Gateron is bad idea (?)

[Neutral]

Hi, (sorry for my little english) recently a buy one modulare mechanical keyboard (GMMK Glorious) with Gateron Brown switchs. Not the best, but good thing for my second mechanical keyboard.

But, after 1-2 months only, switchs have problem. I've already changed 3-4 switchs. Because the spring produces an echo after the return. This is striking enough to be noticed. After change switch, echo of spring it's ok.. no specific sound.

To see on the net, the returns Gateron does not seem to be bad. Bad set and unlucky? I would like your opinion on the matter.


Thank you for answers.

[ddrfraser1]

I don’t think there’s necessarily anything bad about Gateron housings or springs. Lube goes a long way to help spring ping on any switch. There are certainly better switches to try. Gateron brown as well as cherry Mx brown are generally regarded as substandard tactile switches because of their weak tactility and scratchiness. There are a lot of good tactile switches you should consider. The most popular tend to be zealios and holy pandas but that’s just scarring the surface. Good luck!

[Neutral]

I look to take eventually: Kailh Pro Purple. But for Panda i don’t know if this is compatible with my current keyboard (GMMK Glorious Gaming, official for: Cherry, Gateron and Kailh). And i read quickly this morning on the forum that there would be copies or places where they should not be ordered (?) more investigation..

For now I would already trust Kailh who works with Logitech if I’m not mistaken or Cherry, than Gateron seen my experience.

[ddrfraser1]

Holy pandas will work fine on the GMMK. Kailh makes very good switches.

[Error213]

There is nothing bad about gateron but I peorsonally think you had a bad batch or maybe gateron browns aren’t for you. They sure aren’t for me

[Neutral]

I made the choice of browns for "general" uses (gaming + wording). I like switchs (small effect of stairs in the switch. I might want to change in the long term). If i had the choice of all switchs existing i would perhaps choose something else.

I think I came across a bad batch. Type on the keyboard and the noise of a faulty switch sounds very different from the others..

I’ll email Glorious to see if the warranty is possible, but difficult given the product and the context. And I will also look at when the switches Kailh-Purple will be available for purchase again. See order a set to test several switches.

Edit: have 120 Gateron Brown for my TKL, 20-30 on reserve. I hope not to use them all for replacement or that there are too many defective


Thanks for answers 

[Leslieann]

I look to take eventually: Kailh Pro Purple.

Nice switch but they absolutely require lube to stop binding and I had quite a bit of ping with the stock springs.

Some days there was none, other days a few switches had some of the worst ping I've ever experienced, a spring swap solved that and puts them almost on par with stock Zealios v2 (no lube). About 2/3rds the price, but a lot of effort to get there.

[Neutral]

Kailh makes very good switches.

Nice switch but they absolutely require lube to stop binding and I had quite a bit of ping with the stock springs.

Some days there was none, other days a few switches had some of the worst ping I've ever experienced

Hum, i am confused. If Kailh produces good switchs, why require lube (?) It doesn’t make sense to me if I have to tinker with the switches after purchase.

In this case MX Cherry, seem to me to be a more secure value in the prices I am willing to pay for switchs. We learn about it every day, but concerning MX Cherry never seen reviews such as this one. Never had any concerns about to: MX Cherry blue and red silent.

[suicidal_orange]

You have entered the world of enthusiasts - people who care way more than normal people, who think we're a bit crazy.  If you listen to us Cherry MX also need lube and that's just to get them as smooth as the smoothest stock switch without lube, yet thousands of gamers have happily used MX switches without lube for many years...

We can also feel the difference between Zealios which came with 63, 65 or 67 gram - what sane person would do this?  Cherry caters to sane people - brown switches have a small bump and light spring, clears have a bigger bump and heavier spring, that's enough choice.

Have you tried taking your 'defective' switches apart and re-seating the spring?  That may be all they need to stop pinging (assuming that's what you are hearing)

[Leslieann]

Hum, i am confused. If Kailh produces good switchs, why require lube (?) It doesn’t make sense to me if I have to tinker with the switches after purchase.

I've never had other Kailh switches so I can't say for certain if mine were a bad batch or not.

You have entered the world of enthusiasts - people who care way more than normal people, who think we're a bit crazy.  If you listen to us Cherry MX also need lube and that's just to get them as smooth as the smoothest stock switch without lube, yet thousands of gamers have happily used MX switches without lube for many years...

Most of my boards are not lubed and most of them didn't really benefit much when I did.

The Purples however had MASSIVE bind if you hit them even the slightest bit off center, it was like hitting a board. I haven't had any other switch act that bad out of the box, ever. Maybe it was a bad batch, I don't know, but I actually was unable to use them for more than an hour without pain in my hands. Yes, I am used to and prefer light springs but I was able to use Box Jades all day long without a problem, tired but not aching. These HURT.

Once lubed they became quite nice, but out of the box they were terrible.

[suicidal_orange]

You have entered the world of enthusiasts - people who care way more than normal people, who think we're a bit crazy.  If you listen to us Cherry MX also need lube and that's just to get them as smooth as the smoothest stock switch without lube, yet thousands of gamers have happily used MX switches without lube for many years...

Most of my boards are not lubed and most of them didn't really benefit much when I did.

The Purples however had MASSIVE bind if you hit them even the slightest bit off center, it was like hitting a board. I haven't had any other switch act that bad out of the box, ever. Maybe it was a bad batch, I don't know, but I actually was unable to use them for more than an hour without pain in my hands. Yes, I am used to and prefer light springs but I was able to use Box Jades all day long without a problem, tired but not aching. These HURT.

Once lubed they became quite nice, but out of the box they were terrible.

I see! I want to try some

@Neutral - my warning stands, many people here are not all as reserved in their recommendations as Leslieann.

[rinkaan]

I think for the price point gateron after lubed are pretty bang for the buck. Albeit a fair bit of effort to get them lubed... But I tink you will find some satisfaction (and backaches) after lubing and filming them and finding it work well for a fraction of the cost of more expensive switches. Give it a try on a weekend or boredom!

Sent from my Redmi K20 Pro using Tapatalk

[Leslieann]

All switches take a fair bit of effort to lube.

Do Gaterons even benefit from film? I thought that was mostly a Cherry thing, also seems to not be nearly as common as it once was.

[Neutral]

Thanks for answers.

I have time for this 



I test lube on F10, bad sound and after see videos for this and applied to the right places, right sound  . (Maybe little, little, little more resistance, but i’m already an alien). Use silicone grease, which i had on hand, would something else be better suited? I also discovered the films for switchs now, maybe buy a compatible set for future.

I am pleased to have taken a modular keyboard and not welded. Otherwise a bad start for switchs lube.


Edit: hum now i can also apply lube on stabilizers of keyboards  (spacebar, enter, backspace and shift) 

[Leslieann]

Silicoen grease is a bit wide of a spectrum. What's the viscosity, what was it intended for?

Generally we use a silicone based grease (often Super Lube dielectric grease) for any metal to plastic contact then something thinner like Krytox 103 (?), 205 or Finish Line Extreme Flouro for the switches. These are are a really thing teflon based grease. If tactile or clicky, do not lube the legs.

You also may want to look up "bandaid mod Tahae" on youtube.

[jcoffin1981]

I've used Gateron switches, but only the brown variety.  I had them come with keyboards and I have also installed them on boards.  I will say that I have had variance between different orders/lots of switches.  I have had one bag of switches where nearly every one in the bag had this terrible ping.  I've had others that had just a couple in the bag with slight ping. 

I am not sure whether the sound was caused by the spring or from the leaf.  What I did was lube the switches- all parts.  The ping totally went away.  They did however turn into linear switches.

With that being said I have had boards with Cherry switches that pinged horribly.  I returned the board and exchanged it for the same one- this was a Pok3r, and the ping was gone- so you can't blame it on the composition of the case or something.  I have also had different batches of switches that just felt different.  I think there is some variance which may have to do with when it was made, at which plant, or which machine or tooling produced it.  I think Gateron makes a fine switch so I wouldn't write them off.  They are less expensive than many others and maybe this could be a factor.

[Leslieann]

I am not sure whether the sound was caused by the spring or from the leaf.  What I did was lube the switches- all parts.  The ping totally went away.  They did however turn into linear switches.

Ping is the spring.
The thinner the wire the more likely to ping, also type if metal and how it's wound seems to matter. Cherry light springs are known for it, some of the stock Kailh Pro Springs pinged insanely bad but only at certain times. I've run two sets of stainless Sprit springs in those same Kailh and not heard a ping yet.

Lubing the spring helps,some people do one end, some do both, some lube the whole spring. I do both ends.
Lubing the legs on tactile/clicky switches will make them linear. I made that mistake on my Ergo Clears.

[Neutral]

Silicoen grease is a bit wide of a spectrum. What's the viscosity, what was it intended for?

Composition is: white petrolatum 90%, silicon oil 10%, waterproof, for mechanism.

You also may want to look up "bandaid mod Tahae" on youtube.

I’ve seen the videos before, but for buy other lube, expensive in comparison of price of the switchs.

I am not sure whether the sound was caused by the spring or from the leaf.  What I did was lube the switches- all parts.  The ping totally went away.  They did however turn into linear switches.

Lubing the spring helps,some people do one end, some do both, some lube the whole spring. I do both ends.
Lubing the legs on tactile/clicky switches will make them linear. I made that mistake on my Ergo Clears.

On my keyboard I mainly replaced commonly used key switches (+gaming): S, E, R, F, C, F2 and F10 (last for volume sound). I lubing legs on F10 yesterday, but Gateron Brown is hybrid, on the box it's written: "A hybrid between a linear and clicky switchs. Does not generate a click when pressed, but the tactile bump is still present. Ideal for those who want a tactile and work around peers". After lubing F10 it's sweet, but for me the linear feeling was already there at the beginning. I’ve only tested MX Blue and Red Silent so far, my opinion is not necessarily right.

Can be lubricate all switches and (maybe) add a film. Also lubricate the keyboard stabilizers. More, would start to cost too much considering the price of Gateron Brown switches.

[Leslieann]

Composition is: white petrolatum 90%, silicon oil 10%, waterproof, for mechanism.

That tells nothing about viscosity, regardless I can tell you it's probably too thick for switches. Save it for stabs (metal to metal parts only).

I’ve seen the videos before, but for buy other lube, expensive in comparison of price of the switchs.

Look up Finish Line Flouro Extreme, it's less than half the price of Krytox.
About $12 from Amazon, probably a bit less at your local bike shop if they have it in stock (try Walmart and auto parts stores as well)

Beware using other types of lube, petroleum based lubes will damage ABS plastic ( and most others). You want silicone based or teflon (ptfe) based.
Also using that thick lube on switches, while it will feel really slippery they can become very sluggish and some switches won't even properly reset in a timely manner.

On my keyboard I mainly replaced commonly used key switches (+gaming): S, E, R, F, C, F2 and F10 (last for volume sound). I lubing legs on F10 yesterday, but Gateron Brown is hybrid, on the box it's written: "A hybrid between a linear and clicky switchs. Does not generate a click when pressed, but the tactile bump is still present. Ideal for those who want a tactile and work around peers". After lubing F10 it's sweet, but for me the linear feeling was already there at the beginning. I’ve only tested MX Blue and Red Silent so far, my opinion is not necessarily right.

Can be lubricate all switches and (maybe) add a film. Also lubricate the keyboard stabilizers. More, would start to cost too much considering the price of Gateron Brown switches.

That's tactile.
I really despise companies trying to relabel industry standard terms, Matias also does this with their "quiet click".

The tactile bump spring pressure will remain but for most people the feel of the bump gets washed out with lube.
Browns are considered quite linear anyhow, so it's not surprising it felt rather linear to you. It has some of the lightest tactility of almost any mechanical switch.

[Neutral]

Look up Finish Line Flouro Extreme, it's less than half the price of Krytox.

Ok ty, i found on Switzerland for ~15$. Wait one week and open and lubing all switchs + stabilizers.

For the rest (films, springs, stabilizers, etc) you have a site to recommend in particular? (for import into Switzerland)

[Leslieann]

I've never used films, I think those have fallen out of favor actually due to better switches being available. They were popular years ago.

Springs, I prefer Sprit, their site has a where to buy section..
Stabs, Durgod, Everglide, Zeal, Zugg, but generally most stabs can be made to work fine, just make sure they operate freely and lube them well. While you can over lube a switch but it's difficult to over lube a stab, you kidnd of want to overlube them to prevent rattle.

[Neutral]

I will take a moment to look at all of this.

Thank you all for your feedback and advice. 

[Stev!e]

Gateron browns and Cherry MX Browns are one of the first switches people try. They also happen to be the switch people tend to quickly move away from. Gateron does make some good switches however. Gateron Yellows that have been lubed and filmed can offer a very respectable experience for a good price. Gateron ink blacks are also a very popular choice.