Author Topic: Mionix Naos vs. ? Would love everyones opinion (Read 15313 times)

Peanuts · « **on:** Tue, 19 April 2011, 18:12:37 »

Thanks for stopping in, I definitely don't like collecting mice I like to pick one and stick with it for years so I value your honest opinions.

I have spent likely 12+ hours in the last week trying to decide on a new mouse. I'm currently using a Razer Diamondback which has been pretty good (quality wise) not comfort though.
I'm definitely a palm grip I would say, like to stretch my hand out and grab it.
So the Naos looks good but bulky for moving??? I love it has a pinky rest. I hate the logitech MX-5xx line because it makes my pinky drag. Even the diamondback has a bit of a ridge. Maybe you guys and gals can think of something better? Mionix prices are insane, thats whats holding me back their 3200 was cheaper 3 years ago, and you can get $30 mice with more features. If they had the Naos 5000 for $65 on Amazon again I'd buy it tonight.

Level of importance top being post important
Does not let my pinky drag
Ergonomic for right hander
All plastic not rubberized coating that wears down. <- I don't need grippy stuff I can palm it
diamond back style rubber scroll wheel (not cheap plastic ridged one)

My hand how it lays/ size for reference

.XL · « **Reply #1 on:** Tue, 19 April 2011, 18:35:26 »

I had a run with the Naos 3200 - can't say I liked the laser very much, but the body itself is great. It's light (the 5000 is the same weight if you add none of the weights) and very comfortable. My issue with it was that it was lower than my mamba, but from a quick google search I can see it's about the same height as the Diamondback.

The Naos 5000 is a great mouse - very comfortable and very well built (same body as the 3200 I had) with a great sensor. If you buy it off Amazon you can always return it if it doesn't suit you, but I'm sure you'll love it.

snowball · « **Reply #2 on:** Wed, 20 April 2011, 09:20:10 »

The Naos 3200 is optical (Avago ADNS-3080). The 5000 has the Avago ADNS-9500 laser sensor (same as the Xai, G9x, and Kone

)

I actually prefer the 3080 to the 9500. The acceleration of the 9500 sensor kills it for me.

If you have a palm grip the Naos is one of the best. The 5000's acceleration should be manageable on a hard pad.

.XL · « **Reply #3 on:** Wed, 20 April 2011, 09:30:08 »

Acceleration in the 9500? I didn't have any issue with it in the G9x, but the acceleration in the Naos 3200 (same sensor as the ikari i believe) was KILLER. I've read a lot of people have the same problem I did with that sensor...high acceleration that really wrecks the usefulness of the mouse.

You're the first person I've heard have an issue with that sensor. Maybe you just got a bum unit?

snowball · « **Reply #4 on:** Wed, 20 April 2011, 13:30:40 »

Their are some videos out their about the 9500 senors issues

here they are in a graph

I haven't heard of anyone else having accel issues on a 3080.

the Ikari uses a 3060 in the optical version.

.XL · « **Reply #5 on:** Wed, 20 April 2011, 13:33:55 »

Quote from: snowball;334277

Their are some videos out their about the 9500 senors issues

here they are in a graph

Show Image

I'm assuming this was from before the firmware update that fixed whatever acceleration issues were present. Now they're fine.

snowball · « **Reply #6 on:** Wed, 20 April 2011, 19:22:38 »

Just tested mine with the newest firmware. Got positive acceleration.

shot a hole in the wall. built a track to hold the mouse level on the pad. Moved the mouse until I did a 360* turn slowly. Then moved it fast back and overshot the original hole when I hit the side rail on the pad.

Did the Same test with a Zowie EC2 and landed back at start.

All test done in CS:S with raw input enabled and acceleration disabled.

looked like this guys results (I ran my tests on a Zowie Spawn G-TF pad)

http://img208.imageshack.us/f/xaipositiveaccel.png/

snowball · « **Reply #7 on:** Wed, 20 April 2011, 19:37:56 »

I wouldn't say bad, just personal preference. In the same way some users have a preference for mice that have angle snapping.

.XL · « **Reply #8 on:** Wed, 20 April 2011, 19:48:33 »

I personally find acceleration annoying...it's bad when you're playing a game that requires fast yet precise movements.

I'm not really looking forward to the G9x so much now, since it may still have acceleration problems. Oh well...if I don't like it so much I can always sell it on here.

snowball · « **Reply #9 on:** Wed, 20 April 2011, 20:01:21 »

Acceleration is both hardware and software. Puretrak for instance spent a lot of time on a custom SROM for their Valor mouse to allow acceleration to be disabled on the hardware level.

.XL · « **Reply #10 on:** Wed, 20 April 2011, 20:04:18 »

Quote from: snowball;334588

Acceleration is both hardware and software. Puretrak for instance spent a lot of time on a custom SROM for their Valor mouse to allow acceleration to be disabled on the hardware level.

Doesn't that have the same sensor as the Ikari and Naos 3200? If so, I've heard that's a really bad sensor.

Then again, I've heard the Mamba sensor is crap but I've never really had issues with it.

snowball · « **Reply #11 on:** Wed, 20 April 2011, 20:17:55 »

The Valor uses a 3090. Pretty well regarded as the best sensor out there. Puretrak said the real issue was Avago has a 24 week wait on orders of the 3090 sensor.

noodles256 · « **Reply #12 on:** Thu, 21 April 2011, 01:35:40 »

did you preorder the valor? I am quite interested in it

Peanuts · « **Reply #13 on:** Thu, 21 April 2011, 01:36:40 »

Quote from: snowball;334562

http://img208.imageshack.us/f/xaipositiveaccel.png/

So what does this show I'm a little lost in this. I'm curious what my razer uses cause this thing has been pretty decent.
Okay clear this up for me please the Naos the 3060? So the 3090 the newest upgrade in the line 3060 -> 3090? So you think the next Naos will be updating their 3200 soon?

The Naos uses the 9500 sesor? Still not really sure about all this acceleration stuff? If it's an issue can you disable it in the driver?

Bullveyr · « **Reply #14 on:** Thu, 21 April 2011, 02:45:00 »

Quote from: ripster;334571

So is acceleration necessarily bad?

No but unwanted accel. from a sensor issue is because it's not as stable or predictable as the accel. you set via ingame settings for example.

For me it's not a real problem because the accel. on the Xai isn't really high, so I can easily manage it.

Quote

It appears most trackballs have sensors with built in acceleration in my testing.

more likely MCU based

Quote from: ripster;334575

That's a SW thing it sounds like. I doubt trackballs have angle snapping. I can do straight lines amazingly well with a trackball. Just not circles. Circles suck on a trackball.

Angle Snapping helps drawing straight lines.

Quote from: Peanuts;334723

I'm curious what my razer uses cause this thing has been pretty decent.

Normal Diamondback has the A3080 (A3070 when it's one of the first), Plasma Edition has the S3088, no real difference there.

Quote

Okay clear this up for me please the Naos the 3060? So the 3090 the newest upgrade in the line 3060 -> 3090? So you think the next Naos will be updating their 3200 soon?

Naos 3200 has the A3080.
A3090 is still based on the same hardware.

I doubt they will make a Naos 3500 with the A3090, normaly you don't give a mouse a simple sensor update.
Besides, there wouldn't be much benefit, you get higher CPI (Naos 3200 has only 1600 CPI, the 3200 are interpolated) and the option to turn angle snapping of.
That they will make a total new mouse with 3090 is ofc possible.

Quote

The Naos uses the 9500 sesor? Still not really sure about all this acceleration stuff? If it's an issue can you disable it in the driver?

Jep, A9500 and the pos. accel. issue is a real one. It's an issue of the sensor itself so you can't fix it with a driver allthough the driver/software/MCU you counter-work the accel. but that's more a theoretical idea.

PS: From what I've heard Avago is on the way to fix it.

snowball · « **Reply #15 on:** Thu, 21 April 2011, 09:03:50 »

I did put in a pre-order on a Valor and will probably write up a review.

I'm interested to see what steelseries has on the way with it's new mouse also

http://steelseries.com/design/

noodles256 · « **Reply #16 on:** Thu, 21 April 2011, 10:11:50 »

I saw that on the SS site, doesn't look impressive, weird color choices.

.XL · « **Reply #17 on:** Thu, 21 April 2011, 10:19:44 »

Quote from: noodles256;334862

I saw that on the SS site, doesn't look impressive, weird color choices.

It looks almost exactly like their other mice. I'm not impressed. I really think SS is a pretty crappy company (except for their headphones - those are pretty good). I haven't heard many good things about their mousepads and I've heard that their mice are crap.

noodles256 · « **Reply #18 on:** Thu, 21 April 2011, 10:44:54 »

Quote from: .XL;334872

It looks almost exactly like their other mice. I'm not impressed. I really think SS is a pretty crappy company (except for their headphones - those are pretty good). I haven't heard many good things about their mousepads and I've heard that their mice are crap.

meh, their headphones aren't even that great. Hard to not look like an alien wearing dem things. I found a new high quality cloth pad company I plan on using so I refute my statement on the SS QCK. Check xtracpads.com they be pretty cool

snowball · « **Reply #19 on:** Thu, 21 April 2011, 11:22:30 »

They make a good set of surfaces and if you can get the 6Gv2 during a 30 or 40% off sale it becomes a good deal. Not a big fan otherwise. Too much G/\M3R going on.

Bullveyr · « **Reply #20 on:** Thu, 21 April 2011, 13:19:25 »

Quote from: Bullveyr;334743

Naos 3200 has the A3080.

I have to correct myself, it's the A3060.

Peanuts · « **Reply #21 on:** Thu, 21 April 2011, 21:45:22 »

So what other comfortable sugestions do you guys have with optics that doesn't have issues?
Big points no pinky finger drag
Even bigger points with wheel like the diamond back the rubber type amd no pinky drag

.XL · « **Reply #22 on:** Thu, 21 April 2011, 23:24:11 »

Quote from: Peanuts;335255

So what other comfortable sugestions do you guys have with optics that doesn't have issues?
Big points no pinky finger drag
Even bigger points with wheel like the diamond back the rubber type amd no pinky drag

Roccat Kone+? Honestly I think the Naos 5000 is your best bet. Google some reviews about it - people LOVE it.

Peanuts · « **Reply #23 on:** Thu, 21 April 2011, 23:27:02 »

Quote from: .XL;335301

Roccat Kone+? Honestly I think the Naos 5000 is your best bet. Google some reviews about it - people LOVE it.

people in here don't seem to think too highly of it

.XL · « **Reply #24 on:** Thu, 21 April 2011, 23:33:43 »

Quote from: Peanuts;335304

people in here don't seem to think too highly of it

The only issue they have with it is the acceleration, which can be turned off in the OS and the Naos driver itself. I did both on the 3200 and still had a bit noticeable acceleration, but a quick google search shows the Naos 5000 won't have any. Research a bit more yourself and see - the issue may be present out of the box, but it's fixable.

Peanuts · « **Reply #25 on:** Fri, 22 April 2011, 00:11:22 »

Quote from: .XL;335307

The only issue they have with it is the acceleration, which can be turned off in the OS and the Naos driver itself. I did both on the 3200 and still had a bit noticeable acceleration, but a quick google search shows the Naos 5000 won't have any. Research a bit more yourself and see - the issue may be present out of the box, but it's fixable.

Thats confusing I asked if I could via the driver above and someone said no.

side note anyone tried the puretrak valor?

.XL · « **Reply #26 on:** Fri, 22 April 2011, 07:36:13 »

Quote from: Peanuts;335328

Thats confusing I asked if I could via the driver above and someone said no.

side note anyone tried the puretrak valor?

IIRC when I had the 3200 there was an option in the software to change acceleration... I could be wrong though! Your best bet is to download yourself and see

snowball · « **Reply #27 on:** Fri, 22 April 2011, 08:29:02 »

Quote from: Peanuts;335328

Thats confusing I asked if I could via the driver above and someone said no.

side note anyone tried the puretrak valor?

There is both hardware and software acceleration. You can disable the software but not the hardware level. Whether or not the Naos 5000 suffers from the same acceleration as the Xai (that uses the same sensor) has yet to be tested as far as I know.

The Valor should start shipping out in about 3 weeks. I haven't seen any in the hands of users yet.

Vittra · « **Reply #28 on:** Fri, 22 April 2011, 09:24:30 »

That Puretrak Valor looks more like a Roccat Kone than it does a MX518, regardless of their marketing FUD.

snowball · « **Reply #29 on:** Fri, 22 April 2011, 11:19:54 »

Kone is 13.5cm x 7.8cm x UNK cm
MX518 is 13.0cm x 7.0cm x 3.6 cm
Valor is 11.7cm x 7.5cm x 4.5 cm

The valor is pretty small for what they are calling a palm grip.

The EC2 for instance is 12.0 x 4.0 x 5.8~6.5 cm

You need pretty small hands to palm an EC2 without your fingers going off the end.

Bullveyr · « **Reply #30 on:** Fri, 22 April 2011, 13:30:22 »

Quote from: Peanuts;335328

side note anyone tried the puretrak valor?

Not out yet but if you pre/order you get a free Talent.

Quote from: .XL;335410

IIRC when I had the 3200 there was an option in the software to change acceleration... I could be wrong though! Your best bet is to download yourself and see

I thougt he was talking about the A9500 accel. bug/issue, having an accel. option in the driver/software is something different.

edit: oops, didn't see the next page

Peanuts · « **Reply #31 on:** Fri, 22 April 2011, 14:14:11 »

Quote from: snowball;335423

There is both hardware and software acceleration. You can disable the software but not the hardware level. Whether or not the Naos 5000 suffers from the same acceleration as the Xai (that uses the same sensor) has yet to be tested as far as I know.

The Valor should start shipping out in about 3 weeks. I haven't seen any in the hands of users yet.

On their facebook they said the shell wasn't designed from scratch cause it would cost 100k+ It's the same as another mouse someone pointed out. I can't find the post now :/

So which mice have the best gaming optics?

Vittra · « **Reply #32 on:** Fri, 22 April 2011, 15:49:50 »

You're probably thinking of the Steelseries Ikari. The shell seems identical, right down to the grooves on the right.

Edit - If you meant the Valor, it looks like a Cyber Snipa Stinger.

Peanuts · « **Reply #33 on:** Sat, 23 April 2011, 23:18:33 »

OCZ Dominatrix is what it looks like, (the Valor)
I ended up pre-ordering a Valor due to the free talent it comes with. I hope this mouse is comfortable. It says ergonomic, if my pinky drags and is uncomfortable I'm gonna ***** about that statement being bs, lemme tell ya.
Maybe I'll pick up a Naos 5000 if there's a really good deal or if I hate the Valor but I can't justify $80+
Especially when one of their rep's on another forum doesn't even let people know when Amazon has a deal on it, kinda irked me.

Vittra · « **Reply #34 on:** Sun, 24 April 2011, 09:17:13 »

Yeah, the OCZ dominatrix IS the Cyber Snipa Stinger. It's who they got the shell from.

It's funny to see just how many times the same shells are used over and over...

vvvvvv · « **Reply #35 on:** Sun, 24 April 2011, 10:28:18 »

Hello all. I noticed some of you here have more knowledge about sensors certain mice use and their pros and cons, so I need your help. I work in PhotoShop a lot and also play games regularly (low sensitivity gamer), for which I've been using my Logitech G5 mouse (5 years), but it recently broke.

Considering my budget I have 3 options for mice to buy: Mionix Saiph 1800, Mionix Naos 3200, Microsoft SideWinder (no X). I prefer the first 2 overall, but I pretty much only care about the sensor: it's critical it has no correction/prediction/angle snapping and also no acceleration at all (it's fine if they do but have options to fully disable them of course). Which of those 3 comes closer to those requirements?

Thanks a lot. Hope it's not off topic since it's also related to the Naos 3200.

End0rphine · « **Reply #36 on:** Mon, 25 April 2011, 09:18:34 »

Quote from: snowball;335523

Kone is 13.5cm x 7.8cm x UNK cm
MX518 is 13.0cm x 7.0cm x 3.6 cm
Valor is 11.7cm x 7.5cm x 4.5 cm

The valor is pretty small for what they are calling a palm grip.

The EC2 for instance is 12.0 x 4.0 x 5.8~6.5 cm

You need pretty small hands to palm an EC2 without your fingers going off the end.

I think the valor compensates by having a higher bump for the palm. Not sure though, but it's the only way it could ever be considered a palm grip mouse if it were to best the EC2 in size.

Quote from: vvvvvv;336566

Hello all. I noticed some of you here have more knowledge about sensors certain mice use and their pros and cons, so I need your help. I work in PhotoShop a lot and also play games regularly (low sensitivity gamer), for which I've been using my Logitech G5 mouse (5 years), but it recently broke.

Considering my budget I have 3 options for mice to buy: Mionix Saiph 1800, Mionix Naos 3200, Microsoft SideWinder (no X). I prefer the first 2 overall, but I pretty much only care about the sensor: it's critical it has no correction/prediction/angle snapping and also no acceleration at all (it's fine if they do but have options to fully disable them of course). Which of those 3 comes closer to those requirements?Thanks a lot. Hope it's not off topic since it's also related to the Naos 3200.

Could try a deathadder v1/2, [Intellimouse Explorer 3.0/1.1 or a Windows Mouse Optical] - 400 DPI limit.

vvvvvv · « **Reply #37 on:** Mon, 25 April 2011, 11:33:21 »

Thanks for the reply! But I'm only interested in the 3 mice I specified. After some more research it appears that the Mionix Saiph 1800 is the one that meets my requirements, so I might go with that one. Not sure though.

noodles256 · « **Reply #38 on:** Mon, 25 April 2011, 11:42:47 »

get that saiph, where can you find it in U.S.?

.XL · « **Reply #39 on:** Mon, 25 April 2011, 12:27:37 »

I've been using the G9x for three days, heavy use. I have to say it's a fantastic mouse! Much better built than any of the Razer's I have had, and I have NO issues with accel (something that I'd notice, it really annoys me). I can say for sure that there's no accel issues, at least with mine. And angle snapping can be turned on/off through the Setpoint software if you like.

Have to say, I *love* this mouse! Definitely worth the money.

Bullveyr · « **Reply #40 on:** Sun, 01 May 2011, 05:38:55 »

Quote from: vvvvvv;336566

Hello all. I noticed some of you here have more knowledge about sensors certain mice use and their pros and cons, so I need your help. I work in PhotoShop a lot and also play games regularly (low sensitivity gamer), for which I've been using my Logitech G5 mouse (5 years), but it recently broke.

Considering my budget I have 3 options for mice to buy: Mionix Saiph 1800, Mionix Naos 3200, Microsoft SideWinder (no X). I prefer the first 2 overall, but I pretty much only care about the sensor: it's critical it has no correction/prediction/angle snapping and also no acceleration at all (it's fine if they do but have options to fully disable them of course). Which of those 3 comes closer to those requirements?

Thanks a lot. Hope it's not off topic since it's also related to the Naos 3200.

The MS Sidewinder has the same sensor as your old G5, so you know what to expect.

The Naos 3200 has the ADNS-3060, that means no accel. issues but angle snapping (prediction) and the higher CPI values are interpolated.

The Saiph has a sensor from Cypress, the most popular mouse with a Cypress sensor would be the Ikari Laser allthough it's not exactly the same sensor.
You can expect no angle snapping but the max. speed isn't that high, so it's not the best choice for low sense gaming but if you were fine with the G5 you should be fine with the Saiph, they are on the same level in that case.

Bullveyr · « **Reply #41 on:** Sun, 01 May 2011, 08:19:15 »

I'm pretty sure there are enough trackballs with angle snapping around.

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Author Topic: Mionix Naos vs. ? Would love everyones opinion (Read 15313 times)