you need to leave the PCB and components intact...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Tue, 30 July 2013, 07:23:07
keep in mind you need to leave the PCB and components intact...

I'm not sure if that's directed at me, but if it is I won't have to worry - there is no PCB.  I'm just soldering to a bunch of contacts lined up in a row. 

A sand-blaster might actually work...   :))
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 30 July 2013, 10:44:21
DO IT AND TAKE PICS!!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Tue, 30 July 2013, 10:50:20
DO IT AND TAKE PICS!!

Haha, if only I had a sand blaster...

In other news, I have some DeoxIT (link (http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2104746)) that is good for cleaning oxidation of contacts.  Unless you'd advise against trying that, I think I'll give that a go and see if it helps clean the contacts.

The reason I'm trying things other than the suggestions is because Radioshack (my only local supplier) seems to be incapable of carrying the flux pens in store - only online - and I want to get working on it tonight.  I will still check to see if they have any in-store by chance, but it seems unlikely.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 30 July 2013, 14:25:16
deoxit is great for cleaning oxidization at the micron level. go to the hardware store, get some steel wool or some 100 grit sandpaper and go to work
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: domoaligato on Tue, 30 July 2013, 14:37:16
Thought I'd share this while I'm here. 1lb spool of 63/37 Kester 44 only $21.80 and shipping isn't outrageous like the other site. http://www.all-spec.com/products/KW4410.html

here is the .20 version also
http://www.all-spec.com/products/Soldering_and_Rework%7CSolder_and_Soldering_Chemicals%7CSOL-0C/KW4400.html
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Tue, 30 July 2013, 14:40:47
Thought I'd share this while I'm here. 1lb spool of 63/37 Kester 44 only $21.80 and shipping isn't outrageous like the other site. http://www.all-spec.com/products/KW4410.html

here is the .20 version also
http://www.all-spec.com/products/Soldering_and_Rework%7CSolder_and_Soldering_Chemicals%7CSOL-0C/KW4400.html

They are a legit site too, so I'm going to order through them from now on.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 30 July 2013, 20:23:31
i will be completely amazed if you manage to get through more than a single lb of solder in your lifetime.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Tue, 30 July 2013, 20:24:38
i will be completely amazed if you manage to get through more than a single lb of solder in your lifetime.

I want to buy a lb and melt the whole thing down in an oven into a giant solder ball.  Does that count as "using" it?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Tue, 30 July 2013, 21:45:05
i will be completely amazed if you manage to get through more than a single lb of solder in your lifetime.

Hell, I use solder errday and I'm not sure I'll need much more than an LB.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Wed, 31 July 2013, 08:43:55
i will be completely amazed if you manage to get through more than a single lb of solder in your lifetime.

Hell, I use solder errday and I'm not sure I'll need much more than an LB.

I got some 0.031" I meant if I wanted to snag some 0.020" as well :) And I used almost a lb of solder alone when I wired my car with 1/0 for my audio setup. 1/0 ring terminals require a **** ton of solder... and a friggin propane torch to solder with haha.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Wed, 31 July 2013, 08:48:25
That's why I ordered 4oz of .020" instead of getting a pound. It was around the same price per oz as a 1 pound roll of it and since I knew I wasn't going to be soldering a ton, it just made more sense to do that.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Wed, 31 July 2013, 08:52:24
That's why I ordered 4oz of .020" instead of getting a pound. It was around the same price per oz as a 1 pound roll of it and since I knew I wasn't going to be soldering a ton, it just made more sense to do that.

In retrospect I should've probably saved the money and went with that. No way I'm gonna use all of that. Plus I'll be away at school. Guess I'm bringing my iron with me :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Wed, 31 July 2013, 08:55:28
That's why I ordered 4oz of .020" instead of getting a pound. It was around the same price per oz as a 1 pound roll of it and since I knew I wasn't going to be soldering a ton, it just made more sense to do that.

In retrospect I should've probably saved the money and went with that. No way I'm gonna use all of that. Plus I'll be away at school. Guess I'm bringing my iron with me :D

You can always sell some here. I'm sure there are people who don't want a pound and you want to get rid of some......
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Wed, 31 July 2013, 10:06:14
That's why I ordered 4oz of .020" instead of getting a pound. It was around the same price per oz as a 1 pound roll of it and since I knew I wasn't going to be soldering a ton, it just made more sense to do that.

Where does one buy this small amount from?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Wed, 31 July 2013, 10:11:20
Found a solder similar to the Kester 44. There is much less of but at a similar price per ounce since I doubt anyone is really going to need 1lbs of solder for keyboards. And it's .020" thick so it should be thin enough in diameter for SMD work


http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=SMDSW.020_4ozvirtualkey63560000virtualkey910-SMDSW.0204OZ

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 31 July 2013, 10:17:51
that solder has no-clean flux. what we like about kester 44 is the fact that it has a very active (ie, very corroside) RA rosin flux. chip quik might still make a good RA rosin core solder though. i'm pretty MG chem still does, and their rosin is top notch.

edit: note that the major difference between no-clean and rosin flux is that no-clean is _not_ very active. hence, you don't have to clean it off the board after you solder. this is quite if you're processing 1 MILLION PCBs per minute, but if you're soldering like one a week you want the rosin.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Wed, 31 July 2013, 10:27:51
that solder has no-clean flux. what we like about kester 44 is the fact that it has a very active (ie, very corroside) RA rosin flux. chip quik might still make a good RA rosin core solder though. i'm pretty MG chem still does, and their rosin is top notch.

edit: note that the major difference between no-clean and rosin flux is that no-clean is _not_ very active. hence, you don't have to clean it off the board after you solder. this is quite if you're processing 1 MILLION PCBs per minute, but if you're soldering like one a week you want the rosin.

If I wanted to get solder in small amounts would any of the following be worthwhile? I know were beating a dead horse...but I'm trying to absorb all the knowledge slowly ;)


Kester 63/37 .031 Solder,Rosin Core #44, 20 ft, NOS

http://www.ebay.com/itm/111098191441?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649


Kester 44 Rosin Core Solder 63/37 .020" Dispense-Pak

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261152828428?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

or perhaps these

 MG Chemicals 4880 Series, Sn63/Pb37 Rosin Core Leaded Solder, 0.032" Diameter, 0.6 oz Pocket Pack

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK

 Kester Pocket Pack Solder 60/40 0.031 0.50 oz. Tube

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00068IJNQ
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Wed, 31 July 2013, 10:30:54
I dunno, I'm the kind of guy that would rather just spend the extra 10-15 bucks so I don't ever have to order any more in the foreseeable future.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Wed, 31 July 2013, 10:32:27
that solder has no-clean flux. what we like about kester 44 is the fact that it has a very active (ie, very corroside) RA rosin flux. chip quik might still make a good RA rosin core solder though. i'm pretty MG chem still does, and their rosin is top notch.

edit: note that the major difference between no-clean and rosin flux is that no-clean is _not_ very active. hence, you don't have to clean it off the board after you solder. this is quite if you're processing 1 MILLION PCBs per minute, but if you're soldering like one a week you want the rosin.

If I wanted to get solder in small amounts would any of the following be worthwhile? I know were beating a dead horse...but I'm trying to absorb all the knowledge slowly ;)


Kester 63/37 .031 Solder,Rosin Core #44, 20 ft, NOS

http://www.ebay.com/itm/111098191441?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649


Kester 44 Rosin Core Solder 63/37 .020" Dispense-Pak

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261152828428?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

or perhaps these

 MG Chemicals 4880 Series, Sn63/Pb37 Rosin Core Leaded Solder, 0.032" Diameter, 0.6 oz Pocket Pack

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK

 Kester Pocket Pack Solder 60/40 0.031 0.50 oz. Tube

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00068IJNQ

That second link isn't a bad deal. If you want some good solder in a compact size I'd do it. I love those little tube packs for soldering. Though, ~$8 for 3/4 Oz is mad expensive. You can get a pound, which is almost 20x more for about 3x that price.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Wed, 31 July 2013, 10:42:54
that solder has no-clean flux. what we like about kester 44 is the fact that it has a very active (ie, very corroside) RA rosin flux. chip quik might still make a good RA rosin core solder though. i'm pretty MG chem still does, and their rosin is top notch.

edit: note that the major difference between no-clean and rosin flux is that no-clean is _not_ very active. hence, you don't have to clean it off the board after you solder. this is quite if you're processing 1 MILLION PCBs per minute, but if you're soldering like one a week you want the rosin.

If I wanted to get solder in small amounts would any of the following be worthwhile? I know were beating a dead horse...but I'm trying to absorb all the knowledge slowly ;)


Kester 63/37 .031 Solder,Rosin Core #44, 20 ft, NOS

http://www.ebay.com/itm/111098191441?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649


Kester 44 Rosin Core Solder 63/37 .020" Dispense-Pak

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261152828428?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

or perhaps these

 MG Chemicals 4880 Series, Sn63/Pb37 Rosin Core Leaded Solder, 0.032" Diameter, 0.6 oz Pocket Pack

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK

 Kester Pocket Pack Solder 60/40 0.031 0.50 oz. Tube

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00068IJNQ

That second link isn't a bad deal. If you want some good solder in a compact size I'd do it. I love those little tube packs for soldering. Though, ~$8 for 3/4 Oz is mad expensive. You can get a pound, which is almost 20x more for about 3x that price.

Considering that you can get 4 oz for around $12 in my link, it is mad expensive
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Wed, 31 July 2013, 10:45:34
that solder has no-clean flux. what we like about kester 44 is the fact that it has a very active (ie, very corroside) RA rosin flux. chip quik might still make a good RA rosin core solder though. i'm pretty MG chem still does, and their rosin is top notch.

edit: note that the major difference between no-clean and rosin flux is that no-clean is _not_ very active. hence, you don't have to clean it off the board after you solder. this is quite if you're processing 1 MILLION PCBs per minute, but if you're soldering like one a week you want the rosin.

If I wanted to get solder in small amounts would any of the following be worthwhile? I know were beating a dead horse...but I'm trying to absorb all the knowledge slowly ;)


Kester 63/37 .031 Solder,Rosin Core #44, 20 ft, NOS

http://www.ebay.com/itm/111098191441?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649


Kester 44 Rosin Core Solder 63/37 .020" Dispense-Pak

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261152828428?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

or perhaps these

 MG Chemicals 4880 Series, Sn63/Pb37 Rosin Core Leaded Solder, 0.032" Diameter, 0.6 oz Pocket Pack

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK

 Kester Pocket Pack Solder 60/40 0.031 0.50 oz. Tube

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00068IJNQ

That second link isn't a bad deal. If you want some good solder in a compact size I'd do it. I love those little tube packs for soldering. Though, ~$8 for 3/4 Oz is mad expensive. You can get a pound, which is almost 20x more for about 3x that price.

Considering that you can get 4 oz for around $12 in my link, it is mad expensive

Ignoring price what about the actual solder :P
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Wed, 31 July 2013, 10:46:09
that solder has no-clean flux. what we like about kester 44 is the fact that it has a very active (ie, very corroside) RA rosin flux. chip quik might still make a good RA rosin core solder though. i'm pretty MG chem still does, and their rosin is top notch.

edit: note that the major difference between no-clean and rosin flux is that no-clean is _not_ very active. hence, you don't have to clean it off the board after you solder. this is quite if you're processing 1 MILLION PCBs per minute, but if you're soldering like one a week you want the rosin.

If I wanted to get solder in small amounts would any of the following be worthwhile? I know were beating a dead horse...but I'm trying to absorb all the knowledge slowly ;)


Kester 63/37 .031 Solder,Rosin Core #44, 20 ft, NOS

http://www.ebay.com/itm/111098191441?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649


Kester 44 Rosin Core Solder 63/37 .020" Dispense-Pak

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261152828428?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

or perhaps these

 MG Chemicals 4880 Series, Sn63/Pb37 Rosin Core Leaded Solder, 0.032" Diameter, 0.6 oz Pocket Pack

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK

 Kester Pocket Pack Solder 60/40 0.031 0.50 oz. Tube

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00068IJNQ

That second link isn't a bad deal. If you want some good solder in a compact size I'd do it. I love those little tube packs for soldering. Though, ~$8 for 3/4 Oz is mad expensive. You can get a pound, which is almost 20x more for about 3x that price.

Considering that you can get 4 oz for around $12 in my link, it is mad expensive

Ignoring price what about the actual solder :P

And then you can get 16oz for $22 in my link. This is just a vicious cycle. Soon someone will find a 10lb spool for $200.

As for Ray, the solder is Kester 44, it's the same as we've been posting so I presume it'll be just fine :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: esoomenona on Wed, 31 July 2013, 10:48:32
that solder has no-clean flux. what we like about kester 44 is the fact that it has a very active (ie, very corroside) RA rosin flux. chip quik might still make a good RA rosin core solder though. i'm pretty MG chem still does, and their rosin is top notch.

edit: note that the major difference between no-clean and rosin flux is that no-clean is _not_ very active. hence, you don't have to clean it off the board after you solder. this is quite if you're processing 1 MILLION PCBs per minute, but if you're soldering like one a week you want the rosin.

If I wanted to get solder in small amounts would any of the following be worthwhile? I know were beating a dead horse...but I'm trying to absorb all the knowledge slowly ;)


Kester 63/37 .031 Solder,Rosin Core #44, 20 ft, NOS

http://www.ebay.com/itm/111098191441?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649


Kester 44 Rosin Core Solder 63/37 .020" Dispense-Pak

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261152828428?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

or perhaps these

 MG Chemicals 4880 Series, Sn63/Pb37 Rosin Core Leaded Solder, 0.032" Diameter, 0.6 oz Pocket Pack

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK

 Kester Pocket Pack Solder 60/40 0.031 0.50 oz. Tube

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00068IJNQ

That second link isn't a bad deal. If you want some good solder in a compact size I'd do it. I love those little tube packs for soldering. Though, ~$8 for 3/4 Oz is mad expensive. You can get a pound, which is almost 20x more for about 3x that price.

Considering that you can get 4 oz for around $12 in my link, it is mad expensive

Ignoring price what about the actual solder :P

And then you can get 16oz for $22 in my link. This is just a vicious cycle. Soon someone will find a 10lb spool for $200.

As for Ray, the solder is Kester 44, it's the same as we've been posting so I presume it'll be just fine :)

ALL ABOARD THE QUOTE TRAIN!!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Wed, 31 July 2013, 10:50:12
that solder has no-clean flux. what we like about kester 44 is the fact that it has a very active (ie, very corroside) RA rosin flux. chip quik might still make a good RA rosin core solder though. i'm pretty MG chem still does, and their rosin is top notch.

edit: note that the major difference between no-clean and rosin flux is that no-clean is _not_ very active. hence, you don't have to clean it off the board after you solder. this is quite if you're processing 1 MILLION PCBs per minute, but if you're soldering like one a week you want the rosin.

If I wanted to get solder in small amounts would any of the following be worthwhile? I know were beating a dead horse...but I'm trying to absorb all the knowledge slowly ;)


Kester 63/37 .031 Solder,Rosin Core #44, 20 ft, NOS

http://www.ebay.com/itm/111098191441?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649


Kester 44 Rosin Core Solder 63/37 .020" Dispense-Pak

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261152828428?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

or perhaps these

 MG Chemicals 4880 Series, Sn63/Pb37 Rosin Core Leaded Solder, 0.032" Diameter, 0.6 oz Pocket Pack

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK

 Kester Pocket Pack Solder 60/40 0.031 0.50 oz. Tube

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00068IJNQ

That second link isn't a bad deal. If you want some good solder in a compact size I'd do it. I love those little tube packs for soldering. Though, ~$8 for 3/4 Oz is mad expensive. You can get a pound, which is almost 20x more for about 3x that price.

Considering that you can get 4 oz for around $12 in my link, it is mad expensive

Ignoring price what about the actual solder :P

And then you can get 16oz for $22 in my link. This is just a vicious cycle. Soon someone will find a 10lb spool for $200.

As for Ray, the solder is Kester 44, it's the same as we've been posting so I presume it'll be just fine :)

ALL ABOARD THE QUOTE TRAIN!!

Choo Choo!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Wed, 31 July 2013, 11:00:32
Get 1lb and be done for life.

I had no option here in India, as only one shop in 800 shops in our electronics market had 63/37 solder, that too non-Kester-44. Minimum amount was 1lb for $9
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MJ45 on Wed, 31 July 2013, 13:10:42
Get 1lb and be done for life.

I had no option here in India, as only one shop in 800 shops in our electronics market had 63/37 solder, that too non-Kester-44. Minimum amount was 1lb for $9
[/quote
With those pocket packs like M&G chemicals 0.6oz  63/37 .032  I was able to solder my Phantom and a couple of usb connectors. I would rather buy the small ones so its fresh, they are only a couple bucks a pack
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Wed, 31 July 2013, 14:23:49
that solder has no-clean flux. what we like about kester 44 is the fact that it has a very active (ie, very corroside) RA rosin flux. chip quik might still make a good RA rosin core solder though. i'm pretty MG chem still does, and their rosin is top notch.

edit: note that the major difference between no-clean and rosin flux is that no-clean is _not_ very active. hence, you don't have to clean it off the board after you solder. this is quite if you're processing 1 MILLION PCBs per minute, but if you're soldering like one a week you want the rosin.

If I wanted to get solder in small amounts would any of the following be worthwhile? I know were beating a dead horse...but I'm trying to absorb all the knowledge slowly ;)


Kester 63/37 .031 Solder,Rosin Core #44, 20 ft, NOS

http://www.ebay.com/itm/111098191441?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649


Kester 44 Rosin Core Solder 63/37 .020" Dispense-Pak

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261152828428?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

or perhaps these

 MG Chemicals 4880 Series, Sn63/Pb37 Rosin Core Leaded Solder, 0.032" Diameter, 0.6 oz Pocket Pack

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK

 Kester Pocket Pack Solder 60/40 0.031 0.50 oz. Tube

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00068IJNQ
my god. i've actually used every single one of those (although not in those sizes). i've never liked 60/40, but it has its uses in certain applications. the basic idea is that they are all high quality solders. MG chem, alpha metals, chemtronics, and kester all make FANTASTIC products. i may hate no-clean for hobbyist use, but even their no clean is extremely good given the constraints (all of them). choose based on flux type, solder diameter, price, alloy and quantity. you will be hard pressed to find a quantifiable difference between any of those manufacturers' comparable products in hobbyist use.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Wed, 31 July 2013, 14:38:05
so I may have broken my soldering iron after a total of 5 minutes.  I took it out and wanted to just use the hakko tip I bought and apparently it didnt fit over the heating element?(not sure if thats what it is) and the white part cracked/broke.  Oh and it still doesnt fit with part of it cracked off since the cover part wont screw on afterwards.

I haven't tested it yet, but any idea how bad this is?  Wasn't sure if this meant it was unsafe to use or wont heat the tip properly now.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Wed, 31 July 2013, 14:44:19
so I may have broken my soldering iron after a total of 5 minutes.  I took it out and wanted to just use the hakko tip I bought and apparently it didnt fit over the heating element?(not sure if thats what it is) and the white part cracked/broke.  Oh and it still doesnt fit with part of it cracked off since the cover part wont screw on afterwards.

I haven't tested it yet, but any idea how bad this is?  Wasn't sure if this meant it was unsafe to use or wont heat the tip properly now.

What kinda iron was it again? And that looks pretty serious bud. :(
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Wed, 31 July 2013, 14:45:56
so I may have broken my soldering iron after a total of 5 minutes.  I took it out and wanted to just use the hakko tip I bought and apparently it didnt fit over the heating element?(not sure if thats what it is) and the white part cracked/broke.  Oh and it still doesnt fit with part of it cracked off since the cover part wont screw on afterwards.

I haven't tested it yet, but any idea how bad this is?  Wasn't sure if this meant it was unsafe to use or wont heat the tip properly now.

What kinda iron was it again? And that looks pretty serious bud. :(
the yihau 936
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Wed, 31 July 2013, 14:51:13
I bet that HobbyKing would replace it for you under warranty if you contact them.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Wed, 31 July 2013, 14:52:41
that solder has no-clean flux. what we like about kester 44 is the fact that it has a very active (ie, very corroside) RA rosin flux. chip quik might still make a good RA rosin core solder though. i'm pretty MG chem still does, and their rosin is top notch.

edit: note that the major difference between no-clean and rosin flux is that no-clean is _not_ very active. hence, you don't have to clean it off the board after you solder. this is quite if you're processing 1 MILLION PCBs per minute, but if you're soldering like one a week you want the rosin.

If I wanted to get solder in small amounts would any of the following be worthwhile? I know were beating a dead horse...but I'm trying to absorb all the knowledge slowly ;)


Kester 63/37 .031 Solder,Rosin Core #44, 20 ft, NOS

http://www.ebay.com/itm/111098191441?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/111098191441?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649)


Kester 44 Rosin Core Solder 63/37 .020" Dispense-Pak

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261152828428?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/261152828428?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649)

or perhaps these

 MG Chemicals 4880 Series, Sn63/Pb37 Rosin Core Leaded Solder, 0.032" Diameter, 0.6 oz Pocket Pack

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK)

 Kester Pocket Pack Solder 60/40 0.031 0.50 oz. Tube

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00068IJNQ (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00068IJNQ)
my god. i've actually used every single one of those (although not in those sizes). i've never liked 60/40, but it has its uses in certain applications. the basic idea is that they are all high quality solders. MG chem, alpha metals, chemtronics, and kester all make FANTASTIC products. i may hate no-clean for hobbyist use, but even their no clean is extremely good given the constraints (all of them). choose based on flux type, solder diameter, price, alloy and quantity. you will be hard pressed to find a quantifiable difference between any of those manufacturers' comparable products in hobbyist use.


So for a noob soldering on keyboards would any of those 4 listed be a 'better' choice?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Wed, 31 July 2013, 14:53:47
that solder has no-clean flux. what we like about kester 44 is the fact that it has a very active (ie, very corroside) RA rosin flux. chip quik might still make a good RA rosin core solder though. i'm pretty MG chem still does, and their rosin is top notch.

edit: note that the major difference between no-clean and rosin flux is that no-clean is _not_ very active. hence, you don't have to clean it off the board after you solder. this is quite if you're processing 1 MILLION PCBs per minute, but if you're soldering like one a week you want the rosin.

If I wanted to get solder in small amounts would any of the following be worthwhile? I know were beating a dead horse...but I'm trying to absorb all the knowledge slowly ;)


Kester 63/37 .031 Solder,Rosin Core #44, 20 ft, NOS

http://www.ebay.com/itm/111098191441?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/111098191441?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649)


Kester 44 Rosin Core Solder 63/37 .020" Dispense-Pak

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261152828428?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/261152828428?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649)

or perhaps these

 MG Chemicals 4880 Series, Sn63/Pb37 Rosin Core Leaded Solder, 0.032" Diameter, 0.6 oz Pocket Pack

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00425DZGK)

 Kester Pocket Pack Solder 60/40 0.031 0.50 oz. Tube

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00068IJNQ (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00068IJNQ)
my god. i've actually used every single one of those (although not in those sizes). i've never liked 60/40, but it has its uses in certain applications. the basic idea is that they are all high quality solders. MG chem, alpha metals, chemtronics, and kester all make FANTASTIC products. i may hate no-clean for hobbyist use, but even their no clean is extremely good given the constraints (all of them). choose based on flux type, solder diameter, price, alloy and quantity. you will be hard pressed to find a quantifiable difference between any of those manufacturers' comparable products in hobbyist use.


So for a noob soldering on keyboards would any of those 4 listed be a 'better' choice?

Any of the 63/37's would be the same.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 31 July 2013, 14:54:40

Kester Pocket Pack Solder 60/40 0.031 0.50 oz. Tube


So for a noob soldering on keyboards would any of those 4 listed be a 'better' choice?
[/quote]

I use that. We used that at my internship.

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Wed, 31 July 2013, 15:53:11
*sigh* I tested it and I think the crack ****ed with the sensor, so it looks like I'm ordering a soldering iron from amazon and wont get it till friday.  I have class all day tomorrow anyway :\ but still.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Wed, 31 July 2013, 15:56:17
*sigh* I tested it and I think the crack ****ed with the sensor, so it looks like I'm ordering a soldering iron from amazon and wont get it till friday.  I have class all day tomorrow anyway :\ but still.

Yeah, that ceramic part is fairly integral, too.  Gotta make sure your tips are the right ones for your device, bruh.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Wed, 31 July 2013, 16:00:16
*sigh* I tested it and I think the crack ****ed with the sensor, so it looks like I'm ordering a soldering iron from amazon and wont get it till friday.  I have class all day tomorrow anyway :\ but still.

Yeah, that ceramic part is fairly integral, too.  Gotta make sure your tips are the right ones for your device, bruh.

Eh, could have sworn I saw people saying the hakko tips work fine and this hakko tip was for the800 and 900 series.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Wed, 31 July 2013, 16:19:29
Tips for the 888 are different from tips for the 936. The ones for the Yihua should be like this: 900M-T-2.4D.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Wed, 31 July 2013, 16:22:29
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004ORB8J2/ref=oh_details_o02_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 says backwards compatible with 900m which google shows https://www.hakko.com/english/tip_selection/series_900m.html
which lists the 936, but o well.  It's too late now.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: RabRhee on Wed, 31 July 2013, 18:07:01
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004ORB8J2/ref=oh_details_o02_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 says backwards compatible with 900m which google shows https://www.hakko.com/english/tip_selection/series_900m.html
which lists the 936, but o well.  It's too late now.

Sucks about the element, I found a post that says the Hakko or Yihua 936 used the same tip, but its quite possible either it was erroneous or Yihua changed the design since then. :/ There are replacement elements around if that is what broke, but that may be chasing more stress rather than going for a new iron, especially if other things are different sizes / ratings between the two.

http://www.amazon.com/Amico-Replacement-Heating-Element-Soldering/dp/B00CQMHNC8/ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1375311670&sr=1-1&keywords=936+heating+element
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Wed, 31 July 2013, 18:28:29
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004ORB8J2/ref=oh_details_o02_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 says backwards compatible with 900m which google shows https://www.hakko.com/english/tip_selection/series_900m.html
which lists the 936, but o well.  It's too late now.

Sucks about the element, I found a post that says the Hakko or Yihua 936 used the same tip, but its quite possible either it was erroneous or Yihua changed the design since then. :/ There are replacement elements around if that is what broke, but that may be chasing more stress rather than going for a new iron, especially if other things are different sizes / ratings between the two.

http://www.amazon.com/Amico-Replacement-Heating-Element-Soldering/dp/B00CQMHNC8/ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1375311670&sr=1-1&keywords=936+heating+element

Yeah I think I would still need to desolder the old element+solder a new one, not to mention wait 3-4 weeks for it to come in.  So I just bit the bullet and bought a new soldering iron so I can go ahead and do my soldering this weekend.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Wed, 31 July 2013, 18:33:14
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004ORB8J2/ref=oh_details_o02_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 says backwards compatible with 900m which google shows https://www.hakko.com/english/tip_selection/series_900m.html
which lists the 936, but o well.  It's too late now.

Sucks about the element, I found a post that says the Hakko or Yihua 936 used the same tip, but its quite possible either it was erroneous or Yihua changed the design since then. :/ There are replacement elements around if that is what broke, but that may be chasing more stress rather than going for a new iron, especially if other things are different sizes / ratings between the two.

http://www.amazon.com/Amico-Replacement-Heating-Element-Soldering/dp/B00CQMHNC8/ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1375311670&sr=1-1&keywords=936+heating+element

Yeah I think I would still need to desolder the old element+solder a new one, not to mention wait 3-4 weeks for it to come in.  So I just bit the bullet and bought a new soldering iron so I can go ahead and do my soldering this weekend.

I'm assuming you mean the plug in part and not the whole station, right?

If I'm remembering jdcarpe right, you should have been able to get a true hakko wand at that point, which means no question that hakko 900 tips fit.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Wed, 31 July 2013, 18:41:09
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004ORB8J2/ref=oh_details_o02_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 says backwards compatible with 900m which google shows https://www.hakko.com/english/tip_selection/series_900m.html
which lists the 936, but o well.  It's too late now.

Sucks about the element, I found a post that says the Hakko or Yihua 936 used the same tip, but its quite possible either it was erroneous or Yihua changed the design since then. :/ There are replacement elements around if that is what broke, but that may be chasing more stress rather than going for a new iron, especially if other things are different sizes / ratings between the two.

http://www.amazon.com/Amico-Replacement-Heating-Element-Soldering/dp/B00CQMHNC8/ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1375311670&sr=1-1&keywords=936+heating+element

Yeah I think I would still need to desolder the old element+solder a new one, not to mention wait 3-4 weeks for it to come in.  So I just bit the bullet and bought a new soldering iron so I can go ahead and do my soldering this weekend.

I'm assuming you mean the plug in part and not the whole station, right?

If I'm remembering jdcarpe right, you should have been able to get a true hakko wand at that point, which means no question that hakko 900 tips fit.
I was just going to buy an aoyue station from amazon and get it here by friday. 
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Wed, 31 July 2013, 18:45:16
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004ORB8J2/ref=oh_details_o02_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 says backwards compatible with 900m which google shows https://www.hakko.com/english/tip_selection/series_900m.html
which lists the 936, but o well.  It's too late now.

Sucks about the element, I found a post that says the Hakko or Yihua 936 used the same tip, but its quite possible either it was erroneous or Yihua changed the design since then. :/ There are replacement elements around if that is what broke, but that may be chasing more stress rather than going for a new iron, especially if other things are different sizes / ratings between the two.

http://www.amazon.com/Amico-Replacement-Heating-Element-Soldering/dp/B00CQMHNC8/ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1375311670&sr=1-1&keywords=936+heating+element

Yeah I think I would still need to desolder the old element+solder a new one, not to mention wait 3-4 weeks for it to come in.  So I just bit the bullet and bought a new soldering iron so I can go ahead and do my soldering this weekend.

I'm assuming you mean the plug in part and not the whole station, right?

If I'm remembering jdcarpe right, you should have been able to get a true hakko wand at that point, which means no question that hakko 900 tips fit.
I was just going to buy an aoyue station from amazon and get it here by friday.

Oh wow, the wands are a lot more expensive than I realized XD  Carry on
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Wed, 31 July 2013, 18:49:22
Oh wow, the wands are a lot more expensive than I realized XD  Carry on
Yeah I think they were between $10-20 and would take until at the very least monday (ebay) to get here.  I'd rather just get a new station and have it here friday.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Wed, 31 July 2013, 18:50:22
Oh wow, the wands are a lot more expensive than I realized XD  Carry on
Yeah I think they were between $10-20 and would take until at the very least monday (ebay) to get here.  I'd rather just get a new station and have it here friday.

I was looking up the hakko ones through amazon, they're closer to $100
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Thu, 01 August 2013, 08:49:58
Oh wow, the wands are a lot more expensive than I realized XD  Carry on
Yeah I think they were between $10-20 and would take until at the very least monday (ebay) to get here.  I'd rather just get a new station and have it here friday.

I was looking up the hakko ones through amazon, they're closer to $100

Not to mention the Hakko pens have the opposite plug as the Yihua pens. Yihua uses a female connector on the pen, male on the station. Hakko uses male on the pen and female on the station. They aren't cross compatible :/
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Tarzan on Thu, 01 August 2013, 08:59:29
Oh wow, the wands are a lot more expensive than I realized XD  Carry on
Yeah I think they were between $10-20 and would take until at the very least monday (ebay) to get here.  I'd rather just get a new station and have it here friday.

FWIW, the Aoyue soldering station I got from Amazon shipped with a spare element (but only one tip...).  I didn't know what it was, but from reading this thread, I'm glad I've got one on hand.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000I30QBW/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000I30QBW/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: vun on Thu, 01 August 2013, 17:31:05
Finally got the solder I ordered today. The place I ordered from had closed for 2 weeks due to summer, so it took some time. 60/40 Multicore solder, 0.46mm and 0.7mm. At first I thought maybe 0.7 was too large, but when I got it I'm glad I didn't order anything smaller. Also ordered some solder wick and a Hakko tip tinner. Finally ready for when the eDox kit gets here, whenever that is.
Incredibly hard to find proper solder here in Norway, most of what you'll find in the few hardware stores selling it is lead-free junk.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Thu, 01 August 2013, 17:40:01
New Hakko Tips came today :)
can't wait to use them
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Fri, 02 August 2013, 12:40:37
FX888, Soldapullt, and Kester 44 came in yesterday. This iron, omg. Coming from a Home Depot Weller 15w for small electronics work, and a Weller 110/140W Gun for car audio, this thing is outstanding. I was only able to use it for a few minutes late last night, so I took apart a broken LED flashlight and desoldered the 3 LEDs in less than a minute. I'm gonna have a fun time with this bad boy :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tricheboars on Fri, 02 August 2013, 15:40:23
FX888, Soldapullt, and Kester 44 came in yesterday. This iron, omg. Coming from a Home Depot Weller 15w for small electronics work, and a Weller 110/140W Gun for car audio, this thing is outstanding. I was only able to use it for a few minutes late last night, so I took apart a broken LED flashlight and desoldered the 3 LEDs in less than a minute. I'm gonna have a fun time with this bad boy :)

thats my gear son. **** yea. kester 44, Hakko fx888d, and Edsyn Deluxe Soldapullt are my jam. be sure to have a nice light and something to help hold your project.

our setups are premo, but i am still looking for a descent helping hand setup. the cheap one i bought on amazon sucks toe nails. one thing no one told me when i got into soldering is that you need 3-4 hands for everything you want to do outside of keyboards (which are really easy to work with).  also do yourself a favor and stay away from SMD work. that shiz sucks.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Fri, 02 August 2013, 15:52:27
FX888, Soldapullt, and Kester 44 came in yesterday. This iron, omg. Coming from a Home Depot Weller 15w for small electronics work, and a Weller 110/140W Gun for car audio, this thing is outstanding. I was only able to use it for a few minutes late last night, so I took apart a broken LED flashlight and desoldered the 3 LEDs in less than a minute. I'm gonna have a fun time with this bad boy :)

thats my gear son. **** yea. kester 44, Hakko fx888d, and Edsyn Deluxe Soldapullt are my jam. be sure to have a nice light and something to help hold your project.

our setups are premo, but i am still looking for a descent helping hand setup. the cheap one i bought on amazon sucks toe nails. one thing no one told me when i got into soldering is that you need 3-4 hands for everything you want to do outside of keyboards (which are really easy to work with).  also do yourself a favor and stay away from SMD work. that shiz sucks.

Lol will do on the SMD work haha. I actually went with the FX888, non digital one, I prefer the direct setting of a dial, and it was only $80 :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: vun on Fri, 02 August 2013, 16:01:35
I regret not buying the FX-888D, but it's over $200 here, so a bit hard to justify. But if I should somehow find a buyer for my current iron(hah, as if), or it breaks, I'll probably get the FX-888D.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Fri, 02 August 2013, 16:05:01
I regret not buying the FX-888D, but it's over $200 here, so a bit hard to justify. But if I should somehow find a buyer for my current iron(hah, as if), or it breaks, I'll probably get the FX-888D.

Could you benefit from someone purchasing it here and mailing it to you?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: vun on Fri, 02 August 2013, 16:09:29
I regret not buying the FX-888D, but it's over $200 here, so a bit hard to justify. But if I should somehow find a buyer for my current iron(hah, as if), or it breaks, I'll probably get the FX-888D.

Could you benefit from someone purchasing it here and mailing it to you?

Slightly, but as always my issue with proxying is that if something goes wrong I'm pretty much screwed. And I'd still have to get rid of my current iron, which is pretty much impossible.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Fri, 02 August 2013, 16:10:58
I love how people are more than ready to help on GH.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 02 August 2013, 17:37:46
who was it that broke a heating element? replacement parts are easily available. however, you will have to buy genuine hakko (not a terrible thing). call up the hakko folks in your country and ask a replacement heating element for a hakko 936. while you're at it, pick up some tips that are the right size (hakko is pushing the T series tips now for the 888(d) series. these tips do NOT fit the older 936s.

sweet! you don't have to buy genuine hakko: http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=936+heating+element&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3A936+heating+element

of course, you will need to solder the new heating element onto the iron. this is surprisingly easy. twist the wire joints together by hand and put your iron together. MAKE SURE that you've run enough cable that the solder joints are not inside the solder pen (this will make more sense once you get everything apart). the soldering pencil will heat up with the hand twisted electrical connections. OK, you're ready! now solder the joints and shrink your heatshrink or wrap your joints with good quality electrical tape (nowadays this stuff is fiberglass and not rubber by the way).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 02 August 2013, 17:46:07
vun: when it comes down to it, a well soldered joint is a well soldered joint. alaricjls built probably hundreds of keyboards with the weller wlc-100, which is a station that i hate with a passion that could ignite a thousand suns. however, his technique is good and hence his joints are good. to my knowledge, he's never had a single failure in the field.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Fri, 02 August 2013, 17:51:32
who was it that broke a heating element? replacement parts are easily available. however, you will have to buy genuine hakko (not a terrible thing). call up the hakko folks in your country and ask a replacement heating element for a hakko 936. while you're at it, pick up some tips that are the right size (hakko is pushing the T series tips now for the 888(d) series. these tips do NOT fit the older 936s.

sweet! you don't have to buy genuine hakko: http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=936+heating+element&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3A936+heating+element

of course, you will need to solder the new heating element onto the iron. this is surprisingly easy. twist the wire joints together by hand and put your iron together. MAKE SURE that you've run enough cable that the solder joints are not inside the solder pen (this will make more sense once you get everything apart). the soldering pencil will heat up with the hand twisted electrical connections. OK, you're ready! now solder the joints and shrink your heatshrink or wrap your joints with good quality electrical tape (nowadays this stuff is fiberglass and not rubber by the way).

Lol i appreciate the help.  It was me but i bought an aoyue 936 that came in today.  It actually came with a spare heating element.  I didn't think i would be able to use a new heating element without another soldering iron anyway(to solder it together).  Also I think it would have taken too long for it to get to me.

The tip I bought didn't work for this one either, it was close but not quite.  So far I tried soldering/desoldering on an old phone and it didn't seem too bad so I just went right to work on my QFR.  So far I have done the entire far right side(13 keys) on it and have tested to make sure they work.  The only problem I seem to have so far is that I am finding that I usually have to add new solder to each point before desoldering with my iron+soldapullt.  I'm really liking the Aoyue so far, it seems a lot nicer built and it even has this spool thing for my solder. 
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 02 August 2013, 17:55:26
adding more solder to a joint in order to get suction with a soldapullt is normal and actually kind of an advanced technique ;) good job!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: vun on Fri, 02 August 2013, 18:21:35
vun: when it comes down to it, a well soldered joint is a well soldered joint. alaricjls built probably hundreds of keyboards with the weller wlc-100, which is a station that i hate with a passion that could ignite a thousand suns. however, his technique is good and hence his joints are good. to my knowledge, he's never had a single failure in the field.
Oh, it's not that; I know the station is good as I've got a friend who has one who's done loads of soldering with it, LEDs, controllers, that sorta stuff. I just think the Hakko looks smoother and it would make me feel far more confident in my equipment at least. And it'd be easier to get more tips should I want that, afaik there are only two different tips available for mine, so if I'd want a larger wedge for easier desoldering of large joints/components I'm SOL.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bueller on Sat, 03 August 2013, 05:21:10
Currently lowpoly wiring my custom board, kill me. On a lighter note the soldering station I picked up off eBay is pretty awesome for a $40 job. It's a rebadge of the Sparkfun station if anyone is interested.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Sat, 03 August 2013, 10:45:55
Currently lowpoly wiring my custom board, kill me. On a lighter note the soldering station I picked up off eBay is pretty awesome for a $40 job. It's a rebadge of the Sparkfun station if anyone is interested.

Nice!  How's it going?  Seems like you're not enjoying it?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bueller on Sat, 03 August 2013, 10:50:37
Currently lowpoly wiring my custom board, kill me. On a lighter note the soldering station I picked up off eBay is pretty awesome for a $40 job. It's a rebadge of the Sparkfun station if anyone is interested.

Nice!  How's it going?  Seems like you're not enjoying it?

I'm getting there, SLOWLY. I probably could have got it done a lot quicker but I wound up wrapping the diodes around their own length of wire and then heatshrunk in between each pin. Time consuming as hell but with both the columns and rows insulated looks a lot cleaner and will make shorts pretty much impossible. Got all the rows done and I've just started the columns, they're going a lot quicker though so I should have it ready to go sometime tomorrow!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Sat, 03 August 2013, 10:53:58
Oh, wow, heatshrinking everything would definitely get a bit tedious.   :p  Sounds like it'll be really solid and sturdy and short-proof though!  :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: nubbinator on Sat, 03 August 2013, 11:27:11
I'm getting there, SLOWLY. I probably could have got it done a lot quicker but I wound up wrapping the diodes around their own length of wire and then heatshrunk in between each pin. Time consuming as hell but with both the columns and rows insulated looks a lot cleaner and will make shorts pretty much impossible. Got all the rows done and I've just started the columns, they're going a lot quicker though so I should have it ready to go sometime tomorrow!

Hot glue is just as effective.  It's uglier, but it will speed things up.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Sat, 03 August 2013, 12:31:30
So I managed to finish my keyboard last night.  Desoldering wasn't nearly as bad as I was expecting, and I found the soldapullt to be really effective/easy to use.  I had two connections that were a pain to do though.  One of them was the left alt which I knew was bad but the left windows key also had a joint that didn't want to grab the solder.  I ended up using part of a resistor's leads to get the blobs of solder to stay.  Overall pretty easy, just took a while.  I didn't even burn myself :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Narcix on Sat, 03 August 2013, 13:16:26
Can i use the EWIG rapid 20/40 w soldering iron for modding (LEDs)?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: germy on Sat, 03 August 2013, 22:12:19
Ok I'm new to the world of soldering and want to get into it properly.

If I get Aoyue 968A+, do I still need to get something like the Hakko FX888D because I read the former has a soldering iron? Is it comparable to the Hakko?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: The_Beast on Sat, 03 August 2013, 22:13:39
nm....
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Sun, 04 August 2013, 18:07:07
I just want to warn everyone DO NOT USE A SOLDAPULLT COPY!!!!

I was using one made by 'draper' and it kept on jamming & failing to desolder the joint.. In the end it resulted in the pad getting broken. I now think that particular switch spot on the pcb may be permanently broken.

Also, it wasn't my technique. I've desoldered full boards before and I know how to do it. I also cleaned it out multiple times once it started jamming. It's also fairly new.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MJ45 on Sun, 04 August 2013, 18:58:59
The cheap desolder suckers always let me down at the worst time. The genuine Soldapult's are well made and last long. They seen to have real good suction, replacement tips and "O" rings are available so they can last a long time.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Sun, 04 August 2013, 19:21:21
Well, even though my desoldering pump failed and ****ed up a pad I did take a few pictures of my solder joints while I was at it. What do you guys think?

(http://i.imgur.com/deWp8r5.jpg)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Melvang on Sun, 04 August 2013, 20:06:37
I just want to warn everyone DO NOT USE A SOLDAPULLT COPY!!!!

I was using one made by 'draper' and it kept on jamming & failing to desolder the joint.. In the end it resulted in the pad getting broken. I now think that particular switch spot on the pcb may be permanently broken.

Also, it wasn't my technique. I've desoldered full boards before and I know how to do it. I also cleaned it out multiple times once it started jamming. It's also fairly new.

Maybe this is why I messed up 3 pads and a trace on my Phantom during my desoldering operation.  Used a combination of a solder sucker and the desoldering iron both radio shack brand.

Any chance we can get some tip suggestions in the OP at least for sizes?  I am looking to replace the tip on my Weller and not sure what size I want to get.  I know I want to go a bit smaller but not sure how much.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Sun, 04 August 2013, 20:36:46
Maybe this is why I messed up 3 pads and a trace on my Phantom during my desoldering operation.  Used a combination of a solder sucker and the desoldering iron both radio shack brand.

Any chance we can get some tip suggestions in the OP at least for sizes?  I am looking to replace the tip on my Weller and not sure what size I want to get.  I know I want to go a bit smaller but not sure how much.
The problem with mine was that it simply wouldn't suck up all the solder. I had to repeat it again and again, until it reached a point where the pad was screwed up and it couldn't be fixed.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Sun, 04 August 2013, 20:45:50
Any chance we can get some tip suggestions in the OP at least for sizes?  I am looking to replace the tip on my Weller and not sure what size I want to get.  I know I want to go a bit smaller but not sure how much.

I use a 1.6mm chisel head tip. It's large enough to solder switch pins, but small enough to do fine SMD sizes. I use the tip exclusively for everything.



Well, even though my desoldering pump failed and ****ed up a pad I did take a few pictures of my solder joints while I was at it. What do you guys think?
(http://i.imgur.com/deWp8r5.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/deWp8r5.jpg)

One of the worst joints I've seen

jk. Are you fishing for compliments? That's a good joint in regards to how much solder applied, and even heat flow.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Melvang on Sun, 04 August 2013, 20:56:20
Maybe this is why I messed up 3 pads and a trace on my Phantom during my desoldering operation.  Used a combination of a solder sucker and the desoldering iron both radio shack brand.

Any chance we can get some tip suggestions in the OP at least for sizes?  I am looking to replace the tip on my Weller and not sure what size I want to get.  I know I want to go a bit smaller but not sure how much.
The problem with mine was that it simply wouldn't suck up all the solder. I had to repeat it again and again, until it reached a point where the pad was screwed up and it couldn't be fixed.

Sounds familiar
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Sun, 04 August 2013, 21:33:23

Well, even though my desoldering pump failed and ****ed up a pad I did take a few pictures of my solder joints while I was at it. What do you guys think?
(http://i.imgur.com/deWp8r5.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/deWp8r5.jpg)

One of the worst joints I've seen

jk. Are you fishing for compliments? That's a good joint in regards to how much solder applied, and even heat flow.

I was looking at  this  (http://deskthority.net/marketplace-f11/assembled-ergodox-t6255.html) and yeah.... kinda looks like too little solder. Is there any reason to solder the Edox like that? Sorry if this is a dumb question but you know a thing or two about soldering.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Sun, 04 August 2013, 22:12:05
I was looking at  this  (http://deskthority.net/marketplace-f11/assembled-ergodox-t6255.html) and yeah.... kinda looks like too little solder. Is there any reason to solder the Edox like that? Sorry if this is a dumb question but you know a thing or two about soldering.

That guy you linked used too much solder for the diodes, and not enough solder for the switch pins. There should be solder coming out of the hole. There is a higher risk of cold joints when you don't put enough solder (especially the very bottom right hole in the pic). Most of the time, you only really need an electrical connection, but specifically ergo-doxes need a fully complete solder joint because it's all the mechanical support that switch has. The acrylic plate does nothing to actually lock down the switch.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Sun, 04 August 2013, 22:15:09
One of the worst joints I've seen

jk. Are you fishing for compliments? That's a good joint in regards to how much solder applied, and even heat flow.
For once I wasn't fishing for compliments :)) Just wanted to get some feedback on my joints to see if they were ok. Thanks :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: actionbastard on Sun, 04 August 2013, 22:32:58
I was looking at  this  (http://deskthority.net/marketplace-f11/assembled-ergodox-t6255.html) and yeah.... kinda looks like too little solder. Is there any reason to solder the Edox like that? Sorry if this is a dumb question but you know a thing or two about soldering.

That guy you linked used too much solder for the diodes, and not enough solder for the switch pins. There should be solder coming out of the hole. There is a higher risk of cold joints when you don't put enough solder (especially the very bottom right hole in the pic). Most of the time, you only really need an electrical connection, but specifically ergo-doxes need a fully complete solder joint because it's all the mechanical support that switch has. The acrylic plate does nothing to actually lock down the switch.

I noticed the switches for sure, the diodes didn't catch my eye though. What should the correct amount of solder look like on a SMD diode?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Sun, 04 August 2013, 22:38:15
Very tiny amounts. They should bulge out. Although, that's not too terrible as long as there is a connection. It's easier to control the amount of solder if you use solder wire sizes 0.15" or 0.20". Anything else will be too thick and you'll most likely add too much.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: germy on Mon, 05 August 2013, 02:59:22
Is stuff that sounds too good to be true usually not true?

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/220V-HAKKO-FX-951-Soldering-Station-Hakko-Iron-Hakko-Soldering/547462230.html (http://www.aliexpress.com/item/220V-HAKKO-FX-951-Soldering-Station-Hakko-Iron-Hakko-Soldering/547462230.html)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Melvang on Mon, 05 August 2013, 03:00:56
That is a bulk price of 5 units or more plus shipping from overseas if I read that site correctly.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: germy on Mon, 05 August 2013, 03:11:53
It's listed for $262ish on Amazon. How much does that station cost you guys locally in the US from a Fry's or something?

Anyways, I finally got a hold of a seller online. Its OEM ):
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Mon, 05 August 2013, 03:28:25
That is a bulk price of 5 units or more plus shipping from overseas if I read that site correctly.

No, the 5 unit price is a price break, it looks to be that price listed, but the shipping charge is equal to the unit price.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: germy on Mon, 05 August 2013, 06:46:30
Yup it is referring to just one unit. Anybody can chime in on the price of the soldering station at brick and mortar stores in the US? Thinking of asking someone to buy one to ship it over and wanted to get a gauge of the price difference between that and the online prices.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: yasuo on Mon, 05 August 2013, 07:51:42
Goat desolder also good? :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Fri, 09 August 2013, 15:55:17
So, I'm about to buy an OG soldapullt, but they have a $25 minimum. I figure picking up some wick while I'm at it couldn't hurt.. Is edsyn wick any good, if so which of their wicks would you guys recommend?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Fri, 09 August 2013, 15:59:19
So, I'm about to buy an OG soldapullt, but they have a $25 minimum. I figure picking up some wick while I'm at it couldn't hurt.. Is edsyn wick any good, if so which of their wicks would you guys recommend?

I think if you call they wave the $25 minimum.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Fri, 09 August 2013, 16:00:03
So, I'm about to buy an OG soldapullt, but they have a $25 minimum. I figure picking up some wick while I'm at it couldn't hurt.. Is edsyn wick any good, if so which of their wicks would you guys recommend?

I think if you call they wave the $25 minimum.
Oh.. that's cool. Anyway, I might as well pick up some wick anyway, especially if edsyn make good stuff.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Fri, 09 August 2013, 16:00:28
So, I'm about to buy an OG soldapullt, but they have a $25 minimum. I figure picking up some wick while I'm at it couldn't hurt.. Is edsyn wick any good, if so which of their wicks would you guys recommend?

I think if you call they wave the $25 minimum.

That's nice of them. I never knew that!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Fri, 09 August 2013, 16:03:13
So, I'm about to buy an OG soldapullt, but they have a $25 minimum. I figure picking up some wick while I'm at it couldn't hurt.. Is edsyn wick any good, if so which of their wicks would you guys recommend?

I think if you call they wave the $25 minimum.

That's nice of them. I never knew that!

Well I'm sure its YMMV...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Sat, 10 August 2013, 16:13:39
so today i swapped most of the clear switches from my poker, and put in mx whites i recieved from a GB. i think this is the 4th time i have taken apart my poker completely and put it back together, but this time i was putting in new switches. it's quickest i have done it so far too, at 1 hour and 45 minutes. the mx whites feel great, the first clicky switches i am ever trying too. they are really cool and nice and tactile. i also couldn't bare the OEM caps i was using on my poker, so i broke down and put on the GMK doubleshots i bought back in May (i had told myself i was saving them for my main gh60). they feel *amazing* and i think they are gonna stay on my poker. i can say that my joints are getting much better and i'm doing a better job overall, and it keeps on getting better everytime i sit down and play with my poker.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Sat, 10 August 2013, 16:40:34
so today i swapped most of the clear switches from my poker, and put in mx whites i recieved from a GB. i think this is the 4th time i have taken apart my poker completely and put it back together, but this time i was putting in new switches. it's quickest i have done it so far too, at 1 hour and 45 minutes. the mx whites feel great, the first clicky switches i am ever trying too. they are really cool and nice and tactile. i also couldn't bare the OEM caps i was using on my poker, so i broke down and put on the GMK doubleshots i bought back in May (i had told myself i was saving them for my main gh60). they feel *amazing* and i think they are gonna stay on my poker. i can say that my joints are getting much better and i'm doing a better job overall, and it keeps on getting better everytime i sit down and play with my poker.

I love my white switches a lot.  They're like what blues should be.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Sat, 10 August 2013, 16:55:57
they are around the same weight that i am used to and like, and the actual clickyness is really fun.

They're like what blues should be.

i've heard that from so many people that have tried both
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: VesperSAINT on Mon, 12 August 2013, 02:50:57
So my friend's soldering iron which I borrowed and have been using until now... died today... All the lights come on but it won't get hot... Any ways on fixing this thing or is it time for a Yihua? :))
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 12 August 2013, 09:14:57
what kind of iron is it? is it a station or a stand-alone pencil? not getting hot with a pencil indicates heater failure. if it's a station it could either be the power supply or the heater. sometimes cheaper to replace the heater (on a high quality iron) than the entire iron.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Melvang on Mon, 12 August 2013, 14:26:27
Any suggestions for heat setting on my Weller with a 1.6mm tip?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Mon, 12 August 2013, 14:28:43
Any suggestions for heat setting on my Weller with a 1.6mm tip?

If it's a WLC100, just go 3 - 3.5
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: CPTBadAss on Mon, 12 August 2013, 14:29:04
What model Weller do you have? Can you adjust it to an actual temperature or do you have the Weller that has heat levels 1-5?

If you can set it to an actual temperature, I usually run my iron around 650 - 700 F.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: VesperSAINT on Mon, 12 August 2013, 18:25:18
what kind of iron is it? is it a station or a stand-alone pencil? not getting hot with a pencil indicates heater failure. if it's a station it could either be the power supply or the heater. sometimes cheaper to replace the heater (on a high quality iron) than the entire iron.

Thanks for the response!

It's a Tekpower 936D, which is a station. It has a digital display for the temperature which comes on when I power it on but the pen just doesn't get hot.

Also, Do you know if the tips I have for this thing will fit on a Yihua 936?? I tried googling for about an hour but with no success :(
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Melvang on Mon, 12 August 2013, 18:39:49
What model Weller do you have? Can you adjust it to an actual temperature or do you have the Weller that has heat levels 1-5?

If you can set it to an actual temperature, I usually run my iron around 650 - 700 F.
It is the WLC100 so just 1-5 settings.  With the wider factory tip I was using about 3.75 but I can give 3-3.5 a try.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: gnubag on Mon, 12 August 2013, 18:41:38
What model Weller do you have? Can you adjust it to an actual temperature or do you have the Weller that has heat levels 1-5?

If you can set it to an actual temperature, I usually run my iron around 650 - 700 F.
It is the WLC100 so just 1-5 settings.  With the wider factory tip I was using about 3.75 but I can give 3-3.5 a try.

i use 3 for boards, 2 for cables and 2.5 for smd.
works out pretty well.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 12 August 2013, 21:04:31
have an IR thermometer? do your thing with the iron and aim for a tip temperature of 350C. 63/37 rosin core solders pretty much all process around 350

the problem with low settings on the wlc100 is that you have poor thermal recovery. you process a joint at 350, the tip drops below process temperature, and it takes a while to heat up again. the problem with high settings is that it will happily get the tip much hotter than 350C, at which point you will problems with burning your joints and splatter from the solder (especially thin solders). when using an iron like this, you need to develop kind of a zen feeling for how hot your tip is and adjust the power to the tip accordingly so that you get 350C steady state. i was never any good at it, so it didn't work out for me. shrug. ymmv
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Tue, 13 August 2013, 19:34:42
So today I tried to desolder MX switches with LEDs from a board and out  ~50 desolderings, all of the solder points still contained some solder.  I used a
http://www.amazon.com/Aven-17537-Desoldering-Pump-Anti-Static/dp/B003E48EQ6/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1376440377&sr=8-4&keywords=solder+sucker (http://www.amazon.com/Aven-17537-Desoldering-Pump-Anti-Static/dp/B003E48EQ6/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1376440377&sr=8-4&keywords=solder+sucker)
which I think doesn't have enough suction.  Any recommendations for something else?  How is the Soldapult compared to it?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: VesperSAINT on Tue, 13 August 2013, 23:04:56
So today I tried to desolder MX switches with LEDs from a board and out  ~50 desolderings, all of the solder points still contained some solder.  I used a
http://www.amazon.com/Aven-17537-Desoldering-Pump-Anti-Static/dp/B003E48EQ6/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1376440377&sr=8-4&keywords=solder+sucker (http://www.amazon.com/Aven-17537-Desoldering-Pump-Anti-Static/dp/B003E48EQ6/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1376440377&sr=8-4&keywords=solder+sucker)
which I think doesn't have enough suction.  Any recommendations for something else?  How is the Soldapult compared to it?

Once you've sucked out most the solder, you can just heat up your soldering iron/pen and heat up the remaining solder inside and wiggle/disconnect it. Worked for me. That or you can use resin/solder wick to remove the remaining. Also the desoldering iron from Radio Shack works better than you think :P
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Dubsgalore on Tue, 13 August 2013, 23:06:56
So today I tried to desolder MX switches with LEDs from a board and out  ~50 desolderings, all of the solder points still contained some solder.  I used a
http://www.amazon.com/Aven-17537-Desoldering-Pump-Anti-Static/dp/B003E48EQ6/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1376440377&sr=8-4&keywords=solder+sucker (http://www.amazon.com/Aven-17537-Desoldering-Pump-Anti-Static/dp/B003E48EQ6/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1376440377&sr=8-4&keywords=solder+sucker)
which I think doesn't have enough suction.  Any recommendations for something else?  How is the Soldapult compared to it?

i can't express thoughts about the one you linked but the OG edsyn Soldapullt works wonders
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Tue, 13 August 2013, 23:09:44
In those cases, I would prop up the switch gently with a flat head screwdriver on the plate side with one hand and heat up still attached pins with the soldering iron with the other.  Eventually the switch will pop out, and if you are gentle and careful, it's an easy and safe process.  It was annoying, but I had to do that for a lot of switches between 2 Filco PCBs (those damn through-hole copper inserts and solder going all the way to the other side).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: VesperSAINT on Tue, 13 August 2013, 23:11:26
In those cases, I would prop up the switch gently with a flat head screwdriver on the plate side with one hand and heat up still attached pins with the soldering iron with the other.  Eventually the switch will pop out, and if you are gentle and careful, it's an easy and safe process.  It was annoying, but I had to do that for a lot of switches between 2 Filco PCBs (those damn through-hole copper inserts and solder going all the way to the other side).

Oh gawd.. don't even remind me :( Almost had a blunder because of that.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Wed, 14 August 2013, 01:18:30
In those cases, I would prop up the switch gently with a flat head screwdriver on the plate side with one hand and heat up still attached pins with the soldering iron with the other.  Eventually the switch will pop out, and if you are gentle and careful, it's an easy and safe process.  It was annoying, but I had to do that for a lot of switches between 2 Filco PCBs (those damn through-hole copper inserts and solder going all the way to the other side).

Been there, done that, the TVS had all the switch pins bent on the PCB, I'm guessing to lock them in?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Wed, 14 August 2013, 02:43:00
In those cases, I would prop up the switch gently with a flat head screwdriver on the plate side with one hand and heat up still attached pins with the soldering iron with the other.  Eventually the switch will pop out, and if you are gentle and careful, it's an easy and safe process.  It was annoying, but I had to do that for a lot of switches between 2 Filco PCBs (those damn through-hole copper inserts and solder going all the way to the other side).

They have LEDs attached, so it's not that simple :(

I'll try the RadioShack thing.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: VesperSAINT on Wed, 14 August 2013, 02:47:42
In those cases, I would prop up the switch gently with a flat head screwdriver on the plate side with one hand and heat up still attached pins with the soldering iron with the other.  Eventually the switch will pop out, and if you are gentle and careful, it's an easy and safe process.  It was annoying, but I had to do that for a lot of switches between 2 Filco PCBs (those damn through-hole copper inserts and solder going all the way to the other side).

They have LEDs attached, so it's not that simple :(

I'll try the RadioShack thing.

You could always just desolder the LED's first and then try heating up the pins with the soldering iron trick. It worked for me. I have never actually used a solder pump so I don't know how efficient it is with LED's but I used solder wick and flux to do it. The Radio Shack desoldering iron takes awhile to heat up but it gets the job done. If you need a demonstration, you should refer to WFD's youtube video because he pretty much did the same thing I did.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Wed, 14 August 2013, 03:00:09
I didn't really have any trouble using my soldapullt even on the led'ed switches.  But that was a QFR and apparently those are cake.  I just added new solder to each joint before desoldering.  Sounds like a pain but the few times I tried without it, I had trouble melting the old solder.  ==
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: VesperSAINT on Wed, 14 August 2013, 03:07:53
I didn't really have any trouble using my soldapullt even on the led'ed switches.  But that was a QFR and apparently those are cake.  I just added new solder to each joint before desoldering.  Sounds like a pain but the few times I tried without it, I had trouble melting the old solder.  ==

Sounds about right. The QFR really is cake compared to Filco. Filco, you definitely have to add some solder to help it melt and suck up.

I like your avatar Xenderwind :D I've had multiple Asuka avatars in the past on this forum :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Wed, 14 August 2013, 03:23:54
I didn't really have any trouble using my soldapullt even on the led'ed switches.  But that was a QFR and apparently those are cake.  I just added new solder to each joint before desoldering.  Sounds like a pain but the few times I tried without it, I had trouble melting the old solder.  ==

Sounds about right. The QFR really is cake compared to Filco. Filco, you definitely have to add some solder to help it melt and suck up.

I like your avatar Xenderwind :D I've had multiple Asuka avatars in the past on this forum :D

:D  I usually notice who is posting by their avatars so I wasn't sure if I wanted to change mine, but I saw a lot of other people doing it recently so I didn't feel too bad.

But back on topic.  Couldn't you try removing the leds first and then the switches?  I don't know how other boards are but my led's were just through the holes in the top of the switch housing.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Wed, 14 August 2013, 03:28:18
Xender I keep thinking you're Vesper now since your avatar is practically the same as his old one.

God damn it guys can you please pick an anime that isn't Evangelion, I think there's at least 10 Evangelion avatars on this forum already.. :))
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Xenderwind on Wed, 14 August 2013, 03:38:11
Xender I keep thinking you're Vesper now since your avatar is practically the same as his old one.

God damn it guys can you please pick an anime that isn't Evangelion, I think there's at least 10 Evangelion avatars on this forum already.. :))

I hope you're happy.  I also thought about stealing your avatar for a couple hours.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: VesperSAINT on Wed, 14 August 2013, 03:39:08
I didn't really have any trouble using my soldapullt even on the led'ed switches.  But that was a QFR and apparently those are cake.  I just added new solder to each joint before desoldering.  Sounds like a pain but the few times I tried without it, I had trouble melting the old solder.  ==

Sounds about right. The QFR really is cake compared to Filco. Filco, you definitely have to add some solder to help it melt and suck up.

I like your avatar Xenderwind :D I've had multiple Asuka avatars in the past on this forum :D

:D  I usually notice who is posting by their avatars so I wasn't sure if I wanted to change mine, but I saw a lot of other people doing it recently so I didn't feel too bad.

But back on topic.  Couldn't you try removing the leds first and then the switches?  I don't know how other boards are but my led's were just through the holes in the top of the switch housing.

Yeah, the LED's should just drop out if desoldered all the way through. Tis why I desolder LED's first every time.

Xender I keep thinking you're Vesper now since your avatar is practically the same as his old one.

God damn it guys can you please pick an anime that isn't Evangelion, I think there's at least 10 Evangelion avatars on this forum already.. :))

You called? :-*

Xender I keep thinking you're Vesper now since your avatar is practically the same as his old one.

God damn it guys can you please pick an anime that isn't Evangelion, I think there's at least 10 Evangelion avatars on this forum already.. :))

I hope you're happy.  I also thought about stealing your avatar for a couple hours.

:)) I don't mind you using any avatar I've used in the past :D More Asuka lovin'!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photekq on Wed, 14 August 2013, 03:43:48
I hope you're happy.
Very :))
You called? :-*
:))

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Thu, 15 August 2013, 18:26:55
I'm having a problem desoldering Cherry MX plate mount switches.  It seems that when they soldered the board (Poker 2), the solder went very high up on the pins.  I'm using the Radio Shack desoldering iron with bulb now and it can't seem to melt the solder high up on the pins.  Also, it takes quite a bit of force to push the desoldered switches out.  Is this normal?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Thu, 15 August 2013, 20:13:34
I'm having a problem desoldering Cherry MX plate mount switches.  It seems that when they soldered the board (Poker 2), the solder went very high up on the pins.  I'm using the Radio Shack desoldering iron with bulb now and it can't seem to melt the solder high up on the pins.  Also, it takes quite a bit of force to push the desoldered switches out.  Is this normal?

For the board and what you're using, yes. 

Desoldering a poker and that desoldering tool made me hate humanity.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Thu, 15 August 2013, 20:42:43
I'm having a problem desoldering Cherry MX plate mount switches.  It seems that when they soldered the board (Poker 2), the solder went very high up on the pins.  I'm using the Radio Shack desoldering iron with bulb now and it can't seem to melt the solder high up on the pins.  Also, it takes quite a bit of force to push the desoldered switches out.  Is this normal?

For the board and what you're using, yes. 

Desoldering a poker and that desoldering tool made me hate humanity.

Are there any  better options before I go insane? 



 :blank:
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Thu, 15 August 2013, 20:45:08
I'm having a problem desoldering Cherry MX plate mount switches.  It seems that when they soldered the board (Poker 2), the solder went very high up on the pins.  I'm using the Radio Shack desoldering iron with bulb now and it can't seem to melt the solder high up on the pins.  Also, it takes quite a bit of force to push the desoldered switches out.  Is this normal?

For the board and what you're using, yes. 

Desoldering a poker and that desoldering tool made me hate humanity.

Are there any  better options before I go insane? 



 :blank:

Theoretically solder wick or a soldapullt.  Definitely a hakko fx808 or similar vacuum desoldering tool.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Thu, 15 August 2013, 21:03:40
aoyue 474a++!!!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Thu, 15 August 2013, 21:14:40
Do they have more suction?  I'm not sure what would be the best choice out of these options.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 16 August 2013, 02:25:28
the aoyue and 808 will definitely be competing for suction. the aoyue is cool because no one's purchased one yet and in theory is has a ton more space for vacuum pump and is easier to handle, with the station-pencil design. also it's parts-compatible with the very very good hakko 474, which was literally the step above the 808 in the hakko line for like 10 years
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 16 August 2013, 08:39:28
the aoyue and 808 will definitely be competing for suction. the aoyue is cool because no one's purchased one yet and in theory is has a ton more space for vacuum pump and is easier to handle, with the station-pencil design. also it's parts-compatible with the very very good hakko 474, which was literally the step above the 808 in the hakko line for like 10 years

Also, the Aoyue wins in another aspect, being that the suction pump isn't held in your hand, but is removed to the station base. Sometimes it feels slightly awkward holding that beast that is the 808, especially for long desoldering sessions.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Fri, 16 August 2013, 08:45:38
Don't tempt me!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Fri, 16 August 2013, 08:50:33
aoyue 474a++!!!

Do we have links to a great deal on this by any chance?  I didn't find anything posted previously in the thread so far, but maybe I missed it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 16 August 2013, 08:52:56
Don't tempt me!

Do it!



Also, if your new name is going to be MOZ, you have to change your avatar to something similar to this:

(http://blogs2.startribune.com/blogs/randball/files/2008/05/schur.jpg)
Michael Schur as character "Mose Schrute" from the American TV series, "The Office."



aoyue 474a++!!!

Do we have links to a great deal on this by any chance?  I didn't find anything posted previously in the thread so far, but maybe I missed it.

I found one on ebay for $130 plus shipping. Seems like a great deal to me. http://www.ebay.com/itm/121026164771
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Tarzan on Fri, 16 August 2013, 08:57:55
aoyue 474a++!!!

Do we have links to a great deal on this by any chance?  I didn't find anything posted previously in the thread so far, but maybe I missed it.

Looks like it's $99 at Amazon: http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Desoldering-Station/dp/B001UDBGSQ (http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Desoldering-Station/dp/B001UDBGSQ)

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Fri, 16 August 2013, 09:01:52
aoyue 474a++!!!

Do we have links to a great deal on this by any chance?  I didn't find anything posted previously in the thread so far, but maybe I missed it.

Looks like it's $99 at Amazon: http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Desoldering-Station/dp/B001UDBGSQ (http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Desoldering-Station/dp/B001UDBGSQ)



Oh hot damn. I might pick one of these up at some point down the road!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Fri, 16 August 2013, 09:03:14
aoyue 474a++!!!

Do we have links to a great deal on this by any chance?  I didn't find anything posted previously in the thread so far, but maybe I missed it.

Looks like it's $99 at Amazon: http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Desoldering-Station/dp/B001UDBGSQ (http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Desoldering-Station/dp/B001UDBGSQ)



yeah ......about that....shipping on that one is $92

this one

http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC (http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC)

comes out to ~$148 shipped

but both are sold by third parties
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Fri, 16 August 2013, 09:07:12
Don't tempt me!

Do it!



Also, if your new name is going to be MOZ, you have to change your avatar to something similar to this:

Show Image
(http://blogs2.startribune.com/blogs/randball/files/2008/05/schur.jpg)

Michael Schur as character "Mose Schrute" from the American TV series, "The Office."
http://assets0.ordienetworks.com/images/GifGuide/michael_scott/The-Office-gifs-the-office-14948948-240-196.gif
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Fri, 16 August 2013, 09:18:23
yeah ......about that....shipping on that one is $92

this one

http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC (http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC)

comes out to ~$148 shipped

but both are sold by third parties

Hmmm...I will keep that one in mind for when I finally purchase...thanks!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Fri, 16 August 2013, 09:36:38
yeah ......about that....shipping on that one is $92

this one

http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC (http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC)

comes out to ~$148 shipped

but both are sold by third parties

Hmmm...I will keep that one in mind for when I finally purchase...thanks!

Someone is selling an FX888D w/ Kester 44 and an FX808 in the classifieds, $115 and $140 respectively.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Fri, 16 August 2013, 09:39:15
yeah ......about that....shipping on that one is $92

this one

http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC (http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC)

comes out to ~$148 shipped

but both are sold by third parties

Hmmm...I will keep that one in mind for when I finally purchase...thanks!

Someone is selling an FX888D w/ Kester 44 and an FX808 in the classifieds, $115 and $140 respectively.

I know that 808 so tempting.....
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 16 August 2013, 09:46:41
yeah ......about that....shipping on that one is $92

this one

http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC (http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC)

comes out to ~$148 shipped

but both are sold by third parties

Hmmm...I will keep that one in mind for when I finally purchase...thanks!

Someone is selling an FX888D w/ Kester 44 and an FX808 in the classifieds, $115 and $140 respectively.

I know that 808 so tempting.....

Do it! You won't regret. :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Fri, 16 August 2013, 09:47:51
yeah ......about that....shipping on that one is $92

this one

http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC (http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC)

comes out to ~$148 shipped

but both are sold by third parties

Hmmm...I will keep that one in mind for when I finally purchase...thanks!

Someone is selling an FX888D w/ Kester 44 and an FX808 in the classifieds, $115 and $140 respectively.

I know that 808 so tempting.....

Do it! You won't regret. :)

well I know 'someday' I'm going to end up desoldering a backlit board and then it would come in handy!

I've got all this stuff I'm 'going' to do 'someday'.....right now it all sits in boxes.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 16 August 2013, 09:52:05
yeah ......about that....shipping on that one is $92

this one

http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC (http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC)

comes out to ~$148 shipped

but both are sold by third parties

Hmmm...I will keep that one in mind for when I finally purchase...thanks!

Someone is selling an FX888D w/ Kester 44 and an FX808 in the classifieds, $115 and $140 respectively.

I know that 808 so tempting.....

Do it! You won't regret. :)

well I know 'someday' I'm going to end up desoldering a backlit board and then it would come in handy!

I've got all this stuff I'm 'going' to do 'someday'.....right now it all sits in boxes.

You and me both, brother. You and me both.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Fri, 16 August 2013, 09:56:04
yeah ......about that....shipping on that one is $92

this one

http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC (http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC)

comes out to ~$148 shipped

but both are sold by third parties

Hmmm...I will keep that one in mind for when I finally purchase...thanks!

Someone is selling an FX888D w/ Kester 44 and an FX808 in the classifieds, $115 and $140 respectively.

Whaaaaa, how did I miss that?  I will check it out!  Thanks.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Fri, 16 August 2013, 09:58:41
yeah ......about that....shipping on that one is $92

this one

http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC (http://www.amazon.com/Aoyue-474A-Digital-Desoldering-Station/dp/B00ABJ4AEC)

comes out to ~$148 shipped

but both are sold by third parties

Hmmm...I will keep that one in mind for when I finally purchase...thanks!

Someone is selling an FX888D w/ Kester 44 and an FX808 in the classifieds, $115 and $140 respectively.

I know that 808 so tempting.....

Do it! You won't regret. :)

well I know 'someday' I'm going to end up desoldering a backlit board and then it would come in handy!

I've got all this stuff I'm 'going' to do 'someday'.....right now it all sits in boxes.

You and me both, brother. You and me both.

If there's one thing being in the Boyscouts for a few years taught me, it was "Be Prepared" And when you're prepared, always have the best possible thing to use for said occasion :))
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Fri, 16 August 2013, 10:09:06
If there's one thing being in the Boyscouts for a few years taught me, it was "Be Prepared" And when you're prepared, always have the best possible thing to use for said occasion :))

QFT!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Fri, 16 August 2013, 10:11:10
If there's one thing being in the Boyscouts for a few years taught me, it was "Be Prepared" And when you're prepared, always have the best possible thing to use for said occasion :))

QFT!

What is this QFT?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 16 August 2013, 10:11:48
If there's one thing being in the Boyscouts for a few years taught me, it was "Be Prepared" And when you're prepared, always have the best possible thing to use for said occasion :))

QFT!

What is this QFT?

Quoted For Truth. :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: oTurtlez on Fri, 16 August 2013, 10:12:54
If there's one thing being in the Boyscouts for a few years taught me, it was "Be Prepared" And when you're prepared, always have the best possible thing to use for said occasion :))

QFT!

What is this QFT?

Quoted For Truth. :D

I'm flattered haha. Thanks for clearing that up :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: ApocalypseMaow on Fri, 16 August 2013, 13:16:03
Dudes! I just ordered a Aoyue 937+, so stoked.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: kaiserreich on Fri, 16 August 2013, 23:43:42
I'm having a problem desoldering Cherry MX plate mount switches.  It seems that when they soldered the board (Poker 2), the solder went very high up on the pins.  I'm using the Radio Shack desoldering iron with bulb now and it can't seem to melt the solder high up on the pins.  Also, it takes quite a bit of force to push the desoldered switches out.  Is this normal?

Is your iron hot enough to melt Pb-free solder?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Sat, 17 August 2013, 15:29:03
I'm having a problem desoldering Cherry MX plate mount switches.  It seems that when they soldered the board (Poker 2), the solder went very high up on the pins.  I'm using the Radio Shack desoldering iron with bulb now and it can't seem to melt the solder high up on the pins.  Also, it takes quite a bit of force to push the desoldered switches out.  Is this normal?

Is your iron hot enough to melt Pb-free solder?


Yes.

Also, I just bought a Hakko 808 kit from eBay.  I hope it works :P
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheSoulhunter on Sat, 17 August 2013, 20:14:09
I'm having a problem desoldering Cherry MX plate mount switches.  It seems that when they soldered the board (Poker 2), the solder went very high up on the pins.  I'm using the Radio Shack desoldering iron with bulb now and it can't seem to melt the solder high up on the pins.  Also, it takes quite a bit of force to push the desoldered switches out.  Is this normal?

Is your iron hot enough to melt Pb-free solder?


Yes.

Also, I just bought a Hakko 808 kit from eBay.  I hope it works :P

Good decision...
If it takes "quite a bit of force" to push the switches out that probably means some solder was left -> Risk of ripping a solder pad off -> B0rked PCB
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: JonasDK on Sun, 18 August 2013, 15:33:12
I'm on the lookout for a cheap station, and i can't get my hands on the recommended ones. I did some digging and found some, but i don't know if they're any good. Do anyone know something about this (http://www.conradelektronik.dk/KOMPAKT-LODDESTATION-BASETECHZD-99---48-W.htm?websale7=conrad-dk&pi=588415&Ctx={ver%2F7%2Fver}{st%2F3ec%2Fst}{cmd%2F0%2Fcmd}{m%2Fwebsale%2Fm}{s%2Fconrad-dk%2Fs}{l%2F02-aa%2Fl}{sf%2F%3Cs1%3Eloddestation%3C%2Fs1%3E%2Fsf}{p1%2F57533aec61131da5cd241d7dccbf1c7d%2Fp1}{md5%2Fbc43e768e9fb095f9e003029b1535cc6%2Fmd5}) and this (http://www.conradelektronik.dk/BASETECH-KOMPAKT-LODDESTATIONJLT-13-230-V%2fAC-EFFEKT-40-W-TEMPERATUROMR%c5DE-150---420-%b0C.htm?websale7=conrad-dk&pi=588437&Ctx=%7Bver%2F7%2Fver%7D%7Bst%2F3ec%2Fst%7D%7Bcmd%2F0%2Fcmd%7D%7Bm%2Fwebsale%2Fm%7D%7Bs%2Fconrad-dk%2Fs%7D%7Bl%2F02-aa%2Fl%7D%7Bsf%2F%3Cs1%3Eloddestation%3C%2Fs1%3E%2Fsf%7D%7Bp1%2F57533aec61131da5cd241d7dccbf1c7d%2Fp1%7D%7Bmd5%2Fbc43e768e9fb095f9e003029b1535cc6%2Fmd5%7D) station?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: vun on Sun, 18 August 2013, 15:39:14
I'm on the lookout for a cheap station, and i can't get my hands on the recommended ones. I did some digging and found some, but i don't know if they're any good. Do anyone know something about this (http://www.conradelektronik.dk/KOMPAKT-LODDESTATION-BASETECHZD-99---48-W.htm?websale7=conrad-dk&pi=588415&Ctx={ver%2F7%2Fver}{st%2F3ec%2Fst}{cmd%2F0%2Fcmd}{m%2Fwebsale%2Fm}{s%2Fconrad-dk%2Fs}{l%2F02-aa%2Fl}{sf%2F%3Cs1%3Eloddestation%3C%2Fs1%3E%2Fsf}{p1%2F57533aec61131da5cd241d7dccbf1c7d%2Fp1}{md5%2Fbc43e768e9fb095f9e003029b1535cc6%2Fmd5}) and this (http://www.conradelektronik.dk/BASETECH-KOMPAKT-LODDESTATIONJLT-13-230-V%2fAC-EFFEKT-40-W-TEMPERATUROMR%c5DE-150---420-%b0C.htm?websale7=conrad-dk&pi=588437&Ctx=%7Bver%2F7%2Fver%7D%7Bst%2F3ec%2Fst%7D%7Bcmd%2F0%2Fcmd%7D%7Bm%2Fwebsale%2Fm%7D%7Bs%2Fconrad-dk%2Fs%7D%7Bl%2F02-aa%2Fl%7D%7Bsf%2F%3Cs1%3Eloddestation%3C%2Fs1%3E%2Fsf%7D%7Bp1%2F57533aec61131da5cd241d7dccbf1c7d%2Fp1%7D%7Bmd5%2Fbc43e768e9fb095f9e003029b1535cc6%2Fmd5%7D) station?

They look like WLC-100 clones, I'd recommend taking a look at this (http://www.biltema.dk/da/Vaerktoj/Svejsning-og-lodning/Loddevarktoj/Loddestation-19727/). It's the one I have, I haven't used it all that much but it's been brilliant so far, and I have a friend who does a bunch of small electronics soldering with his. Bit more pricey than the ones you linked, but worth it I'd say.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: JonasDK on Sun, 18 August 2013, 15:58:19

They look like WLC-100 clones, I'd recommend taking a look at this (http://www.biltema.dk/da/Vaerktoj/Svejsning-og-lodning/Loddevarktoj/Loddestation-19727/). It's the one I have, I haven't used it all that much but it's been brilliant so far, and I have a friend who does a bunch of small electronics soldering with his. Bit more pricey than the ones you linked, but worth it I'd say.

It's about 5 times more expensive than the other ones  :eek:!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: yasuo on Mon, 19 August 2013, 01:17:39
what name of this tool, it seems for desoldering
(http://www.lowpoly.com/keyboard/m0110/m0110_060.jpg)
That owned lowpoly
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: gnubag on Mon, 19 August 2013, 01:24:11
what name of this tool, it seems for desoldering
Show Image
(http://www.lowpoly.com/keyboard/m0110/m0110_060.jpg)

That owned lowpoly

it is not for desoldering. it is for compressed air.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheSoulhunter on Mon, 19 August 2013, 02:11:12
what name of this tool, it seems for desoldering
Show Image
(http://www.lowpoly.com/keyboard/m0110/m0110_060.jpg)

That owned lowpoly


That's what I use to clean my clothes after work...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: rarar on Mon, 19 August 2013, 15:11:34
Gonna get into soldering soon :) just need to save for a while to be able to get the stuff I need to solder properly :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Mon, 19 August 2013, 15:29:28
Gonna get into soldering soon :) just need to save for a while to be able to get the stuff I need to solder properly :)

You can do quality soldering with the cheap tools, it's just a bit harder and maybe time consuming to get it just right.  It might be beneficial to get some experience on the cheaper tools.

What I mean is, you've already got an iron, so you can "get into it" right now.  :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Mon, 19 August 2013, 15:30:41
And if you learn how to solder well with a cheap iron, imagine how much easier it will be when you get proper equipment! :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MJ45 on Mon, 19 August 2013, 16:17:51
Gonna get into soldering soon :) just need to save for a while to be able to get the stuff I need to solder properly :)
Practice on some old electronic stuff (everybody's got some) that you wont worry about ruining. Watch some how to videos, WFD has some good ones. Good tools help but developing you skills is most important, and that takes practice.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: vun on Mon, 19 August 2013, 18:51:48
Gonna get into soldering soon :) just need to save for a while to be able to get the stuff I need to solder properly :)
Practice on some old electronic stuff (everybody's got some) that you wont worry about ruining. Watch some how to videos, WFD has some good ones. Good tools help but developing you skills is most important, and that takes practice.

I found the EEVBlog videos to be incredibly helpful for learning the basics of soldering, although his videos are aimed at aspiring engineers so just keep in mind that you can get away with cheaper soldering gear for basic soldering.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Mon, 19 August 2013, 21:05:12
what name of this tool, it seems for desoldering
(http://www.atslab.com/images/calibrations/slideshow-img-on-class-pages/calibration-hand-tools.jpg)
 :))
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: gnubag on Mon, 19 August 2013, 21:27:42
what name of this tool, it seems for desoldering
Show Image
(http://www.atslab.com/images/calibrations/slideshow-img-on-class-pages/calibration-hand-tools.jpg)

 :))

it works, trust me.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: rarar on Mon, 19 August 2013, 23:01:04
Gonna get into soldering soon :) just need to save for a while to be able to get the stuff I need to solder properly :)
Practice on some old electronic stuff (everybody's got some) that you wont worry about ruining. Watch some how to videos, WFD has some good ones. Good tools help but developing you skills is most important, and that takes practice.

I found the EEVBlog videos to be incredibly helpful for learning the basics of soldering, although his videos are aimed at aspiring engineers so just keep in mind that you can get away with cheaper soldering gear for basic soldering.
I've watched his part 1 and 2 on soldering, its quite helpful :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Tue, 20 August 2013, 01:14:40
And if you learn how to solder well with a cheap iron, imagine how much easier it will be when you get proper equipment! :D

I know a bunch of labour guys working at my uncle's electronics factory and they all use $3 cheap irons, and they use it like pros, I can only imagine what they would do with proper equipment, wield it like a sword.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Tue, 20 August 2013, 01:26:10
And if you learn how to solder well with a cheap iron, imagine how much easier it will be when you get proper equipment! :D

I know a bunch of labour guys working at my uncle's electronics factory and they all use $3 cheap irons, and they use it like pros, I can only imagine what they would do with proper equipment, wield it like a sword.

They'd break it. :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Tue, 20 August 2013, 01:39:48
And if you learn how to solder well with a cheap iron, imagine how much easier it will be when you get proper equipment! :D

I know a bunch of labour guys working at my uncle's electronics factory and they all use $3 cheap irons, and they use it like pros, I can only imagine what they would do with proper equipment, wield it like a sword.

They'd break it. :)

Hahahahaha
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: yasuo on Tue, 20 August 2013, 06:13:41
what name of this tool, it seems for desoldering
Show Image
(http://www.atslab.com/images/calibrations/slideshow-img-on-class-pages/calibration-hand-tools.jpg)

 :))
:)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :))
The Living Joke Thread it seems  ^-^
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Tue, 20 August 2013, 06:15:55
what name of this tool, it seems for desoldering
Show Image
(http://www.atslab.com/images/calibrations/slideshow-img-on-class-pages/calibration-hand-tools.jpg)

 :))

That's what you use to pop the switches out of the plate. ;)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Tue, 20 August 2013, 18:12:40
what name of this tool, it seems for desoldering
Show Image
(http://www.atslab.com/images/calibrations/slideshow-img-on-class-pages/calibration-hand-tools.jpg)

 :))

That's what you use to pop the switches out of the plate. ;)

Looks a lot easier than using this to pop them out:
(https://okl.scene7.com/is/image/OKL/Product_AKA00115_Image_1?$product$)
 ^-^
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: hasu on Wed, 21 August 2013, 21:58:07
 How do you apply flux to PCB pad? With syringe, brush or pen? Post pic of your equipment and your experience!

I had used this brush with risk of spill out of bottle flux, but I'm happy with BON pen now :)
(http://i.imgur.com/VtHnxV9l.jpg)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Thu, 22 August 2013, 00:07:40
Got the Hakko 808 desoldering gun.  It made short work of everything.  Still had to press a bit to get the switches to pop out though, but nothing was too stubborn.  It did however lift a pad off the board :C , but at least it was a double sided board. 

Does anyone know how to fix the pad? 
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Thu, 22 August 2013, 07:38:49
How do you apply flux to PCB pad? With syringe, brush or pen? Post pic of your equipment and your experience!

I had used this brush with risk of spill out of bottle flux, but I'm happy with BON pen now :)
Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/VtHnxV9l.jpg)

i use a small luer lock squeeze bottle with a 27ga needle. even then, if i just heat up the needle a little with the iron, the flux will flow to the point where i just kind of direct the flow and it covers everything i point the needle at. this is with MG Chem rosin flux. I buy big bulk bottles of the stuff and then fill my applicator bottle with the needle. this is also for thru-hole components. i think a fine brush or just plain old solder paste would be better if i were doing smt

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mashby on Thu, 22 August 2013, 09:44:49
Does anyone know how to fix the pad?

I did the same thing on one of my Poker's, so I'm curious of how people have fixed this in the past as well.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Thu, 22 August 2013, 09:52:51
Got the Hakko 808 desoldering gun.  It made short work of everything.  Still had to press a bit to get the switches to pop out though, but nothing was too stubborn.  It did however lift a pad off the board :C , but at least it was a double sided board. 

Does anyone know how to fix the pad? 

If you lifted the pad, that means you either applied too much heat, pressure, left it on too long, or combinations of all 3. Pads/traces have some kind of glue or adhesive, every time you solder or desolder will weaken the adhesive. If it's already lifted and NOT double sided, then you'll have to bridge the connection with a circuit trace pen or with a small wire.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Thu, 22 August 2013, 15:29:00
and circuit trace pens are a HUGE PITA
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: hasu on Thu, 22 August 2013, 15:42:38
i use a small luer lock squeeze bottle with a 27ga needle. even then, if i just heat up the needle a little with the iron, the flux will flow to the point where i just kind of direct the flow and it covers everything i point the needle at. this is with MG Chem rosin flux. I buy big bulk bottles of the stuff and then fill my applicator bottle with the needle. this is also for thru-hole components. i think a fine brush or just plain old solder paste would be better if i were doing smt

Squeeze bottle with needle sounds better to handle than syringe. I didn't see people using it around here yet. I'll try to find and get it later. Thanks.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mashby on Thu, 22 August 2013, 18:33:22
Below is a closeup shot of the pad that I pulled off of my Poker. The keys that are affected are the  - [ and '

(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7377/9570448155_77b9350598_z.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/compactkey/9570448155/)
Pulled A Pad (http://www.flickr.com/photos/compactkey/9570448155/) by cpkey (http://www.flickr.com/people/compactkey/), on Flickr

Looking at the bottom of the PCB (http://www.flickr.com/photos/compactkey/9570448837/) I see that there is a trace connecting them all together, but my best guess is that what I need to bridge is the pad between the "0" and the "-". At least that what it looks like if I look at an undamaged PCB.

(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7309/9570449899_84525f1f04_z.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/compactkey/9570449899/)
What It Should Look Like (http://www.flickr.com/photos/compactkey/9570449899/) by cpkey (http://www.flickr.com/people/compactkey/), on Flickr

Am I on the right track?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: gnubag on Thu, 22 August 2013, 19:18:48
Show Image
Below is a closeup shot of the pad that I pulled off of my Poker. The keys that are affected are the  - [ and '

(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7377/9570448155_77b9350598_z.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/compactkey/9570448155/)

Pulled A Pad (http://www.flickr.com/photos/compactkey/9570448155/) by cpkey (http://www.flickr.com/people/compactkey/), on Flickr

Looking at the bottom of the PCB (http://www.flickr.com/photos/compactkey/9570448837/) I see that there is a trace connecting them all together, but my best guess is that what I need to bridge is the pad between the "0" and the "-". At least that what it looks like if I look at an undamaged PCB.

(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7309/9570449899_84525f1f04_z.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/compactkey/9570449899/)
What It Should Look Like (http://www.flickr.com/photos/compactkey/9570449899/) by cpkey (http://www.flickr.com/people/compactkey/), on Flickr

Am I on the right track?

yes.
if you still doubt yourself you can plug the keyboard in and test it with a paperclip or something as a bridge.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mashby on Thu, 22 August 2013, 19:23:14
yes.
if you still doubt yourself you can plug the keyboard in and test it with a paperclip or something as a bridge.

Thanks gnubag.

So I'm guessing I need to solder a wire to the respective pin on each switch. Or at least to the pin on the missing pad and then I could solder the wire to the pad on the undamaged switch?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Thu, 22 August 2013, 19:51:52
yes.
if you still doubt yourself you can plug the keyboard in and test it with a paperclip or something as a bridge.

Thanks gnubag.

So I'm guessing I need to solder a wire to the respective pin on each switch. Or at least to the pin on the missing pad and then I could solder the wire to the pad on the undamaged switch?

Correct.

Did you pull up the trace? The Poker PCB is double sided, right? Shouldn't it be okay if the other side pad is still there?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Thu, 22 August 2013, 20:24:18
yah isn't that an unnecessary pad?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mashby on Thu, 22 August 2013, 20:42:50
yah isn't that an unnecessary pad?

You tell me.

Those three keys don't work and that's the only thing I've seen that could be causing it. Diodes check out, switches are good.  :-\
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Thu, 22 August 2013, 23:02:02
Haven't seen a Poker PCB up close, however if there are tracks joining on the side you lifted the pad, then it won't work.

As for those asking about flux, I use good old solder paste, applied using a toothbrush and once everything is done, I brush the pCB clean with some unleaded clean petrol.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: hasu on Fri, 23 August 2013, 03:05:37
mashby,
From poker's matrix, - , 0, p, [, ; and ' should be connected each other and share same colum line. Check connectivity and find bad trace with multimeter.

I hope this helps you somewhat.

Code: [Select]
Poker Mod Resource
==================
2013/01/02

Key Matrix pins
---------------
These key events are observed with xev command on Xorg/Linux.
PCB says "Fn Keyboard Rev 1.2". Column pins are active low and Row pins are input with pull-up.

    R\C|7       8       9       10      15      16      23      24      25      26      27      28      36
    ---+----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    3  |z       x       c       v       m       ,       .       (P6)    Fn      (9)     (8)     (?)     RCtrl
    4  |(*1)    (*2)    (*3)    b       n       (X)     App     (P7)    (1)     (PgUp)  /       (RAlt)  (4)
    5  |`       (F1)    (F2)    5       6       =       (F8)    (P4)    (6)     (PgDn)  -       (?)     LCtrl
    6  |1       2       3       4       7       8       9       (Left)  (X)     (X)     0       (*4)    (F5)
    43 |q       w       e       r       u       i       o       (Right) (X)     (5)     p       (SclLk) (Pause)
    44 |Tab     (CapLk) (F3)    t       y       ]       (F7)    LShift  (3)     LWin    [       (?)     (7)
    45 |a       s       d       f       j       k       l       RShift  Rwin    (4)     ;       (?)     (6)
    46 |(Esc)   (,)     (F4)    g       h       (F6)    (X)     (Down)  (2)     (0)     '       LAlt    (5)
    ( ): not real keys
    (X): no key event
    (?): unclear(media key?)
    *1: Muhenkan
    *2: Henkan-Mode
    *3: Hiragana-katakana
    *4: ScreenShot event?


LED pins and resistors
----------------------
Esc:            13(active low), R15(1.5KOhm)
CapsLock:       17(active low), R8(1.5KOhm)
Spc, Arrows:    14(active low), R13(1.5KOhm) for 4 LEDs


DIP switche pins
----------------
Turning switch on makes line pull down to ground.
SW1:            47(input with pull-up)
SW2:            30(input with pull-up)
SW3:            1(input with pull-up)
SW4:            2(input with pull-up)

EDIT: fixed at matrix(4,27)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 23 August 2013, 06:55:25
yah isn't that an unnecessary pad?

You tell me.

Those three keys don't work and that's the only thing I've seen that could be causing it. Diodes check out, switches are good.  :-\
pic of back of board tehre?

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: hasu on Fri, 23 August 2013, 07:12:37
pic of back of board tehre?

I just got home and took a pic, this is backside of my Poker PCB.
It seems there is bad connection between 0 and - key on mashby's Poker. It should be patched with short wire there.
(http://i.imgur.com/DjOaoqKl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/DjOaoqK.jpg)

EDIT: I was confused and missed context of conversation. Ignore me.
SW99 pad was clearly damaged and lost conection between SW99(-) and SW113(0). I missed completely.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mashby on Fri, 23 August 2013, 08:01:21
pic of back of board tehre?

I linked to it in my earlier post, but here's a photo of the bottom of the PCB

(http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5334/9570449343_e60a439ff0_z.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/compactkey/9570449343/)
Another Closeup (http://www.flickr.com/photos/compactkey/9570449343/) by cpkey (http://www.flickr.com/people/compactkey/), on Flickr


It seems there is bad connection between 0 and - key on mashby's Poker. It should be patched with short wire there.

EDIT: I was confused and missed context of conversation. Ignore me.
SW99 pad was clearly damaged and lost conection between SW99(-) and SW113(0). I missed completely.

Thanks hash, that was my guess, but it's good to hear it confirmed from others smarter than me. I'll play with it this weekend and see if a jumper does the trick.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 23 August 2013, 08:03:26
see that dark joint on the plus where you stripped the pad on the other side? that's a classic cold joint. it has microfractures in it that prevent it from conducting properly. reflow it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Fri, 23 August 2013, 16:20:23
He striped the pad on the -, and the problem is the joint between - and 0 has been destroyed, as the pad on the front of the PCB was connecting the - and the 0.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Fri, 23 August 2013, 21:42:30
yah i see it now. that's a completely ridiculous design. but ok whatever. i would actually dig into the top layer to expose some copper and then use either a gigantic glob of solder or some conductive epoxy to bridge between the pin/pad that still exists and the trace that should just be attached to it with a via.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: rarar on Fri, 23 August 2013, 22:17:02
BTW, does anyone in the MN area have a hakko 888 I could borrow for a day or two so I could try it out before buying? :)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Fri, 23 August 2013, 23:45:39
BTW, does anyone in the MN area have a hakko 888 I could borrow for a day or two so I could try it out before buying? :)

Rarar: I will be in mpls is a week and I will have a 888D.  PM me if you're interested in trying it.  :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: rarar on Fri, 23 August 2013, 23:49:13
BTW, does anyone in the MN area have a hakko 888 I could borrow for a day or two so I could try it out before buying? :)

Rarar: I will be in mpls is a week and I will have a 888D.  PM me if you're interested in trying it.  :D
OHBOYOHBOYOHBOY
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Sat, 24 August 2013, 05:43:54
yah i see it now. that's a completely ridiculous design. but ok whatever. i would actually dig into the top layer to expose some copper and then use either a gigantic glob of solder or some conductive epoxy to bridge between the pin/pad that still exists and the trace that should just be attached to it with a via.

Yeah, just expose some copper on that trace (Be very careful) and use a large blob of solder, or better would be to use a bridge. I made a small mistake with my ErgoDox TRRS connector and then used an LED leg to create a quickfix. I'll post picture later.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 24 August 2013, 08:51:13
conductive epoxy = ye olde jb weld btw
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 24 August 2013, 08:51:36
BTW, does anyone in the MN area have a hakko 888 I could borrow for a day or two so I could try it out before buying? :)

Rarar: I will be in mpls is a week and I will have a 888D.  PM me if you're interested in trying it.  :D
OHBOYOHBOYOHBOY

HOFF, MAN OF MYSTERY has your back bro

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tricheboars on Mon, 26 August 2013, 16:37:15
so.... i got a Edsyn Deluxe Soldapullt and it is great. i love it. this is the one i got:
 http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0019V5HRA/ref=oh_details_o09_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0019V5HRA/ref=oh_details_o09_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1)

but i am seriously damaging the plastic tip of the soldapullt when i desolder. it is melted. it still works great but i am thinking i want to get a metal tip for it rather than plastic.  anyone upgraded their edsyn before and want to enlighten me? which tip did you get and why?

also i am looking to get a smaller tip for my hakko 888 for LEDs. i find the stock tip to be perfect for almost everything but LEDs. what size do y'all recommend and links are always appreciated. especailly amazon ones.  :p

also i want to reiterate that kester 44 is the jam. it is just fantastic solder.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: damorgue on Tue, 27 August 2013, 05:09:11
Anyone know of a good source of eutectic solder in EU? I am running out and am unable to find any for a reasonable price. Most stores appear to have decreased or completely removed theirs election of solders with led. I don't have to comply to ROHS, just looking for some plain 63/37.

Edit: With EU, I just meant reasonably cheap to ship to Sweden. EU also means less hassle with customs fees.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Tue, 27 August 2013, 05:13:12
if someone sends you say a lb of NOS kester 44 from the US, are the rohs EU police going to put you under lead arrest? ;)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: damorgue on Tue, 27 August 2013, 05:19:56
I would have tried buying it from Ebay already if it weren't for the shipping fees which cost roughly the same as the item. That and the possibility that the customs fee is larger than normal. It is still about half the price of the only source I have found locally, EVEN WITH CROSS-POND SHIPPING AND 25% CUSTOMS FEE TAKEN INTO ACCOUNT. I find this unreasonable- All my hopes currently go to Germany as they usually keep their **** together.

Grrr, I should have bought bulk last time mumble muble /grudge
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: vun on Tue, 27 August 2013, 06:01:47
I would have tried buying it from Ebay already if it weren't for the shipping fees which cost roughly the same as the item. That and the possibility that the customs fee is larger than normal. It is still about half the price of the only source I have found locally, EVEN WITH CROSS-POND SHIPPING AND 25% CUSTOMS FEE TAKEN INTO ACCOUNT. I find this unreasonable- All my hopes currently go to Germany as they usually keep their **** together.

Grrr, I should have bought bulk last time mumble muble /grudge

There are some sources in Norway that have 63/37, shipping to Sweden probably isn't a problem, although I don't really know.
So far I've seen 63/37 here (http://www.krepro.no/loddetraad-sn63pb37.html) and here (http://www.emagenturer.no/?PageID=666&ItemID=794).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Thu, 29 August 2013, 02:32:03
Holy crap you guys.  Hakko 808 desoldering gun has changed my life.  Seriously, this thing is absolutely amazing...desolder pads in literally 2 seconds, super clean and smooth.  Wow.  I'm so happy right now.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Thu, 29 August 2013, 02:43:15
Holy crap you guys.  Hakko 808 desoldering gun has changed my life.  Seriously, this thing is absolutely amazing...desolder pads in literally 2 seconds, super clean and smooth.  Wow.  I'm so happy right now.

Same, though I ran out of things to desolder. :c
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheSoulhunter on Thu, 29 August 2013, 06:23:43
Holy crap you guys.  Hakko 808 desoldering gun has changed my life.  Seriously, this thing is absolutely amazing...desolder pads in literally 2 seconds, super clean and smooth.  Wow.  I'm so happy right now.

Same, though I ran out of things to desolder. :c

Offer desolder service to get back what ya paid for the Hakko...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Thu, 29 August 2013, 22:00:22
Or you can rent those out :D
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: HoffmanMyster on Fri, 30 August 2013, 02:08:58
Or you can rent those out :D

Rent out the 808?  I'd consider that...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Photoelectric on Fri, 30 August 2013, 09:34:30
Yeah, the desoldering part is a major inconvenience when it comes to copper-reinforced through-holes and tiny LED hole sizes, so Im sure those fancy desoldering guns would be awesome.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Noko on Fri, 30 August 2013, 20:15:19
Does anyone know anything about the Yihua 937D? 
I was trying to get the 936 from Hobbyking but the shipping+customs fees to Canada would be at least 3 times more than it costs :/
So I found this for sale from Canada on Ebay:
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Digital-Soldering-Station-937D-with-Cel-Feh-Switch-6-Iron-Tip-More-SMD-50W-/121144589108?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_2&hash=item1c34c7bb34

Would this be a worthwhile purchase?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: argyakrivos on Fri, 06 September 2013, 09:50:28
Hey guys, I'm looking to buy a soldering gun / station for my phantom keyboard. I know that almost everyone suggests Weller WLC100, but it is not as easy to find in the UK.

I just found this one: DURATOOL 1296771 Soldering Station (http://uk.farnell.com/jsp/search/productdetail.jsp?sku=1737234) + some goodies.

What are your thoughts on this one? Is it a good alternative to Weller WLC100? They look quite similar to me in terms of specs, but since this is my first buy I thought I should ask your opinion.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Fri, 06 September 2013, 10:20:37
Hey guys, I'm looking to buy a soldering gun / station for my phantom keyboard. I know that almost everyone suggests Weller WLC100, but it is not as easy to find in the UK.

I just found this one: DURATOOL 1296771 Soldering Station (http://uk.farnell.com/jsp/search/productdetail.jsp?sku=1737234) + some goodies.

What are your thoughts on this one? Is it a good alternative to Weller WLC100? They look quite similar to me in terms of specs, but since this is my first buy I thought I should ask your opinion.


Not many people actually recommend the Weller WLC-100. The Weller WES(D)-51 is a nice tool, and for the people who already own a WLC-100 that is fine - I'm not knocking your selection, but I wouldn't recommend it for someone looking to purchase a new station.

I know after shipping and VAT, this will be more expensive, but I would recommend this Hakko FX-888D (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/171115482359), which is about the same price.

Or you could look for a Yihua 936 from China, like this one (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/300921032126).

Maybe you can find a used Hakko 936 somewhere near you? Also, Aoyue 936/937 are worth checking into.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: argyakrivos on Fri, 06 September 2013, 12:28:05
Hey guys, I'm looking to buy a soldering gun / station for my phantom keyboard. I know that almost everyone suggests Weller WLC100, but it is not as easy to find in the UK.

I just found this one: DURATOOL 1296771 Soldering Station (http://uk.farnell.com/jsp/search/productdetail.jsp?sku=1737234) + some goodies.

What are your thoughts on this one? Is it a good alternative to Weller WLC100? They look quite similar to me in terms of specs, but since this is my first buy I thought I should ask your opinion.


Not many people actually recommend the Weller WLC-100. The Weller WES(D)-51 is a nice tool, and for the people who already own a WLC-100 that is fine - I'm not knocking your selection, but I wouldn't recommend it for someone looking to purchase a new station.

I know after shipping and VAT, this will be more expensive, but I would recommend this Hakko FX-888D (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/171115482359), which is about the same price.

Or you could look for a Yihua 936 from China, like this one (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/300921032126).

Maybe you can find a used Hakko 936 somewhere near you? Also, Aoyue 936/937 are worth checking into.

To get Hakko here I will have to pay almost double the price. I couldn't find any Hakko in the UK (new or used) in a reasonable price.

I did find Aoyue 397+ (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/231032924912) for about £47.5. Should I go for this? or the Yihua from China? It should be around the same price.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SeriouSSpotS on Sat, 07 September 2013, 15:04:53
Does the wattage of a soldering iron matter?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Sat, 07 September 2013, 15:06:38
Does the wattage of a soldering iron matter?

The higher the wattage, the better the iron recovers from heat loss.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SeriouSSpotS on Sat, 07 September 2013, 15:12:18
I see, thank you
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jonathanyu on Sat, 07 September 2013, 17:07:33
Hakko FX888D and FX888, which one will be better? seems the button on the FX888D will break much easier than FX888
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sat, 07 September 2013, 17:45:18
go with the D. the D is calibratable and has a more accurate temperature regulator. you will not be pushing the buttons enough for their construction to matter.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jonathanyu on Sat, 07 September 2013, 17:53:39
go with the D. the D is calibratable and has a more accurate temperature regulator. you will not be pushing the buttons enough for their construction to matter.
thanks! I will go with the 888D.  :D and it is cheaper than the 888
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: StrikeEagleCC on Sat, 07 September 2013, 22:00:05
If you're looking for tips, Techspray makes a "Plato" line of tips compatible with the Hakko FX-888(D) that I've had great experience with.

http://www.techspray.com/controls/techspray.tds/tds.ashx?id=132 (http://www.techspray.com/controls/techspray.tds/tds.ashx?id=132) (links to a pdf)

They are available on Mouser in individual pieces.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jonathanyu on Sun, 08 September 2013, 00:34:01
Do you guys like to use point tip or screwdriver tip more? I found that point tip is not really useful in soldering switches
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Sun, 08 September 2013, 00:48:53
I use chisel tip since it lets me get more contact area on what I'm soldering, though I'd imagine conical would allow me to solder very small things more easily.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jonathanyu on Sun, 08 September 2013, 00:57:10
I use chisel tip since it lets me get more contact area on what I'm soldering, though I'd imagine conical would allow me to solder very small things more easily.
if it compare to screwdriver tip, which one heat up the object faster?(switch, diode, something like that)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: PointyFox on Sun, 08 September 2013, 00:59:09
I use chisel tip since it lets me get more contact area on what I'm soldering, though I'd imagine conical would allow me to solder very small things more easily.
if it compare to screwdriver tip, which one heat up the object faster?(switch, diode, something like that)

The chisel tip..er, screwdriver tip.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: StrikeEagleCC on Sun, 08 September 2013, 00:59:48
Definitely the chisel (screwdriver). The conical tips are great in theory, but they become a problem for two reasons: 1: they need a large temperature offset due to their low mass; 2: When tinning them, or doing regular work, the solder tends to migrate up the cone, leaving none at the very tip. I haven't encountered anything yet that I couldn't do more easily with a chisel or a bevel. Bevels are useful for doing SMDs with a tight pitch.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bpiphany on Sun, 08 September 2013, 03:27:07
Chisel tips make better contact with the solder pads on the PCB, which heats them up faster. Soldering small stuff is more about adding a small enough amount of solder than anything else. The solder flows where it is supposed to go anyway. Chisel tips also usually have a pretty pointy corner if you want something smaller. I am able to do most tasks with my 2mm chisel tip, but my most used one is a 1.2mm chisel tip. No matter how small the tip is it's always an improvement if it is chisel shaped rather than with a rounded conical shape.

Chisel tips are different though. They should have a sharp straight edge, and flat sides. Like this
[attachimg=1]
not like this
[attachimg=2]

You want to get into that corner as far as possible
[attachimg=3]
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sun, 08 September 2013, 07:13:32
chisel tips are the bread and butter of soldering. soldering is about heat transfer. heat transfer is about surface area. so in general you want a tip that gives you as much surface area as possible to put in contact with your joint without heating things up that you don't want to heat up, ie, that aren't your joint. the diagram above nails it. you want your tip to make contact with BOTH objects involved in the joint, heat them up above 190C (63/37's melt point) and then feed solder to both surfaces. the flux in the solder will lead the way for the solder to lightly coat the surface of the joint and then isometrically cool into a shiny little bead or coating.

there are two more tips i keep around for special usage: first, the wedge tip that is flat on one side and rounded on the other (basically like a half chisel). these are slightly better for smd wipe soldering than chisels. second, i keep a long pointy tip around when literally nothing else will fit into the space around the joint. but 99% of the tip i have either an 8mm, 16mm, 24mm, or 32mm hakko chisel on (the t18-dxx where xx is the width of the chisel surface).

i don't bother with a hot knife tip because when i need a hot knife i blast an x-acto knife with a butane torch and literally cut things with the hot knife that results.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Sun, 08 September 2013, 07:19:47
Staunch supported of the chisel tip here!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheSoulhunter on Sun, 08 September 2013, 07:24:36
Alright I'm thinking of getting a Hakko 888 soldering kit. What tips should I get with it? I'll buy everything from amazon btw.

I use the d24 (2,4 mm chisel) for most trough-hole stuff...
More contact area than the d16 (better heat transfer) but not too big (like the d32).

I also think you should watch some videos, visual learning really is the way to go here!
Anyway, if you are really looking for a quick simple writeup, here is what I do...

- For switch or LED soldering I use a 2,4mm chisel tip
- Also I use leaded rosin core solder with 1mm diameter
- Make sure components sit flush against the PCB and pins sit right
- Set the temperature of the station to 300-350 degree Celsius and wait for heatup
- Make sure your solder tip is clean, if not clean it (repeat that periodically in the process)
- Put the tip in between pad and pin and feed a small amount of solder in the gap between tip an pin for better heat transfer
- Feed solder from the other side into the gap between pin and pad (enough that you get a solid cone shape bonding) and remove tip
- The two steps above should be done fast and finished when the molten solder completely stops smoking (then the flux is used up)
- Inspect the solder spots... You want a shiny uninterrupted cone shape which contacts the whole pad, best use a magnifying glass for that
- If there seems to be something wrong with the spot, desolder -> clean -> redo, or apply some flux (you can get it seperately) and let the spot reflow by heating it up again
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sun, 08 September 2013, 07:24:47
also it deserves mentioning again: BUY ONE OF THESE:

http://www.amazon.com/SE-MH1047L-Illuminated-Multipower-Magnifier/dp/B003UCODIA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1378643068&sr=8-1&keywords=magnifying+visor
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sun, 08 September 2013, 07:26:01
yep, i only break out the d32 for MONSTER joints. like the 2x12ga wire point to point soldering i've been doing with my welder.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheSoulhunter on Sun, 08 September 2013, 07:32:39
also it deserves mentioning again: BUY ONE OF THESE:

http://www.amazon.com/SE-MH1047L-Illuminated-Multipower-Magnifier/dp/B003UCODIA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1378643068&sr=8-1&keywords=magnifying+visor

Got one of these (with interchangeable lenses tho) but switches to something like this:

[attachimg=1]

Having the magnifying glass in front of the eyes was kinda irritating.
Like when quickly reaching over to a tool etc... o.O
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sun, 08 September 2013, 08:01:01
it's not an either or situation at all. i have the headset and this unit:

http://www.di c k blick.com/products/heavy-duty-magnifier-lamp/?clickTracking=true

with 3x magnification. one of the reasons is that the light on the headset is crap. the 30W CFL in the swingarm unit provides much better light, even if i switch out the magnifier that i'm looking through to the head-mounted unit.

there are also versions of this magnifier that are LED lit (90+ 3.5v non-smt white leds.). this can be nice because the LEDs will never need to be replaced. the CFL bulb will, eventually.

yes, blick art is actually named ****blick. it's the most hilarious human comedy. first of all, that's the founder's name. if that weren't bad enough, he named his gigantic chain of art stores after himself. i suspect no marketing experts were around when he decided to do this...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: damorgue on Sun, 08 September 2013, 08:20:20
there are two more tips i keep around for special usage: first, the wedge tip that is flat on one side and rounded on the other (basically like a half chisel). these are slightly better for smd wipe soldering than chisels. second, i keep a long pointy tip around when literally nothing else will fit into the space around the joint. but 99% of the tip i have either an 8mm, 16mm, 24mm, or 32mm hakko chisel on (the t18-dxx where xx is the width of the chisel surface).

Just in case anyone reads that in the future and are confused, he meant 0.8mm; 1.6mm; 2.4mm and 3.2mm.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sun, 08 September 2013, 08:23:51
yes, sorry, 0630 brain fart.

those would be GIGANTIC chisels.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: StrikeEagleCC on Sun, 08 September 2013, 08:30:26
those would be GIGANTIC chisels.


Ha. That's what I was thinking when I read that post, but figured if anyone accidentally bought (or even found) a chisel that big, it would be worth the story.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: vun on Sun, 08 September 2013, 09:03:45
there are two more tips i keep around for special usage: first, the wedge tip that is flat on one side and rounded on the other (basically like a half chisel). these are slightly better for smd wipe soldering than chisels. second, i keep a long pointy tip around when literally nothing else will fit into the space around the joint. but 99% of the tip i have either an 8mm, 16mm, 24mm, or 32mm hakko chisel on (the t18-dxx where xx is the width of the chisel surface).

Just in case anyone reads that in the future and are confused, he meant 0.8mm; 1.6mm; 2.4mm and 3.2mm.


My mental image of kawa wielding a 32mm soldering tip like a sword is now ruined :(
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: damorgue on Sun, 08 September 2013, 09:28:48
there are two more tips i keep around for special usage: first, the wedge tip that is flat on one side and rounded on the other (basically like a half chisel). these are slightly better for smd wipe soldering than chisels. second, i keep a long pointy tip around when literally nothing else will fit into the space around the joint. but 99% of the tip i have either an 8mm, 16mm, 24mm, or 32mm hakko chisel on (the t18-dxx where xx is the width of the chisel surface).

Just in case anyone reads that in the future and are confused, he meant 0.8mm; 1.6mm; 2.4mm and 3.2mm.


My mental image of kawa wielding a 32mm soldering tip like a sword is now ruined :(

Don't worry, he is about to w(i)eld using a large sword made of ARCS. Who needs wimpy hot metal...

Ming's Awesome Lightsaber StoreTM

Don't forget the royalties on that one when it catches on.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sun, 08 September 2013, 09:33:01
if it helps any, the welder cathode and anode at 32mm diameter copper chromium so i'm still going to do that, just at 1100C and not 350C ;)

i would take a picture but i can't find them (seriously) on my bench right now
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: JPG on Sun, 08 September 2013, 10:33:53
if it helps any, the welder cathode and anode at 32mm diameter copper chromium so i'm still going to do that, just at 1100C and not 350C ;)

i would take a picture but i can't find them (seriously) on my bench right now

Yea they must be just TOO BIG for you to find them  :p
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: vun on Sun, 08 September 2013, 10:40:04
I retract my previous statement, kawa is still wields tools of madness, order is restored.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: kaiserreich on Sun, 08 September 2013, 10:53:15
How do you guys clean boards with white soldermask?

I friggin hate these things. First A87 ps2avr, and now the Phantom is using white solder mask.
The flux gets everywhere and becomes so obvious, and it is a pain to clean with just 99% IPA and a lint free cloth.

Are there any other better methods to clean residual flux off the board?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheSoulhunter on Sun, 08 September 2013, 10:57:41
More IPA and a nail brush :D
Rinse, Brush, Rinse, Brush, Rinse, Brush...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jonathanyu on Sun, 08 September 2013, 11:06:06
Chisel tips make better contact with the solder pads on the PCB, which heats them up faster. Soldering small stuff is more about adding a small enough amount of solder than anything else. The solder flows where it is supposed to go anyway. Chisel tips also usually have a pretty pointy corner if you want something smaller. I am able to do most tasks with my 2mm chisel tip, but my most used one is a 1.2mm chisel tip. No matter how small the tip is it's always an improvement if it is chisel shaped rather than with a rounded conical shape.

Chisel tips are different though. They should have a sharp straight edge, and flat sides. Like this
(Attachment Link)
not like this
(Attachment Link)

You want to get into that corner as far as possible
(Attachment Link)

why not the second one?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sun, 08 September 2013, 11:15:36
i use a branded flux remover. it's either made by mg chem or chemtronics, but it's frickin effective. it's basically every organic solvent at once. they skip the solvents that will destroy the pcb itself, but that's it.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: domoaligato on Sun, 08 September 2013, 11:30:33
Chisel tips make better contact with the solder pads on the PCB, which heats them up faster. Soldering small stuff is more about adding a small enough amount of solder than anything else. The solder flows where it is supposed to go anyway. Chisel tips also usually have a pretty pointy corner if you want something smaller. I am able to do most tasks with my 2mm chisel tip, but my most used one is a 1.2mm chisel tip. No matter how small the tip is it's always an improvement if it is chisel shaped rather than with a rounded conical shape.

Chisel tips are different though. They should have a sharp straight edge, and flat sides. Like this
(Attachment Link)
not like this
(Attachment Link)

You want to get into that corner as far as possible
(Attachment Link)

why not the second one?

because that tip has a flat edged tip and it can not make as much contact as the first.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Sun, 08 September 2013, 11:49:33
I use petrol and find it cleans much better than 99% IPA.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: StrikeEagleCC on Sun, 08 September 2013, 11:59:00
I use petrol and find it cleans much better than 99% IPA.

As in gasoline? Phew, I don't think I could stand the smell.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sun, 08 September 2013, 12:31:28
mineral spirits are basically kerosene (actually usually naptha petroleum byproducts and turpentine). they are quite effective organic solvents when it comes to hydrocarbons.\

the other major solvents are lithium and silicone based. silicone tends to have pretty good stability and chemical resistance but is highy susceptile to ketones, among other things, less susceptible to petroleum derivatives. lithium soaps are highly susceptible to petroleum derivatives.

polymer lubricants each have their own special solvent story. basically the endcaps protect the polymer chain pretty effectively in most polymers (obviously there are some not so happy endings here -- ketones and almost any polymer is one of them, alcohols also tend to be pretty effective at attacking polymers.

Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MJ45 on Sun, 08 September 2013, 12:37:07
i use a branded flux remover. it's either made by mg chem or chemtronics, but it's frickin effective. it's basically every organic solvent at once. they skip the solvents that will destroy the pcb itself, but that's it.
When I ran out of flux remover I tried some R/C car Nitro cleaner and it worked better than the MG chemicals stuff I normally use. I may use this stuff from now on.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sun, 08 September 2013, 14:07:10
woah! how can deny trying out something called nitro?! duly noted ;)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: loadstar81 on Sun, 08 September 2013, 14:17:05
This thread is a goldmine, thanks doods
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Sun, 08 September 2013, 14:58:39
I use petrol and find it cleans much better than 99% IPA.

As in gasoline? Phew, I don't think I could stand the smell.

Yes.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: TheSoulhunter on Sun, 08 September 2013, 16:21:33
I use petrol and find it cleans much better than 99% IPA.

But doesn't it leave residue by itself (in difference to IPA which fully evaporates, which is the reason they use it for optic equipment I guess)?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MOZ on Sun, 08 September 2013, 16:50:07
I use petrol and find it cleans much better than 99% IPA.

But doesn't it leave residue by itself (in difference to IPA which fully evaporates, which is the reason they use it for optic equipment I guess)?

In my experience, yes, but negligible which soon evaporates as well, since petrol is highly volatile.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sun, 08 September 2013, 17:06:29
both IPA and hydrocarbon solvents (of which petroleum distillates such as naptha kerosene, etc. etc. etc. are all such) are incredibly volatile and will vaporize quite quickly. the most annoying thing about them actually is that they disassemble/dissolve the thing you don't want on there and then they vaporize and then you have the remains of the thing to clean up with yet another cleaner. BLURGH!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: JPG on Sun, 08 September 2013, 17:55:01
Hey, what kind of tips does the Hakko FX888D come with? Does it have the "popular" chisels tips?

If not, where do you buy them? They are like 10$ each + shipping (like almost another 10$ for me) on ebay...
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Sun, 08 September 2013, 19:43:33
it comes with a t18-d16 1.6mm chisel. the cheapest place i've found tips is actually fry's. ebay tips are usually knock-offs, so don't bother with that. the reseller that consistently gets the buy box on amazon for the 888D also sells tips FBA and they only charge a couple bucks for the pick and pack fees. imo though, unless you need a really weird SMD tip or you know you're going to be soldering something GIGANTIC (even my welder didn't need more than the d16 by the way), don't bother buying more tips until you have a lot more experience and something particularly weird to solder
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: JPG on Sun, 08 September 2013, 19:46:53
OK, thx for the info, that 1.6mm should work just good!
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: bpiphany on Mon, 09 September 2013, 03:24:54
why not the second one?

It has the flat sides, which is a good start. But the tip is too round. It should be a sharp edge, like a knife, no radius. It's too blunt to put it in other words. It probably does pretty good for large stuff like through hole soldering.

I usually cheat a little when soldering through hole. I start of by melting the solder wire against the iron to get the heat transfer going. After that I continue feeding the solder directly onto the contact surfaces.

For cleaning I use regular rubbing alcohol and a brush (ESD just to play it safe). Then I rinse off in a second cleaner bath of the same alcohol. If I have access to it I finish off by blow drying with pressurized air. That way remaining solids are blown off rather than drying onto the surface.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: StrikeEagleCC on Mon, 09 September 2013, 04:44:50
I usually cheat a little when soldering through hole. I start of by melting the solder wire against the iron to get the heat transfer going. After that I continue feeding the solder directly onto the contact surfaces.

That's actually exactly what you're supposed to do. IPC soldering manuals provide instruction to do exactly that.

Quote
e) Place the soldering iron tip on the connection at the point of maximum thermal mass.
f) Create a heat (solder) bridge by applying flux-cored solder to the junction of the pad, the lead, and the
iron tip (Figure 7-33).
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: pixel5 on Mon, 09 September 2013, 14:09:07
Building a new keyboard soon...need some solder...whats the best deal on the web right now? Bonus points if I can get it from mouser (do they even sell it?)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 09 September 2013, 14:14:19
i have a lb of solder that i can divvy up right now as a test to see how people like NOS vs old stock kester 44
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 09 September 2013, 14:14:44
i mean NEW NEW stock vs new OLD STOCK. sorry.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: pixel5 on Mon, 09 September 2013, 14:55:58
i have a lb of solder that i can divvy up right now as a test to see how people like NOS vs old stock kester 44

I'll be building a handwired keyboard...is that a good test subject? Or are you looking for people doing PCB stuff?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: damorgue on Mon, 09 September 2013, 14:58:48
i have a lb of solder that i can divvy up right now as a test to see how people like NOS vs old stock kester 44

I'll be building a handwired keyboard...is that a good test subject? Or are you looking for people doing PCB stuff?

That application has even higher demands than PCB work so you are probably suitable. It needs an even stronger mechanical bond and since you are soldering a bunch of free hanging wires you are more likely to move them which is a strong suit of eutectic solder. You do not want to move around a non-eutectic solder joint when it is solidifying. (Not that you want to move around a joint with eutectic solder either, it will just cause less problems.)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: MJ45 on Mon, 09 September 2013, 15:48:17
Frys has the Hakko 888D on sale this week for $69.99 which is a good deal if you have a Frys near you. I have the older 888 and its a great solder station for the price range.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Mon, 09 September 2013, 15:52:32
Frys has the Hakko 888D on sale this week for $69.99 which is a good deal if you have a Frys near you. I have the older 888 and its a great solder station for the price range.

That's a really good deal. Too bad I've never even seen a fry's store  ::)
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: JPG on Mon, 09 September 2013, 15:58:44
Frys has the Hakko 888D on sale this week for $69.99 which is a good deal if you have a Frys near you. I have the older 888 and its a great solder station for the price range.

That's a really good deal. Too bad I've never even seen a fry's store  ::)

^this...

How much would it cost to send one to Canada?  :rolleyes:
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: jdcarpe on Mon, 09 September 2013, 16:13:30
Frys has the Hakko 888D on sale this week for $69.99 which is a good deal if you have a Frys near you. I have the older 888 and its a great solder station for the price range.

That's a really good deal. Too bad I've never even seen a fry's store  ::)

^this...

How much would it cost to send one to Canada?  :rolleyes:

Medium flat rate box priority from the US to Canada is $41.95
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Mon, 09 September 2013, 16:18:08
Frys has the Hakko 888D on sale this week for $69.99 which is a good deal if you have a Frys near you. I have the older 888 and its a great solder station for the price range.

That's a really good deal. Too bad I've never even seen a fry's store  ::)

Fry's does online ordering/shipping.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: Parak on Mon, 09 September 2013, 16:29:58
I'll just leave these here for possible inclusion in sticky; as relevant today as they were back in the day they were made:

list=PL926EC0F1F93C1837

list=PL958FF32927823D12
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Mon, 09 September 2013, 16:33:54
Frys has the Hakko 888D on sale this week for $69.99 which is a good deal if you have a Frys near you. I have the older 888 and its a great solder station for the price range.

That's a really good deal. Too bad I've never even seen a fry's store  ::)

Fry's does online ordering/shipping.

 Shipping: Available In-Store Only :(
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Mon, 09 September 2013, 16:59:19
Frys has the Hakko 888D on sale this week for $69.99 which is a good deal if you have a Frys near you. I have the older 888 and its a great solder station for the price range.

That's a really good deal. Too bad I've never even seen a fry's store  ::)

Fry's does online ordering/shipping.

 Shipping: Available In-Store Only :(

Where you live?
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Mon, 09 September 2013, 17:04:03
Frys has the Hakko 888D on sale this week for $69.99 which is a good deal if you have a Frys near you. I have the older 888 and its a great solder station for the price range.

That's a really good deal. Too bad I've never even seen a fry's store  ::)

Fry's does online ordering/shipping.

 Shipping: Available In-Store Only :(

Where you live?


middle of nowhere between st louis, chicago, nashville and indianopolis :p

you have my address ;) ccng haha
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: tjcaustin on Mon, 09 September 2013, 17:04:40
Frys has the Hakko 888D on sale this week for $69.99 which is a good deal if you have a Frys near you. I have the older 888 and its a great solder station for the price range.

That's a really good deal. Too bad I've never even seen a fry's store  ::)

Fry's does online ordering/shipping.

 Shipping: Available In-Store Only :(

Where you live?


middle of nowhere between st louis, chicago, nashville and indianopolis :p

you have my address ;) ccng haha

Doesn't mean I memorized it

Make it worth my while to get one and mail it to you.
Title: Re: The Living Soldering Thread
Post by: SpAmRaY on Mon, 09 September 2013, 17:07:38