Ducky Shine II with Cherry MX Clear switches mini-review.

[csloan1218]

Tis why you go on a quest to find yourself a vintage Fellowes real gel wrist wrest. I gotz one and I wouldn't swap it for anything else

I ordered this one from fellows, I'm sure it will do the trick

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0013CEY0Q/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[VesperSAINT]

Tis why you go on a quest to find yourself a vintage Fellowes real gel wrist wrest. I gotz one and I wouldn't swap it for anything else

I ordered this one from fellows, I'm sure it will do the trick

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0013CEY0Q/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Hmmm, as long as it doesn't smell like death, you should be fine (bad gel can spell like chemicals). I, however, can't go back after experiencing this real gel heaven

[csloan1218]

Ok Vesper, I ordered my shine this morning red switch blue led. I hope your happy with yourself...

[VesperSAINT]

Ok Vesper, I ordered my shine this morning red switch blue led. I hope your happy with yourself...

Hehehe Only as long as you end up loving it, and I'm sure you will! It's just a really solid and beautiful keyboard; you won't regret it.

[nsrexler]

VesperSAINT, you were right. I replaced the stock ABS keycaps with PBT ones and it feels MUCH better. The Clears felt kind of mediocre to me before, but now they feel great because I can feel the tactile bump much more clearly. My only complaint is that I can no longer see the indicator LED for the Caps Lock key, since the window on the keycap is oriented the opposite direction from the switch LED.

[VesperSAINT]

VesperSAINT, you were right. I replaced the stock ABS keycaps with PBT ones and it feels MUCH better. The Clears felt kind of mediocre to me before, but now they feel great because I can feel the tactile bump much more clearly. My only complaint is that I can no longer see the indicator LED for the Caps Lock key, since the window on the keycap is oriented the opposite direction from the switch LED.

I'm glad you were able to like your new keyboard better PBT's are such a cheap and awesome way to improve one's keyboard experience! Well, even if the light doesn't shine through the window, you'll probably still be able to see if it's on or not because the light will shine through the keycap. You put on white or black PBT?

[The_Ed]

I see my student is preaching of vintage gels. Remember who gave you that ebay link for the variation 2. I am still at 7 currently found variations, your variation 2 is still the newest vintage gel gets. My 1's and 1.5 are better of course, but I am still on the lookout for a 0 that's NIB.

EDIT: That amazon link fellowes memory foam wristrest is **** BTW. Just thought you'd want to know csloan1218.

[csloan1218]

EDIT: That amazon link fellowes memory foam wristrest is **** BTW. Just thought you'd want to know csloan1218.

Too late, with prime I got it yesterday. Its way to hard, I'm sending it back asap.

I figure this weekend I'll shop around locally til I find something that works for me.

[nsrexler]

I'm glad you were able to like your new keyboard better PBT's are such a cheap and awesome way to improve one's keyboard experience! Well, even if the light doesn't shine through the window, you'll probably still be able to see if it's on or not because the light will shine through the keycap. You put on white or black PBT?

No such luck. The keycaps are the Ducky black PBT caps with lasered legends. I think I might actually email MK and see if they have any PBT Caps Lock keycaps with the window on top. If not, then it's not a big deal to me.

[VesperSAINT]

I see my student is preaching of vintage gels. Remember who gave you that ebay link for the variation 2. I am still at 7 currently found variations, your variation 2 is still the newest vintage gel gets. My 1's and 1.5 are better of course, but I am still on the lookout for a 0 that's NIB.

EDIT: That amazon link fellowes memory foam wristrest is **** BTW. Just thought you'd want to know csloan1218.

Oo *bows to sensei* I mearly compared my copper to your silver and gold Remember to sell me one of your 1.5's or 1's that you haven't used when you stock up on too many

EDIT: That amazon link fellowes memory foam wristrest is **** BTW. Just thought you'd want to know csloan1218.

Too late, with prime I got it yesterday. Its way to hard, I'm sending it back asap.

I figure this weekend I'll shop around locally til I find something that works for me.

Sorry to hear, bro Hopefully you'll find one to complement that beautiful Shine II that's on the way

No such luck. The keycaps are the Ducky black PBT caps with lasered legends. I think I might actually email MK and see if they have any PBT Caps Lock keycaps with the window on top. If not, then it's not a big deal to me.

OO, hopefully they'll find something for you keep me posted

[The_Ed]

EDIT: That amazon link fellowes memory foam wristrest is **** BTW. Just thought you'd want to know csloan1218.

Too late, with prime I got it yesterday. Its way to hard, I'm sending it back asap.

I figure this weekend I'll shop around locally til I find something that works for me.

The best wristrests are vintage fellowes, the best mousepads are vintage belkin. Vintage belkin are even harder to find than vintage fellowes.

I see my student is preaching of vintage gels. Remember who gave you that ebay link for the variation 2. I am still at 7 currently found variations, your variation 2 is still the newest vintage gel gets. My 1's and 1.5 are better of course, but I am still on the lookout for a 0 that's NIB.

EDIT: That amazon link fellowes memory foam wristrest is **** BTW. Just thought you'd want to know csloan1218.

Oo *bows to sensei* I mearly compared my copper to your silver and gold Remember to sell me one of your 1.5's or 1's that you haven't used when you stock up on too many

You can never have too many. I will still tell you about any cheaper variation 2's I spot.

[csloan1218]

Can you post some links or pics so I would know one if I came across them?

[The_Ed]

No, I have too much invested in the bad ones. EDIT: By too much I mean I have spent quite a few hundred dollars over the past few years.

I will give some hints though. 2 specific colors matter with belkin, missing numbers matter with fellowes. VesperSAINT - If you understand my hint DO NOT tell him what it means. I have already given too much away...

[nsrexler]

No such luck. The keycaps are the Ducky black PBT caps with lasered legends. I think I might actually email MK and see if they have any PBT Caps Lock keycaps with the window on top. If not, then it's not a big deal to me.

OO, hopefully they'll find something for you keep me posted

Response from MK:

Unfortunately, all of Ducky's black PBT caps have the window at the bottom instead of the top. If I find out differently I will let you know, but all of the caps I have seen are this way.

Thank you,

Caleb Putnam
Mechanical Keyboards Inc

Again, not a big deal though. The greatly improved feel is definitely worth it.

[VesperSAINT]

What's the difference between springs in a clear switch and in a black switch? Are the springs in a clear switch the same as those in the green switch (assuming that the green springs are different than the black spring)?

[Larken]

clears are heavier than blacks. no idea about actual greens, but those should be lighter than the springs used in clears.

[VesperSAINT]

Just sold mechanicalkeyboards com another one of these today... Lol.

[raspiguy]

I especially love the DIP switches, which not only enable switching between n- and 6-key rollover, but also allow switching the Windows and Alt keys, which is hugely useful for a Mac user like myself.  Moreover, it came with Ducky keys instead of Windows keys!

So I know this likely isn't the best place to ask this (sorry), but since you mentioned it outright, I was wondering if you could clarify this for an aspiring Shine II owner -- is it both sets of Win-Alt keys (Left & Right) that get swapped in the dip-switch version, or just the left-side set, as the wording on the Ducky product page would seem to suggest?

http://www.duckychannel.com.tw/en/DK9008_shine2.html

I have the v1 9008G2Pro (switches both, but is the "Fn" based switching... so all N-Key, all the time) and have been looking to upgrade to a Shine II ever since realizing the incompatibility with my new customac, but I got a little nervous when I saw the Product page.  I don't want to wait months for the right KB to come back in stock only to realize my cross-platform hopes were doomed to begin with.

[VesperSAINT]

These are out of stock now, btw.

[missalaire]

These are out of stock now, btw.

It took them longer to go out of stock than I thought it would. I thought these would sell much faster.

[VesperSAINT]

These are out of stock now, btw.

It took them longer to go out of stock than I thought it would. I thought these would sell much faster.

I thought the same thing, but it may be from lower exposure it gets than other switch types. Not enough word out there on how awesome the Clear switches are. This thing should be pretty desirable now that they're gone, and the Shine 3 may end up being unnecessarily expensive and the Zero Shine won't have the custom back light options and probably also a lack of Clear switch.

[raspiguy]

These are out of stock now, btw.

It took them longer to go out of stock than I thought it would. I thought these would sell much faster.

I thought the same thing, but it may be from lower exposure it gets than other switch types. Not enough word out there on how awesome the Clear switches are. This thing should be pretty desirable now that they're gone, and the Shine 3 may end up being unnecessarily expensive and the Zero Shine won't have the custom back light options and probably also a lack of Clear switch.

Sorry, I didn't think to address the question to the "greater thread", but since you have one, do you think you could confirm?

I'm posting here randomly because I came across the thread (again, sorry), not because I'm decided on a S2 w/ clears.

[TwistedMentat]

@raspiguy -- Yes, I can confirm that both the left and right <Alt> keys will activate the Windows start menu when DIP switch 2 is set to the "on" position.  Likewise, both the left and right <Ducky Logo> keys behave like the "Alt" modifier when switch 2 is on.

These are out of stock now, btw.

I was lucky to get that last one.  Thank you, VesperSAINT for pointing out to me that they were for sale there.  I hope MK.com hires you into their marketing department.  They can pay you in keyboards!

I couldn't really afford it right now (just paid for an uber-expensive brake job -- I should've been a mechanic!), but I went into debt for this keyboard anyway because it has the features that I want (compared to other boards with Clears), I'm familiar with Ducky quality, and I didn't want to risk that they'd never be in stock again.  Thus, I'm trying hard to love it as much as I love my Ducky with Greens, but to be honest, I'm still somewhat on the fence.

I've had it for just over 48 hours, and I can relate to both some of the good and some of the not-so-good things mentioned earlier in this thread:

THE GOOD:

• The keyboard is sturdy, has a nice heft to it, and does not wobble.  There are no cracks, gouges, scratches, dings, dents, crooked keys, or non-functional LEDs.  All the keys work as they should.
• I like the tactile response of Clears because it is much more pronounced than Browns, which I perceive as dirty or gritty, like they've got a grain of sand stuck in them, or something.
• The weight is really nice, and is quite similar to Greens while typing, as VesperSAINT said.  The minor difference in the springs, though, seems much more pronounced when gaming in an FPS game that requires the "W" key to be held down for forward movement.  It is not nearly as tiring in that case (at least for me).  Thus, the Clear switch serves the purposes of both typing and gaming comfortably.
• Also similar to Greens, and as mentioned in the OP, the spring's resistance increases after actuation, helping to reduce the likelihood and soften the blow of bottoming out.  Some people don't like this; I think it's great.
• The LED lighting is very attractive, and the variety of lighting options is a big plus, particularly the ability to store TWO custom lighting patterns and that the settings are restored after reboot.
• The Cherry actuation point is just right.  I've never tried an ALPS switch or an AEKII, but I think that I, too, would find the immediate actuation rather off-putting.
• I was a fool to order a keyboard with side-printed key caps (the Ducky DK9008G2 Pro Limited Edition PBT).  I can touch type A thru Z with good accuracy and decent-enough WPM (65-70 -- I'm not a programmer), but I quickly discovered after getting the Ducky with Greens that I do not yet have the symbols on the number row memorized!  Side-printed caps also make gaming difficult, especially because I prefer a low-light environment, so they may as well be blank because I can't see the front sides, anyway.  The illuminated legends on the tops of the keys solve those problems.

THE NOT-SO-GOOD:

• This has been said before, no doubt, but the placement of the media keys is just... WTF, man?  Those four keys in the upper-right should be used for this.  I'll bet AutoHotkey can help me.
• While the tactile response is indeed more noticeable in Clears than it is in Browns, it seems a little "chunky" to me.  Dry, but not crisp and distinct like I was expecting.  Properly done Ergo Clears would likely solve that by accentuating the bump and smoothing out the overall action of a full keystroke.
• I do like the default weight of these switches.  Nonetheless, I feel they should be slightly less resistant.  Again, there's a sort of dryness or unnecessary friction to them.  Would simply lubing be enough for me?  Maybe.  But considering the work involved to mod the switches of a back-lit board, one may as well go all the way.  Anything worth doing is worth doing right, yes?
• As jamdox stated in the OP, the white LED lighting, while impressive, does funky things to my eyes when glancing over them.  I usually keep it on the lowest setting, and can't imagine ever needing the highest setting.
• Cherry stabilizers are mushy.  I've never tried Costar stabilizers, and I never noticed this on my other Ducky, probably because of the crisp, clicky Green switches, but it's a little weird.  Not a deal breaker, but... weird.
• Some of the keys ping.  Not all of them, though.  W, U, G, and semicolon are the most distinct on the unit I received.  This is mildly distracting, but for $150 I'm starting to question whether I should ignore it.  Congrats to those who don't experience this.  O-rings or a keyboard mat might help reduce the resonance.
• Placing the PBT key caps from my old Ducky on the new Ducky's alphabet keys seemed to dampen the tactile bump of the Clears.  I didn't try it for very long, so maybe I'll give it another go and leave them on for a day or two.  The mind plays tricks.

CONCLUSION:
I'll keep this keyboard and continue to use it.  Very likely, it will grow on me a bit more.  It is excellent for both typing and gaming, and the MX Clear switch very nearly occupies that middle ground between clicky-tactile and linear switches which the MX Browns were intended -- but have failed -- to secure.  I don't think I would recommend it to others, even if it were still in stock.  Instead, get a keyboard with MX Clears that does not have back-lighting, or one with PCB-mounted switches, then modify it.  Ergo Clears are a must.  Cherry would do very well to manufacture them.  They would make this board spectacular, as the biggest drawbacks for me are the sense of dry friction expressed throughout the entire keystroke and the not-crisp-enough tactile response.

Sorry for the wall of text.  I hope not all of it was superfluous.

[VesperSAINT]

No need to apologize, TwistedMentat! If anything, thank you for your in-depth review! It was definitely an awesome read. You and I seem to share a strange fate where we both bought and heavily focused on the same two keyboards (Ducky Shine 2 w/ Clears and the Ducky DK9008G2 Pro Limited Edition w/ Greens)!!! They are both awesome keyboards, for sure. You credit me too much though *blushes* I have a habit of expressing my opinion like a marketer ) I end up selling my point of view to those around me (my friends here end up buying the products I get because I persuade them into thinking it's the best ) ), and now on GH :PI try to be more objective on GH, of course. Lol. I won't deny I've been credited for others' purchases on mechanicalkeyboards.com; I've probably sold them at least over a dozen keyboards now ) Hiring me or paying me in keyboards would be nice J.K.!!!

Like the Ducky Greens, the Ducky Clears took me about 2 days before I was completely comfortable typing on them. I wouldn't say that this was a bad thing but rather time that was required to adjust to the stiffness, especially if you're coming from Blues, Browns, or Reds. However, after adjustment, I think these 2 switches are the best feeling stock Cherry switches, for sure. I think that PBT keycaps are a must for the complete experience for either switch as the harder characteristic of PBT plastic make the tactility of the Green and Clear switch more pronounced and crisp. I personally found the stock Ducky Shine ABS keycaps to drown out the tactile bump of the Clear switch, while with the PBT's, the tactile bump was much more raw, if not almost rough because of how long the tactile bump is (but I liked this about the Clear switch). You should definitely give it another shot, TwistedMentat. If you type anything like I do on the Clears, you probably lift off right after the actuation bump on the Clears because it's so easy to not bottom out (best feature of Clears), and PBT's only further help with this.

I currently no longer possess the Ducky DK9008G2 Pro Limited Edition w/ Greens nor the Ducky Shine II w/ Clears because I couldn't afford to keep 2 semi-expensive keyboards when I'll soon have a Filco with a custom plate and all the switches and springs available to create and Green, Clear, and Ergo-Clear keyboard. Also, the Green switch was a lil' too stiff for my pinky and ring finger, which caused frequent typos if I wasn't focusing on my typing. BUT TwistedMentat, if you can afford to keep both of them, I highly advise that you do because those two keyboards (especially the Ducky Greens) are absolutely awesome pieces. The spacebar on the Ducky Greens is the most strong crisp breaking Cherry switch I've felt. I don't know how they did it because I've felt multiple CM QFR's Green spacebars, a CM XT Green spacebar, a Green spacebar I soldered into my Blue keyboard, and they all felt soft and weak compared to the stock Green Spacebar I felt in 2 separate Ducky DK9008G2 Pro Limited Editions w/ Greens. It's really weird but true. I regret selling my Ducky Greens but I'm currently brainwashed and will do anything to finish my custom keyboard with Ergo-Clears ) I have everything and now I'm just waiting for my Filco to arrive, which is on it's way

[kelske]

Great write up dudes,

I agree with points on both sides, but in the end sold off my S2 with clears pretty quick. They just weren't the switch for me - and with the difficulty of  modding factory plated switches I couldn't justify keeping it.

Still would love to try lubed ergo's they sound lourvely! Also bursting with topre love after several days with my fc660c

[VesperSAINT]

Great write up dudes,

I agree with points on both sides, but in the end sold off my S2 with clears pretty quick. They just weren't the switch for me - and with the difficulty of  modding factory plated switches I couldn't justify keeping it.

Still would love to try lubed ergo's they sound lourvely! Also bursting with topre love after several days with my fc660c

You should definitely try lubed Ergo-Clears when you can! Even though I haven't built my full keyboard yet, I've made and soldered Ergo-Clears with 3 different types of springs into my practice board, and they feel amazing!

My next keyboard purchase will definitely be the FC660C as soon as they bring out the white one

[therecorder]

I've had the Ducky Shine 2 with Clears for about a month.  I, like the other owners, find it a little "spongy", especially when I compare it to the three Keycool Limited Edition (plate mounted) Clears that I "invested" in last year.  Therefore, the Ducky has been sitting in a closet.  This morning I decided to try an experiment.  I put a set of 37 PBT keycaps on the Ducky (a $20 set that I purchased from Qtang).  It makes a big difference in the feel, when compared to the other keys on the board.  The keys feel smoother, less spongy, and more responsive.  Of course the PBTs didn't do anything to the switch - They just interact and transfer the action differently.  So, if you're a bit disappointed with the keyboard, you might want to try different keycaps.

Good luck, and here's some shots of the change.

[VesperSAINT]

Just like how I did it in my video Eventually put full PBT's because it makes such a drastic difference. Also sounds better!

[therecorder]

Just like how I did it in my video Eventually put full PBT's because it makes such a drastic difference. Also sounds better!

I forgot the about the sound...  You are 100% correct...  Now they're closer to a "thock".

Gonna go watch your video.

[VesperSAINT]

Just like how I did it in my video Eventually put full PBT's because it makes such a drastic difference. Also sounds better!

I forgot the about the sound...  You are 100% correct...  Now they're closer to a "thock".

Gonna go watch your video.

The great thing about thin white PBT's on a Ducky Shine is that the lighting effect is better than the stock keycaps because the legends on the stock ABS keycaps are covered by your fingers when you type. The thin white PBT keycaps act like a window for light

[Photoelectric]

This makes me wonder how the [probable] Clears will feel in the upcoming Duckies with thick stock PBT caps.  I'm thinking of getting one for my OH, who seems do find my favorite Browns too light and even called my filco's MX Blacks easy to bottom out (and did not like the linear nature of those switches).  Without lubricating (I won't have proper equipment to do any switch modding for quite a while), do you think stock Clears are not too much more effort vs MX Blacks?  And should the thick OEM profile PBT caps improve the experience?  I know everyone loooves their Ergo Clears, but I don't hear enough praise for stock Clears (which is all I can have for now, until I find access to proper tools).

[VesperSAINT]

This makes me wonder how the [probable] Clears will feel in the upcoming Duckies with thick stock PBT caps.  I'm thinking of getting one for my OH, who seems do find my favorite Browns too light and even called my filco's MX Blacks easy to bottom out (and did not like the linear nature of those switches).  Without lubricating (I won't have proper equipment to do any switch modding for quite a while), do you think stock Clears are not too much more effort vs MX Blacks?  And should the thick OEM profile PBT caps improve the experience?  I know everyone loooves their Ergo Clears, but I don't hear enough praise for stock Clears (which is all I can have for now, until I find access to proper tools).

Stock clears are about the same stiffness as Cherry MX Black in terms of feel so I wouldn't worry about that. You'll learn to type on Clears so that you'll lift off after actuation/bump, and it's actually a pretty light switch if you do it that way. I think the stock Clears (with PBT's) feel awesome and I absolutely love it, but you have to take into consideration that I enjoy a long rough tactile bump. The stock Clears are really as tactile as a Cherry MX switch can get.

[therecorder]

This makes me wonder how the [probable] Clears will feel in the upcoming Duckies with thick stock PBT caps.  I'm thinking of getting one for my OH, who seems do find my favorite Browns too light and even called my filco's MX Blacks easy to bottom out (and did not like the linear nature of those switches).  Without lubricating (I won't have proper equipment to do any switch modding for quite a while), do you think stock Clears are not too much more effort vs MX Blacks?  And should the thick OEM profile PBT caps improve the experience?  I know everyone loooves their Ergo Clears, but I don't hear enough praise for stock Clears (which is all I can have for now, until I find access to proper tools).

Take a look at the force data and diagrams:

http://mechanicalkeyboards.com/faqs.php?faq=mechanical_switch_difference

Also, how your OH reacts to your (I think) plate mounted switches will be different than the same switches on a PCB mounted board.

And, if your OH is bottoming out on blacks, and doesn't want to bottom out, a White (Milk), Green, or Gray switch board may be a better choice.

[Photoelectric]

Take a look at the force data and diagrams:

http://mechanicalkeyboards.com/faqs.php?faq=mechanical_switch_difference

Also, how your OH reacts to your (I think) plate mounted switches will be different than the same switches on a PCB mounted board.

And, if your OH is bottoming out on blacks, and doesn't want to bottom out, a White (Milk), Green, or Gray switch board may be a better choice.

Thanks.  The Ducky boards are plate-mounted though, as are all of mine.  Also those other switches are either clicky or probably too heavy.  My guess now is that [lubed] stock Clears might be best.

Stock clears are about the same stiffness as Cherry MX Black in terms of feel so I wouldn't worry about that. You'll learn to type on Clears so that you'll lift off after actuation/bump, and it's actually a pretty light switch if you do it that way. I think the stock Clears (with PBT's) feel awesome and I absolutely love it, but you have to take into consideration that I enjoy a long rough tactile bump. The stock Clears are really as tactile as a Cherry MX switch can get.

 Thank you

[therecorder]

The Shine 2s are PCB mounted...  Are the 3s going to be Plate mounted?

[VesperSAINT]

The Shine 2's are plate mounted?

[therecorder]

The Shine 2's are plate mounted?

http://www.duckychannel.com.tw/en/DK9087_shine2.html

http://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/index.php?l=product_detail&p=296

[Photoelectric]

Oh the TKL shine 2s should be plate-mounted, that's what I was thinking of (got one with Browns on the way).  I assumed the full sized version was the same.  Looks like the new PBT boards are PCB-mounted--so then I won't need to desolder to lubricate--niiice!

[VesperSAINT]

I believe MK.com's information is a mistake. They have all Ducky's as PCB mounted, except my DK9008 is plate mounted, as I've opened it and modded it before. The ducky link doesn't say anything about PCB mounted. I believe all Ducky keyboards are plate-mounted. I owned the Ducky Shine 2's with Clears and I can tell you confidently that there was a plate under the switches

Looks like the new PBT boards are PCB-mounted--so then I won't need to desolder to lubricate--niiice!

If this is true, I don't know how to feel. I like my metal plates, and I would rather desolder/solder mod than have no plate. Unless, the new Ducky's are going to have a custom plate... i'm getting confused here... I'm pretty sure Ducky will keep their keyboards plate-mounted.

[therecorder]

Oh the TKL shine 2s should be plate-mounted, that's what I was thinking of (got one with Browns on the way).  I assumed the full sized version was the same.  Looks like the new PBT boards are PCB-mounted--so then I won't need to desolder to lubricate--niiice!

http://mechanicalkeyboards.com does list the 9087 Shine 2s as "Plate Mounted", but I don't think that they are:

http://www.duckychannel.com.tw/en/DK9087_shine2.html
(PCB two-sided routing, safety guaranteed)

[jabar]

All Duckys are plate mounted. The PCB comment is that it's a two-sided PCB. If Ducky ever got rid of their plate they would make a big deal out of it.

[VesperSAINT]

Oh the TKL shine 2s should be plate-mounted, that's what I was thinking of (got one with Browns on the way).  I assumed the full sized version was the same.  Looks like the new PBT boards are PCB-mounted--so then I won't need to desolder to lubricate--niiice!

http://mechanicalkeyboards.com does list the 9087 Shine 2s as "Plate Mounted", but I don't think that they are:

http://www.duckychannel.com.tw/en/DK9087_shine2.html
(PCB two-sided routing, safety guaranteed)

Double sided PCB has nothing to do with PCB mounting. Filco's have double sided PCB and they're plate-mounted.

[Photoelectric]

Ok thank you for clarifying--I was sure they were all plate-mounted and got temporarily excited at the prospect of not having to desolder.  But that is not to be.

[VesperSAINT]

Ok thank you for clarifying--I was sure they were all plate-mounted and got temporarily excited at the prospect of not having to desolder.  But that is not to be.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad new

[Photoelectric]

Ok thank you for clarifying--I was sure they were all plate-mounted and got temporarily excited at the prospect of not having to desolder.  But that is not to be.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad new

No big deal--I really didn't think they were PCB-mounted until this discussion tonight, and it got corrected quickly anyway.  It was like "Oh, really?!! Could it be..?!!!  Okay, nevermind, moving along "  I prefer plate-mounted anyway for stability and protecting the PCB.

[VesperSAINT]

No big deal--I really didn't think they were PCB-mounted until this discussion tonight, and it got corrected quickly anyway.  It was like "Oh, really?!! Could it be..?!!!  Okay, nevermind, moving along "  I prefer plate-mounted anyway for stability and protecting the PCB.

You know what's good for you

[therecorder]

I'm also grateful that others have readjusted my thinking...  which goes to show that you can teach an old dog a new trick (or two).

[VesperSAINT]

I'm also grateful that others have readjusted my thinking...  which goes to show that you can teach an old dog a new trick (or two).

I learn something new here all the time too Glad we could be of help