Is Dell A101w (ALPS black) good for typing?

[Tony]

Hi all, and another topic for newbies.

On my quest to make my work more ergonomic, I come to this site. At first I changed my keyboard layout to Colemak, then looked around for an acceptable mech keyboard. I recently got a Compaq 11800 keyboard with mx brown switches and quite happy with it. I do not play games much.

Right now I have an offer to buy a 2nd hand Dell AT101w (ALPS black) mechanical keyboard.

Please give me advice whether this keyboard good enough for touch typing? I am looking forward to hearing from your experience.

[patrickgeekhack]

As with any keyboard, some like it while some don't. I loved for a while, but did not like the fact I had to press the keys right in the middle for the keys to feel smooth. Some people have noticed this too, while some have not. It's certainly a well-built keyboard, very well-built. Too bad I lost mine.

I don't know if you have had any experience with other ALPS switches, but don't judge ALPS in general based on ALPS black only.

[theferenc]

I like mine to type on. The problem with it is that the older ones tend to be very dirty, and that dirt gets in to the switches.

I didn't like the way the switches felt "gritty" when I first got the keyboard. Once I had cleaned each switch individually though, the keyboard felt very very nice.

Unfortunately, I broke the slider on one of the keys, and had to glue it back together, since I did not have spares of either slider or key cap. It works just fine, it's just a wee bit off center. It's only really noticeable if you're looking for it, and doesn't impact touch typing at all.

So, what I'm saying is, yes, they are nice for typing, but only if you clean them. Which is a lot of work. And be VERY careful pulling the key caps. Not as bad as pulling the caps from an apple extended, but still tough.

[Tony]

Thanks for your advice. I will come to have a typing test on that keyboard to check if the keys are smooth or not.
 
He asks for 15us$ and no more cost since I can pick it up.

I am in Vietnam, South East Asia.

Edit: For cleaning and removing the keys in Dell AT101w keyboard, this topic has extensive detaled info on it. Thanks theferenc

[George7]

I use the UK version (AT102W) at work, and it's a nice board to type on.

[theferenc]

Just remember to be VERY CAREFUL when pulling Alps key caps. They are removeable, but it takes a lot of effort. Make sure you pull straight up, or as close to it as possible, or you will likely break a stem. I managed to get all but 1 cap off whole.

Edit: I just spent some time disassembling my AEKII, and I found that, BY FAR, the easiest way to pop the key caps is to get something flat, like a butter knife, under the cap, but ON the switch. Then just rotate it a wee bit, and the cap pops off, easy peasy. Using a keypuller was actually harder, and felt more likely to snap a cap stem.

Black and dampened cream Alps are actually both pretty nice to type on, if you like a firmer switch. Not as nice as buckling spring or topre, but significantly better than anything Cherry puts out, IMO.

[Tony]

It's an old dirty keyboard with some keys are very hard to press. As theferenc said, the keycaps take a lot of force to pull out. I use two screwdrivers to pull from opposite directions, carefully follow theferenc's advice of pulling as straight as possible.

I tried to do type tests on that and missed a lot of keys with speed of 40wpm. I have to press bottomed out to type fast on this linear ALPS black switches.

I suppose that is not good for touch typing. For FPS or strategy gaming, it might be good.

[theferenc]

Definitely sounds like the switches need cleaning, as they shouldn't feel linear. At least, mine don't feel linear.

Try the way I suggested, getting something between the bottom of the key and the top of the switch. That REALLY simplified getting the keys off, and gave me much fewer difficulties.

Anyway, if you are willing to take the time to clean them, the switches can actually be quite nice. But it's really your call, as it is kind of a PITA.

[keyboardlover]

In my opinion, it is not a good keyboard for typing. Low-force switches are best for typing; the AT101W requires too much force for typing for long periods of time. On top of requiring a lot of force, they are not a smooth switch and off center keypresses often times don't register. For FPS it's also not a good choice because it has 2-kro.

[theferenc]

I couldn't disagree more about low force switches. The cherry brown keyboards miss so many keystrokes, for instance.

Give me a nice, heavy, buckling spring or similar, and I'm happy.

[keyboardlover]

Try typing a 25 page thesis on it. Maybe I have wimp fingers, but they'd be hurting.

[itlnstln]

I'm with KBL.  For long/all-day typing, the lower the force the better.  It's just hard to get used to after years of high-force keyboards.  My path was BS -> ALPS -> Cherrys -> Topre.  The hardest jump was from ALPS to Cherrys (browns).  Now that I type on Cherry browns and Topres, I would never go back to a stiffer switch (except for the occasional indulgence in BS).

[Tony]

According to your thoughtful advices, I decide I should get a Dell ALPS black keyboard and try some cleaning on it, just for fun.

Hopefully after cleaning this keyboard is good for gaming as well as for typing.

In the worst case, I always have a mech keyboard to toy with.

[theferenc]

Try typing a 25 page thesis on it. Maybe I have wimp fingers, but they'd be hurting.

Does a 30 page PhD proposal count? Or thousands of lines of C and Fortran? How about a dissertation?

I'm a PhD student, nearly done. I do a LOT of typing all day, every day. And I prefer my Model M to nearly everything if I'm doing a lot of typing.

I mean, I very much enjoy typing on my HHKB as well, but still, that's a "heavy" switch compared to browns. At least to my fingers it is.

Maybe I'm just weird, but I really prefer the heavier keys. They just have a nice feel to them, and they are nice and bouncy.

It might also be how I type. I type quickly (about 110 WPM), but I don't use my pinkies for much except modifiers. Technically, it's touch typing, but not in the traditional fashion. So that might be why I prefer heavier switches, and why my hands don't get tired.

[keyboardlover]

Well, different strokes for different folks...
But yea I think that's a bit weird

[theferenc]

Differences make the world go 'round, as they say. And everyone thinks I'm a bit weird, so no worries.

[keyboardlover]

Well its not like I'M normal

[theferenc]

You're here. By definition, you're broken in special ways. It's what makes this forum so much fun!

[keyb_gr]

How does one manage to miss keystrokes on a low-force (and smooth) switch like browns? Accidental extra ones, well, that I could still understand...

BTW, a Model M is so far ahead of my AT102DW (AT101W's German layout cousin) it's not even funny. There's a lot of boards I'd prefer to that Dell. And that's without any off-center issues. Talk about rough feel, somewhat short travel and very hard landing. Seems I'm not an ALPS guy in general (whites felt better but very heavy and disruptive).

[Tony]

I am typing on a Compaq keyboard with mx brown switch now.

At first impression my error rate increased 2%, the keys seemed very sticky and it is very hard to do fast combinations.

After a while I learn to feel the keys. That means to press with less force, just enough to register the key but not too much to bottom.

It required me to change the distance and angles from wrists to keyboard and table, the height of my chair, etc. and after several days I have got it right. A wrist rest may help.

For Windows 7 I also use regedit > Hkeycurrent user > Control Panel > Accessibility > Keyboard Response to set up the response and delay variables to smaller numbers to match the faster responsive keyboard, then reboot my computer.

Now I type a bit faster than in a buckling spring switch like IBM model M, and my hands sometimes feel like dancing on the keyboard.

[theferenc]

Don't ask me how. Maybe because they are so light, my fingers don't want to push them hard enough? But the cherry I had and the kinesis I still have, both resulted in many missed key presses. I'm generally a harder typer, though I don't often bottom out on my Customizer, but for some reason, I never seemed to get a handle on the proper distance for the brown switches. The tactile feedback was atrocious, which is why I prefer clears.

And they resulted in very uncomfortable hands. I'm sure it was my fault, as I was trying to avoid damaging the pcb mounted switches, as they felt so damn fragile. But my hands started to cramp from having to be so careful. This is one of the reasons I so like buckling springs, alps, and topres. No feelings of fragility.

[ffarysam]

As with any keyboard, some like it while some don't.