Best Office Keyboard?

[cyberdeath]

Hello everyone,

This very question has been plaguing me for the past month.  I currently have a Cooler Master QuickFire Pro (Cherry Red) for home and am looking to get one for my office at work.  I have used the old mechanical keyboards in the 80s and early 90s...and I remember what they felt like.  After using my latest purchase listed above in addition to my previous mechanical keyboard purchases from years gone by, I have decided I can't stand to get anything but one.

So, I now need to find a keyboard for my office.  I have my own office (with a door...etc...) where I work on technology (mainly fixing complex problems, some scripting, some coding, and just some plain typing).

First off, noise is not a factor.

Second, price is somewhat of a factor...but it's going to be on the company tab...so it's not a huge consideration (but I don't want to buy something overly expensive just for the fact of saying I bought an expensive keyboard....price:performance ratio applies).

Third, I have tried the Cherry blue switches and I like them...they are fine.  I remember the old buckling spring as well.  However, I am not sure which one is better.  But, I do know I will not be gaming on this one so I'd prefer the tactile feedback of the cherry blue or buckling spring.

As a quick note...I also prefer a minimalistic design with the keyboard (standard 104 keys...including the keypad).  I want a full keyboard but I don't want or need a bunch of extra buttons.  I'd prefer a smaller footprint on my desk, but would be okay with larger if it was better in other ways (such as the Unicomp seems bigger but it may be superior based on the buckling springs).

I have done a great deal of research on the options out there.  I looked at the Unicomp UB40P4A, the Das Keyboard Model S Professional, and the Matias QuietPro.  As I mentioned before, I am not sure whether buckling spring or Cherry Blue is better...so, likewise, I'm not sure about the Unicomp.  I like the Das Keyboard, but I have heard from this forum that the quality may be going down (and I am not a big fan of the glossy...not a deal-breaker, though).  I also like the Matias because it's not glossy, but it is "quiet" and I'm not sure I want quiet (after listening to the audio clips...I like the tactile pro better...just not in white).  I also looked at a Filco and liked it except the characters are on the front side of the keyboard (Filco Majestouch 2 Keyboard), which wouldn't work too well for an office environment (in my opinion).

So, I am hoping that someone may have a keyboard suggestion that I haven't looked at yet...or give better insight into the ones I have looked at.  Also, there may be some coming down the pipe that I might should wait on as well...and I can certainly do that.

Please help!

[hashbaz]

Can I get the executive summary?

Welcome to GH.

[Quarzac]

The main difference between Cherry Blues and Buckling Springs is the weight of the keys. If you want tactility and a weight closer to the reds you're using now, go with the blues. If you think you'll be fine with the heavier keys and the the superior tactility of BS, go with the Unicomp. The magical middleground here is an IBM Model F, which is, in my opinion, the best keyboard out there, but they can be hard to find, the layout is peculiar, and they can require a good amount of work to get them to work with modern computers. You may also be interested in vintage white alps, which are tactile, loud, and heavy like BS, or Montereys, which are very tactile, noisy, and closer in weight to blues. Montereys can be tough to track down though, as they're not common. White Alps can be found in many different boards, such as the Northgate Omnikey, Focus FK2001, and a number of others.

[Larken]

normal filcos (non ninja editions) doesn't come with side printed keys.

As far as switch types go, if you're liking your reds now, it may be quite an adjustment to type on buckling springs (personal experience going from browns and reds to a unicomp), but otherwise they're solid boards. I'd avoid the DAS.

Matias should be using Alps, something I'm not entirely familiar with, but from what I heard, their tactility is great. Otherwise, I often find browns are the best compromise for office usage, although some might find the tactile bump to be too subtle.

[TotalChaos]

@cyberdeath

If you like Cherry Red then you should stick with it.  Your muscle memory provides maximum efficiency when you actually allow your muscle memory to do its thing.  How can your muscle memory help you if you keep randomly changing keyswitches?

If you train your muscles to learn to type well on Cherry Blues then when you go home you will smashing too much force into your cherry reds.

Your hands are the most valuable tool you have, why ruin them for nothing?

[cyberdeath]

Can I get the executive summary?

Welcome to GH.

Oh!  Darn...guess I need to work on my verbosity . And thanks...seems like a great group of folks on here.

The main difference between Cherry Blues and Buckling Springs is the weight of the keys. If you want tactility and a weight closer to the reds you're using now, go with the blues. If you think you'll be fine with the heavier keys and the the superior tactility of BS, go with the Unicomp. The magical middleground here is an IBM Model F, which is, in my opinion, the best keyboard out there, but they can be hard to find, the layout is peculiar, and they can require a good amount of work to get them to work with modern computers. You may also be interested in vintage white alps, which are tactile, loud, and heavy like BS, or Montereys, which are very tactile, noisy, and closer in weight to blues. Montereys can be tough to track down though, as they're not common. White Alps can be found in many different boards, such as the Northgate Omnikey, Focus FK2001, and a number of others.

Excellent advice!  I actually just recently went from blues to the reds because I occasionally play a FPS game [CS:GO] after work (great for stress relief after a long day at the office).  So, I'd be curious to know the jump in difference between the blue and the BS (in terms of exertion required to actuate the key).  I also must admit that, after looking up the Model F, it brought back some memories.  However, I also must say that I'm looking for something with a modern appeal yet with the classic quality (much like many say the Thinkpad T series is).  From a totally eclectic/hobbyest perspective...I'd be interested, just don't think I could pull it off for my office.  The White Alps seem interesting...are they as reliable as the BS & the cherries (overall...knowing brand makes a large difference as well)?

normal filcos (non ninja editions) doesn't come with side printed keys.

As far as switch types go, if you're liking your reds now, it may be quite an adjustment to type on buckling springs (personal experience going from browns and reds to a unicomp), but otherwise they're solid boards. I'd avoid the DAS.

Matias should be using Alps, something I'm not entirely familiar with, but from what I heard, their tactility is great. Otherwise, I often find browns are the best compromise for office usage, although some might find the tactile bump to be too subtle.

It's funny you should say that, Larken.  Right after I posted that message, I finally made sense of the Filco website and found the FKBN104MC/EB2.  As I mentioned to Quarzac, I use the reds for FPS gaming and I have used blues prior (just switched in the past couple months...hence the recent desire to get one for my office).  I agree with you on the browns in terms of noise in an open office environment.  I'm fortunate to have my own semi-large office with enough airspace to dampen the noise before it gets near someone else's ears down the hall (or so I think).  From listening to the sounds of the blues, browns, and BS...I prefer the blues and BS.  I also do have to say I'm one of those who like the extra tactility when typing of the blues.  I can tolerate typing on my reds but they remind me more of a high-end membrane keyboard.

---- Thanks to everyone for their responses so far...is certainly giving me some things to think about!  Keep the thoughts coming! :-).

[cyberdeath]

@cyberdeath

If you like Cherry Red then you should stick with it.  Your muscle memory provides maximum efficiency when you actually allow your muscle memory to do its thing.  How can your muscle memory help you if you keep randomly changing keyswitches?

If you train your muscles to learn to type well on Cherry Blues then when you go home you will smashing too much force into your cherry reds.

Your hands are the most valuable tool you have, why ruin them for nothing?

Good point...I have had blues prior to the reds...and you're right...it is a transition.  However, I prefer the reds for gaming because they offer the quickest reflex (important when playing an FPS).  But, while I'm getting used to typing on the reds, I say I miss the more responsive feel of the blues I had before when it comes to normal non-gaming use...even being on a cheap mechanical keyboard.

Do you think it's possible to have a blue (or BS) for work and a red for play at the same time?  Or do you think I will do harm to my hands by doing so?  Because you are right again...your hands are the most important tool, especially when your job relies heavily, almost completely, on them (in a sense).

[rowdy]

Welcome to Geekhack!

MX blues - I have them at work (and home).  Great tactility, although I tend to bottom out.

O-rings if you want to dampen the bottoming out noise, without losing the tactile click.

Filco is one of the better quality boards, but also one of the more expensive MX boards.  However, it should last you for many years, if cost is a concern.  Each key switch is rated for 50 million strokes.

[Larken]

I used to go between reds and brown all the time. Reds while at work, and browns while at home (gaming). I don't imagine it much of a problem going to blues either, except I don't really like the clicks. I did run into problems when I went for heavier switches like clears and buckling springs - having been on lighter switches for over a year, muscle memory tends to cause me to just put enough force into the key press, so that I don't bottom out, which of course results in a problem of not pushing the keys on my unicomp hard enough. The main culprit is the backspace, which is reached by my fourth or little finger.

TLDR, blues, reds and browns are generally fine to switch between, although the change in tactility might still take some getting use to.

[TotalChaos]

@cyberdeath

If you like Cherry Red then you should stick with it.  Your muscle memory provides maximum efficiency when you actually allow your muscle memory to do its thing.  How can your muscle memory help you if you keep randomly changing keyswitches?

If you train your muscles to learn to type well on Cherry Blues then when you go home you will smashing too much force into your cherry reds.

Your hands are the most valuable tool you have, why ruin them for nothing?

Good point...I have had blues prior to the reds...and you're right...it is a transition.  However, I prefer the reds for gaming because they offer the quickest reflex (important when playing an FPS).  But, while I'm getting used to typing on the reds, I say I miss the more responsive feel of the blues I had before when it comes to normal non-gaming use...even being on a cheap mechanical keyboard.

Do you think it's possible to have a blue (or BS) for work and a red for play at the same time?  Or do you think I will do harm to my hands by doing so?  Because you are right again...your hands are the most important tool, especially when your job relies heavily, almost completely, on them (in a sense).

I think you type such huge amounts that you are going to damage your hands no matter what.  The question is do you want your hands to hurt all the time when you are 55 years old?  Or only 45?  If you will just make some ergonomical decsions now, while you are still young and healthy then you will get an extra 200,000 miles of use out of your hands before the hand pain thing starts.

At some point in the future your hands will bother u... then they will bother u worse... and your work will make u goto the doc.  The doc will say "Carpal Tunnel Syndrome!"  and send u off to surgery.  Then you will wake up with great big UGLY disgusting scars all down your arms.  Then a few months later your symptoms will return and u will figure out "Hey!  This carpal tunnel surgery thing is a scam!"  Hahahhaa too late 4 u.  They already got ur money.   Now u r stuck with even worse symptoms.

OR

You could skip all that crap by using your head to make some intelligent choices before all that stuff happens.

OR

You could skip all that crap and go straight from "World Class Game Player and Elite Megacoder" on Monday to "Catastrophic Nerve Damage, ur going to die, haha" on Tuesday like I did.

[cyberdeath]

Welcome to Geekhack!

MX blues - I have them at work (and home).  Great tactility, although I tend to bottom out.

O-rings if you want to dampen the bottoming out noise, without losing the tactile click.

Filco is one of the better quality boards, but also one of the more expensive MX boards.  However, it should last you for many years, if cost is a concern.  Each key switch is rated for 50 million strokes.

Thanks for the welcome . I hopefully won't bottom them out too much...but I like the O-ring idea if things don't work out (I saw that on some other posts here, too..).  Cost isn't a major concern...and I really liked the 50 mil. keystrokes, too (good selling point).

I used to go between reds and brown all the time. Reds while at work, and browns while at home (gaming). I don't imagine it much of a problem going to blues either, except I don't really like the clicks. I did run into problems when I went for heavier switches like clears and buckling springs - having been on lighter switches for over a year, muscle memory tends to cause me to just put enough force into the key press, so that I don't bottom out, which of course results in a problem of not pushing the keys on my unicomp hard enough. The main culprit is the backspace, which is reached by my fourth or little finger.

TLDR, blues, reds and browns are generally fine to switch between, although the change in tactility might still take some getting use to.

Sounds like this may mean BS is out of the question if I want to keep my reds at home, correct?

I'd like tactility and a little bit of eclectic with BS but also don't want to overly mash keys at home nor wear myself out at work, either.

@cyberdeath

If you like Cherry Red then you should stick with it.  Your muscle memory provides maximum efficiency when you actually allow your muscle memory to do its thing.  How can your muscle memory help you if you keep randomly changing keyswitches?

If you train your muscles to learn to type well on Cherry Blues then when you go home you will smashing too much force into your cherry reds.

Your hands are the most valuable tool you have, why ruin them for nothing?

Good point...I have had blues prior to the reds...and you're right...it is a transition.  However, I prefer the reds for gaming because they offer the quickest reflex (important when playing an FPS).  But, while I'm getting used to typing on the reds, I say I miss the more responsive feel of the blues I had before when it comes to normal non-gaming use...even being on a cheap mechanical keyboard.

Do you think it's possible to have a blue (or BS) for work and a red for play at the same time?  Or do you think I will do harm to my hands by doing so?  Because you are right again...your hands are the most important tool, especially when your job relies heavily, almost completely, on them (in a sense).

I think you type such huge amounts that you are going to damage your hands no matter what.  The question is do you want your hands to hurt all the time when you are 55 years old?  Or only 45?  If you will just make some ergonomical decsions now, while you are still young and healthy then you will get an extra 200,000 miles of use out of your hands before the hand pain thing starts.

At some point in the future your hands will bother u... then they will bother u worse... and your work will make u goto the doc.  The doc will say "Carpal Tunnel Syndrome!"  and send u off to surgery.  Then you will wake up with great big UGLY disgusting scars all down your arms.  Then a few months later your symptoms will return and u will figure out "Hey!  This carpal tunnel surgery thing is a scam!"  Hahahhaa too late 4 u.  They already got ur money.   Now u r stuck with even worse symptoms.

OR

You could skip all that crap by using your head to make some intelligent choices before all that stuff happens.

OR

You could skip all that crap and go straight from "World Class Game Player and Elite Megacoder" on Monday to "Catastrophic Nerve Damage, ur going to die, haha" on Tuesday like I did.

I can somewhat relate to your sentiments as I had problems about 5-10 years ago with my wrists that made me unable to use them for several days to "heal" on their own (this happened more than once).  So, I certainly don't want that to happen again nor do I want it to get worse.

But, is moving from a red to a blue (and back...repetitively) that major of a difference?

I think you've essentially convinced me that I shouldn't go with the BS (which is not necessarily a bad thing).

[TotalChaos]

I can somewhat relate to your sentiments as I had problems about 5-10 years ago with my wrists that made me unable to use them for several days to "heal" on their own (this happened more than once).  So, I certainly don't want that to happen again nor do I want it to get worse.

You are lucky.  Your body fired a warning shot over your bow and then was nice enough to let you recover in a short time.

I got not such warning. And no recovery.

But, is moving from a red to a blue (and back...repetitively) that major of a difference?

Did you learn anything from your wrist pain?

What are you going to do if u get unlucky and your wrist pain comes back 20x worse for 40x as long?

Every day your body gets older.  Your chance of getting unlucky is increasing.

I think you've essentially convinced me that I shouldn't go with the BS (which is not necessarily a bad thing).

If u want to use BS and it works for u then use it and stick with it.  But holy crap, switching from BS to Red is just not a wise decision.

I use Reds because it wastes the least amount of power.

The less power u put into each stroke, the less the tension is on your tendons as they slide across your carpal bones.  Over millions of keystrokes, it adds up.

If u typed a little bit here and there it would not matter how much stress you drag across your tendons because your body would have time to heal.

But in today's world, we never type small amounts do we?  We bang out code all day long, write loveletters to our secret girlfriends, chat on forums and IRC, ad infinitum  then bash keys in video games. 

I use Reds because they do not encourage me to smash into the bottom.  They are like Blacks in that regard.  In any event, no matter what switch u use, do ur hands a favor and install some 40a O-rings, if u haven't already.
Impacts are tremendously bad for your nerves and tendons.  Cause enough impacts and you will cause a problem.  If there was a keyboard you could type on without ever triggering an impact then you could get away with huge amounts of typing over very long periods of time.

[cyberdeath]

Did you learn anything from your wrist pain?
What are you going to do if u get unlucky and your wrist pain comes back 20x worse for 40x as long?
Every day your body gets older.  Your chance of getting unlucky is increasing.

I certainly did learn quite a bit from it.  I noticed that it started to bother me when I sat in awkward positions and still tried to type.  Learned that I need to keep typing to a minimum when done away from a desk.

But, as you mentioned, I learned that I didn't want to play with the odds so I did the above and haven't had problems since (not to say it can't happen in the future if I am not careful).

If u want to use BS and it works for u then use it and stick with it.  But holy crap, switching from BS to Red is just not a wise decision.

I use Reds because it wastes the least amount of power.

The less power u put into each stroke, the less the tension is on your tendons as they slide across your carpal bones.  Over millions of keystrokes, it adds up.

If u typed a little bit here and there it would not matter how much stress you drag across your tendons because your body would have time to heal.

But in today's world, we never type small amounts do we?  We bang out code all day long, write loveletters to our secret girlfriends, chat on forums and IRC, ad infinitum  then bash keys in video games. 

I use Reds because they do not encourage me to smash into the bottom.  They are like Blacks in that regard.  In any event, no matter what switch u use, do ur hands a favor and install some 40a O-rings, if u haven't already.

Impacts are tremendously bad for your nerves and tendons.  Cause enough impacts and you will cause a problem.  If there was a keyboard you could type on without ever triggering an impact then you could get away with huge amounts of typing over very long periods of time.

Wow...quite accurate depiction there as I sit typing in IRC along with these forums among other things.  I can't use a BS and play games so I have to switch between the two. Sounds like I need a blue keyboard with 40a o-rings because I do want to occasionally play at home.  Which ones: 0.4mm or 0.2mm?

[cyberdeath]

I appreciate everyone's feedback.  I am now beginning to lean towards this one as alluded to by several of you: Filco Majestouch-2, NKR, Click Action, USA Keyboard (http://www.keyboardco.com/keyboard_details.asp?PRODUCT=649)

Of course, TotalChaos made a good argument towards keyboards with less exertion required (as BS requires) so I am trying to go for the middle-of-the-road with the blues (between red and BS since browns are similar in required exertion).

However, I am still open for suggestions and will take each of them into consideration.

[Joe6pack]

I appreciate everyone's feedback.  I am now beginning to lean towards this one as alluded to by several of you: Filco Majestouch-2, NKR, Click Action, USA Keyboard (http://www.keyboardco.com/keyboard_details.asp?PRODUCT=649)

Of course, TotalChaos made a good argument towards keyboards with less exertion required (as BS requires) so I am trying to go for the middle-of-the-road with the blues (between red and BS since browns are similar in required exertion).

However, I am still open for suggestions and will take each of them into consideration.

If you are in the US, keyboardco has this on Amazon.com

[rowdy]

Reds (45g) actually have a slightly softer spring than blues (50g), and also don't have the tactile bump that you need to overcome to get the key to register.

If you suspect hand/write problems, it might be better to get a softer keyboard so there is less finger strain.  Also a good ergonomic sitting position would be essential.  Although I have no such problems at the moment, I do try to sit properly when typing for a while (ignore me now, sitting cross-legged on my chair, which has been lowered slightly so my knees fit under the desk).

If you do have a recurring RSI problem or similar, maybe have a quick scan of the ergonomics section and see what others are saying about this.

[CPTBadAss]

I appreciate everyone's feedback.  I am now beginning to lean towards this one as alluded to by several of you: Filco Majestouch-2, NKR, Click Action, USA Keyboard (http://www.keyboardco.com/keyboard_details.asp?PRODUCT=649)

Of course, TotalChaos made a good argument towards keyboards with less exertion required (as BS requires) so I am trying to go for the middle-of-the-road with the blues (between red and BS since browns are similar in required exertion).

However, I am still open for suggestions and will take each of them into consideration.

Drink the kool aid, get the Filco. I just bought one a couple weeks back and its amazing.

[TwistedMentat]

@cyberdeath -- Joe6pack made a great point: if you live in the USA save yourself the cost of shipping.

Reds, Blues, and Browns all have the same spring in them.  The 5g difference in actuation force is imparted by the tactile bump.  In my experience on a friend's board with MX Browns, they are so light I would bottom out hard on every keystroke.  Some O-rings would be a nice benefit, both to reduce noise and to provide cushion.  Imsto's silica gel rings look like a good deal compared to what you'll find elsewhere, though I've not yet tried them.  Just my $.02

[Vectivus]

If I were going to buy a second board for work, I'd be going with another Filco with MX Browns (my gaming board at home is a Filco with MX Blacks). Unfortunately, ain't no sense buying something for my current office... gotta wait until I get a job where I care about setting up an office for myself.

[daerid]

You can't argue with how quiet the RealForces are, if noise is a primary concern.

[jkercado]

I use an Unicomp Ultra Classic at the office. No one complains about the noise; in fact, one thing I've realized is that most people really bang at regular rubber dome keyboards, and in many cases make as much and sometimes even more noise than what I make with the Unicomp,

It's a fantastic tool.